[00:00:02]
[Landmark Commission Meeting on October 2, 2023.]
UH, LET'S GO AHEAD AT, UM, ONE OH FIVE.AND FIRST WE NEED TO, UM, UH, START WITH A MOTION SO THAT WE CAN HAVE AN ACTING TRIP.
I MOVE THAT, UH, COMMISSIONER COURTNEY, ACT AS ACTING CHAIR FOR THIS MEETING.
UM, AND NEXT THEN, UM, I MOVE TO HAVE, UH, COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER SERVE AS OUR ACTING VICE CHAIR.
THEY SAID WE ACTUALLY HAD TO HAVE AN ACTING CHAIR FIRST, SO, UM, THERE WE GO.
GOOD AFTERNOON, COMMISSIONERS.
DISTRICT TWO I, I SAW HER LINK FORWARD.
DISTRICT THREE, DISTRICT FOUR.
DISTRICT SEVEN, DISTRICT EIGHT.
WE ALSO HAVE COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS.
PARDON ME, MR. CUMMINGS? I'M HERE.
SO, WELL, WE HAVE TWO MINUTES,
ALL RIGHT, LET'S GO AHEAD THEN.
AND, UM, WELL, WHAT IF THOUGH, UM, AS COMMISSIONER GIBSON IS, I, I THINK ON A PHONE CALL EARLIER, IS, IS HIS STEP STILL OVER
SO THEN THAT WOULD PUT US AS, UH, ONE TO MANY.
SO WE HAVE COMMISSIONER, UH, CUMMINGS IN PERSON.
I, I DON'T KNOW, UM, WHO PARTICIPATED LAST TIME BETWEEN COMMISSIONER TAYLOR AND COMMISSIONER ANDERSON WAS THE DETERMINATION, I THINK TO ROTATE OR BETWEEN THE TWO OF THEM? DOES ANYBODY RECALL? OF COURSE.
SO THAT'S WHY I WAS JUST GOING BETWEEN COMMISSIONER TAYLOR AND COMMISSIONER ANDERSON.
SO WAS COMMISSIONER ANDERSON WAS PRESENT FOR OH, BOTH THE PRESENT FOR THE BRIEFING.
AYE, ANDERSON, IS THAT THE LAST MEETING? OKAY.
SO THEN, UM, WITH COMMISSIONER ANDERSON BEING PRESENT AT THE LAST MEETING, UM, JIM, WE APPRECIATE YOUR WILLINGNESS TO, UM, DIAL IN AND PARTICIPATE, BUT WE'LL HAVE ONE TOO MANY.
SO, UH, COMMISSIONER TAYLOR, ARE YOU ABLE TO BE PRESENT FOR THE DURATION OF THE ENTIRE MEETING THIS AFTERNOON? YES, MA'AM.
ALRIGHT, WELL THEN WE'LL GO ON AHEAD AND, AND MOVE FORWARD.
UM, THANK YOU COMMISSIONER ANDERSON FOR YOUR, UH, WILLINGNESS TO PARTICIPATE, BUT WE'LL HAVE TO, UH, HAVE MANY, OKAY? OKAY.
CAN I GO ON AND LISTEN? OF COURSE.
HOW DO I DO THAT? UH, TURN YOUR CAMERA OFF.
YOU CAN JUST TURN HIS CAMERA OFF.
ALL RIGHT THEN WITH THAT, WE'LL GO ON AHEAD THEN AND, UM, HANDLE THE, UH, A MINUTES.
DO WE HAVE ANY PUBLIC SPEAKERS FOR
[00:05:01]
THE MINUTES? NO.ALRIGHT, SO THEN CAN WE GET A MOTION TO APPROVE MINUTES? SO MOVED.
ANY OPPOSED? ALL RIGHT, THEN MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT CHAIR.
EXCUSE ME, I, I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH EVERYBODY AND I CAN'T SEE WHO'S GOT IT SPEAKING.
SO IF WE COULD SAY OUR NAMES AND I WOULD APPRECIATE THAT.
UH, WHO IS THE MAKER OF THE MOTION? I MOVE.
THIS IS COMMISSIONER OSA AND OUR SECOND WAS OKAY.
WE DO NOT HAVE ANYBODY THAT NEEDS TO RECUSE FROM ANYTHING.
DOES THAT STILL STAND FOR THE AFTERNOON AS WELL? NO.
ALRIGHT, THEN LET'S GO AHEAD AND, UH, SET A, SET THE ORDER.
ALRIGHT, COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER HERE.
I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE CONSENT ITEMS TWO THROUGH EIGHT AS WELL AS DISCUSSION ITEM ONE, MOVING IT TO CONSENT.
UH, SECOND, SECOND, SECOND IS WITH NO, LET ME, I HAVE A QUESTION, HOWEVER, ABOUT, UM, DISCUSSION ITEM EIGHT, WASN'T IT EIGHT WHERE WE WERE GOING TO DISCUSSION ITEM, MAKE, OFFER A CLARITY TO IT, DISCUSSION ITEM ONE, DISCUSSION ONE, THOUGHT WE WERE GONNA OFFER A, A STATEMENT, CLARITY OR, UM, THOSE BASED ON STAFF RECOMMENDATION, WHICH WOULD BE OUR APPROVAL, CORRECT? SO IS THAT FOR THE, THE QUESTION FOR THE CITY ATTORNEY? UM, IF WE, IF THE CONSENT ITEMS ARE PER STAFF, UH, RECOMMENDATION, WE WOULDN'T NEED THE CLARIFICATION ON THE WOOD WINDOWS, CORRECT.
MOTION TO INCLUDE THAT IT'S SPECIFICALLY APPROVED PER STAFF RECOMMENDATION.
THAT IS REGARDING ITEM DISCUSSION ONE.
SO THEN, LET'S SEE, UH, LET'S GO AHEAD AND, UM, GO THROUGH THE ORDER FOR THE REMAINDER.
MADAM CHAIR, I MOVE THAT THE REMAINING ITEMS BE ORDERED AS FOLLOWS, CONSENT REVIEW.
CONS COURTESY REVIEW, WHICH IS THE ONLY ONE ON THE AGENDA TODAY.
THE DESIGNATION, PUBLIC HEARING CONSENT ONE.
MADAM CHAIR, MAY I ASK A QUESTION? YES.
ARE WE COUNTING COMMISSIONER GIBSON PRESENT BECAUSE HIS GLASSES WOULD BE
YEAH, HE'S OUT OF THE ROOM IS SHOWING IN FAVOR.
WHAT, WHY DON'T WE, UM,
RIGHT? SO THINK THAT'S SITTING SEVEN.
[00:10:31]
ALL RIGHT.SO THE DETERMINATION FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE IS THAT, UM, HE'S PRESENT.
UH, COMMISSIONER GIBSON IS PRESENT.
ALRIGHT, SO, UH, LET'S GO AHEAD AND MOVE FORWARD THEN WITH COURTESY REVIEW.
RHONDA DUNN PRESENTING ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF.
UH, THE CASE IN QUESTION IS COURTESY REVIEW ITEM NUMBER ONE, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS CITED AT 4 0 0 1 CAPITAL AVENUE.
THE NAME OF THE PROPERTY, BECAUSE IT'S INDIVIDUALLY LISTED, IS ALEX W. SPENCER JUNIOR HIGH SCHOOL.
THE CASE NUMBER IS CR 2 34 DASH ZERO ONE R D.
THE REQUEST, AGAIN, IT'S A COURTESY REVIEW TO REPLACE ALL WINDOWS A TOTAL OF 74.
THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS THAT THE PROPOSAL TO REPLACE ALL WINDOWS TOTAL OF 74 BE CONCEPTUALLY APPROVED WITH THE UNDERSTANDING THAT GLAZING IS TO RE BE REPLACED, AND THE OTHER WINDOW ELEMENTS, DASH FRAMES, SASHES, MUSS, ET CETERA, ARE TO BE REPAIRED.
MOREOVER, THE FINAL DESIGN, AS WELL AS ANY ASSOCIATED SITE PLANS, ELEVATIONS, RENDERINGS, AND DETAILS ARE TO BE SUBMITTED FOR FINAL LANDMARK COMMISSION REVIEW.
CAN I GET SOMEBODY TO READ THE
WELL, I, ONCE I FIND IT IN HERE, I GUESS I SHOULD I, NO.
COURTESY REVIEW COMMISSIONER PAGE 13.
COMMISSIONER SWAN DOESN'T MIND DOING IT.
SO WE'LL GO AHEAD AND COMMISSIONER SWAN, YOU NEED TO PRINT ON THE
COURTESY REVIEW, NO FORMAL ACTION TAKEN.
COMMENTS ONLY SUPPORTED COMMENTS.
UH, ONE, PROVIDE A DETAILED CONDITION ASSESSMENT OF EACH WINDOW STATING COMMENTS IN THE ASSESSMENT REPORT.
TWO, REPAIR WINDOWS IN LIEU OF REPLACEMENT OF WINDOWS THREE, THE WINDOW FRAMES AS IS FOUR.
DETERMINE IF WINDOW SASHES ARE OF THE SIZE TO ALLOW ENERGY EFFICIENT, CLEAR GLASS PANES.
AND FIVE, CONDUCT COST BENEFIT ANALYSIS TO ASSIST IN DETERMINING PROPER COURSE OF ENERGY EFFICIENT ACTION.
I E SINGLE OR DOUBLE PLANE GLASS.
DO WE HAVE ANY SPEAKERS FOR COURTESY REVIEW? YOU? THEY DIDN'T.
SO I'M, I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER THE LAST TIME WE HAD A COURTESY REVIEW WHERE WE DIDN'T HAVE TIME TO
UM, WE'LL JUST GO AHEAD THEN, I GUESS AT THAT POINT AND MOVE FORWARD WITH, UH, COMMENTS.
DOES ANYONE PRESENT HAVE ANY COMMENTS? OKAY.
DOES ANYONE ATTENDING REMOTELY HAVE ANY COMMENTS ON THE COURTESY REVIEW? NO.
WELL THEN WITH THAT WE'LL GO ON AHEAD AND MOVE FORWARD.
ALL RIGHT, THEN WE'LL GO ON AHEAD THEN AND MOVE ON TO, UH, THE PUBLIC HEARING FOR THE INITIATION.
RHONDA DUNN, REPRESENTING CITY STAFF, UH, PUBLIC HEARING ITEM NUMBER ONE, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS CITED AT 1515 SOUTH HARWOOD STREET, KNOWN AS OLD CITY PARK.
THE REQUEST IS FOR A PUBLIC HEARING TO CONSIDER THE INITIATION OF THE HISTORIC DESIGNATION PROCESS FOR 1515 SOUTH HARWOOD STREET, ALSO KNOWN AS OLD CITY PARK STAFF.
RECOMMENDATION IS APPROVAL DESIGNATION, COMMITTEE RECOMMENDATION IS ALSO APPROVAL.
[00:15:02]
UM, OH, NO, I GUESS, UH, DO WE, UH, HAVE ANY SPEAKERS ON BEHALF OF, OF THAT COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY? DO YOU, WERE YOU SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF, UM, YEAH, IS THERE NO PUBLIC SIGNED UP OR THAT NEED TO GO FIRST OR? OKAY, LET'S GO AHEAD AND THEN, UM, CALL OUR FIRST SPEAKER.MR. DONNA HEFFLER? YES, I'M REMOTE.
ALL RIGHT, MS. HEFFLER, UH, WE JUST NEED TO SWEAR YOU IN.
UH, DO YOU PROMISE TO, UH, TELL THE TRUTH TODAY WHILE COMMENTING ON THIS ITEM? OKAY, GREAT.
DO YOU HAVE THE, IS YOU WANT TO KEEP IN TIME FOR US? OKAY.
ALL RIGHT, MS. HEER, YOU CAN, YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND GO.
I JUST WANTED TO BE IN RECORD OF PUBLIC SUPPORT OF GL HISTORIC DESIGNATION.
UM, NEXT SPEAKER ON THIS ITEM IS CHRISTINA TURNER.
THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING ME TO SPEAK.
I'M CHRIS TURNER WARE WITH THE PARK AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT.
I'M THE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR OVER PLANNING AND DESIGN.
CITY PARK WAS THE FIRST PARK IN THE DALLAS PARK SYSTEM ACQUIRED IN 18, OH, HOLD ON.
WE HAVE THIS FOR YOU ON, DO YOU PROMISE TO TELL THE TRUTH TODAY? THANK YOU.
CITY PARK WAS THE FIRST PARK IN THE DALLAS PARK SYSTEM ACQUIRED IN 1876.
THE PARK AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT UNDERSTANDS AND RESPECTS THE HISTORY OF THE PARK.
WE ARE JUST BEGINNING A MASTER PLANNING EFFORT FOR CITY PARK, WHICH WILL DEFINE THE CONDITION OF THE BUILDINGS AND PROPERTY AT CITY PARK, INCLUDING THE COMPLEX HYDROLOGY AND FLOOD PRONE STATUS.
RECENT SEVERE FLOODING HAS RESULTED IN THE DEGRADATION OF SEVERAL STRUCTURES OF THE PARK AND REPAIRS ARE CURRENTLY IN PROGRESS OF THOSE STRUCTURES.
THE MASTER PLAN EFFORT WILL CREATE FURTHER UNDERSTANDING OF HOW TO PREVENT FURTHER DESTRUCTION TO THESE VALUABLE ASSETS.
WE LOOK FORWARD TO PRESENTING RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE PARK AND RECREATION BOARD AND THE LANDMARK COMMISSION AFTER WE HAVE HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO ANALYZE THE PROPERTY AND ITS FEATURES DURING THE MASTER PLANNING EFFORTS.
THE PARK AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT RESPECTFULLY REQUESTS THAT CONSIDERATION FOR CITY PARK AS A HISTORICAL FACILITY BE POSTPONED.
UNTIL SUCH TIME AS THIS ANALYSIS IS COMPLETE, EVERYONE CAN BENEFIT FROM THE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION THAT WILL BE GLEANED FROM THE MASTER PLANNING EFFORTS.
AND WE THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION TODAY.
DO WE HAVE ANY OTHER, UH, PUBLIC SPEAKERS SIGNED UP? YES, WE HAVE TWO LETTERS.
UM, WE HAVE ANY VOLUNTEERS TO READ THE LETTERS THEN TO THE RECORD? OKAY.
SEPTEMBER 29TH, 2023, LANDMARK COMMISSION AND OFFICE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION CITY OF DALLAS, 1500 MELA STREET, FIVE CN, DALLAS, TEXAS 7 5 2 0 1 RE INITIATION OF OLD CITY PARK DESIGNATION, LANDMARK COMMISSION AGENDA OCTOBER 2ND, 2023.
DEAR COMMISSION, MEMBERS AND PRESERVATION STAFF PRESERVATION DALLAS SUPPORTS THE INITIATION OF OLD CITY PARK.
THIS PARK ALONG WITH ITS BUILDINGS AND STRUCTURES IS AN IMPORTANT HISTORIC AND CULTURAL RESOURCE FOR OUR COMMUNITY.
THE RETENTION OF ITS ARCHITECTURAL FEATURES AND PARK SETTING IS A DYNAMIC AND ENGAGING REPRESENTATION OF OUR PAST.
WHILE THESE STRUCTURES HAVE BEEN RELOCATED, THE INTERPRETIVE COMPONENT HAS BEEN OPERATIONAL SINCE 1969.
IT ARTICULATES THE VERY TYPES OF RESOURCES THAT ARE NOT ADEQUATELY REPRESENTED IN OTHER PARTS OF OUR CITY.
HAVING LANDMARK DESIGNATED ENVIRONMENTS SUCH AS OLD CITY PARK IS AN IMPORTANT PUBLIC HISTORY EDUCATIONAL RESOURCE, ESPECIALLY WHEN ACCOMPANIED BY AN ALL BY AN INCLUSIVE PROGRAM.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE TO OUR CITY, SINCERELY, VICTORIA PLOW, UH, VICTORIA PLOW, PRESIDENT PRESERVATION DALLAS.
WE RECEIVED ANOTHER LETTER FROM MARCEL QUIMBEE, OCTOBER 1ST, 2023.
LANDMARK COMMISSIONERS ALL CITY PARK WAS CREATED IN 1876 WHEN THE PROPERTY WAS ACQUIRED FROM JJ EKINS BECOMING THE CITY OF DALLAS'S FIRST PUBLIC PARK.
[00:20:01]
SPRINGS, AN ARTESIAN SPRING AND SOURCE OF FRESHWATER USED BY INDIAN TRIBES AND LATER DALLAS RESIDENTS.THE PARK WAS SOON IMPROVED WITH WALKING AND RIDING PATHS, FOUNTAINS OF BANDSTAND, GARDENS, TENNIS COURTS, GREENHOUSES IN THE CITY'S FIRST ZOO LOCATED AT THE EDGE OF DALLAS.
AT THE TIME, THE PARK SERVED DALLAS RESIDENCE WITH RECREATIONAL OPPORTUNITIES.
IN 18 85, 9 ACRES OF ADJACENT PROPERTY, INCLUDING ADJACENT BROWDER SPRINGS, WERE PURCHASED AND ADDED TO THE PARK IN THE CEDARS NEIGHBORHOOD, WAS SOON BUILT ADJACENT TO THE PARK.
UNFORTUNATELY, THE CONSTRUCTION OF I 35 TOOK APPROXIMATELY HALF OF THE PARK, INCLUDING THE LOCATION OF BROWER SPRINGS AND CUT OFF THE PARK AND ADJACENT NEIGHBORHOODS FROM DOWNTOWN DALLAS.
IN 1966, DALLAS COUNTY HERITAGE SOCIETY CREATED OLD CITY PARK, A MUSEUM OF VERNACULAR, DALLAS ARCHITECTURE AT THE PARK.
OLD CITY PARK INCLUDES, UH, THE RICHARD M GANO DOG TROT HOUSE 1854 MILLMORE 1855 TO 1962, AND THE MILLER LOG CABINET 1847, ALL OF WHICH ARE RECORDED.
TEXAS HISTORIC LANDMARKS, OLD CITY PARK, THE DALLAS'S, THE CITY OF DALLAS'S FIRST PARK IS MOSTLY, UH, IS, IS MOST WORTHY OF INITIATION BY DALLAS LANDMARK COMMISSION AS A CITY OF DALLAS LANDMARK.
I ENCOURAGE THE COMMISSION TO APPROVE THIS INITIATION.
SINCERELY, AND THANK YOU MARCEL QUIMBEE, F A I A.
WE HAVE ANY OTHER SPEAKERS SIGNED UP OR PRESENT THAT WANNA SPEAK ON BEHALF OF THE INITIATION.
ALL RIGHT, COMMISSIONERS WITH THAT, UH, COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY.
UM, THE, THE PLACE CURRENTLY KNOWN AS OLD CITY PARK, WHICH IT CAME TO BE KNOWN AFTER THE HISTORIC VILLAGE OPENED UP, WAS AS IT HAD BEEN REPORTED, IT HAS LAYERS AND LAYERS OF HISTORIC IMPORTANCE TO THIS TOWN, INCLUDING ASSISTING WITH THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE URBAN AREA AROUND IT.
FING, YOU KNOW, ORIGINALLY BEEN A RURAL AREA AND, AND THE, UM, HOUSING NEIGHBORHOOD CALLED THE CEDARS WAS BUILT UP AROUND IT AND HAS CHANGED IN CHARACTER OVER THE YEARS.
SO IT HAS HOSTED A WIDE VARIETY OF THE PEOPLE WHO MAKE UP DALLAS'S HISTORIC POPULATION.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS THE COMMENTS OF THE, UM, THE SPEAKER FROM THE PARKS DEPARTMENT IF SHE'D LIKE TO RETURN TO THE MICROPHONE.
AND I'M AFRAID I DID NOT CATCH HER NAME.
COULD SOMEONE REMIND ME OF THAT? UH, CHRIS TURNER NOTE WHERE, NICE TO MEET YOU, MA'AM.
I'M SORRY, I'M NOT THERE IN PERSON, BUT I WAS EXPOSED TO COVID AND REALLY DIDN'T WANNA, UM, SEND A PLAGUE TO THE ENTIRE COMMISSION.
SO I HAVE STAYED AT HOME TODAY.
I'M A LITTLE CONFUSED ABOUT THE IDEA THAT, UM, DOING THE MASTER PLAN PROCESS FIRST WOULD INFORM THE HISTORIC DESIGNATION PROCESS RATHER THAN THE OTHER WAY AROUND.
IF WE DO THEM IN CONJUNCTION OR THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION PROCESS FIRST, THAT GIVES A BASELINE FOR THE MASTER PLAN WITH FULL KNOWLEDGE CONSTRUCTED WITH THE HELP OF OUR DESIGNATION COMMITTEE.
THAT'S PART OF THE LANDMARK COMMISSION TO HELP THE MASTER PLANNERS UNDERSTAND THE HISTORY OF THE PARK AND THE SIGNIFICANCE OF BOTH THE LANDSCAPE AND ALL THE BUILDINGS THAT HAVE BEEN MOVED THERE.
WOULD YOU LIKE TO SPEAK BACK TO THAT AND HELP ME UNDERSTAND? YES, MA'AM.
THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER FOR THE QUESTION.
UM, WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO DO AS PART OF THE MASTER PLANNING EFFORT IS BASICALLY DO THE ANALYSIS TO BASICALLY LOOK AT THE BUILDINGS TO SEE WHICH BUILDINGS MAY BE, UM, WORTH SAVING AND NOT WORTH SAVING.
WE HAVE SOME CONCERNS THAT SOME OF THE BUILDINGS OUT THERE MAY BE TOO FAR PAST THEIR CONDITION TO BE ABLE TO SAVE.
AND WE HAVE CONCERNS THAT IF THEY'RE DESIGNATED AS HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT RIGHT NOW, THAT WE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO DO THE, EITHER THE NECESSARY REPAIRS OR EVEN POSSIBLY BE ABLE TO REMOVE THE BUILDINGS IF THEY NEED TO BE REMOVED AND THEY'RE NOT ABLE TO BE REPAIRED.
SO WE WOULD LIKE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO THOSE CONDITION ASSESSMENTS ON THOSE BUILDINGS BEFORE THEY'RE, UM, DESIGNATED AS HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT.
THAT'S ALL WE'RE ASKING FOR, IS THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE ABLE TO HAVE THAT MASTER PLANNING EFFORT AND LOOK AT THAT CONDITION ASSESSMENT BEFORE EVERYTHING IS, IS DECLARED, EXCUSE ME, HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT OUT THERE.
NOW I UNDERSTAND WHERE THE CONFUSION IS COMING FROM.
THE DESIGNATION PROCESS WOULD INVITE THE OWNER OF ANY PROPERTY, IN THIS CASE, THE CITY OF DALLAS, TO JOIN US AT THE DESIGNATION COMMITTEE, TO CRAFT THE ORDINANCE REGULATIONS IN A WAY THAT SERVES BOTH THE PURPOSE OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION AND THE NEEDS OF THE OWNER.
CERTAINLY, AS I HAVE A LONG ASSOCIATION WITH THAT MUSEUM, AND I'M PROBABLY MOST FAMILIAR WITH THE BUILDINGS THAN ANYBODY, I RECOGNIZE THAT THEY ARE OF VARIED LEVELS OF HISTORIC IMPORTANCE AND CERTAINLY IN VARIED LEVELS OF, UM, DEFERRED MAINTENANCE, WE MIGHT SAY.
SO THIS PROCESS OF DESIGNATION, YOU WOULD BE INVITED
[00:25:01]
TO JOIN WITH US, OF COURSE, AND WE WOULD DISCUSS THOSE ITEMS AND LAY OUT THE ORDINANCE IN THE BEST INTEREST OF ALL OF US.I DON'T REALLY SEE HOW WE NEED TO COMPLETE THE DRAINAGE ISSUES BEFORE WE DO OUR, UM, OUR INITIATION PROCESS.
THE DRAINAGE HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR DECADES OUT THERE, AND YES, IT HAS BEEN DETRIMENTAL TO THE BUILDINGS AND I'M GLAD IT'S GOING TO BE FIXED.
BUT PRESERVATION AND DESIGNATION DO NOT STOP IMPORTANT WORK FROM TAKING PLACE.
THEY JUST GUIDE IT TO PRE RESERVE THE HISTORIC MATERIAL AND THE HISTORIC ATMOSPHERE.
SO WE ARE NOT IN OPPOSITION TO YOUR EFFORTS AT A MASTER PLAN AND CERTAINLY NOT IN OPPOSITION TO YOUR EFFORTS TO WISELY MANAGE THE HISTORIC FABRIC THERE.
IT'S JUST MOST EFFECTIVE IF THE, IN THAT THE DESIGNATION PROCESS WORKS BEGINNING IMMEDIATELY WORKS WITH YOU AS YOU MOVE ALONG IN YOUR PLANS.
AND, UM, UNLESS THERE ARE ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS, I WILL, I WILL LET ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS WHO MIGHT HAVE SOMETHING TO SAY.
AND, AND COMMISSIONER, IF I MAY, WE ALSO ARE NOT OPPOSED TO HISTORICAL DESIGNATION.
WE JUST WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION IN HAND BEFORE THAT HISTORICAL DESIGNATION HAPPENS.
WE HAVE SOME CONCERNS WITH THE DRAINAGE THAT WE MAY POSSIBLY NEED TO REMOVE SOME OF THESE STRUCTURES IN ORDER TO ADDRESS THE DRAINAGE, AND WE WOULD JUST LIKE TO BE ABLE TO HAVE THAT INFORMATION IN HAND BEFORE THAT HISTORICAL DESIGNATION IS MOVED.
AND THAT'S OUR RESPECTFUL REQUEST TODAY.
AS AS I STATED, I THINK THAT DOING THEM TOGETHER WILL ONLY HELP, AND AS I SAID, WE INTEND TO WORK WITH YOU AND BE UNDERSTANDING IF A BUILDING NEEDED TO COME DOWN OR BE SCOOTED OVER A LITTLE BIT.
SOME OF THEM, THEM ARE QUITE SMALL IN ORDER TO ADDRESS THE DRAINAGE ISSUES.
THAT IS THE TYPE OF THING THAT THE LANDMARK COMMISSION CAN CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND.
AND WE HAVE A VARIETY OF PROFESSIONALS ON OUR COMMISSION, INCLUDING ARCHITECTS AND PEOPLE WHO ARE FAMILIAR WITH THESE ISSUES.
SO I, I REALLY, AGAIN, INSIST THAT WE ARE HERE TO BE YOUR FRIENDS IN THIS PROJECT WORKING TOGETHER, NOT SOME SORT OF ROADBLOCK, BUT IT IS BETTER TO HAVE THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION OVERSIGHT ALL ALONG THE WAY, LEST SOME WELL-MEANING PERSON MAKE AN UNFORTUNATE MISJUDGMENT THAT CANNOT BE UNDONE.
COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY, I KNOW YOU HAVE A, A MOTION, I HAVE A QUESTION MOTION A LITTLE BIT LATER.
UM, AND COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS, I JUST HAD A QUESTION FOR HER ON WHAT YOU MAY HAVE.
IT MAY HAVE BEEN STATED, BUT COULD YOU RESTATE IT IF IT HAD, WHAT'S YOUR TIMEFRAME ON, ON GETTING YOUR, UH, DRAINAGE QUESTIONS AND THINGS LIKE THAT? HAS THAT BEEN ADDRESSED ON WHAT THE TIMEFRAME IS? WE'RE LOOKING AT APPROXIMATELY EIGHT TO NINE MONTHS TO HAVE THESE, UM, CONDITION ASSESSMENTS COMPLETED.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO, UH, ECHO COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY'S COMMENTS ABOUT, UM, GOING THROUGH THE DESIGNATION PROCESS AND THE MASTER PLAN PROCESS AT THE SAME TIME.
I THINK IT CAN BE VERY BENEFICIAL TO HAVE THE DESIGNATION COMMITTEE WORK WITH YOU ON THIS BECAUSE THEY DO HAVE A RESOURCE AND KNOWLEDGE OF THESE BUILDINGS ON THE SITE AND WHICH ONES ARE MOST, MOST IMPORTANT, WHICH ONES ARE IMPORTANT, WHICH ONES MAY NOT BE AS IMPORTANT.
SO THEY CAN REALLY HELP GUIDE THE MASTER PLAN FOR THE SITE, AND THESE CAN EASILY WORK IN TANDEM TOGETHER.
UM, YOU KNOW, AS WE WERE WORKING THROUGH THE PROCESS, UH, COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY MENTIONED THAT YOU WERE ABLE TO BE PART OF THE PROCESS ALONG THE WAY.
I SERVE ON THE DESIGNATION COMMISSION, UH, AS WELL AS COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY.
AND WE HAVE WORKED WITH MANY APPLICANTS OVER THE YEARS ON CRAFTING, UH, PRESERVATION CRITERIA THAT MEET THE NEEDS OF THE, UH, OF THE APPLICANT, AS WELL AS PRESERVING THE IMPORTANT PARTS OF THE SITES OR BUILDINGS THAT WE'RE WORKING TO, TO DESIGNATE.
SO I THINK IT'S VERY BENEFICIAL FOR US TO WORK, UM, TOGETHER, UH, ON THAT.
THANK YOU COMMISSIONER PREZI, ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS PRESENT TODAY IN PERSON WITH ANY COMMENTS? I HAVE A QUESTION.
UH, FOR THE PARK REPRESENTATIVE, CAN SHE GO UP TO THE MIC AGAIN? HOW MANY STRUCTURES ARE AT OLD CITY PARK, PLEASE? I APOLOGIZE.
I'M LOOKING TOWARDS MY PROJECT MANAGER TO HELP GIMME SOME ASSISTANCE WITH THAT ANSWER.
AFTERNOON, I'M TRENT WILLIAMS. UH, DO YOU NEED TO SWEAR ME IN? UH, DO YOU PROMISE TO TELL THE TRUTH TODAY? YES, SIR.
THE TRUTH IS, I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT NUMBER OF STRUCTURES OUT THERE, BUT I, THEY COULD HAVE ESCAPED MY MEMORY OVER THE YEARS.
THERE'S BEEN A FEW ADDITIONS, SO I COULDN'T TELL YOU EXACTLY.
[00:30:02]
I WOULD, UH, GUESS THERE'S SOMEBODY HERE THAT THERE WAS AN EXACT NUMBER.DID YOU SHE COULD HEAR YES, I HEARD THAT.
SO MY NEXT QUESTION WAS GOING TO BE THEN, HOW MANY STRUCTURES HAVE Y'ALL ASSESSED, UH, AS MAY THAT MAY BE NEEDED TO BE MOVED, UH, TO FIXED DRAINAGE ISSUES? WE HAVE NOT STARTED THE STUDY OF THE STRUCTURE, SO WE DO NOT HAVE AN ANSWER ON HOW MANY MIGHT NEED TO BE AFFECTED BY ANY KIND OF DRAINAGE, UH, CONTROL OR, OR REPAIR TO THE, TO THE DEPARTMENT.
UH, HINOJOSA, YOU FINISHED, UM, COMMENTS AND QUESTIONS? YES, I SAID THANK YOU COMMISSIONER SWAN.
I, AND THIS A QUESTION IS ADDRESSED TO REALLY WHOMEVER, UH, FEELS HE OR SHE CAN ANSWER IT.
IT, IT SOUNDS ALMOST AS IF WE'RE CONSIDERING A PIECEMEAL DESIGNATION.
ARE WE, ARE WE LOOKING AT OLD CITY PARK BECAUSE OF ITS, UH, IMPORTANCE AS OLD CITY PARK GOING BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF ITS CREATION, BUT ARE, ARE WE CONSIDERING ALSO ITS STATUS SINCE AT LEAST THE, UH, IMPORTATION OF MILL MORTA THERE IN THE EARLY SIXTIES AS ALSO AS A BUILDING MUSEUM? SO ARE WE CONSIDERING THE ENTIRE EVOLUTION OF OLD CITY PARK FROM ITS FIRST USE AS THE PRIMARY CITY PARK TO ITS CURRENT STATUS AS A BUILDING MUSEUM? AND IF SO, WHY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT THE REMOVAL OF STRUCTURES BEFORE WE DESIGNATE? BECAUSE IT SEEMS TO ME THAT DESIGNATION IS SOMETHING THAT WE DO TO ACKNOWLEDGE SIGNIFICANCE NOT TO, UH, MAN, I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT TO SAY.
IT SOUNDS LIKE WE'RE, IT IS NOT ABOUT EXPEDIENCY.
IT'S ABOUT ACKNOWLEDGING SIGNIFICANCE.
AND THEN I THINK, UH, WHAT WE DO IN THE PROCESS OF DESIGNATION INFORMS, UM, UH, UH, WE LET THE PLACE SPEAK TO US AND TELL US WHAT IT WAS AND WHAT IT HAS BECOME AND HOW THAT IS HISTORICALLY SIGNIFICANT.
AND THEN WE LET THAT INFORM WHAT IT IS TO BECOME.
AND IT SEEMS THAT TO PUT ANYTHING, UH, ANY MATTERS OF EXPEDIENCY IN FRONT OF THAT IS, IS TO GET THE CAR BEFORE THE HORSE.
SO IF, IF ANYBODY, I MEAN, FIRST, IF ANYONE COULD JUST CLARIFY WHY WE ARE MAKING THE DESIGNATION AGAIN, I THINK I, I GET IT.
MY INTENTION IN THIS DESIGNATION WAS TO RECOGNIZE ALL THE SIGNIFICANT HISTORIC EVENTS THAT HAVE TAKEN PLACE THERE FROM ITS EARLIEST, UM, APPEARANCE.
AND THAT WOULD OF COURSE INCLUDE THE COMING OF THE RELOCATED HISTORIC STRUCTURES AS OF VILLAGE SET UP.
THERE IS AT LEAST ONE SUCH MUSEUM THAT IS NOW RECOGNIZED ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER THAT'S IN COLD SPRINGS HARBOR IN CAPE FEAR IN NEW JERSEY.
AND THEY WERE SUCCESSFUL IN DOING THAT BECAUSE IT ITSELF CREATED A, UM, A, IT REPRESENTED A NEW HISTORIC MOVEMENT THAT, UM, TO TRY TO EDUCATE PEOPLE BY HAVING THEM GET TO VISIT A SORT OF A VILLAGE TYPE THING.
THE BUILDINGS OF THEM THEMSELVES, TWO OF THEM ARE RECOGNIZED BY THE, THE STATE OF TEXAS, THE T H C AS HISTORIC ANTIQUITIES.
SO THEY ALWAYS HAVE TO BE, UM, ADDRESSED PROPERLY THROUGH, THROUGH THE T H C BEFORE ANY CHANGES ARE MADE.
AND I, I DEFINITELY AGREE THAT THE REASON WE WANT TO START WITH ASSESSING HISTORICALLY, THE VALUE OF EACH COMPONENT OF THE PARK, WHICH IS BOTH LANDSCAPING AND BUILDINGS BEFORE ANY MAJOR CHANGES ARE MADE, IS BECAUSE WHAT IF ONE OF THOSE MAJOR CHANGES WAS INADVERTENTLY DESTRUCTIVE OF SOMETHING THAT PROVED HISTORICALLY IMPORTANT? HISTORIANS ARE NOT, UM, ILLOGICAL OR NOT UNDERSTANDING OF PRACTICAL THINGS.
UH, I ASSURE YOU I WORKED THERE FOR 15 YEARS AND WAS IN CHARGE OF TRYING TO MAINTAIN THE BUILDINGS ON A TEENY WEENY BUDGET.
AND I HAVE WAITED INTO THE FLOOD WATERS AND RESCUED THE ARTIFACTS AND TRIED TO FIX THE BUILDINGS AFTER THE FLOODING HAPPENED.
I UNDERSTAND THE PRACTICAL CONCERNS RELATED TO OLD CITY PARK, PERHAPS BETTER THAN ANYBODY DOES, EXCEPT THE PEOPLE WHO DO THAT JOB.
NOW, SINCE I LEFT FOUR YEARS AGO, COMMISSIONER SWAN, DID YOU HAVE YES.
AS A MOTION AND ORDER FOR THIS, UH, FOR THIS ITEM? WE, WE WILL, COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY HAS, UM, UH, A MOTION FOR US AFTER.
COMMISSIONER PREZI AS, AS PART OF THE DESIGNATION PROCESS, WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT ALL OF THOSE BUILDINGS INDIVIDUALLY AND SEE WHEN THEY WERE MOVED TO THE SITE.
THEY'RE ALL HISTORIC IN NATURE NOW, UM, BY AGE, BUT THEY ARE NOT NECESSARILY HISTORIC TO THE SITE BY WHEN THEY WERE MOVED TO THE SITE.
SO WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT EACH ONE OF THOSE BUILDINGS WHEN THEY WERE MOVED, WHAT PURPOSE THEY SERVE IN THE OVERALL EDUCATIONAL ASPECT
[00:35:01]
OF WHAT WAS DALLAS HERITAGE VILLAGE.'CAUSE THAT'S REALLY WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS COLLECTION OF BUILDINGS THAT WERE BROUGHT TO THE SITE FOR THAT VERY SPECIFIC PERS PURPOSE TO EDUCATE PEOPLE ABOUT LIFE DURING THOSE DIFFERENT PERIODS OF TIME WHEN THOSE BUILDINGS WERE OCCUPIED AND OWNED.
UM, SO THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE RESEARCH DONE, AND THIS IS WHAT THE DESIGNATION PROCESS WILL HELP US DO, IS TO, TO GO THROUGH EACH ONE OF THE BUILDINGS AND IDENTIFY ALL OF THEM AND HOW THEY RELATE TO ONE ANOTHER AND TO THE SITE.
BUT, UH, I GUESS YOU'RE SAYING THAT, UH, THERE MAY BE, UH, LEVELS, UH, BUT BUT IT ISN'T, ISN'T ALSO TRUE THAT ALL OF THOSE BUILDINGS WERE ASSEMBLED THERE WITH CONSIDERATION TO CREATING AN IMMERSIVE EXPERIENCE, AND ALL OF THEM WERE CHOSEN AND MOVED FOR THEIR CAPACITY TO CONTRIBUTE.
THEY ARE ALL CONTRIBUTING IN THAT SENSE.
UH, BUT SOME OF THOSE MAY HAVE BEEN MOVED IN, UM, LATER THAN THE 40 YEAR TIME PERIOD THAT WE LOOK AT FOR WHAT'S HISTORIC.
SO IF THEY WERE MOVED IN AFTER THOSE 40 YEARS, THEN TECHNICALLY WE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO CONSIDER THEM HISTORIC BECAUSE THEY WERE MOVED IN AFTER, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE WITH CITY OF DALLAS LANDMARK PROCESS, YOU HAVE TO, IT HAS TO BE 40 YEARS OR OLDER.
AND SO WE WOULD LOOK AT IT AS IT'S MOVED TO THE SITE BECAUSE SOME OF THOSE BUILDINGS WERE NOT IN DALLAS OR, OR, UM, LANDMARK BEFORE THEY WERE REMOVED TO THE SITE.
SO WE NEED TO LOOK AT WHAT TIME PERIOD
SO THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CITY OF DALLAS AND CORRECT.
DO WE HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS OR, OR COMMENTS FOR OUR SPEAKERS? IF NOT, I THINK WE'RE READY FOR A MOTION.
COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, DO YOU HAVE A QUESTION? NO, I HAVE A MOTION, UH, CHAIR.
UH, UM, COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY HAS A, A MOTION THAT SHE WAS GOING TO READ WITH, I GAVE 20 YEARS OF MY LIFE TO THAT PLACE.
I WAS NOT TRYING TO USURP YOUR, UH, CONNECTION THERE.
I WAS STILL RELATING TO YOU AS THE CHAIR.
I, I, YEAH, IT, IT'S ALL COMPLICATED.
SO AT THIS TIME, I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION THAT IN THE MATTER OF 1515 SOUTH HARWOOD KNOWN AS OLD CITY PARK, THAT WE APPROVE THE INITIATION OF THIS SITE AS A CITY OF DALLAS LANDMARK AND THE ATION PROCESS.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OR FIRST, IS THERE ANY, UH, DISCUSSION OR COMMENTS AROUND THE MOTION? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.
ANY IN OPPOSITION? RIGHT? YEAH.
NEXT, WE'LL MOVE ON TO CONSENT ITEM ONE.
RHONDA DUNN, SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF PRESENTING CONSENT ITEMS C ONE.
THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS LOCATED AT 1401 COMMERCE STREET.
UH, THE NAME OF THE BUILDING, BECAUSE IT'S INDIVIDUALLY LISTED, IS THE MAGNOLIA BUILDING.
THE CASE NUMBER IS CA 2 34 15 R D.
THE REQUEST ARE AS FOLLOWS, ONE.
A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL A CANOPY AND AWNINGS ON SOUTH COMMERCE STREET AND WEST AKRON STREET ELEVATIONS OVER GROUND LEVEL OPENINGS ONLY TWO.
A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO, TO STOREFRONT FENESTRATION AT GROUND LEVEL, INCLUDING THE INSTALLATION OF NEW WINDOWS AND DOORS.
THE THIRD REQUEST IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE ASPHALT, A TAR LAYERED ROOFING WITH T P O MEMBRANE ROOFING AT 26TH LEVEL.
AND ON ELEVATOR PENTHOUSE FOUR, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL NEW GLASS ROOFTOP ENCLOSURE ABOVE THE MAIN ENTRANCE.
REQUEST NUMBER FIVE, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE UPPER LEVEL METAL RAILING WITH A SPINDLE BALLADE REQUEST SIX.
A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A THREE STORY ADDITION ON RIGHT EAST SIDE OF MAIN BUILDING.
REQUEST NUMBER SEVEN IS FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL SITE IMPROVEMENTS INCLUDING LANDSCAPING AND HARDSCAPING.
IN OTHER WORDS, CURB EXTENSION AND GRANITE PAVERS ON THE SOUTH AND WEST SIDES.
STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS ARE AS FOLLOWS, THIS WILL TAKE
[00:40:01]
A WHILE.ONE, UH, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL A CANOPY AND AWNINGS ON SOUTH COMMERCE STREET AND WEST AKRON STREET ELEVATIONS OVER GROUND LEVEL OPENINGS ONLY BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23.
THE PROPOSED WORK MEETS THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
RECOMMENDATION NUMBER TWO, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO ALTER STOREFRONT FENESTRATION AT GROUND LEVEL, INCLUDING THE INSTALLATION OF NEW WINDOWS AND DOORS BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION THAT APPLICANT'S RESPONSE TO CONDITION TWO OF THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR NATIONAL PARK SERVICE N P S CONDITIONS DATED 7 28 20 23 INCLUDED IN THE APPLICATION BE APPROVED BY N P SS PRIOR TO COMM COMMENCEMENT OF WORK.
IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITION WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERION CRITERIA SECTION TWO, SUBDIVISION A TWO UNDER TREATMENT OF ALTERED PORTIONS AND SECTION FIVE SUBDIVISION D UNDER WINDOW TREATMENT AND GLAZING THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
RECOMMENDATION NUMBER THREE THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE ASPHALT A TAR LAYERED ROOFING WITH T P O MEMBRANE ROOFING AT 26 LEVEL AND ON ELEVATED PENTHOUSE BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23.
THE PROPOSED WORK MEETS THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
RECOMMENDATION NUMBER FOUR, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL NEW GLASS ROOFTOP ENCLOSURE ABOVE THE MAIN ENTRANCE BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23.
BUT THE FOLLOWING CONDITION THAT APPLICANT'S RESPONSE TO CONDITION ONE OF THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR NATIONAL PARK SERVICE CONDITIONS DATED 7 28 20 23 INCLUDED IN THE APPLICATION BE APPROVED BY NATIONAL PARK SERVICE PRIOR TO COMMENCEMENT OF WORK.
IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITION WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
SECTION ONE SUBDIVISION B PERTAINING TO EXCEPTIONS AND SECTION SIX SUBDIVISION A PERTAINING TO BUILDABLE VOLUME, THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION RECOMMENDATION FIVE.
THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE UPPER LEVEL METAL RAILING WITH SPINDLE BALUSTRADE BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION THAT THE REPLACEMENT BALUSTRADE MATCHED THE ORIGINAL STONE BALUSTRADE AND COLOR IN GENERAL COMPOSITION IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITION WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERION.
SECTION TWO, SUBDIVISION B UNDER TREATMENT OF ALTERED PRE ALTERED PORTIONS, THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION RECOMMENDATION SIX.
THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A THREE STORY ADDITION ON RIGHT EAST SIDE OF MAIN BUILDING BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23.
BUT THE FOLLOWING CONDITION, THE APPLICANT'S RESPONSE TO CONDITION ONE OF THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR NATIONAL PARK SERVICE N P S CONDITIONS DATED 7 28 20 23,
[00:45:01]
INCLUDING IN THE APPLICATION BE APPROVED BY N P S PRIOR TO COMMENCEMENT OF WORK IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITION WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERION.SECTION SIX, SUBDIVISION C ACCORDING TO NO PERTAINING TO BUILDABLE VOLUME, THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
AND FINALLY, RECOMMENDATION SEVEN THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL SITE IMPROVEMENTS INCLUDING LANDSCAPING AND HARDSCAPING I E IN OTHER WORDS, A CURB EXTENSION AND GRANITE PAVERS ON THE SOUTH AND WEST SIDES BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS.
STATED 9 7 20 23 POST WORK MEETS THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIORS GUIDELINES FOR SETTING DISTRICT OR NEIGHBORHOOD TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATIONS.
THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL A CANOPY AND AWNINGS ON SOUTH COMMERCE STREET AND WEST AKRON STREET ELEVATIONS OVER GROUND LEVEL OPENINGS ONLY BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED.
THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO ALTER STOREFRONT FENESTRATION AT GROUND LEVEL, INCLUDING THE INSTALLATION OF NEW WINDOWS AND DOORS BE APPROVED.
THE FOLLOWING CONDITION, APPLICANT TO ADDRESS CONDITION TWO OF THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR NATIONAL PARK SERVICE CONDITIONS DATED 7 28 20 23 ATTACHED TO THIS APPLICATION.
THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE ASPHALT CAR LAYERED ROOFING WITH T P O MAN BRAIN ROOFING AT 26TH LEVEL AND ON ELEVATOR PENTHOUSE BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED, OR THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL NEW GLASS ROOFTOP ENCLOSURE ABOVE THE MAIN ENTRANCE BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION.
APPLICANT TO ADDRESS CONDITION ONE OF THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR NATIONAL PARK SERVICE CONDITIONS DATED 7 28 20 23 ATTACHED TO THIS APPLICATION.
FIVE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE UPPER LEVEL METAL RAILING WITH A SPINDLE BALLAST TRADE BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED.
THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A THREE STORY EDITION ON RIGHT EAST SIDE OF MAIN BUILDING, BE APPROVED FOR THE FOLLOWING CONDITION.
APPLICANT TO ADDRESS CONDITION ONE OF THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR NATIONAL PARK SERVICE CONDITIONS DATED 7 28 20 23 ATTACHED TO THIS APPLICATION.
SEVEN, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL SITE IMPROVEMENTS INCLUDING LANDSCAPING AND HARDSCAPING.
FOR EXAMPLE, A CURB EX EXTENSION AND GRANITE PAVERS ON THE SOUTH AND WEST SIDE TO BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION, NO STREET TREES ON ACCURATE STREET OR COMMERCE STREET.
NOTE THE APPLICANT SUBMITTED REVISIONS ADDRESSING CONDITIONS ONE AND TWO OF THE NET UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF THE INTERIOR NATIONAL PARK SERVICE CONDITIONS DATED 7 28 20 23 ATTACHED TO THIS APPLICATION.
COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERG PUT OUR FIRST, UM, SPEAKER PLEASE.
FOR THIS ITEM WE HAVE FELICIA SANTIAGO, COULD YOU PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND YOUR COMMITMENT TO TELL THE TRUTH TODAY? GOOD AFTERNOON EVERYONE.
I'M AN ARCHITECT WITH GUNSLER AND I, I DO PROMISE TO TELL THE TRUTH.
I'VE ALSO BROUGHT, UH, SOME ADDITIONAL MATERIAL FOR YOU ALL TO LOOK AT, UH, ADDITIONAL IMAGES OF BOT CANOPIES AND NIES, AS WELL AS PHYSICAL SAMPLES OF MATERIALS AS WELL.
AND BEHIND ME, I DO HAVE THE TWO ADDITIONAL SPEAKERS THAT WE SIGNED UP.
IF YOU DON'T MIND, I'LL, I'LL BRING THEM UP WITH ME SO THAT WE CAN CLARIFY AND ANSWER QUESTIONS AS THEY COME UP.
JUST GO AHEAD AND NAME ALL THE SPEAKERS ON THE SIDE OF FELICIA SANTIAGO, PATRICK PARKER, ALEJANDRO GUERRERO, AND BILL PEARSON.
AND PRIOR TO SPEAKING, IF YOU'LL JUST STATE YOUR NAME AND YOUR COMMITMENT TO TELL THE TRUTH.
IT'S PATRICK PARKER, UH, PROJECT ARCHITECT.
AND I WAS SPELLED ALEJANDRO GUERRERO.
I'M ON DESIGN DIRECTOR WITH LER, ALSO AN ARCHITECT.
UM, WITH THE OWNERSHIP, DID YOU HAVE, UM, A PREPARED STATEMENT
[00:50:01]
OR ANYTHING THAT YOU WANT TO DO? YOU DO HAVE THAT TIME AVAILABLE? UH, WE DO NOT.UM, BUT WE DO WANNA EXPRESS THAT WE HAVE ENJOYED WORKING ON THIS PROJECT.
WE UNDERSTAND THE IMPORTANCE OF THIS HISTORIC BUILDING TO DOWNTOWN DALLAS, AND WE'RE, WE'RE LOOKING FORWARD TO CONTINUING THE WORK.
UH, SO WE'LL GO AHEAD AND BEGIN WITH QUESTIONS.
COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER? I HAVE A FEW.
UM, I JUST NOTICED IN REVIEWING THE PRESENTATION, IT WASN'T A PART OF THE REQUEST, BUT IT IS SOMETHING THAT IS SHOWN TO BE CHANGED ON, UH, FROM THE EXISTING CONDITION, UH, TO POTENTIALLY IN THE FUTURE SHOWS THE FLAGPOLE BEING REMOVED ABOVE THE MAIN ENTRANCE, UM, AT THE POINT OF, UH, WHERE IT IS BEHIND THE MEDALLION.
AND MY RESEARCH OF SHOWING THAT TO BE A INTEGRAL PART OF THIS BUILDING SINCE ITS INCEPTION IN 1922, I WAS, UM, RENDERING SHOW FLAG POLES TO BE MOVED TO AN OUTRIGGER TYPE FASHION ON THE FACADE.
UH, IN THE FUTURE, POTENTIALLY WE NEED TO ADDRESS, UH, THAT CHANGE IF THAT'S, UH, PLANNED.
WASN'T A PART OF THIS REQUEST, BUT I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT THE PLAN IS.
WE DO UNDERSTAND THAT THE FLAGPOLE IS, UM, IN, WAS INSTALLED IN 1922, UM, HOWEVER IT WAS REMOVED AND REPLACED IN 1998.
SO THE FLAGPOLE THAT YOU SEE THERE IS NOT THE ORIGINAL HISTORIC FLAGPOLE, BUT IT'S BEEN A PART OF A VISUAL ASPECT OF THE BUILDING SINCE THE BEGINNING, CORRECT? YES, IT HAS.
AND, UM, I'M CURIOUS TO KNOW, UM, WHAT, UH, INSPIRED THE DESIGN OF THE CANOPY, UM, AND WHAT BROUGHT ABOUT THAT KIND OF SCALLOPED DESIGN IS THAT, UH, A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT FACTORS THAT WE CONSIDERED.
UM, ONE, ONE IMPORTANT ASPECT WAS TO ACHIEVE A LIGHTNESS IN, IN THAT STRUCTURE, UH, UNDERSTANDING THAT, UH, FOLLOWING THE, THE USE FOR THE, FOR THE BUILDING, UH, AND, AND THE REQUIREMENT TO, FROM A BRAND, UH, THAT, THAT WILL BE OPERATING THE BUILDING TO HAVE A COVER OVER THE, THE MAIN DOOR.
UH, NOT ONLY TO SIGNAL THE ENTRANCE, BUT ALSO TO PROVIDE SOME, UH, UH, COVERAGE FROM THE, FROM THE WEATHER.
AND, UM, IN, IN, IN TRYING TO ACHIEVE THAT GOAL, WE ALSO LOOKED AT, UH, MAINTAINING THE INTEGRITY OF THE VISUAL ASPECT OF THE, OF THE FACADE OF THE HISTORIC FACADE, SO LIGHTNESS AND ALSO CREATING A, UH, ELEMENT THAT WOULD FEEL APPROPRIATE AND, AND WOULD FEEL INTEGRATED TO THE, TO THE ORIGINAL DESIGN.
UM, THE, THE, THE SCALLOP OR, OR THE WAY THAT THE, UH, CANOPY FEATHERS OUT OF THE BUILDING HAS TO DO WITH INTEGRATING A, UM, THE, THE, THE EXISTING OPENING OF, OF THE FAC OR THE, THE MAIN ENTRANCE, BUT THEN ALSO TRYING TO ACHIEVE, UH, A LARGER COVERAGE FOR, FOR THE WEATHER, FOR PEOPLE, UH, STANDING, UH, WAITING FOR, UH, UH, AN AUTOMOBILE WAITING TO BE PICKED, PICKED UP OR RIGHT BEFORE ENTERING THE BUILDING.
AND, AND IT ALSO ANTICIPATES, UH, THE, THE, THE REDESIGN OF THE INTERIOR OF THE BUILDING IN, IN TRYING TO CONNECT VISUALLY, UH, THE, THE AESTHETICS OF, UH, THE ASSIGNED BEING, BEING BROUGHT TO THE, TO THE BUILDING.
SO YOU WOULD SAY THE ADDING OF THIS CANOPY IS PRIMARILY DUE TO THE FACT THAT THE CURRENT MOTOR COURT IS BEING TAKEN UP BY THE NEW BUILDING? YES.
SO THE EXISTING COVERED AREAS WAS ANY THOUGHT GIVEN TO PROVIDING A DESIGN THAT MATCHES MORE CLOSELY THE KIND OF MORE STANDARD STREAMLINED KIND OF DESIGN FOUND ON BUILDINGS SUCH AS YOUR NEIGHBOR ACROSS THE STREET OFFICE OR THE DAVIS BUILDING OR, UM, INTERURBAN BUILDING MORE FORMS OF KIND OF LINEAR STANDARD, A DESIGN THAT BEING MORE FITTING OF A BUILDING OF THE EARLY, EARLY 20TH CENTURY.
WE, WE LOOKED AT A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT SCHEMES, UH, ORIGINALLY, UH, LANDED ON ONE, UH, THAT, UH, TO OUR INTERPRETATION, UH, ALSO ACHIEVED A, A LOOP AND AESTHETIC THAT THAT WAS APPROPRIATE TO, TO THE, UH, ERA OF THE, THE ORIGINAL BUILDING.
UH, NEVERTHELESS, UH, OF COURSE USING A, WITHOUT MORE OF AN EXPRESSIVE, UH, LOOK IN, IN INCORPORATED
[00:55:01]
CURVES THAT THAT, THAT WE PERHAPS SAW IN SOME, UH, FACADE MOTIFS.SO ARE YOU, DID I HEAR YOU SAY THAT YOU HAVE A DIFFERENT DESIGN OR WE, WE, WE ORIGINALLY STARTED WITH A DESIGN THAT ACTUALLY WAS, UH, LARGER.
UH, IT WAS, IT WAS A LARGER CANOPY THAT, THAT IN WORKING CLOSELY, UH, WITH THE LANDMARK COMMISSION AND, AND THROUGH, UH, ANTICIPATORY HEARINGS, UH, WE, WE, UM, WE, WE ARRIVE AT, AT THE, AT THE CURRENT DESIGN THAT, THAT YOU SEE, WHAT BODIES, UM, KIND OF GAVE YOU ENCOURAGEMENT TO GO THIS KIND OF ROUTE WITH THIS DESIGN? WAS THERE ANY SPECIFIC, UH, SO WE HAVE, UM, HAD OUR CANOPY DESIGN GO THROUGH SEVERAL ITERATIONS FROM THE BEGINNING.
WE'VE BEEN LOOKING AT THIS DESIGN FOR ABOUT TWO YEARS NOW.
THE, UH, COURTESY REVIEWS THAT WE'VE HAD WITH LANDMARK, UH, HERE, WE'VE TAKEN THOSE COMMENTS INTO CONSIDERATION.
UH, WE'VE HAD SEVERAL REVIEWS WITH C H C, UH, FOR THE TAX CREDIT PROCESS THAT WE ARE UNDERGOING.
WE'VE TAKEN THEIR COMMENTS INTO CONSIDERATION AS WELL AS NATIONAL PARK SERVICE.
UH, SO IT, IT HAS GONE THROUGH, UM, SEVERAL DIFFERENT FORMS TRYING TO GET IT JUST RIGHT FOR THE ENTRANCE OF THIS BUILDING.
UM, YEAH, THERE WERE SOME QUESTIONS THAT NOVEMBER 7TH ABOUT
I WOULD'VE BEEN VERY CURIOUS TO SEE ANY OTHER DESIGNS THAT YOU HAD IF YOU, YOU HADN'T.
UM, SO MOVING ALONG, UM, THE ADDITIONS FACADE, UH, TO THE EAST, IT'S SIGNIFICANTLY CHANGED SINCE THE COURTESY REVIEW, AND I'M VERY CURIOUS AS TO THE INSPIRATION FOR THAT.
THE ORIGINAL DESIGN KIND OF FOLLOWED SOME OF THE HORIZONTAL LINES, DIDN'T EXACTLY MATCH THE BUILDING, BUT DID KIND OF COMPLIMENT A LITTLE BIT.
THIS IS A VERY FAR DEPARTURE OF THAT.
CURIOUS TO KNOW HOW YOU ENDED UP THERE.
SO, UH, AS YOU MENTIONED, IT DID HAVE A DIFFERENT DESIGN AND JUST LIKE THE CANOPY, IT'S GONE THROUGH SEVERAL DESIGN ITERATIONS AS WELL.
AND AS WE CONTINUE TALKING WITH THE DIFFERENT PARTIES THAT, UM, ARE LOOKING AT THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION OF THE BUILDING, WE TOOK THEIR COMMENTS AND APPLIED IT TO THE DESIGN.
WHAT YOU SEE NOW IS A COLLABORATION OF THE DISCUSSIONS THAT WE'VE HAD LEADING TO A DESIGN UNDERSTANDING.
WE LOOKED CLOSELY AT THE VERTICALITY OF THIS BUILDING WANTING TO INCORPORATE THAT MORE IN AN IDEAL RATHER THAN A LITERAL TRANSLATION.
UM, WE ALSO FOLLOWED THAT SAME CONCEPT WITH THE HORIZONTAL LINES THAT YOU ARE SPEAKING OF.
AND IN TAKING THOSE, THOSE COMMENTS, APPLYING THAT TO THE DESIGN, WHAT WE CAME UP WITH AND ULTIMATELY FORWARD ON TO T H C AND NATIONAL PARK SERVICE, WE GOT REALLY GREAT POSITIVE FEEDBACK FROM THEM.
AND THEY'RE UNDERSTANDING THAT THE DESIGN THAT WE HAVE FOR THIS NEW EDITION ISN'T A REPLICA.
IT'S NOT TAKING ANYTHING LITERALLY.
AND IT GIVES A NEW GREAT CONTRAST OF HISTORIC AND NEW.
UM, UH, I, I HAD SOME FURTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT THE, THE BRASS AT THE NOVEMBER 7TH MEETING, AND I WAS THE ONE WHO RAISED THE CONCERNS ABOUT THE COLOR OF THE BRASS AND LOOKED TO BRASSY.
UM, I DO LIKE THIS BRONZE COLOR THAT WAS PASSED AROUND, DEFINITELY MORE SUBDUED, AND I BELIEVE THE MECONIUM IN OPEN AIR SPACE WOULD BE BETTER HIDDEN BY THIS COLOR.
SO ANY FURTHER CONCERNS ABOUT THAT? UM, THERE WERE SOME FURTHER COMMENTS FROM THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE AND SOME OF THE DISCUSSIONS ABOUT SOME OF THE TREES THAT WERE PLACED ON THE, ON THE ROUTE.
I NOTICE IN SOME OF THE RENDERINGS THAT THERE WERE TREES STILL IN THAT OPEN AIR COURT WAS THE ULTIMATE GOAL, FOLLOWED E P SS RECOMMENDATION AND NOT HAVE THOSE THERE.
SO THE, THE OPENING AIR COURT, IS THAT THE ROOF DECK THAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO WITH THE POOL? WELL, BOTH THE POOL AND THE OPEN AIR, UH, THAT I BELIEVE THE N P SS DOCUMENTS STATED THERE WAS ONE OF THE CONDITIONS WAS THAT TREES NOT BE VISIBLE.
UM, AND I THINK THAT WOULD BE ACROSS THE BOARD IN ALL AREAS THAT WOULD BE VISIBLE FROM THE GROUND.
SO FOR THE HISTORIC BUILDING, THERE WILL BE NOTHING VISIBLE PAST
YOU MAY HAVE SEEN WAS UPDATED, REMOVED TREES POOL DECK, BUT YOU MAY HAVE SEEN HIMSELF THAT DOESN'T VISIBLE, JUST WANTED TO CONFIRM THAT WAS PART OF THIS, UH, 'CAUSE I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE TREES ADDED TO THE AIR AIRPORT MAYBE TO TRY TO HIDE THE
AND I THINK WITH THE CHANGES IN THE BRASS, I WOULD FEEL BETTER WITH HOW THE TREES
THAT REALLY CONCLUDES MY QUESTIONS.
YOU MAY HAVE FURTHER COMMENTS.
DO YOU HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM ME? COMMISSIONER SHERMAN? I HAVE A REQUEST.
UM, WE'RE ALL VISUAL LEARNERS, SOME
[01:00:01]
OF US MORE SO THAN OTHERS, SO IT WOULD REALLY HELP, I BELIEVE IF WE'RE NOT LOOKING AT WRITTEN TEXTS WHILE WE'RE HAVING THESE DISCUSSIONS ABOUT FORM AND, UH, RENDERINGS AND COLOR, IT WOULD BE FAR MORE ADVANTAGEOUS.I THINK IF WE WERE TO GET OUR VISUALS ALL IN FRONT OF US.
WE PARTICULARLY LIKE PAGE ONE 18 OF 6 0 7, ET CETERA, IF THAT'S OKAY, LISA, UH, PLEASE.
RIGHT? UM, BECAUSE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE ADDITION BEING MODERNISTIC AND IT'S VERY DIFFICULT FOR THOSE OF US THAT ARE NOT ARCHITECTS TO DISCUSS THAT INTELLIGENTLY WITHOUT LOOKING AT IT, UM, IN FRONT OF US.
IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT FORM AND FENESTRATION AND WHAT HAVE YOU.
IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE MO, YOU KNOW, THE ADDITION BEING A MODERNISTIC, SOLELY MODERNISTIC EXPRESSION AND NOT RELATING TO THE, THE MAGNOLIA, UM, AS IT IS, WHAT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO WITNESS IT? IT WAS, I HAVE A QUESTION.
IT COMMISSIONER TRUMAN? IS, IS THAT ONE ADEQUATE? OKAY, COMMISSIONER? UH, YEAH, I HAD A QUESTION.
UM, N P S NATIONAL PARK SERVICE MAY HAVE BEEN LOOKING AT THIS.
UM, IS THIS THE, UH, REITERATION, IS THIS THE DESIGN BEFORE US? IS THAT CURRENTLY, IS THAT THE COMMENTS THAT THEY'VE MADE BASED UPON THIS DESIGN OR IS THAT ON ANOTHER VERSION? NO, THE THE PACKAGE THAT WE'VE SUBMITTED TO YOU ARE THE SAME DRAWINGS THAT THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE HAS IN HAND.
DID THEY NOT HAVE ANY CONCERNS WITH THE, THE FISHBOWL, HUMAN FISHBOWL EFFECT THAT THE, THIS IS KIND OF CREATING? UM, DID THEY HAVE ANY, ANY COMMENTS ON THIS? YOU MEAN FROM THE ADDITION? YEAH, FROM THE ADDITION.
NO, THEY DID NOT HAVE ANY FURTHER COMMENTS FOR US.
ON THE ADDITION OF THE ADDITION THAT YOU SEE IN THIS IMAGE HERE, IT DOES HIGHLIGHT THE TWO STORY BALLROOM THAT IS WITHIN IT.
COMMISSIONER MINGS, DO YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS? NOT PUT TOGETHER QUITE YET.
COMMISSIONER RENELL, I HAVE SOME COMMENTS AND QUESTIONS REGARDING THE, THE GROUND PLANE OR FIRST FLOOR ELEVATION IN PARTICULAR, ESPECIALLY IN COMPARISON TO THE, THE QUANTITY OF FENESTRATION AND THE, UH, THE AMOUNT OF ATTENTION TO DETAIL.
AND THIS IS IN STARK CONTRAST, BASICALLY A CLEAN PLANE, NO ARTICULATION.
THERE'S MAYBE FOUR LINES THAT ARE VERTICAL IN IT, MARKING SOME DOORS.
I ALSO REALIZE IT'S A, IT'S A, UH, IT'S A LOADING, UH, OR LOADING AREA.
HOWEVER, I MEAN, JUST IN COMPARISON TO SOME OTHER HISTORIC BUILDINGS, UH, FIRE STATIONS, FOR INSTANCE, THERE'S ONE ON, UM, ON CEDAR, ON CEDAR SPRINGS, UH, A FEW BLOCKS FROM MY OFFICE.
AND, YOU KNOW, GRANTED THEIR DOORS, I MEAN, THEY'RE, THEY'RE BAY, THEY'RE BAYS FOR, FOR VEHICLES.
I REALIZE THIS ONE'S PROBABLY ABOUT THREE OR FOUR TIMES THE WIDTH OF THOSE.
HOWEVER, THE ATTENTION TO, TO DETAIL AND HUMAN SCALE AT GROUND LEVEL IN PARTICULAR, LET ALONE THE FISHBOWL EFFECT UP ABOVE THAT, IT SEEMS TOO FAR IN CONTRAST TO ME PERSONALLY.
UM, YOU KNOW, WITH ANYTHING DEPICTING, YOU KNOW, UM, UM, A BREAKDOWN SCALE, HUMAN SIZE, UM, AND I'M ASSUMING THIS IS PROBABLY 12 TO 15 FEET TALL AND PROBABLY 40, 50 FEET WIDE WITH, WITH VIRTUALLY NO FENESTRATION IS, IS TOO STARK FOR, FOR ME.
UM, IN YOUR INVESTIGATION OF, OF THE DETAILING OF THAT, UM, WHAT'S, WHAT'S BEEN THE PROGRESS OF, WHAT'S BEEN THE, UH, THE ANALYSIS OF THAT AND WHY IS IT SO STARK? UH, WHILE WE DISCUSSED THIS, IS IT POSSIBLE TO, UM, MOVE THE PAGE TO FURTHER INTO THE PACKAGE? WE DO HAVE A DRAWING THAT HIGHLIGHTS THIS AREA, IF YOU WILL.
[01:05:22]
OKAY.WHERE YOU WANT TO GO? SO THIS LOOKS LIKE THE BEGINNING OF OUR PACKAGE WITH EXISTING PHOTOGRAPH, UM, EXISTING CONDITIONS.
SO IF YOU SCROLL TO THE, UM, PROBABLY TOWARDS THE END, YES.
UM, LET'S TRY IN THE, UH, A 100 AREA, WE CAN JUST ELEVATIONS A BIT TOO FAR.
I'LL, I'LL SCALE IT BACK TO, YEAH, YOU GO AHEAD.
IF YOU DON'T MIND JUST SCROLLING OVER TO THE RIGHT HAND SIDE, THIS IS A GOOD ELEVATION FOR US TO LOOK AT.
SO THIS ELEVATION SHOWS THE COMMERCE STREET SAW, UM, HIGHLIGHTING THE ADDITION WITH THE LOADING DOCK AT GROUND LEVEL.
AND I'LL MENTION BEFORE I HAND IT OFF TO, UH, ONE OF MY DESIGN TEAMMATES HERE, UH, THAT THE LOADING DOCK DOORS HAVE ALSO GONE THROUGH SEVERAL ITERATIONS.
WE'VE LISTENED TO, UM, MANY FOLKS WITH THEIR ADVICE ON HOW TO DESIGN THIS, HOW IT WOULD LOOK AT STREET LEVEL, UH, WALKING PAST IT.
AT ONE POINT IT DID LOOK LIKE, UH, TRUE LOADING DOCK DOORS.
AND, UH, WE WERE ENCOURAGED TO PROGRESS OUR DESIGN FURTHER.
UH, SO THIS IS OUR, OUR ULTIMATE DESIGN, BUT I'LL, I'LL ALLOW MY COMMIT TO
AND, AND OF COURSE, WHAT YOU'RE SEEING HERE IS, IS, IS A CONCLUSION OR AT LEAST A PRELIMINARY CONCLUSION OF, OF A LONG, LONG PROCESS, LONG DESIGN PROCESS.
AND, UH, HERE WE ARE REPRESENTING A MUCH LARGER TEAM THAT INCLUDES BOTH OWNERSHIP, UH, ALTHOUGH DESIGN DISCIPLINES AND, UH, IMPORTANTLY TO THE, THE HOTEL BRAND.
UM, THE, UM, IN, IN THE EVOLUTION OF THIS DESIGN, WE SAW A, UM, AN OPPORTUNITY TO ESTABLISH A POINT IN TIME FOR THIS EXPANSION.
AND IN REVIEWING INITIAL, UH, EXPLORATIONS, UH, BOTH WITH THE CITY AND WITHIN THE THE SIGN TEAM, WHAT WE DECIDED ON, UH, WAS TO, UH, GO FOR A DESIGN THAT WOULD, UH, MORE, MORE CLOSELY EXPRESS, UH, CURRENT, CURRENT POSSIBILITIES, UH, WITH THE DESIGN, WITH TECHNOLOGY AND, AND, AND DESIGN TECHNOLOGY.
AND, UM, ALTHOUGH WE TOOK HINTS OR WE KEPT HINTS OF THE, OF THE EXISTING BUILDING IN, IN THE WAY OF ESTABLISHING A DATE LINE OR, OR CARRYING THROUGH DATE LINES, AS YOU SEE ON THE TOP CORNERS AND ON THE, ON THE LOCATION OF THE GROUND LEVEL, UH, FENESTRATION, UH, OPENING, UH, WE, WE DECIDED TO REMOVE THE, THE REMAINDER DETAIL, UNDERSTANDING THAT IT WAS ALSO GOING TO BE VERY HARD TO MIMIC, UH, A BUILDING THAT THAT WAS, UH, DESIGNED AND CONCEIVED MORE, MORE THAN A HUNDRED YEARS AGO.
SO IN A WAY, IT'S, UH, CELEBRATING THE EXISTING BUILDING, UH, LOOKING TO ELEVATE BOTH THE BUILDING AND ITS SURROUNDING, UH, CONTEXT, BUT DOING IT IN A, IN A WAY THAT IT'S CONTEMPORARY AND IT SPEAKS, UH, MORE CLOSELY TO DAYS, UH, WAY OF THINKING ABOUT ARCHITECTURE AND DESIGN.
UH, THE OTHER, UH, IMPORTANT THING TO MENTION IS, UM, ON THE, UH, THE, THE LARGE FORMAT WINDOW IS, IS AN OPPORTUNITY THAT WE SAW ON, ON RETHINKING THE WAY THAT THIS TYPES OF CASES, UH, OCCUR, UH, OCCURRED, UH, BOTH IN THE CITY AND, AND IN MANY PLACES WHERE BIG EVENTS ARE, ARE, ARE HELD, UH, BEHIND, UH, BEHIND DOORS ARE NOT TYPICALLY NOT EXPOSED TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC, TYPICALLY SPACES THAT ARE, UM, NOT, UH, NATURALLY LIT AND, AND KIND OF HIDDEN FROM THE, FROM THE PUBLIC REAL.
AND HERE WE SAW THIS OPPORTUNITY TO ENGAGE THE CITY IN A DIFFERENT WAY BY FACING, UH, LARGE WINDOWS BOTH ON THIS FACADE AND ON THE, UH, PEGA PARK FACADE.
AND GIVING THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THIS EVENTS TO OPEN UP TOWARDS THE CITY AND BE ABLE TO HAVE THAT DIALOGUE BETWEEN THE PUBLIC REALM AND THE PRIVATE, UM, EVENTS TAKING PLACE.
UM, AND, AND AT THE SAME TIME, OFFERING THIS, BUILDING AN OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE A UNIQUE SPACE
[01:10:01]
THAT, UH, WHEN YOU THOUGHT ABOUT, UH, HOSTING AN EVENT IN, IN THIS PLACE, YOU, YOU NOT ONLY, UH, WERE HOSTING A MEETING IN THE CITY IN DALLAS, BUT LITERALLY ENGAGING THE CITY OF DALLAS AS A BACKGROUND, AS A BACKDROP TO, TO THOSE, UH, TO, TO THAT EVENT.AND LASTLY, TOUCHING ON THE BOTTOM ON THE GROUND FLOOR.
UH, AGAIN, UH, THROUGH A SERIES OF DIFFERENT ITERATIONS, I THINK THE DECISION WAS MADE TO, UH, TO, UH, NOT CALL TOO MUCH ATTENTION TO THIS, TO THE, TO THE LARGE FORMAT DOORS TO ALLOW THE LOADING DOCK TO HAPPEN BEHIND.
ALSO, ALSO THE REQUIREMENT, UH, AS, AS, UH, AS BEEN STATED HERE, HAS TO DO WITH BEING ABLE TO OPERATE AND TO, UH, FACILITATE, UH, LOADING AND UNLOADING, UH, DELIVERIES AND, AND REMOVAL OF, OF TRASH.
UH, AND ALTHOUGH THERE'S, UH, THERE'S SIMPLE LINES AND SIMPLE DESIGN, WHAT WE DID TRY TO DO WAS TO MAINTAIN A HIGH QUALITY, UH, MATERIAL PALLET, UH, IN, IN OTHER WORDS, BUT WE'RE THINKING IS THAT THE SAME BRASS, UH, FINISH THAT, THAT YOU HAVE ELSEWHERE, UH, IN THE PROJECT, BOTH IN THE EXISTING BUILDING AND, AND ON THE ADDITION, YOU, YOU WOULD SEE HERE AND THE, THE, THE ENTIRE GROUND FLOOR AS, AS YOU SEE IT HERE ON THIS FACADE, WOULD BE CLAD WITH THE SAME STONE THAT IT'S USED IN THE BUILDING.
SO EVEN THE GARAGE, UH, DOOR THAT THAT OPENS UP TO ALLOW FOR DELIVERIES WOULD BE CLAD, UM, WITH, WITH THE INDIANA LIMESTONE, THAT, THAT IT'S, THAT THAT WAS USED IN THE ORIGINAL BUILDING AND THE ANY DETAIL WOULD COME FROM THAT, THAT TEXTURE.
UH, AND THAT COMBINATION OF MATERIALS.
AND THEN VERY SLA, VERY SUBTLE, UM, JOINT, JOINT WARD, UH, IN THE STONE, UH, TO BE USED.
NO, I APPRECIATE THE, UM, THE LIKENESS OF MATERIALS, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, SIMILAR VERTICAL PROPORTIONS, HOWEVER, IT'S JUST THE WAY THE BUILDING MEETS THE GROUND, YOU KNOW, AND IT DOESN'T MATTER IF IT WAS BUILT IN 1900 OR IN 2020, UM, THE BUILDING STILL MEETS THE GROUND AND IN THE, IN THE, THE HISTORIC BUILDING OR THE HOTEL IT IS EXISTS TODAY.
I MEAN, IT ACKNOWLEDGED THE SIZE OF A HUMAN BEING NEXT TO IT.
UM, AND, AND YOUR PROPOSAL IN MY MIND DOES NOT, UM, IT RESPONDS TO THE SIZE OF A TRUCK AND NOT THE SIZE OF A PERSON.
IT'S, IT'S NOT, UM, YOU KNOW, MATERIALS.
UM, I MEAN, YOU EVEN MADE AN ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF, OF PUTTING A, A PLANTER IN FRONT OF A, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE SAME SIZE PLANTER AS IN FRONT OF THE OTHER WINDOWS, WHICH MEANS, YEAH, THERE IS, UH, THE POTENTIAL FOR SOMEONE BEING NEXT TO THIS AND, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE APPRECIATING SOMETHING GREEN AND IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE SAME SIZE, BUT, UM, BUT THERE'S REALLY NOTHING ELSE.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S MY CONCERN ABOUT IT, ABOUT THIS DESIGN.
COMMISSIONER RNA, DO YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS OR COMMENT? COMMISSIONER, COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS? DID YOU, YEAH, JUST SOMETHING BRIEF, UM, SINCE WE'RE EXPOSED SEEMINGLY TO ALL OF THE, TO A LOT OF THE FRONT OF THE FINISH, WHAT'S ON THE INTERIOR? DO WE HAVE THAT THE FINISHES BROKE DOWN FROM THE INTERIOR OF THE, LOOKING THROUGH THIS FISHBOWL, UM, BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE INTERIOR FINISHES SEEMS TO COME INTO PLAY SINCE IT'S SO EXPOSED.
SO THOSE FINISHES WOULD BE JUST ABOUT AS IMPORTANT AS SOME OF THE FINISHES ON THE EXTERIOR, SINCE IT'S THIS BIG OPEN WINDOWS ALSO EXPOSED.
UM, SO I'M WONDERING IF THERE'S EVEN A BREAKDOWN ON THAT.
I DID HAVE A QUESTION ON ALSO STAFF.
UM, I WAS GONNA ASK STAFF, STAFF IF THEY, UM, COULD RESPOND TO MAYBE THE BUILDING VOLUME AS SPOKEN THROUGH N P SS ON THE, UH, WHERE NEW STRUCTURES CAN BE SYMPATHETIC AND HOW SOMETIMES THEY MAY BE AN ADVERSE EFFECT.
UM, CAN YOU JUST BRIEFLY SPEAK TO, UH, THIS, I, I, APPARENTLY YOU DIDN'T HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WITH THIS CREATING AN ADVERSE EFFECT WITH RESPECT TO THE ANNEX? YES.
UM, AND I KNOW THERE'S, OH, SOME THINGS THAT CAN BE LOOKED AT FROM ONE SET OF EYES TO
[01:15:01]
ANOTHER SET OF EYES, BUT, UH, WHAT'S, CAN YOU KIND OF PULL THIS IN HERE A LITTLE BIT ON, ON, ON THAT FOR ME? HOW YOU WERE LOOKING AT? YES.I WAS LOOKING AT IT IN TERMS OF THE MATCHING OF THE LIMESTONE, THE HORIZONTAL LINE GOING ACROSS ALSO WITH RESPECT TO THE ORDINANCE, SAYING IT'S OKAY TO BUILD A THREE STORY ADDITION IN THIS LOCATION, THAT THIS IS A BUILDABLE AREA.
SO THAT'S WHAT I WAS LOOKING AT.
I MEAN, I CAN SEE IT NOW FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE, THAT IT'S NOT AS DETAILED AS IT SHOULD BE, AS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, COMMISSIONER RENO.
NOT, UM, IT'S NOT QUITE WHAT I'M SAYING, AT LEAST ON MY VANTAGE POINT.
I'M KIND OF SAYING ALMOST TO THE ANOTHER EFFECT, UH, AT LEAST ON THROUGH THE RENDERING THAT I'VE SEEN, HOW IT JUST ILLUMINATES THE ENTIRE SPACE AND WITH THE BIG, THE, THE LARGE GLAZING AREA THAT WE ARE, AND THAT THAT FISHBOWL EFFECT THAT WE'RE HAVING, THE INTERIOR NOW IS BEING BROUGHT TO THE EXTERIOR AND THOSE COME INTO PLAY.
SO I'M KIND OF SEEING IT FROM THAT, NOT ONLY THE ELEVATIONS HERE, BUT ALSO THE RENDERING THAT I'VE JUST SEEN ON SOME OF THE PRIOR PAGES.
UM, SO I, YOU'RE NOT TAKING INTO ANY, ANY ISSUES.
STAFF DOESN'T TAKE ANY ISSUES WITH SEEING SO MUCH OF THE INTERIOR AND HAVING, WHEN IT'S A PARTY GOING ON AT NIGHT, THAT THIS WILL BE A HUGE FOCAL POINT ILLUMINATING THIS GREAT SPACE, AND THEN EVERYTHING ELSE IS GONNA BE SECONDARY TO THE BLOCK AND TO THE BUILDING AND TO THE FACADES.
ONCE THIS FLIP ON THE SWITCHES AND WE HAVE A GALA HERE AT THIS AREA IS, BECOMES A HUGE FOCAL POINT.
AND IS THAT NOT OVERTAKING IN STAFF'S MIND THAT, UH, WHAT WE COULD BE LOOKING AT AND THAT POSSIBLE CREATE AN ADVERSE EFFECT ON, ON HOW IT'S GONNA AFFECT THE HISTORIC BUILDING RIGHT NEXT TO IT? I SEE YOUR POINTS.
I, I THINK SOMETHING TO CONSIDER OR THINK ABOUT IS, UM, THE EXAMPLES THAT COME IMMEDIATELY TO MIND TO ME ARE THE ONE, THE ONE THAT WAS DONE TO THE REAR OF THE OLD PARKLAND HOSPITAL, WHICH HAS, UH, A LARGE GLASS HYPHEN BETWEEN, AND THEN, AND THEN THE BRICK.
THE OTHER ONE IS, UM, THAT'S A LITTLE MORE MODERN, BUT IT'S ONLY THE, UM, ELEVATOR TOWER FOR THE SIXTH FLOOR, UH, WHICH IS FAIRLY, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF A HYPHEN, AND THEN YOU'VE GOT PRETTY MUCH A MONOLITHIC TOWER.
SO I, AGAIN, I THINK IT IN THE WAY, THIS IS THE STRUGGLE WE ALWAYS HAVE, RIGHT? BUT YOU WANT IT TO BE COMPATIBLE, BUT DIFFERENTIATED.
AND IN A WAY, WE'RE LOOKING TO THE PARK SERVICE AND TO THE TEXAS HISTORICAL COMMISSION TO HELP US DEFINE THAT TOO.
BUT WE'RE STILL OUR OWN ENTITY.
I MEAN, I THINK THOSE ARE BOTH REALLY GOOD EXAMPLES, AND WHERE WE WOULD PARSE ON THAT WOULD BE THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN ONE OF THEM IS IN THE BACK.
SO THE HIERARCHY OF IT DOES THIS, THIS IS A HUGE, HUGE UNDERTAKING AT ONE OF OUR MOST SIGNIFICANT BUILDINGS IN DALLAS.
UM, UH, WOULD IT BECOME THE LET'S GO DOWN TO THE FISHBOWL BUILDING, OR WOULD IT BE LET'S GO TO THE RED HORSE BUILDING NOW? I MEAN, MIGHT TAKE ITS OWN CHARACTERISTICS.
UM,
I'M JUST REALLY, REALLY NERVOUS ABOUT THIS TAKING OVER, TAKING OVER THE SPOT HERE.
IT IS SUCH A MONUMENTAL BIG THING HERE.
AND I KNOW WE'RE, WE'RE STILL IN
[01:20:01]
ACTUALLY QUESTION PERIOD,COMMISSIONER PRE, UM, I WOULD AGREE WITH, UH, WITH YOUR COMMENTS, UH, COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS ON, ON, ON THE SPACE AND SORT OF THE FISHBOWL EFFECT.
MY QUESTION WOULD BE IS, I KNOW WE DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE PURVIEW OVER THE INTERIOR, BUT WE'RE GONNA SEE ALL OF THIS WITH THIS LARGE GLASS SURFACE.
ARE THERE PLANS FOR CURTAINS OR SHADES OR SOMETHING INSIDE, IF, IF, IF SOME OF THOSE OCCUPANTS DON'T WANNA BE ABLE TO BE IN A FISHBOWL?
AND THERE IS, IT WOULD BE SHEER AT MOST TIMES.
I MEAN, THERE'S CERTAINLY TRANSPARENCY.
YOU CAN'T HIDE THAT BACK, BUT I, I PROBABLY, IT'S ALMOST AT THIS POINT, THE PUBLIC OUTSIDE CAN HIDING LIKE THINGS, THINGS, BUT IT CERTAINLY WILL BE SHARED IN A COMMENT OF LIGHTING THROUGH ALL FOCUS IN WORD.
WE'RE NOT TRYING TO PROJECT OUTWARD, EVEN THOUGH YES, THAT WOULD BE
BUT I THINK ALSO TOO, WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING IS TO, UM, ENHANCE ELIMINATION OF THE PODIUM ITSELF.
UH, WE KNOW THE BUILDING, WHICH IS BRINGING SOME OF THAT BACK AND WE'RE COMPLEMENTING THE BUILDING THAT, AND CERTAINLY NOT
BUT AGAIN, BEHIND SHARE, NOT JUST DO ANY OF OUR, UH, COMMISSIONERS ATTENDING REMOTELY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? I HAVE ONE QUESTION.
UM, DO YOU HAPPEN TO HAVE ANY INFORMATION ABOUT THE GLASS? IS IT, UM, HAVE A HIGH EXTERIOR REFLECTANCE, OR IS IT, UM, YOU KNOW, WILL IT BE POSSIBLE TO SEE INSIDE? IS IT TOTALLY CLEAR? IS IT FRITTED OR IS THERE ANY OTHER KIND OF TREATMENT APPLIED? UH, YOU MENTIONED SOME SHEER SHADES OR SOMETHING.
I, I COULDN'T HEAR EVERYTHING, BUT WILL THERE BE ROLLER SHADES OR SOME OTHER TYPE OF, UH, SHADING DEVICE? THANK YOU.
INCLUDED IN OUR PLANS ARE CLEAR GLAZING, AND WE DID HAVE A SAMPLE GOING AROUND, UM, FOR THOSE PRESENT TO TAKE A LOOK AT.
UM, THE SHEER, UM, FABRIC THAT'S BEEN DISCUSSED IS A CURTAIN CORRECT ME IF COMMISSIONER FOGLEMAN, DID YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS? NO, THAT'S IT.
UM, DID I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY THAT THE, UH, THE PLINTH UNDER THE BIG, UH, BALLROOM IS, UH, LOADING AND UNLOADING? YES, THAT'S CORRECT.
SO THAT IS A, THAT'S KIND OF A FUNCTIONAL, UH, PROGRAM LIKE SUPPORT SPACE THAT DIDN'T SUPPORT ANY KIND OF FENESTRATION.
IT'S BACK OF HOUSE LOADING DOCK.
AND THE, UH, THE KIND OF, UH, SEVENTIES TV SET PROSCENIUM THAT FRAMES THE BALLROOM.
HOW DEEP IS THAT? PROBABLY THE, THE FRAME.
I BELIEVE IT'S ABOUT FIVE FEET DEEPLY TAKEN IN GLASS.
SO IT'S, YOU'RE, SO ALL THE ACTIVITY IS SET BACK AT LEAST FIVE FEET FROM THE, BY THAT PROSCENIUM.
AND IS THAT, THAT'S SIMPLY A FRAMING DEVICE, RIGHT? IT DOESN'T, UH, DOES IT ACCOMPLISH SOMETHING ELSE THAT I'M NOT SEEING? IS THERE KIND OF BA SOME KIND OF BALUT RATE OR, OR I MEAN, SOME KIND OF RAILING THAT KEEPS SOMEBODY FROM VENTURING INTO IT? I'M NOT SURE IF I QUITE UNDERSTAND HOW IT'S RELATED TO THE FLOOR OF THE BALLROOM.
IT STARTS AT THE SECOND FLOOR AND IT PROJECTS OUT, BUT NO, YOU CAN'T WALK OUT TO IT.
AND THERE'S NO EXTERIOR TAPE EITHER.
IT'S JUST COMPLETELY WIDTH IN THE BOTTOM.
ARE THERE TWO LAYERS OF GLASS? NO, I'M SORRY.
SO, UM, YEAH, SO, SO THE GLASS, UH, MEETS THE, THE FLOOR LINE.
SO, SO THERE'S NO OPENING BETWEEN THE GLASS AND THE FLOOR.
UH, AND WHAT, WHAT THE FRAME IS DOING, UH, IS TRYING TO CONCEAL THE, THE OUTER FRAME, WHICH, WHICH, UH, UM, FOLLOWS THE, THE DATA LINES THAT, THAT WE CARRIED ON FROM THE ORIGINAL BUILDING.
AND, UH, IT, IT MAKES THAT, THAT FRAME MAKES, MAKES, UM, A CONNECTION WITH THE INTERIOR SPACE OR THE FRAME THAT IS FORMED.
THE, THE INTERIOR SPACE, UH, BECAUSE WE HAVE, UH, A POOL DECK ON, ON THE, ON TOP OF THE, OF THE BALLROOM.
UH, WE HAVE A DEEP, UH, STRUCTURE.
I'M SORRY, YOU HAVE A, YOU HAVE A POOL DECK? WE HAVE A POOL.
BECAUSE OF THE DEPTH THAT BETWEEN THE, THE, THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THE POOL, UH, STRUCTURE AND, UH, UH, MECHANICAL, UH, M E P INSTALLATIONS, UH, WE HAVE A DEEPER, UH, SLAP PACKAGE ON THE TOP.
SO ACCOMMODATE THE DROP IN THE CEILING YEAH.
I WAS TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE RELATIONSHIP OF THE BOTTOM OF THAT FRAME.
LIKE IF I WERE ONE OF THOSE, UH, UH, PATRONS THAT I SEE ON THE BALLROOM FLOOR, AS THEY LOOK OUT WHAT
[01:25:01]
IS KEEPING THEM FROM WALKING OUT INTO THAT, UH, THE LOWER PART OF THE FRAME THAT I SEE THERE, I DON'T, I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE RELATIONSHIP THERE.IS THERE LIKE A GLASS PARTITION OR RAILING OR SOMETHING? WE, WE CURRENTLY OH, OKAY.
SO, SO THAT RETAIL, THAT DETAIL HAS BEEN REVISED, UH, AND IN, IN THE NEW ITERATION, THE, THE GLASS MEETS THE, THE, OR THE FLOOR MEETS THE GLASS.
SO THERE'S NO GAP BETWEEN THE GLASS AND THE OH, SO YOU, THERE'S NO FRAME ON THE BOTTOM, YOU'RE SAYING THERE'S NO FRAME ON THE BOTTOM THAT FRAMING THE FRAME HAPPENS ON THE SIDES AND ON THE TOP CONCEDE IS NOT CONTINUED ALL THE WAY AROUND.
AND, AND THE BOTTOM PATH, THE, THE BOTTOM PART ACTS AS A SHADOW BOX TO BE CONTINUING TO GIVE THE SAME LOOK FROM THE OUTSIDE PERSPECTIVE,
OH, OH, I SEE, I SEE, I SEE, I SEE.
SO THE RENDERING AND THE PACKET IS NOT CORRECT.
SO MY NEXT QUESTION, UM, THAT IS, THAT I THINK IS ONE OF THE COMMISSIONERS REFERRED TO A LITTLE PLANTER BOX SITTING ON THE SIDEWALK IN FRONT OF THAT BIG, UH, HOW, HOW HIGH IS THAT WALL AGAIN, THAT SHEAR WALL OF, OF, UH, PLAING.
YEAH, IF YOU COULD, IF YOU COULD DISTRIBUTE THOSE, THAT'D BE GREAT.
I'LL JUST KEEP ASKING THESE QUESTIONS IN THE MEANTIME THOUGH.
UM, BECAUSE I'M, I'M WONDERING WHAT IS, WHAT MOTIVATED THE APPEARANCE OF THAT LITTLE PLANTER BOX IN LIKE ONE SPECIFIC LOCATION OF THAT BIG WALL? UH, SO IF WE'RE TAKING A LOOK AT THIS ELEVATION THAT WE HAVE UP ON THE SCREEN MM-HMM.
UM, SO THOSE, THOSE SET OF DOORS, THEY ACTUALLY ENTER INTO A EGRESS STAIR THAT WE NEED TO SAFELY EXIT THE BUILDING.
AND I BELIEVE THAT'S THE SHADOW BOX THAT YOU'RE DISCUSSING IS BETWEEN THE DOOR AND THE WINDOW? IS THAT THE, I DON'T, ALL I SEE IS WALL.
I DON'T REALLY SEE, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S DIFFERENT ON DIFFERENT PAGE, ON DIFFERENT SHEETS.
UM, I'M LOOKING ON PAGE ONE 19, I THINK IT IS, OF OUR PRESENTATION OF OUR PACKET WHERE WE'RE LOOKING FROM, FROM, UH, SOME HEIGHT DOWN INTO THE BALLROOM.
IS IT POSSIBLE FOR US TO LOOK AT YEAH, THAT'S THE ONE.
THE SECOND PAGE OF WHAT YOU JUST HANDED IT.
UH, BUILDING, BUILDING EXPANSION IS WHAT IT'S CALLED.
AND I SEE A LITTLE, UH, PLATTER BOX THAT IS THE WIDTH OF ONE SET OF THE PANELS.
THE REASON I'M ASKING IS, GO AHEAD.
IF YOU HAVE AN ANSWERED, GO AHEAD.
THIS RENDERING IS NOT UP TO DATE.
SO IF IT'S THE TREE THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE HIGHLIGHTING THAT'S BETWEEN THE ADDITION AND THE ANNEX? WELL, THE TREE IS ACTUALLY KIND OF RIGHT NEXT TO THE STREET.
THAT TREE IS NO LONGER IN OUR PLANS.
I'M NOT ASKING ABOUT THE TREE.
I'M ASKING ABOUT THE LITTLE BOX OF SHRUBBERY THAT IS SITTING LIKE NEXT TO THE WALL.
WHY WAS IT THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE? GREAT QUESTION.
BUT WE HAVE, UH, MODIFIED OUR LANDSCAPING BASED ON COMMENTS TO REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF LANDSCAPING THAT'S ON COMMERCE STREET.
UH, IT'S BEEN REDUCED IN AMOUNT AND ALSO IN SIZE SO THAT IT'S NOW SMALLER PLANTS.
BECAUSE THE REASON I'M ASKING IS IT SEEMS LIKE, I, I CAN'T IMAGINE WHY YOU WOULD PUT A LITTLE BOXER FOREVER THERE, UNLESS MAYBE YOU WERE TRYING TO MAKE A PASSER BY A PASSERBY FEEL BETTER ABOUT THE FACT THAT THEY WERE WALKING PAST A 12 FOOT WALL THAT ABSOLUTELY OFFERED ABSOLUTELY NOTHING OF INTEREST FOR THEM.
16 FOOT HIGH WALL THAT OFFERS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
MY QUESTION IS, HOW COULD WE RETHINK THIS SO THAT IT WOULD BE MORE COMPATIBLE TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD IN THE SENSE OF, THIS HAS ALWAYS BEEN A DOWNTOWN NEIGHBORHOOD, AND DURING THE SEVENTIES, WE REALLY STARTED TO FALL DOWN IN TERMS OF WHAT WE OFFERED TO PEOPLE THAT THAT GAVE THEM REASONS TO WALK ON THE STREET.
WHEN I WAS A KID IN THE SIXTIES, AND THERE WAS THE NUT SHOP, THERE WAS A, LIKE, YOU'D WALK DOWN THE STREET LIKE ELM STREET, THERE WAS A PLACE TO TURN INTO LIKE EVERY FEW FEET, EVERY 10 OR 15 FEET, SOMETIMES EVEN CLOSER TOGETHER.
AND I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'VE GOT A CHALLENGE WITH A SERVICE FUNCTION, BUT ON THE ONE HAND, YOU'RE OFFERING THE, THE PERSON WHO'S ACTUALLY ON THE STREET, NOTHING.
YOU'VE GOT A BIG FLAT SCREEN PRESENTATION
[01:30:01]
OF A BALLROOM THAT IS REALLY, YOU CAN REALLY ONLY SEE INTO IF YOU GET SO FAR BACK THAT YOU CAN OVERCOME THE FACT THAT IT'S 16 FEET ABOVE THE STREET, OR IF YOU'RE STAYING IN SOME NEARBY BUILDING, AND YOU CAN LOOK DOWN INTO IT.SO IT REALLY SEEMS TO BE A VIEW THAT'S RESERVED FOR A VERY FEW PEOPLE.
THE PEOPLE THAT ARE GONNA HAVE A GOOD VIEW OF IT ARE THE PEOPLE WITH THE GOOD SEATS WHEREVER THIS PICTURE WAS TAKEN FROM.
BUT MOST OF US AREN'T GONNA APPRECIATE IT THAT WAY.
AND YOU'VE ACTUALLY ADDED A CANOPY TO THE HOTEL, WHICH, YOU KNOW, WE, WE CAN ARGUE ALL DIFFERENT KINDS OF WAYS, BUT ONCE THE PERSON GETS TO THE ADDITION, THERE'S NOTHING TO KEEP THE WEATHER OFF.
AND THERE'S NOTHING TO MAKE SOMEBODY DO ANYTHING EXCEPT HURRY TO GET PAST THAT WET OR HEAT, YOU KNOW,
NOW, I, I ADMIT YOU'VE GOT A PROGRAMMATIC CHALLENGE, BUT HERE YOU PRESENTED WHAT IS THE EQUIVALENT OF A VIEWING SCREEN ABOVE THE STREET.
AND I LOOK AT LIKE THE, THE CONTEXTUAL PICTURES, AND WE'RE LOOKING INTO AT AND P, UM, DISCOVERY PLAZA, ABSOLUTELY FULL OF SCREENS.
THE VERY FEW THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO, YOU CAN PUT LIKE, YOU KNOW, WINDOWS FOR ADVERTISING AND DISPLAY, BUT NOWADAYS WE DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT.
WE HAVE SCREENS, UM, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, MAYBE YOU COULDN'T SERVICE THE WINDOWS FOR DISPLAY AND ACCOMMODATE YOUR LOADING SPACE BEHIND IT.
BUT IT JUST SEEMS THAT THE 21ST CENTURY AFFORDS SO MUCH IN TERMS OF THINGS YOU CAN DO WITH A FLAT BARREN EXPANSE.
AND JUST, JUST GIVE US, YOU KNOW, I GUESS I'M ASKING, COULD YOU PLEASE CONSIDER OFFERING SOMETHING TO THE PEDESTRIAN IN THIS EDITION? UM, SOMETHING TO KEEP THE WEATHER OFF AND A REASON TO LINGER FOR A MOMENT, OR IT JUST, JUST, JUST SOMETHING TO KEEP THEIR INTEREST OR, OR ENGAGE IN IT.
BECAUSE RIGHT NOW, LOOK, I LOOK AT THAT LITTLE PLANTER BOX AND IT LOOKS LIKE, AH, SOMEBODY THOUGHT THERE MIGHT BE A NEED TO ENGAGE OR THAT SOMETHING NEEDS TO BE OFFERED.
I DON'T THINK I CAN ASK ANY MORE QUESTIONS.
UH, COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER HAS A, A MOTION, ARE THERE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS? OH, EXCUSE ME.
AND JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, WHAT YOU JUST PASSED OUT IS NOT CORRECT, AS OPPOSED TO THE DRAWINGS THAT ARE IN THE PACKET OR THAT WE WERE SUBMITTED.
THE INTENTION FOR THESE ADDITIONAL IMAGERY IS TO HELP UNDERSTAND THE CANOPIES AND THE AWNINGS.
SO THE LANDSCAPING DOES NEED TO BE TWEAKED ON THESE, THESE, I'M TALKING ABOUT THE WINDOWS SYSTEM HERE, THE WINDOW, JUST SO THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS KNOW THAT THIS IS THE WINDOWS.
IF YOU CAN GO TO PAGE ONE 13 IN THE PACKET, THE WINDOWS ARE DIFFERENT IN TWO.
OR THAT SHOWS THE ACTUAL IN TWO WAYS WINDOWS SYSTEMS IS DIFFERENT THAN WHAT IS ON THIS DRAWING.
IT'S ACTUALLY THERE'S MORE DIVISIONS AND IT'S SET BACK IN FURTHER.
UM, YEAH, THERE'S A GOOD DRAWING WHICH SHOWS THAT.
OH, IT'S ONE 13 IN OUR, THE FULL AGENDA PACKET.
IT'S SIX PANELS AS OPPOSED TO FOUR.
LET'S SEE, THIS ONE, NO, THAT'S FOUR ON THIS ONE TOO.
YEAH, THERE'S, KEEP, KEEP GOING.
YEAH, IT'S KEEP GOING UP, UP FOUR MORE PAGES.
FOUR MORE, JUST YEAH, KEEP GOING.
HEY, YOU'RE GETTING CLOSE ONE.
[01:35:02]
KEEP GOING.OR JUST SHRINK THE DRAWING A LITTLE.
AND YOU CAN SEE THERE'S A, IF YOU REDUCE THE ZOOM ON THE PAGE, YOU'LL BE ABLE TO SEE THE, YEAH.
AND THEN IN THE LEFT, KINDA THE LEFT CORNER THERE.
YOU CAN JUST BARELY SEE GO ONE.
SO JUST GO UP OR MAKE IT SMALLER.
SEE WHERE IT SAYS BALLROOM? MM-HMM.
IF I CAN CLARIFY, UM, THIS IS A BALLROOM FACADE THAT FACES THE, THE PGAS PART.
SO, SO THE CHALLENGE THAT WE HAVE THERE, THERE, THERE'S A FIRE CODE, UH, ASPECT.
SO ALTHOUGH THE PIECES REMAIN THE SAME, THAT WE, WE LOWER, UH, THE, THE AMOUNT OF LACING ON THE FACADE BY PUSHING THE, THE GLASS BACK.
SO IT SITS WITHIN THE, THE LARGER FRAME.
SO, SO THIS IS NOT FACING COMMERCE, THIS IS FACING THE, THE BACKSIDE OR, OR THE, THE
COMMISSIONER PRECI, DO YOU HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS? I DON'T.
THE APPLICANT, I THINK WE'VE CLEARED IT UP.
IT'S JUST MORE DIVISIONS ON OF THE, UH, WINDOW SYSTEM THAN WHATS ON THERON.
IF WE DON'T HAVE ANY, UM, COMMISSIONERS REMOTELY WITH, UH, QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT.
COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER HAS, UM, A MOTION? NO.
I MAKE THIS MOTION, UM, READY FOR ANY AMENDMENTS THAT MAY COME
AND, UH, READY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU HAVE REGARDED ANYWAY.
MOTION IN THE MATTER OF C ONE ITEM CA 2 34 DASH 15 RD LOCATED AT 1401 COMMERCE STREET, COMMONLY KNOWN AS THE MAGNOLIA BUILDING RELATED PROPERTY.
REGARDING ITEM ONE APPROVAL SUBJECT TO STAFF RECOMMENDATION WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION THAT THE CANOPY OVER THE COMMERCE STREET ENTRANCE BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
THE PROPOSED WORK WILL ADVERSELY AFFECT THE CHARACTER OF THE HISTORIC PROPERTY IN THE DISTRICT FOR THE FOLLOWING REASONS.
ALFRED BLOSSOM'S WORKS OF SIMILAR SCALE OR NOTABLE FOR GRAND SCALE ENTRANCES WITHOUT CANOPIES, WHICH OTHERWISE HINDER A VIS VIEW OF THE UPWARD AND WOULD IMPACT THE ENTRANCE.
SIMILAR LANDMARK DESIGNATED STRUCTURES IN THE VICINITY DO NOT HAVE CANOPIES OF A MODERN DESIGN, BUT RATHER SHOW A DESIGN WHILE THE FITTING A COMMERCIAL STRUCTURE OF THE EARLY, EARLY 20TH CENTURY OR HAD NO CANOPY AT ALL.
REGARDING ITEM TWO, THAT THE CHANGES TO FENESTRATION OF THE LOWER FLOORS OF THE MAGNOLIA BUILDING BE APPROVED.
RECOMMENDATION REGARDING ITEM THREE, THAT THE ROOF REPLACEMENT ON THE 26TH FLOOR BE APPROVED SUBJECT TO STAFF.
RECOMMENDATION REGARDING ITEM FOUR, THE APPROVAL OF THE SMALL ENCLOSURE KNOWN AS THE LACONIAN AND THE AIRPORT BE APPROVED SUBJECT TO STAFF RECOMMENDATION CONDITIONAL ON THE ADDRESSING THE DEPARTMENT OF INTERIOR CONDITIONS WITH NO TREES OR PLANTINGS BE VISIBLE FROM THE GROUND REGARDING ITEM FIVE, THAT THE RE RESTORATION OF BALUSTRADE BE APPROVED SUBJECT TO STAFF.
RECOMMENDATION REGARDING ITEM SIX, THAT THE NEW ADDITION BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE AS PROPOSED WORK WILL ADVERSELY AFFECT THE CHARACTER OF THE HISTORIC PROPERTY IN THE DISTRICT.
THE ADDITION IS A DISTRACTION FROM THE CONTRIBUTING PROPERTY DUE TO ITS INCOMPATIBLE DESIGN, AND IT DOES NOT MATCH PEDESTRIAN NATURE OF THE MAGNOLIA BUILDING IN ITS BASE.
REGARDING ITEM SEVEN, THAT THE HARDSCAPING AND LANDSCAPING BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED.
THE CONDITION THAT STREET TREES BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE, I BELIEVE THEY'VE BEEN REMOVED.
BUT PER, UM, THE RECOMMENDATION TO TASK FORCE AS SUCH STREET TREES WILL ADVERSELY AFFECT THE CHARACTER OF THE SORT PROPERTY IN THE DISTRICT.
THIS MOTION IS MADE FOR THE ABOVE ITEMS ONLY AND DOES NOT ADDRESS NEW SIGNAGE OR THE REMOVAL OF THE FLAG.
UH, OPPORTUNITY FOR DISCUSSION.
MAD CHAIR, IF I COULD CLARIFY, COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERG'S, UH, MOTION.
SO FOR ITEM ONE AND SEVEN, YOU APPROVED, BUT THEN AL ALSO DENIED.
UM, WITHOUT PREJUDICE IT, WE CAN'T HAVE BOTH IN THE SAME MOTION.
SO IT CAN BE APPROVAL, UM, SUBJECT TO STAFF RECOMMENDATION.
BUT YOU CAN SAY, JUST TO CLARIFY, DID I WOULD HAVE PREJUDICE ITEM SIX.
I APPROVED THE, UM, OTHER FORMS OF CANOPIES, BUT WE, I WOULD, THE MOTION WAS TO SIMPLY DENY THE REQUEST FOR THE SINGLE CANOPY ALONG COMMERCE.
[01:40:01]
THE OVERALL NO.SO YOU'RE JUST SAYING YOUR APPROVING, I'M, I'M APPROVING WITH CONDITIONS THAT THE MAIN CANOPY ON COMMERCE BE DENIED FOR THOSE REASONS STATED TO PULL 'EM APART.
MOTION SHOULD PROBABLY BE TO SEPARATE OUT THE YES GEOGRAPHICALLY, SEPARATE THEM OUT AND INDICATE THAT IT IS THE CANOPIES, THE MINOR CANOPIES VERSUS THE MAJOR ONE OVER THE MAIN ENTRANCE.
THAT SHOULD PROBABLY BE PULLED APART.
AND I, I BELIEVE MY MOTION CLARIFIED THAT.
AND THAT THE ONLY ONE THAT I DENIED WITH THAT PREJUDICE WAS THE PRIMARY ENTRANCE CANOPY ON, WHICH I THINK WOULD BE, BUT THAT WOULD BE THE INTENT OF OUR MOTION.
THEY, THEY PROBABLY SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN GROUPED IN THE FIRST PLACE 'CAUSE THEY DO NEED TO BE SEPARATED.
BUT HOW DO WE DO THAT IN ONE MOTION? THE MOTION TO DIVIDE THE ITEM.
SO DOES THAT COME IN ADVANCE OF THE OVERALL MOTION OR DOES, CAN IT BE PART OF THE OVERALL MOTION? IT SHOULD BE, THE FIRST MOTION WOULD BE TO DIVIDE THE, THE QUESTION AND THEN VOTE ON THAT.
AND THEN YOU WOULD MAKE A MOTION ON BOTH OF THOSE SEPARATELY.
BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IT'S ONE MOTION AND YOU CAN'T HAVE AN APPROVAL AND DENY ONE REQUEST AND YOU CAN'T HAVE AN APPROVAL AND DENIAL IN ONE REQUEST.
COULD WE APPROVE THIS MOTION I MADE AND RETROACTIVELY CREATE, HAVE A SECOND MOTION PULLING THOSE APART AFTER? OR COULD WE MOMENTARILY WITHDRAW THIS MOTION, MAKE THE OTHER MOTION AND, AND VOTE ON IT TO, TO HAVE A CLEAN RECORD? WE, WE SHOULD PROBABLY WITHDRAW THE MOTION, DIVIDE THE QUESTION AND THEN, OKAY, I MOVE TO WITHDRAW THE MOTION.
THAT VOTE ON THAT WE VOTE ON THE WITHDRAWAL.
NO, I MEAN THE, THE COMMISSION DOESN'T SAY ANYTHING OPPOSITE.
THEN I MOVE REGARDING ITEM ONE, THAT WE DIVIDE THIS REQUEST INTO TWO SEPARATE REQUESTS.
ONE BEING THE PRIMARY ENTRANCE CANOPY THAT IS OF THE
AND THE SECOND PORTION BEING, OR THE SECOND REQUEST BEING ALL OTHER CHANGES REGARDING THIS REQUEST WOULD BE A MINOR CANOPIES ET SECOND.
ANY IN OPPOSITION? OKAY, COMMISSIONER
UM, I'LL TRY TO MAKE THIS QUICK 'CAUSE WE, WE HAVE IT ON RECORD THE FIRST TIME AND I'M SORRY, IN FIRST SEVEN, DID YOU DO THE SAME THING? YOU APPROVED AND DENIED SOMETHING WITH REQUEST NUMBER SEVEN? UM, YEAH, THAT'S TRUE.
I BELIEVE THE STREET TREES HAVE BEEN RENEWED CONSIDERATION MM-HMM.
ALRIGHT, SO NOW IN THE MATTER OF ITEM C ONE, CA 2 3 4 DASH 0 1 5 RD LOCATED 1401 COMMON STREET, COMMONLY KNOWN AS MAGNOLIA BUILDING.
ITEM ONE HAS BEEN BROKEN APART INTO TWO DIFFERENT REQUESTS.
UM, THE SECOND PORTION OF THIS REQUEST WAS REGARDING CANOPIES THAT ARE MINOR IN NATURE.
THAT WOULD BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED.
THE FIRST PORTION OF THIS REQUEST WOULD BE TO DENY WITHOUT PREJUDICE THE PRIMARY CANOPY ALONG COMMERCE STREET, WHICH IS IN THE MAIN ENTRANCE ALONG THAT PORTION OF THE BUILDING.
THIS PROPOSED WORK WILL ADVERSELY AFFECT THE CHARACTER OF HISTORIC PROPERTY IN THE DISTRICT FOR THE FOLLOWING REASONS.
ALFRED BOSTON'S WORKS OF SIMILAR SCALE OR NOTABLE FOR GRAND SCALE ENTRANCES WITHOUT CANOPIES, WHICH OTHERWISE HINDER A VISITOR VIEW OF IMPACT.
SIMILAR LANDMARK
REGARDING STANDALONE ITEM NUMBER TWO THAT THE CHANGES TO THE FENESTRATION LOWER FORWARD
AND THREE, THAT THE ROOF REPLACEMENT ON 24 BE APPROVED SUBJECT TO STAFF.
RECOMMENDATION ITEM FOUR, THAT THE APPROVAL OF THE SMALL AND IMPROVEMENT
[01:45:02]
AS LONG AS THE PLANS ACCURATELY REFLECT THAT.PLEASE BE VISIBLE FROM THE GROUND AS DISCUSSED TODAY REGARDING ITEM NUMBER FIVE, THAT THE RESTORATION OF BALLADE BE APPROVED.
SUBJECT STAFF RECOMMENDATION ITEM SIX.
THE NEW ADDITION BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE AS THE PROPOSED WORK WILL ADVERSELY AFFECT THE CHARACTER.
THE HISTORIC PROPERTY IN THE DISTRICT, IN ADDITION IS A DISTRACTION FROM THE CONTRIBUTING PROPERTY DUE TO ITS INCOMPATIBLE DESIGN AND IT DOES NOT MATCH THE PEDESTRIAN NATURE OF THE MAGNOLIA BUILDING AT ITS FACE.
ITEM NUMBER SEVEN, THAT THE HARDSCAPING AND LANDSCAPING BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED, WHICH SHOW THE REMOVAL OF STREET TREES.
THE MOTION IS MADE TO THE ABOVE ITEMS ONLY AND DOES NOT ADDRESS NEW SIGNAGE OR THE REMOVAL OF THE FIVEFOLD.
ALRIGHT, COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER, DO YOU HAVE ANY, UM, COMMENTS OR DISCUSSIONS YOU MENTIONED? UM, ANYBODY HAS ANY QUESTIONS? UM, UH, I, I DID SUBMIT TO THE COMMISSION JUST FOR THEIR CONSIDERATION.
I'M SURE IT CAN BE PART OF THE RECORD.
UM, JUST SOME PICTURES OF SOME BUILDINGS OF MR. BOSTON'S WORK, UM, THAT ARE SIMILAR IN NATURE TO THIS BUILDING AND THAT THEY HAVE GRAND SCALE ENTRANCES.
I FEEL VERY STRONGLY WITH THE ADDITION OF THIS CANOPY, UM, IS VERY INTRUSIVE IN NATURE.
YOU KNOW, THE PURPOSE OF THESE KIND OF CANOPIES WOULD HELP TO DEFINE ENTRANCES TO BUILDINGS.
THIS ENTRANCE DOESN'T NEED ANY MORE DEFINITION.
UM, I'M CONCERNED THAT THIS ADDITION, UM, WILL BE SOMEWHAT PURE OF OUR SOLD AND IT COULD BE REMOVED AND AS IT PRETTY SIGNIFICANT DEPARTURE OF WHAT WOULD BE APPROVED ON OTHER SIMILAR BUILDINGS.
YOU LOOK AT OTHER BUILDINGS SUCH AS THE A OFFICE WHICH HAVE HAD, YOU KNOW, NICE ADDITIONS MADE THAT LOOK NOT HISTORICALLY APPROPRIATE.
UM, THE OTHER SMALLER CANOPIES, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH THE BRASS OR THE BRONZE AND THE COLORED FOAM ARE SIGNIFICANT.
UM, THE OTHER ITEMS OF COURSE WE HAVE RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL OTHER THAN ITEM SIX OF MY REC, MY, UM, MOTION IS BASED ON SOME OF THE DISCUSSIONS WE'VE HAD HERE AT THE I S A, JUST REGARDING THE BUILDING THAT A LITTLE MORE WORK DOESN'T MATCH THE PEDESTRIAN NATURE OF THE MAGNO BUILDING.
ALSO WANTED TO JUST POINT OUT THAT THE APPROVAL OR ANY APPROVALS TODAY DID NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE CHANGES FIVEFOLD.
THAT'S A PRETTY IMPORTANT CHANGE MADE TO THE BUILDING THAT'S BEEN A PART OF THE BUILDING SINCE IT'S INCEPTION.
SO OTHER THAN THAT, THAT'S THE REASON FOR MOTION.
DUNN, CAN YOU STOP, UH, SHARING YOUR SCREEN SO WE CAN MAKE CERTAIN THAT NO ONE ATTENDING REMOTELY HAS ANY QUESTIONS OR, UH, COMMENTS ON THIS MOTION? ANYONE ELSE? ANYONE ATTENDING REMOTELY? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? EXCUSE ME.
SORRY, I, I KIND OF TOOK YOU OFF THE TASK A LITTLE EARLIER, BUT, BUT HONESTLY, THIS ADDITION STRIKES ME MORE AS A REMNANT OF SOME BAD SEVENTIES URBANISM THAT HAPPENED TO BE LEFT FROM A BAD ERA OF URBANISM THAN OF SOMETHING WE WOULD WANNA DO MOVING FORWARD WHEN RIGHT ALL AROUND US, WE'VE GOT SUCH GREAT, UH, GREAT EXAMPLES OF WHAT YOU CAN DO WHEN THERE IS NOTHING OF PROGRAMMATIC INTEREST, UH, BEHIND A WALL.
YOU KNOW, ALL OVER AT, AT AND T DISCOVERY PLAZA IS JUST ONE SCREEN AFTER ANOTHER.
AND, UH, I'M NOT SAYING YOU YOU WANNA COMPETE WITH THAT, BUT YOU COULD CERTAINLY COMPLIMENT THAT.
UH, I THINK IN THE PAST, YOU KNOW, THEY WOULD'VE HAD, UH, WINDOW DISPLAYS IN SUCH A SHALLOW AREA BECAUSE STREET FRONTAGE LIKE THAT, THAT GETS EYES IS SO VALUABLE.
AND, BUT IT, IT'S NOT JUST THE VALUE OF IT AS A WAY OF, OF, OF, YOU KNOW, GETTING MESSAGES OUT.
BUT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT WHAT MAKES A PLACE WALKABLE, WALKABLE, WE SO OFTEN TALK IN TERMS OF THE WIDTH OF THE SIDEWALK AND THE, THE RADII OF THE CURVES AND WHETHER IT'S GOT SHADE OR NOT AND ALL THIS KIND OF STUFF.
AND WHAT WE FORGET IS THAT HUMAN BEINGS LIKE TO BE ENGAGED AND INTERESTED IN THINGS THEY WILL PUT UP WITH ALL KINDS OF DISCOMFORT.
YOU KNOW, EVEN A BLINDING SUN AND ROARING TRAFFIC IF SOMETHING INTERESTS THEM SUFFICIENTLY, AND WE DON'T THINK ABOUT THE OFFERING THE PASSERBY SOMETHING TO ENGAGE HER, YOU'VE GOT A GREAT OPPORTUNITY HERE.
AND IT, IT JUST FEELS LIKE THE KIND OF BUILDINGS THAT AS A CHILD, YOU KNOW, A TEENAGER IN THE SEVENTIES, I SAW IT GO UP ONE AFTER ANOTHER AS ALL THE BEAUTIFUL THEATERS AND OTHER KINDS OF DOWNTOWN STOREFRONTS DISAPPEARED.
[01:50:01]
SO, YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND YOU'VE GOT PROGRAMMATIC LIMITATIONS, BUT, UM, AND I'M NOT CRAZY ABOUT SCREENS.WE, WE SPEND ALL DAY LOOKING AT THEM, BUT AT THE SAME TIME AS THE AT DISCOVERY PLAZA DEMONSTRATES ACROSS THE STREET, THERE ARE SOME WONDERFUL, CREATIVE, ENGAGING THINGS YOU CAN DO WITH THAT MUCH SPACE.
HOPE YOU'LL COME BACK WITH SOMETHING THAT OFFERS A LITTLE MORE OF A PEDESTRIAN AND, AND MAYBE RETHINKS THE KIND OF OF, UH, ARTICULATION AND DETAIL IN THAT BIG THING, WHICH IS GONNA BE A LOT LIKE A TV SET THAT'S NOT ON WHENEVER SOMETHING'S NOT GOING ON THERE.
ALTHOUGH COMMISSIONER RENO, UH, I JUST WANTED TO ADD A COUPLE MORE COMMENTS ALONG WITH, UH, UH, WITH, UM, UH, WITH COMMISSIONER IS THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK PAYING ATTENTION TO THE HUMAN SKILL, IT, IT, THIS, YOU KNOW, ON THAT GROUND LEVEL IS, UM, IS HIGHLY IMPORTANT.
YOU KNOW, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU CONSIDER THE AMOUNT OF, UH, UH, ATTENTION THAT'S BEEN PAID TO THE MAIN ENTRANCE AND, YOU KNOW, TO, BECAUSE THIS IS THE FRONT OF THE, THE BUILDING, UM, I'M NOT SAYING IT HAS TO BE HISTORIC, IT HAS TO BE COMPATIBLE.
IT HAS TO FEEL LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE, WE PAID SOME ATTENTION TO THE FACT THAT HUMAN BEINGS ARE WALKING PAST THIS FACADE.
UM, SO I ENCOURAGE YOU TO DO THAT.
ALRIGHT, WITH THAT, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.
YOU HAVE RECEIVED, UH, SOME APPROVES, UH, AS WELL THOUGH AS, UH, DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE, WHICH YOU CAN APPEAL THE C P T FOR A FEE.
UH, STAFF WILL GET WITH YOU A LITTLE BIT MORE TO TELL YOU ABOUT THAT PROCESS, OKAY? MM-HMM.
ALL RIGHT, LET'S MOVE ON NOW TO DISCUSSION ITEM TWO.
CHRISTINA MAN, CASTERS, EXCUSE ME, ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER 2 49 10 RIEGER AVE MUNGER PLACE, HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 3 4 0 2 6 CMM, THE REQUEST, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CHANGE THE EXISTING PAINT COLORS TO SHERWIN WILLIAMS S W 7 0 0 9 CURLEY WHITE FOR THE BODY AND SHERWIN WILLIAMS S W 7 0 6 9 IRON ORE FOR THE TRIM STAFF RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CHANGE EXISTING COLORS TO SHERWIN WILLIAMS, 7 0 0 9 PEARL WHITE FOR THE BODY AND SHERWIN WILLIAMS 7 0 6 9 IRON NOR FURTHER TRIM BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
THE PUR THE PROPOSED WORK IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
SECTION 51 P DASH 97 1 11 C I ROMAN THREE UNDER COLOR CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 G SIX C ROMAN TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS.
OKAY, UM, TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATIONS ONE THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE, CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A GRANITE IN GROUND SWIMMING POOL AT THE WEST CORNER OF REAR YARD WITH THE POOL EQUIPMENT TO BE PLACED BEHIND THE PRESS.
UH, MAYBE I'M IN, I THINK I'M IN CONSENT.
I WAS AT A PAGE MARKED AND EVERYTHING.
THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFIC CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CHANGE EXISTING PAINT COLORS TO BODY SHERWIN WILLIAMS, S W 7 0 0 9, PEARL WHITE, AND TRIM, SHERWIN WILLIAMS 6 2 5 8 TRICO BLACK BE APPROVED WITH THE CONDITIONS THAT THE COLOR SUBMITTED ARE WITHIN THE ACCEPTABLE COLOR RANGE STANDARDS CONTAINED IN EXHIBIT 97 G COMMENT ADDED POST TASKFORCE MEETING.
UPON FURTHER RESEARCH, IT DOES NOT APPEAR THAT TRICO BLACK IS WITHIN THE ACCEPTABLE RANGE COLOR VALUE OF ONE V OR TWO V, WHERE, UH, MOTOR REPLACE ORDINANCE DOESN'T ALLOW ANYTHING WITH A COLOR VALUE LOWER THAN THREE V.
NO APPLICANT HAS CHOSEN SW 7 0 6 9 IRON OR TO REPLACE IN PLACE OF SW 6 2 5 8 5 1 BLACK.
WE HAVE, UH, SPEAKER COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER, CAN YOU CALL OUR FIRST SPEAKER? YES.
FOR D TWO, WE HAVE CATHERINE BILLINGSLEY.
MS. BILLINGSLEY, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND YOUR COMMITMENT TO TELL THE TRUTH TODAY.
HI, MY NAME IS CATHERINE BILLINGSLEY AND I WILL TELL THE TRUTH.
SO AFTER THE FEEDBACK WE'VE RECEIVED, WE'VE DECIDED TO PIVOT ON THE COLOR SCHEME AND
[01:55:01]
I HAVE THE COLORS HERE.IF I CAN SHARE MY SCREEN FOR YOU GUYS.
I DON'T THINK IT'S LETTING ME, OKAY.
OKAY, MS. BILLINGSLEY, IS IT ALLOWING YOU TO SHARE? YOU HAVE SHARING RIGHTS? IT IS NOT.
THAT'S THE FIRST TIME I'M SEEING THEM TOO.
SO THESE ARE THE NEW COLORS THAT WE WERE THINKING.
UM, THE VINTAGE VOGUE FOR THE SIDINGS, THE SWISS COFFEE FOR THE TRIM, AND THEN THE ROOK WOOD SHUTTER FOR THE ACCENT.
SORRY, MS. BENSEY, DID YOU HAVE ANY FURTHER INFORMATION OR COMMENTS YOU WANTED TO OFFER? NO, UH, JUST THAT WE WERE ABANDONING THE ORIGINAL COLOR SCHEME AND WE'D LIKE TO GO WITH THIS ONE.
WITH THAT, UM, COMMISSIONERS DOES WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY FALL WITHIN THE ORDINANCE.
I CAN LOOK THROUGH THEM REALLY QUICK, BUT THIS IS THE FIRST TIME I'M SAYING ANYTHING.
UM, WE'LL START AND SEE IF THERE ARE ANY COMMISSIONERS HAVE ANY QUESTION FOR HER.
FIRST, UM, COMMISSIONER SHOWMAN, UM, A QUESTION WHEN IT COMES TO MAKING DECISIONS WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF THE TASK FORCE, DO WE HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO ESSENTIALLY SHOOT FROM THE HIP AND, UM, IGNORE THE FACT THAT WE ARE ESSENTIALLY ENTITLED TO A TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION AS A, DURING THIS PROCESS? I MEAN, I'M ASKING FOR ME, IT'S TO YOUR DISCRETION.
HOWEVER, IN A SITUATION LIKE THIS, I THINK EVERYONE WOULD FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE THAT STAFF IS ABLE TO TAKE THE TIME AND REVIEW THE COLORS AND THAT, BECAUSE THIS IS BASICALLY COMING IN WITH A WHOLE NEW SET.
AND SO IT'D REALLY BE BETTER IF, UM, IT COULD GO BACK AND GO THROUGH STAFF AND GIVE THEM AMPLE, AMPLE TIME INSTEAD OF SITTING HERE IN THE MEETING AND, AND TRYING TO FIGURE THIS OUT.
SO WE WOULD ASK, I THINK THAT THIS BE POSTPONED OR DI UH, I THINK DENIED WITHOUT PRE PREJUDICED AND, UM, BROUGHT BACK THE NEXT MEETING.
IF, IF THESE ALL MEET THE MUNSELL COLOR, THEN YOU KNOW IT'S POSSIBLE TO DO A JUST A STAFF REVIEW.
BUT WE DON'T KNOW AT THIS TIME BECAUSE STAFF IS BEING ASKED TO DO THIS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE MEETING.
SO IT'D BE MUCH BETTER IF WE DENIED WITHOUT, IF YOU ALL DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE AND STAFF AND THE TASK FORCE WOULD HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO RE-REVIEW AND MAKE SURE THE COLORS FIT INTO THE ELL PARAMETERS AS DEFINED IN THE ORDINANCE.
AND WITH THAT, IF THERE IS ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION, I HAVE A MOTION.
UH, DO ANY COMMISSIONERS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? COMMISSIONER POSI, I HAVE A QUESTION ON, ON THE PREVIOUS APPLICATION SUBMITTED, YOU HAD A LIGHT SIDING COLOR AND THEN DARK TRIM AND NOW YOU'RE GOING WITH A DARK SIDING COLOR AND LIGHT TRIM.
SO THAT COMPLETELY CHANGES THE LOOK FROM WHAT'S, UH, WHAT'S THERE NOW AND WHAT, WHAT WAS PRESENTED.
DO ANY OF OUR COMMISSIONERS ATTENDING REMOTELY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? ALL RIGHT, WITH THAT, COMMISSIONER RENER, THANK YOU.
UM, IN THE MATTER OF 82 49 CENTER, READ YOUR AVENUE ON AMONG THE PLACES HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 3 4 DASH 0 2 6 CMM.
I MOVE THAT THIS COMMISSION EXERCISE ITS DISCRETION AND, UM, DENY WITHOUT PREJUDICE THE APPLICATION FOR THE REASONS STATED IN THE, UM, STAFF RECOMMENDATION, UH, THE PRESERVATION CRITERIA AS WELL AS THE, UM, SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS.
ANY OF OUR COMMISSIONERS HAVE ANY COMMENTS OR DISCUSSION AROUND THE MOTION? SEEING NONE.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR PLEASE SAY AYE.
[02:00:01]
AYE.ALL THOSE OPPOSED, PLEASE STATE YOUR OPPOSITION.
YOU HAVE RECEIVED A DENY WITHOUT PREJUDICE, WHICH MEANS YOU DO HAVE THE ABILITY TO APPEAL TO C P C FOR A FEE STAFF CAN GET WITH YOU TO DISCUSS THAT PROCESS.
MOVING ON NOW TO DISCUSSION ITEM THREE.
THIS IS RHONDA DUNN SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF.
UH, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS CITED AT 2 0 8 LANDIS STREET IN THE 10TH STREET NEIGHBORHOOD HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE CASE NUMBER IS CA 2 34 DASH 0 1 8 R D.
THE REQUEST IS FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT STAFF.
RECOMMENDATION IS AS FOLLOWS, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
ONE THAT FACIA BOARD BE SOLID WOOD WITH A MINIMUM HEIGHT OF 12 INCHES.
TWO, THAT EXTERIOR WINDOW AND DOOR CAPS OR HEADERS BE SOLID WOOD WITH A MINIMUM HEIGHT OF EIGHT INCHES.
THREE, THAT THAT EXTERIOR WINDOW, TRIMS, SIDES, AND APRON AND MUL BE SOLID WOOD WITH A MINIMUM WIDTH OF FOUR INCHES.
AND THAT WOOD TRIM BE APPLIED TO NOT FLUSH WITH THE EXTERIOR SIDING.
IMPLEMENTATION OF THE, THE RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERION.
SECTION B UNDER NEW CONSTRUCTION AND ADDITIONS, THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR'S GUIDELINES FOR SETTING DISTRICT OR NEIGHBORHOOD TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
TRIM DETAILS SHOULD BE APPLIED TO ALL ELEVATIONS.
PATTERN NUMBER 1 0 5 AND PORCH POSTS SHOULD BE ROUND TO MATCH.
EXAMPLE PROVIDED NOTE APPLICANT IS A PARTICIPANT IN THE CITY OF DALLAS AFFORDABLE HOUSING BUILDING PROGRAM AND REQUEST CONSIDERATION REGARDING WINDOW OPTIONS BERGER FOR DISCUSSION ITEM THREE, WE HAVE DAVID ANDERSON.
SIR, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND YOUR COMMITMENT TO TELL THE TRUTH TODAY.
YES, YOUR NAME AGAIN? CAN YOU HEAR ME? YOU MAY BEGIN.
UM, OKAY, WELL I'VE BEEN HERE AGAIN.
THANK YOU FOR HEARING ME AGAIN.
UM, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO PROVE THIS WE CAN MOVE FORWARD AND, UM, THE TOPIC.
DO ANY COMMISSIONERS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? DR.
DUNN, IF YOU, UM, WOULD STOP SHARING YOUR SCREEN SO THAT WE CAN SEE, UM, EVERYONE AT HOME.
IT DOES LOOK AS THOUGH COMMISSIONER IT.
UM, IN THE NOTE THAT SAYS APPLICANT IS A PARTICIPANT IN THE CITY OF DALLAS, AFFORDABLE HOUSING, UH, REQUEST CONSIDERATION REGARDING WINDOW OPTIONS.
WHAT, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? WELL, I WOULD LIKE TO GO WITH A, UH, DIFFERENT WINDOW OPTION FROM WOOD FROM A PAST STANDPOINT.
COMMISSIONER OFFICE, DID YOU HAVE ANY FOLLOW UP QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? NO.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? BEING NONE AT HOME, DO ANY OF THE COMMISSIONER DO I HAVE, UM, A MOTION FROM ANYONE? OH, EXCUSE ME.
UM, MR. ANDERSON, DURING OUR BRIEFING, WE, WE TALKED A GREAT DEAL AND THERE SEEMED TO BE A LITTLE CONFUSION ABOUT THE NATURE OF THE FOUNDATION.
IT SEEMS TO REFERENCE VARIOUS AREAS HAVING DIFFERENT FORMS, JUST DIFFERENT TYPES.
FOUNDATION, IT WASN'T REALLY CLEAR.
YEAH, AND I APOLOGIZE FOR THAT.
WHEN WE FIRST WENT OUT, I, UM, NORTEK DID THE
[02:05:01]
FOUNDATION WAS THERE FOR US AND THEY DO THE UM, UH, SLIDESO, UM, I HIRED ANOTHER COMPANY THAT'S DESIGNED
I DIDN'T WANNA GO THROUGH THE EXTENT EVERYTHING I GET APPROVAL ON THE HOME, BUT IT WOULD BE A PEER FOUNDATION HOME.
BUT, UH, COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, DO YOU HAVE ANY FOLLOW UP QUESTIONS TO THAT? I GUESS MY QUESTION WOULD BE FOR STAFF IS DOES THAT ALTER THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION OR DOES IT REINFORCE THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION OR WHAT'S THE OPINION OF STAFF? WELL, STAFF RECOMMENDATION ALL ALONG HAS BEEN FOR PEERING BEING FOUNDATION.
WELL, MY POINT IS EVEN IF THE DRAWINGS WERE NOT CLEAR AND THE CONTENT OF THE APPLICATION WASN'T CLEAR, THEN IT'S NOT CLEAR IT WHAT WE'RE PROVEN CORRECT.
SO DOES THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION MAYBE BE ALTERED SPEC BY WHAT WE'RE RECRUITING? IF THE APPLICATION WAS CONFUSING? IF THE APPLICATION IS CONFUSING AS WE HAVE DONE IN THE PAST WHERE WE HAVE SPECIFIED AS A CONDITION WHAT WE WOULD DESIRE THE, UM, FOUNDATION TO BE, THAT WOULD BE STAFF RECOMMENDATION.
IN OTHER WORDS, SAY AS A CONDITION THAT THE, UH, FOUNDATION BE HERE IN BEAM OR WHATEVER THE COMMISSION DECIDES.
AND THAT'S NOT IN THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION CURRENTLY? CORRECT? CURRENTLY IT IS NOT CURRENTLY.
THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS BASICALLY REFERRING TO THE TREND DETAILING NOT THE, UM, FOUNDATION THIS TIME.
COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, DO YOU HAVE A FOLLOW UP QUESTION TO THAT? NOT YET.
I HAVE A QUESTION FOR A STAFF.
UM, THE TASK FORCE RECOMMENDED ROUND COLUMNS FOR THIS HOUSE, WHAT DID THEY SPECIFY? ANY REASON WHY? I MEAN, IF, YOU KNOW, TYPICALLY A SIMPLE CRAFTSMAN LIKE THIS WOULD NOT HAVE, UH, WOULD HAVE A MORE SIMPLE COLUMN IN POST THAN A ROUND, UH, ROUND TYPE COLUMN.
THEY WERE GOING WITH THE, UH, DIAGRAM GIVEN TO THEM AS THE MODEL, WHICH WAS DONE BY MS. MCCOY AND IN THE MODEL IT, WE POST AROUND AND SO THAT'S WHY THEY MADE THE DECISION OR THE RECOMMENDATION.
WELL TO ME, THEY'RE NOT IDENTIFIED IN THE DRAWING, WHETHER THEY'RE SQUARE OR BROWN
AND SO THE OTHER QUESTION I HAVE IS, IS I MEAN MAYBE A STATEMENT OF COMPLI, UH, UH, UM, THE STAIRS WHEN YOU'RE TYPICALLY GOING UP TO A PORCH GO MORE DIRECTLY TO THE FRONT DOOR.
I SEE IT'S KIND OF, I KNOW, I KNOW IT'S IN THE DRAWING, UM, THERE THAT NANCY SUBMITTED, BUT YOU KNOW, TO ME I THINK STAIRS SHOULD GO.
SO TYPICALLY THEY GO DIRECTLY TO THE DOOR OR MORE CLOSELY TO THE DOOR THAN THIS, UH, IS ON THAT, BUT THAT'S JUST A
THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY CO I WOULD ASSUME THE TASK FORCE DIDN'T HAVE ANY COMMENTS ON THAT.
COMMISSIONER RENO, UM, I HAD A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS.
I I THOUGHT THE LAST TIME THAT THIS WAS SUBMITTED WAS THAT THE RECOMMENDATION FROM, UH, FROM STAFF WAS THAT THE FOUNDATION BE POST IN BEAM, NOT PEER IN BEAM.
YEAH, I HAD CONCRETE POST AND BEAM.
UH, THE OTHER THING IS WHAT WE WERE CONSIDERING LAST TIME WAS THE ELEVATION.
AND SO I WAS THINKING WE WERE BUILDING ON A HILL, BUT IT WAS NEVER A HILL, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.
SO THAT'S WHY I'M OKAY WITH HERE BEING THE LOT ITSELF IS FLAT NOW IT WAS NOT ORIGINALLY.
SO I HAD ONE ADDITIONAL QUESTION REGARDING THE, THE SOFFIT DETAIL.
UM, AND I I'M ALSO REFERRING TO, UM, I APOLOGIZE, THE, THE ARCHITECT'S NAME THAT DID THE HISTORIC DRAWING, UH, TO USE AS A REFERENCE.
AND THE ONE FOOT TRIM BOARD, THAT TRIM BOARD SHOULD BE IN PLAIN OR IMMEDIATELY ATTACHED TO THE PLANE OF THE MAIN HOUSE, NOT OUT AT THE LINE OF THE, UH, OF THE OVERHANG.
[02:10:01]
ARE DRASTICALLY KIND OF, THEY'RE NOT CORRECT.UM, JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE IN POINT WITH THE WALL AND NOT, NOT ACTUALLY PART OF THE EVERYTHING.
UM, CAN YOU VERIFY WHICH ONE THAT ACTUALLY IS? IT MIGHT, DOES MY QUESTION MAKE SENSE? OKAY, SO YOU'RE SAYING IN THE PICTURE, GIVEN THEY APPEAR TO STICK OUT, BUT YOU'RE SAYING THEY NEED TO BE FLUSH WITH THE WALL ATTACHED TO THE WALL FACE.
SO, UM, SO IF YOU HAVE THE FRAMING OF THE HOUSE AND THEN THE, THE LAP BOARD OR THE, UH, THE ONE 17 OR THE 1 0 5, UH, PROFILE, THEN THE, THE TRIM SHOULD GO RIGHT ON THE FACE OF THAT, NOT OUT AT THE FACE OF THE RAFTERS.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? SO, YEAH.
I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE BECAUSE WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT THE ELEVATION, THAT WAS, UH, THE CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS, THEY'RE, THEY'RE PRETTY FAR OUT.
THE RAFTERS ARE SUPPOSED TO, UM, BE EXPOSED AND HANGING OUT PAST THE, THE TRIM BOARD.
SO IN THE CONSTRUCTION DRAWING, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THE PROFIT, OR RATHER THE FACEBOOK HEADER IS WHAT WE WERE CALLING EARLIER IS FLUSHED WITH THE WATER.
WERE YOU FINISHED, COMMISSIONER, COMMISSIONER
WELL I THINK THAT IS, WELL SOME OF THE DRAWINGS DO HAVE ONE 17 WHERE 1 0 5 CAME UP WAS TASKFORCE RECOMMENDED 1 0 5 AND TASKFORCE RECOMMENDED 1 0 5 BECAUSE IT WAS AN AFFORDABLE HOUSE.
AND ACCORDING TO THE TASKFORCE MEMBER WHO IS FROM THE 10TH STREET, UM, DISTRICT, HE FELT AS IF SINCE IT WAS CHEAPER AND IT WAS GONNA BE AN AFFORDABLE HOUSE, HE WAS OKAY WITH 1 0 5.
WHAT'S IS IS BOTH PREVALENT IN, UH, THROUGHOUT THE NEIGHBORHOOD QUITE A BIT OR IS THERE ONE THAT, UH, UH, TAKES MORE CONSIDERABLE, UM, HIERARCHY, UH, PREFERENCE 1 1 7 TAKES MORE CONSIDERABLE HIERARCHY OR PREFERENCE? WHAT WOULD YOU SAY? UH, JUST ROUGHLY PERCENTAGE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT THEY WOULD SAY ON ONE 17 BEING USED? I CAN'T REALLY GIVE A PERCENTAGE.
I'D HAVE TO ACTUALLY SIT HERE AND THINK ABOUT THE BLOCKS I'VE COVERED.
IF, IF 50 50, HALF AND HALF, OH, OKAY, HERE WE GO.
IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ACTUAL HOUSES THAT PEOPLE ARE LIVING IN, 1 1 17 IS USUALLY WHAT IS THERE, BUT YOU CAN FIND NUMEROUS HOMES WITH BOTH SIGHTINGS THAT ARE NOT BEING LIVED IN WITHIN THE DISTRICT.
ARE THOSE, ARE THOSE, UM, UH, HISTORIC HOMES OR HAVE THOSE BEEN, ARE THOSE THOSE ARE, OR THOSE ARE HOMES THAT ARE IN THE DISTRICT THAT, UM, SOME ARE CONTRIBUTING, SOME ARE NOT CONTRIBUTING, SOME ARE VACANT, SOME ARE BOARDED UP.
BUT YOU CAN SEE THOSE REMNANTS OF BOTH SIGHTINGS THROUGHOUT THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
BUT 1, 1 17 PREDOMINANTLY, UM, IS WHAT YOU WOULD FIND ON HOMES, PEOPLE ACTUALLY LIVING IN CURRENTLY.
COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS, DO YOU HAVE ANY FOLLOW UP QUESTIONS? ADDITION? OKAY, COMMISSIONER, UH, SWAN, WELL FIRST OF ALL, IN, IN ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION, COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS, UH, DURING THE MAIN PART OF THE PERIOD OF HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE FROM THE 1890S UNTIL, UH, SAY ABOUT 1930, IT WAS VIRTUALLY A HUNDRED PERCENT ONE 17, YOU START TO SEE SOME OF THE WIDER SIGHTINGS, THE SHIPLAP SIDINGS, LIKE 1 0 5 AND 1 0 1 0 7, UH, STARTING ABOUT 1935.
AND THEN YOU SEE THEM FAIRLY PREVALENT IN THE POST-WAR CONSTRUCTIONS WHERE THE EAVES BECAME ALMOST NON-EXISTENT.
THERE WEREN'T WIDE OVERHANGS AND THEY STARTED USING THE 1 0 7 SIDING.
SO DURING THE PERIOD OF HISTORIC
[02:15:01]
SIGNIFICANCE, IT'S, IT'S ALMOST A HUNDRED PERCENT ONE 17.UM, AND I WAS GONNA ASK THE APPLICANT, UH, OH, FIRST OF ALL, DID THE APPLICANT, DID YOU REQUEST 1 0 5 SIDING? NO.
SO THAT JUST CAME FROM, THAT ORIGINATED WITH TASK FORCE.
SO YOU HAD, YOU HAVE NOT DONE A PRICE COMPARISON OF 1 0 5 AND ONE 17 AND ASKED FOR ONE? NO, I HAVE NOT ASKED FOR ANY.
I'VE BEEN GOING ON ALL RECOMMENDATIONS JUST SO WE CAN LEAVE IT TO LONG TIME.
'CAUSE I, I REALLY, IF YOU, UH, I'M NOT SURE WHAT THE SAVINGS WOULD BE.
I DON'T KNOW IF THERE IS A SAVINGS.
SO MAYBE WE SHOULD JUST, JUST DISPENSE WITH THAT BECAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE THAT'S JUST CLOUDING AN ISSUE.
YOU'RE ALWAYS SAFE IN TERMS OF THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE WITH ONE 17, IF THAT'S, IF THAT'S ALL RIGHT WITH YOU.
UH, THEN, UH, ON THE MATTER OF THE, UH, THE FOUNDATION, UH, THAT IS ALL, ALL OF THE FOUNDATION IS GOING TO BE SHEATHED WITH THE HARDY BOARD? CORRECT.
AND DID YOU HAVE PLANS TO ATTACH THAT TO LIKE SAY A FUR, FUR STRIPS OR WERE YOU GOING TO USE A CONSTRUCTION GLUE OR HOW ARE YOU PLANNING ON ATTACHING THAT TO THE, UH, CONCRETE PERIMETER BEING? I COULDN'T ANSWER THAT QUESTION.
I'D HAVE TO HAVE THE ACTUALLY GO TO ANSWER THAT ONE.
YOU TELL ME YOU WANT IT ONE WAY.
LOT OF KNOWLEDGE HERE AND I'M GONNA FOLLOW, GONNA FOLLOW YOU GUYS.
AND NOW THE, THE ONE OF THE, UH, REALLY THE MAIN CONSIDERATION IN GOING WITH A, UH, A POST FOUNDATION OR A PURE BEAM FOUNDATION, THERE WERE PURE AND BEAM FOUNDATIONS.
UH, THEY DIDN'T REALLY COME IN AGAIN UNTIL THE THIRTIES.
YOU SEE SOME LATER HOUSES LIKE ON, UH, ON THE, UH, UM, BONTON HEIGHTS EDITION, UH, ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE CEMETERY WHERE THE HOUSE THERE A LITTLE BIT LATER.
THERE'S A HOUSE ON CHURCH STREET, THE ONLY ONE I KNOW OF FROM THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE WITH A CONCRETE PERIMETER SKIRT.
BUT THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT IF IT'S COVERED WITH AN, AN APPROPRIATE SIDING.
WHAT THE NEIGHBORHOOD DID NOT HAVE WAS EXPOSED, UH, YOU KNOW, CONCRETE PERIMETER, UH, BEAMS. SO, UM, THE MAIN CONSIDERATION WITH THAT IS TO KEEP PEOPLE FROM CHANGING THE NATURAL CONTOURS, UH, AND AFFECTING THE WAY THAT THE HOUSE MEETS THE GROUND BECAUSE THEY CHANGED THE, THE NATURAL CONTOURS.
UH, A 10TH STREET HOUSE MEETS THE GROUND IN TWO WAYS.
UM, IT EITHER, UH, IS OPEN UNDERNEATH, WHICH YOU SEE VERY RARELY THAT OCCURRED WHERE YOU HAD A REALLY EXTREME CHANGE OF GRADE, SAY FROM THE FRONT TO THE BACK.
AND OFTEN THE BACK OF THE HOUSE WOULD BE OPEN UNDERNEATH.
'CAUSE YOU COULD WALK UNDER IT, IT WOULD BE USED FOR STORAGE.
YOU DON'T SEE THAT MUCH ANYMORE.
MOST OF THOSE EXAMPLES ARE GONE.
UH, THE OTHER WAY THAT IT MET THE GROUND WAS TO CONTOUR THE, UH, THE, THE SIDING TO MEET THE GROUND LEVEL AS IT CHANGED.
SO IT JUST, LIKE, THEY JUST LITERALLY CUT A PROFILE AND FOLLOWED THAT PROFILE.
AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE HOUSES ON EITHER SIDE OF WHERE YOU'RE PROPOSING TO BUILD, UH, YOU CAN EVEN SEE IN THE PHOTOGRAPHS THAT THE, UH, FOUNDATION SKIRT IS HIGHER IN THE BACK OF THE HOUSE BECAUSE THE IS HIGHER ABOVE THE GROUND BECAUSE THE GROUND HAS ACTUALLY FALLEN.
AND WITH THE CONCRETE, UH, PRINTER SKIRT THAT IS NOW IN YOUR PROPOSAL, IT'LL BE NO PROBLEM AT ALL TO SIMPLY POUR THAT PERIMETER SKIRT TO FOLLOW THAT CONTOUR.
UM, SO THAT YOU CAN JUST KIND OF, YOU, YOU SEE IN THE PHOTOGRAPH WHERE IT'S MOUNTED UP ONCE YOU BUILT YOUR HOUSE, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE GROUND THAT'S UNDER THE HOUSE IF YOU JUST THIS ONE YOU HAVE A QUESTION? I, I KNOW THAT IT'S, YEAH.
I'M, I'M, I'M JUST TRYING TO MOVE THIS ALONG AS QUICKLY AS I CAN, UM, BECAUSE I THINK THAT A MOTION NEEDS TO TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT.
I JUST WANTED TO BE SURE THAT I'M HAVING AN UNDERSTANDING WITH THE APPLICANT.
UM, NOW AS FAR AS THE WINDOWS GO, OH, WELL, LET'S SEE.
I'M TRYING TO THINK IF I HAD ANYTHING.
YEAH, THAT, THAT'S IT FOR NOW.
I CAN ADDRESS FURTHER THE QUESTION.
DUN, UH, WOULD YOU, UH, STOP SHARING YOUR SCREEN SO THAT WE CAN SEE THE COMMISSIONERS AT HOME.
JUST MAKE CERTAIN, UM, THAT THERE, DOES ANYONE ATTENDING REMOTELY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT? YES.
SO ANY ADDITIONAL, UH, MAY I ADDRESS, UH, COMMISSIONER, UM, OSIS STATEMENT ABOUT THE STEPS BEING ON CENTER WITH THE DOOR? I, IS IT A QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT OR SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD TAKE CARE OF DURING
[02:20:01]
PRECI, WHEN YOU MAKE YOUR STATEMENT ABOUT DOORS BEING, UH, UH, STEPS, APPROACHING STEPS BEING MORE OR LESS UNCENTERED WITH DOORS, DID YOU CONSIDER THE FACT THAT 10TH STREET, UH, A SINGLE BAY AND A 10TH STREET HOUSE IS ABOUT 12 FEET AND A DOUBLE BAY IN A 10TH STREET HOUSE IS ABOUT 24 FEET LEAVING NO ROOM FOR A CENTRAL HALLWAY HALLWAY.AND THAT, THAT MIGHT ACCOUNT FOR ENTRY STEPS OFTEN BEING OFF CENTER WITH DOORS, WHICH WOULD BE LOCATED IN ONE BAY OR THE OTHER.
UM, WELL I WILL DEFER TO YOU AND, AND YOU KNOWING 10 STREET BETTER AS FAR AS WHAT'S THERE.
UM, I WAS JUST GOING OFF OF WHAT TYPICALLY I'VE SEEN WITH CRAFTSMEN BUNGALOW HOUSES WHERE THEY TYPICALLY TEND TO BE IN LINE WITH THE DOOR OR VERY CLOSE TO THE DOOR.
BUT IF THAT'S, UH, PRECEDENT AND THE PENN STREET, I'M, I'M FINE WITH THAT.
AND I THINK THEY OFTEN WERE IN LINE SO THE DOORS HIT AND WOULD SIMPLY CHOOSE ONE BAY OR THE OTHER.
IT'S A MORE DIRECT ROUTE TO THE DOOR.
IF WE DON'T HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT, DO WE HAVE A MOTION COMMISSIONER
IS THAT INDICATIVE OF YOU HAVE ANY MOTION? I HAVE A QUESTION.
UM, MR. ANDERSON, WE ARE ALL, I BELIEVE EAGER TO SEE NEW CONSTRUCTION ON 10TH STREET AND PARTICULARLY APPROPRIATE CONSTRUCTION ON 10TH STREET.
AND I JUST HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS WITH THE HISTORY OF THIS ONE MS. LOT IN PARTICULAR, WHICH I DON'T RECALL WHAT WAS SAID LAST TIME I WAS HERE, BUT I DON'T RECALL IF YOU WERE ASKED OR WHAT YOUR TESTIMONY WAS, BUT I'M EAGER TO KNOW IF, IS IT YOUR TESTIMONY THAT THE LOT ELEVATION HAS BEEN OR HAS NOT BEEN CHANGED WITH THE ADDITION OF INFILL DIRT OR DO YOU NOT KNOW? UM, I KNOW THERE WAS DIRT PUT ON OUR LOT ALONG WITH A LOT OF TRASH.
UM, THE PICTURE THAT I, I GAVE DR.
DUNN WAS A PICTURE THAT I HAD TAKEN, UH, WHEN I WENT UP AND LOOKED AT THAT LOT AFTER THE, THE LOT HAD BEEN SIGNED, WE BY THE CITY.
UM, I DIDN'T NOTICE WHAT EVERYBODY ELSE SAYS ABOUT A SEVERE DROP OFF THERE IS IN THE BACK OF A LOT A PRETTY GOOD DROP OFF, BUT THAT LOT FOR THE MOST PART LOOKS JUST LIKE THE LOTS ON EITHER SIDE OF IT.
AND UH, THE ONLY THING I KNOW THAT OUR GUYS DID WAS SMOOTH OUT THE DIRT THAT WAS REMAINING HAVE TO BE REMOVED ALL THE BROTHERS.
AND THAT'S TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE BECAUSE UM, I KNOW THAT WE HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO SEE TO IT THAT THE LANDSCAPES ARE PROTECTED.
AND 10TH STREET IS, IT'S, IT'S VERY, I CAN'T FIGURE OUT HOW TO SAY IT, BUT THE ELEVATION'S VARY GREATLY FROM LOT TO LOT AND BLOCK TO BLOCK AND WITHIN BLOCKS.
AND SO IT'S AN INTERESTING ENVIRONMENT.
IT'S CONNECTED TO THE HISTORY, SO THAT'S WHY I WANTED TO KNOW WHAT WE KNEW.
AND UM, THE OTHER THING I WANNA KNOW IS THIS BEING A LAND BANK HOUSE, CAN YOU GIVE US, I'M VERY CURIOUS, I DON'T KNOW, UM, HOW DID THE LAND BANK PROGRAM WORK? DOES A LOT GET GIFTED FROM THE CITY TO THE DEVELOPER? IS THAT HOW IT WORKS? NO, WE PURCHASED A LOT TO A VERY LOW PRICE AND THEN WE HAVE TO BUILD THE HOMES TO MEET THE MIDDLE INCOME AFFORDABILITY PRICE TO THE CITY FED.
SO YOU ESSENTIALLY GETTING THE, THE LOT AT A REDUCED RATE, BUT YOU'RE STILL PRICE SENSITIVE, RETURN ON INVESTMENT SENSITIVE IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, LET'S SAY THE WINDOWS THAT ARE PUT IN.
SO THAT'S GONNA AFFECT THE PROFIT MARGIN OR, UM, WELL, WE'RE ONLY ALLOWED TO MAKE SO MUCH PROFIT THE WAY THE CITY HAS IT STRUCTURED.
SO, AND IT'S VERY REGULATED ON WHAT WE DO AND, AND, UH, WHAT EVERYBODY'S ALLOWED TO DO THIS THING ATE PROGRAM.
SO, UM, IT'S NOT LIKE I'M TRYING TO SAVE MONEY UNTIL I CAN MAKE MORE MONEY.
BECAUSE WE, I THINK WE HAVE TO BE MINDFUL OF WHAT WE APPROVE BECAUSE IT'S, IT'S SETS.
UM, IT DOESN'T, PRECEDENT'S NOT A WORD WE'RE SUPPOSED TO USE, BUT IT DOES ILLUSTRATE FOR FUTURE DEVELOPERS, WHETHER YOU OR OTHERS, WHAT THIS LANDMARK PERMISSION ENDORSES.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I ASKED THOSE QUESTIONS, AND I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR HELP.
I, I'M, I DON'T, CAN'T SAY I'M BLESSED, BUT, UM, I, I HAVE SEVERAL MORE THAT HAVE BEEN, UM, I, I'VE PURCHASED THROUGH THE
UH, I THINK THAT WOULD BE, UH, MAKE FOR AN EXCELLENT BRIEFING THAT WE CAN RECOMMEND A CHAIR, MONTGOMERY END OF FUTURE TO INVITE SOMEBODY FROM, UM, THE HOUSING DEPARTMENTS.
TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THE LAND BANK PROGRAM AND HOW IT WORKS AND, AND HOW THAT WOULD FUNCTION IN FROM THESE HISTORIC DISTRICTS.
DOES ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT
[02:25:01]
BEFORE WE TAKE A MOTION? IF YOU NOT SEE ANYBODY ATTENDING REMOTELY WITH ANY QUESTIONS, DO WE HAVE A MOTION? UH, I HAVE A MOTION MATTER CHAIR, MS. MARK.IN THE MATTER OF CA 2 3 4 RD, OTHERWISE KNOWN AS TWO STREET, UH, I MOVE THAT WE, UH, THAT THE, UH, REQUEST BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECS DATED, DATED 9 7 23.
UH, AND WITH CONDITIONS CITED BY STAFF AND WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS THAT, UM, THE CONCRETE PUR AND BEAM FOUNDATION, UH, BE POURED SO AS TO FOLLOW THE PRECEDENT LAND CONTOURS AS DEMONSTRATED OR EX EXEMPLIFIED BY THE HOUSES ON EITHER SIDE, THAT IT APPROXIMATE THE CONTOURS OF, UH, THAT IT TAKE EXCUSES FROM THE HOUSES IMMEDIATELY ON EITHER SIDE, UH, AND THAT THE FRONT STEPS ALIGN WITH THE FRONT DOOR, UH, THAT THE SIDING BE ONE 17.
ANY DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION, MR. SWAN? YEAH, I HAVE A LITTLE BIT.
THIS IS WHERE I CAN CAN YOU ASK THE SECOND ONE? EXCUSE ME.
UH, UH, COMMISSIONER TAYLOR, THIS IS WHERE I CAN CLARIFY A LITTLE BIT, BUT REALLY, REALLY WHAT I'M ASKING HERE BECAUSE OF THE, UH, IF YOU LOOK AT THE CONTOUR, THE, THE, UH, CONTOUR, WHAT DO I CALL THEM? LIKE, UH, UH, FOUNDATION SKIRT LINES AS THEY MEET THE GROUND, THEY ARE NOT EXTREME.
THERE'S NOT AN EXTREME DI DIFFERENTIAL FROM ONE SIDE TO ANOTHER RIGHT NOW.
THERE'S A, A CONSIDERABLE MOUNDING ON THE SITE, BUT THAT MOUNDING CAN REALLY BE CONCEALED BY YOUR FOUNDATION, AND YOU CAN JUST REMOVE THE EARTH ON THE OUTSIDE OF YOUR FOUNDATION SO AS TO MAKE A MORE CONTIGUOUS, UH, SLOPE IN, IN, UH, CONFORMITY WITH WHAT WAS THERE BEFORE.
A LOT OF DIRT WAS ADDED TO THAT FOUNDATION, UH, BECAUSE THAT, UH, WHAT ONE THING I, I DIDN'T GET TO SAY WHEN I WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW HOUSES MEET THE GROUND IN 10TH STREET, THEY WILL EITHER BE OPEN UNDERNEATH A CONDITION YOU RARELY SEE, OR THEY WILL FOLLOW THE, UH, GROUND CONTOUR AS IT CHANGES FROM ONE INSIDE OF THE HOUSE TO THE OTHER, OR ONE END OF THE HOUSE TO THE OTHER.
VERY OFTEN WHERE YOU HAVE A SITE THAT IS FLAT OR NEARLY FLAT.
AND THE DIFFERENCE, UM, THE, THE CONTOURING THAT THE FOUNDATION SKIRT HAS TO DO IS NOT VERY EXTREME.
YOU'LL OFTEN SEE FLARING OF THE FOUNDATION SKIRT, WHICH IS JUST A LITTLE BIT OF A FLOURISH, THAT IF YOU ARE FINDING THAT YOU NEED TO ATTACH THE, UM, UH, HARDY BOARD WITH FURRY STRIPS, IT'S NOT MUCH IN THE WAY OF ADDITIONAL WORK LABOR MATERIALS TO FLARE THAT A BIT AND REALLY MAKE IT LOOK LIKE A 10TH STREET HOUSE.
IT WAS NEVER REALISTIC TO DO THAT, WHERE YOU HAD, SAY, A FULL EIGHT TO 10 FEET OF ELEVATION CHANGE, UH, OR LAND CONTOUR CHANGE FROM ONE SIDE TO THE OTHER.
'CAUSE AS YOU CAN IMAGINE, AS THE CONCRETE, UH, AS THE, UH, UH, SIDING FOUNDATION SKIRT CONTINUED TO FLARE, IT WOULD BECOME VERY, VERY WIDE.
UH, AND THAT WOULD BE HARD TO MANAGE.
BUT THAT, THAT'S JUST SIMPLY SOMETHING THAT IS UP TO YOU.
UM, I DON'T THINK, UH, YOU KNOW, NOW THAT WE'RE GOING WITH THE AND BEAM FOUNDATION, UH, UH, AS LONG AS YOU ARE FOLLOW THE GROUND TOURS, THE GROUND CONTOURS, IT WILL BE VERY MUCH IN, IN CONFORMITY WITH WHAT I'M ASKING FOR HERE.
AND AS FAR AS THE COLUMNS, I, I DID NOT, UH, SPECIFY IN THE MOTION THAT THEY BE ROUND OR SQUARE.
UH, SIMPLY WE ASK THAT THEY BE, UH, COMPLEMENTARY TO THE HOUSE AND COMPATIBLE WITH THE STYLE THAT YOU'VE CHOSEN.
OH, AND I DID ASK FOR, UH, REALLY OFF OF COMMISSIONER PREZI'S, UH, COMMENT THAT THE STEPS BE ALIGNED BECAUSE WHEN I REVIEWED THE DRAWING, I COULD SEE HERE THAT THERE WAS NO COMPLICATION IN SIMPLY PUSHING THE STEPS OVER TO ALIGN WITH THE FRONT DOOR.
THERE'S NOTHING I WOULD SPAWN THE PLAN AND I WOULD, UH, RIGHT.
IT WOULD PROBABLY BE VERY MUCH IN CONFORM BECAUSE SOMETIMES YOU HAVE SITUATIONS WHERE YOU HAVE FOUR COLUMNS ACROSS THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE THAT ARE VERY NATURALLY DIVID, DIVIDING IT TO CREATE A CENTRAL, UH, YOU KNOW, LIKE A CENTRAL
[02:30:01]
OPENING OR BAY BETWEEN THE COLUMNS.BUT BECAUSE INSIDE THE HOUSE YOU HAVE A ROOM NEXT TO A ROOM AND YOU, YOU HAVE TO PUT THE DOOR OFF CENTER.
SO YOU'LL SOMETIMES HAVE A SITUATION WHERE THEY PUT THE STEPS ON CENTER WITH THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE TO, UM, TO ALIGN WITH THE COLUMN SPACING, BUT THEN THE DOOR HAS TO BE OFF CENTER SO IT CAN ENTER INTO A ROOM INSTEAD OF INTO A WALL.
IF THERE ARE NO FURTHER COMMENTS, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.
ANYONE IN OPPOSITION? ALRIGHT, THIS PASSES.
THANK YOU MR. ANDERSON FOR YOUR TENACITY AND COMMITMENT TO THIS PROCESS.
MOVING ON TO DISCUSSION ITEM FIVE.
ITEM NUMBER FIVE IS 1 0 4 SOUTH, I'M SORRY, I'M MARCUS WATSON WITH STAFF.
NUMBER, ITEM NUMBER FIVE IS 1 0 4 SOUTH WINDERMERE AVENUE, WINNETKA HEIGHTS HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 3 4 DASH 0 1 0 MW.
THIS IS A REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW ACCESSORY BUILDING WITH DWELLING UNITS AT THE EAST SIDE OF THE PROPERTY IN THE SAME FOOTPRINT AS THE PREVIOUS ACCESSORY BUILDING CONSTRUCTION.
STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW ACCESSORY BUILDING WITH DWELLING UNITS AT THE EAST SIDE OF THE PROPERTY IN THE SAME FOOTPRINT AS THE PREVIOUS ACCESSORY BUILDING CONSTRUCTION PARTIALLY COMPLETED BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
WITH THE FINDING OF FACT THAT THE PROPOSED BUILDING IS LOCATED IN THE CORNER SIDE YARD AND THEREFORE IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
SECTIONS 51 E 80 DASH 87.1 11 A ONE AND 51 P 87 1 1 1 A FIVE, CITY CODE SECTION 51 A 4.501 G SIX C, AND AT TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING INSTRUCTORS FOR THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR EXCHANGE.
UH, TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW ACCESSORY BUILDING WITH DWELLING UNITS AT THE EAST SIDE OF THE PROPERTY IN THE SAME FOOTPRINT AS THE PREVIOUS ACCESSORY BUILDING CONSTRUCTION PARTIALLY COMPLETED.
BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE WITH THE FOLLOWING COMMENTS SPECIFY WINDOWS MUST BE WOOD, BUY WINDOWS WITH TALLER BOTTOM SASH RAIL, SASH RAIL, HERITAGE LINE PREFERENCE FOR HIP ROOF INSTEAD OF GABLE.
PROVIDE PICTURE OF COMBINATION OF BLOCK COLORS.
NEED CLEARER COPY OF ELEVATIONS.
IF THIS WERE BEING PROPOSED WITHOUT KNOWLEDGE OF THE PREVIOUS STRUCTURE, WOULD THIS BE APPROVED? IS THIS IN THE CORNER SIDE YARD? DOES IT MEET DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS? IS IT FAR ENOUGH ENOUGH? BAT ELEVATIONS NEED TO MATCH THE ACTUAL ACCESSORY BUILDING AND THE MAIN BUILDING AND ADD PHOTOS OF THE MAIN BUILDING.
COMMISSIONER FOR DISCUSSION ITEM FIVE, WE HAVE FERNANDO MARTINEZ.
OKAY, IF HE'S NOT ON THE, WHAT I LIKE TO DO,
UH, MADAM CHAIR, I MOVE THAT THE TABLE ITEM B FIVE UNTIL LATER IN THIS MEETING AND MOVE ITEM B FOUR TO OUR NEXT ITEM FOR CONSIDERATION.
MOVING ON NOW TO DISCUSSION ITEM FOUR.
RHONDA DUNN PRESENTING ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF.
THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS LOCATED LOCATED AT 36 15 MEYER STREET IN THE WHEATLEY PLACE, HISTORIC DISTRICT CASE NUMBER CA 2 3 4 20 R D.
THE REQUEST IS FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT STAFF.
RECOMMENDATION IS AS FOLLOWS, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 20 23 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
ONE, THAT DEPTH OF FRONT PORCH BE A MINIMUM OF SIX FEET BEHIND PORCH COLUMNS.
TWO THAT REAR STAIRS BE CENTERED WITH REAR EXTERIOR DOOR.
THREE, THAT STAIR TREADS FRONT AND REAR BE 11 INCHES.
[02:35:01]
BE ADDED TO LEFT REAR ELEVATION.IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
SECTIONS 9.2, 9.3, 9.7, AND NINE POINT 11 SUBDIVISION A PERTAINING TO NEW CONSTRUCTION AND ADDITIONS.
THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR'S GUIDELINES FOR SETTING DISTRICT OR NEIGHBORHOOD TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATE IS TO CONSTRUCT NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LIVE.
BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
WINDOWS SHOULD BE ADDED TO THE REAR LEFT SIDE.
LOUVER IN FRONT GABLE SHOULD BE HORIZONTAL.
GABLE WALLS SHOULD HAVE A HORIZONTAL LEFT SIDING.
SIDING SHOULD BE PATTERN ONE 17.
AND RAFTER TAILS SHOULD BE AT ROOF LINE.
APPLICANT IS A PARTICIPANT IN THE CITY OF DALLAS AFFORDABLE HOUSING BUILDING PROGRAM AND REQUEST CONSIDERATION REGARDING WINDOW OPTIONS.
OKAY, SIR, I'LL GO AHEAD AND STATE YOUR NAME AND YOUR COMMITMENT TO TELL THE TRUTH TODAY.
YES, MY NAME IS, UH, CHARLES MENSA AND I'M THE C P A AND PROJECT MANAGER FOR THIS PROJECT.
AND I TO TELL THE TRUTH TODAY, YOU MAY BEGIN.
WE ARE SEEKING APPROVAL FOR 36 15 MYERS.
WE WENT THROUGH SEVERAL ROUNDS OF REVISIONS AND WE'VE MADE ALL THE SPECIFIED CHANGES.
ADDITIONALLY, WE WOULD LIKE TO REQUEST, UM, ADDITIONAL WINDOW OPTIONS, UH, FROM THE RECOMMENDED WOOD TO ALUMINUM JUST BECAUSE IT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE COST EFFECTIVE AND IT HAS, UM, A LOT BETTER DURABILITY.
ANYTHING FURTHER? UH, NO MA'AM.
WITH THAT, COMMISSIONERS, DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE APPLICANT?
COMMISSIONER RENA? YEAH, I HAD A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS REGARDING THE DRAWINGS.
UH, SPECIFICALLY FOR THE SOFFIT DETAIL.
I KNOW THERE'S SEVERAL DIFFERENT ONES IN THE DRAWINGS THAT YOU'VE PROVIDED, UH, BUT I JUST WANTED TO KIND OF CLARIFY WHICH ONES YOU'RE ACTUALLY GONNA BUILD.
AND LIKEWISE, FOR THE FOUNDATION, THERE'S UM, PIER AND BEAM DRAWN.
AND THEN THERE'S ALSO, UH, SLAB.
SO I JUST WANTED CONFIRMATION ON WHICH DETAILS YOU WERE ACTUALLY USED.
THE FOUNDATION IS ON, IN THE DOCKET, IT'S ON PAGE 483, AND THEN THE SOT IS ON THE FOLLOWING PAGE AFTER THAT.
SO FOUNDATION DETAILS IS WHAT YOU MENTIONED FIRST, CORRECT? MM-HMM.
THESE ARE THE FOUNDATION DETAILS SUBMITTED AND IT DOES START OFF WITH THE DISCUSSION.
UH, ON THE FOUNDATION DETAILS, I'LL HAVE TO DOUBLE CHECK WITH THE BUILDER ON THAT ONE.
AND THEN ON THE FOLLOWING PAGE, UM, I THINK THAT, UH, IT WAS EITHER TASK FORCE OR IT WAS EITHER OR STAFF THAT HAD RECOMMENDED OPEN RAFTER TILLS.
AM I CORRECT? BUT IN THESE DETAILS THEY SHOW A CLOSED SOFFIT.
THEY SHOW A SOFFIT WITH ZERO OVERHANG.
THEY'RE, THERE'S FOUR DIFFERENT ONES.
JUST WANNA KNOW WHICH ONES THE, WHEN IT'S GONNA BE BUILT.
I'LL HAVE TO DOUBLE CHECK WITH THE BUILDER ON THAT ONE AS WELL, BECAUSE I KNOW THAT WE GOT SEVERAL, WE HAVE SEVERAL DIFFERENT EMAILS AND BACK AND FORTH IN REGARDS TO THE REVISIONS THAT WE WERE SUPPOSED TO MAKE.
AND THEN WE DID SUBMIT, I THINK LAST WEEK.
SO I'LL HAVE TO JUST VERIFY THAT DEPEND, BILL.
[02:40:05]
OKAY.COMMISSIONER
YES, I GOT, UH, SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT THE BRACKETS ON THE, UH, EXTERIOR RAPTORS ON THE FRONT, OR, UH, JUST BEHIND THE BARGE BOARDS, YOU'VE GOT THREE, UH, E BRACKETS OR, OR, UH, UH, RAKE EDGE BRACKETS SHOWN.
THERE IS NO BRACKET WHERE YOU WOULD WOULD EXPECT TO SEE ONE AT THE END OF THE RUN OF THE RAFTER DOWN AT THE BOTTOM.
IN OTHER WORDS, IN THE MIDDLE, YOU HAVE IT SET UP TO BE A CRAFTSMAN STYLE GABLE WITH, UH, WITH, UH, DECORATIVE BRACKETS SUPPORTING THE EXTERIOR RAPTOR OR, OR THE BARGE BOARDS.
AND THEN AT THE END OF THE RAPTORS, SUDDENLY THERE'S NO OVERHANG.
UH, IT LOOKS LIKE YOU'VE GOT AN EXPOSED RAPTOR TAIL DRAWN, BUT IT, THERE IS NOT THE KIND OF OVERHANG THAT WOULD JUSTIFY OR, OR REALLY SHOW, UH, AN EXTERIOR RAPTOR TAIL.
AND THERE'S AN ABSENCE OF A BRACKET.
NOW I CAN UNDERSTAND WHY THE BRACKET IS ABSENT BECAUSE THE WAY THAT, UM, WHERE, WHERE YOUR, UH, CEILING PLATE IS, IT'S TOO LOW TO, TO SUPPORT THE PRESENCE OR LIKE TO EVEN MAKE ROOM FOR THE PRESENCE OF A, A BRACKET, YOU'D HAVE TO BE ATTACHING IT TO YOUR COLUMN.
WHAT A HOUSE OF THIS VINTAGE GENERALLY DID WAS HAVE A, A HIGHER CEILING.
SO THAT GAVE THE, UM, THE CARPENTER THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE A SIDED PANEL, KIND OF LIKE A, UM, WELL AT THE, AT THE TOP OF THE COLUMNS.
UH, AND THAT SIDED PORTION OF THE FACADE JUST WRAPPED ALL THE WAY AROUND AND GAVE THEM ROOM TO SUPPORT, UH, A AND LIKE THE FINAL E THE FINAL BRACKET NEAR THE END OF THE RAFTERS.
DO, DO YOU SEE, AM I BEING CLEAR? YEAH.
UH, AND I THINK THIS HOUSE WANTS TO BE A CRAFTSMAN HOUSE.
UM, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE'RE SEEING A LOT OF WHERE THEY JUST, THEY DON'T PUT THAT EXTRA HEIGHT OF SIDING IN THERE TO SUPPORT THAT BRACKET.
UM, YEAH, I THINK I REACHED THE END OF WHAT I CAN SAY IN A QUESTION, BUT
'CAUSE I KNOW WE'VE BEEN, UH, THIS HAS BEEN ONGOING FOR US FOR AT LEAST THREE OR FOUR MONTHS.
AND WE'D LIKE, WE'D LIKE TO SEE YOU BE ABLE TO GET ALONG WITH IT TOO.
AND I'M JUST SAYING TO, YEAH, BECAUSE IT, EVERYTHING SEEMS TO BE PUSHING IN THE DIRECTION OF A CRAFTSMAN STYLE HOUSE MM-HMM.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMISSIONERS HERE IN PERSON.
DUNN, IF YOU'LL STOP SHARING SO THAT WE COULD SEE, UM, IF THERE ARE ANY COMMISSIONERS ATTENDING REMOTELY THAT HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.
UM, DO WE HAVE A MOTION? UM, I'LL MAKE A MOTION COMMISSION'S FINE.
UM, IN THE MATTER OF CA 2 3 4 DASH TWO RD, OTHERWISE KNOWN AS 36 15 MEYER STREET, I MOVE THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATE IS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 9 7 23 WITH THE FALLING CONDITIONS THAT THE DEPTH OF THE FRONT PORCH SHOULD BE A MINIMUM OF SIX FEET BEHIND PORCH COLUMNS.
THAT REAR STAIRS SHOULD BE CENTERED WITH REAR EXTERIOR DOOR THAT STA STAIR TREADS FRONT REAR WOULD BE 11 INCHES THAT A WINDOW BE ADDED TO THE LEFT REAR ELEVATION.
UH, THAT THE HEIGHT ABOVE THE TOPS, THE, THE, UH, SIDED HEIGHT ABOVE THE TOPS OF THE PORCH COLUMNS, UH, AND, UH, THE WINDOWS ON THE MAIN BODY OF THE HOUSE BE EXTENDED SO AS TO ACCOMMODATE THE PLACEMENT OF A FINAL, UH, BRACKET AT THE LOWER
[02:45:01]
END OF THE EXTERIOR EAVES.AND THAT THE EVES EXTEND AT LEAST 16 INCHES BEYOND THE, UH, BACHELOR BOARD.
UM, THAT'S THE MOTION NEGATIVE.
SECOND, SECOND, SECOND FROM COMMISSIONER RENO.
ANY, UH, DISCUSSION OR COMMENTS REGARDING THE MOTION? SEEING NONE FROM ANYONE ATTENDING REMOTELY EITHER.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.
ANY IN OPPOSITION, PLEASE STATE SUCH YOU HAVE AN APPROVAL WITH CONDITIONS YOU CAN GET WITH STAFF TO GO OVER THOSE DETAILS A LITTLE BIT MORE SPECIFICALLY IF YOU HAVE ANY FOLLOW UP QUESTIONS, WE'LL MOVE BACK, UM, ON THE AGENDA TO, UH, DISCUSSION ITEM FIVE.
DO I NEED TO READ THAT IN AGAIN? I DON'T BELIEVE SO.
WILL MR. WE MOVE THE TABLE? SHOULD WE UNDO THE TABLE SO THAT HE DOESN'T HAVE TO READ IT AGAIN? I THINK SO.
UH, I MOVE THAT WE MOVE TO DISCUSSION ITEM FIVE, RESUMING DISCUSSION AS WE WERE EARLIER IN THIS MEETING.
COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, SECONDED SHERMAN, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? AYE.
WE, UM, I, YEAH, WE DO NOT HAVE A SPEAKER.
DO WE HAVE, UM, ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF BEFORE ENTERTAINING A MOTION? NO QUESTIONS FOR STAFF.
COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, YOUR UM, LIGHT IS ON.
DO YOU HAVE A MOTION? I DO, I DO.
UM, I'D LIKE TO PREFACE IT, HOWEVER, WITH, UM, A REQUEST, UM, NOT MAKE IT FORMAL, BUT MAKE IT INFORMAL THAT IF, UM, STAFF OR OUR DIRECTOR IS, UM, UM, IN RECEIVING ANYTHING FROM THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS THAT THEY PLEASE HIGHLIGHT THAT SUCH THAT USE, UM, THE REGULATION USE FOR TRACK ONE PERTAINING TO, UM, THE LOSS OF DWELLING UNITS ONCE
UM, SO WITH THAT, UM, IN THE MATTER OF D 5 1 0 4 SOUTH WINDERMERE AVENUE IN WINNETKA HEIGHTS HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 3 4 DASH 0 1 0 MW, I MOVE THAT, UM, THE REQUEST BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE FOR STAFF RECOMMENDATION FOR THE REASONS STATED IN THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION, INCLUDING PRESERVATION CRITERIA CITED, AND, UM, UM, THE SECTIONS PERTAINING TO NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AS WELL AS ALL APPLICABLE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARD.
DO WE HAVE A SECOND, SECOND, SECOND FROM COMMISSIONER GUEST? DO WE HAVE ANY DISCUSSION OR COMMENTS AROUND THE MOTION? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.
ANY IN OPPOSITION, PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO REGISTER.
SO NOW, OKAY, THAT IS A DENIAL, UH, WHICH THE APPLICANT WILL BE ABLE TO APPEAL THE C P C IF THEY SO CHOOSE FOR A B.
MOVING ON TO DISCUSSION ITEM SIX.
DISCUSSION ITEM SIX IS 1 0 4 SOUTH WINDERMERE AVENUE, WINNETKA HEIGHTS, HISTORIC DISTRICT CD 2 34 DASH ZERO ONE MW.
THIS IS A CERTIFICATE, A REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF DEMO DEMOLITION TO DEMOLISH A NON-CONTRIBUTING ACCESSORY STRUCTURE UNDER THE DEMOLITION STANDARD, NON-CONTRIBUTING OR NEWER THAN THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE THE WORK HAS IS PARTIALLY COMPLETED WITHOUT A CV OR HAS BEEN COMPLETED WITHOUT A CV.
STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF A DEMOLITION TO DEMOLISH A NON-CONTRIBUTING ACCESSORY STRUCTURE UNDER THE DEMOLITION STANDARD, NON-CONTRIBUTING, OR NEWER THAN THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE WERE COMPLETED WITHOUT A CD HE APPROVED WITH THE FINDING OF FACT THAT THE WORK MEETS CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 H FOUR D, AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS, IT'S LIKE GETTING CAUGHT UP IN IT.
TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF DEMOLITION TO DEMOLISH A NON-CONTRIBUTING ACCESSORY STRUCTURE UNDER THE DEMOLITION STANDARD, NON-CONTRIBUTING, OR NEWER THAN THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE WERE COMPLETED WITHOUT A CD BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING COMMENTS, EFFORTS TO KEEP THE STRUCTURE WERE MADE, IT IS NON-CONTRIBUTING AND IT HAD LOST ANY CHARACTER ANYWAY.
UM, DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF PRIOR TO, UH, A MOTION QUESTION? SEVEN, QUESTION FOR STAFF.
[02:50:01]
I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE LANGUAGE HERE OF IT BEING, UM, NEWER IN THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE AS FAR AS WE'RE CONCERNED BECAUSE DID YOU NOT SUGGEST THAT IT WAS 1939 FOR THAT? I I SIMPLY AM SAYING THAT THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE IS 1910 TO 1935.AND I BELIEVE THAT IT'S POST 35.
SO IF WE WERE TO SAY BECAUSE IT'S NEWER THAN THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE, IT WOULD HAVE TO BE BUILT PRIOR TO 1910.
THAT THE OH, YOU MEAN NOT, THE BUILDING IS NOT OLD ENOUGH TO BE OKAY.
I HAVING THE SAME PROBLEM, ALTHOUGH, UM, OKAY, I GET IT.
NO, ION WELL, YOUR RIGHT ON QUESTION FOUR, YOU HAVE YOUR LIGHT ON.
DO YOU HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF OR YES.
I, TO ME, THESE KINDS OF PROBLEMS ARE SO PERPLEXING I DON'T UNDERSTAND SOMETIMES.
IF WE GO AHEAD AND PASS THIS DEMOLITION, I'LL GIVE THE CERTIFICATE OF DEMOLITION IS WHAT HAPPENS IS WHATEVER'S BEEN BUILT SO FAR GETS SCRAPED OFF THE GROUND AND SENT TO THE LANDFILL UNLESS THEY COME BACK WITH THE PREVIOUS CA FOR THE NEW CONSTRUCTION.
IF, IF THEY COME BACK, SAY AFTER THEY'VE BEEN TO BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS, AND THEN YOU, YOU GO L M C CHANGE YOUR MINDS AND AND GRANT THEM THAT NEW BUILDING, THEN YES.
IT, THE, THE PARTIALLY BUILT BUILDING HAS TO BE BROUGHT IN AND SOME LANDFILL UNLESS THEY CAN REUSE PARTS OF IT.
UM, YOU KNOW, HOW OFTEN DOES THAT HAPPEN? I DON'T KNOW.
IT, WAS THERE ANY POSSIBILITY HERE OF THEM MOVING THE STRUCTURE SO AS TO BE IN CONFORMANCE WITH THE SETBACK REQUIREMENT? THEY HAVEN'T CONSIDERED THAT YET.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT WOULD ENTAIL.
I THINK IT'S, IT'S A SLAB, IT'S A, ON A SLAB DATION, BUT I DON'T KNOW.
THEY WOULD PROBABLY, IT WOULD PROBABLY BE CHEAPER FOR THEM TO TEAR IT DOWN AND REBUILD THAN TO TRY TO MOVE IT.
THEY HAVEN'T CONSIDERED IT YET.
WELL, OF COURSE THEY'D BE, I PRESUME THEY'D BE MOVING AT A VERY SHORT DISTANCE.
IT WOULD, UH, I THINK IT'S ABOUT MAYBE 10 FEET INTO THE REQUIRED SIDE YARD.
BUT THEY WOULDN'T BE PUTTING IT ON A FLATBED AND HAULING IT UNDER POWER LINES OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, RIGHT? CORRECT.
SO EVEN IF, SAY WE SAY, I, I KNOW THE VOTE HAS BEEN TAKEN, BUT SAY WE HAD, UH, VOTED, UH, THE OTHER WAY ON THE FIRST QUESTION AND DECIDED THAT WE WERE GONNA APPROVE THE STRUCTURE, WOULD ZONING HAVE THEN SAID, NO, YOU CAN'T DO IT.
UM, YOU, YOU COULD GO AHEAD AND SAY THAT WE ARE OKAY WITH IT, BUT THEN THEY WOULD STILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS OF LIKE GOING THROUGH TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS FOR VARIANCE IN ORDER TO GET THEIR PERMIT.
AND THEN I GUESS THE LAST THING THAT I'M CURIOUS ABOUT, AND I, I DON'T KNOW WHO CAN ANSWER THIS, BUT ARE WE, ARE WE FOLLOWING PROCESS NOW OR ARE WE LOOKING TO TOWARD OUTCOMES IN THE WAY WE'RE MAKING DECISIONS TODAY? SO, UM, THE, MY RECOMMENDATION IS BASED ON KIND OF THE REALITY OF THAT THE BUILDING'S ALREADY BEEN DEMOLISHED, AND THEN THE REALITY OF, UM, THE NEW, THE NEW BUILDING, IT IS A NEW BILL.
IT HAS TO MEET THE CURRENT ZONING REQUIREMENTS UNLESS THEY CAN GET THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS TO, TO SEE THEIR SIDE OF THE CASE.
THAT STILL DOESN'T CHANGE NECESSARILY.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO NECESSARILY CHANGE YOUR, YOUR OPINION ON IT.
YOU DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO GO, GO BACK AND APPROVE IT JUST BECAUSE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS HAS APPROVED IT, BECAUSE IT'S IN THE PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
SO, UM, SO IT'S REALLY KIND OF THE PROCESS IS THE PRACTICAL SIDE OF IT.
THE, THE, THE PRESERVATION SIDE OF IT IS, UM, THERE QUESTION, IF THERE HAD NEVER BEEN THIS BUILDING ALREADY THERE, AND IF THEY CAME TO YOU WITH NEW, A NEW CONSTRUCTION IN THAT, IN THAT ZONE, WOULD YOU HAVE APPROVED IT OR, OR DENIED IT? LIKE IF THEY HAD NEVER BUILT OR DONE ANYTHING UNAUTHORIZED BEFORE, BEFORE THEY ASKED PERMISSION.
AND, AND I THINK WE WOULDN'T, WE BOTH AGREE THAT THAT WOULD BE UNLIKELY AT THIS POINT SIMPLY BECAUSE A NEW BUILDING WOULD'VE HAD
[02:55:01]
NO HISTORY IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.SO THAT, THAT'S PART OF WHAT THE STAFF, UH, RECOMMENDATION IS BASED ON.
IS THAT THIS BUILDING, THE, THE NEW BUILDING, THE, THE OLD BUILDING THAT WE'RE NOW TALKING ABOUT IN THE DEMOLITION WOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN APPROVED HAD IT BEEN, HAD IT COME TO Y'ALL, UM, AND IT, AND IT WAS NON-CONFORMING.
IT WAS, IT WAS ALREADY NON-CONFORMING.
AND THE, THE ONLY REASON I'M ASKING THESE QUESTIONS IS I THINK SOMETIMES IT SEEMS SOMETIMES THAT THESE BUILDINGS THAT MAYBE DON'T FOLLOW ALL THE RULES, BUT EVOLVED PERHAPS BEFORE THERE WERE RULES OR, YOU KNOW, WHEN THEY WERE ALLOWED TO COME IN, THEY ARE PART OF THE EVOLUTION OF THE DISTRICT.
AND SOMETIMES WHILE WE WOULDN'T NECESSARILY DEEM THEM COMPATIBLE, NOW THEY HAVE A KIND OF CLAIM IN THAT THEY HAVE CONTRIBUTED TO THE LIFE AND THE SPATIAL QUALITY AND ALL THAT OF THE DISTRICT FOR DECADES NOW.
NOW I KIND OF TEND TO DEFER TO COMMISSIONERS THAT KNOW WHEN ECHO HEIGHTS BETTER THAN I DO.
BUT, UM, ANYWAY, I JUST, I, I GUESS I JUST FIND MYSELF BEING SOMEWHAT SYMPATHETIC TO HOUSING OPTIONS THAT ARE MORE AFFORDABLE IN A CITY WHERE THEY'RE GROWING LESS AND LESS AFFORDABLE.
AND WHERE, UH, IT JUST SEEMS THAT NEIGHBORHOODS ARE OFTEN GROWING LESS AND LESS QUIRKY AND INTERESTING IN THE WAY THAT WAY THAT THEY EVOLVE OR THANKS.
ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? I HAVE NO QUESTION.
THIS MAY BE A QUESTION FOR STAFF AND LEGAL
AND SO SHOULD WE BE BASING OUR DECISION ON WHAT WAS THERE BEFORE THE BUILDING WAS DEMOLISHED OR WHAT IS THERE NOW THIS, THIS IS BASED ON THE BUILDING THAT WAS THERE BEFORE IT WAS DEMOLISHED.
SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE APPROVING A DEMOLITION AFTER THE FACT, BASICALLY SO THAT THEY CAN MOVE ON WITH WHATEVER IS THE NEXT STEP? UM, YEAH, SO THAT'S WHY I, I USE THE STANDARD OF, EVEN, EVEN THE BUILDING THAT WAS THERE WAS NOT NEEDED.
WHAT I, WHAT I THINK I'M HEARING IS, IT REALLY DOESN'T MATTER HOW WE VOTE ON THIS, BECAUSE IF WE VOTE AGAINST, IF WE DENY THE CERTIFICATE OF DEMOLITION, IS THERE ANY CHANCE AT ALL THAT THE APPLICANT WOULD BE COMPELLED TO REBUILD THE BUILDING MORE OR LESS AS IT WAS ON ITS ORIGINAL FOOTPRINT? THAT IT WOULD, IT WOULD, IT WOULD GO, MOST LIKELY GO TO COURT.
AND THAT IS THE REMEDY WITHIN OUR ORDINANCE FOR AN UNAUTHORIZED DEMOLITION WOULD BE TO REBUILD IT.
AND, AND IF THAT WERE A CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURE IN A PERFECT SITE LOCATION THAT FOLLOWED ALL THE SETBACK RULES THAT COULD ACTUALLY HAPPEN, CORRECT.
BUT IS THERE ANY CHANCE THAT'S GONNA HAPPEN IN THIS CASE? SO IS THERE ANY EVEN, IS THERE EVEN ANY POSSIBILITY OF THAT HAPPENING IN THIS CASE IF YOU WERE TO DENY THE DEMOLITION? MOST LIKELY.
THE ONLY, I THINK THAT THE PROBABILITY IS FAIRLY GOOD THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO BUILD IT BACK, WHICH IT'S, IT'S HALF BUILT AS IT IS.
LIKE, SO THAT'S WHAT THE, THE, THE ONE, THE CA THAT YOU JUST HEARD WAS BASICALLY THE BUILDING THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO BUILD BACK, MAYBE SOME CHANGES IN THE WINDOWS AND DOORS, BUT IT WOULD BE IN THE SAME, THAT WOULD BE IN THAT FOOTPRINT.
IT HAD THE, IT HAS THE SAME CEILING.
I MEAN, UH, ROOF, IT WOULD'VE THE SAME BRICK.
SO BASICALLY, BUT IT FALLS OUTSIDE OF THE SETBACK REQUIREMENT.
THAT'S, THAT'S A PROBLEM BOTH IN THE PRESERVATION CRITERIA AND IN THE ZONING IN THE DEVELOPMENT.
SO WOULDN'T THERE BE A POINT IN THE, YOU HAVE TO BUILD THIS FACT PROCESS WHERE SOMEBODY WOULD SAY, AH, BUT YOU CAN'T BECAUSE IT FALLS OUTSIDE OF THE SETBACK REQUIREMENT.
I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THAT OUTCOME WOULD BE.
IT MIGHT BE THAT IT WOULD BE THE, THE SAME BUILDING, BUT IT WOULD HAVE TO BE WITHIN THE REAR YARD.
IT MIGHT HAVE TO BE, UH, MOVED BACK.
SO IT MIGHT END UP BEING EXACTLY THE SAME AS WHAT WE'RE ALREADY TALKING ABOUT.
I'M GONNA DEFER TO, WELL, I JUST WANT TO FOCUS THE DISCUSSION ON THE STANDARD THAT THIS IS AGAIN, A CERTIFICATE OF DEMOLITION AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WHAT WAS THERE, WHAT'S BEEN REBUILT.
SO I JUST WANTED TO REITERATE THE STANDARD, UM, IN THE CODE, IF I MAY READ THAT SECTION.
SO IT SAYS, THE LANDMARK COMMISSION MUST DENY AN APPLICATION TO DEMOLISH OR
[03:00:01]
REMOVE A STRUCTURE THAT IS NON CONTRIBUTING TO THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT BECAUSE IT IS NEWER THAN THE PERIOD OF HISTORIC SIGN SIGNIFICANCE, UNLESS IT BINDS THAT ONE.THE IS NON-CONTRIBUTING TO THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT.
THE STRUCTURE IS NEWER THAN THE PERIOD OF HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE FOR THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT.
AND THREE, THAT THE DEMOLITION OF THE STRUCTURE WILL NOT ADVERSELY AFFECT THE HISTORIC CHARACTER OF THE PROPERTY OR THE INTEGRITY OF THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT.
SO WE HAVE TO CONSIDER WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY THERE.
AND IF IT MEETS ALL OF THESE THREE THINGS, THEN YOU HAVE TO GRANT THE, THE CERTIFICATE OF DEMOLITION.
SO WAS THAT, WAS THAT ORIGINAL BU ORIGINAL BUILDING, WAS IT NON-CONTRIBUTING TO THE STORE GO DISTRICT? WAS IT NEWER THAN THE PERIOD OF, OF SIGNIFICANCE? AND WOULD IT NOT ADVERSELY AFFECT THE HISTORIC CHARACTER OF THE PROPERTY OR THE INTEGRITY OF THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT MEET THOSE THREE.
IF IT MEETS THOSE THREE, THEN YOU HAVE TO GRANT.
BUT IF IT DOES NOT MEET ONE OF THOSE THREE, THEN YOU MUST DENY THE APPLICATION.
SO IF YOU ARE TO DENY THE APPLICATION, YOU HAVE TO BASE IT OFF OF ONE OF THOSE THREE STANDARDS.
AND SO I, I HAVE A QUESTION BASED ON THAT.
YOU SAID THOUGH THAT THE PROCESS, UH, FOR A DENIAL WOULD MEAN THAT THEY WOULD BECOME COMPELLED TO BUILD WHAT THEY'RE ALREADY BUILDING.
THE, THAT WOULD REALLY BE THE ONLY REMEDY OTHER THAN A, A FINE, BUT, AND IT'S NOT A VERY LARGE FINE.
BUT, BUT YES, THAT WOULD, THAT'S THE REMEDY WITHIN OUR ORDINANCE, UM, FOR AN UNAUTHORIZED DEMOLITION TO BUILD IT UP.
IT SEEMS CONCEIVABLY THAT A DENIAL WOULD BE QUITE HELPFUL FOR THE APPLICANT.
DOES ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF, THE ATTORNEY ALONG THIS LINE? DOES ANYONE, UM, ATTENDING REMOTELY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR CITY STAFF, CITY ATTORNEY, ANYTHING ALONG THOSE LINES? I DO NOT.
ANYONE? COMMISSIONER SHERMER? IT WAS OUR SOLE DETERMINATION AS TO WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS NOT CONTRIBUTING BASED ON WHAT THE, UM, SURVEY SHOWS FOR THE NATIONAL REGISTER.
BECAUSE THE EVIDENCE OF THE BUILDING ITSELF IS NO LONGER AVAILABLE TO US.
WE CAN'T ASCERTAIN, UM, WE DON'T BELIEVE THAT WAS THE CASE, THAT WE BELIEVE THE SURVEYOR MADE THE MISTAKE.
IF, IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR A REASON TO DENY THIS APPLICATION, YOU'LL NEED TO NAME BASED ON THOSE THREE, UH, CRITERIA THAT, THAT THERESA WENT OVER, AND YOU'LL NEED TO TELL WHY IT, IT DOESN'T MEET ONE OF THOSE.
AND WHY IS IT ADVANTAGEOUS TO THE APPLICANT, UM, FOR IT TO BE DENIED? DID YOU SAY THAT MR.
IT DOESN'T FALL WITHIN THE SCOPES OR THE REASONINGS AS TO WHAT SHE WOULD ALLOW, BUT IT ABSOLUTELY WOULD BE HELPFUL TO THE APPLICANT.
UH, FULLY COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERG IS AN AGREEMENT AS WELL.
YEAH, IT, IT, IT WOULD BE HELPFUL BECAUSE THEY WOULDN'T BE FORCED TO RECREATE IT.
IN OTHER WORDS, THEY, THE, IF I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY, THE ENFORCEMENT OF REBUILDING IT WOULD NOT NECESSARILY BE REQUIRED BECAUSE IT COULDN'T BE RIGHT.
AND IT CAN'T BE SOUGHT VIA THE COURTS THOUGH.
WE, WE ESSENTIALLY ABSOLVE THEM OF GOING TO COURT.
IS THAT CORRECT? FORCING THEM TO REBUILD IT.
IF YOU, IF YOU APPROVE THE DEMOLITION, IF YOU APPROVE THE DEMOLITION, IF YOU APPROVE THE DEMOLITION, THAT'S GONNA SATISFY OUR, OUR, UH, PROSECUTORS.
BUT IN, IN THAT WAY IT'S
SO A DENIAL IS WHAT WOULD LEAD TO THE PROCESS BY WHICH THEY WOULD BE COMPELLED TO REBUILD IT AND REBUILD A NONCONFORMING STRUCTURE, WHICH IS WHAT THEY'RE, I JUST, I DON'T, I I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT WAS LAND, WHICH IS, I CANNOT PREDICT WHERE IT WOULD LAND.
AS FAR AS THE SETBACK, WHICH YOU UNDERSTOOD.
SO, BUT THE, YOU SAID THE REMEDY FOR THAT IS THE COMPULSION TO BUILD THAT WHICH WAS THERE PREVIOUSLY, WHICH IS WHAT THEY'VE STARTED TO DO.
THAT'S WHAT THEY INTENDED TO DO ANYWAY.
WE WOULD LET THEM PROCEED AS SEEMINGLY.
I MEAN, THAT'S THE OUTCOME THEY WANT.
DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING DIANE, MR. SWAN? YEAH, MY QUESTION IS THIS, I THINK THAT IN AS MUCH AS THIS, AM I, AM I WRONG IN BELIEVING THAT THIS IS A
[03:05:01]
SOMEWHAT ECCENTRIC SITE IN THE DISTRICT? THAT THIS IS NOT TYPICAL? UH, YOU MEAN IN TRACK ONE, DO WE HAVE ANY OTHER MULTI-FAMILY STRUCTURES THAT FACE A MAJOR BOULEVARD? WELL, NO, IT, IT'S NOT JUST THAT.IT'S THE FACT THAT IT, OR IT'S AN ACCESSORY BUILDING.
IT'S KIND OF AN ODD SHAPED LOT, ISN'T IT? ISN'T IT? WE HAVE SEVERAL THAT ARE TRIANGULAR AND THAT MAY BE ONE OF HIS ARGUMENTS AT BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS IS THE SHAPE OF THE LOT.
THEY MIGHT GIVE THEM SOME LEEWAY ON THE SETBACKS.
AND I, I, I JUST, I PARTLY, I GUESS 'CAUSE OF MY EXPERIENCE WITH 10TH STREET, I'M, I'M KIND OF SYMPATHETIC TO SETBACK DECISIONS THAT ARE MORE SITUATIONAL THAN THEY ARE ABOUT FORMULAS, BECAUSE SOMETIMES THE SPATIAL EXPERIENCE OF SOMETHING IS MORE SATISFYING AS, PARTICULARLY IN AN ECCENTRIC SITUATION, IT JUST MAKES MORE SENSE THAN WHATEVER THE FORMULA FOR SETBACK WOULD REQUIRE.
AND ALL I'M KIND OF ASKING IS FOR SOME UNDERSTANDING.
'CAUSE I, I, YOU KNOW, I DRIVE BY THIS PLACE, BUT I HAVEN'T REALLY LOOKED AT IT HARD AND I'VE NEVER REALLY STUDIED THE ACCESSORY BUILDINGS.
OBVIOUSLY THEY NEVER ATTRACTED MY ATTENTION BECAUSE OF HOW DELETERIOUS THEY WERE TO THE CHARACTER OF THE DISTRICT.
I'M JUST WONDERING IF ON BALANCE, IF THESE MODEST RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES UNITS, UM, IF THEY WERE COMPATIBLE AND PERHAPS CONTRIBUTING TO A SENSE OF THE PLACE OVER THE MANY DECADES THAT THEY STOOD THERE.
I'M JUST KIND OF WONDERING BECAUSE IT SEEMS SOMETIMES WHEN WE'RE FOLLOWING PROCESS MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE, AND WE'RE LOOKING AT AN ORDINANCE THAT'S SW SOMEWHAT FOR FORMULAIC AND DOESN'T NECESSARILY TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE EXPERIENCE OF BEING IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD WITH ITS OCCASIONAL ECCENTRIC LOTS.
UM, IF WE'RE MOVING TOWARDS SOMETHING BETTER OR IF WE'RE JUST SATISFYING AN ORDINANCE, I DON'T KNOW.
I'M, I'M KIND OF ASKING, I'M ASKING FOR HELP ON THIS.
I WOULDN'T SUGGEST THAT THIS LOT IS ECCENTRIC.
I WOULD SUGGEST THAT IT'S PERHAPS UNCOMMON.
UM, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE SOME OTHERS THAT ARE ATYPICAL, RIGHT? UM, ESPECIALLY ALONG JEFFERSON, WHICH IS JEFFERSON ANGLES FROM THE SOUTHEAST TO THE NORTHWEST AND CONSEQUENTLY LEFT SOME SLICED AND DICED KIND OF ANGULAR LOTS UPON WHICH TO BUILD, BUT DON'T, I'VE LIVED NEARBY MM-HMM.
MY RECOLLECTION OF THAT BUILDING WAS THAT YEARS AND YEARS AGO, IT WAS NOT USED FOR DWELLING PURPOSES.
AND THEN CONSEQUENTLY IT TURNED INTO DWELLING SPACES THAT WAS RIDDLED WITH PROSTITUTION AND DRUG ACTIVITY FOR A LONG, LONG TIME.
SO FOR ME, THERE'S A LOT OF, YOU KNOW, I, I DON'T HAVE FOND RECOLLECTION TO THAT BUILDING ON THE FIRST, BUT I THINK THAT BUILDING JUST POPPED UP AS SOME KINDA RANDOM POP-UP.
I DON'T THINK IT WAS, YOU KNOW, ARCHITECTURAL ENHANCING TO THE MAIN DWELLING.
I I THINK IT SERVED ORIGINALLY A FUNCTIONAL PURPOSE.
BUT THAT CAME, YOU KNOW, AFTER THE PERIOD OF SIGNIFICANCE.
SO IT, MR. SHERMAN, I'M SORRY, THIS IS REALLY CON YOU, YOU'RE, YOU'RE STAYING COMMENTS ABOUT IN YOUR THOUGHTS AND FEELINGS ABOUT THE, UM, REQUEST WITHOUT EMOTION ON THE FLOOR.
THIS IS STILL RIGHT, THERE HASN'T BEEN EMOTION ON THE FLOOR.
THIS IS STILL A TIME FOR QUESTION.
MY CONCERN, IF I CAN SPEAK TO MY CONCERN INSTEAD OF MY EMOTION IS FOR THE, THE FACT THAT WHAT SORT OF MESSAGE IS SENT TO WHATEVER INVESTOR MIGHT LIKE TO COME INTO THIS DISTRICT.
SO THE COMMISSION DOESN'T REALLY CARE.
IS THAT THE MESSAGE? WHAT IS THE MESSAGE? I'M NOT SO SURE ABOUT WHAT WE'RE TELLING SOMEONE ABOUT THE NATURE OF THIS DISTRICT AND HOW ITS, UM, USES ARE UPHELD AND HOW ITS GUIDELINES ARE ADHERED TO.
THAT'S WHAT CONCERNS ME ABOUT IT.
HONESTLY, THAT SPACE IS PROBABLY BETTER SUITED FOR PARKING.
WHERE ELSE ARE YOU GONNA PARK UNLESS YOU'RE GONNA RIDE THE BUS.
THAT'S, YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS HIGHEST AND BEST USE IN WHAT'S PRACTICAL SENSE FOR THE DISTRICT.
I DON'T SEE THE NATURE OF THIS LITTLE BUILDING HAVING ENHANCED IT.
THANK YOU FOR ANSWERING MY QUESTION.
[03:10:01]
IN TERMS OF PROCESS, IF THE APPLICATION IS DENIED AND, UH, SEEMINGLY FOLLOW THE PROCESS THROUGH AND THE COURT COMPELS THEM, DOES THAT ABSOLVE THE APPLICANT OF HAVING TO GO FURTHER BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT? I WOULD HAVE TO DEFER TO STAFF.I HAVEN'T TALKED TO COMMUNITY PROSECUTION.
UM, THAT'S, I DON'T KNOW WHICH ONE WOULD COME FIRST, HONESTLY.
COMMISSIONER
WE'VE TALKED ABOUT BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT SO MANY TIMES.
I'M, I FORGET, HAS THIS APPLICANT ANNOUNCED AN INTENTION TO TAKE THIS TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT? YES.
SO THAT'S GONNA HAPPEN NO MATTER WHAT WE DO HERE TODAY, MORE THAN LIKELY, YES.
ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS, COMMENTS, ANYONE ATTENDING REMOTELY WITH ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS?
I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR FROM KATE SINGLETON ON THIS, JUST FOR THE RECORD.
UM, AND WHAT WOULD BE THE, WHAT YOU'D WANT ME TO SPEAK ABOUT.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW THAT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE DISTRICT AS A WHOLE IN ITS FUTURE, WHAT DO YOU THINK THIS CASE, UM, SHOULD
AND I THINK THIS, I THINK THE APPLICANT'S GONNA GO TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS AND THEN WE'LL SEE WHERE IT PLAYS OUT FROM THERE.
BUT I BELIEVE THE STAFF HAS GIVEN THE BEST RECOMMENDATION.
WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS QUITE A BIT.
AND SO I THINK STAFF HAS TRIED TO FOLLOW THE ORDINANCE IN A DIFFICULT SITUATION, THE BEST THAT WE CAN AND GIVE YOU BEST RECOMMENDATION TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT.
I HAVE ANION IF NO ONE ELSE WANTS TO, I'M HAPPY TO DEFER TO SOMEBODY ELSE, HONESTLY.
BUT I'M HAPPY TO MAKE CONVICTION.
WERE READY WHEN YOU ARE IN THE MATTER OF DISCUSSION.
ITEM 6 1 0 4 SOUTH WINDERMERE AVENUE IN THE WINNETKA HEIGHTS HISTORIC DISTRICT, CD 2 3 4 DASH 0 0 1 MW.
I MOVE THAT THIS COMMISSION ACCEPTS STAFF RECOMMENDATION, UM, FOR THE REASONS STATED AND READ INTO THE RECORD.
DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION OR COMMENTS AROUND THE MOTION? SEEING NONE.
DOES ANYONE REMOTELY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS AROUND THE MOTION? SEEING NONE.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.
ANY OF THOSE IN OPPOSITION, PLEASE GIVE NOTICE NOW.
THIS MOTION PASSES, UH, TOUCHING BASE ON TWO ITEMS BEFORE WE ADJOURN FOR THE DAY.
UH, WANTED TO TOUCH BASE AND SEE IF H R N A HAD ANY INFORMATION THAT, UM, THEY WANTED TO PROVIDE OR IF THEY HAD REACHED OUT TO YOU WITH ANY INFORMATION? NO.
UM, AND THEN, UH, ONE FINAL ITEM.
WELL, YES, UM, MS. HINES, THERE WERE, UH, SOME QUESTIONS FROM THE BRIEFING THIS MORNING.
WERE YOU GOING TO PROVIDE THOSE ANSWERS TODAY OR WILL YOU BE FOLLOWING UP WITH THOSE ELECTRONICALLY VIA STAFF? WE'LL PROVIDE THOSE ANSWERS TO YOU VIA ELECTRONICALLY, VIA STAFF.
UM, DON'T
UH, SHOULD WE SEND OUR MOTION SHEETS TO ELAINE AS WE USUALLY DO, OR SEND THEM TO ME
UM, PLEASE SEND YOUR MOTION SHEETS TO ME AND, UH, WE'RE GONNA PUT, WE'LL PUT THEM ALL TOGETHER.
ELAINE SHOULD BE BACK, UM, AND, AND BRING THEM TO ELAINE IN THE HOSPITAL.
UH, THE 14TH I THINK IS HER LAST DAY.
[03:15:01]
IN THE FOLLOWING MONDAY.SO, BUT IF YOU'LL PLEASE DO THAT.
SO WE'LL HAVE THEM, UM, WE'LL KNOW WHERE THEY ARE.
AND WITH THAT, WE ARE AGENDA FIRST 20.