Jun 17, 2024 City Planning Commission

GOOD MORNING, UH, COMMISSIONERS.

DISTRICT ONE, PRESENT.

PRESENT? DISTRICT 11.

DISTRICT 14, MR. PRESIDENT, DISTRICT 14 HERE.

AND PLACE 15.

I'M HERE.

YOU HAVE QUORUM, SIR.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MS. FAINA.

TODAY IS THURSDAY, JUNE 17TH, 9:10 AM WELCOME TO THE SPECIALLY CALLED HEARING OF THE DALLAS CITY PLANE COMMISSION.

UH, COMMISSIONERS.

[BRIEFINGS]

WE'RE GONNA START OFF WITH A BRIEFING.

OUR TWO GENTLEMEN ARE HERE AND READY TO GO.

UH, AND, UH, WE WILL GO TO TAKE SOME PUBLIC INPUT AFTER THAT.

GOOD MORNING, GENTLEMEN.

ALRIGHT, GOOD MORNING.

TOD, UH, SPECIFICALLY HOW ADDITIONAL DENSITY SHOULD BE, UH, SHOULD BE FOCUSED ON TOD AND HOW THAT SHOULD, SHOULD WORK WITHIN THE PLACE TYPES.

UM, THANK YOU.

I HOPE THOSE FATHERS HAD A GREAT FATHER'S DAY.

UM, SO LET'S GET GOING.

SO TODAY'S GONNA BE VERY BRIEF, UH, WITH THIS BRIEFING.

JUST GONNA GIVE A QUICK OVERVIEW IN TERMS OF WHERE WE'VE BEEN THE LAST, UH, SIX MONTHS WITH THIS PROJECT WITH YOU ALL, AND GO OVER SOME OVER, UH, TOUCHING POINTS FROM THE LAST UPDATE TO THE PLAN DOCUMENT.

AND THEN JUST OPEN THAT UP FOR ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS.

AND THEN WE CAN GO INTO, UH, THE PUBLIC HEARING.

SO I'M GONNA SPEAK ON TOUCH ON, UH, THE CPC PROCESS TO DATE, UM, HIGHLIGHTS OF THE, THE MOST RECENT PLAN UPDATE AND THE NEXT STEPS, UH, FOR THIS PROJECT.

UH, SO IN THE LAST SIX MONTHS, UH, WE'VE HAD A LOT OF INTERACTION WITH THIS BODY, UH, FROM CPC BRIEFINGS, WORKSHOPS, PUBLIC HEARINGS.

AND WHAT WE WANNA DO IS GIVE A QUICK SNAPSHOT OF WHAT WE'VE DONE SO FAR, UM, IN ADDITION TO OTHER ENGAGEMENT THAT WE'VE HAD WITH COUNCIL, THE COMMUNITY, ET CETERA.

JUST WANT TO HIGHLIGHT WHAT WE'VE DONE WITH CPC SO FAR.

UH, SO WE'VE HAD, UH, SIX BRIEFINGS, UH, TWO WORKSHOPS, AND THIS IS THE THIRD, UH, PUBLIC MEETING THAT WE'RE HAVING WITH THIS BODY.

UH, IN ADDITION TO THAT, WE'VE HAD A, A NUMBER OF TOWN HALLS, NEIGHBORHOOD MEETINGS, UM, THROUGHOUT THE CITY.

UM, THOSE THAT HAVE BEEN LED BY YOU ALL OR COUNCIL MEMBERS, THESE ARE THE ONES THAT WE'RE SHOWING.

UH, THIS DOES NOT INCLUDE, YOU KNOW, INDIVIDUAL MEETINGS WITH COUNCIL OR THE PROFESSIONAL ORGANIZATIONS OR, OR TECHNICAL REVIEW COMMITTEE.

UM, BUT JUST WANNA GIVE A QUICK OVERVIEW THAT WE'VE BEEN DOING SOMETHING PROBABLY EVERY WEEK, UH, SINCE THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR.

UM, AND IN THIS MAP, I WANT TO JUST KIND OF TOUCH ON WHAT WE'VE HEARD SO FAR.

SO AS THE PUBLIC HAS BEEN PROVIDING COMMENTS TO YOU ALL, UH, THROUGH LETTERS OR THE PUBLIC HEARING, UH, WHAT OUR TEAM HAS DONE, UH, THOSE THAT HAVE PROVIDED THEIR ADDRESS AS REQUIRED, UH, FOR THESE PUBLIC COMMENTS AND PUBLIC HEARINGS, WE STARTED TO MAP THOSE, UH, THROUGHOUT THE CITY JUST TO BE ABLE TO FIND OR FIGURE OUT OR SEE, UH, WHERE CERTAIN SENTIMENTS ARE COMING FROM.

I THOUGHT WE THINK THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT TO KNOW EXACTLY WHICH AREAS ARE SAYING WHAT, UM, AND ALSO JUST TO SEE VISUALLY THE FEEDBACK THAT WE'RE GETTING, UM, FROM THE PUBLIC.

SO, JUST WANTED TO SHOW THIS, THAT THE BLUE INDICATES THOSE ARE USUALLY IN FAVOR.

UH, THOSE THAT ARE IN OPPOSITIONS IS IN MAGENTA, AND THOSE THAT ARE NEUTRAL ARE IN BLACK.

UH, SO AGAIN, JUST TRYING TO SHOW A, A GEOGRAPHICAL SPREAD OF THE COMETS, WHERE THEY'RE COMING FROM, UM, AS WE ARE TAKING THAT INPUT, UH, FROM YOU ALL FROM THE COMMUNITY AND OTHER ORGANIZATIONS THAT ARE HELPING US TO UPDATE THIS DRAFT.

UH, SO PLAN, UPDATE HIGHLIGHTS, AND WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO TO, I'M GOING TO TALK THROUGH, UH, THESE ON THE LIST, AND WE'LL USE THIS AS A GENERAL GUIDE AS WE BEGIN OUR CONVERSATION.

I'M JUST GONNA TOUCH ON THE MAJOR, UH, HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE LAST UPDATE.

UH, SO ONE, UH, WE'VE ADDED OVERVIEW AND PURPOSE LANGUAGE, UH, IN THE DOCUMENT, UH, SPECIFICALLY ELABORATING ON THE HISTORIC DISTRICTS, NSOS CONSERVATION DISTRICTS, AND HOW THOSE RELATE TO FORD DALLAS.

UH, WE'VE ADDED A HISTORICAL CONTEXT AND TRENDS SECTION THAT GIVES A BIT MORE CONTEXT IN TERMS OF WHERE, WHERE WE'RE COMING FROM, FROM THE, FROM THIS PARTICULAR PROCESS FROM THE CITY AND WHERE WE'RE LOOKING TO GO.

UH, WE TOUCH ON CURRENT CONDITIONS AND THE EQUITY CONNECTIONS TO ALL THE LAND USE THEMES.

SO I THINK THAT WAS A, UH, UH, A FEEDBACK FROM YOU ALL JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT CONNECTION TO THE THEMES ARE CONNECTING TO WHAT'S ON THE GROUND, WHAT WE'RE SEEING AND EQUITY, UH, THROUGHOUT THE CITY.

SO WE'VE DONE THAT AS WELL.

UH, WE'VE ADDED SOME EMPHASIS ON

[00:05:01]

UH, WE'VE ALSO DEFINED AND UPDATED, UM, THE PRIMARY AND SECONDARY USE DEFINITIONS.

UM, AND ALSO TOO, WE'VE ADDED AND UPDATED THE, THE LANE USE, THE LANE USES WITHIN THAT MATRIX TO, TO COINCIDE WITH THOSE DEFINITIONS AS WELL.

UH, LAST FOUR, WE'VE UPDATED THE CONTEXT LANGUAGE AND ADDED LOCATIONAL STRATEGIES FOR EACH OF THE PLACE TYPES, UH, SPECIFICALLY THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE TO ADDRESS A LOT OF THE CONCERNS, UH, THAT WE HEARD FROM THE COMMUNITY AND THIS BODY.

UH, WE'VE ALSO, UH, ADDED SOME UPDATES TO DESIGN STRATEGIES THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRETY OF ALL THE PLACE TYPES.

SO PROVIDING A BIT MORE CONTEXT, A BIT MORE DETAIL ON HOW, UH, CERTAIN ADDITIONAL DEVELOPMENT, UH, SHOULD LOOK LIKE IN THESE PLACE TYPES.

UH, PROVIDED CLARITY ON THE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE, UH, IMPLEMENTATION TABLE.

UH, THERE WAS A BIT OF AMBIGUITY, UH, IN THE LAST VERSION, SO WE'VE ADDED A BIT MORE CLARITY ON, ON WHAT THOSE ACTION STEPS SHOULD LOOK LIKE.

AND THEN LASTLY, WE'VE ADDED THE CONTEXT, UH, EXCUSE ME, THE SUPPORTING DOCUMENTS, UH, SPECIFICALLY CONTEXT MAPS, GLOSSARY, UH, AREA SPECIFIC MAPS, AND THE EXISTING CONDITIONS REPORT INTO THE, UH, COMPREHENSIVE VERSION OF THIS DOCUMENT.

SO THOSE ITEMS THAT WE REFERENCE IN THE, THE MAIN PLAN DOCUMENT, YOU CAN ALSO LOOK AT, UH, THE APPENDICES TO SEE HOW THOSE TIE IN, UH, TO THE DOCUMENT.

UH, SO ALSO WHAT I'M GONNA DO IS JUST QUICKLY GIVE A QUICK OVERVIEW WITH THE SCHEDULE.

WE'LL, WE'LL COME BACK TO THIS AS WELL, UH, AT THE END OF THE MEETING.

SO TO DATE, AND LIKE I MENTIONED, WE'VE HAD A SERIES OF PUBLIC HEARINGS, UH, WORKSHOPS, UH, PUBLIC MEETINGS AS WELL, AND BRIEFINGS.

SO TODAY IS A PUBLIC HEARING AND BRIEFING.

UM, AND AFTER TODAY, WE'LL PROBABLY HAVE ANOTHER CONVER MORE CONVERSATION IN TERMS OF WHAT THE NEXT STEP LOOKS LIKE IN TERMS OF, UM, IN JULY, HOW WE'RE GONNA BE MOVING FORWARD, THIS PARTICULAR PROCESS.

BUT JUST FOR TODAY, TODAY IS A PUBLIC MEETING, WHICH IS GONNA INCLUDE A PUBLIC HEARING.

AND JUST FOR CLARITY, UH, WE HAVE A REGULARLY SCHEDULED CPC, UH, MEETING ON THE 20TH OF THIS WEEK.

UH, STAFF IS GONNA BE AVAILABLE FOR DALLAS STAFF IS GONNA BE AVAILABLE FOR ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS, BUT THAT MEETING ISN'T MEANT AS A PUBLIC HEARING JUST TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT THIS BODY MIGHT HAVE, UM, AFTER THIS MEETING HAS CONCLUDED.

SO WITH THAT, THAT IS ALL THAT I HAVE, UH, GO BACK TO YOU CHAIR.

UH, AND JUST ONE QUICK QUESTION FOR ME IN TERMS OF THE CALENDAR, THE, UH, THE MEETING ON THE 20TH, IT'S JUST A PLACEHOLDER.

IT'S JUST, JUST WE, WE PUT IT ON THERE TO HAVE FLEXIBILITY AND TO GIVE, UH, COMMISSIONERS THE OPPORTUNITY TO ASK QUESTIONS OF STAFF ON THURSDAY IF THERE ISN'T, YOU KNOW, ARE ANY AT THAT POINT? UH, CORRECT, YES.

AND WHAT WE TYPICALLY DO IS EVERY CPC MEETING AS THIS PROJECT IS ON, WE'RE GONNA BE ON THAT JUST TO ALLOW THE POSSIBILITY FOR US TO SPEAK, UH, TO YOU ALL.

BUT IF NOT NEEDED, UH, THEN WE WON'T HAVE TO, UH, ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.

BUT IT'S, WE'RE GONNA BE ON ALL OF THOSE, UM, MEETINGS MOVING FORWARD UNTIL THIS PROJECT HAS BEEN RECOMMENDED TO THE COUNCIL.

EXCELLENT.

AND, UH, IT, IT IS A LARGE DOCUMENT.

UH, MANY OF US HAVE, HAVE PRINTED IT OUT, STILL WORKING THROUGH IT COMMISSIONERS, UH, AND THERE IS STILL TIME.

WE, WE STILL HAVE, IN FACT, WEEKS BEFORE, UH, THE POSSIBILITY OF A GLOBAL VOTE TO, UH, TO TAKE ON THIS ISSUE.

CORRECT.

QUESTIONS, COMMISSIONERS, AND LET THE RECORD REFLECT THAT COMMISSIONER LER IS ONLINE, JOINED US AT 9:05 AM ANY QUESTIONS, COMMISSIONER? OKAY.

DID YOU RECEIVE THAT? YES.

UH, COMMISSIONERS, JUST, JUST A POINT OF CLARIFICATION.

UH, THE PLAN IS TO, UH, IF WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR TWO GENTLEMEN HERE, IF NOT, THEN WE'LL GO TO OUR PUBLIC SPEAKERS AND AFTER OUR PUBLIC SPEAKERS, UH, WE'LL DISCUSS, UH, THE ITEMS THAT WE DISCUSSED BEFORE THAT WE TRIED TO GET CONSENSUS AS WELL AS THE, THE NEW LANGUAGE THAT WAS EMAILED OUT FROM SOME OF US LAST NIGHT.

[00:10:02]

IF ANYTHING.

AND ANYTHING ELSE? YES.

YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.

GENTLEMEN, WE'RE READY TO TAKE, UH, INPUT FROM YOU.

UH, THEN, UH, LADIES AND

[PUBLIC TESTIMONY]

UM, LET ME STATE THE SPEAKER GUIDELINES.

WE ARE GONNA GO WITH ONE MINUTE PER SPEAKER.

I WILL PLEASE ASK YOU TO, UH, BEGIN WITH YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD, AND TO ADDRESS ALL YOUR COMMENTS TO THE CHAIR.

PLEASE MAKE SURE NOT TO NAME ANY PLAN COMMISSIONER BY NAME.

WE DO HAVE SOME SPEAKERS ONLINE.

FOR OUR SPEAKERS ONLINE.

MAKE SURE THAT YOUR CAMERA IS ON AND WORKING.

STATE LAW REQUIRES THAT WE SEE YOU IN ORDER TO HEAR FROM YOU.

WE'RE GONNA TAKE, UH, IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER, FOLKS, SO IF YOU WANNA JUST COME ON DOWN, WE'RE READY TO TAKE INPUT.

YOUR LITTLE TAG JUST FELL, SIR, IF YOU WANT IT.

GOOD MORNING, ED.

ZARA, 1003 VALENCIA, DALLAS, FORWARD.

DALLAS HAS GOTTEN BACKWARD.

THE NEW VERSION OF FORWARD DALLAS DROPPED ON US LIKE A BOMB.

WITH THAT, ANY PUBLIC INPUT IS ANOTHER ATTEMPT TO DESTROY SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

THE COMMUNITY, THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE NOW INCLUDES TINY HOMES INSTEAD OF ADUS.

SO ANYONE WITH A GARDEN HOSE, EXTENSION CORD AND COMPOST TOILET CAN PUT A MOBILE HOME IN THEIR LOT.

COTT COURTS A SLICK NAME FOR MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENT ON A SINGLE LOT SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED TOWN HOMES, DUPLEXES, TRIPLEXES, MULTIPLEX, MULTI-FAMILY WITH, THROUGH THE 10 ATTACHED UNITS, PROPERTY TAXES WILL INCREASE DUE TO INCREASED DENSITY FOR YEARS.

DALLAS RESIDENTS HAVE CLEARLY STATED THEY WANT EXISTING NEIGHBORHOODS PROTECTED.

ALL OF THESE LAND USES ARE UNACCEPTABLE.

THE SOLUTION IS EASY IN OUR ZONE.

DISTRICTS, SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED AS THE ONLY PRIMARY USE, ONLY ONE UTILITY SERVICE ALLOWED.

ALL OTHER LAND USES IN OUR ZONE DISTRICTS ARE CLASSIFIED AS SECONDARY USES ONLY.

IT'S OKAY.

MY NAME IS BRIAN.

TONY, I'M HERE ON BEHALF OF THE DALLAS HOUSING COALITION.

I WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT THIS NEW DRAFT IS ACTUALLY A STRONG COMPROMISE, UM, IMPROVEMENTS INCLUDING THE DESIGN STANDARDS, CONTEXT, LANGUAGE, AND LOCATIONAL STRATEGIES.

WHAT'S MOST IMPORTANT HERE IS THAT WE ARE CREATING AN INCLUSIVE CITY, ONE THAT HAS A VISION, UH, WHERE EVERYBODY CAN SUCCEED.

HERE, CAN START A HOME, CAN AGE IN PLACE, AND OUR YOUNG ADULTS AND STUDENTS CAN PROSPER.

WE HAVE SEVERAL OF OUR MEMBERS HERE TODAY IN OUR AUDIENCE.

THIS IS EQUALLY A FAIR HOUSING ISSUE, INCLUDING, UH, THAT ALL NEIGHBORHOODS MUST ACCOMMODATE MORE HOUSING, HIGH OPPORTUNITY AREAS MUST ALLOW MORE HOUSING.

WE'VE ONLY SEEN AFFORDABLE HOUSING PUT INTO OUR SOUTHERN SECTOR.

THAT'S A RESULT OF OUR SEGREGATION FORWARD.

DALLAS LOOKS TO ADDRESS THAT.

AND THEN THERE ARE NEIGHBORHOODS STUCK IN THE MIDDLE THAT NEED MORE POLICY SOLUTIONS THAT WILL COME ALONG AFTER FORWARD DALLAS IS PUT INTO PLACE.

BUT THIS IS A VISIONARY DOCUMENT, UH, ONE THAT WE NEEDED TO HAVE UPDATED SINCE 2006.

AND IT'S A CITYWIDE PLAN.

WE WANT THAT VISION TO BE ONE THAT IS INCLUSIVE, THAT'S FAIR TO EVERYBODY, AND ALLOWS US ALL TO PROSPER.

PLEASE CONTINUE TO HELP MOVE THIS PLAN FORWARD.

AND THANK YOU.

CAN YOU PLEASE, UH, STATE YOUR ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD? AND MY ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD IS 1500 PECOS STREET, UNIT FOUR, DALLAS, TEXAS.

DIANE BIRDWELL, 57 0 5 WICK AND DALLAS.

7 5 2 2 7.

Y'ALL SEEN ME BEFORE.

YOU'VE SEEN ME AT FOUR MEETINGS.

SO I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND ALL THOSE POSITIVE COMMENTS BECAUSE THAT'S NOT WHAT I'VE SEEN.

MY EXPERIENCE.

THE NEIGHBORHOODS THAT'LL BE IMPACTED BY THIS ARE ACTUALLY THOSE IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR.

THE ONES WHO WILL BE NEGATIVELY IMPACTED WILL BE THE MIDDLE CLASS AND WORKING CLASS NEIGHBORHOODS OF, UH, CAS VIEW, BUCKNER TERRACE, PARKDALE, PECAN HEIGHTS, DOLPHIN HEIGHTS.

UH, IT WILL NOT REALLY IMPACT LAKEWOOD VERY MUCH, BUT IT, AND IT DEFINITELY WON'T IMPACT PRESIDENT HOLLOW, BUT WHAT IT'S GONNA DO IS NEGATIVELY IMPACT US JAMMING MORE PEOPLE INTO A CITY, INTO THE SAME AREA WHERE WE HAVE NOT ENOUGH RESOURCES RIGHT NOW FOR GARBAGE COLLECTION, POWER GRID COPS, AND FIRE AND AMBULANCE.

IT'S RIDICULOUS.

AND I WORE THIS BECAUSE I'M ON THE VETERANS COMMISSION FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS, AND I REPRESENT D SEVEN AND I REMEMBER THAT I REPRESENT THE CITIZENS AND THE VETERANS.

I DON'T REPRESENT BUSINESS INTERESTS.

AND I WANT Y'ALL TO REMEMBER THAT.

AND REMEMBER THE PERSON WHO APPOINTED Y'ALL.

BECAUSE WHEN THE NEXT THREE ELECTIONS COME UP, AS THE CITY COUNCIL COMES UP FOR ELECTION, WE ARE GOING TO REMEMBER HOW THIS COMMISSION VOTED ON EVERYTHING.

AND WE'RE GONNA REMEMBER YOUR APPOINTED, Y'ALL.

UH, THEY'RE SELLING FOR 900 ASIDE, SO I DON'T THINK THAT THERE'S GONNA BE AFFORDABLE HOUSING AT 900 ASIDE ON A DUPLEX.

IT'S GONNA INSPIRE US.

JENNIFER JUDKINS, 62 55.

RAVEN DALE LANE, DALLAS, TEXAS.

SO I LIVE OVER IN PERTH TERRACE.

UM, AND I GET THIS WHOLE DENSITY THING, BUT IT'S ALL, AND IT'S ALL ABOUT THE MATH FITTING MORE PEOPLE IN, BUT THE MATH DOESN'T WORK.

KARTH TERRACE, WE'VE RECENTLY HAD SOME NEW DUPLEXES GO IN.

[00:15:01]

UH, AS FAR AS A PLEX GOES, MY NEIGHBORHOOD, WE HAVE 60 FEET OF FRONTAGE.

ABOUT 18 OF THAT IS A DRIVEWAY, AT LEAST 42 FEET LEFT.

STANDARD PARKING SPACE, 18 FEET BY NINE.

SO YOU'RE GETTING TWO CARS THERE.

IF YOU'VE GOT A NINE PLEX, YOU'VE GOT TWO CARS PER PLACE.

WHERE ARE THE OTHER 16 CARS GONNA PARK? SO ASSUMING THEY'RE GONNA PARK ON BOTH SIDES, MY STREET IS 26 FEET WIDE.

I'VE GOT AN EIGHT FOOT CAR ON ONE SIDE, EIGHT FOOT CAR ON THE OTHER.

I'VE GOT 10 FEET LEFT.

SO ARE MY, IS MY STREET GONNA BECOME ONE WAY? HOW IS SANITATION GONNA PICK UP THE GARBAGE? ALREADY THEY HAVE TO BEEP TO GET PEOPLE TO MOVE THEIR CAR.

LOVEY HAWKINS, 1824 ALTADENA LANE, DISTRICT EIGHT.

MY MAJOR CONCERN IS SINCE THIS LAST SUMMER WHEN WE STARTED WORKING WITH FORWOOD DALLAS, WE WERE TOLD THEN AS WE WORKED WITH FORWARD DALLAS, THAT THE INPUT THAT THE COMMUNITY GAVE TO FORWARD DALLAS WOULD IMMEDIATELY BE GIVEN TO THE ZONING COMMISSION.

WHENEVER ANYBODY CAME UP FOR A PERMIT OR ANYTHING, THE ZONING COMMISSION WOULD BE AWARE OF WHAT THE COMMUNITY HAD SAID THROUGH FORWARD DALLAS.

I KNOW THAT FORWARD DALLAS IS MERELY A GUIDELINE, BUT IT IS OUR HOPE IN THE COMMUNITY AS WE ARE HAVING ALL OF THESE MEETING GIVEN OUR INPUT, THAT THE ZONING COMMISSIONERS WILL PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT THE COMMUNITY IS SAYING NOW, BECAUSE WE ARE TIRED OF EVERY TIME SOMETHING COMES UP.

THANK YOU, MA'AM.

WE'RE THE LAST TO FIND OUT THAT SOME COMPANY THANK YOU, MA'AM.

UM, ADAM LAMONT, UH, 9 4 3 2 AMBERTON PARKWAY.

UM, BEEN DOWN HERE BEFORE, UM, BE DOWN HERE AGAIN.

UM, YOU KNOW, IN ORDER TO TRY TO MAKE DALLAS A A BETTER AND MORE AFFORDABLE, UH, CITY.

SO IT, YOU KNOW, I WOULD SAY IT'S ALWAYS EASY TO SAY NO.

UM, IN THIS CASE, THE, THE CLEAR ANSWER WITH FOR DALLAS, UH, IS YES, UH, THERE ARE QUITE SOME LOUD VOICES IN THE ROOM FIGHTING BACK AGAINST ANY SORT OF CHANGES HAPPENING TO SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

UH, WHEN WE ACTUALLY DO SURVEYS OF DALLAS REV RESIDENTS, YOU KNOW, WHEN THERE WAS AN ACTUAL SURVEY DONE A FEW YEARS AGO, UH, THERE WAS CLEAR MAJORITY SUPPORT FOR THOSE THINGS.

SO I THINK THAT'S SUPER, SUPER IMPORTANT, IS NOT JUST TO LISTEN TO THE LOUDEST VOICES IN THE ROOM, BUT TO REALLY UNDERSTAND, UM, WHERE THE PEOPLE OF OF DALLAS ARE.

UM, YOU ALL KNOW THAT FOR DALLAS WOULDN'T ALLOW ANY OF THESE THINGS TO HAPPEN BY WRIGHT.

UM, IT'LL BE GREAT TO WORK OUT EXACTLY HOW WE WANT TO IMPLEMENT THESE CHANGES DOWN THE ROAD.

UM, YOU KNOW, WE CAN DO THINGS LIKE WHAT THEY DID IN ARLINGTON VIRGINIA, LIMIT THE NUMBER IN THE FIRST, UH, FEW YEARS, RIGHT? TO SEE WHERE THESE CHANGES ARE ARE HAPPENING, UM, AND, YOU KNOW, PUT SOME GEOGRAPHIC, UM, DESIGNATIONS ON IT TOO.

SO, THANK YOU, SIR.

UM, APPRECIATE YOU AND THANK YOU SO MUCH.

UH, MY NAME'S MATT BACH.

I LIVE AT 1 5 7 4 6 COVID CIRCLE, UH, OF COURSE DALLAS.

UM, I, I DO SUPPORT THE CONCEPT OF FORWARD DALLAS.

I, I THINK PLANNING IS ESSENTIAL.

UH, BUT THE CURRENT VERSION WOULD IRREPARABLY HARM DALLAS'S GREATEST ONE OF DALLAS'S GREATEST ASSETS, ITS NEIGHBORHOODS.

UM, I'M ASKING THAT YOU PLEASE REQUIRE FOR DALLAS TO BE AMENDED TO ELIMINATE THE LAND USES THAT ALLOW FOR NEW DUPLEXES, ADUS, OR ANY MULTIFAMILY APARTMENTS, COTTAGE COURTS, UH, AND PLEASE REINSTITUTE A PLACE TYPE SOLELY DEDICATED TO TRADITIONAL FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

UH, I'M ASKING HERE THAT YOU REALLY PROTECT THE EXISTING HOMEOWNERS WHO HAVE CHOSEN TO MAKE DALLAS THEIR HOME FOR 10, 20, 30 MORE YEARS AND MOVED HERE BECAUSE OF THE WONDERFUL NEIGHBORHOODS.

WHEN WE PURCHASED OUR HOMES, WE ASSUMED THE UNDERLYING ZONING AND CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD WOULD NOT CHANGE THE NOTION THAT INCREASED DENSITY WILL HELP AFFORDABILITY IS SIMPLY NOT TRUE.

AND STUDIES HAVE SHOWN THIS.

[00:20:01]

I'M STILL THE PROUDEST AND MOST UNAPOLOGETIC COUNCIL, DISTRICT 14 RESIDENT YOU'LL EVER MEET.

AND UNFORTUNATELY STILL A MILLENNIAL.

THE LACK OF ACTUAL REPRESENTATION BY SOME OF YOU IS THE SINGLE MOST DISRESPECTFUL EXERCISE OF PUBLIC PROCESS I'VE EVER SEEN IN MY LIFE.

I'M TIRED OF BEING TOLD WE'RE MISINFORMED.

THERE'S NOTHING MISINFORMING ABOUT SEEING MULTIPLEX AS PRIMARY USE IN OUR SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

OUR ASK HAS BEEN PAINFULLY SIMPLE THIS WHOLE TIME.

REMOVE MULTIPLEX FROM COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL SO WE DON'T HAVE TO KEEP COMING BACK TO FIGHT IT.

TRUST ME, WE WOULD RATHER BE FIGHTING FOR OUR STREETS, OUR SCHOOLS, OUR LIBRARIES, OUR PARKS.

BUT IF YOU KEEP THIS IN, WE WILL KEEP FIGHTING IT.

WE ABSOLUTELY WILL.

AND I WILL TELL YOU, IF MULTIPLEXES AREN'T REMOVED FROM COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, WE WILL ORGANIZE, WE WILL RAISE MONEY, WE WILL RUN OUR OWN COUNCIL CANDIDATES IN 25, AND WE WILL KEEP FIGHTING BACK.

MY NAME IS ROSEANNE MASSINO MILLS.

I LIVE AT 6 9 0 6 CAS LOMA AVENUE.

I'M A MEMBER OR A RESIDENT IN DISTRICT 14.

I HAVE SUBMITTED MY DETAILED COMMENTS TO ALL MEMBERS OF THE COMMISSION, AND I ASK THAT THOSE COMMENTS BE INCLUDED IN THE RECORD OF THIS PROCEEDING.

THEY ARE, THANK YOU.

I'M STRONGLY OPPOSED TO THE FOLLOWING.

FIRST, RETAINING MULTIPLEX IS A PRIMARY USE AND NOT REVISING IT AS A SECONDARY USE, RETAINING THE MULTIPLEX DEFINITION AS NINE TO FEWER UNITS AND NOT REVISING IT DOWN TO EIGHT OR FEWER.

UM, INCLUDING IN SHOEHORNING, THE UNDEFINED COTTAGE COURT AND THE UNDEFINED TINY HOUSE INTO THE SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED DEFINITION.

AND THERE IS MORE COMMENTARY IN MY, UH, NOTES THAT I HAVE SUBMITTED TO YOU.

SO TO CONTINUE, UM, AS OTHER SPEAKERS HAVE SAID, MULTIPLEX IS A PRIMARY USE UNSUPPORTABLE BY CITY SERVICES.

I FIND THAT, UM, THE COMMENTS THAT THOSE WHO ARE OPPOSED TO THE PLAN HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO ENTER INTO NSOS AND CONSERVATION DISTRICTS.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MA'AM.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US TODAY, PROFOUNDLY BACKWARD AND ELITIST.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

MORNING SIR.

MY NAME IS MICHAEL ANETTE.

I LIVE AT 2210 WEST 10TH, UM, DALLAS.

I WAS ON THE LANDMARK COMMISSION, THE DESIGNATION COMMITTEE.

I WAS THE PRESIDENT OF HERITAGE OF CLIFF, THE OLE CLIFF CONSERVATION LEAGUE.

I JUST WANNA SAY BRIEFLY THAT, UM, THIS IS NOT GONNA CURE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

UM, FORT WORTH.

THEY, THEY, 26% OF OF HOMES IN FORT WORTH ARE OWNED BY CORPORATIONS.

THERE ARE NO MORE FIX OR UPPERS FOR PEOPLE TO ACQUIRE.

UM, IT'S HOME VERSUS HOME BUYER VERSUS CORPORATION.

NOW THEY TEXT US CONSTANTLY PRETENDING THEY'RE OUR FRIENDS.

HEY, MIKE, WOULD YOU LIKE TO SELL? MY NAME IS NOT MIKE.

UM, THE, UH, FIRST TIME HOMEOWNERS HAVE LARGE STUDENT DEBT.

IF YOU MAKE THE LAND ABLE TO DO MORE, THE LAND IS GONNA BE WORTH MORE AND THE LAND IS GONNA BE TAXED MORE.

AND THOSE KIND OF TAXES FOR LAND VALUE ARE NOT ABLE TO BE APPEALED AT THE AT D AD.

UM, AND IF YOU'RE GONNA DO THIS, MAKE CONSERVATION DISTRICT AND SHORT DISTRICTS EASIER TO ACQUIRE, LOWER THE PERCENTAGES SO THAT MORE PEOPLE CAN PROTECT THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS, IF THAT'S GONNA BE THE ONLY WAY THAT THAT'S POSSIBLE.

AND, UM, ALL I HAVE TO SAY IS THAT ON SOCIAL MEDIA, PEOPLE ARE BEING DEMONIZED FOR BUYING A HOUSE 10, 20, 30 YEARS AGO THAT NOBODY WANTED FIXING IT UP, MAKING A NEIGHBORHOOD DESIRABLE, AND NOW YOU WANT TO GIVE IT TO DEVELOPERS.

AND I JUST REALLY THINK THAT'S WRONG.

THANKS FOR THE OPPORTUNITY.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.

MORNING COMMISSIONERS.

MY NAME IS BILLY LANE.

I RESIDE AT 28 31 WHITEWOOD IN DISTRICT THREE.

I'M A MEMBER OF THE DALLAS HOUSING COALITION AND WE FULLY SUPPORT THE COMMUNITY PLACE TYPE.

UH, I'M A HOMEOWNER.

THERE'S A VACANT LOT NEXT TO MY HOME.

I'M PROUD OF MY HOME.

I WOULD'VE NO PROBLEM WITH A DUPLEX QUADPLEX.

WHAT I AM TIRED OF IS WATCHING PEOPLE WHO LOOK LIKE ME DOWN LAYING ON SIDEWALKS FOR HOMES.

OUR CITY CANNOT CONTINUE LIKE THAT.

AND I THINK THE FORWARD DALLAS PLAN WILL HELP MOVE US FORWARD.

HI, CAROL BELL WALTON.

UH, WHILE I FULLY SUPPORT THE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE PORTION OF FORWARD DALLAS, I'M VERY CONCERNED THAT, UH, THE PLANNING DIDN'T ACTUALLY INVOLVE SCIENCE.

THAT, UH, IT WAS SEEMINGLY DONE IN PLANNING AND THEY DIDN'T GO TO TRANSPORTATION AND THAT THEY DIDN'T GO TO DWU.

SO THAT SCIENCE IS OUT THERE, AND I BEG OF YOU TO CONSIDER THE SCIENCE.

WHAT WOULD A 5% REDUCTION IN PERMEABLE LAND DUE TO OUR OVERTAXED STORM WATER SYSTEM IN EAST DALLAS? WE ALREADY CAN'T SUSTAIN THE STORM WATER WE GET.

OKAY, WHAT WOULD A 10% DO NOW WHEN WE CONSIDER THAT 25% OF OUR HOMES ARE OWNED, OWNED BY CORPORATIONS, WHAT WOULD A 25% REDUCTION OF PERMEABLE LAND LOOK LIKE IN EAST DALLAS? IT WOULD LOOK LIKE FLOODING.

DID YOU KNOW THE SPILLWAY IN WHITE ROCK LAKE IS ONLY AT 75% CAPACITY FOR WHAT IS RECOMMENDED

[00:25:01]

FOR FLOODING.

WE CAN'T SUSTAIN THE DENSITY.

THE OTHER THING IS TRAFFIC.

WHY DIDN'T THEY GO TO TRAFFIC? WE HAVE THOROUGHFARE THAT ARE LOCKED UP INTO EAST DALLAS BECAUSE OF THE LAKE.

ASK TRAFFIC IF WE INCREASE 10%.

WHAT IS THAT GONNA DO? THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

WHAT GRIDLOCK MORNING ARE WE GONNA CAUSE? THANK YOU.

I LIVE AT 61 45 PARKDALE DRIVE, DALLAS, TEXAS 7 5 2 2 7.

UH, I'M DISCOURAGED.

EVERYBODY KNOWS WHERE I STAND ON THIS.

I DON'T.

UM, I'M JUST DISCOURAGED TO LEARN HOW THIS BODY, UM, HAS NOT REALLY BEEN LISTENING TO THE RESIDENTS OF OUR SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

UM, I'M DISAPPOINTED THAT SOME OF OUR COUNCIL MEMBERS ARE ALSO WHO I OPENLY SUPPORTED AND, UM, AND ASSISTED WITH, UH, WITH LIFTING INTO OFFICE OR NOT LISTENING TO OUR RESIDENTS.

I WANT IT TO BE KNOWN.

I WILL SPEND EVERY AVAILABLE WORKING MOMENT OF MY LIFE FROM THIS POINT FORWARD WORKING TO DISMANTLE THIS UNBALANCED VISION THAT ONLY BENEFITS SPECIAL INTEREST AND NOT THE VOICES OF THE RESIDENTS OF THIS CITY WHO LIVE, WORK, PLAY, AND PAY TAXES HERE.

GOOD MORNING, MA'AM.

THE, I THINK THE MICROPHONE GOT TURNED OFF THERE.

THERE'S A LITTLE BUTTON THERE.

CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW? YES, MA'AM.

I CAN.

NO, YOU DON'T WANNA MISS THIS.

FORWARD.

DALLAS VIOLATES THE APPROVED 2033 DALLAS HOUSING PLAN, WHICH STATES INCREASED PRESERVATION TO IMPROVING HOUSING AFFORDABILITY FOR A BROAD MIXED USE OF MIXED INCOME IN ALL CITIES.

FORWARD.

DALLAS COMPLETELY IGNORES THIS AND MAKES, MAKES AFFORDABILITY WORSE AND BREAKS THE DALLAS POLICY FORWARD.

DALLAS PROMOTES DEMOLITION AND REDEVELOPMENT, ESPECIALLY IN OUR MOST AFFORDABLE NEIGHBORHOODS BECAUSE IT PROMOTES MULTIFAMILY ON SINGLE FAMILY LOTS.

COMPETITION FOR LOTS WILL SOAR, AND I'M ALREADY GOT FOUR APPLICATIONS IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD TO CHANGE SINGLE FAMILY TO DUPLEX, GENTRIFICATION, REDEVELOPMENT AND INCREASING THE TAX BURDEN, WHICH HAS HAPPENED WILL PUSH MORE AND MORE OWNERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES.

PLANNERS ADMITTED FORWARD DALLAS DOESN'T ADDRESS AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

NOW THEY MUST ADMIT IT ENCOURAGES BULLDOZING OUR MOST AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND IN NEIGHBORHOODS AND IN THANK YOU FOR NEIGHBORHOOD PROTECTIONS BY PLAN DEVELOPMENT.

UM, MY NAME IS ANGELA MEDRANO, 2331 DOUGLAS AVENUE IN THE OAK LAWN AREA.

UM, I'M HERE WITHOUT, YOU KNOW, COMMENTS WRITTEN DOWN BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO SAY ANYMORE.

UM, THE TRUST THAT Y'ALL ASK US FOR, YOU ASK FOR OUR TRUST, AND THEN YOU CONTINUALLY DON'T LISTEN TO WHAT PEOPLE SAY.

UM, YOU KNOW, MR. AGU PRESENTED ALL THESE THINGS THAT COULD BE CHANGED.

YOU KNOW, WE COULD TAKE THESE DOTS OUT AND THEN WE GET A NEW DRAFT WITH SO MANY CHANGES, AND THEN CODE REFORM IS COMING RIGHT? A YEAR AGO WHEN WE WERE HERE FIGHTING ST.

THAT THAT GOT PASSED THAT $2 MILLION TO REWRITE THE CODE.

SO THAT'S GONNA COME LIKE RIGHT AFTER THIS, RIGHT? SO EVERYTHING YOU DO ON HERE, Y'ALL ARE GONNA HAVE THE CODE REWRITTEN, REWRITTEN TO SUPPORT EXACTLY WHAT THE DEVELOPERS WANT AND THE GREED AND THE PEOPLE THAT AREN'T HERE.

THANK YOU, MA'AM.

PY AND FLORAL FARMS. UM, OUR COALITION WORKED VERY CLOSELY WITH THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT TO GET THOSE WINS IN THIS PLAN.

MY NAME IS CHRISTINE HOPKINS.

I LIVE AT 1 1 1 8 ELMWOOD BOULEVARD.

AND MY OPINIONS ON FORWARD DALLAS COME FROM AN EQUITY LENS.

THERE'S ONE THING THAT FORWARD DALLAS HAS GOTTEN ABSOLUTELY CORRECT, WHICH IS REMOVING INDUSTRIAL USES AND THE INDUSTRIAL RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCIES IN WEST DALLAS

[00:30:01]

AND SO WE WANNA SEE THE PLAN MOVE FORWARD.

BUT I DO THINK THERE'S ONE THING THAT THE PLAN IS GETTING WRONG FROM AN EQUITY STANDPOINT, WHICH IS PUTTING EXPENSIVE UGLY MULTIPLEXES IN SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS THAT CURRENTLY HAVE PROPERTIES VALUED BETWEEN A HUNDRED GRAND OR THREE TO 300 GRAND.

THERE ARE STILL THOSE AFFORDABLE WORKING CLASS NEIGHBORHOODS OUT THERE.

AND THIS, THESE ARE PICTURES FROM OAK CLIFF WHERE I LIVE.

YOU HAVE A NINE PLEX HERE THAT IS RIGHT NEXT TO A SINGLE FAMILY HOME TOWERING OVER IT.

THAT HOUSE USED TO HAVE A DEC HEAD VALUE IN THE HUNDRED GRANDS.

NOW IT'S GOING UP TO OVER 300 GRAND AND IT'S A $1.66 MILLION PROPERTY NEXT DOOR.

WE HAVE ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF THAT HERE, WHERE A PROPERTY USED TO BE IN THE $200,000 RANGE.

IT INFLUENCES ZONING DECISIONS.

MORNING, DOLORES SOROKA, 48 22 SWISS FORWARD.

DALLAS IS OVERWHELMINGLY OPPOSED BECAUSE IT VIOLATES DALLAS HOUSING POLICY.

THIS NEW VERSION OF FORWARD DALLAS LACKS COMMUNITY INPUT.

IT IGNORES OUR AGING INFRASTRUCTURE.

IT CANNOT IMPOSE CONTEXT SENSITIVITY BY TEXAS LAW AND IT DOESN'T PROTECT SINGLE FAMILY OR ZONE DISTRICTS.

FORWARD DALLAS PROMOTES LUXURY HOUSING AND NEW, AND NOW OFFERS BRAND NEW CONCEPTS OF COTTAGE COURT AND TINY HOMES, WHICH WERE NEVER DISCUSSED.

AND NO ONE REQUESTED FORWARD DALLAS ALSO ENCOURAGES BULLDOZING EXISTING HOMES, WHICH IS OUR MOST AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

VIOLATING DALLAS HOUSING.

HOUSING POLICY IS DELIBERATELY PUTTING AFFORDABILITY AND HOMEOWNER PROTECTION ON A BACK BURNER, I GUESS TO DIE THERE.

CPC, YOU MUST FIX THIS DRAFT TO INCLUDE WHAT WE AND THE YIMBYS DEMAND QUALITY, AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND PROTECTION FOR SINGLE FAMILY DISTRICTS.

DO NOT VOTE TO KICK AFFORDABILITY ISSUES DOWN THE ROAD IN ORDER TO PROMOTE DEREGULATION AND BIG BUSINESS.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH AT THE SACRIFICE OF EXISTING HOMEOWNERS.

VENET SCHMIDT 7 1 5 PARK.

THANK YOU FOR HOLDING THIS PUBLIC HEARING.

WE'RE ALL TRYING TO DIGEST THIS NEW DOCUMENT.

UH, FORWARD DALLAS STATES THAT THE URBAN DALLAS URBAN HEAT INDEX IS THE SECOND HIGHEST IN THE NATION.

CURIOUSLY, THE MAPS IN FORWARD DALLAS SHOW THAT THE LOWEST HEAT INDEXES ARE IN SINGLE FAMILY DISTRICTS.

THE FORMER DALLAS LAND AND LOAN, NOW KNOWN AS THE BISHOP ARTS DISTRICT, USED TO BE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

THAT AREA HAS BEEN UP ZONED AND THE OLD HOUSING STOCK IS BEING REPLACED WITH GREATER DENSITY APARTMENTS AND CONDOS.

GREATER DENSITY IS NOT CONTRIBUTING TO GREATER AFFORDABILITY.

IN ADDITION, THAT AREA NOW HAS ONE OF THE GREATEST HEAT INDEXES IN THE CITY OF DALLAS.

WE'VE GOT TO GET THIS RIGHT.

WE CAN HEAR GAGGLES OF REQUESTS FROM INAPPROPRIATE DEVELOPMENTS BECAUSE QUOTE FORWARD DALLAS STATES, THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN SERVES MAINLY AS A GUIDE FOR ZONING REQUESTS FORWARD.

DALLAS DEFINES COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL AS LARGELY SINGLE FAMILY.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US, SIR.

MY NAME IS PAM YODER AND I AM AT 76 21 EL SIDOR DRIVE IN DISTRICT 11.

I'M REPRESENTING NOT ONLY MYSELF, BUT MY MOTHER WHO ALSO LIVES IN THAT SAME NEIGHBORHOOD, BUT SHE IS IN DISTRICT 12.

UM, I'M JUST HERE TO SAY I BOUGHT MY HOUSE 25 YEARS AGO BECAUSE IT HAD BEAUTIFUL TREES AND IT WAS A BEAUTIFUL NEIGHBORHOOD AND I LOVE WHERE I LIVE AND I DON'T WANT THAT TO CHANGE.

YELLOW CARDS SO WE CAN HAVE A RECORD OF YOUR VISIT WITH US.

ANY OTHER SPEAKERS? COMMISSIONER, UH, FOLKS? OKAY.

COMMISSION QUESTIONS FOR ANY OF OUR SPEAKERS? OH, WE DO HAVE SOME FOLKS ONLINE.

PARDON ME? COMMISSIONER? UM, I DON'T HAVE THE LIST.

GEORGE, WHO'S FIRST ON OUR LIST, SIR? NO, SIR.

THANK YOU, MS. PINA.

FOLKS, IF YOU, AT SOME POINT TODAY, IF YOU COULD JUST COME DOWN AND FILL OUT ONE OF THOSE LITTLE

[00:35:01]

MR. SROS, GOOD MORNING.

PLEASE MAKE SURE YOU HAVE YOUR CAMERA ON AND WORKING.

MY NAME IS JAN CISNEROS.

I LIVE AT 28 21 BEDFORD STREET IN WEST.

MRS. ROS, MAKE SURE YOU, YOU TOGGLE YOUR MIC ON.

WE CAN'T HEAR YOU.

CAN YOU HEAR ME? YES, WE CAN NOW.

MORNING.

MY NAME IS JANIE CISNEROS.

I LIVE AT 28 21 BECKFORD STREET IN WEST DALLAS.

I'M IN SUPPORT OF FORWARD DALLAS.

I WANNA THANK PUD FOR LISTENING TO US AND TAKING SERIOUSLY THE INSIGHT FROM RESIDENTS WHO LIVE IN EJ COMMUNITIES.

I AM GRATEFUL THAT THIS NEW DRAFT PROMINENTLY CALLS OUT THE REDUCTION OF INDUSTRIAL PROXIMITY TO RESIDENTIAL HOMES AS A GOAL TO MEET THAT GOAL.

RESIDENTS IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD OF THE SINGLETON CORRIDOR IN WEST DALLAS PROPOSE A FLEX COMMERCIAL PLACE TYPE BUFFER ALONG THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE TRAIN TRACKS.

THE REASON BEING THAT IT'S INAPPROPRIATE TO HAVE A LOGISTICS INDUSTRIAL PARK PLACE TYPE IMMEDIATELY ADJACENT TO A PRIMARILY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE LIKE COMMUNITY, MIXED USE AS A REFERENCE, THERE ARE HOMES LOCATED LESS THAN 200 FEET FROM INDUSTRY IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD.

WE ALSO WANNA FLAG THAT COMMUNITY MIXED USE LISTS LIKE INDUSTRIAL AS A POTENTIAL LAND USE.

WE'RE CONCERNED ABOUT THIS IF THE MAJORITY OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD IS TO BE DESIGNATED COMMUNITY MIXED USE.

WE'D RATHER NOT HAVE ANY INDUSTRIAL RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCY ISSUES NOW OR IN THE FUTURE.

UM, AGAIN, THANK YOU FOR TO EVERYONE WHO'S WORKED ON WARD DALLAS, UH, FOR MA AND FOR MAKING EJ A PRIORITY IN THIS PROCESS.

THE PLAN SHOWS THAT WE'RE MOVING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION FOR MORE DIVERSE HOUSING OPTIONS AND GETTING CLOSER TO DALLAS BECOMING A SAFER, MORE WALKABLE CITY.

COMMISSIONER, YOU'RE MIKE.

I THINK WE HAVE ONE OTHER SPEAKER ON LINE.

MS. CHAMPION, YOU HAVE A COUPLE OF MINUTES OKAY.

COMMISSIONER'S QUESTIONS FOR ANY OF OUR SPEAKERS? COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT, PLEASE, SIR.

MS. HAWKINS, YOU HAD STATED THAT YOU LIVE IN OAK CLIFF AND THAT, UH, YOU GAVE AN EXAMPLE OF AN, UH, SINGLE FAMILY HOME THAT IS, UH, NEXT TO A NINE PLEX.

AND YOU, AND YOU STATED THAT THE, UH, PROPERTY TAXES ON OR THE VALUE OF THAT HOME, SINGLE FAMILY HOME WENT UP FROM 100,000 TO 300,000.

IS THAT CORRECT? UH, YOU, YOU WERE ABOUT TO GIVE AN EXAMPLE OF, OF A SECOND HOME, BUT THE TIME CONSTRAINT, UH, DIDN'T ALLOW YOU TO DO SO.

AND I'D LIKE TO ASK YOU TO GIVE THAT SECOND EXAMPLE.

PLEASE.

WILL YOU, YOU MICROPHONE THE MICROPHONE? I, I DON'T KNOW HOW TO GET THE SLIDE BACK UP ON YOUR SCREEN, BUT IT WAS A HOME THAT HAD BEEN HISTORICALLY IN THE 200 TO $300,000 RANGE.

AND THEY BUILT, UH, LUXURY CONDOS NEXT TO IT.

AND THERE ARE I THINK 10 UNITS THAT ARE 600.

THEY WENT FOR 665,000 EACH.

SO IT'S LIKE A 3 MILLION PLUS PROPERTY THAT'S NEXT DOOR.

NOW THIS HOUSE IS OVER 880,000 IN 2023.

I LOOKED UP 2024 AND IT'S OVER 1 MILLION VALUED.

SO THINGS LIKE THAT ARE GONNA PRICE PEOPLE OUT OF THEIR HOMES 'CAUSE THEY CAN'T AFFORD THE PROPERTY TAXES.

AND I'M REALLY SCARED OF THAT IF IT'S OPENED UP TO ANYTHING BEYOND 80 OR DUPLEXES.

I HAD A QUESTION FOR ADAM LAMONT TOO, PLEASE.

I, I THINK HE IS.

ADAM, HE STEPPED OUT.

LAMONT STILL HERE? YEAH.

HE, HE, HE, UH, HE STATED THAT THE, UH, THE MAJORITY OF THE CITIZENS IN THE CITY OF DALLAS SUPPORT A PROPOSITION, BUT I WASN'T CLEAR ABOUT THE PROPOSITION THAT THEY SUPPORT, BUT WOULD, WOULD YOU LIKE HIM TO TAKE YOUR QUESTION, COMMISSIONER? YEAH, I MEAN, IF, IF YOU, IF YOU COULD ANSWER IT FOR ALAN ADAM, THAT'S BE, THAT'D BE GREAT.

I'D LIKE TO HEAR THAT AND I'D LIKE TO, UH, KNOW WHAT WAS THE BASIS FOR THAT.

I BELIEVE HE WAS REFERRING TO THE COMMUNITY RESIDENT INPUT SURVEYS THAT THE CITY OF DALLAS HAS PUT OUT IN RECENT YEARS.

UH, WE CAN FIND THOSE LINKS AND SEND THEM TO YOU ABOUT, UH, PEOPLE IN DALLAS ACTUALLY HAVING A PREFERENCE FOR A DIVERSE OPTION OF HOUSING TYPES.

SO THAT WAS WHAT HE WAS SAYING, THE MAJORITY SUPPORTS.

THANKS FOR YOUR CLARIFICATION.

COMMISSIONER COMMISSIONERS, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR OUR SPEAKERS?

[00:40:03]

I HAVE ONE OTHER QUESTION.

MS. ROBERTS? YEAH, MS. ROBERTS.

UM, FORGIVE ME, I, THE LADY WHO, UH, STATED THAT SHE LIVES ON A NEIGHBORHOOD WHERE, UH, THERE HAVE BEEN FOUR RECENT APPLICATIONS FOR DUPLEX HOMES.

I AM SORRY YOU'RE HAVING TO COME ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THESE STAIRS.

AGAIN, FORGIVE ME, IT'S .

THANK YOU KAREN FOR, FOR COMING ALL THE WAY DOWN AGAIN.

SURE.

UH, SO YOU, YOU INDICATE THAT IN YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD THERE HAVE BEEN FOUR RECENT APPLICATIONS WHERE, UH, THE DEVELOPER WANTS TO REZONE, UH, HOME LOTS THAT ARE, ARE IN OUR ZONE COMMUNITY TO, UH, DUPLEX.

IS THAT CORRECT? WELL, MY NEIGHBORHOOD IS ZONED WITH A PLAN DEVELOPMENT, WHICH IS NOT PROTECTED.

BY THIS PLAN BY BEFORE DALLAS.

AND I KNOW ON FRIDAY I GOT NOTICES FROM, I GET THE CITY NOTICES THERE ARE, THERE IS ONE DEVEL, ONE PERSON THAT HAS THREE RESIDENT THREE HOUSES ON ONE STREET THAT HE WANTS TO TURN INTO DUPLEXES.

AND WHAT'S HAPPENING IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD IS THAT WITH THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT, EACH LOT IS ZONED AS IT WAS AT THE TIME THAT WE PASSED THE PD IN 1981.

A HUNDRED PERCENT BY ALL COUNCIL AND PLAN COMMISSION.

THE BASE, THE BASE ZONING OF THE PD IS RESIDENTIAL.

AND THE, AND, AND WHAT, AND YOU CAN, IF YOU HAVE A, IF YOUR HOUSE, IF YOUR PROPERTY IS A DUPLEX, YOU CAN REBUILD IT.

BUT IF IT'S SINGLE FAMILY, IT HAS TO COME BACK, SINGLE FAMILY.

AND WHAT WE'RE HAVING IS OUR LITTLE HAS SHE REFERENCED OUR LITTLE $200,000 NOW HOUSES WHO'D HAVE THOUGHT ARE BEING TORN DOWN AND TURNED INTO OVER A MILLION DOLLAR DUPLEXES.

AND OBVIOUSLY THAT'S WHAT THIS GUY WANTS TO DO.

I HAVEN'T MET WITH HIM YET AND THIS IS WHERE OUR AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS GOING.

THANK YOU FOR EXPANDING ON THAT.

THANK I APPRECIATE THAT, KAREN.

UM, WHAT ARE THE SIZE LOTS THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT? R SEVEN FIVE.

R SEVEN FIVE? YES SIR.

A MINIMUM OF 7,500 SQUARE FEET.

DID, ARE THEY MUCH BIGGER THAN THAT? UH, NO.

THE, THE LOTS ARE R SEVEN FIVE THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITY.

THROUGH, THROUGHOUT.

I MEAN, THERE ARE A FEW EXCEPTIONS.

THERE ARE A COUPLE OF LITTLE APARTMENTS, ET CETERA.

THERE'S SOME COMMERCIAL PROPERTY, BUT THE LOTS ARE R 75.

AND I DID NOTICE ON THE APPLICATION THAT I READ THAT, THAT DID SAY R 75.

THANK, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US COMMISSIONERS.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR ANY OF OUR SPEAKERS? IS IT TO LIKE, TO MAKE A PUBLIC COMMENT? I'M SORRY, MA'AM.

WE, WE MOVED ON.

THANK YOU SO MUCH COMMISSIONERS.

I JUST WANNA ACKNOWLEDGE ANYONE WHO DID NOT SPEAK IS WELCOME TO SEND WRITTEN COMMENTS AND TO ALL OF US AT ANY TIME AND WE DO RECEIVE THOSE.

THANK YOU MR. CHAIR.

AND WE DO READ THEM SLOWLY, BUT WE DO IT HUNDREDS OF EMAILS.

COMMISSIONERS.

UH, IF ARE NO QUESTIONS FOR ANY OF OUR SPEAKERS, LET'S TAKE A BREAK HERE.

UH, LET'S BE BACK AT, UH, 10 15.

SO WITH THAT, AND I'M THEN I DO HAVE SOME BRIEF COMMENTS IF I HAVE A SECOND.

OKAY, COMMISSIONER, SO WE ARE BACK ON THE RECORD.

UH, GEORGE.

OH, THERE IS COMMISSIONER LER.

WE'RE SET.

WE'RE RECORDING.

AWESOME.

IT IS 10:26 AM MY APOLOGIES FOR THE DELAY.

UH, WE ARE BACK ON THE RECORD.

COMMISSIONERS,

[2. 24-2034 Consideration of the ForwardDallas 2.0 Comprehensive Plan CPC Draft Plan #4]

VICE CHAIR RUBIN? YES.

UM, THANK YOU MR. CHAIR.

I HAVE A MOTION AND MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT IN ORDER TO, UM, START CONSIDERATION OF THE DOCUMENT AND TO START AMENDING IT AS A CITY PLAN COMMISSION, THAT WE FIRST NEED TO MAKE A GENERAL MOTION ON FORWARD DALLAS, UM, 2.0 DRAFT NUMBER FOUR, AT WHICH POINT WE WILL BE ABLE TO START AS A BODY, UM, INTRODUCING AMENDMENTS TO THE DOCUMENT.

[00:45:01]

UM, SO IN THE MATTER OF OUR, UM, FORWARD DALLAS COMPREHENSIVE LAND USE PLAN UPDATE, UM, FOR ALSO KNOWN AS FORWARD DALLAS 2.0, I MOVE THAT WE, UM, RECOMMEND THE DOCUMENT TO CITY COUNCIL FOR CONSIDERATION.

A SECOND.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER HARBERT FOR YOUR SECOND COMMENTS.

GREAT.

AND MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT WE WILL NOT TAKE A FINAL VOTE ON THIS TODAY, BUT WE JUST NEED THIS, THIS, SO WE CAN START AMENDING IT.

AND CONSIDERING THE DOCUMENT, I I THOUGHT WE'D HAVE LOTS OF QUESTIONS.

LET'S GO AHEAD AND TAKE THOSE.

SETH SAW COMMISSIONER HANIN FIRST.

WELL, I THINK I, COULD YOU RESTATE THE MOTION BECAUSE I THINK AS IT'S PHRASED, IT'S AS IF WE ARE MOVING THIS FORWARD.

NOT THAT WE'RE, I UNDERSTAND THAT'S NOT THE INTENT, BUT THE LANGUAGE AS I HEARD IT, AS WE'RE RECOMMENDING THIS DOCUMENT TO MOVE FORWARD TO CITY COUNCIL.

NOT THAT OPENING THE DISCUSSION FOR CONSIDERATION OF A FUTURE RECOMMENDATION.

AND PERHAPS MR. MOORE MIGHT WEIGH IN ON THE APP APPROPRIATE FORM, PLEASE.

THAT, YES.

SO COMMISSIONER, WE NEED A MOTION ON THE FLOOR IN ORDER FOR THE BODY TO DEBATE IT.

SO IT COULD BE THE, IT COULD TAKE THE FORM OF A MOTION TO APPROVE OR A MOTION TO DENY.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE INTENT IS TO CONSIDER AMENDMENTS TODAY AND THEN TO HOLD TO A DATE CERTAIN, IN ORDER TO CONSIDER AMENDMENTS, WE WOULD HAVE TO HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE ON THE FLOOR AND THEN AMENDMENTS TO THAT MOTION TO THE UNDERLYING DOCUMENT.

AND THEN A MOTION TO HOLD COULD BE MADE BECAUSE THAT TAKES PRECEDENCE OVER THE MAIN MOTION.

AND A MO ANY AMENDMENTS THAT MOTION IF APPROVED, WOULD, UH, HOLD THAT, HOLD THE DOCUMENT OR HOLD FORWARD DOUBT INTO THAT DAY CERTAIN.

SO, MR. MOORE, A, A, A MOTION, THE MOTION THAT WAS ALREADY READ INTO THE RECORD, UH, DOES NOT PREVENT OTHER CHANGES FROM HAPPENING WHEN WE TAKE THIS BACK UP, UH, AT A HEARING IN JULY.

CORRECT.

IT WOULD JUST BE AN AMENDMENT TO THE MAIN MOTION AS MADE BY VICE CHAIR RUBIN.

UH, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, DID YOU HAVE A FOLLOW UP? COULD YOU RESTATE THE MOTION? YES.

AND I'LL ALSO SPEAK TO MY INTENT AND I UNDERSTAND THAT I NEED TO MAKE, MAKE THIS MOTION IN, IN THIS WAY IN ORDER FOR THE BODY TO START ACTUALLY AMENDING THE LANGUAGE OF THE DOCUMENT.

SO MY MOTION IS, UM, IN THE MATTER OF THE FORWARD DALLAS COMPREHENSIVE PLAN VERSION 2.0 TO RECOMMEND THE DOCUMENT, UM, FOR CONSIDERATION TO COUNSEL.

AND I CAN ADD IN SUBJECT TO ANY CHANGES MADE BY THE BODY AT THIS HEARING OR A FUTURE PUBLIC HEARING ON THE DOCUMENT.

UH, IS IT, WOULD WE NEED A, A MOTION THEN AFTER WE'RE, WE'RE FINISH DIS FINISHED DISCUSSION, THE, UH, THE CHANGES TO THE DOCUMENT.

SO WITH THE AMENDED MOTION AND MR. MOORE, HELP ME IF I'M INCORRECT.

SO WITH THE AMENDED MOTION, IT, IT SHOWS THE INTENT FOR US TO PROVIDE SOME FORM OF FORWARD DALLAS TO BE SENT ON TO CITY COUNCIL AT A DATE LEFT OPEN AFTER WE ARE O OPENING THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THIS BODY TO GO THROUGH IT AND MAKE CHANGES AS WE AND SEE THE COMMUNITY HAS ASKED US TO MAKE.

IS THAT CORRECT, COMMISSIONER BLAIR? IN ORDER TO HAVE DEBATE ON FORWARD DALLAS, WE NEED A MOTION.

THERE WAS A MOTION TO APPROVE.

AND NOW ANY, THE FLOOR IS OPEN TO MAKE AMENDMENTS.

AND WE HAVE A SECOND.

UH, YEAH, UH, RIGHT, OF COURSE.

ASSUMING YOU HAVE A SECOND, SO NOW WE CAN DISCUSS, WE CAN DISCUSS FORWARD DALLAS AS IT AS IT IS TODAY, CORRECT? CORRECT.

AND WE CAN AMEND IT AS NEEDED AS OF TODAY, CORRECT? CORRECT.

AND THEN IN THE FUTURE, WE WILL GET PROBABLY VERSION FIVE OR SIX BEFORE WE SEND IT ON TO CITY COUNCIL FOR APPROVAL AFTER WE DEBATE IT AND CHANGE IT.

IS THAT WHAT THE MOTION IS ACTUALLY ASKING US TO DO? I, I WILL DEFER TO STAFF IF THEY WILL, UM, MAKE THE EDIT TO THE DOCUMENT BASED ON THE AMENDMENTS THAT ARE ADOPTED TODAY.

BUT YOU WILL BE ABLE TO AMEND IT TODAY AND AT A LATER DATE IF IT IS HELD.

I UNDERSTAND.

AND I APPRECIATE THE MOTION.

ONE QUICK QUESTION FOR YOU, MR. MOORE.

[00:50:01]

DO WE THEN NEED A MOTION TO HOLD THE DOCUMENT? YES, SIR.

SO WE CAN COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, IF WE VOTE TO APPROVE, THEN WE'RE DONE.

I I DON'T, I MEAN, SOMEBODY WOULD HAVE TO MAKE A MOTION TO AMEND HIS MOTION.

AND, AND I HAVE A SECOND QUESTION.

IF SOMEONE VOTES TO START APPROVING AMENDMENTS, CAN THAT PERSON LATER ULTIMATELY VOTE AGAINST THE ENTIRE PLAN BEING FORWARDED TO CITY COUNCIL? YES.

COMMISSIONER TO THE SECOND QUESTION.

IF YOU CAN VOTE, MAKE AMENDMENTS AND VOTE NO ON THE FINAL, UH, WHEN IT COMES UP FOR THE FINAL VOTE.

FOR THE FIRST QUESTION, YOU ARE CORRECT.

IF THE BODY WERE TO ADOPT THE AMENDMENT AS CURRENTLY MADE, IT WOULD BE OVER.

BUT I THINK AS VICE CHAIR RUBIN AND THE CHAIR SUGGESTED, THE INTENT IS TO CONSIDER AMENDMENTS TODAY AND ULTIMATELY HOLD THE MATTER.

THE INTENT IS NOT TO SEND THE DOCUMENT TO COUNSEL TODAY.

THE INTENT IS TO, TO MAKE THE AMENDMENTS, UH, MANY OF WHICH WE HAVE HEARD FROM, FROM FOLKS, UH, FOR THE LAST TWO YEARS.

UH, AND THEN HAVE JULY HAVE THE TIME TO GO THROUGH THE DOCUMENT AGAIN AND COME BACK IN JULY AND HOPEFULLY TAKE A GLOBAL VOTE, UM, TO PASS THIS ON TO COUNCIL.

BUT WE NEED A MOTION ON THE FLOOR IN ORDER A MOTION TO BEGIN THAT PROCESS.

COMMISSIONER FORAY, DO WE HAVE TO VOTE ON THIS MOTION THEN? YES, WE DO.

WE'RE WE'RE IN, WE'RE DISCUSSING IT NOW.

'CAUSE IT, IT IS A LITTLE BIT COUNTERINTUITIVE.

UH, IT WAS TO ME , NO.

IF A VOTE ON THE, WE DO NOT NEED TO VOTE ON THIS MOTION TODAY.

IT SIMPLY HAS TO BE MADE SO WE CAN START DISCUSSION AND AMENDMENT OF THE DOCUMENTS AND THEN SOMEONE CAN MOVE LATER IN THE DAY TO HOLD IT, WHICH I ANTICIPATE ONE OF US, IF NOT MYSELF, WILL MAKE THAT MOTION, WHICH I FULLY INTEND TO SUPPORT.

AND THEN WE WILL PICK IT UP AGAIN.

MOST LIKELY AT OUR MEETING IN JULY WHEN WE, AFTER WE HOLD IT, COMMISSIONER HALL.

I, I UNDERSTAND THIS IS A PAR PARLIAMENTARY LEGAL PROCEDURE THAT WE'RE ABOUT TO DO, BUT OVER THE PAST FEW MONTHS WE HAVE TWEAKED THIS DOCUMENT.

SO WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE NOW VERSUS WHAT WE'VE BEEN DOING FOR THE PAST FEW CONSIDERATE, UH, SESSIONS? WE'VE GIVEN GENERAL SUGGESTIONS TO STAFF ON WAYS TO TWEAK IT.

THIS IS GOING TO BE ACTUAL MODIFICATIONS TO THE DOCUMENT THAT ARE BEING MADE BY A MOTION BY COMMISSIONERS ON THIS BODY TO, FOR EXAMPLE, REPLACE CERTAIN LANGUAGE WITH OTHER LANGUAGE STRIKE PROVISIONS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

SO WE GIVEN IN GENERAL DIRECTIONS ON STAFF AND WE'VE GOTTEN STAFF DRAFTS BEFORE, BUT WITH THIS MOTION, THAT DOCUMENT IS NOW FULLY IN THE BODY'S HANDS TO MODIFY AND ADJUST.

SO AT THIS, IF THIS, THIS IS GONNA GO THROUGH THAT MEANS, UH, WE WOULD ACTUALLY BE MAKING CHANGES TO THE EXISTING DOCUMENT OR VOTING ON RECOMMENDED CHANGES TO THE EXISTING DOCUMENT.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER.

WE, SORRY, LATE THIS IS, I HAD TO OPEN UP MY BUSINESS FOR, UM, WHAT IS THE MOTION? OR COULDN'T IT BE EMAILED TO ME IF IT'S ALREADY OR ANYTHING? YEAH, THE MOTION IS SIMPLY FOR THE PURPOSE OF STARTING DEBATE AND ALLOWING US TO MAKE AMENDMENTS TO FORWARD DALLAS IS TO RECOMMEND THE DOCUMENT TO BE SENT TO COUNSEL AFTER WE DO THE UPDATE SUBJECT TO ANY AMENDMENTS THAT WE MAKE TODAY OR AT A FUTURE MEETING.

OF JUST FUNDAMENTAL ISSUES THAT NEED TO BE ADDRESSED THROUGH THIS.

AND DO WE HAVE ANY OF THOSE OR JUST THE ONES THAT WE THROW OUT TODAY? I THINK ANY MEMBER OF THE BODY IS FREE TO INTRODUCE AMENDMENTS TO THE DOCUMENT IS MY UNDERSTANDING.

UM, AND WE, WE WOULD THOUGH, LIKE TO FOCUS ON THE THINGS THAT WE, WE SPOKE ABOUT THE LAST TIME, WHICH WERE THE CONSENSUS ITEMS THAT INCLUDES THE PLACE TYPES AND THE, YOU KNOW, THE SEVEN OTHER THINGS THAT WERE ON THE POWERPOINT.

UH, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, I'M SORRY, I, I'M CONFUSED.

IT WAS, WE, WE'VE BEEN GIVEN A, YOU KNOW, A, A PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL REVISION OF FORWARD DALLAS THAT MOST OF US HAVE NOT HAD IN OUR HANDS FOR, FOR TWO WEEKS.

AND, UM, AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, THERE ARE STILL A LOT

[00:55:01]

I DON'T THINK LIMITING DISCUSSION TO JUST, UH, I I JUST DON'T THINK, I MEAN, PERSONALLY MY PREFERENCE, I'M NOT GONNA BE SUPPORTING THE MOTION.

MY, MY PERSONAL PREFERENCE WOULD BE THAT WE CONTINUE THE SORT OF INPUT THAT WE HAVE BEEN GIVING, BEEN GIVEN, BEEN GIVING, I'M SORRY, THE LAST FEW, UM, MEETINGS.

UH, 'CAUSE I KNOW I'M CERTAINLY NOT, I DID NOT COME HERE PREPARED TODAY TO GIVE SPECIFIC TEXTUAL CHANGES ON THE VERY LARGE NUMBER OF, YOU KNOW, ISSUES THAT I HAVE WITH THIS.

SO.

BUT JUST, JUST TO BE CLEAR, WE'RE WE'RE NOT LIMITING IT TO THAT.

IT'S JUST THESE ARE THE ITEMS THAT WE HAVE DISCUSSED THAT WE DISCUSSED AT OUR LAST HEARING THAT WERE EMAILED OUT.

UH, WE'RE NOT LIMITING TO THAT, BUT THOSE ARE, THOSE ARE THE MAIN POINTS, UH, THAT I THINK WE HAD NOT GAINED CONSENSUS ON.

AND WHICH IN FACT WE DID, I THINK IN FIVE OF THE EIGHT OR SIX OF THE EIGHT WE HAD CONSENSUS AS A BODY.

UH, OPEN TO DISCUSSION COMES FIRST.

NICE CHAIR RUBIN.

OF THESE SOLUTIONS IS GOING TO BE SUFFICIENT ON ITS OWN, AND IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE DON'T PUT ALL OF OUR EGGS IN ONE BASKET.

UM, I'M REALLY EXCITED TO, UM, START THIS PROCESS OF, OF GETTING FORWARD DALLAS INTO GOOD SHAPE TO SEND ON CITY COUNCIL, WHICH WON'T BE FINALIZED TODAY, BUT I THINK WE CAN DO SOME REALLY GOOD WORK.

UM, I HAD THE HONOR OF CHAIRING THE COMPREHENSIVE LAND USE PLAN COMMITTEE AND I AM REALLY HAPPY THAT OUR FORWARD DALLAS UPDATE IS FINALLY BEFORE THIS BODY, UM, FOR CONSIDERATION AND A VOTE TO BE FORTHCOMING TO PASS THIS ON TO CITY COUNCIL.

THIS HAS BEEN A PROCESS THAT'S GONE ON FOR ROUGHLY TWO AND A HALF YEARS, AND THROUGH LOTS OF HARD WORK, EXTENSIVE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT AND SOME VERY HEALTHY AND MUCH NEEDED DIALOGUE WITH SOME VERY MEANINGFUL CHANGES THAT I BELIEVE THAT THE BODY WILL MAKE EITHER TODAY OR AT A FUTURE MEETING, WE'VE ARRIVED AT A GREAT COMPREHENSIVE PLAN THAT WILL SERVE THE CITY WELL IN ITS FUTURE PLANNING AND ZONING EFFORTS.

UM, THIS WAS THE PRODUCT OF EXTENSIVE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT, 31 CLUB MEETINGS, UM, NINE CPC MEETINGS THUS FAR ADDRESSING THE COMP PLAN OVER 200 IN-PERSON EVENTS AND 70 VIRTUAL EVENTS.

UH, MORE EMAILS, ANY OF US CAN COUNT, AND SOME REALLY INNOVATIVE ONLINE ENGAGEMENT BY CITY STAFF.

UM, MANY OF YOU KNOW THAT I'VE SPENT COUNTLESS HOURS TALKING ABOUT FORWARD DALLAS AND I COULD SPEND HOURS, UM, TODAY GOING ON ABOUT IT.

BUT TODAY I JUST WANNA FOCUS ON A COUPLE OF ISSUES IN FOR DALLAS THAT WERE THE MOST DIFFICULT AND ARGUABLY THE MOST IMPORTANT SECTIONS OF THIS DOCUMENT.

SO THE FIRST, THE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE THEME.

UM, ASIDE FROM HISTORICAL LAND USE POLICIES THAT WE'VE SEEN CALLING FOR RACIAL SEGREGATION IN THE CITY, THE BIGGEST LAND USE AND JUSTICE THAT WE'VE SEEN IN DALLAS HISTORY IS ALLOWING INCOMPATIBLE INDUSTRIAL USES TO BE LOCATED FAR TOO CLOSE TO AREAS WHERE OUR BLACK AND BROWN CITIZENS PREDOMINANTLY LIVE.

UM, THE PREVIOUS DRAFT OF FORWARD DALLAS DIDN'T DO ENOUGH VERSION OF FORWARD DALLAS FROM 2006, DIDN'T DO ENOUGH TO ADDRESS THIS.

AND THE VERSION THAT WE HAVE IN FRONT OF US TODAY IS A MASSIVE STEP IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION.

UM, IT REALLY THOUGHTFULLY ADDRESSES, UM, AREAS LIKE WEST DALLAS JOPPA AND FOR FARMS AND CALLS FOR TARGETED ZONING INTERVENTIONS IN THOSE AREAS.

AND ALSO ADDRESSES SOME OF THE INCREASING TENSIONS THAT WE'VE SEEN BETWEEN WAREHOUSE LOGISTICS USES AND EXISTING RESIDENTIAL AREAS.

UM, I WILL GET TO THANK YOUS AT THE END, BUT UM, REALLY WANNA APPRECIATE ALL THE GREAT, UM, INPUT THAT WE'VE GOTTEN FROM, UM, SEVERAL PEOPLE INCLUDING COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, WHO WAS MY CLUB VICE CHAIR, UM, CITY STAFF, AND THE GROUP OF ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE ADVOCATES WHO REGULARLY MET WITH CITY STAFF TO ADDRESS THIS PIECE.

UM, THE OTHER PIECE THAT I WANT TO ADDRESS IS THE HOUSING CHOICE AND ACCESS AND COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE.

UM, WHICH I THINK HAS BEEN BY AND FAR THE MOST, UM, CONTROVERSIAL PIECE OF THIS, BUT ALSO PROBABLY UP THERE, UM, AS THE MOST IMPORTANT.

SO WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF A SUBSTANTIAL HOUSING SHORTAGE DUE TO, AMONG OTHER THINGS, NOT BUILDING ENOUGH HOUSING TO MEET OUR CITY'S HOUSING NEEDS, WHICH HAS LED TO HOUSING PRICES THAT HAVE BECOME INCREASINGLY UNATTAINABLE FOR MANY PEOPLE WHO LIVE HERE.

AND ALL OF THAT HAS HAPPENED UNDER OUR EXISTING DEVELOPMENT ZONE CODE AND OUR EXISTING ZONING.

AND WE NEED TO ADDRESS THAT HOUSING SHORTAGE, UM, BOTH TODAY AND TO ACCOUNT FOR FUTURE PROJECTED GROWTH OF THE CITY.

AND THIS DRAFT CALLS FOR A NUMBER OF STRATEGIES TO INCREASE ATTAINABLE AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN THE CITY, INCLUDING FACILITATING TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, MIXED USE REDEVELOPMENT IN EXISTING COMMERCIAL AREAS AND ALONG CORRIDORS THAT ARE ALMOST EXCLUSIVELY RETAIL TODAY.

AND THEN MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING AND GENTLE DENSITY.

NONE

[01:00:01]

AS WE'VE SEEN RECENTLY.

TOD DONE WELL, TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT DONE WELL IS QUITE COMPLEX AND TAKE CAN TAKE YEARS TO SEE FRUITION.

AND MIXED USE REDEVELOPMENT OF AGING COMMERCIAL HAS GENERATED SIGNIFICANT CONCERN AMONG CERTAIN MEMBERS OF OUR COMMUNITY.

SO THAT BRINGS US TO THE MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING PIECE.

THE GENTLE DENSITY PIECE.

IN OTHER WORDS, ADDING ADDITIONAL HOUSING UNITS IN A WAY THAT'S SENSITIVE TO THE FORM AND SCALE OF EXISTING HOMES IN THE AREA.

THINGS LIKE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, DUPLEXES, AND SMALL MULTIPLEXES IN SOME PARTS OF TOWN, WE ALREADY HAVE MISSING MIDDLE THAT FITS REALLY WELL INTO OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.

MUCH OF THIS ARE DUPLEXES BUILT IN THE 1960S AND EARLIERS AND MULTIPLEXES BUILT IN THE 1950S AND BEFORE.

AND THERE'S SUBSTANTIAL BENEFITS TO MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING LIKE THIS.

IT PRESENTS, UM, ADDITIONAL HOUSING OPTIONS IN A MARKET WHERE MANY SINGLE FAMILY HOMES HAVE SIMPLY BECOME UNATTAINABLE.

IT PROVIDES OPPORTUNITIES FOR KEY MEMBER OF OUR COMMUNITIES LIKE TEACHERS AND FIRST RESPONDERS TO BE A PART OF OUR MOST VIBRANT MA NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO OUR SUSTAINABILITY GOALS.

YOU KNOW, TOO MANY PEOPLE WHO WORK IN DALLAS AND CHOOSE TO SPEND THEIR FREE TIME IN DALLAS HAVE TO COME IN FROM THE SUBURBS FOR THIS.

AND WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO MORE TO ACCOMMODATE THEM IN OUR CENTRAL CITY.

NOW WE'VE SEEN SIGNIFICANT OPPOSITIONS TO THIS MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING.

SOME OF THE OPPOSITION STEMS FROM THE FACT THAT SOME OF THE PRODUCT THAT WE'RE GETTING BUILT TODAY, LIKE DUPLEXES AND OTHER PRODUCTS IS PROBLEMATIC WHEN IT COMES TO DESIGN.

IT'S OUT OF SCALE WITH EXISTING HOUSING AND NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND TOO OFTEN WE SEE HOMES WITH FOUR FRONT LOADED GARAGE SPOTS TOO MUCH CONCRETE IN THE FRONT YARD AND ENTRANCES THAT AREN'T ORIENTED TO THE STREET MOVING FORWARD.

WE NEED DESIGN STANDARDS IN OUR CODE THAT ARE MEANINGFUL AND LANGUAGE TO ADDRESS WHERE AND HOW MISSING MID HOUSEHOLD MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING CAN BE BUILT.

AND I HOPE THAT I OR SOME OF MY COLLEAGUES WILL OFFER LANGUAGE TO ADDRESS THAT IN THE FORWARD DALLAS DRAFT.

UM, THAT BRINGS ME TO THE PEAK QUESTION OF MULTIPLEX USE IN THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL SLASH SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPES, WHICH I THINK HAS PROBABLY, UM, GENERATED THE MOST CONSTERNATION AMONG MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY.

WE'VE HEARD CONCERNS THAT BECAUSE MULTIPLEX IS A PRIMARY USE IN THESE TWO PLACE TYPES, ANYONE COULD COME IN AND KNOCK DOWN A SINGLE FAMILY HOME AND BUILD UP TO A NINE PLEX ON ANY LOT.

THAT IS NOT THE INTENT HERE.

AND I DON'T THINK THE EXISTING DRAFT CALLS FOR ALLOWING NINE PLEXES ON ANY LOT OR MULTIPLEXES ON ANY LOT.

WE DO NEED TO BE THOUGHTFUL ABOUT HOW AND WHERE WE INCORPORATE MULTIPLEXES IN PARTICULAR TO BE SENSITIVE TO CONCERNS ABOUT DISPLACEMENT OF EXISTING RESIDENTS IN NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ARE AT RISK OF GENTRIFICATION.

AND TO THAT END THAT I UNDERSTAND THAT ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES TODAY WILL MAKE A MOTION THAT WILL CHANGE MULTIPLEX FROM A PRIMARY USE TO A SECONDARY USE IN THESE TWO PLACE TYPES.

AND IF THAT MOTION'S MADE, I DO PLAN TO SUPPORT IT BECAUSE I BELIEVE THAT IT REPRESENTS A GOOD COMPROMISE TO ADDRESS THESE COMMUNITY CONCERNS.

UM, THE LAST THING ON THE HOUSING PIECE IS THAT THIS IS JUST THE BEGINNING.

IT'S NOT A ZONING CHANGE, IT'S NOT A DEVELOPMENT TO, IT'S NOT AN AMENDMENT TO OUR DEVELOPMENT CODE.

AND I REALLY LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING THE NEXT STEPS AS WE LOOK AT, UM, THE WAYS THAT WE ADDRESS OUR HOUSING NEEDS, BOTH TODAY AND MOVING FORWARD.

UM, FINALLY, I JUST WANT TO EXTEND A FEW THANK YOUS TO PEOPLE WHO WERE PLAYED REALLY IMPORTANT, UM, ROLES IN THIS PROCESS.

THERE'S THE COMPREHENSIVE LAND USE PLAN COMMITTEE, UM, MY INVALUABLE VICE CHAIR, DEBORAH CARPENTER, AS WELL AS PETER GOLDSTEIN, ROY LOPEZ, JENNIFER SCRIPPS, NATHANIEL BARRETT, JOE CANNON, JERRY HAWKINS, KRISTEN NIGHTINGALE, LINDA MCMAHON, MATT HOUSTON, MAUREEN MILLIGAN, FORMER COMMISSIONER, JASMINE ANDERSON, DUSTIN BULLARD, JENNIFER RONELL, AND LYNETTE A AGUILAR.

UM, ALSO THANK YOU TO PUD STAFF MEMBERS, INTERIM DIRECTOR, ANDREA GILLIS, LAWRENCE AGU, PATRICK BLADES, BRIAN PRICE, SHALANDA MEN, G**O JOHNSON, ASHIMA SHAIK, TED HELM, AND ARTURO DEL CASTILLO PLUS GEORGE MENDOZA FOR ALL OF HIS TECHNICAL SUPPORT.

AND THANK YOU ALSO TO OUR FOR FORMER PUD DIRECTOR, UM, JULIA RYAN AND OUR NEW, UM, PUD DIRECTOR EMILY LIU, THE TECHNICAL REVIEW COMMITTEE.

AND FINALLY, THANK YOU TO ALL OF THE COMMUNITY MEMBERS WHO HAVE ENGAGED IN THIS PROCESS IN MYRIAD WAYS, FROM EMAILS TO COMMUNITY MEETINGS, TO PUBLIC HEARINGS, TO MEETING WITH STAFF.

YOUR VOICES HAVE BEEN HEARD.

I BELIEVE WE'LL SEE SOME REALLY GOOD TWEAKS TO THE DOCUMENT, UM, TODAY AND POSSIBLY AT OUR NEXT MEETING TO ADDRESS A LOT OF THESE COMMUNITY CONCERNS.

SO WE CAN MOVE FORWARD TO COUNCIL WITH THE CONSENSUS DOCUMENT THAT WHILE IT MIGHT NOT SATISFY EVERYONE, 100% IS A REAL STEP FORWARD FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS AND ITS FUTURE LAND USE NEEDS.

AND WITH THAT, I LOOK FORWARD TO HEARING THE, UM, AMENDMENTS

[01:05:01]

AND DISCUSSION AMONGST THE BODY.

AND HOPEFULLY WE WILL BE SENDING THIS ON TO COUNCIL, UM, AT A FUTURE MEETING.

VICE CHAIR, COMMISSIONER HERBERT, SIR.

UM, THANK YOU VICE CHAIR.

UH, I APPRECIATE THE TIME.

I'VE, I'VE APPRECIATED THE TIME THAT YOU AND THE CHAIR HAVE LISTENED TO ME, UM, AND MY COMMUNITY.

UM, MOST OF THE COMMISSIONERS AROUND HERE KNOW I REPRESENT, UH, A SECTION OF THE CITY THAT HAS BEEN CALLING FOR EQUITY FOR QUITE A LONG TIME.

SO FINDING WAYS TO, TO GET CONSENSUS AMONGST US ALL.

EVERY WEEK WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO TALK THROUGH SOME THINGS, MEET IN THE MIDDLE, AND, AND FIND WAYS TO IMPROVE WITH THAT.

I WANNA, UM, MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION WITH THE FOLLOWING CHANGES, UM, FOR THE PLACE TYPE AND LAND USE MATRIX FOR SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL AND COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL CHANGE, MULTIPLEX TO SECONDARY USE UNDER HOUSING CHOICE AND ACCESS A ONE REPLACE WIDTH TO ENSURE THAT DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES THAT MAY BE ADDED INTO NEIGHBORHOODS ARE COMPATIBLE WITH EXISTING HOMES.

CONSIDER IMPLEMENTING DESIGN STANDARDS INTO THE DEVELOPMENT CODE AND STRENGTHENING THE NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION OVERLAY ORDINANCE TO ADDRESS, AMONG OTHER THINGS, HEIGHT, ROUTE DESIGN, GARAGE PARKING, PLACEMENT, IMPERVIOUS SURFACE LOT COVERAGE AND SQUARE FOOTAGE, LOCATION OF FRONT DOORS AND SETBACKS.

IN SOME INSTANCES, DESIGN STANDARDS FOR DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES MAY NEED TO BE MORE STRINGENT THAN THOSE IMPOSED ON THE ESTABLISHED HOUSING TYPE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

FOR EXAMPLE, CONSIDERING REQUIRING PARKING AT AT DUPLEXES IN THE REAR OF THE LOT WHILE CONTINUING TO ALLOW BUT NOT ENCOURAGE FRONT LOAD PARKING FOR SINGLE FAMILY HOMES UNDER HOUSING CHOICE AND ACCESS A, ADD A NEW ITEM.

CONSIDER IMPLEMENTING CRITERIA THAT FACILITATES THE DEVELOPMENT OF DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES, SUCH AS SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED AND MULTIPLEXES, AND LOCATIONS WELL SUITED FOR SUCH DEVELOPMENT, SUCH AS NEAR TRANSIT STATIONS AND ALONG CORRIDORS AND TRANSITION AREAS BETWEEN NINE RESIDENTIAL AND EXISTING RESIDENTIAL AREAS, AND ON FORMAL CIVIC INSTITUTIONAL PROPERTIES AND POSSIBLY ON CORNER LOTS.

ADD TO THE INTRODUCTION, MANY ESTABLISHED NEIGHBORHOODS RANGING FROM THOSE THAT EX CO THAT CONSIST OF EXCLUSIVELY SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED RESIDENCES TO THOSE WITH A DIVERSE ARRAY OF HOUSING TYPES, HAVE EXPERIENCED CONSIDERABLE CHANGES SINCE THE FIRST FORD DALLAS PLAN WAS ESTABLISHED IN 2006, IN LARGE PART, DUE TO MARKET DEMANDS FOR HOUSING SIGNIFICANTLY OUTSTRIPPING OUR HOUSING SUPPLY.

WHILE SOME OF THIS REDEVELOPMENT HAS BENEFITED NEIGHBORHOODS IN TOO MANY INSTANCES, IT HAS LED TO EXISTING RESIDENTS BEING DISPLACED FROM THEIR LONGTIME HOMES.

ON ONE HAND, MANY DALLAS NEIGHBORHOODS THAT HAVE EXPERIENCED SIGNIFICANT DISPLACEMENT DESPITE BEING ZONED SINGLE FAMILY.

ON THE OTHER HAND, NEIGHBORHOODS THAT HAVE ALLOWED DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES HAVE NOT BEEN IMMUNE TO DISPLACEMENT EITHER.

THE MOST IMPORTANT CONSIDERATION AS THE CITY MOVES FORWARD IN THE CONVERSATION ABOUT ADDING NEW HOUSING TYPES ARE ONE, MEETING THE HOUSING NEEDS OF DALLAS RESIDENTS IN THE MIDST OF HOUSING SHORTAGES.

AND IN LIGHT OF PROJECTIONS, THAT HOUSING DEMAND WILL CONTINUE TO GROW ALONG WITH THE CITY ITSELF.

AND TWO, ENSURING THAT RESIDENCES OF ESTABLISHED NEIGHBORHOODS ARE NOT DISPLACED.

OTHER CONSIDERATIONS ARE ALSO RELEVANT WHEN HAVING DISCUSSIONS ABOUT ADDING NEW HOUSING TYPES TO EXISTING NEIGHBORHOODS.

THESE CONSIDERATIONS INCLUDE, BUT ARE NOT LIMITED TO, LIMITED TO ENSURING THAT THE NEW HOUSING TYPES ARE SENSITIVE TO THE COMPATIBLE, I'M SORRY, ARE SENSITIVE TO AND COMPATIBLE WITH THE EXISTING HOUSING IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD IN, IN TERMS OF DESIGN AND LOCATION, AND ADDRESSING THE MITIGATING ANY ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS THAT COULD RESULT FROM CARELESS FROM THE CARELESS ADDITION OF THE NEW HOUSING TYPES.

IN CONTRAST, CERTAIN CONSIDERATIONS SHOULD NOT BE GIVEN WEIGHT IN ANY DISCUSSION ABOUT ADDING NEW TYPES OF HOUSING.

AS HISTORY SHOWS, LAND USE AND ZONING HAVE BEEN USED AS TOOLS TO SEGREGATE PEOPLE.

UNFORTUNATELY, SOME CONTINUE TO VOICE THOSE SENTIMENTS TODAY, PARTICULARLY WHEN IT COMES TO EXCLUDING PEOPLE OF ALLURE.

SOCIAL ECONOMIC STATUS ARGUMENTS BASED ON THESE SENTIMENTS DO NOT DESERVE ANY WEIGHT.

RATHER, LAND USE AND ZONING DECISIONS SHOULD PROCEED FROM THE FUNDAMENTAL TENANT THAT ALL RESIDENTS OF DALLAS ARE EQUAL AND CAN LIVE AND THRIVE AS NEIGHBORS IN ALL PARTS OF THE CITY.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER HERBERT, AND THANK YOU COMMISSIONER BLAIR FOR YOUR SECOND COMMISSIONER.

[01:10:01]

HERBERT, DID YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS ON THE, UH, AND JUST TO SUMMARIZE, WE DO HAVE A MOTION TO AMEND THE DOCUMENT TO MOVE MULTIPLEX IN SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL AND COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL TO A SECONDARY USE.

MAKE COMMISSIONER HERBERT SECOND ABOUT COMMISSIONER BLAIR COMMENT, SIR, A BRIEF COMMENT, UM, WHAT YOU GUYS HEARD WAS A LOT OF THE PASSION AND EMOTION THAT WE'VE HEARD FROM THE ENVIRONMENT, OUR CITIZENS, UM, THAT ARE OUT IN THE COMMUNITY AND KNOW THE LOUDEST.

UM, I'VE ENGAGED IN A LOT OF COMMENTS, A LOT OF CRITICISM, UM, A LOT OF ENCOURAGEMENT AND LACK THEREOF.

UM, AND I WAS, I TRY TO CAPTURE AS MUCH AS IT CAN, UM, DELIVER THAT TO SOME OF MY COUNTERPARTS FOR CONSISTENT, UM, UM, AND, UH, PARTNERSHIP AND DELIVER IT THE BEST WAY I COULD TO MEET EVERYBODY'S, UM, NEEDS, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.

SO, THANK YOU COMMISSIONER BLAIR.

I SECOND THE MOTION AND I, THIS IS A START TO TODAY'S DISCUSSION.

THIS GIVES US A BASIS TO SAY, LET'S FURTHER DISCUSS AND HAVE CONSIDERATION OF THIS MASSIVE DOCUMENT.

WHEN WE STARTED, IT WAS SOMETHING WE COULD READ ONLINE.

IT HAS WITH THE CHANGES AND, AND BY FAR SOME OF THE CHANGES WE'VE SEEN TODAY.

YOU CAN ONLY READ THIS, UH, IN PRINT.

UM, WE HAVE HEARD, AND WE ARE HEARING, I HAVE HEARD FROM DISTRICT EIGHT INTENSELY ON THE, THE, SOME PROTECTIONS THAT THEY FELT ARE NEEDED.

THIS BY FAR STARTS, UH, A HEALTHY DISCUSSION WHEN IT COMES TO HOUSING CHOICES, PROTECTIONS THAT WE HAVE HEARD ALREADY FROM TODAY.

AND, AND I'M ONLY, I CAN ONLY SPEAK INTENTLY ON DISTRICT EIGHT, BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I KNOW SOME OF THE OTHER DISTRICTS HAVE CONCERN IS THE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE PIECE.

I AM HAPPY TO HEAR AND HAPPY TO, TO, TO, UM, SECOND THE MOTION THAT THAT STATES THAT CONSIDERATION SHOULD BE GIVEN FOR THE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE AND THAT EQUITY IN HOUSING CHOICES SHOULD NOT BE ONLY CONSIDERED IN ONE AREA, BUT EQUITABLY THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE ENTIRE CITY.

SO THANK YOU.

WITH THAT.

THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER BLAIR.

UM, I WILL BE SUPPORTING THE MOTION.

I I DIDN'T OPINE ON THIS THE LAST TIME, BUT I, I BELIEVE THAT, UH, SHIFTING THE MULTIPLEX TO A SECONDARY USE AND COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL AND SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL REFLECTS THE CURRENT REALITIES ON THE GROUND.

THIS ADJUSTMENT ALSO ALIGNS WITH THIS PLAN, WITH THE PHILOSOPHY THAT MANY OF US FOLLOW WHEN CONSIDERING INCREASED DENSITY, AND THAT IS IMPLEMENTING CHANGES WHERE IT MAKES SENSE.

THE REALITY IS, IS THAT THE CITY OF DALLAS WILL NOT SOLVE ITS HOUSING CRISIS BY DEVELOPING NINE PLEXES IN THE MIDDLE OF SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

THIS PHENOMENON DID NOT OCCUR AFTER FORWARD DALLAS IN 2006, NOR IS IT FORESEEN TO HAPPEN WITH THIS CURRENT UPDATE.

DEVELOPMENT OF NINE PLEXES IN THE MIDDLE OF SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS IS NOT A GOAL OF THIS CURRENT PROPOSAL.

SUCH AN APPROACH IS SIMPLY NOT SCALABLE.

THE VERY PRESENCE OF MANY OF YOU HERE TODAY, ALONG WITH THE DOZENS AND DOZENS OF EMAILS IN OPPOSITION, UNDERSCORES JUST HOW UNREALISTIC THIS IDEA IS.

AS MANY OF YOU HAVE POINTED OUT, FORD DALLAS CANNOT CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING DIRECTLY.

THAT IS CORRECT.

CREATING BELOW MARKET RATE HOUSING REQUIRES EITHER FINANCIAL INCENTIVES OR THE EXCHANGE OF ENTITLEMENTS, NEITHER OF WHICH FORWARD DALLAS IS EMPOWERED TO DO.

INSTEAD, IT AIMS TO WELCOME THE CREATION OF MORE ATTAINABLE HOUSING BY SUGGESTING VARIOUS HOUSING TYPES WHERE IT MAKES SENSE.

IN NUMEROUS TOWN HALLS MEETINGS AND DOZENS OF EMAILS, MANY OF YOU HAVE POSED A CRUCIAL QUESTION, WHAT WILL HAPPEN TO OUR NEIGHBORHOODS? WHILE THIS QUESTION IS INDEED SIGNIFICANT, I BELIEVE THERE'S AN EVEN MORE INTRIGUING ONE TO EXPLORE, AND THAT IS HOW WILL THESE CHANGES EN UNFOLD? IMPLEMENTING ANY CHANGE INVOLVES ENGAGING IN THE REZONING PROCESS, WHICH CAN BE COSTLY, TIME CONSUMING, AND MOST OF ALL UNPREDICTABLE.

AFTER A STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS PUBLISHED, A COMMISSIONER REPRESENTING THE DISTRICT WHERE THE APPLICATION ORIGINATED, REVIEWS THE CASE MOST COMMISSIONERS LIVE IN THE DISTRICTS.

THEY REPRESENT AN IMPORTANT ASPECT OR OUR RESPONSIBILITY AS COMMISSIONERS IS CONDUCTING COMMUNITY MEETINGS, PARTICULARLY IN CASES FACING OPPOSITION.

[01:15:01]

THIS PROCESS CULMINATES IN A PUBLIC HEARING OR INDIVIDUALS CAN VOICE THEIR SUPPORT OR OPPOSITION.

THE FINAL DECISION RESTS WITH THE CITY COUNCIL, DETERMINE DURING A PUBLIC HEARING OPEN TO SPEAKERS BOTH IN SUPPORT AND IN OPPOSITION.

IT'S ESSENTIAL TO RECOGNIZE THAT NO WORDS IN A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN CAN SHIELD AGAINST A ZONING CHANGE.

AS PROPERTY OWNERS RETAIN THE RIGHT TO APPLY FOR SUCH CHANGES AT THEIR DISCRETION, THE SAFEGUARD, MANY SEEK LIES IN THE PROCESS ITSELF, OVERSEEN BY INDIVIDUALS AROUND THIS VERY HORSESHOE, STARTING AT THE CITY PLAN COMMISSION AND ULTIMATELY THE DALLAS CITY COUNCIL, OUR APPROACH IS CHARACTERIZED BY TRANSPARENCY AND ACCOUNTABILITY, INCORPORATING CHECKS AND BALANCES AT EACH STAGE.

RECENTLY, COMMISSIONER BLAIR AND I DISCUSSED A CASE THAT INITIALLY SEEMED AS STRAIGHTFORWARD WHEN VIEWED THROUGH THE LENS OF THE 2006 FORWARD DALLAS PLAN.

HOWEVER, UPON VISITING THE ACTUAL SITE AND GAINING A DEEPER UNDERSTANDING OF ITS CONTEXT, LOCATION IMPACT ON THE SURROUNDINGS AND THE SPECIFIC DETAILS OF THE ZONING REQUEST, WE REALIZED THAT THE SOLUTION WASN'T AS SIMPLE AS IT FIRST APPEARED.

IT BECAME CLEAR THAT THE FORWARD DALLAS GUIDANCE, WHILE VALUABLE, SIMPLY DIDN'T ALIGN WITH THE REALITIES ON THE GROUND.

THIS IS NOT UNUSUAL IN MANY CASES.

IT'S THE UNIQUE CIRCUMSTANCES AND INTRICACY SURROUNDING EACH SITE THAT DRIVE OUR DECISION MAKING PROCESS.

WHILE SOME APPLICATIONS MAY FIT WELL WITHIN THE BROAD STROKES OF FORWARD DALLAS RECOMMENDATION, OTHERS SIMPLY DO NOT FORWARD DALLAS, AS THE CITY'S OFFICIAL POLICY MUST REALISTICALLY ADDRESS THE NEEDS OF THE ENTIRE COMMUNITY.

AS MEMBERS OF THE CITY PLAN COMMISSION, WE RELY ON OUR EXPERIENCE WITH ZONING AND OUR UNDERSTANDING OF THE CITY'S DATA PROVEN HOUSING CRISIS.

IN OUR DECISION MAKING, WE HAVE A MORAL AND PROFESSIONAL DUTY TO RESPOND TO THESE HOUSING NEEDS.

IMPLEMENTATION WILL HAPPEN INCREMENTALLY AND LARGELY ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS.

WE HEARD CLEARLY, HOWEVER, THAT PRIORITY MUST BE PLACED ON FIRST, ESTABLISHING AN UPDATE SET OF CODES THAT INCORPORATE DESIGN STANDARDS DIRECTLY INTO THE DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS TO ENSURE GREATER PREDICTABILITY AND MORE ALIGNMENT WITH THE ESTABLISHED DEVELOPMENT.

THERE IS NO SINGLE SOLUTION.

IT'S ABOUT CREATING OPTIONS WHERE THEY MAY, WHERE THEY MAKE SENSE.

AS A CITY, WE NEED TO LOOK AT HOW TO BRING PEOPLE TOGETHER AND NOT HOW WE SEPARATE THEM.

HOUSING OPTIONS PLAY A CRUCIAL ROLE IN THIS.

THE HOUSING CRISIS HAS LEFT MANY WITH FEWER CHOICES, AND OUR LAND USE POLICY SHOULD NOT CREATE ADDITIONAL BARRIERS.

STRENGTHENING OUR GREAT NEIGHBORHOODS REMAINS A PRIORITY, AND TOGETHER WE MUST EXPLORE SENSIBLE WAYS TO ACCOMMODATE OUR C CITY'S EVOLVING LIFESTYLES PREFERENCES AND NEEDS.

I THINK WE'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK TO DOING JUST THAT.

COMMISSIONER WHEELER, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I HOPE THAT, UM, ONCE, UH, FORWARD DALLAS, UM, MOVES FORWARD IN HOUSING, UM, IS DESIGN STANDARDS ALLOW ALLOWING DESIGN STANDARDS IN ZONING CASES THAT IS RELATED TO HOUSING.

UM, IT IS VERY IMPERATIVE THAT THAT HAPPENS BECAUSE OFTENTIMES WE, BECAUSE IT'S A STRAIGHT ZONING CASE, WE'RE NOT ABLE TO CONSIDER DESIGN STANDARDS AND THOSE DESIGN STANDARDS.

WHEN A DEVELOPER WALKS OUT THE DOOR, THEY MIGHT SHOW US SOMETHING THAT IS NICE AND WE SEE IT AND THEY SAY THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE GONNA BUILD, BUT IT'S NOT WHAT'S ACTUALLY BEING BUILT ON THE GROUND.

AND THAT'S BEEN MY CONCERN WITH HOUSING.

I'M GONNA SUPPORT THE MOTION 100%, BUT MY CONCERN HAS ALWAYS BEEN WHAT THE, WHY CAN'T WE CONSIDER DESIGN STANDARDS WHEN IT COMES TO HOUSING TYPES? UM, AND HERE'S DESIGN STANDARDS ARE ESSENTIALLY IN ZONING CASES RELATED TO HOUSING TO ENSURE THAT NEW DEVELOPMENT ALIGNS WITH THE NEEDS OF DESIRES OF THE COMMUNITY.

BY INCORP INCORPORATING DESIGN STANDARDS, WE CAN PROMOTE A COHESIVE AND ATTRACTIVE URBAN ENVIRONMENT, WHILE ALSO ADDRESSING ISSUES SUCH AS DENSITY AND AFFORDABILITY.

IN STRAIGHT ZONING CASES WHERE DESIGN STANDARDS ARE NOT CONSIDERED, THERE IS A RISK OF ALLOWING HOUSINGS THAT MAY NOT BE IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE COMMUNITY.

WITHOUT PROPER GUIDELINES, DEVELOPERS MAY PRIORITIZE PROFIT OVER COMMUNITY NEEDS RESULTING IN DEVELOPMENT THAT ARE OUT OF TOUCH WITH THE SURROUNDING AREAS.

BY IMPLEMENTING DESIGN STANDARDS, WE CAN ENCOURAGE A MIX OF USAGES ALONG MAJOR CORRIDORS THAT WILL ALLOW FOR INCREASED DENSITY AND AFFORDABILITY WHILE STILL RESPECTING THE CARROT OF SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOOD.

THIS APPROACH PROMOTES A BALANCE AND SUSTAINABILITY URBAN ENVIRONMENT THAT MEETS THE DIVERSE NEEDS OF RESIDENTS.

OVERALL DESIGN STANDARDS PLAY A CRUCIAL ROLE IN SHAPING THE BUILT ENVIRONMENT AND ENSURING THE NEW DEVELOPMENT ENHANCE THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR ALL COMMUNITY MEMBERS.

BY INCORPORATING DESIGN STANDARDS AND ZONING DECISIONS RELATED TO HOUSING, WE CAN CREATE A VIBRANT, INCLUSIVE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT REFLECTS VALUES AND PREFERENCES

[01:20:01]

OF THE COMMUNITY.

I GET TO SAY THAT BECAUSE, UM, I THINK I, I MIGHT BE MISTAKEN AND STAFF CAN CORRECT ME.

I BELIEVE THAT THAT MY COMMUNITY, MY NEIGHBORHOOD IN MY DISTRICT IS THE LAST OF THE AREA PLANS TO BE COMPLETED.

AM I COR, AM I CORRECT? WE HAVE BEEN WORKING FOUR YEARS ON A AREA PLAN.

WE THOUGHT WE WERE FINISHED, BUT THEN WE HAD THESE MEGA MANSIONS BEING BUILT IN THE SOUTH DALLAS, AND BECAUSE OF DESIGN STANDARDS, THERE WAS DUPLEXES THAT WERE BUILT IN SOUTH DALLAS DURING MY TERM ON A CPC THAT BECAUSE OF DESIGN STANDARDS, THAT WE SAW SOMETHING PRETTY AT CPC AND WHEN IT WAS BUILT, IT WAS NOT, IT WAS NOT, UM, IT WAS NOT A PRODUCT THAT WE WOULD HAVE APPROVED IF THE DESIGN STANDARDS WERE BEEN IN PLACE.

AND WE GET A GREAT CHOICE OF THIS WEEKEND GOING OUT IN THE COMMUNITY WITH PUBLIC STAFF.

WE'RE GOING OUT IN THE COMMUNITY WITH MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY LEADERS SO THAT WE CAN MAKE SURE THAT IN OUR AREA PLAN, THAT OUR DESIGN STANDARDS IS IMPLEMENTING SO THAT WE CAN HAVE HOUSING TYPES AND WHERE WE FIT.

OUR COMMUNITY HAS A DIVERSE AMOUNT OF HOUSING TYPES, AND WE WANNA MAKE SURE WE GET IT RIGHT.

SO BY SUPPORTING THIS PARTICULAR MOTION, IT ALIGNS WITH WHAT PD 5 95 SOUTH DALLAS AREA PLAN TASK FORCE HAS WENT IN AND SAID, THIS IS WHAT WE NEED.

WE SHOULD HAVE PROBABLY BEEN FINISHED WITH EVERYONE ELSE, BUT BECAUSE OUR AREA IS SO UNIQUE, AND WE WERE IN THE MIDDLE OF A FLOURISH OF HOUSING THAT IS GROSSLY INCOMPATIBLE AS OUR HONORABLE, UM, COUNCIL MEMBER, UH, FORMER COUNCIL MEMBER, UH, DIANE RAGSDALE HAS SAID OVER AND OVER AGAIN, IT IS GROSSLY INCOMPATIBLE.

AND SO, BUT WE'RE ALSO SAYING THAT WE NEED, ALONG WITH CORRIDORS, WE CAN LOOK AT WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE? I HAD A, A AWESOME CHANCE AT TALKING WITH, UM, JOBY ABOUT, THEY WERE 100% AGAINST ANY APARTMENTS, BUT I WAS ABLE TO TALK TO THEM AND SAY, WELL, LET'S OPEN THE IDEA.

OH, WELL, SMALL.

UM, YOU WANT, YOU WANT ALONG CARBONDALE IT TO BE A, A, A COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR, BUT YOU ALSO CAN GET SOME DENSITY AND NOT A CRAZY AMOUNT OF DENSITY THAT REFLECTS OTHER AREAS SO THAT YOU CAN HAVE SUPPORTED HOUSE TYPES THAT, THAT ARE IN THAT SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOOD ALONG THAT CORRIDOR THAT WILL NOT IMPEDE INTO THE THE CURRENT NEIGHBORHOOD.

SO WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT HOUSE TYPES, I THINK THIS HAS TO GO NEIGHBORHOOD BY NEIGHBORHOOD, COMMUNITY BY COMMUNITY, BECAUSE THERE IS COMMUNITIES WHO NEED THAT.

BUT MY ONLY FEAR IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR IS BECAUSE WE'RE SO VULNERABLE AND SUSCEPTIBLE TO, UM, DEVELOPERS WHO DO NOT COME INTO THE COMMUNITY AND ASK WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS, THAT WE MIGHT NOT GET A HOUSING TYPE.

THAT THE HOUSING TYPE MIGHT BE DENSITY, BUT IT MIGHT LOOK LIKE GARBAGE AND IT MIGHT BE OVERPRICED.

SO I AM 100% FOR DENSITY, ESPECIALLY SMALL DENSITY.

I HAVE TALKED WITH, UM, WITH PUD EXTENSIVELY.

I'VE WORKED WITH, UH, ANDREA AND, AND PATRICK FOR QUITE SOME TIME, AND LINDSAY AND MS. BOWIE AND, AND THAT DRIVING FORCES ME DRIVING THE CITY.

I DRIVE FROM ONE END TO THE OTHER END, AND THEY GET CALLS SOMETIME EIGHT, NINE O'CLOCK AT NIGHT BECAUSE SOMETHING POPPED UP AND I SEEN SOMETHING FOR THE FIRST TIME.

AND HOW DOES, AND WHERE DOES AND CAN THAT FIT IN SOUTH DALLAS, BUT GIVE US DENSITY? AND OFTENTIMES THERE IS VOICES THAT ARE BEING SPOKEN ABOUT THE SOUTHERN SECTOR WHO HAS NEVER PASSED 30 IN THE LAST YEAR AND DON'T UN AND, AND, AND DOES NOT HAVE, AND DO NOT HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT OUR CRISIS IS.

OUR CRISIS IS THERE IS NOT AFFORDABILITY SOUTH OF 30.

IF IT IS, IT'S FULL AFFORDABILITY.

WE CAN'T OFTENTIMES, EVEN HERE, WE CAN'T GET AFFORDABILITY IN ZONING CASES BECAUSE OF ENLO FEE.

WE NEED DENSITY, WE NEED AFFORDABILITY, WE NEED DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES.

CORRIDORS, I AM FOR A SINGLE FAMILY HOME.

I OWN A COUPLE OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES, BUT I ALSO GREW UP IN A SMALL APARTMENT COMPLEX, UM, KIND SIMILAR TO THE ONES ON GASTON, WHERE MY MOTHER WAS A SINGLE PARENT AND SHE CAN GO TO WORK AND HO HOLLER ACROSS THE HO WELL ACROSS THE, THE, UM, COURTYARD AND TELL THE NEIGHBOR, CAN YOU LOOK IN ON MY KIDS? AND WE HAD A FAMILY SETTING.

I'VE ALSO, MY MOTHER LIVED IN A SIXPLEX RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF SOUTH DALLAS, BUT IT FIT AND IT WAS AFFORDABLE.

ONE BEDROOM WHEN SHE DIDN'T HAVE ANY KIDS, SHE DIDN'T WANT A, AN APARTMENT COMPLEX.

SHE NEITHER WANTED A HOUSE, BUT SHE WAS ABLE TO SEE A SIXPLEX.

SO THAT DIVERSITY WHERE IT FITS, MAKING SURE THAT THE COMMUNITY IS INVOLVED, THE THOSE, UM, NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION OVERLAYS, THIS GROSS INCOMPATIBLE HOUSING THAT IS OUT PRICING OUR SENIORS WHERE THEY CAN'T, UM, AGE IN PLACE ANYMORE.

THOSE THINGS REALLY IS CONSIDERABLE.

AND SO I BELIEVE THAT THE MAIN FOCUS OF ME IS FOR MY, MYSELF ON VOTING, UM, ON

[01:25:01]

THESE CASES IS, IS THERE GONNA BE DESIGN STANDARDS? IS THERE GONNA WORK ITS WAY INTO HOW WE VOTE ON HOUSING WHEN IT COMES TO STRAIGHT ZONING CASES? THAT IS CONSIDERED HOUSING.

AND THAT IS MY DECIDING FACTOR ON, ON WHICH WAY DO I VOTE.

AND THAT DESIGN STANDARD IS BEING IN PLACE.

AND, AND HAVING COMMISSIONERS THAT UNDERSTAND THAT DESIGN STANDARDS IS THE ONLY THING THAT SEPARATES ME FROM SAYING YES OR NO.

UM, AND, AND I BELIEVE THAT P STAFF HAS GREATLY HEARD US OVER THE LAST, UH, COUPLE YEARS.

I'M SO READY TO CLOSE THE SOUTH DALLAS AREA PLAN, TASK FORCE OUT.

WHEN I FIRST CAME ON, THE ONLY THING I WAS CONCERNED ABOUT WAS PARKING INCOMPATIBILITY AGENCIES 25 FEET FROM THE CURVE, NPD 5 9 5 AND CATERING SERVICES AS A SUP.

AND THAT'S WAS ALL I KNEW.

AND IT MORPHED IN ME LEARNING AND, AND GOING BACK TO SCHOOL AND SAYING THAT I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT I AM A PART OF, UH, OF THE CHANGE THAT SOUTH DALLAS IS GOING TO NEED.

THAT'S NOT PROBABLY IN MY LIFETIME, BUT IN MY NIECES, NEPHEWS, AND MY 8-YEAR-OLD SON.

SO I JUST, I SUPPORT THIS AND I THANK PUD.

UM, WHEN ANDREA CAME ON, WE HAD 160 AREA PLANS IN SOUTH DALLAS THAT HAD NEVER CAME TO FULL, UH, FRUITION.

AND SHE SAID, WE'RE NOT DOING THAT AGAIN.

WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT THE ONES THAT'S BEEN IN PLACE, AND LET'S GET SOME, LET'S GO IN AND DO SOME SURGERY.

AND BELIEVE ME OR NOT, HOUSING TYPE WAS ONE OF OUR SURGERIES.

I BELIEVE IT'S ONE OF OUR GUIDING PRINCIPLES THAT WE WENT IN.

ALSO, WE HAVE UNIQUE ZONING IN SOUTH DALLAS THAT, UM, I THINK MOST HAD NEVER HEARD OF NCS.

UM, AND WE'RE NOW LOOKING AT SAYING, CAN WE GET SOME HOUSING TYPES ALONG THAT, THAT, THAT THOSE CORRIDORS IN SOUTH DALLAS THAT WILL ALLOW FOR THOSE APARTMENTS THAT SO MANY OF OUR APARTMENTS WERE TORE DOWN ARE NOW HAVING SOME SINGLE FAMILY HOUSING OR SOME DUPLEXES ON IT.

SO WE, I LOOK FORWARD TO THIS AS LONG AS IT HAS DESIGN STANDARDS WORKED INTO IT.

THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, PLEASE.

AND I LOOK FORWARD TO HAVING MORE AMENDMENTS TO ADDRESS GENTRIFICATION IN THIS BEFORE IT ULTIMATELY GOES TO COUNCIL.

UM, IN THE INTEREST OF TIME, I'M NOT GONNA REPEAT A LOT OF WHAT'S ALREADY BEEN SENT.

I, I AGREE WITH MOST OF IT.

I WILL BE SUPPORTING THE MOTION, UM, AS THE FIRST OF MANY MOTIONS I HOPE TO HEAR.

UM, AS THE DISTRICT 14 REPRESENTATIVE, I REPRESENT A MULTIPLE, A GROUP OF MULTIPLE COMPETING INTERESTS THAT HAVE BEEN AT ODDS WITH ONE ANOTHER THROUGHOUT THIS PROCESS.

AND I THINK THAT THIS IS A BALANCED COMPROMISE.

I KNOW THAT PROBABLY ALL OF THE GROUPS ARE UNHAPPY WITH THE COMPROMISE.

THE SINGLE FAMILY HOMEOWNERS WANT NO CHANGE, AND CITIES THAT DON'T CHANGE DON'T THRIVE.

AND THE HOUSING ADVOCATES WANT NO RULES.

AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S A FAIR, UM, RESPONSE TO THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE INVESTED OVER THE COURSE OF DECADES IN THE CITY EITHER.

AND SO I THINK THAT THIS STRIKES A HEALTHY BALANCE BETWEEN THE TWO PRIMARY COMPETING INTERESTS.

AND I ALSO THINK IT'S REFLECTIVE OF WHAT'S ON THE GROUND IN SO MANY NEIGHBORHOODS.

IF YOU REALLY LOOK AT THE HISTORY OF THE CITY OF DALLAS AND HOW WE GOT THE ZONING WE GOT, IT'S AN OVERLAY THAT DOESN'T ACCURATELY DESCRIBE WHAT'S ON THE GROUND BECAUSE IT WAS PUT IN AFTER THE FACT.

AND MOST OF OUR, PARTICULARLY IN MY DISTRICT, UM, EAST DALLAS HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOODS ARE NOT SINGLE FAMILY, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NAMED THAT.

AND SO I THINK THAT THIS COMPROMISE BY TAKING OUT THE MULTIPLEX, UM, REALLY DOESN'T FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE THE CHARACTER OF THESE NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND I THINK THE LANGUAGE THAT TALKS ABOUT CREATING INFILL DESIGN STANDARDS AS PART OF THIS PLAN GOES, UH, TOWARD WHAT'S REALLY THE HEART OF THE ISSUE WITH THESE SMALLER DENSITY INFILL IS WHERE DO WE PUT IT AND HOW IS IT GOING TO REASONABLY FIT INTO THE EXISTING STOCK OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD? AND THIS PLAN DOESN'T DO THAT, AND IT'S NOT DESIGNED TO DO THAT BECAUSE THIS IS A, AN OVERARCHING PLANNING DOCUMENT.

IT'S NOT AN IMPLEMENT IMPLEMENTATION DOCUMENT.

THAT IMPLEMENTATION PIECE IS GOING TO HAVE TO BE SOMETHING WE WORK ON NEXT, AND THAT HAS TO BE SOMETHING THAT IS PART OF THAT.

AND THIS AMENDMENT SPECIFICALLY CALLS FOR THAT.

I ALSO THINK THAT THIS AMENDMENT HELPS ADDRESS THE GENTRIFICATION ISSUES WE SEE.

AND I DON'T THINK IT GOES FAR ENOUGH.

I THINK THERE NEEDS TO BE MORE IN THIS, UM, FORWARD DALLAS,

[01:30:01]

BUT I THINK THIS IS A GOOD FIRST STEP IN STARTING TO TALK ABOUT HOW WE PROTECT SOME OF THE WORKING CLASS, UM, NEIGHBORHOODS THAT WILL BE TARGETED, THAT ARE ALREADY BEING TARGETED.

IF WE DON'T DO ANOTHER THING, THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS ARE ON THE CHOP AND YOU KNOW IT, AND WE SEE IT.

AND SO WHAT THIS PLAN CAN DO AND WHAT IMPLEMENTATION FEATURES IN THIS PLAN CAN DO IS START TO CREATE WAYS IN WHICH WE CAN FORMULATE IMPLEMENTATION TO START TO PROTECT THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS THAT DO NOT EXIST TODAY.

AND SO THOSE ARE SOME OF THE REASONS I'M SUPPORTING THIS AMENDMENT.

UM, AND FRANKLY THOUGH, THERE ARE A LOT OF LOUD VOICES WHO OPPOSE IT.

THERE ARE SO MANY VOICES WHO SUPPORT IT.

I HAVE RECEIVED EASILY AS MUCH SUPPORT FOR THIS PLAN AS OPPOSITION.

I HAVE RECEIVED THOUSANDS OF EMAILS, CALLS, TEXTS IN PERSON MEETINGS, AND THE SUPPORT FOR IT IS OVERWHELMING.

I KNOW THAT, THAT SOME OF YOU DON'T WANT TO BELIEVE THAT, BUT IT'S TRUE.

AND, AND I HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO REPRESENT ALL OF THE CONSTITUENTS, NOT JUST THE ONES I KNOW THE BEST OR NOT JUST THE ONES WHO ARE THE LOUDEST OR NOT FRANKLY, JUST THE ONES WHO LIKE TO THREATEN ME.

UM, SO I ALSO SUPPORT THIS BECAUSE I THINK IT ADDRESSES THE CONCERNS ABOUT ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT THAT IS NOT JUST BUILDING WAREHOUSES NEXT TO HOMES.

IT ALSO SPECIFICALLY GOES TO, IS ALLOWING A CERTAIN DEVELOPMENT GOING TO CREATE, UM, YOU KNOW, IMPERMISSIBLE RUNOFF ON NEIGHBORHOOD PROPERTIES, IMPERMISSIBLE, UH, DRAINAGE ISSUES THAT MIGHT ADVERSELY IMPACT A NEIGHBORHOOD OR OTHER TYPES OF ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT.

WE SPECIFICALLY CHOSE A BROAD TERM LIKE THAT TO ENCOMPASS A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT WAYS THAT DEVELOPMENT CAN AND SOMETIMES DOES ADVERSELY IMPACT COMMUNITIES.

UM, AND I THINK THAT THAT GOES TO A LOT OF THE CONCERNS THAT YOU ALL HAVE RAISED ABOUT INFILL DEVELOPMENT AND HOW IT CAN ADVERSELY IMPACT NEIGHBORHOODS FROM ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERN.

UM, AND, AND FINALLY, YOU KNOW, I REJECT THE IDEA THAT WE DON'T NEED TO PLAN FOR HOUSING, THAT WE HAVE ENOUGH HOUSING.

THE, THE STATISTICS SIMPLY DO NOT BEAR THAT OUT.

THAT IS JUST UNTRUE.

AND WE ARE THE FASTEST GROWING REGION IN THE COUNTRY, AND DALLAS COUNTY AND TARRANT COUNTY ARE NOT GROWING AS FAST.

AND I, AND THE DATA IS, IS PRETTY CLEAR THAT THAT IS IN, IN MANY WAYS BECAUSE WE ARE NOT BUILDING ENOUGH HOUSING THAT'S AFFORDABLE ENOUGH FOR PEOPLE TO LIVE HERE.

AND ONE OF THE WAYS YOU CREATE MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS TO JUST BUILD MORE HOUSING WHILE FORWARD.

DALLAS IS NOT AN AFFORDABLE HOUSING PLAN PER SE.

ALLOWING FOR DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES AND ALLOWING FOR MORE HOUSING IS ONE WAY TO COMBAT THAT.

AND I AM SYMPATHETIC OR EMPATHETIC FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE BUILT THEIR FAMILIES AND LIVES AND BOUGHT HOMES AND INVESTED IN COMMUNITIES AND LIVED HERE FOR DECADES BECAUSE I'M ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE.

BUT I CAN BE ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE AND BE EMPATHETIC TOWARD YOUNGER PEOPLE WHO WANT THAT SAME LIFE AND CAN'T AFFORD IT.

AND THINK ABOUT HOW THE FUTURE OF THE CITY NEEDS TO OPERATE AND START TO TRANSFORM IN ORDER TO ALLOW FOR FUTURE GENERATIONS TO HAVE WHAT MY GENERATIONS AND GENERATIONS BEFORE ME HAVE HAD.

AND IF WE DON'T DO THINGS DIFFERENTLY, THAT'S SIMPLY NOT GOING TO BE THE REALITY FOR SO MANY PEOPLE.

AND I JUST FIND IT UNACCEPTABLE TO SAY, WELL, THEN THEY CAN LIVE IN FRISCO OR ALLEN UNTIL THEY CAN AFFORD TO MOVE TO DALLAS, BECAUSE THAT'S NOT SUSTAINABLE FOR OUR CITY.

AND THAT'S NOT THE ATTITUDE THAT LEADERS IN OUR CITY SHOULD HAVE OR WANT FOR OUR COMMUNITIES AND OUR CITIES.

YOU COMMISSIONER, COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT.

WELL, UH, COMMISSIONER HERBERT, UH, ACCEPT AN AMENDMENT TO YOUR, UH, MOTION.

UH, I WOULD LIKE TO PROPOSE THAT IN, IN THE, UH, SECOND TO THE LAST PARAGRAPH ON THE SECOND PAGE OF YOUR, UH, MOTION WHERE YOU SAY THESE CONSIDERATIONS INCLUDE, BUT ARE NOT LIMITED TO ENSURING THAT THE NEW HOUSING TYPES ARE SENSITIVE TO AND COMPATIBLE WITH THE EXISTING HOUSING IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD IN TERMS OF DESIGN AND LOCATION IN ADDRESSING

[01:35:01]

AND MITIGATING ANY ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS.

I WOULD LIKE TO, UH, INSERT WHERE IT SAYS, IN ADDRESSING, I WOULD LIKE TO CHANGE AND TO WHILE AND THEN SAY, ADDRESSING THE INFRASTRUCTURE NEEDS IN THE COMMUNITY AND, AND MITIGATING ANY ADVERSE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS.

WILL YOU, ARE YOU WILLING TO, UH, WOULD YOU, UH, ACCEPT MODIFYING AND ADDING THAT SHORT LITTLE, UH, CHANGE TO YOUR STATEMENT? YES.

COMMISSIONER FORSYTH.

I WILL.

AND I AGREED WITH THAT CHANGE.

JUST A SECOND.

EXCELLENT.

ANYONE IN THE BODY OBJECT FOR THE, UH, THE CHANGE IN THE LANGUAGE? COMMISSIONER FORSIGHT ADDITIONAL COMMENTS, SIR? I, I WOULD LIKE TO SAY I SUPPORT THIS MOTION HOWEVER, AND, AND I'M, AND I'M EXCITED TO SEE, YOU KNOW, THE, UH, THE CHANGE OF, UH, MULTIPLEX TO SECONDARY USE IN THE SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL AND THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPES.

I, I, I DO HAVE CONCERNS THOUGH REGARDING THE FACT THAT WE'VE ADDED COTTAGE COURTS AND TINY HOMES TO THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED, UH, LAND USE AND COTTAGE COURTS TO THE SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED LAND USE.

UH, HOW, AND I WOULD LIKE TO ASK THE CHAIRMAN HOW I CAN ADDRESS THAT.

UH, DO I ADDRESS THAT THROUGH A CHANGE OR, UH, UH, TO THIS OR WOULD THAT BE A SEPARATE AMENDMENT? IT WOULD BE A SEPARATE AMENDMENT.

WHICH YOU CAN ABSOLUTELY MAKE.

BUT, UH, AT THIS POINT WE'RE JUST, WE'RE JUST GONNA DISCUSS THIS, UM, WHAT COMMISSIONER HERBERT READ INTO THE RECORD CHANGING OF THE PLACE TYPE, AS WELL AS THE OTHER, UH, PIECES AS WELL AS THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT ADDED BY COMMISSIONER FORSIGHT, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON.

THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR.

UM, WHAT, I THINK THIS IS AN IMPORTANT FIRST STEP IN PROTECTING OUR EXISTING STABLE NEIGHBORHOODS, BUT THOSE THAT ARE ALSO AT RISK OR MOST LIKELY TO EXPERIENCE GENTRIFICATION.

I DON'T THINK THIS IS THE END, IN MY OPINION.

I THINK WE HAVE MUCH MORE LANGUAGE REVISIONS THAT I LOOK FORWARD TO THIS BODY DEBATING.

I THINK ONE THING THAT I DON'T SEE, I THINK THIS STARTS TO TALK ABOUT IT, IS NOT REPEATING ISSUES THAT WE HAVE SEEN IN OUR CITY.

THIS IS NOT THE FIRST TIME THAT OUR CITY HAS CONFRONTED WHAT IS TERM TO HOUSING CRISIS.

I LIVE IN A COMMUNITY THAT DIRECTLY EXPERIENCED THAT.

I BOUGHT MY FIRST HOME IN THE MUNGER PLACE, HISTORIC DISTRICT.

IT WAS 20 YEARS AFTER THAT ORDINANCE HAD BEEN PUT INTO PLACE.

IT WAS A SINGLE FAMILY HOUSE THAT WAS CONVERTED INTO A TRIPLEX WITH PLUMBING RUN ON THE EXTERIOR OF THE BUILDING.

I WOULD LIKE THIS BODY TO STOP AND THINK ABOUT THAT.

THERE'S NOTHING IN THIS PLAN.

THERE'S NOTHING IN OUR BUILDING CODE.

THERE IS NOTHING THAT PREVENTS THAT FROM HAPPENING IN THE FUTURE.

I REPRESENT NEIGHBORHOODS THAT ARE CLEARLY ESTABLISHED THAT HAVE MANY OF THE PROTECTIONS THAT WE SPEAK ABOUT.

I REPRESENT MANY OTHER COMMUNITIES THAT DO NOT.

THEY ARE DIRECTLY AT RISK FROM GENTRIFICATION, ONGOING AND IN THE FUTURE.

THOSE ARE THE COMMUNITIES THAT I AM MOST CONCERNED ABOUT.

WE HEARD MS. ROBERTS EARLIER TODAY, A COMMUNITY THAT HAS AN ESTABLISHED PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT, HAS A LAND USE MAP THAT WAS PUT INTO PLACE.

THEY ARE SEEING GENTRIFICATION ON A SCALE THAT MOST OF US CAN'T IMAGINE AND IS NOW BEING IDENTIFIED FOR FUTURE DENSITY CONTRARY TO THEIR ESTABLISHED PLAN DEVELOPMENT.

DISTRICT PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS AREN'T ADDRESSED IN THIS PLAN.

THAT IS ONE AMENDMENT THAT I HOPE THIS BODY WILL CONSIDER, BECAUSE IT IS CRITICAL TO ACKNOWLEDGING NOT JUST WHERE WE HAVE NSOS HISTORIC DISTRICTS OR CONSERVATION DISTRICTS, BUT THOSE THAT ALSO HAVE ESTABLISHED PLANS THAT ARE THE GUIDING DOCUMENTS THAT HAVE ALLOWED THOSE COMMUNITIES TO THRIVE AND ARE NOW SOME OF OUR MOST AT RISK FOR OUR NATURALLY AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I LOOK FORWARD TO CONTINUING THIS, BUT I APPRECIATE COMMISSIONER HERBERT AND THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS WHO PUT THE TIME IN WITH THIS FIRST AMENDMENT.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON COMMERS.

ANY OTHER DISCUSSION BEFORE WE GO TO SECOND ROUND? COMMISSIONER CARPENTER? I, I DO SUPPORT THE, UM, THE MOTION FOR WHAT WAS READ INTO THE RECORD AS A, AS A FIRST STEP.

UM, BUT ECHOING WHAT COMMISSIONER HAMPTON HAS SAID TO A, TO A LARGE DEGREE AND WOULD, UM, AND NOW THAT I KNOW WHAT THE FORMAT IS, I WILL COME, I WILL COME TO SUBSEQUENT MEETINGS WITH VERY SPECIFIC UH, WORDING CHANGES OF HUNDREDS OF THEM POSSIBLY.

UM, THE TENSION IN THIS DOCUMENT IS ADDING DENSITY AND PREVENTING

[01:40:01]

GENTRIFICATION, AND IT'S JUST LIKE ON THE LAST PARAGRAPH OF THE FIRST PAGE.

NUMBER TWO IS ENSURING THAT RESIDENTS OF ESTABLISHED NEIGHBORHOODS ARE NOT DISPLACED.

IT SEEMS TO ME THAT, I MEAN, IT JUST ALWAYS, THE THUMB COMES DOWN VERY HARD ON ADDING DENSITY, AND IT'S LIKE, OH, WELL, AND IT'LL BE NICE IF WE CAN PREVENT DISPLACEMENT.

THERE REALLY NEEDS TO BE VERY RIGOROUS, UM, PLANS LANGUAGE PUT INTO THIS DOCUMENT THAT ELEVATES THE IMPORTANCE OF, OF PREVENTING DISPLACEMENT.

UM, I'M VERY TROUBLED BY THE LANGUAGE IN SECTION, LET'S SEE, PAGE TWO DASH 10 UNDER HOUSING CHOICE.

WHY IS THIS IMPORTANT, NUMBER ONE, DECREASING STOCK OF NATURALLY OCCURRING AFFORDABLE HOUSING? I COULD, I COULD SUPPORT THAT UP TO THAT POINT, BUT THEN IT GOES ON TO SAY, PARTLY DUE TO POOR CONSERVATION OF OLDER HOUSING STOCK, NOW THE SUBJECT IS WORTHY OF, YOU KNOW, AN ESSAY.

BUT THAT'S NOT THE MAIN REASON WHY WE DON'T HAVE, UM, AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU GET TO NUMBER TWO, A LACK OF DIVERSE AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING OPTIONS CITYWIDE DUE TO ZONING AND LAND USE BARRIERS, THAT'S BASICALLY SAYING, IF WE HAD MORE DENSITY, WE'D HAVE MORE AFFORDABILITY, WE MIGHT HAVE MORE DIVERSITY, BUT WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE MORE AFFORD IT.

JUST THEY DON'T GO TOGETHER.

THEY REALLY DON'T.

AND NUMBER FOUR, DISPROPORTIONATE DISPLACEMENT IN LOW TO MODERATE INCOME AREAS DUE TO BURDENSOME DEVELOPMENT RESTRICTIONS.

ABSOLUTELY NOT THE CASE.

NOT THE CASE WHATSOEVER.

WE'RE GETTING DISPLACEMENT IN LOW TO MODERATE INCOME AREAS.

BE, UH, FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS.

ONE, THE WAY DEC A VALUES LAND, UM, YOU KNOW, RECENT STUDIES SAID DEC AD SYSTEMATICALLY OVERVALUE, UM, PROPERTY IN LOWER INCOME NEIGHBORHOODS, AND THEY UNDERESTIMATE IN, IN HIGHER INCOME NEIGHBORHOODS.

ANY NEW CONSTRUCTION THAT GOES ON IN A LOW TO MODERATE INCOME AREA RESETS THE LAND VALUES.

AND ADDING DENSITY TO THAT JUST DOES IT MORE AND MORE AND MORE AND MORE.

SO, YOU KNOW, I WILL BE COMING BACK AT A FUTURE MEETING WITH SOME SPECIFIC, YOU KNOW, LANGUAGE CHANGES, BUT I JUST GIVE THESE AS AN EXAMPLE OF, OF THE THUMB IS VERY FIRMLY ON THE SCALE IN THIS DOCUMENT OF, OF PUTTING MORE DENSITY INTO THESE NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND IT, AT BEST, IT GLOSSES OVER THE, THE DISPLACEMENT THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.

YOU KNOW, IT REFERENCES AN ANTI DISPLACEMENT CHECKLIST OR DOCUMENT THAT DOES NOT EXIST.

I MEAN, I'VE NEVER SEEN IT.

I'M TOLD THAT NO ONE HAS SEEN IT.

THERE MAY BE A DRAFT.

UM, YOU KNOW, WE JUST CAN'T RELY, I MEAN, AND I THINK EVEN IF IT'S, UM, DEVELOPED, IT'S GONNA BE LIKE A FAIRY, A FEATHER STANDING UP TO A BULLDOZER.

I MEAN, WE ARE REALLY GOING TO HAVE, I MEAN, UNFORTUNATELY THE NSO PROCESS IS SO TIME CONSUMING AND TAKES SO MUCH COMMUNITY AND STAFF TIME THAT, YOU KNOW, WE SAW IT HOW HAPPEN IN ELM THICKET.

I'M SEEING IT HAPPEN IN OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS.

BY THE TIME WE, WE CATCH UP WITH THE PROCESS AND GET SOMETHING IN PLACE, THE DISPLACEMENT HAS ALREADY OCCURRED.

IF WE DON'T DEVELOP, IF THIS DOCUMENT DOESN'T POINT OUT THE NECESSITY OF, OF RID, OF STRINGENT, I'LL SAY, DESIGN STANDARDS TO ACCOMPANY OR TO, TO, AS A PRECURSOR TO ANY SORT OF ENTITLEMENT TO ADD, UM, DENSITY, THEN WE'RE JUST THROWING A MATCH INTO DRY GRASS AS FAR AS DISPLACEMENT GOES.

COMMISSIONER WHEELER, UM, I THINK I'LL CONCUR WITH YOU ON SOME POINTS.

IT DEPENDS.

UM, I I, I, I DO KNOW IN OUR CASE, AND I CAN ONLY SPEAK TO OUR CASE, WHERE THERE IS A PLAN DEVELOPMENT THAT WAS PUT INTO PLACE TO STOP SOME BAD ACTORS AND, AND, UM, AS FAR AS BUSINESS IS, UH, THE TYPE OF HOUSING THAT WE WANTED.

BUT WHAT WE DID FIND WAS THERE WAS SOME BARRIERS FROM ZONING THAT DID NOT ALLOW FOR, DURING A TIME BEFORE COVID THAT DID NOT ALLOW SOME AFFORDABLE HOUSING TO BE BUILT IN PLACES THAT NOW IN AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS AT.

UM, IF THOSE ZONING, UM, DEVELOPERS RAN FROM THOSE, FROM THAT AREA BECAUSE OF ZONING, OUR PD HAD HAD ALL KIND OF RESTRICTIONS PURPOSELY DURING A TIME THAT IT NEEDED IT SO THAT WE WOULDN'T BE DISPLACED.

AND I BELIEVE THAT EVEN THOUGH, UM, OUR COMMUNITY IS SEEING SOME GROSSLY INCOMPATIBLE HOUSING IN CERTAIN AREAS, WE HAVE AREAS THAT HAS MAINTAINED THEIR AFFORDABILITY BECAUSE THE PD WAS READING IN A WAY, UM, THAT THAT COULD NOT HAPPEN.

UM, WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT ADDRESSING THE ZONING CHANGES AND, AND AREAS THAT NEED PD, UM, I HAVE CHOPPY, CHOPPY HAS BEEN FIGHTING FOR YEARS BECAUSE OF

[01:45:01]

ENVIRONMENTAL INJUSTICES, UM, HOUSING TYPES.

NO ONE EVER WHEN, WHEN SITTING DOWN, BECAUSE THEY ORIGINALLY JUST YELLED AT ME AND NEVER TALKED WITH ME.

BUT WHEN WE DID GET READY TO, WHEN WE DID SIT DOWN, NO ONE HAD EVER TOLD THEM ABOUT A PLAN DISTRICT.

NOBODY, THEY DIDN'T EVEN KNOW WHAT IT WAS.

AND I WAS SO CONFUSED BECAUSE A PLAN DISTRICT WOULD HAVE ALLOWED THEM 10, 15, 20 YEARS AGO TO, TO BE ABLE TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE NEEDS THAT WERE NEEDED IN AREAS.

AND OFTENTIMES, UM, THAT INFORMATION, UM, IS LEFT OUT OF COMMUNITIES THAT DO NOT UNDERSTAND ZONING.

THEY JUST UNDERSTAND THE BASIC NEEDS, BUT NOT THE LANGUAGE OR THE TOOLS THAT NEEDS TO BE PUT IN PLACE.

WHEN I EXPLAINED TO JAPI, WHY HADN'T YOU ALL HAD PLANNED DISTRICTS, AND THEY HAD WORKED WITH PEOPLE WHO CAME INTO THE COMMUNITY THAT WERE A ICP, UM, CERTIFIED PLANNERS.

THEY HAD WORKED WITH CITY STAFF, ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE AGENCY.

THEY HAD WORKED WITH ALL THESE DIFFERENT PEOPLE WHO HAD NEVER SAID, YOU NEED A PLAN DISTRICT.

YOU NEED TO PLAN YOUR COMMUNITY.

AND WHEN I, AND THIS WAS A COUPLE OF MONTHS AGO, ABOUT THREE MONTHS AGO, I IMMEDIATELY WENT TO PUD AND SAID, JO NEEDS A PLAN.

DISTRICT THREE 10 NEEDS A PLAN DISTRICT.

THESE PLACES IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR, UM, DO NOT HAVE PLANNED DISTRICT.

THANK GOD FOR, FOR COUNCILMAN, UM, FORMER COUNCILMAN, UM, UH, DIANE RAGSDALE AND, AND LEO CHENEY.

AND THOSE WHO SAW THAT KNEW THE LANGUAGE.

WE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT, WHAT THEY WERE DOING.

WE, WE DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THE REASON THAT THESE THINGS HAD BEEN PUT IN PLACE.

BUT THANK GOD THAT THEY DID, BECAUSE SOUTH DALLAS WOULD HAVE BEEN LIKE WEST DALLAS GENTRIFIED BEFORE THEY COULD EVER GET A PLAN.

AND SO WHAT WE DO HAVE RESTRICTIONS, THE ZONING MATTERS.

UM, IT, IT, IT MATTERS ON THE HOUSING, IT MATTERS ON, UM, THERE'S A DEVELOPER, NOT A DEVELOPER PERSON THAT BUY PROPERTIES.

JUST SO HAPPENED.

HE LIVES IN THE CAAR, BUT HE'S TOTALLY ENGAGED IN OUR COMMUNITY.

AND HE SAID, I WANNA TURN IT, I WANTED TO GO BACK.

I DIDN'T KNOW THAT THERE WERE APARTMENTS ABOVE A BUILDING THAT I HAVE WENT TO SINCE PROBABLY BEFORE I WAS SUPPOSED TO GO TO THE BUILDING.

UM, BUT WHEN I ASKED MY MOTHER, SHE SAID, OH, YEAH, THERE WAS APARTMENTS THERE.

I WAS LIKE, SERIOUSLY? AND THEY COULD NOT REPLACE HIM.

AND HE WAS LIKE, IT'LL BE FUN.

I SAID, WELL, WHY DON'T YOU APPLY? SO I THINK IN, IN, IT DEPENDS ON WHERE THE ZONING IS AT.

UM, NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION OVERLAYS, MOST COMMUNITIES DIDN'T KNOW IT.

QUEEN CITY DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT.

AND THEY HAVE FACED THE MOST AMOUNT OF GROSSLY INCOMPATIBLE HOUSING IN MY COMMUNITY.

UM, AND NOW THAT WE HAVE SOME THINGS IN PLACE, SO I I, I DO BELIEVE THAT WE DO NEED TO, TO THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX.

WE NEED PLANNERS WHO ARE ENGAGED IN THE COMMUNITY.

WE NEED OUR COMMISSIONERS SOMETIME.

WE GOTTA, WE HAVE TO VISIT COMMUNITIES.

WE HAVE TO GO, WE HAVE TO GO ACROSS LINES BECAUSE WE HAVE GREAT, UM, HISTORICAL BUILDINGS OR LEGACY BUILDINGS IN EVERY COMMUNITY THROUGHOUT DALLAS THAT ARE BEING LOST BECAUSE OF THESE DESIGN STANDARDS.

NOT COMMUNITIES, NOT BEING EDUCATED AND DON'T HAVE THE TIME TO BE EDUCATED.

AGAIN, I TELL YOU ALL A HUNDRED TIMES, I, I BRAG BECAUSE FOR ME, THAT'S A GREAT FEAT.

I'M 47 AND I'M IN SCHOOL FOR URBAN PLANNING.

THAT IS SOMETHING IF I WOULD'VE KNEW AS MUCH AS WHEN I LEARNED ZONING, I LOVE IT.

I CAN TALK ABOUT IT FOR HOURS.

IF I HAVE KNEW THAT AT 20, I COULD HAVE BEEN IN MY COMMUNITY MAKING GREAT CHANGES, RIGHT? SO, UM, SOME OF THOSE THINGS THAT WE NEED TO ADDRESS.

BUT IN OUR COMMUNITY, I CAN'T SPEAK OF EVERYONE ELSE.

I DO DRIVE THE WHOLE CITY.

I LIVED A LITTLE BIT IN EVERY RUN CITY.

WE HAVE ZONING LAWS THAT HAVE REALLY HELD BACK OUR GROWTH.

WE HAVE ZONING LAWS THAT IN OTHER PEOPLE WHO WANNA OPEN BUSINESSES IN SOUTH DALLAS CAN'T BECAUSE OF ZONING, THE ZONING ISSUES.

WHEN WE WENT AND LOOKED AT THE, AT OUR ZONING ISSUES, THE FIRST THING I EVER DID IN MY LIFE WAS I WAS A BEAUTICIAN.

BUT THERE'S A BEAUTY SHOP ON EVERY CORNER IN EVERY NEIGHBORHOOD IN URBAN NEIGHBORHOOD IN THE CITY OF DALLAS.

I MEAN, THAT'S CITY OF DALLAS IN THE UNITED STATES.

I KNOW THIS FOR A FACT.

I'VE TRAVELED EVERY, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU'RE ENTERING AND WHAT WE CALL THE HOOD BECAUSE THERE'S A BEAUTY SHOP, A BARBERSHOP, A CONVENIENCE STORE, A SO MANY DIFFERENT TYPES OF BUSINESS, A CHECK CASH IN PLACE, A ALL THESE DIFFERENT TYPES OF BUSINESSES THAT ARE MORE HARM THAT, THAT, THAT DOES NOT ADD TO DIVERSITY BECAUSE OF THE ZONING.

UM, PD 5 95 SAYS, CATERING SERVICE NEEDS A SUP.

I HAVE COUSINS WHO HAVE LEFT CORPORATE AMERICA.

THEY, THEY'RE CATERERS.

THEIR BUSINESS IS NOT NEXT DOOR TO THEIR HOUSE, THEIR BUSINESSES ACROSS TOWN BECAUSE OF ZONING.

AND THAT ZONING LEADS TO AFFORDABILITY ISSUES BECAUSE NOW SHE PAYS MORE IN RENT FOR A PLACE ON OUTSIDE OF SOUTH DALLAS.

SHE GETS LESS TIME WITH HER CHILDREN.

SHE LEFT CORPORATE

[01:50:01]

AMERICA SO THAT SHE CAN BE WITH HER CHILDREN BECAUSE THERE'S HOUSING TYPES ALONG MAJOR CORRIDORS THAT WOULD BE ALLOWED EVERYWHERE ELSE.

SHE COULD POSSIBLY OWN A BUILDING AND BUILD A HOUSE OR BUILD HER HOUSING ON TOP OF HER BUILDING.

THAT'S NOT ALLOWED IN OUR CORRIDORS.

AND SO I THINK THAT ZONING PLAYS A MAJOR DIS, UH, A MAJOR ISSUE.

I BELIEVE THAT THE EDUC, UM, SOME SOLUTIONS THAT WE DO HAVE WITH THE CITY OF DALLAS IS NOT OFFERED READILY TO COMMUNITIES IN URBAN NEIGHBORHOODS THAT WOULD BE OFFERED IN OTHER NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND OFTEN BECAUSE THEY'RE ALREADY EDUCATED ON THOSE THINGS.

UM, AGAIN, I CAN'T SAY JOCKY WAS JUST SURPRISED WHEN I SAID PLAN DISTRICT.

TO ME, IT WAS A SOLUTION THAT WAS A NO BRAINER.

THAT SAID, IF YOU GET THIS, THEN YOU GET TO MAKE CHOICES AS A COMMUNITY.

AND YOU ALL HAVE BEEN YELLING AND SCREAMING FROM THE TOP OF YOUR LUNGS FOR YEARS ABOUT WHAT YOU NEED.

AND A PLAN DISTRICT WOULD'VE BEEN SIMPLY ABLE TO GET YOU THAT, AND IT COULD HAVE BEEN INITIATED BY STAFF.

UM, AND SO I THINK, UM, WHAT IS GOOD ON ONE SIDE OF THE FENCE IS NOT OFFERED READILY ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FENCE.

AND THAT'S THE MAJOR ISSUE THAT WE ARE HAVING.

THAT'S WHY THE COMMUNITIES ARE STAYING THE SAME.

AND THE ONLY TIME THAT CHANGES ARE COMING IS WHEN SOMEONE WITH THE FINANCIAL BACKING COMES IN AND APPLIES FOR A ZONING CHANGE AND THEY GET WHAT THEY GET WHEN IT COULD HAVE BEEN APPLIED FROM THE CITY.

AND I THINK THE CITY, UH, STAFF AS OF RECENT, I THINK THEY'RE DOING A BETTER JOB.

BUT IN OF ALL, THEY DID NOT, THEY DID NOT COME INTO THESE COMMUNITIES AND OFFER SOLUTIONS THAT WOULD NOT COST OF COMMUNITY FINANCIALLY, THAT IT WOULD'VE BEEN ON THE CITY BACK.

THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS? OKAY.

SEEING NONE.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.

ANY OPPOSED? MOTION OPPOSED AMENDMENT INCLUDING THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT? YES.

NOT THAT, NOT THAT'S A, THAT'S GONNA BE A SEPARATE MOTION.

SO NO OPPOSITION.

I BELIEVE THERE WAS NO OPPOSITION UNANIMOUS VOTE.

UH, COMMISSIONERS, WHY DON'T WE JUST GO AHEAD AND TAKE THESE ITEMS ONE AT A TIME.

UH, WE CAN DISCUSSION, DISCUSS THEM BOTH ON THEM, AND THEN ALSO WE HAVE TIME TO MAKE ANY OTHER AMENDMENTS THAT, UH, YOU FEEL UNNECESSARY AT THIS TIME.

AND AGAIN, THE PROCESS DOESN'T END TODAY.

WE HAVE TIME TO MAKE ADDITIONAL, UH, AMENDMENTS TO THE DOCUMENT.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, UH, WHERE IS, LET'S, LET'S TAKE A 10 MINUTE BREAK.

I THINK SOME OF US, UH, HAVE, WE'LL GET MORE COPIES OF THIS 10, 10 MINUTE BREAK.

MR. CHAIR, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, PLEASE.

COMMISSIONERS, WE ALL RECORDING? 11:59 AM WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD.

I THINK WE ALL RECEIVED COPIES OF THE DRAFT NUMBER FOUR HIGHLIGHTS.

WE CAN TAKE THEM ALL ONE AT A TIME.

WE'LL NEED MOTIONS TO ADD THEM AND AMEND THE DOCUMENT.

YOU OKAY? OKAY.

LET'S GO TO ITEM NUMBER ONE, ADD OVERVIEW, AND THE PURPOSE LANGUAGE.

ELABORATING IN RELATIONSHIP TO HISTORIC DISTRICT NSOS AND CONSERVATION DISTRICTS ON PAGES ONE SIXTH AND ONE SEVENTH.

UM, REGARDING THE LANGUAGE ON ONE SIXTH MM-HMM.

, UH, RELATIONSHIP TO HISTORIC DISTRICTS.

IT'S THE FIFTH PARAGRAPH I WOULD SUGGEST THAT WE ADD AFTER NSOS ESTABLISHED PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS SO THAT THE REVISED LANGUAGE WOULD READ HISTORIC DISTRICTS, HDS, CONSERVATION DISTRICT CDS, NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION, OVERLAYS, NSOS, AND ESTABLISHED PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS AND OTHER NEIGHBORHOOD LED EFFORTS.

RESPECT, AND THEN GO ONWARD.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER HAMPTON.

UH, LET ME GET THAT.

IS THAT A MOTION? YES.

1 93 TO, UM, PLU PD 99 GASTON AVENUE, WHICH IS A SPINE THAT CONNECTS FOUR OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICTS IN OLD EAST DALLAS.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER HAMPTON FOR A MOTION TO AMEND THE AMENDMENT.

AND COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, FOR YOUR SECOND, LET'S DISCUSS THAT.

VICE CHAIR RUBIN, UH, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON.

DID YOU? WELL, I THINK JUST AS WE'VE HEARD, WE HAVE A NUMBER OF ESTABLISHED PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS THAT ARE STILL WIDELY UTILIZED, RELIED UPON, UM, BY THE VARIOUS COMMUNITIES THROUGHOUT OUR CITY.

AND I THINK HAVING THOSE REFERENCED, I WAS PARTICULARLY CONCERNED THAT WHEN WE GO ON TO THE NEXT, UM, PARAGRAPH WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT RELATIONSHIPS TO OTHER PLANS, I THINK THE INTENT WAS TO REFLECT THAT THERE ARE SOME PDS THAT ARE NO LONGER NEEDED, MAYBE IN CONFLICT, UM, WITH CURRENT POLICY, AND THAT IT'S APPROPRIATE THAT THOSE PERHAPS ARE NOT CARRIED FORWARD.

HOWEVER, THERE'S MANY OTHER CASES WHERE THOSE PDS ARE RELEVANT AND IMPORTANT WITHIN THEIR COMMUNITIES.

UM, YOU KNOW, FROM PD

[01:55:01]

I THINK ALL OF THOSE ARE STILL VERY MUCH RELEVANT.

AND I THINK REFLECTING THOSE IN THIS DOCUMENT IS IMPORTANT.

WELL, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, PLEASE.

COMMISSIONER HEMP.

AND MR. RUBIN, DID YOU WANNA GO COMMISSIONER CASE THEN BEFORE, SINCE YOU KNOW MR. RUBIN? I, I LIKE THE INTENT OF THIS AMENDMENT, BUT I THINK IT COULD PROBABLY USE JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE.

UM, IN MY VIEW, IT PAINTS WITH A LITTLE BIT OF A BROAD BRUSH HERE AND JUST SIMPLY, UM, ADDING THE WORD IN PDS RIGHT AFTER NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION OVERLAYS.

AND I THINK THIS CAME UP AT A PRIOR CLAN COMMISSION HEARING WHERE WE HAVE SEEN PDS THAT ARE REALLY GOOD AND REALLY IMPORTANT FOR NEIGHBORHOODS.

WE'VE ALSO SEEN AT THE OTHER END OF THE SPECTRUM, YOU KNOW, PDS THAT, THAT WHERE SOME PAID CONSULTANT COMES IN AND ROS 'EM THROUGH, AND THEY DON'T REPRESENT GOOD PLANNING EFFORTS, EQUITABLE PLANNING EFFORTS, THOUGHTFUL PLANNING EFFORTS, WHETHER THEY'RE RESIDENTIAL OR, UM, YOU KNOW, PARTICULARLY OTHER NON-RESIDENTIAL USES.

SO I WAS WONDERING IF COMMISSIONER HAMPTON WOULD, UM, ACCEPT A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT THAT, UM, IN FRONT OF THE WORD PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS ADDS THE WORD EQUITABLE NEIGHBORHOOD LED PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS.

SO WILL, I ACTUALLY, I SAID ESTABLISHED PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS AND THERE IS STILL LANGUAGE THAT IS WITHIN THE, AND, AND I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH YOU, COMMISSIONER RUBIN.

I THINK ON THE NEXT PARAGRAPH ON ONE SEVEN, WELL, FURTHER ON EX IT SAYS PLAN, SORRY, I'M MISSING IT.

IT'S ESSENTIALLY WHERE, UM, POLICIES, THIS PLAN SUPERSEDES ANY POLICIES IN CONFLICT WITH THOSE IN PREVIOUSLY ADOPTED PLANS.

SO THAT'S ON ONE SEVEN, FIRST PARAGRAPH, WHICH I THINK SPEAKS DIRECTLY TO THE IDEA THAT THERE ARE PLAN DEVELOPMENTS THAT ARE NO LONGER APPROPRIATE AND WILL BE IN CONFLICT WITH BOTH THE LANGUAGE OF THIS PLAN AS WELL AS THE, UM, MAP.

I MEAN, I'M NOT, I I HAVE NO OBJECTION TO, TO REVIEWING THAT LANGUAGE AND I'M JUST QUESTIONING THAT WE'RE GONNA HIT THE INTENT OF IT.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, PLEASE.

AND I SEE THE RELATIONSHIP TO OTHER PLANS IS, IS ADDRESSING PLANS AS OPPOSED TO THINGS THAT ARE IN THE ZONING CODE, LIKE CHAPTER 51 P, LIKE PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT.

SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT AS WE INCORPORATE THIS LANGUAGE, IT, SINCE WE HAVE A SEPARATE PARAGRAPH OR SUBSECTION ADDRESSING THINGS THAT ARE ACTUALLY IN OUR ZONING CODE, THAT WE ALSO, WHEN WE ADDRESS PDS THERE, BECAUSE THE WORD PD DOESN'T APPEAR IN THE FOLLOWING SECTION, TALKING ABOUT PLANS, IT TALKS ABOUT PLANS NOT PDS.

SO JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE GET THE LANGUAGE RIGHT ON PDS IN THIS RELATIONSHIP TO HISTORIC DISTRICTS, CONSERVATION DISTRICTS.

AND NSOS.

YEAH, UH, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT IN THE CONTEXT OF THIS PARAGRAPH, PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS IS PRETTY CLEARLY NEIGHBORHOOD PDS.

I MEAN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HISTORIC DISTRICTS, CONSERVATION DISTRICTS, NSOS AND OTHER NEIGHBORHOOD LED EFFORTS, PUTTING PDS IN THERE.

UM, IN THE LANGUAGE OF THAT PARAGRAPH SEEMS PRETTY OBVIOUSLY NEIGHBORHOOD PDS, UH, UM, I DON'T, I I DON'T SHARE COMMISSIONER RUBIN'S CONCERN THAT THAT'S GONNA BE TAKEN OUTTA CONTEXT OR MISREAD.

AND GIVEN THE NATURE OF THE, THIS TYPE OF DOCUMENT, EVEN IF IT IS MISCONSTRUED BY SOMEBODY, IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S NOT GONNA BE, YOU KNOW, OUTCOME DETERMINATIVE OF WHAT THE BODY DOES WITH IT.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, I HAVE A, A SUGGESTED TWEAK, WHICH WOULD BE TO SAY, UM, THE HISTORIC DISTRICT'S CONSERVATION NSOS AND OTHER NEIGHBORHOOD LED EFFORTS, INCLUDING PDS REFLECT THOUGHTFUL CONSIDERATIONS.

WOULD THAT BARK BETTER? THANK COMMISSIONER HAMPTON.

YOU OKAY WITH THAT AMENDMENT? YEAH, I THINK THAT MAKES SENSE, MR. KINGSTON.

IT ADDRESSES THE CONCERN RAISED BY COMMISSIONER RUBIN, VICE CHAIR RUBIN.

EXCELLENT.

AND, UH, COMMISSIONER KINGSTON IS OKAY WITH THAT.

ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? OKAY, SEE NONE.

ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

ANY OPPOSED? AYE.

HAVE IT.

LET'S GO TO NUMBER TWO, ADDED HISTORICAL

[02:00:01]

CO.

UH, MR. CHAIR PLEASE.

I HAVE ONE OTHER.

UM, ADDITION ON THIS PAGE UNDER RELATIONSHIP TO ZONING, UM, WE ALREADY QUOTE THE, UM, ON PAGE ONE SIX, UNDER RELATIONSHIP TO ZONING.

WE ALREADY QUOTE THE CITY ORDINANCE ADDRESSING THE, UM, RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE COMP PLAN AND ZONING AND DEVELOPMENT.

I'D ALSO LIKE TO, UH, PROPOSE THAT WE ALSO QUOTE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE SECTION 2 1 3 0.002 C, WHICH READS A MUNICIPALITY MAY DEFINE IN ITS CHARTER OR BY ORDINANCE, THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS AND MAY PROVIDE STANDARDS FOR DETERMINING THE CONSISTENCY REQUIRED BETWEEN A PLAN AND DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS.

SO THAT THIS QUESTION THAT WOULD BE UNDER THE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE, THAT'S THE LANGUAGE OF TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE SECTION 2 1 3 0.002 C.

DO THAT AGAIN? YES.

UM, ADD, IT'S ADD LANGUAGE QUOTING TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE TWO 13.002 C, WHICH READS A MUNICIPALITY MAY DEFINE IN ITS CHARTER OR BY ORDINANCE, THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS AND MAY PROVIDE STANDARDS FOR DETERMINING THE CONSISTENCY REQUIRED BETWEEN A PLAN AND THE DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS.

AND THAT COMES BEFORE THE CITY ORDINANCE, THE ORDINANCE LANGUAGE FROM OUR CITY, CITY CODE UNDER THE RELATIONSHIP TO ZONING PORTION UNDER ON PAGE ONE DASH SIX.

ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? COMMISSIONERS? OKAY.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR MOTION, VICE RUBIN AND COMMISSIONER BLAIR FOR A SECOND AT DISCUSSION.

AND THAT I KNOW THERE'S BEEN SOME CONFUSION ABOUT CONFUSION, UM, ABOUT, UH, IN SOME OF THE DISCUSSION ABOUT FORWARD DALLAS, ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE PLAN AND OUR DEVELOPMENT REGULATIONS AND ZONING.

AND I THINK THIS PROVISION OF THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE IS REALLY IMPORTANT TO INCLUDE IN ADDITION TO, UM, THE, THE, UM, LANGUAGE OF OUR CITY CODE AS WELL, WHICH MAKES CLEAR THAT THESE ARE GOT, THAT THE COMP PLANNER GUIDELINES AND NOT BINDING, WE CAN CONSIDER OTHER THINGS IN ADDITION TO OUR, UM, OUR, OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN BETWEEN THE, UM, LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE LANGUAGE AND THE LANGUAGE THAT WE'VE USED IN OUR CITY CODE TO, UM, GIVE EFFECT TO THAT LANGUAGE FROM LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE.

SEE? ALL, ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.

ANY OPPOSED? AYES HABIT.

ANY OTHER AMENDMENTS? COMMISSIONERS IN ITEM NUMBER ONE? OKAY.

WE'LL GO TO ITEM NUMBER TWO.

ADDED HISTORICAL CONTEXT AND TRENDS LANGUAGE.

1 8, 1 8, 1 8 AND ONE NINE.

YOU WANNA GET ANY OF THOSE INTO THE RECORD? COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, NOT .

UH, COMMISSIONERS, I'LL NEED A MOTION TO, UH, AMEND THE DOCUMENT PER THIS DOCUMENT.

COMMISSIONER BLAIR, THANK YOU FOR YOUR MOTION AND VICE CHAIR, RUBEN, FOR YOUR SECOND.

ANY DISCUSSION POINT OF CLARIFICATION? YES.

IF, IF WE DO HAVE COMMENTS, WE COULD BRING THOSE BACK AT A LATER DATE.

ABSOLUTELY.

IT'S DENSE AND I THINK I AM GONNA HAVE COMMENTS.

IT IS, I'M NOT READY WITH LANGUAGE TODAY.

THAT'S WHY, YOU KNOW, THESE ARE, THESE ARE THE EIGHT ITEMS OR SO THAT WE KIND OF GOT A CONSENSUS ON THE LAST TIME, BUT KNOWING FULL WELL THAT ONCE WE SEE THOSE WORDS ON THE DOCUMENT, WE MAY WANT TO TWEAK 'EM A BIT.

UH, YES, PLEASE.

UM, ANDREA GALE'S PLANNING IN URBAN DESIGN.

I JUST WANNA TAKE THIS OPPORTUNITY, SINCE SEVERAL OF YOU NOW MENTIONED THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO BRING FORWARD SOME EDITS.

I WOULD VERY MUCH ASK THAT AT THE NEXT MEETING OR UPCOMING MEETING OR BEFORE THE MEETING, THAT YOU HAVE THAT LANGUAGE FLESHED OUT.

SO IN THE WAY THAT, YOU KNOW, COMMISSIONER HERBERT HAD READ INTO THE RECORD SO THAT WE CAN HAVE THAT ALL PIECED TOGETHER SO THAT WE CAN, EVERYONE CAN SEE IT BEFOREHAND.

IT IN REAL TIME AS WE'RE DEBATING IT.

AND POINT OF CLARIFICATION, IS IT, UM, ACCEPTABLE IF WE DO SIMILAR? AND I APPRECIATE COMMISSIONER HERBERT SENDING THAT, SEND A WRITTEN DRAFT FORM.

UM, RISK SKILL IS TO YOURSELF, MR. GU, COPY OF THE CHAIR, AND THEN WE CAN CIRCULATE SO THAT EVERYONE CAN LOOK AT

[02:05:01]

YES, PLEASE.

AND, AND JUST SUBSTANTIVE CHANGES, WE DON'T, IF YOU WANNA JUST SEND US SORT OF EDITS LIKE CAPITALIZATIONS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, WE'RE HAPPY TO MAKE THOSE CHANGES.

I WOULD CERTAINLY APPRECIATE THAT.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON IS UN UNLIKE, UH, OUR VERY TALENTED ATTORNEY FRIENDS.

I, I NEED TO ACTUALLY READ THINGS AND THINK ABOUT IT.

AND, AND SO THE, THE IMPROVISATIONAL READING FOR ME, I NEED TO, IT DOESN'T WORK.

I HAD TO, SO I WOULD APPRECIATE, UH, RECEIVING EVERYTHING IN ADVANCE, LIKE COMMISSIONER HERBERT SENT THAT OUT.

UM, SO WE DO HAVE A MOTION ON THE TABLE.

AGAIN, WE CAN COME BACK AND REVISIT THIS IF THERE ARE ANY OTHER ADJUSTMENTS.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.

A THE OPPOSED AYES HAVE IT.

GO TO NUMBER THREE, UPDATE THE CURRENT CONDITIONS AND EQUITY CONNECTIONS FOR THEMES ON TWO FOUR AND TWO 17.

SO ONE QUESTION ON THOSE, AND I WILL JUST SAY IN COMPARING THE CURRENT DRAFT TO THE PRIOR, THERE'S, UM, FORMATTING CHANGES THAT I WAS HAVING, DIFFICULTY I ALIGNING THE, NOT THAT, AGAIN, MOST I UNDERSTAND, I THINK WHY SOME OF IT'S DONE, BUT I THINK I'M GONNA HAVE A DIFFICULT TIME GETTING THROUGH ALL OF THOSE TODAY.

IS IT POSSIBLE THAT WE DEFER THIS ONE, WHICH I THINK IS A PRETTY, ONE OF OUR MORE SUBSTANTIVE ITEMS UNTIL OUR NEXT MEETING? AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT NEEDS TO BE A MOTION.

I DON'T THINK IT NEEDS TO BE A MOTION.

NO, AND THANK YOU.

I'M HAPPY TO DO THAT.

WELL, I WOULD APPRECIATE MY COMMISSIONER SUPPORTING THAT.

LIKE I SAID, THIS ONE WAS JUST VERY DENSE.

IT IS COMPLICATED.

OKAY, THEN LET'S GO TO NUMBER FOUR, MR. CHAIR, TABLE NUMBER THREE.

IF, SO, THE WAY I UNDERSTOOD VICE CHAIR RUBIN'S OR ORIGINAL MOTION WAS TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL BASED ON WHAT WAS PRESENTED THAT INCLUDED ALL THE UPDATED PINK LANGUAGE.

SO I, I GUESS IN SHORT, I THINK WE'VE ALREADY DONE THIS.

UM, SO WE DON'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH EACH TOPIC AND SAY, YOU KNOW, ARE THERE ANY, IF YOU WANNA MAKE CHANGES, WE WOULD HAVE TO OBVIOUSLY DO THAT.

BUT IF IT'S JUST TO APPROVE THE PINK LANGUAGE, I DON'T THINK THAT THE BODY NEEDS TO DO THAT, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.

I UNDERSTAND THAT.

NO, SORRY.

SO AS I, AND MAYBE I MIGHT BE THE ONLY ONE CONFUSED, BUT FOR EXAMPLE, THE, WE LOOKED AT ITEM NUMBER TWO, THE A ADDED A HISTORICAL CONTEXT AND TRENDS LANGUAGE, AND IT'S ALL PINK, WHICH MEANS IT WAS AN U WAS UPDATED LANGUAGE FROM THE, FROM THIS DRAFT COMPARED TO THE MOST RECENT ONE.

AND I I, IT SOUNDED LIKE THE BODY JUST TRIED TO AMEND, ADOPT THIS PINK LANGUAGE.

AND WHAT I'M SAYING IS I UNDERSTOOD VICE CHAIR RUBIN'S ORIGINAL MOTION WAS INCLUDED ALL OF THIS LANGUAGE.

SO IF YOU WANT TO, AND I SEE COMMISSIONER KINGSTON SAYING NO.

SO IF THAT'S NOT HOW VICE CHAIR RUBIN'S OR ORIGINAL MOTION WAS UNDERSTOOD BY THE BODY, I WILL DEFER.

I KNOW WHERE YOU'RE GOING.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, PLEASE GO AHEAD.

IF THAT WAS HIS MOTION, I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND IT AND I WOULD LIKE TO, YEAH, I I THINK WE JUST TAKE HIM ONE AT A TIME AND YEAH, JUST TAKE IT SLOWLY.

THAT, THAT WORK? YEAH.

COMMISSIONER WHEELER, PLEASE.

UM, AND AGAIN, JUST LIKE ON ITEM NUMBER THREE, SOME OF THESE CHANGES ARE, UH, ARE COMPLICATED AND SO HAPPY TO TABLE THOSE NUMBER FOUR.

ARE WE, ARE WE ON NUMBER FOUR? YES.

ADDED, OKAY.

ADDED EMPHASIS ON TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENTS.

TWO SIX AND TWO NINE.

HOW ARE WE FEELING ABOUT THAT? I HAVE NO CHANGES TODAY.

YOU HAVE NO CHANGES.

ANYONE HAVE ANY CHANGES OR DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THAT TODAY? COMMISSIONER HERBERT? MY APOLOGIES.

YES, I AM.

I HAD TIME TO REVIEW THE TOD ESPECIALLY BECAUSE IT WAS A HUGE ASPECT FOR MY COMMUNITY, AND I'M WILLING TO MAKE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE CHANGES TO YOU.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER HERBERT FOR YOUR MOTION.

SECONDED BY VICE CHAIR RUBIN.

DISCUSSION.

I THINK THAT WHEN WE, WE, UM, I WANNA ASK THE QUESTION, UM, WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT INCREASING, UH, LAND USE MIX WITHIN THE TLD CENTERS, UM, I, UM, I WOULD WANT, UH, I GUESS IN SOME TYPE OF LANGUAGE BECAUSE IT WOULD BE MIXED USE.

UM, COMMISSIONER SCHOCK, GLASS, GLASS, UH, ZONING, UH, LAST HEARING, UM, PUT

[02:10:01]

SOME LANGUAGE IN TO A, A DEVELOPMENT THAT WERE, IT WOULD NOT, UM, BE A BURDEN ON A DEVELOPER THAT, WHERE THERE CAN BE THE SHARED WORKSPACE, BUT IT WOULD, UM, UNTIL A DEVELOPMENT GETS TO A CERTAIN AREA.

IS THAT CONSIDERED, I, I'M NOT FOR SURE.

COMMISSIONER SHAR, I .

UM, CAN YOU KIND OF COMMENT ON THAT? BECAUSE I THINK THAT, THAT, THAT WOULD MAKE A, A, A TOTAL, WELL, WE DON'T KNOW, DEVELOP A, A DEVELOPER IN THE BEGINNING, WHICH WOULD LEAD THEM TO HAVE SOME ALTERNATIVE HOUSING, UM, AND COMMERCIAL TYPES MIXED IN.

SO YOU'RE ASKING HOW WE CAN WORK SIMILAR CONCEPTS INTO TODS? YES.

BECAUSE MOST OF THOSE WOULD BE, UM, THAT TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT THAT YOU, THAT YOU CAN, THAT YOU UNIQUE SPEND THAT YOU GAVE US LAST TIME THAT WE, I MEAN, I DEFINITELY HAVE SUGGESTIONS.

I WOULD NEED SOME TIME TO CRAFT A LANGUAGE ON IT IF WE WANTED TO HOLD IT, OR I MAY HAVE BEEN MORE THAN WILLING TO OFFER UP SOME STUFF.

UM, I DON'T REMEMBER EXACTLY.

I DON'T KNOW IF, UH, UM, ANDREA WAS HERE LAST TIME, UH, OR PATRICK, WHEN KIND OF, CAN YOU GIVE A REFERENCE TO THAT LANG KIND OF THE LANGUAGE YOU DID? IT WAS CONCERNING THE SHARED WORK ON ONE SIDE.

UM, UNTIL DEVELOPMENT GETS TO THAT POINT BECAUSE YOU HAVE A DISTRICT THAT HAS A LOT OF, OF, UH, MIXED USE AND SOME OF THE RETAIL ON GROUND AND, AND, AND IT'S SUFFERING WHERE IT DOESN'T HAVE, UM, TENANTS YET.

SO THE CONCEPT WAS IF THE GOLD STANDARD IS TO HAVE STREET ACTIVATING USES IN MIXED USE PROJECTS, BUT THE CURRENT MARKET CONDITIONS DON'T MAKE THAT POSSIBLE, HOW CAN YOU STILL NOT INHIBIT DEVELOPMENT? MEANING PROMOTE DEVELOPMENT TODAY IN 20 24, 25, UM, BUT DO IT IN SUCH A WAY WHERE AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE THOSE SPACES COULD THEN ADAPT AND MORPH TO A HEAVIER COMMERCIAL USE.

ONE OF THE CORE WAYS THAT YOU CAN DO THAT IS MAKING SURE THAT THE BUILDING SHELL, UM, IS SORT OF COMMERCIAL READY AT A FUTURE DATE.

AND ONE OF THE CURRENT USES THAT CAN STRADDLE BOTH WORLDS IS A LIVE WORK CONCEPT.

SO YOU'RE HAVING A STREET LEVEL RESIDENTIAL THAT MAY HAVE SOME STREET ACTIVATING COMPONENT TO IT.

THE OTHER CONCEPT THAT WOULD GO ALONG WITH THAT IS MAKING SURE THAT YOU HAVE GROUND FLOOR ACCESS TO THE UNITS AS OPPOSED TO ONE ENTRANCE.

AND THEN ACCESSING THOSE, THOSE, UH, LIVE WORKSPACES FROM SAY, A CENTRAL CORRIDOR INTERIOR TO THE BUILDING.

YOU REALLY WANNA MAKE SURE THOSE ENTRANCE EGRESSES OUT ONTO THE STREET.

SO THOSE WERE TWO OF THE CORE CONCEPTS THAT WE, WE, UH, USED IN THAT IN ZONING CASE.

SO I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT, THAT THAT WAS SAID BY YOU, UM, THAT THAT, THAT THIS CAN BE INCLUDED IN THIS BECAUSE, UM, WE ARE WORKING ON OUR AREA PLAN RIGHT NOW, AND I DON'T BELIEVE THAT PATRICK OR ANDREA WAS HERE AND BEING ABLE TO HAVE THIS KIND OF IN THAT WRITING, UM, WOULD REALLY PLAY A KEY ON ATTRACTING DEVELOPERS THAT WHO, OO OTHERWISE WOULD NOT WANNA DO A MIXED USE COMMUNITY.

EVEN IF IT'S CLOSE TO A TOD BECAUSE OF THE FUR, THEY WON'T BE ABLE TO OCCUPY OR USE THOSE SPACES.

AND, UM, I DIDN'T HAVE THE LANGUAGE, BUT I DEFINITELY CALLED LINDSAY AND SAID WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE, THE, THE HEARING SO THAT YOU ALL CAN HEAR THAT AND THAT, AND THAT WORKS, I THINK ESPECIALLY IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR.

UM, BUT IF YOU CAN GET THAT LANGUAGE, 'CAUSE THAT WAS REALLY A PIVOTAL POINT WHEN YOU INTRODUCED THAT, THAT, THAT I, I COULD SEE SOME ADDING IT WHERE MAYBE IT SAYS, WHERE, WHERE ARE WE TODAY? I MEAN, IF WE HAD SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE THAT RECOGNIZES THAT ALTHOUGH WE MAY NOT HAVE A MARKET CONDITIONS THAT COULD SUPPORT, UM, COMMERCIAL SPACES, UH, THE INTENT IS TO HAVE THEM THERE SOMEDAY.

AND WHAT WOULD BE SOME OF THE IDEAS THAT WE WOULD YEAH.

IMPLEMENT TODAY TO HELP US GET TO THAT, YOU KNOW, IF WE WANNA JUST CALL IT THE GOLD STANDARD OR THE, YOU KNOW, OVERARCHING GOAL.

UM, YES, COMMISSIONER WHEELER AND COMMISSIONER SCHOCK, I THINK WE CAN COME BACK WITH SOME LANGUAGE, UM, EITHER IN THIS SECTION SPECIFICALLY OR IN THE IMPLEMENTATION SECTION WHERE WE GET AT THE SAME CONCEPT OF, IT MAY NOT BE COMMERCIAL RIGHT NOW, BUT WE'RE CREATING A CODE AND CREATING A DEVELOPMENT AROUND TOD TO, TO SPEAK TO BOTH OF YOUR POINTS.

YES, YES.

I THINK WE CAN COME BACK WITH THAT LANGUAGE.

SO THERE WAS A CASE THAT WE HAD LAST, ON THE LAST THREE, OUR LAST HEARING, AND IT WAS RELATED TO THAT.

AND THAT LANGUAGE WAS KIND OF PUT INTO PLACE AND IT WOULD, IT IS HELPING, UM, I MEAN, 'CAUSE IT SAT, I THINK IT WAS ON THE, THE SIDE STREET, NOT THE, IT WAS BECKLEY AND BECKLEY AND I CAN'T REMEMBER THE SIDE STREET, BUT THE SIDE STREET WAS FIFTH AND SIXTH BECKLEY ON JUAN AND ZANG.

AND I THINK THAT WOULD GO A LONG WAY OF ATTRACTING ALL KIND OF BUSINESSES THAT COULD HAVE THAT COMBINATION.

AND WHAT HAPPENED WAS THAT ON THE SIDE STREET IT WOULD HAVE A LIVE WORK UNTIL IT CAN GET TO THAT.

[02:15:01]

A SMALL BUSINESS OWNER THAT JUST NEEDS A LITTLE SPACE BUT WANNA LIVE AND IT CUTS AND IT, IT GIVES AN AFFORDABLE, AFFORDABLE ABILITY, UM, AND ADDS OUR, IT WILL HELP US IN OUR AFFORDABLE HOUSING PROCESS BECAUSE IF I CAN LIVE AND WORK IN THE SAME PLACE NOW, IT SAVES ME INCOME AND IT'S FROM STAFF'S PERSPECTIVE, IF YOU TWO WOULDN'T MIND EITHER FINDING THE LANGUAGE OF THAT CASE SPECIFICALLY JUST AND PROVIDING THAT TO US SO WE CAN THEN FIND A WAY TO INCORPORATE EXACTLY WHAT YOU ALL ARE MENTIONING, UH, SO WE'RE NOT GUESSING.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON FALLBACK COMMISSIONER CARPENTER.

MOST DEFINITELY.

I, I WANNA, I, I DEFINITELY, UM, PUD, WHICH WAS, I MEAN, PATRICK AND LINDSEY BECAUSE AGAIN, WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF OUR HOUSING AND I REALLY THOUGHT THAT WOULD BE CONSIDERABLE IN, IN SOUTH DALLAS.

ANDOUT, THE WHOLE CITY THOUGH.

COMMISSIONER KEYSTONE.

NO, I DON'T THINK I'M READY TO VOTE ON THIS ITEM TODAY.

I HAVE SOME PAUSE ABOUT THE LAST PARAGRAPH.

IT SEEMS FAIRLY DISMISSIVE OF THE LOW DENSITY RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS.

UH, I'M NOT SURE IT, IT RECOGNIZES THAT A THIRD OF THE LAND AROUND RAIL STATIONS IS LOW DENSITY RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS RATHER THAN SOMETHING THAT MIGHT BE MORE APPROPRIATE.

BUT IT DOESN'T SEEM TO SOLVE FOR WHAT, WHAT HAPPENED TO THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND I'M NOT COMFORTABLE WITH BEING QUITE SO DISMISSIVE TO THOSE COMMUNITIES.

I THINK THAT LANGUAGE IS PRETTY RUDE.

UM, UM, I THINK ONE THING I'M TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT I UNDERSTAND IS WE'VE, UM, AGAIN, HAVE REFERENCE TO VACANT OR UNDEVELOPED LAND.

I THINK AS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IN OTHER SECTIONS, VACANT CAN MEAN A LOT OF THINGS.

AND I DID GO BACK AND I APPRECIATE HAVING THE GLOSSARY NOW 'CAUSE IT IS DEFINED IN THE GLOSSARY.

UM, BUT IT ALSO DOESN'T INCLUDE LANGUAGE THAT WE, UM, SOMETIMES CONSIDER SUCH AS, YOU KNOW, AS OF THE PASSAGE OF THIS ORDINANCE, SO THAT IT'S CLEAR THAT, YOU KNOW, ANY LAND CAN BE MADE VACANT.

AND I THINK HOW WE DEFINE THAT, I THINK I UNDERSTAND, UM, WHAT THE INTENT IS AND I, I I THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE THAT IT IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US AS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WHETHER IT'S MIXED USE FLEXIBILITY, UM, WHERE MARKET ISSUES AREN'T THERE.

I THINK I UNDERSTAND ALL THOSE ITEMS. I JUST, I FEEL LIKE THOSE TWO PARAGRAPHS, UM, MIGHT NEED A LITTLE BIT MORE ATTENTION.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, I, I THINK THERE'S A CONSIDERABLE OPPORTUNITY FOR MISUNDERSTANDING IN THIS PARTICULAR, UM, THEME BECAUSE I THINK TO MOST PEOPLE, TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT MEANS THE AREA AROUND DART STATIONS, THE PARKING LOTS, AND PERHAPS SOME COMMERCIAL PROPERTY IMMEDIATELY AROUND IT.

AND IN FACT, THE SECOND PINK PARAGRAPH HERE SAYS THE LAND WITHIN TOD AREAS THEN IN, IN, UM, PERRAN HALF MILE OF DART RAIL STATIONS AND, AND ALL THE FIGURES THAT COME ALONG AFTERWARDS THAT REALLY UNDERSTATES WHERE THIS COULD APPLY.

BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK IN THE GLOSSARY OR YOU LOOK OVER UNDER, DO YOU, DID YOU KNOW IN THE SECOND, UH, IN THIS ON PAGE TWO SIX, THE SECOND PARAGRAPH, IT SAYS A TOD CAN BE FOCUSED AROUND LIGHT RAIL STATIONS AS WELL AS MAJOR BUS NODES, BIKE INFRASTRUCTURE AND TRAILS.

AND IF, IF, IF WE'RE BEING DISMISSIVE OF SINGLE FAMILY DEVELOPMENT WITHIN HALF A MILE OF ALL THOSE THINGS, I MEAN, THAT COVERS A GREAT DEAL OF THE CITY.

I MEAN, YOU JUST TAKE THE DART STATIONS ALONE AND YOU DRAW, YOU KNOW, HALF A MILE CIRCLES AROUND THEM AND THEN YOU GO TO MAJOR BUS NODES.

WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT A MAJOR BUS NODE IS IF THAT'S, IF YOU'RE NEAR A HOSPITAL WHERE THERE'S FAIRLY FREQUENT BUS SERVICE, DOES THAT, I MEAN, IT IT PUTS A LOT OF IT, IT, IT ADDS A LOT OF AMBIGUITY.

SO I, I'M, I'M THINKING PERHAPS THAT WE NEED TO HAVE A CLEARER EXPRESSION OF, OF WHAT THE EXTENT OF THIS COULD BE.

BECAUSE I THINK WHEN PEOPLE HEAR TRANSITORY DEVELOPMENT, THEY'RE JUST THINKING DART RAILS.

AND THIS, THIS ONE PARAGRAPH ABOUT THE LAND WITHIN DART TOD AREAS, VERY MUCH UNDERSTATES HOW MUCH LAND THIS, THIS THEME COULD ENCOMPASS SKILL US.

SO BASED ON THOSE COMMENTS, I WOULD ASK THAT I'M HEARING FROM COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON AND COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, THAT YOU WANNA SEE DIFFERENT LANGUAGE IN HERE.

SO I WOULD HOPE THAT COMING INTO THAT, IF YOU ALL COULD WORK TOGETHER TO GET SOME PROPOSED LANGUAGE FOR THIS SECTION, UM, SO THAT THE BODY CAN DIGEST IT, UM, BECAUSE WE CAN TALK, I MEAN, I KNOW YOU'VE POINTED OUT A LOT OF CONCERNS, BUT UNTIL WE CAN SEE THAT ACTUAL LANGUAGE, I THINK IT'S

[02:20:01]

GONNA BE HARD FOR US TO, TO NAIL THIS ONE DOWN.

WELL, COULD I, WE TRIED TO MAKE SEVERAL ATTEMPTS AT HEARING WHAT YOU SAID, BUT I THINK Y'ALL NEED TO DELI TO BRING SOMETHING TO US, IF I MAY.

I THINK IT WOULD ALSO HELP US TO HEAR A CLARIFICATION OF INTENT FROM, YOU KNOW, THE PUD STAFF.

BECAUSE IF, IF THE REALLY THE INTENT IS TO DISCOURAGE SINGLE FAMILY ZONING WITHIN HALF A MILE OF ALL THESE DIFFERENT PLACES, THAT'S NOT, SO THIS IS A DESCRIPTION OF CURRENT CONDITION CONDITIONS, EXISTING CONDITIONS, WHAT WE HAVE TODAY, I THINK ONE OF THE, THE COMMENTS HAS BEEN FROM THE COMMUNITY, OH, PUT ALL YOUR DENSITY IN OUR TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT AREAS.

THIS IS ACKNOWLEDGING THAT A LARGE PORTION OF OUR TRANSIT DEVELOPMENT AREAS ARE ZONED FOR SINGLE FAMILY AND THEY HAVE SINGLE FAMILY USES.

SO JUST TO SAY DUMP YOUR DENSITY THERE, I THINK IS NOT, I'M LOOKING AT IT IN A SENSE OF THAT'S GOING TO OPEN UP A WHOLE CAN OF WORMS THAT I DON'T THINK, AND THAT'S WHY IN THE IMPLEMENTATION AREAS, IN THE IMPLEMENTATION SECTION FOR TOD IT SPECIFICALLY SAYS WE NEED TO PLAN FOR THESE AREAS AND WE NEED TO DO MORE STRATEGIC PLANS FOR THOSE STATION AREAS.

IT'S NOT AT ALL INTENDED TO SAY OR BE DISMISSIVE OF.

AND IF THAT'S HOW IT COMES ACROSS, WE NEED TO CHANGE THAT BECAUSE IT WAS TO COME ACROSS THAT ACKNOWLEDGING THAT THERE IS A LOT OF SINGLE EXISTING, SINGLE FAMILY AND SINGLE FAMILY ZONING IN THOSE AREAS.

SO WE CAN'T JUST SAY, PUT IT THERE WITHOUT FURTHER ANALYSIS.

IF I MAY, I, I THINK THE DISCONNECT HERE MAY BE THAT I THINK FOR THE LAY PERSON, I MEAN THE PEOPLE THAT I TALK TO WHEN THEY HEAR TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, THEIR MIND SAYS DART STATION, DART STATION AND PARKING LOT.

AND LIKE I SAY, MAYBE A LITTLE BIT OF THE COMMERCIAL, BUT THEY'RE NOT THINKING THE NEIGHBORHOOD, YOU KNOW, WITHIN WHAT WE COULD BE CONSIDERED WALKING DISTANCE.

SO I'M THINKING THAT PLANNING STAFF AND ORDINARY NON PLANNING STAFF PEOPLE ARE, ARE JUST SEEING DIFFERENT AREAS WHEN THEY HEAR TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT.

AND THAT'S FINE.

SO WE NEED TO COME UP WITH LANGUAGE THAT MAKES THAT CLEAR BECAUSE THE STANDARD IN THE WORLD, LIKE THE TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT WORLD IS TOD IS HALF MILE FROM A TRANSIT STATION.

SO IF WE WANNA HANDLE THAT DIFFERENTLY HERE, AND I THINK THAT'S WHY WE'VE ADDED IN, BECAUSE THERE WAS CONCERN ABOUT THAT THE NEIGHBORHOOD CENTERS, THE MIXED USE CENTERS, THE CITY CENTERS, THAT THERE ARE VARYING SCALES DEPENDING ON HOW YOU'VE GOT THE ENVIRONMENT BUILT OUT.

SO SOME OF THOSE IMAGES THAT, YOU KNOW, YES, WHEN SOME PEOPLE HEAR TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, THEY JUST THINK, YOU KNOW, POTENTIALLY 40 UNITS WITH ALL THE DIFFERENT UNITS MIXED OR ALL THE DIFFERENT USES MIXED IN.

BUT THE REALITY IN DALLAS IS THAT'S NOT THE CASE BECAUSE WE HAVE VARYING SCALES AND OUR TRANSIT STATIONS WERE NOT NECESSARILY PLACED IN AREAS THAT WE'RE GOING TO MAXIMIZE RIDERSHIP.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS? COMMISSIONER HOUSEWRIGHT, PLEASE.

I CAN SEE THERE BEING DIFFERENT, UM, GUIDELINES FOR TRANSIT STATIONS THAT ARE IN THE MIDST OF A SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOOD AND OTHERS THAT ARE SURROUNDED BY SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT OR UNDEVELOPED.

100%.

AND THERE SHOULD BE, I'LL DEFINITELY, SO IF WE NEED TO MAKE THAT MORE CLEAR, EVEN FOR MAY EVEN MORE CLEAR, OR IF IT'S COMING ACROSS AS THAT'S NOT WHAT THE INTENT IS, THEN THEN WE NEED, WE NEED TO COME UP WITH SOME LANGUAGE TO MAKE THAT VERY CLEAR.

OKAY, COMMISSIONER SHARP, IF THE INTENT IS TO GET MORE CLARITY, I'M IN FAVOR OF THAT.

I, YOU KNOW, IF WE WANT TO USE ADDITIONAL LANGUAGE LIKE MULTIMODAL TRANSPORTATION NETWORKS OR WHATEVER, AND PLACE MORE EMPHASIS THAT THIS IS NOT JUST ABOUT DART AND A HALF MILE, BUT IF THE INTENT IS TO RE-LOOK AT THIS AND THEN DIAL IT BACK TO JUST A HALF MILE WITHIN DART, I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF THAT.

I REALLY THINK THIS IS WITH REGARDS TO DENSITY, THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT DOCUMENT.

THIS IS OUR PATH INTO, UM, INTO DENSITY IN A CONTEXT SENSITIVE WAY.

AND I THINK THERE NEEDS TO PROBABLY BE BETTER PUBLIC EDUCATION ON EXPLAINING THAT.

THAT ALSO INCLUDES BUS NETWORKS AND OTHER TRANSPORTATION NETWORK OUTSIDE OF JUST RAIL.

SO I'M SUPPORTIVE OF THAT, NOT SUPPORTIVE OF DIALING THIS BACK JUST TO BE THE TRADITIONAL INTERPRETATION OF A HALF MILE FROM A DART RAIL STATION.

WELL, THIS IS AN IMPORTANT CONVERSATION.

I APPRECIATE THE OBSERVATIONS FROM, UH, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER.

UH, I WAS NOT AWARE, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT A ONE HALF MILE RADIUS.

I'M, I READ THIS AND I THOUGHT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT PARKING LOT IN A DART STATION.

BUT ANYWAY, NEVERTHELESS, I'LL MAKE A, I'LL MAKE A REMARK BASICALLY IN THAT CONTEXT, IN, IN THE CONTEXT OF MY DISTRICT.

UM, THIS SECTION READS TO ME THAT IF WE CAN GET THE ZONING RIGHT AROUND OUR, OUR TRANSIT LINES, THEN WE'VE SOLVED THE PROBLEM.

UM,

[02:25:01]

IN MY DISTRICT, WE'VE HAD STATIONS LANGUISH FOR DECADES, AND SO I WOULD BE VERY OPEN TO LANGUAGE THAT AT LEAST REFERENCES ECONOMIC INCENTIVES, ECONOMIC PARTNERSHIPS WITH DART TAX CREDITS, OTHER TOOLS OUTSIDE OF THIS LAND USE DOCUMENT THAT I THINK MAY VERY WELL BE REQUIRED TO GET THE KIND OF TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT WE NEED.

UH, I JUST DON'T SEE THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY IN THIS CITY HAVING MUCH REGARD FOR TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, HENCE MARKING MOCKINGBIRD STATION AND I CAN'T REALLY NAME ANY OTHERS.

UM, YOU KNOW, SO, UM, I I THINK WE'VE GOT A, AN ISSUE HERE THAT'S BIGGER THAN JUST THE LAND USE ISSUE.

AND, AND MIGHT I JUST REFER YOU TO PAGE FOUR EIGHT? WE DID ADD IN THE IMPLEMENTATION TABLE BASED ON COMMENTS.

I THINK IT WAS COMMISSIONER KINGSTON ABOUT WANTING TO, IT, IT, AGAIN, NOT JUST BEING LAND USE AND ZONING, BUT SOME INCENTIVIZING.

UM, AND SO I THINK WE ADDED, UM, ACTION STEP THREE AND FOUR ON PAGE FOUR THROUGH EIGHT TO TRY TO GET AT SOME OF THAT, UM, ABOUT THE INCENTIVIZING AND THEN MAYBE SOME ZONING WITHIN AND OF ITSELF WITHIN THOSE AREAS THAT ARE TAILORED.

SO I WOULD JUST, IF, IF WE'RE, IF WE HOLD THIS ITEM, UM, I WOULD THINK ABOUT ANY LANGUAGE THAT GOES INTO THE THEME FOR TOD AND THEN SOME OF THESE OTHER RELATED AND, UM, EDITS THAT WERE RECOMMENDED, UM, IN THIS LATEST DRAFT.

COMMISSIONER, WE THERE.

UM, I DEFINITELY, BECAUSE YOU, WE HAVE ACTUALLY, UM, A TOD PLAN THAT WAS SUBMITTED SOME YEARS BACK FOR, I WANNA, OH, UM, I THINK WE CALLED IT PILOT POINT.

IS THAT THE NAME OF, UH, MR. LAWSON'S GROUP? PILOT POINT, PO POINT? WHAT IS IT? WHAT'S THE NAME OF HIS GROUP? SOUTH POINT? YEAH, SOUTH POINT, SOUTH POINT THAT IS AROUND THE DART MLK STATION THAT, UM, QUITE A BIT OF PROPERTY OWNERS ARE GETTING TOGETHER RIGHT NOW AND IS ASKING, UH, CITY STAFF TO LEAD THE, TO WORKING WITH CITY STAFF SO THAT THEY CAN GET THAT TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT.

UM, AND THESE ARE LEGACY OWNERS WHO'VE BEEN IN THE COMMUNITY SOME 50 PLUS YEARS WHO OWN QUITE A BIT OF PROPERTY AROUND A TOD THAT HAS NEVER LED TO DEVELOPMENT.

AND NOW THEY'RE SAYING THEY'RE GETTING TOGETHER AND THEY WANT THESE TYPE OF TOOLS AND THAT COULD HAVE BEEN IN PLACE THAT WILL, WOULD HAVE ALLOWED THEM TO BUILD RIGHT NOW AND DEVELOP AN AREA THAT IS GOING TO HAVE THAT AFFORDABILITY, SOME MIXED USE ASPECTS, AND THEY'RE WILLING TO SOME BUILDINGS THAT THEY HAVE TURN DOWN AND ADD TO SO THAT WE CAN GET SOME MORE DENSITY, AFFORDABILITY, UM, MORE RETAIL AND, AND, UM, OFFICE SPACES THAT ARE SO MISSING IN OUR, IN OUR COMMUNITY.

BUT THESE TYPE OF TOOLS BEING IN PLACE WITH THE RIGHT LANGUAGE COULD HAVE PUT THEM FURTHER, UM, FORWARD THAN WHERE THEY'RE AT RIGHT NOW.

THEY LITERALLY HAD TO, HAD TO FIGHT TOOTH AND NAIL JUST TO GET ON SOMEONE BOOKS TO BE EVEN HAVE THAT KIND OF CONVERSATION FOR A TOD THAT'S ALREADY IN PLACE.

SO, UM, I I THINK THIS IS GONNA BE A PRIME EXAMPLE OF, OF WHAT THIS, WHAT THIS COULD DO TO A TOD.

UM, I THINK PATRICK MAYBE GIVE US SOME BETTER UNDERSTANDING TO HOW THAT, HOW THE ZONING, HOW THE TOD THAT'S IN PLACE, BUT THE ZONING IS NOT CONDUCIVE TO THAT, HOW THEY'RE WORKING TO GET THAT DONE.

AND, AND, AND WE WILL INTRODUCE AFFORDABILITY BECAUSE THE RIGHT DEVELOPERS AND PROPERTY OWNERS OWN THE PRINT LAND NOW.

YES, COMMISSIONER, I, I THINK THE TWO STATION OR THE THREE STATIONS IN, UM, IN SOUTH DALLAS, THE, THE TRANSIT STATIONS ARE A GOOD EXAMPLE OF THE ZONING NOT MATCHING THE PLAN AND NOT BEING CONDUCIVE TO, UM, TO TOD DEVELOPMENT.

UM, AND TO, UH, COMMISSIONER'S HOUSEWIFE POINT, I THINK EVEN WHERE THERE ARE SOME POSSIBILITIES THERE WHERE THEY DO HAVE SOME ZONING, IT HASN'T HAPPENED IN PART BECAUSE OF OTHER ISSUES THAT ARE GOING ON.

UM, AND, AND TO, UM, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER'S POINT ABOUT UNDERSTANDING TOD, ONE OF THE THINGS I WOULD ALSO POINT OUT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT HOW IT'S TRANSIT TRAILS, HIGH FREQUENCY BUS STOPS IS, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF PEOPLE, WE ALL THINK OF TOD AS MOCKINGBIRD STATION, BUT WHEN PEOPLE COME TO DALLAS AND WHO ARE EXPERTS IN TOD, THEY TALK ABOUT THE KATY TRAIL AND THAT THE KATY TRAIL HAS BEEN A REALLY GOOD TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE IT SPURRED A LOT OF DEVELOPMENT ALONG THE TRAIL.

AND THOSE TRAIL HEADS THAT WE DON'T TRADITIONALLY IN DALLAS, THINK OF AS TOD COMMISSIONER HERBERT.

AND HAD TO CHANGE A COUPLE TIMES BECAUSE OF CHANGE OF LAWS AND CHANGES, THINGS LIKE THAT.

UM, WE HAVE A PROJECT CURRENTLY THAT'S PROBABLY COMING SOON, THE WESTMORELAND STATION, AND THAT STATION TOOK CREATIVITY FROM DART DISD IN THE CITY OF DALLAS.

UM, A PROPOSAL WAS PUT OUT, DEVELOPER PICKED UP THE PROPOSAL

[02:30:01]

SO AS WE LOOK AT THESE TODS, WE DO NEED TO UNDERSTAND IT'S NOT AS EASY AS WE EXPECT ACCORDING TO THE LANDOWNERS AND TO THE, THE AREA THAT HALF MILE BETWEEN HERE AND THE TOD OR WHATEVER IT ARE WE REFERRING TO EMPTY LAND OR LAND THAT EXISTS OR HOMES THAT EXIST.

CAN THAT BE CLARIFIED OR DOES IT NEED TO BE EVEN? THANK YOU, MR. BLAIR.

I'VE BEEN SITTING HERE LISTENING TO EVERYBODY ABOUT TODS WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE, WHAT IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE, WHAT IT NEEDS TO LOOK LIKE, WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT.

I'VE GOT ONE THAT HAS A WHOLE LOT OF LAND.

IT HAS A AREA PLAN.

THE AREA PLAN IS OLD.

UM, IT DIDN'T HAVE A MAJOR TOD, THE, THE LAND USE HAS CHANGED.

IT NEEDS TO BE ACTIVATED FOR A UNIVERSITY AND IT HAS LAND THAT HAS BEEN ZONED THAT'S IN THE INAPPROPRIATELY ZONED.

AND I'M SITTING HERE AND I'M THINKING, HOW DO I, HOW, HOW DO I EXPLAIN THIS WHERE WE ARE TODAY? BECAUSE WHERE WE ARE TODAY FOR EVERYBODY IS DIFFERENT AND NOTHING THAT ANYONE WRITES IS GOING TO BE RIGHT FOR EVERYONE.

SO WHEN I'M READING WHERE WE ARE TODAY, I, I THINK I I PART OF ME SAYS THAT WE NEED TO DIAL IT BACK AND BE A MORE BROADER INCLUSIVE, UM, EXPLANATION OF WHERE WE ARE TODAY OR WE NEED TO, AND BECAUSE YOU CAN'T SAY DISTRICT NINE LOOKS LIKE THIS.

DISTRICT 11 LOOKS LIKE THIS, DISTRICT EIGHT LOOKS LIKE THIS.

DISTRICT THREE LOOKS LIKE THIS.

DISTRICT FOUR WANTS TO GO HERE, DISTRICT SEVEN NEEDS TO GO THERE.

THAT'S WHAT I'M, AND THAT'S WHAT I'M HEARING.

AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO.

SO IF WE DIAL BACK AND SAY THAT THAT TODS TO WHERE WE ARE TODAY, WE, HERE'S THE HISTORICAL INFORMATION, UM, TODS SHOULD BE A HALF AN AIR HALF A MILE FROM A, A DART RAIL WE NEED TO STATION.

AND THAT TODS TODAY MAY LOOK DIFFERENT BASED ON NEEDS AND USE OF TODAY AND WHERE WE, WHERE AND WHERE.

THE LAST CHECK PARAGRAPH SAYS, WHERE, ALTHOUGH OPPORTUNITY EXISTED WHERE LAND USE AND ZONING BARRIERS TO REALIZE THE POTENTIAL, DA, DA DA DA DA.

WHAT I'M HEARING FOR FOR MY DISTRICT IS DUMP, DUMP, DUMP, DUMP, DUMP.

AND THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH.

AND IN NEAR THE DARK, NEAR THE UNTD STATION, IT NEEDS TO BE EXTREMELY THOUGHTFULLY PLANNED NO MATTER WHAT IS ZONED TODAY, BECAUSE THE OPPORTUNITY EXISTS FOR BEAUTIFUL GROWTH, BEAUTIFUL DESIGN MOCKINGBIRD STATION ISH, BECAUSE THAT AREA IS, IT NEEDS TO BE YOUTHFUL BECAUSE IT'S AT A UNIVERSITY AND YOU NEED TO HAVE THIS TO IN, TO ACTIVATE THAT TYPE OF USE.

SO I WOULD SAY DIAL IT BACK.

DON'T BE TOO SPECIFIC.

JUST BE WHERE WE ARE TODAY IS DIFFERENT FOR EVERY AREA IN, IN DISTRICT ONE.

IT, YOU GUYS ALREADY HAVE WHAT, WHAT HALF OF US DON'T HAVE.

UM, SO JUST MAKE IT HIGH, HIGH, HIGH, BUT, BUT GIVE IT ENOUGH DEPTH THAT SAYS IT'S BEEN THOUGHT THROUGH.

WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE? I DON'T KNOW, BUT THAT'S MY OPINION WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE.

WE NEED TO DEFINE AND FIGURE IT OUT AND DO IT ASAP.

UH, COMMISSIONERS, WE, WE ACTUALLY DO HAVE A MOTION ON THE TABLE, IT SOUNDS LIKE, UH, A MAJORITY.

I'M NOT QUITE READY TO, TO VOTE ON IT, BUT I DON'T WANT TO VOTE IT DOWN.

COMMISSIONER HERBERT, YOU STILL HAVE THE MOTION OR IT'S A LOT OF DISCUSSION THAT NEED TO BE HAD AND I'D LIKE TO PULL MY MOTION.

A QUICK DECISION COMMISSIONERS.

YOU OKAY WITH THAT? ALRIGHT, SO WE WILL TABLE ITEM.

THAT WAS

[02:35:01]

I LOOK FORWARD TO READING YOUR, UH, YOUR LANGUAGE, YOUR PROPOSED LANGUAGE ON THIS.

LET'S GET THAT INTO STAFF PLEASE.

SO THAT'S NUMBER FOUR.

THREE AND FOUR HAVE BEEN TABLED TEXAS 10.

NUMBER FIVE, UPDATED DEFINITION OF PRIMARY AND SECONDARY USE UPDATES TO THE PLACE TYPE LAND USE MATRIX ON THREE SIX AND THREE SEVEN.

JUST THE DEFINITIONS.

YES, MR. CHAIR.

RUBEN, I'LL MAKE A MOTION SIMPLY ON THE DEFINITION SECTION TO APPROVE THAT NOT ON THE MATRIX BENEATH IT.

I GET A SECOND.

THE DEFINITION DEFINING PRIMARY AND SECONDARY USE SECOND TO.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT FOR YOUR SECOND COMMENTS, JUST FOR THE, THE TWO DEFINITIONS THERE.

I THINK WE TALKED THIS ONE TO DEATH AT A PREVIOUS MEETING, SO I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD.

I AGREE.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS? AS LONG AS WE CHANGE THE SPELLING OF COMPLIMENT TO HAVE AN E IN THE MIDDLE , THAT IS THE FRIENDLIEST AMENDMENT I'VE EVER HEARD AND I'M HAPPY TO ACCEPT IT.

ALL RIGHT, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.

THE OPPOSED AYES HAVE IT.

SCO NUMBER SIX, UPDATED CONTEXT LANGUAGE.

UH, SHARON .

PARDON ME.

MY APOLOGIES.

WE'RE GETTING AHEAD OF MYSELF.

YES, I KNOW ANN USE MATRIX.

COULDN'T SNEAK THAT IN.

CAN I MAKE AN AMENDMENT PLEASE ON THE MATRIX, PLEASE? THANK YOU.

UH, I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION.

EXCUSE ME.

I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION BY, IN THE PLACE TYPES LAND USE MATRIX ON PAGE THREE DASH SIX, REMOVE COTTAGE COURTS AND TINY HOMES FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY, DETACHED LAND USE CATEGORY, REMOVE TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED CATEGORY AND ADD CLUSTERED HOUSING TO MULTIPLEX.

ALSO, I WOULD PROPOSE TO CHANGE THE DEFINITION OF MULTIPLEX TO FEWER THAN EIGHT UNITS IN THE DEFINITION OF MULTIFAMILY FROM NINE OR MORE DWELLING UNITS INSTEAD OF FROM 10 OR MORE DRILLING UNITS.

AND, UM, THAT IS MY MOTION.

I'D ALSO LIKE TO SPEAK ON MY MOTION.

DO WE HAVE A SECOND? I HAVE A QUESTION ON THE MOTION.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON.

YOU SAID MORE THAN EIGHT? YEAH, THE MIC CHANGE DEFINITION OF MULTIPLEX TO FEWER THAN EIGHT UNITS AND THE DEFINITION OF MULTIFAMILY FROM, UH, TO BE FROM NINE OR MORE DWELLING UNITS, THAT LEAVES OUT ANY EIGHT PLEXES.

DO YOU INTEND TO DO THAT? THE FEWER THAN NINE WOULD BE THE, WELL CAN I, UH, AMEND THAT TO EIGHT OR FEWER? OKAY.

I'M JUST, CAN I AMEND THAT TO EIGHT OR FEWER? I I'M JUST MAKING SURE THAT THAT WAS WHAT YOU INTENDED.

I, I I MEANT EIGHT, EIGHT OR FEWER FEWER THAN EIGHT.

EIGHT ARE FEWER.

THE, UH, CHANGE THE DEFINITION OF MULTIPLEX TO EIGHT ARE FEWER UNITS.

AND THEN THE DEFINITION OF MULTIFAMILY TO BE FROM NINE OR MORE DWELLING UNITS.

COMMISSIONER FORSYTH, I BELIEVE IT'S EIGHT AND EIGHT.

SO THAT YOU DON'T HAVE A GAP IN THE NUMBER.

WELL, NO.

EIGHT, IF YOUR EIGHT OR FEWER EIGHT, EIGHT ARE FEWER WOULD BE MULTIPLEX AND THEN NINE OR MORE AND NINE OR MORE WOULD BE A, A MULTIFAMILY.

AND AND, AND THE REASON WHY I, I WOULD LIKE TO ADD CLUSTERED HOUSING TO MULTIPLEX IS, IS THAT I, I GUESS THEY NEED A SECOND BEFORE YOU KNOW I PROCEED.

I I WILL SECOND IT SO WE CAN HAVE DISCUSSION ON THIS.

CAN I MAKE A MOTION TO DIVIDE THE QUESTION SINCE THERE ARE SO MANY PIECES TO YOU OKAY.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, SECONDED THE MOTION, UH, COMMENTS.

COMMISSIONER FORESITE? YES, IF YOU'LL ALLOW ME, I WOULD LIKE TO READ THE DEFINITION OF CLUSTERED HOUSING THAT'S IN THE GLOSSARY SECTION OF THE FORD DALLAS PLAN.

IF YOU GO TO PAGE GA DASH SIX, IT STATES CLUSTERED HOUSING REFERS TO A RANGE OF MULTI-UNIT HOUSING TYPES THAT ARE DESIGNED TO FIT WITHIN THE SCALE AND FORM OF DETACHED TO SINGLE FAMILY HOMES.

THESE HOUSING TYPES, WHICH INCLUDE OPTIONS LIKE DUPLEXES, FOURPLEXES, COTTAGE COURTS, COURTYARD BUILDINGS, ARE INTEGRATED INTO WALKABLE NEIGHBORHOODS AND SUPPORT DIVERSE HOUSING NEEDS AND PROMOTE WALKABILITY.

SO BASICALLY CLO CO COTTAGE HOMES ARE FIT IN THIS CLUSTERED HOUSING CATEGORY, YOU KNOW, SO THEY BASICALLY, YOU KNOW, SHOULD FALL WITHIN THIS CATEGORY UNDER MULTIPLEX.

AND IT COULD AND, AND IT COULD EXIST, BUT IT, IT SHOULD JUST BE A SECONDARY LAND USE.

LOTS OF DISCUSSIONS.

[02:40:01]

WITH THAT? YEAH, I THINK IT'S, YOU'D LIKE FOR ME TO TAKE OUT THE DEFINITION OF MULTIPLEX, UH, TO FEWER, IF WE COULD JUST GO ONE AT A TIME AND THAT WAY WE CAN CAN OH, OKAY.

DIVIDE THE QUESTION.

I SEE.

MR. MOORE, CAN YOU EXPLAIN HOW THE MOTION TO DIVIDE THE QUESTION WORKS? YEAH.

SO IT WOULD JUST, YOU WOULD VOTE ON EACH COMPONENT PART INDIVIDUALLY RATHER THAN TAKING IT AS A WHOLE.

ESSENTIALLY LESS COMPLEX FOR US TO CONSIDER.

COMMISSIONER, YOU OKAY WITH THAT? THAT'S, THAT'S FINE.

UH, I, I WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE THOUGH THOUGH THAT WITH MULTIPLEX, THAT SHOULD REALLY BE TRIPLEX UP TO THE EIGHT UNITS.

I MEAN THAT THERE'S NO NEED TO PUT TRIPLEX UNDER THE SINGLE FAMILY, UH, ATTACHED WHEN IT FITS UNDER MULTIPLEX.

AND THAT'S THE REASON FOR MAKING THAT CHANGE.

IT'S TRUE.

AND, AND THEN AGAIN, THE COTTAGE COURTS, WHICH WE'VE ADDED, UH, IN THIS VERSION OF THE PLAN, UH, TO ME THAT IS, UH, FITS UNDER THE DEFINITION THAT WE JUST READ OF CLUSTERED HOUSING, WHICH, YOU KNOW, SHOULD JUST BE, GO ALONG WITH MULTIPLEX.

SO LET'S GO BACK TO, UH, LET'S ONLY DISCUSS THE, THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACH, THE ADJUSTMENTS THAT YOU WANNA MAKE THERE.

COMMISSIONER, IF YOU DON'T MIND READING THOSE IN THERE, AND THEN WE'LL, WE'LL GO TO THE REST, PLEASE.

UH, I, I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION BY, IN THE PLACE TYPES LAND USE MATRIX ON PAGE THREE SIX, REMOVE COTTAGE COURTS AND TINY HOMES FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED LAND USE CATEGORY.

CAN I GET A SECOND FOR THAT? COMMISSIONER HAMPTON? SECONDED THAT DISCUSSION.

UH, DID YOU WANT TO ADD ADDITIONAL COMMENTS, COMMISSIONER TO THAT? UH, I, I, I, I'VE ALWAYS STATED MY REASONING.

SO I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT I'M HEARING THIS RIGHT.

SO IN THE, SO WE WILL NOT, SO YOU CAN'T, YOU WON'T BE, WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS THAT THE CONSIDERATION WILL BE FOR NOT BUILDING TINY HOMES.

NO, I'M JUST SAYING THAT THEY WOULD BE A SECONDARY LAND USE WITHIN THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, UH, PLACE TYPE, NOT A PRIMARY.

SO SOME PARTS OF THAT I AGREE WITH, BUT SOME PARTS I DON'T.

IN COMMUNITIES WHERE WE CAN, WHERE, BECAUSE ARE, WE, WE'RE LOOKING AT NOW AND FUTURE, UM, PEOPLE ARE MOVING TOWARDS TINIER HOMES.

AND SO TINY, THE TINY HOME FACTOR OF IT.

AND WHAT EL THE, UH, COTTAGES, UM, I, I, I, I BELIEVE SHOULD STILL BE ABLE TO BE IN A SINGLE FAMILY HOME COMMUNITY.

UM, BUT WHEN YOU GO TO TALKING ABOUT MULTIPLEXES, UM, THE MULTIPLEXES AND THE, UM, CLUSTERED HOUSING, CLUSTER HOUSING BEING REPLACED, MULTIPLEX BEING REPLACED WITH CLUSTER HOUSING? NO, NO.

IT CLUSTER HOUSING WOULD BE ADDED TO THE DEFINITION OF, IN THAT CATEGORY WHERE IT SAYS MULTIPLEX, IT WOULD BE MULTIPLEXES, UH, PLUS CLUSTERED HOUSING.

AND SPECIFICALLY RECOGNIZES THAT, UM, FORMER CIVIC OR INSTITUTIONAL PROPERTIES WOULD BE AN APPROPRIATE PLACE TO PUT THOSE.

SO, OKAY, SO THAT'S FINE.

BUT WHEN WE GONNA TALK ABOUT THE SINGLE FAMILY THOUGH, SINGLE FAMILY REMOVING, REMOVING THOSE SINGLE, UM, DWELLING UNITS FROM SINGLE FAMILY.

I, I, I CAN'T CONCUR WITH THAT ONE BECAUSE I DO KNOW.

SO IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DENSITY, RIGHT? I THINK I'M GOING RIGHT.

I'M, IF I'M TALKING, IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DENSITY IN AREAS WHERE WE CAN PUT A SINGLE FAMILY, UM, I MEAN A TINY HOME COMMUNITY, UM, WHICH THEY ARE BUILDING THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY, PEOPLE ARE SAYING, HEY, I LIKE TINY HOMES AS COLLEGE STUDENTS, SINGLE FAM, FIRST SINGLE, SINGLE, UM, PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE CHILDREN, MAYBE NOT MARRIED YET, ARE LOOKING FOR SINGLE FAMILY.

AND THAT'S A, THAT'S ANOTHER, UM, THAT, THAT, THAT CAN REDUCE OUR HOUSING MARKET.

EVERY ONE OF SOME PEOPLE DON'T WANNA LIVE IN AN APARTMENT, ONE BEDROOM APARTMENT, BUT THEY WOULD LIKE A, A TINY HOME.

I DON'T THINK WE CAN MOVE, I DON'T THINK IT'LL BE IN GOOD, GOOD FAITH GOING FOR OUR FUTURE TO REMOVE THAT FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY.

WELL, AM I RIGHT? UH, YEAH, WE'LL COME BACK TO YOU, COMMISSIONER.

WE'LL GO, GO IN A ROW.

DOES THAT CONCLUDE YOUR COMMENTS? YEAH.

SO SOME OF THE ONES THAT'S SINGLE, UM, I, I, I JUST, I CAN'T SAY REMOVE, BUT I DO LIKE WHERE YOU'RE GOING WITH WHAT WE CONSIDER A, A MULTIPLEX AND WHAT YOU CONSIDER A, UM, MULTIFAMILY.

MULTIFAMILY.

I, I DO, I DO THINK THAT COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, THANK YOU.

UM, I WON'T BE SUPPORTING THE MOTION.

I THINK THAT THE FIRST AMENDMENT WE ADOPTED TODAY THAT, UM, SPECIFICALLY STATES THAT, UM, WE SHOULD GIVE CONSIDERATION TO WHERE THINGS LIKE CLUSTER HOUSING, SHARED ACCESS HOUSING, COTTAGE COURTS GO

[02:45:01]

LIKE, YOU KNOW, THESE DEAD CHURCH SITES THAT WE HAVE TO DEAL WITH, UM, IS ADDRESSES SOME OF THOSE CONCERNS.

AND KIND OF LIKE COMMISSIONER WHEELER SAID, I THINK THAT COLLEGE COURTS AND TINY HOME COMMUNITIES ARE SOMETHING THAT OTHER CITIES ARE DOING.

THEY'RE SUCCESSFUL.

THERE ARE AN AVENUE TO PROVIDE MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING OPTIONS.

IT'S FRANKLY, A WAY TO PROVIDE HOUSING FOR PEOPLE TO AGE IN PLACE FOR PEOPLE TO REMAIN IN THEIR COMMUNITIES WHEN THEY CAN NO LONGER CONTINUE TO MANAGE THE LARGER HOMES THAT THEY WANT STAYED IN.

AND, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF FOLKS, WE'RE SEEING A TREND WHERE PEOPLE ARE NOT SETTLING THEIR LARGER HOMES BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE ANOTHER PLACE TO MOVE INTO.

WE'RE NOT PROVIDING THE TYPE OF SENIOR, SMALLER SENIOR HOUSING FOR PEOPLE AS ANOTHER OPTION.

SO THEY'RE CONTINUING TO STAY IN THEIR LARGER HOMES AND THEY'RE CONTINUING TO KEEP THAT HOUSING STUFF OFF OFF THE MARKET FOR OTHER PEOPLE WHO MIGHT WANT TO HAVE IT.

AND IF WE DON'T PLAN TO ALLOW THE CONSTRUCTION OF THESE NEWER TYPES OF, UM, MAYBE NOT EVEN NEWER, I MEAN COLLEGE COURSE HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR DECADES, BUT ALLOW OUR ZONING CODE TO BE MORE FLEXIBLE, THEN WE'RE NOT GONNA PROVIDE THOSE OPPORTUNITIES AND SOLVE SOME OF THOSE PROBLEMS. THEY ARE DETACHED, THEY CAN BE DETACHED OR ATTACHED, AND I THINK IT'S FULLY APPROPRIATE FOR THEM TO BE IN THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

AND WHERE THEY GO IS A DIFFERENT QUESTION.

AND I THINK WE'VE, WE'VE STARTED TO ADDRESS THAT.

UM, I WILL SAY THAT I THINK TINY HOME AND COTTAGE COURT ARE TWO TERMS THAT SHOULD BE DEFINED IN THE GLOSSARY SECTION.

I'VE MADE A NOTE ON THAT AND I, AND HOPEFULLY THAT MIGHT ADDRESS SOME OF YOUR CONCERNS, BUT I WON'T BE SUPPORTING THIS MOTION.

BUT THAT'S ANOTHER CATEGORY, ANOTHER CONVERSATION.

COMMISSIONER HERBERT FROM VALLEY VICE CHAIR RUBIN.

UM, YES, TO GIVE SOME CONTEXT, I LIVE IN A NEIGHBORHOOD CALLED CAPELLA PARK.

IT'S A PLANNED PD, ONE OF THE LATER ONES.

I THINK IT WAS APPROVED IN 2005.

UM, A LOT OF OUR HOMES ARE IN THE SINGLE FAMILY SECTIONS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

A LOT OF THE HOMES RANGE FROM 1700 SQUARE FEET TO 3,500 SQUARE FEET.

UM, MOST OF US SHARE A SIDE YARD, BUT HAVE HUGE BACKYARDS, FRONT YARDS, SETBACKS, SO ON AND SO FORTH.

WITHIN THE COMMUNITY.

WE HAVE THREE COTTAGE NEIGHBORHOODS, THREE COTTAGE SECTIONS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD, UM, THAT HAVE A SHARED ALLEY GARAGES IN THE BACK, A COURTYARD IN THE FRONT WHERE A LOT OF OUR SENIORS, LIKE WHEN THEY MOVED IN PLAN TO MOVE INTO THESE UNITS, DO NOT STAY ON SALE AT ALL.

THEY GO, UM, THEY STARTED AT 1 49 YEARS AGO AND NOW WE'RE AT THREE 50, BUT THE HOMES ARE SELLING AT FIVE 50 AND SIX 50 NOW.

SO ONCE AGAIN, THE NATURAL, ACCORDING AFFORDABILITY IS HAPPENING IN THIS AREA.

UM, SO THAT'S WHY, UM, LOOKING AT THE MOTION, I UNDERSTAND THE INTENT.

THE AREA I CANNOT SUPPORT IS THE REMOVAL OF, OF COTTAGE COURTS.

I HAVE THREE IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD.

MY COMMUNITY WILL NOT SUPPORT IT.

I CAN SUPPORT MOVING TRIPLEXES TO SECONDARY AND REDUCING THE TYPE OF HOMES IN COTTAGE COURTS.

UM, I JUST CAN'T, UM, GET BEHIND REMOVING COTTAGE COURTS COMPLETELY.

MR. RUBIN, WELL, FOLLOWING, I, I ALSO WON'T BE SUPPORTING THE MOTION, BUT FOLLOWING UP ON, I THINK COMMISSIONER HERBERT HIT ON A REALLY GOOD POINT IS, YOU KNOW, WHILE WE DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO CONTROL OWNERSHIP VERSUS RENTAL WITHIN, YOU KNOW, OUR, YOU KNOW, DEVELOPMENT CODE, UM, ONE REALLY BENEFICIAL ASPECT OF OF SOME OF THESE OTHER TYPES OF HOUSING THAT FITS WELL INTO EXISTING, YOU KNOW, PREDOMINANTLY SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS, IS THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S, YOU KNOW, WITH THESE TYPES OF HOUSING PRODUCT, IT IS FEASIBLE TO OFFER IT ON A FOR SALE BASIS.

IT'S NOT GUARANTEED, I DON'T WANNA OVER PROMISE THERE, BUT IT GIVES PEOPLE ANOTHER ENTRY OPTION INTO SOME REALLY WONDERFUL NEIGHBORHOODS LIKE CAPELLA PARK.

AND I IMAGINE THAT THOSE HAVE, YOU KNOW, SKYROCKETED IN PRICE IN PART BECAUSE THERE IS DEMAND FOR IT AND WE'RE JUST NOT BUILDING ENOUGH OF IT TODAY.

SO, UM, I AM FULLY IN FAVOR OF LEAVING COTTAGE COURTS AND POTENTIALLY SENSITIVELY DEFINED TINY HOMES.

AND I DON'T KNOW IF MAYBE TINY HOMES IS NOT THE RIGHT LANGUAGE EXACTLY, BUT MAYBE WE COULD PLAY AROUND WITH THAT AND, UM, CONTINUING TO MOVE FORWARD.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON? THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR.

I SECONDED THE MOTION BECAUSE I THINK MANY OF US WANTED TO HAVE MAYBE MORE DISCUSSION ABOUT THESE CONTEXTS OF THE DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES THAT WE'VE, I THINK BEEN HEARING ABOUT, TALKING ABOUT.

UM, I DO FIND THAT TINY HOMES ARE MORE LIKELY ARE, IN MY OPINION,

[02:50:01]

UM, BETTER SERVED IN ANOTHER ONE OF OUR LAND USES, UM, COTTAGE HOMES.

I'M ACTUALLY NOT AS TROUBLED ABOUT BEING INCLUDED IN SINGLE FAMILY FOR THIS SIMPLE REASON THAT WE HAVE MANY EXAMPLES THROUGHOUT OUR CITY FROM TRADITIONAL COTTAGE COURTS TO WHAT MANY OF US WOULD CALL SMALL LOT SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL JOSEPHINE COURTS ARE, ARE IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD, THE BOTTOM.

UM, WE SPECIFICALLY WROTE IN, UM, LANGUAGE TO ALLOW FOR THAT.

AND I THINK IT IS ONE OF THE TOOLS THAT WE POTENTIALLY HAVE THAT HONORS TRADITIONAL SINGLE FAMILY WHILE TRYING TO THINK ABOUT HOW WE MIGHT, WHERE APPROPRIATE PUT IT IN.

I THINK COMMISSIONER KINGSTON'S COMMENT THAT INCLUDING IT IN THE GLOSSARY, I MEAN, THAT'S ABSOLUTELY NEEDED BECAUSE I THINK IT'S THE OTHER THING THAT GIVES EVERYONE, AS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT, I THINK MANY OF THE THINGS THAT I'VE HEARD FROM THE COMMUNITY IS ASKING FOR PREDICTABILITY.

AND WE CAN'T GIVE ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY TO ANYTHING AND THE SCALE OF HIS ZONING DOCUMENT.

BUT AS MUCH AS WE CAN PROVIDE MORE LANGUAGE IN TERMS OF INTENT, I THINK IT HELPS US, I THINK IT HELPS FUTURE ITERATIONS OF THIS BODY MOVE THIS DOCUMENT FORWARD, WHICH IS CERTAINLY WHAT I HOPE, UM, IS THE OUTCOME OF THIS.

SO THANK YOU MR. CHAIR.

THE, THE, THE, THE WONDERFUL CHAIR, UH, LADY, UH, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, WHO SECONDED MY MOTION, UH, SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY FEEL THAT COTTAGE COURTS SHOULD BE ALLOWED UNDER SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

I, UM, I CAN SEE COTTAGE HOUSING IN SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED BECAUSE IT, IT IN DISTRICT EIGHT, I CAN SEE IT AS, UM, SUPPORTIVE OF, OF THOSE THAT NEED TO AGE IN PLACE.

BUT, AND HA AND AS I THINK ABOUT WHEN MY PARENTS WERE AGING IN PLACE, IT WOULD'VE BEEN NICE TO HAVE SOMETHING THAT WAS MANAGEABLE FOR JUST THEM AND NOT A BIG HOUSE WHERE YOU COULD COLLECT A WHOLE LOT OF THINGS, UM, AND FOR OTHERS TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH.

BUT, UM, SO I CAN SEE, AND I CAN SEE IT AS COMMUNITY, SO WHERE, WHERE, WHERE THOSE THAT ARE AGING IN PLACE CAN GET TOGETHER AND SIT IN THE FRONT PORCH AND AND HAVE COMMUNITY.

WHEN I SEE TINY HOMES, UM, I THINK THAT, I THINK THAT WHAT THE, THE INTENT HERE WAS FOR ADUS.

AND I CAN SEE IN SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED IT.

I, WELL, I I SEE TINY HOMES AS THE INTENT WAS ADUS BECAUSE WHEN I SEE TINY HOMES, I SEE SEVERAL HOMES.

'CAUSE THERE THERE ARE NO MORE THAN 200, 300 SQUARE FEET, 700 SQUARE SOME 700 SQUARE FEET OR BELOW.

YOU SEE MULTIPLE HOMES ON A LOT.

AND I DON'T, I DON'T UN I DON'T REMEMBER READING IN OUR CODE WHERE WE HAVE MULTIPLE SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING UNITS IN ONE LOT.

SO YEAH, FIRST OF ALL, IT NEEDS TO BE DEFINED SO WE KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

UM, I SEE TINY HOMES IS NOT A SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED BECAUSE IT SHOULD BE ALL ON ONE LOT.

AND I SEE.

SO, BUT I ALSO SEE THAT THE AVAILABILITY FOR ADUS FOR THE PURPOSES IN WHICH WE, BECAUSE WE ALREADY HAVE SINGLE FAMILY HOMES WITH ADUS, SO THIS DOES NOT PROVIDE THIS, UM, FOR ADUS IN THIS AT ALL.

SO THAT'S MY, MY OPINION.

ANY OTHER CHAIRMAN SHA BEFORE WE PUT MY, UH, MY VOTE TO, UH, MY MOTION TO VOTE, UH, YOU KNOW, I FIRST WOULD LIKE TO STATE THAT WE MADE A COMPROMISE BY AGREEING TO PUT SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS IN THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE AS OPPOSED TO SEPARATING IT OUT.

AND, AND THE FOLKS IN THE SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS JUST SIMPLY WANT THE PROTECTION THAT THE SINGLE FAMILY HOME, UH, ONE LOT ONE HOME IS THE, UH, PRIMARY LAND USE WITHIN SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND SO, UH, WE'RE, WE'RE VERY HAPPY TO SEE, YOU KNOW, MOVING METRO, UH, MULTIPLEX TO A SECONDARY LAND USE WITHIN THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE.

UH, YOU KNOW, BUT SO SAYING THAT COTTAGE HOMES WOULD BE PART OF THE CLUSTERED HOUSING UNDER MULTIPLEX, IT WOULD STILL BE ALLOWED IN THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE.

IT'S, WE'RE NOT SAYING THAT YOU CANNOT HAVE THE COTTAGE HOMES, WE'RE JUST SIMPLY SAYING THAT IT WOULD BE A SECONDARY LAND USE AND NOT A PRIMARILY IN USE.

SO I DON'T SEE WHAT'S UNFAIR ABOUT THAT.

HOWEVER, SINCE I, I'VE HEARD EVERYONE AROUND THE, THE, THE, THE HORSESHOE HERE, YOU KNOW, PRETTY MUCH INCLUDING

[02:55:01]

I WOULD LIKE TO AMEND MY MOTION IF IT'S POSSIBLE.

AND I WOULD LIKE TO, TO MAKE MY MOTION TO SAY I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION BY, IN THE PLACE TYPES LAND USE MATRIX.

ON PAGE THREE SIX, REMOVE TINY HOMES FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED LAND USE.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR MOTION.

DO I HAVE A SECOND? HOLD SECOND.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON SECOND THE MOTION DISCUSSION ON THAT ITEM.

COMMISSIONER TURNON, I WON'T BE ACCEPTING THE, THE, UH, THE MOTION OR THE MENDED MOTION.

UM, PRIMARILY THE WAY I LOOK AT THIS, YOU KNOW, WE'RE, WE ARE IN A TIME WHERE WE ARE TRYING TO DO MORE WITH LESS.

WE'RE, WE'RE DOING THAT WITH ENERGY, WE'RE DOING THAT WITH WATER, WE'RE DOING THAT WITH MATERIALS.

LAND IS NO DIFFERENT.

WE ARE TRYING TO FIND WAYS TO USE LAND MORE EFFICIENTLY.

SO THE, THAT'S A PRIMARY GOAL OF THE DAY AND AGE THAT WE LIVE IN.

SO IT SHOULD BE A PRIMARY USE.

IT NOT, SHOULD NOT BE A SECONDARY USE.

WE SHOULD BE TRYING TO PROMOTE AND FIND WAYS TO, UM, TO PUT MORE HOUSING ON LESS LAND IN AN APPROPRIATE SCALED WAY.

COMMISSIONER HERBERT, UM, I'M, I'M, UM, AT A MIDPOINT HERE AND I'M PROBABLY GOING TO ASK FOR, UM, SOME ADVICE FROM THE EXPERIENCED, UM, PEOPLE AROUND THE TABLE.

IN MY OPINION, YES, TINY HOMES ARE NEEDED.

UM, I THINK TIME, TINY HOMES AT A CERTAIN EXTENT EXISTS IN DISTRICT FOUR AND DISTRICT THREE AT A LARGER SCALE, MEANING 900 TO 1150 SQUARE FEET.

UM, SO HOW DO WE, AS TEXANS, RIGHT? SOMEONE WHO DOESN'T HAVE A LARGE FOOTPRINT IN THE TINY HOME INDUSTRY TODAY, HOW DO WE DEFINE WHAT TINY HOME IN DALLAS IS, RIGHT? DO WE SAY NO, ONE 50 TO THREE 50, BUT MAYBE FOUR 50 TO NOT, IS IS THERE AN OPPORTUNITY TO FIND WHAT WE, A TEXAN OR DALLAS SITE WOULD CONSIDER A TINY HOME OR GARDEN HOME FOR THAT CASE? SO JUST WANTED TO PUT THAT OUT THERE.

DIFFERENT FROM DARK COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, PLEASE.

I REALLY THINK WE NEED TO HAVE THE DEFINITIONS OF THESE TWO BEFORE WE VOTE ON WHETHER THEY SHOULD BE INCLUDED IN PLACE TYPES BECAUSE WE ARE SHOOTING IN THE DARK.

BECAUSE HE JUST SAID HE CONSIDERS A TINY HOME TO BE 900 SQUARE FEET.

WHO, WHO, THAT'S A HOME, HOME WOULDN'T CALL THAT.

I'D SAY THAT WOULD BE THE SMALLEST HOMES THAT EXIST IN OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.

SO NOT TINY HOME ON A NATIONAL SCALE, BUT IN A DALLAS SCALE, RIGHT? IT, THAT WOULD BE OUR SMALLER STYLE.

SO YOU'RE RIGHT.

YEAH, I MEAN I THINK THE TRADITIONAL DEFINITION OF TINY HOME IS MAYBE A THIRD OF THAT.

AND SO I THINK WE NEED TO FLESH OUT THOSE DEFINITIONS AND THEN REVISIT WHERE THESE CONCEPTS APPROPRIATELY FIT.

OTHERWISE WE'RE JUST GONNA REVISIT IT AGAIN ANYWAY.

LIKELY IF, IF YOU'D LIKE, I CAN ON THE FLY DO SOME DEFINITIONS RIGHT NOW.

AND THEN IF YOU WANNA MOVE ON TO THE SECOND PIECE AND THEN YOU CAN COME BACK AND IF WE SHOW YOU THE DEFINITIONS, I MEAN IF THE SEC, 'CAUSE HE HAS TWO COMMISSIONER FORESIGHTS, UM, THERE'S A MULTIPLE PRONGED RECOMMENDATION IF YOU WANNA DO THAT.

I HAVE A COMMISSIONER BLAIR, WELL, FROM REALTOR.COM TINY HOMES IS 100 TO 400 SQUARE FEET.

SO BASED ON THAT, THAT'S, THAT WOULD BE, THAT SHOULD BE THE DEFINITION OR I RECOMMEND THAT TO BE THE DEFINITION OF IF IT'S FROM REALTOR.COM.

WELL, UM, WHEN I LOOK AT THE, I, I WATCH THE SHOW AND IT'S LIKE SOMETIMES 700, BUT IT SAYS THERE ISN'T, THERE ISN'T A SET STANDARD.

UM, A TINY HOME RARELY EXCEEDS 500 FEET SQUARE, 500 SQUARE FEET.

SO, UM, BEYOND THAT SIZE, THEY'RE MERELY SMALL HOMES, RIGHT? SO THERE IS AN INDUSTRY STANDARD.

SO IT'S GENERALLY 400, 450 SQUARE FEET ISH.

BUT FOR PLANT, WE DON'T NEED TO USE THAT FOR THIS BECAUSE WE'RE NOT CREATING ZONING STANDARDS FOR THIS.

IF YOU WANNA PROVIDE A GENERALIZED RECOMMENDATION THAT GIVES YOU SOME SORT OF PARAMETERS OF WHAT WE'RE SAYING, WHAT YOU ARE IMAGINING A TINY HOME TO BE, THEN WE CAN GO FROM THERE.

I THINK WE HAVE COMMISSION.

WILL YOU FINISH WITH YOUR COMMENTS, COMMISSIONER KINGSTON? WELL, I THINK YOU ARE.

PLEASE ON THE, ON THE SUBJECT OF DEFINITION, I THINK A BIG D DIFFERENTIAL DIFFERENTIATING ASPECT OF TINY HOME IS, IS IT ON A MOVABLE CHASSIS OR NOT? AND I THINK

[03:00:01]

THAT THAT'S WHAT WE GET BACK TO DEFINITIONS, BECAUSE WHILE WE'RE NOT CREATING ZONING STANDARDS, WE DO NEED TO KNOW WHAT THE ANIMAL WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS, IS THIS A ZEBRA? IS IT AN ELEPHANT? AND JUST SAYING IT'S 400 SQUARE FEET IS NOT, YOU'RE RIGHT, EXCUSE ME.

THAT'S NOT ENOUGH TO KNOW WHETHER IT'S APPROPRIATE IN A CERTAIN CATEGORY OF USES IN MY OPINION.

SO I THINK WE NEED TO, LOOK, I'M ALL IN FAVOR OF GETTING THIS DONE 'CAUSE I'M LIKE THE REST OF US, I THINK PROBABLY TIRED OF LOOKING AT IT, BUT I DON'T WANNA BE EXPEDIENT FOR THE SAKE OF GETTING IT DONE AND BE SLOPPY.

I THINK THAT THESE ARE CONCEPTS ARE IMPORTANT BECAUSE I THINK THEY HAVE THE POTENTIAL TO ALLOW THIS DOCUMENT TO PROVIDE SOME AFFORDABILITY THAT'S DESPERATELY NEEDED.

AND I THINK THESE ARE SOME CONCEPTS THAT HAVE COME A LITTLE LATE TO THE GAME, BUT I DON'T WANNA BE DISMISSIVE OF THEM.

AND I THINK THAT WE SHOULD HAVE SOME GOOD DEFINITIONS TO CONSIDER IF WE CAN WORK SOME UP TODAY AND COME BACK TO THIS MAYBE AT THE END AND, AND MOVE ON TO A DIFFERENT SUBJECT AND KINDA REVISIT THIS.

GREAT.

BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR TO THE PROCESS OR TO THE PUBLIC TO JUST, YOU KNOW, PULL UP SOMETHING ON GOOGLE AND , NO OFFENSE AND GO WITH IT.

WELL I THINK I WON'T TAKE AN OFFENSE TO THAT .

I'M GONNA TURN THE MIC OFF.

DID YOU HAVEN'T SPOKEN FIRST ROUND COMMISSIONER WHEELER, PLEASE.

UM, 'CAUSE I DID GO ON GOOGLE, BUT LET ME TELL YOU, LET ME TELL YOU THAT, UM, UH, I WATCH A GTV ALL DAY.

SO , SO I'M, I'M WATCHING TINY HOMES.

I'M LOOKING AT, LISTEN, I'M LOOKING AT MY CAT, I'M LOOKING AT, I'M ALL ON GOOGLE LOOKING AT, UH, HOME DEPOT, UH, STORAGE BEING TURNED INTO LISTEN, I AM INTO IT ALL.

UM, BUT ALSO WHERE DOES COTTAGE MEET TINY HOME BECAUSE MAYBE THAT'S THE, THE DIFFERENCE.

'CAUSE YOU KNOW, TINY HOME, A TINY HOME IS SO MANY FEET AND THEN A COTTAGE IS SO MANY FEET.

SO WILL IT BE DEFINED ALSO LOOKING AT, UM, IS IS THERE A, SO HOW WE HAVE DUPLEX DISTRICTS, WE HAVE, I KNOW, UM, BEAR STREET HAS A TOWN HOME DISTRICT, TINY HOME DISTRICTS, RIGHT? UM, I WOULD CONSIDER SAYING IN SO MANY WORDS THAT THE COUNTER HOMELESS SOLUTION THAT THE CITY HELPED FUND ON MALCOLM X RIGHT BEFORE THAT, THAT KINDA IS THE BORDER OF DEEP ELHAM AND SOUTH DALLAS THAT IS FOR THE HOMELESS SOLUTION.

IT KIND OF FITS THAT TINY HOME, UM, SOLUTION.

IT JUST SO HAPPENED IT'S FOR UH, LONG-TERM HOMELESS SOLUTIONS.

BUT IT HAS A COMMUNITY CENTER, IT HAS A, IT HAS WASHING LAUNDRY, IT HAS SOME RESOURCES LOOKING AT WHERE DOES THAT FIT IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

THAT GIVES, UH, THAT NECESSARILY A DEVELOPER MIGHT NOT WANNA DO A MULTI-FAMILY UNIT, BUT HE CAN DO A CLUSTERED UNIT AND IT SITS RIGHT ON THE OUTSKIRTS OR IT SITS IN THE AREA AND WE CAN GET OUR HOME, WE CAN GET OUR, OUR SENIORS IN A, IN A COMMUNITY RIGHT NEXT TO US, UM, THAT THEY WOULD TO GET THAT COMMUNITY FEELING.

'CAUSE ALL SENIORS DON'T WANNA LIVE IN AN APARTMENT COMPLEX OR LIVE IN A, UM, WHAT IS THAT SENIOR LIVING PER SE BUILDING, BUT THAT CLUSTER AND, AND CREATING, ADDING, IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN ADD TO IT? LIKE, UH, THOSE SUBDISTRICTS, THOSE SUBDISTRICTS, LIKE WE HAVE DUPLEX DISTRICTS, UH, TOWN HOME DISTRICTS AND THAT TINY HOME COTTAGE DISTRICT WHERE WE CAN GET THOSE, THOSE SENIORS IN PLACE.

'CAUSE QUITE NATURALLY WE KNOW THAT SENIORS LIKE TO ADD, I KNOW TO STUFF , THE BIGGER THE HOUSE, THE MORE STUFF .

THERE'S A WORKING.

SO JUST FOR REFERENCE, THERE'S A WORKING DEFINITION UP ON THIS IS ONE OF A STANDARD, PRETTY STANDARD DEFINITION.

AGAIN, IT DOES NOT HAVE TO BE THIS DEFINITION, BUT THIS IS GENERALLY WHAT IS COMPRISED OF A COTTAGE COURT.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN SEE THAT.

ANYONE CAN SEE THAT IT'S UP ON THAT SCREEN.

I CANNOT.

BUT IS IT POSSIBLE FOR YOU TO PUT THAT IN A BIGGER FONT PLEASE? A LITTLE BAR OR, YEAH, BOTH READ IT AND OR IF LAUREN, SEE IF YOU WANNA READ IT OUT OR PATRICK YEAH, I CAN READ IT.

UM, SO THIS IS FROM, UH, MISSING MIDDLE, UH, WEBSITE FOR COTTAGE COURTS.

UH, A GROUP OF SMALL ONE

[03:05:01]

TO 1.5 STORY DETACHED STRUCTURES ARRANGED AROUND A SHARED COURT VISIBLE FROM THE STREET.

THE SHERIFF COURT IS AN IMPORTANT COMMUNITY ENHANCING ELEMENT, AND UNIT ENTRANCES SHOULD BE FROM THE SHARED COURT.

IT REPRESENTS, OH, SORRY, IT REPLACES THE FUNCTION OF A REAR YARD.

OFTEN REAR MOST BUILDING CAN BE UP TO TWO STORIES.

CAN I GO FOR CLARIFICATION PLEASE? DID YOU SAY THOSE ARE DETACHED? THE DEFINITION IS DETACHED? YES.

ALRIGHT.

COMMISSIONER CHER, I'M COMFORTABLE MOVING FORWARD.

UM, YOU KNOW, I DON'T, I DON'T THINK WHAT HONING IN ON THE NUANCE OF A DEFINITION WOULD AFFECT THE WAY I FEEL ABOUT, UH, THE MOTION THAT'S BEING MADE.

UM, AND THEN ALSO JUST KNOW THAT BUILDING INSPECTION DOES WEIGH IN ON THIS STUFF WITH REGARDS TO CHASSIS AND THEY, THEY AT TIME OF PERMITTING REVIEW AND HAVE THEIR OWN STANDARD FOR, FOR THIS.

BUT ESSENTIALLY IT'S A SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED AND ROUTE.

IF IT WAS ON A CHASSIS, IT'D REQUIRE SKIRTING.

AND SO THERE'S, THERE'S PROTECTIONS ALREADY IN PLACE THAT WOULD REGULATE THAT, BUT I, I WOULD BE IN FAVOR MOVING FORWARD.

WELL, ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? COMMISSIONERS, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER? WELL, I KNOW I'M GONNA REGRET ASKING THIS, BUT WHAT HAPPENED TO A DU ? THE AGREEMENT WAS THAT I, THE GENERAL AGREEMENT AT THE LAST MEETING WAS THAT THE RECOMMENDATION WOULD GET MOVED INTO THE IMPLEMENTATION MATRIX IN THE BACK.

SO THERE IS, THIS WAS, IT WAS REMOVED OUT OF SINGLE FAMILY, OUT OF THE TABLE, OUT OF THE MATRIX.

AND A RECOMMENDATION WAS, UM, I THINK EDITED A LITTLE BIT IN THE IMPLEMENTATION SECTION UNDER HOUSING TO EXPLORE ALLOWING ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, UM, IN RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS.

SO IT'S IN THE MATRIX NOW.

NO REGRETS.

AND AS WE MOVE FORWARD, I'M SORRY, CHAIR THESE, PLEASE.

AS WE MOVE FORWARD, UM, SOME OF THE OLDER PUD STAFF MAY KNOW THE GODFATHER OF POCKET NEIGHBORHOODS ACTUALLY CAME TO DALLAS AND DID A TOUR.

I THINK IT WOULD HELP US IF WE LOOKED INTO THAT WEBSITE, POCKET NEIGHBORHOOD.COM AND SEE HOW BEAUTIFUL COTTAGE NEIGHBORHOODS CAN BE AND HOW WE'RE MISSING OUT ON, UM, POSSIBLY SOLVING SOME OF OUR HOUSING ISSUES.

BUT YEAH.

ANY OTHER DISCUSSION COMMISSIONERS? I, SO COMMISSIONER FORSYTH, PLEASE.

THE, WE'RE VOTING ON THE, THE ADMITTED MOTION THAT I MADE TO REMOVE THE TINY HOMES.

THAT'S CORRECT.

SINGLE FAMILY.

THAT'S CORRECT.

HIS MOTION BY, UH, COMMISSIONER FORSIGHT, SECOND BY COMMISSIONER HAMPTON AMENDED MOTION.

SO IT CAN BE ACCEPT, IT CAN BE JUST SHE ACCEPTED IT, I BELIEVE.

SO IT DOESN'T MEAN, IT DOESN'T THE MOTION HONOR JUSTICE, THE NO, THIS IS AN EMAIL FRIENDLY AMENDMENT.

DOESN'T REQUIRE, BUT THE AMENDMENT ITSELF REQUIRES A VOTE.

THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT DOES NOT REQUIRE, CORRECT.

YEAH, WE'RE VOTING ON THE AMENDMENT.

ON THE, ON HIS MOTION.

NOW THE YES, WHICH WAS TO JUST ON THE TINY HOMES PIECE TO REMOVE IT FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED LAND.

BUT SO COMMISSIONER FORSYTH MADE A MO A MOTION THAT WAS COMPLEX.

VICE CHAIR RUBEN ASKED TO DIVIDE THE QUESTION.

SO THEN IT WAS, THE QUESTION WAS REMOVAL OF THE COTTAGE HOMES AND THE TINY HOMES TO WHICH COMMISSIONER FORSYTH DID A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT TO HIS OWN MOTION TO MAKE IT ONLY TINY HOMES.

JUST THE TINY HOMES.

SO THAT'S NOT, THAT'S REQUIRED A MOTION THAT VOTING ON REMOVAL OF THE TINY HOMES.

IT REQUIRES A VOTE ALONG WITH THE OTHER PORTIONS OF THE MOTION THAT WE HAVEN'T QUITE GOT TO YET.

WE JUST, IT'S NOT TOGETHER.

YES, IT'S JUST THE TINY HOMES PIECE.

WE CAN HEAR THAT.

WHATEVER WE YEAH, WE, WE ARE ONLY VOTING ON, THERE WAS A QUESTION ON THE, THE AMENDMENT AND THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT.

AND THEN COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT THEN CHANGED, UH, HIS MOTION ESSENTIALLY TO ONLY TAKE OUT THE TINY HOMES PIECE FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

AND THEN WE HAD EXTENSIVE DISCUSSION AND THEN COMMISSIONER CARPENTER ADDED THE A DU, BUT WE DIDN'T REGRET IT AND , SO WE WERE VOTING ON THAT ITEM.

NOW ONLY COMMISSIONERS.

ANY, ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT? MAKE SURE WE'RE ON THE SAME PAGE YOU WANNA READ? IF YOU DON'T MIND, COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT, WE, WE HAVE A REQUEST IF YOU COULD REREAD YOUR MOTION, SIR, I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION BY, IN THE PLACE TYPES LAND USE MATRIX.

ON PAGE THREE SIX, REMOVE TINY HOMES FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED LAND USE CATEGORY.

AND WE, WE HAVE A SECOND LETTER.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR PLEASE SAY AYE.

DISTRICT ONE? DISTRICT TWO.

THAT'S COMMISSIONER, LET'S DO A RECORD, BUT WHY NOT

[03:10:05]

OH, ABSO DISTRICT? NO.

OH, I'M SORRY.

HE'S ONLINE.

I DIDN'T HEAR THE VOTE.

DIDN'T HEAR THE VOTE.

I SAID NO, I SAID NO.

DISTRICT 14 AND PLACE 15.

MOTION FAILS.

UH, COMMISSIONER FORSET, LET'S GO TO THE NEXT PIECE.

UM, I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION BY, IN THE PLACE TYPES LAND USE MATRIX.

ON PAGE THREE SIX, REMOVE TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED, UH, LAND USE CATEGORY.

ONE MORE TIME.

COMMISSIONERS.

WE'RE KIND OF PROCESSING IT.

PLEASE.

I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION BY, IN THE PLACE TYPES LAND USE MATRIX.

ON PAGE THREE SIX, REMOVE TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS FROM SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED LAND USE CATEGORY.

DO WE HAVE A SECOND? CAN WE ASK FOR CLARIFICATION PLEASE? BECAUSE I'M THINKING THAT THERE WAS ORIGINALLY HE HAD PLANNED TO MOVE THOSE SOMEWHERE ELSE, SO NO.

WELL, I, I, I HAD ALSO PLANNED TO SAY ADD CLUSTERED HOUSING TO MULTIPLEX, BUT, BUT, BUT THE IDEA FOR ADDING CLUSTERED HOUSING TO MULTIPLEX WAS THAT THAT WOULD INCLUDE THE COTTAGE COURTS.

AND, AND WE'VE ALREADY OBVIOUSLY AGREED THAT COTTAGE COURTS ARE GONNA STAY UNDER THE SINGLE FAMILY DE DE, UH, DETACHED LAND USE.

SO, UM, I, I GUESS THERE WAS, IS IS KIND OF MOOT NOW ADDING CLUSTERED HOUSING TO MULTIPLEX.

BUT, BUT I STILL FEEL THAT TRIPLEXES IN COTTAGE COURTS SHOULD BE REMOVED FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED LAND USE.

AND THAT'S MY MOTION.

CAN I HAVE A SECOND? ARE YOU SECONDING? DO YOU HAVE A QUESTION? SEPARATE MOTION.

YOU WANTED TO REMOVE IT AND IT AND CHANGE IT TO CLUSTERED HOUSING.

AM I RIGHT? IT'S ALL CLUSTERED.

IT'S CLUSTERED HOUSING.

IS THIS THE PART OF THE MOTION WHERE YOU, WHERE YOU DEFINED, UM, MULTIPLEX AND, AND, AND, UH, MULTI-FAMILY? OR IS THAT THE NEXT ONE? BECAUSE YOU DO NO, THE, THE DEFINITION OF MULTIPLEX, UH, TO FEWER THAN EIGHT UNITS WOULD BE IN A SEPARATE MOTION.

SO THAT'S IN A SEPARATE MOTION BECAUSE, UH, COMMISSIONER RUBIN ASKED ME TO SE SE SEPARATE OUT EACH ONE OF THESE, UH, ITEMS IN, IN THIS MOTION.

SO, YOU KNOW, THE NEXT ITEM WAS TO REMOVE TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED LAND USE CATEGORY.

UM, I THINK CAN I OFFER A MODIFICATION THEN? I MEAN A FRIENDLY YES.

NO, WE DON'T, WE DON'T YET HAVE A SECOND.

WE NEED A SECOND.

WE DON'T NEED A YEAH, I, I I'M CERTAINLY OPEN TO, TO A, A VACANT FRIENDLY MEMBER.

SECOND IT FOR THE PURPOSE OF DISCUSSION, THEN WE DO HAVE A SECOND.

I, SO I, I, I WOULD OFFER AMENDMENT COMMISSIONER CARPENTER TO TAKE COTTAGE TO TAKE THE, TAKE THE COTTAGE COURTS OUT AND LEAVE THE OTHER TWO IN.

AND THEN, BECAUSE I MEAN, THEY'RE PART OF, WE WANNA KEEP THAT IN SINGLE FAMILY.

I, I THINK THAT'S A CONSENSUS WHAT WE GOT FROM THE LAST, UH, THE VOTE AND THEN LEAVING YOUR OTHER TWO IN TO MEAN LEAVING YOUR OTHER TWO A PART OF THE MOTION AND TAKING COTTAGE COURTS OUT OF THAT MOTION.

CAN I, CAN I CLARIFY? YEAH.

OR LIKE, DO WE DO NEED CLARIFICATION? YES.

CAN I PROVIDE SOME CLARIFICATION? SO ON THE FLIP, SO THE MOTION IS SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED IN YOUR TABLE ON THREE SIX.

IF YOU GO UP TO SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED CURRENTLY RIGHT NOW IT INCLUDES TOWNHOMES, DUPLEXES, TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS.

THE MOTION IS TO REMOVE TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS.

SO THAT WOULD LEAVE FOR SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED.

THAT WOULD LEAVE TOWN HOMES AND DUPLEXES.

SO THAT'S THE MOTION ON THE TABLE TO REMOVE, TO JUST KEEP FOR SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED.

IT WOULD JUST INCLUDE TOWNHOUSES AND DUPLEXES, NOT TRIPLEXES OR COTTAGE COURTS.

[03:15:01]

SO THE COTTAGE COURTS, ARE WE CONSIDERING THEM ATTACHED? BECAUSE ATTACHED BE, COULD BE.

ARE WE CONSIDERING THAT ATTACHED? BECAUSE THEY WOULD BE ON THE SAME LOT.

IN OTHER WORDS, BECAUSE I KNOW THAT, SO WHAT I DO, SO, SO I KNOW ATTACHED WITH, WITH, WITH, WITH TOWN HOMES, IT'S THE LAND UP.

IT IS SEPARATE, IT'S SINGLE FAMILY BECAUSE THE LAND UP UNDER EACH TOWN HOME IS, IS DIFFERENT.

IT IS PLANTED DIFFERENT, BUT THEY SHARE A WALL.

BUT THEY SHARE A WALL.

WHERE A CONDO IS THE SAME BUILD, BUT IT'S, IT, UH, IT HAS ONE CONTINUOUS LAND USE.

IS THAT THE SAME THING THAT WE'RE SAYING ABOUT COTTAGE HOMES? COTTAGE.

COTTAGE, YOU CAN HAVE A COTTAGE COURT WHERE YOU HAVE A SINGLE, A SINGLE, A DUPLEX.

A SINGLE.

SO IN THIS INSTANCE, THAT WOULD BE SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED, ATTACHED FAMILY DETACHED.

BEFORE SHE SAID, OKAY, SO I GOT IT.

SO, 'CAUSE I UNDERSTAND TOWN HOMES, ONE, TOWN HOMES, CONDOS.

I UNDERSTAND THOSE, THE REASONS.

COMMISSIONER HERBERT, UM, I'M NOT SURE THIS MAY BE A FRIENDLY, UH, IF ACCEPTED OR, BUT FOR MY PROTECTIONS OF THE PROTECTIONS OF MY NEIGHBORS, I WOULD'VE, UM, KEPT TOWN HOMES IN DUPLEXES, UM, POSSIBLY TRIPLEXES.

BUT UNDER COTTAGE COURTS, I WOULD RESTRICT COTTAGE COURTS TO BE, UM, NO MORE THAN QUAD, UH, A FOURPLEX.

BUT WE'VE ALREADY LEFT COTTAGE COURTS.

HIS MOTION IS TO STRIKE COMMISSIONER, UH, HERBERT IS TRYING TO DO A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT.

I I'LL NOT ACCEPT THAT.

WHICH SHE WILL NOT ACCEPT.

SO YOU CAN COME BACK AND MAKE THAT AN UNFRIENDLY AMENDMENT IF YOU'D LIKE, BUT WE CAN JUST KEEP THIS ON THERE.

COURT QUADPLEX IS THE SAME AS, IS IS WORSE THAN A TRIPLEX IS MORE THAN A TRIPLEX.

SO, NO, I, I'M, I'M SORRY, COMMISSIONER.

SO I'LL MAKE A UNFRIENDLY AMENDMENT.

AND IF I HAVE, I'LL MAKE A COMMENT AFTERWARDS.

SO MY UNFRIENDLY AMENDMENT WOULD BE TO, UM, LEAVE AS WRITTEN RE UM, IN RESTRICTING COTTAGE COURTS TO NO MORE THAN QUAD QUADS.

AND IF I HAVE A SECOND, I'LL TALK TO Y YOU DO HAVE A SECOND.

SO IF SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED WITH COTTAGE COURTS IN IT AS IT IS TODAY DOES NOT RESTRICT SIZE, WE CAN HAVE NINE PLEXES IN A COURT THAT'S SHARED.

AND NOW WE HAVE A MULTITUDE OF HOMES.

THAT'S WHY I DECIDED TO RESTRICT IT.

UM, THE WAY COTTAGE HOMES I'VE SEEN BE SUCCESSFUL WITH QUADS AND TRIPLEXES IS THERE WAS A SHARED PARKING, AND THEN THOSE QUADS ALL HAD ACCESS TO THE COMMUNITY GARDEN IN THE MIDDLE, OR THE LANDSCAPING IN THE MIDDLE.

UM, THE BEST I'VE SEEN IT DONE WAS AT A QUAD LEVEL AND IS WHY I PUT THAT PARAMETER IN.

UM, I'M WILLING TO DISCUSS MORE, BUT LIMITING THE COTTAGE COURTS UNDER SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED, I THINK MAKES SENSE BECAUSE BY THE UNITS BEING ATTACHED, UM, A LOT CAN BE DONE.

AND I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THE NEIGHBORHOODS ARE SAFE.

UH, EXTRA RUBEN, FOLLOW THAT.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER WHEELER.

COMMISSIONER, I APPRECIATE THE INTENT OF COMMISSIONER HERBERT'S AMENDMENT TO THE AMENDMENT.

MY CONCERN IS THAT I UNDERSTAND THAT A LOT OF, YOU KNOW, FOUR MAY BE A GOOD SORT OF POINT FOR MANY COTTAGE COURTS, BUT THERE MAY BE INSTANCES WHERE CREATIVITY AND FLEXIBILITY CALL FOR A LARGE, LARGER COTTAGE COURT, FOR EXAMPLE, LET'S JUST SAY THERE ARE TWO SIDE BY SIDE LOTS OR A DOUBLE LOT, MAYBE SIX MIGHT MAKE SENSE, OR EIGHT MIGHT MAKE SENSE FOR A SENSITIVELY DESIGNED COTTAGE COURT.

SO I WOULD PROBABLY LEAVE THE NUMBER UP FOR FURTHER DISCUSSION WHEN WE SEE AMENDMENTS TO OUR DEVELOPMENT CODE, OR WHEN WE SEE APPLICATIONS FOR A PD OR SOMETHING LIKE TO, TO HEAR THAT RATHER THAN IMPOSE A SORT OF CAP AT THIS POINT.

AND, AND WE'LL JUST NEED TO BE SENSITIVE TO NUMBERS MOVING FORWARD.

COMMISSIONER, UH, KINGSTON? YEAH, I THINK WE'RE GETTING TOO FAR IN THE WEEDS ON WHAT COTTAGE COURT IS GONNA BE.

WHAT I WOULD ANTICIPATE IS WE'RE GONNA AMEND OUR DEVELOPMENT CODE TO HAVE AN ENTIRE SECTION ON COTTAGE COURTS.

THE CITY OF ARLINGTON RECENTLY AMENDED THEIR DEVELOPMENT CODE TO HAVE AN ENTIRE SECTION ON COTTAGE COURTS, WHICH DEFINES WHAT A COTTAGE COURT IS WITH ALL OF THE DIFFERENT PIECES THAT I THINK YOU'RE LOOKING FOR.

I THINK THAT IS AN IMPLEMENTATION PIECE AND NOT A 30,000 FOOT PLANNING PIECE.

AND SO I THINK WE NEED TO REMEMBER WE'RE AT THE 30,000 FOOT, NOT THE GROUND LEVEL.

NOT THE GROUND LEVEL.

UNDERSTOOD.

MY AND I, MY THINKING IS TO WHAT'S PRIMARY, WHAT'S SECONDARY? BUT I DEFINITELY AGREE.

[03:20:01]

I, I, I, I DEFINITELY AGREE, BUT I THINK IT'S, IT'S GOOD THAT WE ARE SPEAKING ON IT NOW SO THAT PUD CAN, CAN CONSIDER THAT.

BECAUSE WHEN WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT LARGER, I'M GONNA TALK AT THAT POINT, I'M LOOKING AT THAT'S ASSURE, ALMOST ASSURE ACCESS WITH A, WITH TOWN HOME DISTRICT TYPE OF DEAL FOR KEEPS IT COTTAGEY FILLED.

WHEN YOU GO TO TALKING ABOUT MORE UNITS AND ATTACHED, ATTACHED, YOU'RE LOOKING AT TOWNHOMES, AT TOWNHOMES CONDO OR WHATEVER WE CALL THEM.

WHEREAS I THINK WHAT HE, WHAT WHAT COMMISSIONER HERBERT IS SAYING, LET'S GET FOUR UNITS HERE, FOUR UNITS HERE, FOUR UNITS HERE, AND STILL HAVE THAT COURTYARD FIELD.

UM, BUT THAT CONTINUOUS BUILDING MIGHT TAKE AWAY FROM THE COURTYARD, UM, TYPE OF SITUATION THAT I THINK YOU'RE LOOKING AT.

THE COURTYARD PLAYS A, THE COURT, THE COURT PART OF COTTAGE IS WHAT HE'S TRYING TO MAKE SURE STAYS COMMISSIONER AIRE.

WE HAVE NOT HAD OFFICIAL DEFINITION THAT WE'RE USING FOR COTTAGE COURT UNTIL THEN.

I CAN'T, YOU GUYS ARE DOING NOTHING BUT CONFUSING THE SITUATION WITH TRYING TO DEFINE SOMETHING THAT'S NOT DEFINED, ESPECIALLY NO REFINE SOMETHING THAT HAS NOT BEEN DEFINED.

YOU CAN'T REFINE IT UNTIL YOU DEFINE IT.

UM, THEN NUMBER TWO, UM, AND I SEE, UH, UH, MR. AGUS GOT HIS HAND UP.

LIKE, UH, SO, BUT YOU, CAN I FINISH BEFORE YOU? IF YOU, YOU, YOU GIVE US A DEFINITION, UM, BUT THEN IF I'M LOOKING AT SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED, I BELIEVE WHAT THE INTENT READS TO ME, YOU HAVE, AND IT SHOULD MAYBE HAVE BEEN IN A DIFFERENT ORDER.

YOU HAVE DUPLEX, WHICH IS TWO FAMILIES ATTACHED, OR TWO LIVING UNITS, DWELLING UNITS ATTACHED.

YOU HAVE TRIPLEX, WHICH ARE THREE UNITS ATTACHED.

YOU HAVE TOWN HOMES, WHICH WOULD BE FOUR OR MORE SINGLE FAMILY UNITS ATTACHED BEFORE YOU GO TO MUL MULTIPLEX.

AND IT'S, AND IF THAT IS THE INTENT, THEN I CAN SEE IF YOU, AND, AND IF YOU'RE DEFINING COTTAGE CORDS AS SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT, YOUR YOUR, YOUR SPEAK, YOUR MICROPHONE IS STILL ON.

IF YOU'RE DEFINING COTTAGE CORDS AS SMALLER AS AS SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED, SHARING A, A, A GREEN SHARING, UH, THE FRONT YARDS, THEN I WOULD SAY THE ONLY THING THAT, THAT LEAVING TRIPLEXES DUPLEXES IN TOWN HOMES AND SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED ALONE AND POSSIBLY REMOVING COTTAGE COURTS BECAUSE IT'S SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

IF YOU THAT, IF YOU ARE DEFINING COTTAGE COURTS AS SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED, SHARING, SHARING THE, THE, THE WALKING SPACE IN THE FRONT AND AND SHARING THE PARKING IN THE BACK.

SO THAT'S MY STAR GO.

KINGSTON DID A GREAT GOOD JOB EXPLAINING THAT THE CODE WOULD BE THAT PIECE THAT ELABORATES ON WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE.

LOTS TO UNPACK THERE.

SO, UM, SO , SO ON THE SCREEN, UH, I THINK EARLIER IN THE PREVIOUS MOTION WE MENTIONED, UH, THIS DEFINITION IN TERMS OF COLLEGE COURTS, AND I THINK EVERYBODY WAS OKAY WITH THIS PARTICULAR DEFINITION.

I CAN REREAD IT.

UM, BUT IN ADDITION TO THIS, WE CAN ALSO, IF YOU LOOK IN THE GLOSSARY UNDER CLUSTERED HOUSING, THAT'S ALSO ANOTHER TERM THAT COTTAGE COURTS USE.

UH, WE CAN EITHER DO A FEW THINGS IN TERMS OF USING THIS DEFINITION ON THEIR SCREEN, UH, FOR THAT AS WELL.

AND MAYBE JUST DEFINING IN THE GLOSSARY, COTTAGE COURTS SLASH CLUSTERED HOUSING, UH, THAT COULD BE A WAY OF DOING THAT AS WELL.

I JUST WANNA JUST GO BACK TO THIS DEFINITION THAT I THOUGHT WE, UH, WE HAD CLARIFIED THAT WE WANTED TO GO FORWARD WITH FOR COTTAGE COURTS.

UH, SECONDLY, GOING BACK TO THE MATRIX, AND I'LL COME BACK TO THIS, GOING BACK TO THE MATRIX OVER HERE.

JUST TO BE CLEAR ON WHAT WE'RE, WE'RE LOOKING AT IN THIS MATRIX.

UH, THE, THE LAND USES OR THE EXAMPLES THAT ARE UNDERNEATH EACH OF THESE LAND USES ARE EXAMPLES.

THESE ARE NOT THE DEFINITIONS OF THESE LAND USES.

IT'S MORE TO KIND OF GET A GENERAL UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT YOU TYPICALLY SEE IN THESE LAND USES.

UH, SO IF KIND OF DEFINING WHAT THE, THE NUMBER IS, I THINK COMMISSIONER

[03:25:01]

THIS IS MEANT TO JUST GIVE A GENERAL IDEA OF WHAT YOU TYPICALLY SEE IN THESE, UM, LAND USES.

SO IF E EITHER OF THESE ARE CAUSING CONFUSION OR THEY DON'T EXIST NOW, OR NOT, UH, UH, A LAND USE THAT WE WANNA SEE IN THE FUTURE, WE CAN PLAY WITH THESE EXAMPLES.

BUT THE IDEA OF THESE EXAMPLES IS GIVE A GENERAL IDEA OF WHAT THESE LANE USES LOOK LIKE ON THE GROUND.

SO THESE ARE NOT MEANT TO DEFINE, WE CAN USE A GLOSSARY TO DO THAT.

BUT THE, THE IDEA OF THIS KIND OF PROVIDE GENERALLY WHAT THESE LAND USES TYPICALLY HAVE IN THEM.

THEY'RE NOT ALL EX, THEY'RE NOT EXHAUSTIVE, BUT TOUCH ON A FEW DIFFERENT THINGS.

AND CHAIR, I HAVE A POINT OF CLARIFICATION TO MY STATEMENT.

UM, WHEN I MENTIONED THE QUADS OR THE FOUR, I WAS MEANING A COURTYARD OF MULTIPLE FOURPLEXES, NOT FOUR HOUSES IN ONE.

JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT WAS CLEAR.

I UNDERSTOOD THAT PART.

THAT BLEW MY MIND NOW.

WELL, NO, AND I UNDERSTOOD THAT THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.

AND SO THAT'S WHY I WAS COMING BACK AROUND THAT I DON'T EVEN, THAT ISN'T NECESSARILY EVEN WHAT THE DEFINITION OF A COTTAGE COURT WOULD BE.

I THINK THAT'S MORE OF A FOURPLEX COMMUNITY THAT MAY BE DESIGNED AROUND A COURTYARD.

UM, BUT THAT'S GENERALLY NOT.

SO IN TO THAT POINT, I ATTACHED COURTYARDS COURT.

COTTAGE COURTS AREN'T POPULAR AT ALL.

RIGHT? RIGHT.

IT'S USUALLY SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

SO YES.

CAN I ASK A QUESTION? SURE.

IS COTTAGE COURT DEFINED IN OUR CODE? IS IS, HUH? NO.

THEN FOR A COMP PLAN, WE CAN'T USE SOMETHING THAT IS NOT DEFINED.

CAN WE OR CAN WE USE SOMETHING THAT'S NOT DEFINED IN OUR CODE? WE CAN YES, IT, BUT IT IS TO SAY IT IS NOT THE REGULATORY DEFINITION.

SO WHEN WE CAME, IF WE CAME BACK TO, WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT THIS AND SAY, OH, WHEN WE DO THE ZONING CODE UPDATE, WE NEED TO ADD COTTAGE COURTS INTO THE ZONING CODE UPDATE.

WE ARE NOT GOING TO BE BOUND TO ANY DEFINITION THAT'S IN IS WE WOULD USE THIS AS REFERENCE POINT.

BUT ONCE WE GET INTO THE REGULATION PIECE, THAT IS GOING TO GET FINALIZED IN THE ZONING CODE.

IT COULD BE DIFFERENT FROM THIS DEFINITION.

SO HELP ME UNDERSTAND WHY WE WOULD USE SOMETHING THAT'S NOT DEFINED AND USED IN OUR CODE UNTIL IT'S USED IN OUR CODE.

ARE THERE, ARE WE PUTTING THE CART BEFORE THE HORSE AND MAKING A COMP PLAN DEF ADD OR DEFINE CODE? OR SHOULD WE BE USING CODE AS A TOOL TO DEFINE OUR COMP PLAN? SO WHAT I WOULD SAY IS THAT THIS IS WHERE YOU LOOK AT ASPIRATIONAL, WHAT OUR CODE MIGHT CURRENTLY BE MISSING, WHAT YOU WANT TO SEE IN CERTAIN AREAS, AND SO THAT YOU CAN GIVE A NUDGE TO THE CODE WHEN IT GETS UPDATED.

THAT SAYS, WE NEED YOU TO INCLUDE A DEFINITION AND DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS FOR COTTAGE COURTS.

SO THEN A AND, AND HELP ME UNDERSTAND AGAIN, UH, AND, AND I'M THANK YOU THANKFUL FOR THIS, THIS CLARIFICATION THAT THIS, THIS DISCUSSION BECAUSE I, UH, UH, BUT HELP ME UNDERSTAND IF WE'RE DEF WHAT ARE WE DEFINING COTTAGE? WELL, WELL, WE ARE, WE'RE USING WHAT YOU HAD ON THE SCREEN AS COTTAGE COURT, AS AS A SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED.

THAT COULD BE ONE, ONE AND A HALF STORY, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH.

SO IF WE'RE USING THAT, UM, A GROUP OF SMALL ONE TO ONE AND A HALF STORY DETACHED STRUCTURES ARRANGED AROUND A SHARED COURT VISIBLE FROM THE STREET, THEN IF THAT'S WHAT WE'RE USING AS OUR DEFINITION, THEN COTTAGE COURTS SHOULD NOT BE IN SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED IF WE'RE, WE'RE DEFINING IT AS DETACHED TEST.

MR. RUBIN, I THINK I'M, I'M GOOD.

THAT THEY ARE EITHER PERPENDICULAR TO THE STREET OR ORIENTED TOWARDS THE STREET ON WHATEVER LANGUAGE.

AND I ACTUALLY WANNA MAKE AN OBSERVATION ON OUR DEFINITION, UM, BECAUSE I THINK WHAT MANY OF US ARE, OR WHAT I WOULD ENVISION, I, I WON'T SPEAK FOR THE BODY, IS THAT THESE WOULD BE ORIENTED TO THE STREET.

BECAUSE I THINK A LOT OF WHAT WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IS HOW WE'RE CREATING COMMUNITY ADDRESSING THE PUBLIC REALM.

AND SO AS WE CONSIDER THIS DEFINITION, PRESUMABLY AT A FUTURE MEETING, I WOULD SUGGEST THAT WE IN INCLUDE

[03:30:01]

I DON'T THINK THAT'S RIGHT.

CONSIDER DON'T, I DON'T THINK THAT IT'S TO THE COURTYARD.

YEAH, THEY'RE ORIENTED TO THE COURTYARD, BUT THAT THE OVERALL DEVELOPMENT WOULD OPEN TO THE STREET.

OH YEAH.

ESSENTIALLY.

DON'T PUT YOUR SIDE, DON'T PUT YOUR BACK THAT THEY ENGAGE WITH THE PUBLIC GROUND.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER.

ICK.

'CAUSE I'M A GOOGLE QUEEN.

I WENT AND I FOUND A DEVELOPMENT IN NEW HAMPSHIRE, IN KEEN NEW HAMPSHIRE THAT ACTUALLY HAS, AND I'M GONNA SAY IT, IT HAS, THEY HAVE AN ORDINANCE THAT WAS JUST DONE A MONTH AGO.

UM, COTTAGE COURTS ARE GROUPINGS OF SMALL HOUSING AROUND SHARED PUBLIC SPACE SPACE.

CONSIDER A TYPE OF MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING.

THEY CAN BE BUILT AS FAR SALE AS UP TO 1200 SQUARE FEET.

UM, AND THE PARKING IS IN THE REAR.

UM, BUT THEY WENT IN TO CREATE AN A, A ADOPTED PLAN FOR THIS PARTICULAR COURTYARD.

UM, SO I'M GONNA MAKE SURE I SEND THAT WITH THE STAFF BECAUSE SOMEBODY'S, WHAT THEY SAY IN, UH, MINNESOTA.

WHAT GOOD MAYORS DO.

GOOD MAYORS A COPY.

I MEAN STEAL.

SO WE WANNA MAKE SURE, I'M GONNA SEND THIS TO YOU ALL LIKE IT'S ALL WRITTEN UP AND IT'S READY TO GO.

TO YOLANDA.

COMMISSIONERS, ANY OTHER CLARIFICATIONS BEFORE WE TAKE A RECORDED VOTE? THE MOTION? ? CAN WE HOLD IT? COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, WE NEED A HISTORY, UH, BOOK ONE MORE TIME.

COMMISSIONER FORT THAT I'M, I'M SORRY.

THIS DISCUSSION GOES ON AND WE NEED TO BE REFRESHED.

OH, I'M MY APOLOGIES.

COMMISSIONER FORT, IT'S ACTUALLY, WE'RE ON COMMISSIONER HERBERT'S UNFRIENDLY, UH, AMENDMENT TO, UH, KEEP THE LANGUAGE AS IS.

BUT IS IT CORRECT TO SAY CAP AT FOUR? WOULD THAT BE CORRECT? UH, CAP ATTACHED KEPT THE ATTACHED HOMES INSIDE OF A COURTYARD AT FOUR? YES.

WHO SECONDED? COMMISSIONER? UH, HERBERT'S.

CAP.

THE ATTACHED RESTRICT COURTYARD AND TO QUADS AND ALL THAT IS, IS THERE A WAY WE CAN JUST HOLD A WHOLE THING UNTIL WE CAN GET SOME EXPLANATION? I THINK THIS HAS TO BE GOING.

UH, OKAY.

COMMISSIONER? NO.

MOTION.

DID YOU GET THAT, YOLANDA? YES.

LET'S TAKE A RECORDER.

DISTRICT EIGHT? I DON'T EVEN KNOW.

YES, I DO HAVE TO DO A NO, BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW.

SO WE GO BACK TO THE MOTION NOW.

COMMISSIONER FORESITE, PLEASE, SIR, IF YOU DON'T MIND REPEATING ONE MORE TIME.

I MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION BY, IN THE PLACE TYPES LAND USE MATRIX ON PAGES.

UH, PAGE THREE SIX, REMOVE TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS FROM SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED LAND USE CATEGORY ON THAT ONE.

SO IT IS TO REMOVE TRIPLEXES AND COTTAGE COURTS.

FROM SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED.

YEAH, WE'RE TRYING OUR BEST TO CONFUSE YOU, YOLANDA.

WE'VE DONE IT.

AND Y'ALL ARE DOING A THOROUGH JOB.

OKAY, SO THAT WAS FOUR SECONDS.

I'M READY.

WE'RE READY FOR YOUR YES, SIR.

DISTRICT ONE, DISTRICT TWO? NO.

DISTRICT 14 AND PLACE 15.

NO FAILS.

KNOW, NO, NO, NO, NO, GO AHEAD.

COMMISSIONER FORIN, DID YOU HAVE A THIRD MOTION, SIR? UH, UH, CHAIRMAN SHAE, I, I'M GONNA, UH, NOT MAKE ANY FURTHER MOTIONS.

IT'S OBVIOUS THAT, UH, THIS COMMISSION IS, UH, YOU

[03:35:01]

GO AHEAD WITH YOUR NEXT.

UH, YES.

I HAVE A RIGHT TO EXPRESS THE REASON WHY I'M NOT MAKING ANY FURTHER MOTIONS, BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY ANY MOTIONS THAT I MAKE, OR LIKE SEEDS THAT ARE THROWN ONTO CONCRETE, UM, IT'S CLEAR THAT THIS COMMISSION HAS, YOU KNOW, ON ONE HAND SAID THAT WE'RE MOVING METROPLEXES TO A SECONDARY LAND USE.

BUT ON THE OTHER HAND, NOW WE'RE PUTTING ALL THESE SECONDARY LAND USES INTO THE PRIMARY LAND USE CATEGORIES, YOU KNOW, AND, AND SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE BASICALLY MAKING IT SO THAT THE FOLKS THAT WERE HERE THIS MORNING ARE NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THIS PLAN WHEN IT GOES TO THE CITY COUNCIL.

YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE MADE IT VERY CLEAR THAT SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS SHOULD BE ONE LOT ONE HOME.

AND, AND THEY DON'T WANT, UH, THESE, UH, COTTAGE COURTS.

THEY DON'T WANT ADUS, THEY DON'T WANT THE TINY HOMES ON IN, IN SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS.

IT CERTAINLY SHOULD NOT BE A PRIMARY LAND USE.

WE WERE WILLING TO COMPROMISE BY INCLUDING THE SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS IN THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE, AS LONG AS YOU GUYS WERE WILLING TO PUT ALL THESE OTHER THINGS THAT WE DON'T WANT IN SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS IN THAT SECONDARY LAND USE CATEGORY, AND YOU'RE NOT WILLING TO DO IT.

SO GUESS WHAT? THE FOLKS WHO ARE HERE THIS MORNING ARE GONNA CONTINUE TO OPPOSE THIS PLAN.

AND WHEN IT GOES AS CITY COUNSEL, I'LL BE WITH THEM IN OPPOSING THIS PLAN.

MAKE SURE WE, THERE.

I I, I WANNA, I WANNA SAY THAT, LORD, PLEASE DON'T LET ME HAVE ETHICS TODAY THAN ETHICS VIOLATION.

THE MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE THAT COME IN THIS ROOM DOES NOT REPRESENT THE WHOLE DALLAS.

THE SOUTHERN SECTOR IS VERY UNDERREPRESENTED WHEN IT COMES TO PEOPLE COMING TO SPEAK.

UM, MAYBE BECAUSE THEY HAVE JOBS.

MAYBE 'CAUSE THEY CAN'T TAKE OFF FROM WORK.

MAYBE, MAYBE, MAYBE.

I DON'T KNOW.

BUT WHAT I DO HEAR THEM SAY IS THAT, FIRST OF ALL, WE HAVE MAJORITY OF RENTERS IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR, WHICH MEANS THAT WE ARE GONNA ALWAYS NEED DIFFERENT TYPE OF HOUSE TYPES.

WE'RE GONNA NEED HOME PLACE TYPES.

WE'RE GONNA NEED SINGLE FAMILY, LARGE, SMALL, OUR AGING IN PLACE ARE VERY MUCH DISPLACED.

UM, THERE'S NOT ENOUGH SENIOR LIVING.

THERE'S NOT ENOUGH SENIOR COMMUNITY LIVING.

UM, THERE ARE SO MANY THINGS THAT PLAY AND I UNDERSTAND SINGLE FAMILY HOME.

I AM A SINGLE FAMILY TYPE OF PERSON.

I LIKE YARDS.

I LIKE ALL THAT.

BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT AS I GET OLDER, UM, I'M PROBABLY GONNA WANNA DOWNSIZE.

RIGHT? I'M, I'M RIGHT NOW, I, I WANNA ADD ON EVERY THREE, FOUR YEARS TO MY HOUSE, RIGHT? BUT I ALSO KNOW IF MY HUSBAND IS 10 YEARS OLDER THAN ME, AND I MIGHT HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF HIM IN A COUPLE YEARS AND I'M GONNA NEED SOMETHING.

I MEAN, THESE ARE THE THINGS.

SO A LOT OF THE, THE LOUDEST VOICE IS NOT ALWAYS THE REPRESENTATION.

WE HAVE A MILLION PEOPLE IN DALLAS AND A HUNDRED THOUSAND VOTE, UM, BECAUSE OF WHATEVER REASON.

BUT I'M GONNA SAY THAT VERY SELDOM DO I SEE THE SOUTHERN SECTOR, UM, THE MINORITY, UH, UH, THE MINORITIES OF DALLAS COMING AND SPEAK ON THIS.

'CAUSE THEY DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND RIGHT NOW.

THE ONLY THING THEY CAN EVEN CONSIDER IS HOW CAN I PAY MY BILLS? WHEN CAN I PAY MY RENT? AND THEY'RE NOT REPRESENTING.

SO I CAN'T JUST BECAUSE THE LOUDEST VOICES ARE SAYING NO.

AND I UNDERSTAND THAT IN CERTAIN AREAS THAT PEOPLE WANNA MAINTAIN, MAINTAIN SINGLE FAMILY, I WANT THAT TO HAPPEN.

I TAKE THAT IN CONSIDERATION, THE CORRIDORS AND WHERE DOES THIS FIT? IT'S NOT A ONE SIZE FIT ALL DALLAS, RIGHT? NOW, IN SOME OF THOSE AREAS, THEY'RE SAYING THEY WANNA KEEP SINGLE FAMILY, HAVE 30 DIFFERENT TYPE OF PLACE TYPES THAT A HISTORICAL HAS BEEN THERE FOR, UM, OVER ALMOST A HUNDRED YEARS.

SO I DON'T THINK THAT THE MAJORITY OF DALLAS SPEAKING, I'M THINKING THAT THE MORE AFFLUENT, SOME OF THE ONES WHO HAVE TIME TO GET OFF FROM WORK, BUT OUR YOUNGER PEOPLE ARE OUR, OUR SENIORS.

THOSE THAT, THAT, THAT NEED IT RIGHT NOW, A, A FA A ONE, A TWO FAMILY, A FOUR FAMILY, UM, NEW FAMILY THAT'S IN THEIR LATE TWENTIES, EARLY THIRTIES, CANNOT AFFORD TO BUY HOUSING IN DALLAS.

THAT'S NOT REPRESENTATION.

AND THEY DEFINITELY CAN'T RENT A NEW FAMILY.

MATTER OF FACT, A NEWLYWED COUPLE WITH NO CHILDREN CANNOT BUY HOUSING.

THEY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH HOUSING OPTIONS, WHICH MAKE THE HOUSING MARKET GO UP.

SO THAT'S NOT A REPRESENTATION, UM, OF DALLAS.

IT'S JUST NOT, IT HAS NEVER BEEN A MILLION.

THERE'S A, THERE'S, THERE'S A MILLION VOTERS OR, OR CLOSE TO, UH, UH, THAT, AND AGAIN, IN EACH DISTRICT WE HAVE 24, 2500 PEOPLE THAT COME OUT AND VOTE.

THAT'S JUST THE PEOPLE THAT ARE COMMITTED TO DOING THAT.

SO I THINK THAT

[03:40:01]

MAYBE I, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE ON ONE, I MEAN, YOU REPRESENT DISTRICT FOUR AND I KNOW FOR A FACT DISTRICT FOUR NEEDS MORE HOUSING.

IT IS THE BIG, IT IS ONE OF THE MOST POVERTY S STRICT IN DISTRICTS IN DI IN IN THIS CITY, RIGHT? ALONG WITH DISTRICT EIGHT, DISTRICT FIVE, DISTRICT FOUR, I MEAN ON DISTRICT, UH, UH, THREE AND DISTRICT TWO, RIGHT? AND I JUST DON'T BELIEVE THAT SINGLE FAMILY I I, I IS, IS REPRESENTED WHEN PEOPLE COME IN THIS AUDIENCE, YOU CAN LOOK AT, YOU CAN LOOK AT THE REPRESENTATION AND SAY THAT DALLAS IS NOT REPRESENTED.

'CAUSE IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE DALLAS.

THERE'S NOT, YOU SEE VERY FEW OTHER THAN IN THAT AUDIENCE.

WHEN THEY COME, YEAH, THEY'RE LOUD AND SPEAKING.

AND I UNDERSTAND ONE PROTECT 3, 400, 700, $800,000 HOMES.

BUT MAN, LISTEN, IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD WHERE WE WAS PAYING FOR, I PAID $25,000 FOR MY HOUSE.

I, MY TAXES IS A TWO, IS GETTING CLOSER TO $200,000, UM, FOR, UH, APPRAISAL.

'CAUSE SOMEONE BUILT A MEGA MANSION NEXT DOOR.

I'D RATHER IT BEEN SPLIT IN TWO HOUSES THAN SOME SINGLE FAMILY YOUNG PEOPLE COULD HAVE MOVED IN.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, IF COMMISSIONER FORTH, THAT IS FINISHED WITH MOTIONS.

I HAVE ANOTHER ONE.

COMMISSIONER BLAIR, DID YOU, UM, I WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT, UM, COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT, THAT, THAT DON'T BE DISCOURAGED.

UM, YOU MAY HAVE GOTTEN NOT GOTTEN A POSITIVE VOTE ON THESE, BUT YOU HAVE ON SOME OTHER CASES.

AND WHAT I'M, WHAT I WOULD SAY TO YOU THAT WHEN YOU LOOK AT YOUR MULTIFAMILY OF AND AND REDEFINING THOSE, YOU MAY FIND SOME FAVORABLE VOTES THAT YOU DIDN'T FIND ELSEWHERE.

DON'T BE DISCOURAGED.

KEEP MOVING ON.

AND SOME, AND WHEN I WAS IN CORPORATE AMERICA, SOMETIMES YOU HAD TO TAKE 15 NOS TO GET A YES.

SO KEEP MOVING ON MR. HERBERT.

THANK YOU, UH, COMMISSIONER FORESITE, YOU'RE MY NEIGHBOR.

I UNDERSTAND YOUR INTENT.

I'M DEALING WITH SOME OF THE SAME VOICES YOU'RE DEALING WITH, BUT I'M ALSO DEALING WITH ANOTHER SIDE OF, OF THOSE VOICES THAT ARE ASKING FOR NOT EVEN A PLACE TO LIVE.

I LIVE HERE.

THIS IS THE TYPE OF LIVING I HAVE.

I WANT TO BE INCLUDED.

THAT'S IMPORTANT.

I'M GETTING MY BUTT KICKED ACROSS THE BOARD IN SEVERAL DISTRICTS OTHER THAN MY OWN.

MY PEOPLE ARE SUPPORTING ME.

I'VE TRIED TO COMPLY AS MUCH AS I CAN WITH EVERYBODY, UM, TO GET WHAT WE NEEDED AND BE STRICT ABOUT IT.

UM, I TRIED TO MOVE THE NEEDLE EVEN ON COTTAGE COURSE JUST NOW.

MY MY GOOD FAVOR IS OVER.

UM, SO I GET IT.

UH, I UNDERSTAND YOUR INPUT AND TRUST ME, I UNDERSTAND YOUR FRUSTRATION AS WELL.

AND TO COMMISSIONER BLAIR'S POINT, WE HAVE TO FIND COMPROMISE ALONG THE WAY.

WE'RE NOT GOING TO WIN THEM ALL.

I'VE LOST MORE THAN I WON HERE, BUT I COME BACK TO THE TABLE WITH AN OPEN END AND OPEN HEAD.

'CAUSE I KNOW I'M GONNA NEED EACH AND ONE OF YOU GUYS AS WE MOVE FORWARD.

SO, I'LL COM SEND THE SAME THING OUT TO YOU.

I'LL ASK YOU TO SPEAK WITH YOUR GROUP AND GET THAT UNDERSTANDING.

UM, AND THEN TAKE TIME TO BETTER VIEW WHAT, WHAT CAN HAPPEN WITH COTTAGE COURTS.

I THINK WITHOUT UNDERSTANDING COMPLETELY WHAT COTTAGE COURTS ARE, UM, YOU, YOU COULD BE DENYING SOMETHING, UM, THAT COULD BE POTENTIALLY GROUNDBREAKING FOR DISTRICT THREE.

UH, DISTRICT FOUR, THANK YOU.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS? COMMISSIONERS? OKAY, LET'S COME BACK AT TWO O'CLOCK.

LET'S TAKE A BREAK.

CHAIR.

THE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE PIECE AND THE OTHER PIECES OF THIS DOCUMENT.

I NEED A CLARIFICATION.

YES, PLEASE.

UM, THERE WAS A MOTION, THE FIRST MOTION, WHICH WAS FROM FORSYTH AND HAMPTON.

I'D JUST LIKE TO KNOW WHAT HAPPENED WITH THAT MOTION, BECAUSE THERE WAS AN ORIGINAL MOTION.

I UNDERSTOOD THOSE TO BE WITHDRAWN.

THAT COMMISSIONER, I UNDERSTOOD THEM TO BE WITHDRAWN WHEN COMMISSIONER FORSYTH SAID HE NO LONGER WANTED TO MAKE THOSE.

WELL, THE VERY FIRST ONE WAS WITHDRAWN BECAUSE COMMISSIONER RUBIN RIGHTLY REQUESTED WE DO AMEN.

BREAK.

MUST HAVE MISSED THAT.

THANK YOU FOR THE, I I THINK WE HAVE ONE MORE COMMENT.

I WANNA ADDRESS ONE THING I SEE MY COLLEAGUE, UM, WHO IS DISAPPOINTED WITH THE LAST VOTE LEAVING.

AND I KNOW THAT THIS HOUSING PIECE IS INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT TO YOU AND TO ALL OF US IN THE WAY THAT THE VOTES WENT.

YOU KNOW, YOU'RE, YOU'RE OBVIOUSLY DISSATISFIED WITH THEM, BUT WE HAVE INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT WORK LEFT TO DO TODAY WHEN IT COMES TO

[03:45:01]

SO WITH, WITH GREAT RESPECT, I WOULD IMPLORE YOU TO STAY WITH US FOR THE REST OF THE DAY AND ADVOCATE FOR DISTRICT FOUR, NOT JUST ON THIS PIECE, BUT ON THE ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE PIECE AS WELL, WHICH IS INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT TO DISTRICT FOUR AND OTHER DISTRICTS THROUGHOUT THE CITY.

SO I, I HOPE YOU WILL RECONSIDER YOUR DECISION TO, TO LEAVE.

OKAY, COMMISSIONER, LET'S TAKE A 15 MINUTE BREAK.

1 52.

WE ARE RECORDING.

IT IS TWO 15.

WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD.

UM, BEFORE WE HEAD BACK INTO OUR, UH, OUR SHEET HERE OF EIGHT ITEMS, VICE CHAIR HAS A AMENDMENT YES.

ON THE PLACE TYPE MATRIX.

PUT ON YOUR SEAT BELT AND I'LL, I'LL BE HAPPY TO SPEAK TO IT IN JUST A MOMENT.

UM, IT IS THREE DASH SIX ON MULTIPLEX AND APARTMENT.

CHANGE THE DEFINITION OF MULTIPLEX TO EIGHT OR FEWER ATTACHED DWELLING UNITS AND FOR APARTMENTS, CHANGE IT TO MULTIFAMILY WITH NINE OR MORE ATTACHED DWELLING UNITS.

AND IF I HAVE A SECOND, I'M HAPPY TO, I'LL SECOND, I'LL SECOND THAT.

COMMISSIONER BLAIR WILL SECOND THAT.

UH, I HAD A REALLY GOOD CONVERSATION WITH ONE OF OUR SPEAKERS TODAY WHILE WE WERE ON BREAK, WHERE, UM, SHE MADE THE VERY GOOD POINT THAT, UM, AND EIGHT PLEX ALLOWS FOUR AND FOUR TO BE BUILT.

SO IT'S ABLE TO BE MORE SENSITIVE AS TO HEIGHT IN EXISTING, UM, NEIGHBORHOODS.

WHEREAS NINE LARGELY, UM, MAKES IT MUCH MORE LIKELY THAT IT WILL GO UP TO AN ADDITIONAL STORY.

UM, AND, AND GIVEN THE EXPERIENCE, UM, THAT, THAT I THINK SOME OF THE EXAMPLES THAT SHE BROUGHT TO MY ATTENTION, I THINK THAT'S A REALLY SENSIBLE SOLUTION TO, UM, ADDRESS MISSING METAL.

ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT? COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, PLEASE.

I'LL ALSO SAY THAT IS AN IMPROVEMENT.

'CAUSE RIGHT NOW THE MULTIPLEX IS FEWER THAN 10 AND THE APARTMENT IS MORE THAN 10.

SO I GUESS 10 WOULDN'T BE ALLOWED.

ANYWAY, WE, WE CAUGHT THAT AND WE, WE THOUGHT WE WOULD LEAVE THAT FOR LATER, BUT I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN, OF COURSE YOU WOULD'VE CAUGHT THAT.

GOSH, I, I CAN NEVER WIN WITH DEBRA.

NEVER.

NOBODY CAN I KNOW.

OH, YOU CAN CALL ME TONY, I DON'T MIND.

UH, THANK YOU FOR STAYING WITH US.

UH, APPRECIATE THE INPUT COMMISSION.

ANY COMMENTS ON THAT? WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND THEN.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.

ANY OPPOSED? ONE NA OVER THERE.

MOTION CARRIES.

UH, I BELIEVE IT WAS COMMISSIONER CHER.

OKAY, NOW WE GO BACK TO ITEM.

I THINK WE'RE ON SIX.

IS THAT RIGHT? YES.

UPDATE CONTEXT, UPDATED CONTEXT, LANGUAGE AND ADDED LOCATION STRATEGIES AND DESIGN CONSIDERATIONS TO THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE.

TYPE THREE 16 THROUGH THREE 19.

MAY I ASK JUST ONE POINT OF CLARIFICATION? ABSOLUTELY, PLEASE.

UM, THREE SIX AND THREE SEVEN.

I THINK WE HAD A HANDFUL OF OTHER CHANGES.

I'M PRESUMING IF WE HAVE COMMENTS ON THOSE, WE'LL BRING THEM FORWARD AT A LATER DATE.

THERE'S OTHER PINK ITEMS THAT WE HAVE NOT DISCUSSED TODAY.

IT'S UP TO YOU.

YEAH, IF YOU, YEAH, I DON'T MIND TAKING 'EM ON.

YEAH, WELL WHY NOT? YOU WANNA DO THEM? I JUST WANTED TO NOTE THERE WERE MORE AND THAT I WOULD LIKELY HAVE COMMENTS AT ANOTHER MEETING.

IT'S UP TO YOU.

WE CAN TAKE 'EM NOW IF YOU'D LIKE.

I, I WOULD RATHER COME BACK.

SHE'S NOT READY.

IT'S OKAY.

, WE'RE PUTTING PRESSURE ON YOU, .

IT WILL BE UPDATED BY COMMISSIONER HERBERT'S LANGUAGE THAT WAS PUT FORWARD TO EXACTLY.

UH, NO, WE'RE, WE'RE GONNA DO, I THINK WE'RE ON SIX, BUT, UH, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON WAS JUST POINTING OUT THERE ARE OTHER CHANGES THAT WE DO NEED TO, TO ADDRESS.

UM, SO WE'RE ON SIX UPDATED, COULD I, JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, COULD I POINT OUT THAT I THINK IN ADDITION TO ANYTHING THAT WAS UPDATED IN HERE, THERE ARE SOME THINGS THAT PER THE LANGUAGE THAT WAS VOTED ON THIS MORNING IN COMMISSIONER HERBERT'S MOTION WILL SUPERSEDE WILL, WILL INCLUDE UPDATES TO THAT.

SO ANYTHING THAT IS A LOT OF THIS WHAT'S, SORRY, I'M, TO MAKE IT CLEAR WHAT'S CURRENTLY IN THE DRAFT IN PINK, SOME OF

[03:50:01]

AND SO IT'S SORT OF A MOTION NOW.

IT'S NUMBER SIX PLUS THE, THE MOTION THAT WAS PUT FORTH TODAY.

SO I HAVE A QUESTION.

SPLITS THAT OUT.

I HAVE A QUESTION THEN.

NOT TO BOG US DOWN.

A LOT OF HIS MOTION TOUCHED A LOT ON, ON COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL.

WOULD IT BE EASIER TO UPDATE THIS BEFORE WE DISCUSS THREE NUMBER ITEM NUMBER SIX ON THIS PAGE? WELL, THIS HAS BEEN DECIDED ON, THIS IS WHAT WE'RE GOING WITH EXCEPT FOR, I THINK THERE WAS THE, THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT BY COMMISSIONER FORESIGHT.

SO THIS IS WHAT WE'RE GOING WITH.

SO THIS WILL GET UPDATED TO REFLECT THIS.

THANK, SO IF THERE'S ANYTHING IN THESE PAGES THAT WEREN'T ADDRESSED THROUGH THIS, WE CAN TACKLE THAT.

VICE CHAIR RUBEN.

THE, THE WAY THAT I READ THE MOTION THAT COMMISSIONER HERBERT, UH, INTRODUCED THIS MORNING THAT WE PASSED WAS THE SECOND AND THIRD ITEMS HOUSING CHOICE AND ACCESS.

IT SAYS A ONE.

I THOUGHT THAT WAS IN THE POLICY IMPLEMENTATION SECTION.

UM, SO WE REPLACED THE DESIGN STANDARDS LANGUAGE THAT WE HAVE IN THE IMPLEMENTATION SECTION, WHICH I BELIEVE IN SECTION FOUR WITH THIS NEW A ONE.

AND THEN WE ADD A NEW ITEM ON THE LOCATIONAL CRITERIA.

ALSO AN IMPLEMENTATION TABLE.

MY UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT THIS DID NOT ALTER PAGES THREE 16 THROUGH THREE 19, WHICH ADDRESS THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE.

BUT DOES THE INTRODUCTION THAT, I GUESS I HAVE A QUESTION.

I'M CONFUSED ABOUT WHERE THE INTRODUCTION LANGUAGE GOES.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE DOCUMENT HAS AN INTRODUCTION.

SO WE CAN MAKE SURE THAT THE LANGUAGE THAT WAS ADOPTED THIS MORNING THAT IT'S CONSISTENT IN THIS SECTION AS WELL.

'CAUSE THERE'S SOME INFORMATION ABOUT LOCATIONS THAT WAS ADOPTED THIS MORNING THAT WE WOULD THEN, THAT'S ALSO IN THIS SECTION.

BUT JUST MAKING SURE THAT THAT IS CONSISTENT.

HAVE TO THINK ABOUT IT BEEN MAYBE DO WE CHANGE IT TO, UM, DIFFERENT OR WE COULD BE POTENTIALLY SAY DIFFERENT TYPES OF HOUSING THAT ARE SENSITIVELY INTEGRATED AND WE DON'T EVEN PUT IN THE EXAMPLES.

AND TO, TO ADD TO THAT, I THINK THE LANGUAGE THAT WAS PROPOSED WAS FOR THE IMPLEMENTATION TABLE, BUT I THINK THAT SHOULD BE CONSISTENT IN THE IMPLEMENTATION TABLE, THE THEME IN THIS PARTICULAR PLACE TYPE, UH, AS WELL.

THAT SOUNDS WONDERFUL TO ME.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMISSIONERS? I FEELING COMFORT WITH THIS PAGE OR WHAT DO YOU THINK COMMISSIONER? COMMISSIONER CASON, PLEASE.

WELL, GIVEN THE CHANGE WE MADE THIS MORNING, I'M NOT SURE THE WORD, I'M NOT SURE IF THE WORD MULTIPLEX, I'M NOT SURE THERE'S A BETTER WORD.

MAYBE MULTIFAMILY BUILDING IS, SINCE WE USE MULTIPLEX IN A DIFFERENT CONTEXT IN THAT SECOND PARAGRAPH, PAGE THREE DASH ONE 16, ARE WE STILL LOOKING AT THAT? MM-HMM.

AM I BEHIND? YEAH, NO, YOU'RE FINE.

I'M JUST, WE USE MULTIPLEX SORT OF AS A DEFINED TERM.

I'M JUST WONDERING IF THERE'S A DIFFERENT TERM THAT MIGHT BE, UM, MIGHT CONVEY THAT BETTER.

I DON'T KNOW.

I KNOW IT'S, IT'S A TELL ME WHERE YOU RIGHT HERE.

SORRY.

I MEAN, IT'S A, IT'S A NOT A PRIMARY USE AS A SECONDARY USE.

I JUST, AND I'M NOT STUCK ON IT.

I JUST RAISE IT GIVEN THE, THE CHANGE WE ALREADY MADE.

YEAH, THAT'S TRUE.

DO YOU WANT US TO CALL OUT THE ACTUAL HOUSING TYPES TO BE MORE CLEAR THAT WE COULD SAY THAT IT'S DUPLEXES? FOURPLEXES? I DON'T KNOW.

MAYBE I'M JUST BEING PEDANTIC.

NEVERMIND.

NO, I THINK THERE, I THINK YOU HAVE, SHE HAS A POINT THAT MULTIPLEX THERE SEEMS A LITTLE, ALRIGHT.

YOU

[03:55:01]

WE JUST HAVE IT LABELED AS DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES.

I I'M PROBABLY JUST OVERTHINKING IT.

UH, DISREGARD.

THAT'S FINE.

YOUR HEAD THERE.

I ACTUALLY, NOW THAT I FINALLY FOUND IT IN THE LANGUAGE I HAD TO ASK, BUT YEAH, I SAW IT.

YEAH, I MEAN I, I TEND TO AGREE THAT PROVIDING SOME CLARITY THERE MAY BE HELPFUL BECAUSE I THINK THE GOAL IS IS THAT IT'S ALTERNATE AND, AND I THINK MS. GILLIS MAY HAVE SAID IT, ALTERNATE HOUSING THAT INTEGRATES WITHIN THE COMMUNITY CHARACTER IS, IS I THINK WHAT THE LARGER INTENT HERE IS.

IS.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER CARPENTER.

WHAT, GO AHEAD PLEASE.

COMM.

WELL IS THE PHRASE, I MEAN IF YOU LOOK IN THE GLOSSARY UNDER CLUSTERED HOUSING, IT SAYS IT REFERS TO A RANGE OF MULTI-UNIT HOUSING TYPES THAT ARE DESIGNED TO FIT WITHIN THE SCALE IN FORM OF DETACH SINGLE FAMILY HOMES.

I KNOW AND INCLUDES ALL THE DIFFERENCE.

I MEAN, WOULD A REFERENCE TO CLUSTERED HOUSING, SENSITIVELY INTEGRATED CLUSTERED HOUSING TYPES, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

I THINK THAT'S A GOOD RECOMMENDATION.

UH, COMMISSIONERS WHAT IT, IT SEEMS LIKE WE, WE MAY NEED TO WORDSMITH THIS A LITTLE BIT FURTHER.

WHY DON'T WE TABLE THIS ITEM AND, AND BRING IT BACK AT OUR NEXT SESSION.

I THINK THERE'S SOMETHING THERE THAT WE JUST CAN'T PUT OUR FINGER ON.

WE CAN COME BACK TO IT.

UH, ANYTHING ELSE? COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, PLEASE? YES.

THE, UM, ON PAGE THREE 16, UM, SECOND COLUMN, THIS LAST PARAGRAPH WHERE IT SAYS, THIS PLACE TYPE GENERALLY APPEARS IN TWO DIFFERENT FORMS AND GOES ON TO ABOUT THE, THE BEFORE 1950 AND AFTER THAT I, I KNOW THIS IS A, UM, A LEGACY OF, OF THE VERY FIRST DRAFT THAT I KNOW, UH, VICE CHAIR RUBIN REMEMBERS THAT WE TACKLED AT CLUB BUT HAS SINCE BEEN ELIMINATED SOME THE WHY DO WE STILL HAVE THIS, THIS, THIS REMNANT HERE.

WHY WOULD NOT JUST, I, I DON'T UNDERSTAND THE NECESSITY OF THIS ENTIRE PARAGRAPH BECAUSE THE, OR AT LEAST NOT THE FIRST PART OF IT WHERE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ADDING NEW HOUSING TYPES IS APPROPRIATE.

I MEAN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ADDING NEW HOUSING TYPES TO, UH, COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL BEING APPROPRIATE, PROVIDED THAT THEY'RE SENSITIVE TO EXISTING SCALE DESIGN AND STABILITY OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

I MEAN, WHY ARE WE STILL MAKING THIS DISTINCTION ABOUT THE SUBURBAN AND THE GRIDED LAYOUT? I CAN SPEAK TO THAT AND THEN I GUESS WHOEVER ELSE CAN JUMP AS WELL.

SO GOING BACK TO WHAT YOU MENTIONED WHEN, UH, THIS PLACE TYPE WAS LAST UPDATED, WE MENTIONED THAT THERE, THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT FORMS THAT EXIST NOW OF SINGLE FAMILY, UM, NEIGHBORHOODS.

THOSE THAT ARE MORE SUBURBAN IN NATURE.

THOSE ARE MORE GRIDED IN NATURE.

UM, I THINK THE PREVIOUS LANGUAGE THAT WE HAD HERE, UH, WAS EX EXPLAINING THOSE IN A BIT TOO MUCH, UH, PLANNING TERMS. UH, BUT I THINK THE REALITY IS THAT THOSE CONTEXTS STILL EXIST.

SO JUST WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT, UM, THAT IN THE CITY YOU'LL SEE THOSE TWO DIFFERENT FORMS, BUT IT'S STILL UNDERNEATH OR WITHIN THIS PARTICULAR, UH, PLACE TYPE.

UH, BUT I'M CURIOUS IF YOU'RE THINKING THAT, UM, DIFFERENTIATING THAT IN THIS PLACE TYPE MAKES SENSE OR ARE YOU THINKING THAT THIS, I'M, I'M THINKING IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE BECAUSE ORIGINALLY THIS LANGUAGE IS IN HERE, WAS IN HERE TO CLEARLY MAKE THIS TWO SEPARATE PLACE TYPES.

AND WE DID AWAY WITH THAT LONG AGO.

SO I'M JUST, I'M NOT QUITE SURE THAT IT, IT'S NECESSARY TO ME, PART OF IT IS ALSO TO ENSURE THAT THOSE TWO DIFFERENT DESIGNS OF THOSE COMMUNITIES, THAT IT, THAT THOSE DESIGNS AREN'T USED AS A BASIS TO PREVENT DIFFERENT TYPE OF HOUSING.

SO IT'S AN, IT'S AN EQUITY ISSUE TO SAY JUST BECAUSE MY NEIGHBORHOOD HAS CURVY STREETS AND IT'S NOT LIKE THAT OTHER NEIGHBORHOOD, YOU SHOULDN'T USE THIS DOCUMENT AS A BASIS TO, I DON'T SEE ANYONE MAKING THAT ARGUMENT.

I MEAN, IT SEEMS LIKE THE ONLY PLACE THIS EVER EXISTED WAS IN THE, YOU KNOW, WAS THE ORIGINAL DISTINCTION THAT WAS BEING MADE, YOU KNOW, FOR WHATEVER PURPOSE, YOU KNOW, IN CLUB.

BUT THAT'S GONE AWAY.

SO I'M JUST, I I DON'T KNOW IF WE NEED TO MAKE A DISTINCTION.

'CAUSE THE POINT WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE IS THAT THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS, UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ADVOCATING HOUSING, ADDING NEW HOUSING TYPES THAT ARE SENSITIVE TO SCALE AND DESIGN AND

[04:00:01]

ALL THAT.

AND WELL, I GUESS I COULD SEGUE ONTO ANOTHER QUESTION, WHICH IS WHAT IS THE MECHANISM FOR CONTEXT SENSITIVITY? UH, I THINK YOUR SECOND QUESTION WOULD BE THE CODE UPDATE, UH, AND MORE DETAILS IN THAT.

SO WE HAVEN'T, THAT, THAT'S NOT THE, UM, THE SCOPE OF THIS, BUT THAT WILL BE SOMETHING THAT WE ELABORATE IN THE IMPLEMENTATION TABLE THAT THE CODE COMPONENT OF THAT WOULD HELP TO, TO LET, TO GET THAT TO THAT POINT.

THAT'LL BE THAT MECHANISM.

ARE YOU LOOKING AT THAT? DO YOU HAVE A FOLLOW UP COMMISSIONER CARPENTER? UM, NOT VICE CHAIR RUBEN.

I, I, I HAVE LIVED THIS FOR A LONG, LONG TIME AND REMEMBER WHEN THERE WERE THE TWO DIFFERENT PLACE TYPES? I CAN'T EVEN, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER THEIR NAMES ANYMORE.

TRADITIONAL AND, AND BLENDED.

AND YEAH, AS, AS COMMISSIONER CARPENTER SAYS, MUCH MORE BLUNTLY, AND I THINK WITH, WITH PROBABLY A LOT OF TRUTH IN THERE, THERE WAS A DIVIDE BETWEEN NORTH AND SOUTH AND WHERE BLENDED WAS, WAS DISTRIBUTED VERSUS THE, THE TRADITIONAL.

AND I, I THINK WE MADE A RIGHT MOVE GOING WITH COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL.

BUT AS WE STILL SEE IN SOME COMMENTS MADE TODAY, A LOT OF THE PEOPLE SAY, YOU KNOW, X, Y, AND Z MISSING MIDDLE IS GREAT, LET'S PUT IT IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR.

AND WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE SOUTHERN SECTOR SHOULD HAVE A LOT OF DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES, BUT I THINK IT'S TRUE NORTH OF I 30 AS WELL.

AND I THINK THIS LANGUAGE IN HERE IS A IMPORTANT SORT OF FIREWALL TO SAY THAT WE NEED TO HAVE THIS DISCUSSION THROUGHOUT THE CITY ABOUT HOW WE SENSITIVELY INCORPORATE ADDITIONAL AND NEW TYPES OF HOUSING.

AND THAT THE SUBURBAN CHARACTER OF SOME PARTS OF THE CITY OR IS, IS NOT A WAY OUT OF THAT DIFFICULT DISCUSSION.

THE SOLUTIONS MAY LOOK DIFFERENT DEPENDING ON WHAT THE NEIGHBORHOOD LOOKS LIKE.

I DON'T KNOW NECESSARILY IF THAT'S THE CASE, BUT IT'S A TOPIC FOR, FOR FUTURE DISCUSSION.

BUT I APPRECIATE HAVING THIS LANGUAGE IN HERE WITH MY UNDERSTANDING OF, OF THE HISTORY OF THE DOCUMENT.

IT MAY BE, YOU KNOW, LESS IMPORTANT TO OTHERS WHO HAVEN'T BEEN ON THE BOAT FOR THIS ENTIRE JOURNEY SERVING ON CLUB AND ALL THAT.

AND THAT'S NO DISRESPECT TO THEM, BUT, BUT I SEE THIS LANGUAGE IS PARTICULARLY IMPORTANT TO OUR, OUR CONVERSATIONS MOVING FORWARD.

COMMISSIONER HERBERT? UM, I THOUGHT, UH, READING ABOUT THE, THE GRID LAYOUT, I, I HAD READ INFORMATION ON AND KNEW, HAD SOME PREVIOUS KNOWLEDGE OF, I THOUGHT IT PROVIDED SOME CONTEXT FOR ME, UM, IN UNDERSTANDING HOW OUR STREETS ARE LAID OUT IN DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE CITY.

UM, IN CONTEXT OF FOR DALLAS.

UH, BUT I'VE HAD PEOPLE ASK, WHY IS MY NEIGHBORHOOD LIKE, LIKE, LOOK LIKE THIS? OR WHY DO I HAVE DUPLEXES IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD? AND I THINK IT GOES BACK TO THE OLD GRIDS AND, AND THE WAY THE CITY WAS BUILT OUT.

SO I DIDN'T SEE A, A HUGE ISSUE WITH THE LANGUAGE.

UM, MAYBE CONTEXTUALIZING IT MORE MAY HELP, BUT, UM, THE HISTORY OF HOW THE NEIGHBORHOODS ARE GRIDED, UM, TODAY, I THINK IS IMPORTANT TO OVERALL UNDERSTANDING.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS ON THIS ITEM? COMMISSIONERS.

SO LET'S GO TO NUMBER SEVEN THEN.

SINCE WE, WE WON'T VOTE ON THIS ITEM SINCE THERE'S A LITTLE PIECE OF IT THAT I THINK NEEDS A LITTLE MORE ADJUSTMENT.

WE'LL GO TO THE, UH, GENERAL UPDATES TO DESIGN STRATEGIES FOR SEVERAL PLACE TYPES.

ON THREE EIGHT THROUGH 3 55, IT SAYS ITEM NUMBER SEVEN.

SO THESE LARGELY INCLUDE THE SECOND PAGES OF, SO YOU HAVE PAGE ONE OF EACH OF THE PLACE TYPES THAT GOES OVER THE CHARACTER DESCRIPTION AND THEN THE PLACE TYPE APPLICATION AND SORT OF THE LAND USE MIX.

THEN YOU FLIP TO THE SECOND PART AND THAT'S WHERE YOU GET YOUR ADJACENCIES, URBAN DESIGN ELEMENTS AND STRATEGIES AND DIFFERENT, YOU KNOW, BUILDING FORM AND CHARACTER THAT WE RECEIVED A LOT OF COMMENTS FOR RECOMMENDATIONS FOR DIFFERENT DESIGN ELEMENTS AND STRATEGIES, UM, FROM DIFFERENT COMMISSIONERS AND THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT IT.

AND SO IN THE PINK ON THOSE SECOND SPREADS, WE'VE GOT SOME ADJUSTMENTS AND SOME OF IT'S THE SAME LANGUAGE CARRYING OVER, BUT WE JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT Y'ALL ARE OKAY WITH IT.

CAN I, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER

[04:05:01]

? PARDON ME, YOUR HONOR.

ON PAGE 3 14, 3 DASH 14, SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL, UH, ITEM S TB SIX.

ANY NEW INDUSTRIAL USES ADJACENT TO THIS PLACE TYPE SHOULD BE ENVIRONMENTALLY LOW IMPACT.

WELL BUFFERED WITH NATURAL VEGETATION FROM RESIDENTIAL USES AND CONTAINED WITHIN THE PROPERTY TO AVOID NEGATIVE SPILLOVER IMPACTS ON RESIDENTIAL USES OR ENVIRONMENTALLY SENSITIVE AREAS.

UM, MY QUESTION IS WHY ARE NEW INDUSTRIAL USES ACCEPTABLE NEXT TO SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL? WE DON'T MAKE THAT POINT ABOUT ANY OF THEIR, UH, RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPES.

AND SO TO ME THIS IS, UM, ALMOST PERPETUATING AN OLD WAY OF THINKING, WHICH IS THAT, WELL, IT'S KIND OF THE NATURAL ORDER OF THINGS THAT THIS PART OF TOWN WE HAVE INDUSTRIAL USES AND IF WE JUST PUT IN SOME FENCE AND SOME PLANTINGS AND ALL THAT, EVERYTHING WILL BE OKAY.

UM, AND I I, I DON'T THINK THAT IS SERVING OUR EQUITY GOALS.

HILL BACK WHERE YOU HAVE NOTHING BUT, AND THEN YOU HAVE DEVELOPERS WHO'S BUILDING ITCHING DOWN 35 AND TO THE POINT THAT AT SOME POINT THEY'RE GONNA BUY LAND ON THAT SIDE.

UM, I'M GONNA THINK ABOUT ONE IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD AND I KIND OF, UM, WHEN I, AGAIN, I TALKED TO CHOPPY AND I GAVE THEM A NEW PERSPECTIVE ON SOME INDUSTRIAL USES OR YOU'RE LOOKING AT PY AND THEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT THREE 10 AND THEN THREE 10 HAS SOME INDUSTRIAL USES, BUT WHAT DOES THAT INDUSTRIAL USE LOOK LIKE? UM, BATCH PLANT WAS 100% NO, BUT WHEN I TOLD THEM ABOUT, UM, ALEXANDRA'S, ALEXANDER'S CABINETS MAKERS WHO WE WENT TO BEFORE HOME DEPOT AND EXPLAINED TO THEM THAT'S INDUSTRIAL, THEY WERE LIKE, YES.

AND SO DEPENDING ON WHAT THAT INDUSTRIAL USE IS, INDUSTRIAL USE IS SO WIDE RANGE.

IF IT'S A, IF, IF I WORK IN AN AREA AND THE INDUSTRIAL USE IS NOT AN ENVIRONMENTAL HAZARD AND THAT JOB AND I CAN PUT THAT JOB IN WALKING SPACE, THEN I THINK THAT'S THE, THOSE ARE THE INDUSTRIAL USES THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THAT, THAT ARE CONSIDERED INDUSTRIAL SMALL WAREHOUSES.

UM, UM, A A CABINET MAKING SHOP THAT SERVICE THE COMMUNITY, BUT IT SITS IN AN INDUSTRIAL CORRIDOR LIKE THREE 10, WHICH I HAVE SAID THAT THREE 10 NEEDS NEEDS A PD.

BUT IF THIS WOULD BE, IF THE, IF THERE CAN BE A PLACE TYPE I NOT PLACE TYPE OR A CORRIDOR CAN BE NAMED THAT WITHOUT A PD BECAUSE WE KNOW YOU DON'T LIKE PDS , THAT WILL TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THAT CLOSENESS TO A A, A NEIGHBORHOOD, UM, BECAUSE OF WHERE IT SITS.

IT SITS IN, IN PROXIMITY TO THREE DIFFERENT MAJOR, UM, UM, FREEWAYS.

UM, THE JOB ACCESSIBILITY, THAT'S WHERE WE LOOK AT IT.

BUT I THINK IT'S GONNA BE, UM, TO COMMISSIONER BLA UH, CARPENTER'S, UM, UH, I DON'T THINK IT'S THE HARD INDUSTRIAL, IT'S THAT SOFTWARE INDUSTRIAL USES THAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT.

LIKE, UM, LIKE AGAIN, LIKE THE CABINET WHEN YOU'RE GOING IN AND YOU'RE TALKING TO SOMEONE LIKE JOCKEY WHO IS 100% AGAINST ANY TYPE OF, UM, WAS 100% AGAINST INDUSTRIAL USES.

AND WHEN YOU GO IN AND EXPLAIN TO THEM THIS IS AN INDUSTRIAL USE, WELL THEY KNOW THAT THIS ISN'T ONE, AND THEN THEY SAY, OKAY, THAT'S ACCEPTABLE.

MAYBE, MAYBE THAT CAN, IF I MAY, I THINK PERHAPS THEN IF WE, UM, ADDED SOME LANGUAGE HERE TO PROHIBIT NEW POTENTIALLY INCOMPATIBLE INDUSTRIAL USES NEXT TO THIS PLACE, TODD, AND THEN FOCUSED THIS LANGUAGE ON USES THAT ARE NOT POTENTIALLY INCOMPATIBLE, BUT STILL, YOU KNOW, NEED THE, THE BUFFERING AND THAT SORT OF THING.

BUT I THINK WE SHOULD BE PRETTY CLEAR THAT WE DON'T WANT NEW POTENTIALLY INCOMPATIBLE ANY USES THAT ARE POTENTIALLY INCOMPATIBLE.

I, I THINK THAT'S WHAT I DO BELIEVE THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT, WHERE THE LANGUAGE IS DEFINITELY A, A MATTER AND MAKING SURE THAT THAT WHATEVER THE INDUSTRIAL USE IT IS NOT, UM, IT'S, IT'S NOT CLASSIFIED RIGHT, WRONG, IT HAS TO BE CLASSIFIED IN THAT COAST, UH, WITH, WITH WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.

BUT, AND THEN ALSO LOOKING AT, UM, THE OPPOSITE BUILDING HOUSING CLOSE TO INDUSTRIAL USES THAT ARE GROSSLY INCOMPATIBLE.

THAT ARE INCOMPATIBLE.

AND WHAT WE'RE SEEING IS PEOPLE THAT WE'RE SEEING THAT DEVELOPERS ARE BUILDING IN AREAS THAT HAS A HIGH, UM, UM, INDUSTRIAL USE AND THEN 10 YEARS FROM NOW WE'LL BE HEARING SAYING, WELL, THE ENVIRONMENTAL INJUSTICES IS THAT ARE HAPPENING, BUT THE DEVELOPER BUILDS AND WE ALLOWED A DEVELOPER TO BUILD CLOSE TO OUR INDUSTRIAL AREAS.

AND THEN WE PUSH ALL IN INDUSTRY OUT.

SO WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S A VICE VICE VERSA TYPE OF DEAL.

LIKE WHAT'S THERE, WHAT ONE SHOULD NOT COUNSEL OUT THE OTHER BY WHICH WAS THEIR FIRST, UM, I GUESS KIND OF WHAT I WOULD SAY THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF 35 IN THOSE INDUSTRIAL AREAS ALONG WALNUT HILL, RIGHT? WALNUT

[04:10:01]

AND THEN 10 YEARS FROM NOW, WE'LL BE COMPLAINING, COMMISSIONER BLAIR, UM, I LIKE THE IN NOT INCOMPATIBLE WELL, WELL INCOMPATIBLE ANY NEW INDUSTRIAL INCOMPATIBLE USE POTENTIALLY INCOMPATIBLE USES.

UM, I DO APPRECIATE THAT AND THAT SHOULD BE SOMETHING CALLED OUT.

UM, AND UH, OTHER THAN THAT, I, I APPRECIATE EXACTLY WHAT WAS SAID, BUT MY, WHAT I WAS GOING TO ALSO, UM, I CHANGED MY MIND.

I'M, I'M GOOD MR. CHAIR.

RUBEN.

YEAH, I'M LOOKING AT THIS LANGUAGE AND AS WE'RE KIND OF MERGING ON A CONSENSUS, UM, STB SIX SAYS, ANY NEW INDUSTRIAL USES ADJACENT TO THIS PLACE TYPE SHOULD BE ENVIRONMENTALLY LOW IMPACT, WHICH I THINK DOES A LOT OF THE WORK THAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO.

MAYBE ADDING THE WORD COMPATIBLE WITH THE USES IN THIS DISTRICT TO BE THE, THE OTHER PHRASE IN THERE, BECAUSE I I I LIKE THE LANGUAGE WE HAVE NOW, AND I WOULD ENCOURAGE STRENGTHENING THIS.

I WOULDN'T MAKE ANY REFERENCE TO POTENTIALLY INCOMPATIBLE USES BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THIS LANGUAGE IN THERE AUTHORIZES THAT OR SUGGESTS IT RIGHT NOW.

SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, CAN I, SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, JUST SAY ANY NEW IN KEEPING IT IN A POSITIVE VEIN OPPOSED TO SAYING INCOMPATIBLE POTENTIALLY? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? SO, SO ANY NEW INDUSTRIAL USES ADJACENT TO THIS PLACE TALK SHOULD BE, I DON'T KNOW, SOMETHING COMPATIBLE.

COMPATIBLE AND SHOULD BE COMPATIBLE AND ENVIRONMENTALLY I COULD GO THERE.

TO GIVE MORE SPECIFICITY TO IT.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, WHAT DO YOU THINK? ? OKAY.

ANY OTHER COMMENTS? COMMISSIONERS? I HEARD SOMEONE, I, I WOULD WANT TO POINT OUT, UM, COMPATIBLE MIGHT NOT BE THE BEST WORD BECAUSE POTENTIALLY INCOMPATIBLE AND COMPATIBLE GOES BACK TO OUR ZONING CODE AND I DON'T WANNA GET THOSE COM LIKE CONFLATED.

AND SO SOMEONE COMES IN AND SAYS, WELL, THIS IS INDUSTRIAL INSIDE, NOT COMPATIBLE.

AND SO I THINK WE HAVE THE INTENT OF THAT AND I THINK WE CAN KEEP WORKING ON THE WORDSMITHING ON THAT TO, TO GET WHAT, UH, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, UM, BLAIR AND VICE CHAIR RUBIN ARE SAYING JUST, I'LL JUST ELABORATE HERE.

YOU KNOW, BECAUSE MY CONCERN HERE, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE I'VE, I'VE BEEN IN DALLAS FOR A LONG TIME, SINCE 84, AND I'VE LIVED IN WEST DALLAS SINCE 88.

AND I, I USED TO COME DOWN HERE AND REGULARLY GET BEAT UP AT DURING ZONING CASES WHEN, YOU KNOW, COMMISSIONERS HERE WOULD SAY, WELL, MS. CARPENTER, DIDN'T YOU REALIZE WHERE YOU WERE MOVING WHEN YOU MOVED THERE? AND I'D SAY, WELL, I THOUGHT I MOVED INTO A NEIGHBORHOOD WITH THE FULL PROTECTION OF THE DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE LIKE ANY OTHER, AND THEY WOULD, YOU KNOW, VOTE AGAINST ME AND THAT WAS THE END.

AND THEY USE A PD TO, UH, PUT IN A NEW METAL SALVAGE PLANT RIGHT NEXT TO MY NEIGHBORHOOD.

UM, YOU KNOW, THERE'S SUCH A, A, A PREEXISTING BIAS THAT IN THAT SOME OF THESE, UH, LESS AFFLUENT NEIGHBORHOODS IN THE SOUTH ARE THE PLACES TO PUT INDUSTRIAL PROPERTY.

AND I KNOW AS THIS DOCUMENT GOES FORWARD, THERE ARE GONNA BE SENTENCES LIFTED FROM THIS DOCUMENT FOREVER, FOREVER, AND EVER UNTIL THE NEXT ITERATION COMES UP THAT ARE GONNA BE USED TO, YOU KNOW, BUTTRESS APPLICATIONS FOR ZONING.

AND I GUESS WHAT I'M REALLY SENSITIVE TO IS THAT SINCE THERE'S ALREADY THE, THE PREEXISTING BIAS THAT INDUSTRIAL GOES HERE, WE'RE ALMOST ENCOURAGING IT HERE BY GOING, WELL, YOU KNOW, AS LONG AS WE PUT IN SOME VEGETATION AND BUFFER IT A LITTLE BIT.

UM, I MEAN, NOT THAT I'M NOT SENSITIVE TO WHAT, UH, BAIN IS SAYING ABOUT THE, UM, ENVIRONMENTALLY LOW IMPACT, IT'S JUST, I, I GUESS I NEED TO GIVE MORE THOUGHT TO TO THE WORDING HERE BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO, UH, REEMPHASIZE SIZE, UH, OR, OR, OR ADD WEIGHT TO THE, TO THE PREEXISTING NOTION THAT, THAT THESE ARE THE PLACES TO PUT INDUSTRIAL.

THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR.

I, I THINK I WOULD LEAN MORE TOWARDS THE LANGUAGE I SUGGESTED BY COMMISSIONER CARPENTER.

I CERTAINLY AGREE WITH VICE CHAIR RUBIN.

WE'VE TRIED TO PLACE WHAT WE'D WANNA SEE, BUT I WOULD ALWAYS FEEL LIKE MORE CLARITY IS HELPFUL, PARTICULARLY IF THOSE OF US AROUND THIS BODY ARE READING THIS IN DIFFERENT FORMATS.

IT SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD CERTAINLY BE HELPFUL

[04:15:01]

VICE CHAIR, TB THREE HITS ON THIS, IT MAY NOT DO EVERYTHING THAT WE NEED TO DO, BUT IT SAYS THE INDUSTRIAL HUB PLACE TYPE SHOULD NOT BE ADJACENT TO THIS PLACE TYPE.

SO IF THERE ARE OTHER INDUSTRIAL USES THAT WE HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT BEING ADJACENT, BUT NOT WITHIN SMALL TOWN RESIDENTIAL, THEN MAYBE STP THREE IS THE PLACE TO ADD A LITTLE BIT MORE TEETH.

CHIEF, MAY I? ABSOLUTELY.

I MEAN, IS IT PERMISSIBLE TO, ARE WE GOING THROUGH THE PAGES SEQUENTIALLY? YES.

WELL, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER'S LOOKING THROUGH YES.

ANY ADJUSTMENTS THAT YOU WANT IN THESE PAGES? LET'S PLEASE.

PARDON ME? YES.

FOR, FOR THIS ONE ITEM, WE, UH, WE TABLED THAT PAGE JUST TO MAKE THOSE ADJUSTMENTS AND COME BACK AND THE FRESH LOOKER NEXT TIME.

WE'RE NOW GONNA LITERALLY PAGE THREE NINE AND THREE 10 AND THREE THROUGH 3 55.

JUST KIND OF SKIMM THOSE IF YOU HAVE ANY CHANGES AND SOME NOTES THAT YOU MADE, I PLEASE.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER? YES.

IT, IT, IT, IT, IT COULD BE ANYWHERE THAT HAS OLDER COMMUNITIES THAT ARE IN NEED OF INSISTENCE.

ON PAGE THREE 18, UNDER LOCATIONAL STRATEGY, THE SECOND PARAGRAPH, EXISTING HOUSING STOCK SHOULD BE RETAINED WHENEVER POSSIBLE TO MINIMIZE THE DISPLACEMENT OF EXISTING RESIDENTS, PARTICULARLY IN AREAS IDENTIFIED AS HIGH RISK FOR DISPLACEMENT, UH, POWER.

IS THERE A MECHANISM FOR IDENTIFYING AREAS AT HIGH RISK FOR DISPLACEMENT? AND I MEAN, THIS ALMOST SOUNDS AS IF ZONE UP ZONING SHOULD BE, SHOULD BE, YOU KNOW, TURNED DOWN ALL I I I I'M JUST HAVING TROUBLE WITH THE SCOPE OF THIS PARTICULAR SENTENCE.

SO THIS IS IN RESPONSE TO A LOT OF CONCERNS THAT WE'VE HEARD FROM RESIDENTS IN PARTICULARLY WEST DALLAS, BUT ALSO SOUTH DALLAS THAT SAY YOU'RE JUST GOING TO PUT ALL THE NEW HOUSING AND ALL THE DENSITY THERE AND THEN WE'RE ALL GOING TO BE DISPLACED.

UM, SO IT IS TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT WE HAVE TO BE INTENTIONAL AND CAREFUL AND CAUTIOUS BECAUSE THERE MAY BE CERTAIN AREAS WHERE THERE COULD HAVE, THERE COULD BE A GREATER NEGATIVE IMPACT THAN OTHERS.

NOW I WILL SAY THIS, WHAT PART OF WHAT HOUSING HAS BEEN DOING, THE HOUSING DEPARTMENT, PART OF WHAT WE HAVE BEEN LOOKING AT IS LAYERING ALL OF THIS DIFFERENT DATA THAT WE HAVE TO IDENTIFY.

AND WEST DALLAS HAS DONE, DONE SOME OF THIS IS SORT OF GETTING A DISPLACEMENT RISK MAP.

NOW IT'S STILL, IT DOESN'T GIVE AN ANSWER, BUT IT GIVES US SOME ADDITIONAL GUIDANCE TO SAY MAYBE THIS IS ANOTHER LAYER AND ANOTHER CONSIDERATION THAT WE HAVE TO MAKE BEFORE X IS DONE.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT X IS, BUT WHATEVER THAT MIGHT BE.

COMMISSIONER, PLEASE.

WELL, WHEN I READ THIS IN, IN, AS IN AS COMMISSIONER CARPENTER HAD SAYS, PARTICULARLY IN AREAS IDENTIFIED AS HIGH RISK FOR DISPLACEMENT, IT BEGS THE QUESTION, WELL, WHAT AREAS ARE THOSE? AND IT BEGS THE QUESTION HELP.

DO WE HAVE SOMETHING TO IDENTIFY THOSE, THOSE, UM, HIGH RISK AREAS IF WE OTHERWISE, WHAT IT COULD BE, WHAT IT COULD BE SAYING, ANYTHING THAT'S READY FOR GENTRIFICATION,

[04:20:02]

SO THAT COULD BE THE WHOLE ENTIRE SOUTHERN SECTOR JUST ABOUT .

AND I'M NOT SURE THAT'S WHAT WE WANT TO SAY.

SO HELP ME IDENTIFY THIS.

HIGH, HIGH RISK FOR DISPLACEMENT AREA IS LAST RUBIN, IF I REMEMBER WE HAD OUR CPC RETREAT SEVERAL MONTHS AGO AND OUR SPEAKER, JAMES ARMSTRONG FROM BUILDERS OF HOPE IDENTIFIED SOME MATRIX ABOUT OR METRICS FOR DISPLACEMENT RISK AND, AND WALKED US THROUGH SOME OF THOSE.

AND I ADMITTEDLY HAVE NOT DUG DEEP INTO THOSE METRICES, BUT, OR METRICSES, BUT METRICS, SORRY, UM, TOO MANY WORDS THAT SOUND SIMILAR AND IT'S BEEN A LONG DAY.

UM, BUT I, I ASSUME THAT BETWEEN THE NONPROFIT AND PRIVATE SECTORS AND MAYBE EVEN ON IN THE CITY'S HOUSING DEPARTMENT, THERE ARE TOOLS OUT THERE GIVEN WHAT'S BEING, UM, WHAT WAS PREVIOUSLY PRESENTED TO US.

SO MAYBE WE NEED A SPECIFIC REFERENCE THERE, BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE IT EXISTS, EVEN IF WE DON'T HAVE A SPECIFIC REFERENCE IN THERE RIGHT NOW, COMMISSIONER.

UM, I, I WOULD, WELL, I KNOW WHEN I, WHEN I GO DOWN BECKLEY, UM, AND I SEE THE MEGA MANSIONS IN, IN RIGHT NEXT TO THE O THOSE, THOSE THAT CONCERNS ME 'CAUSE IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S MOVING SOUTH.

AND HIGH RISK AREAS FOR THE DISPLACEMENT COULD BE ANYWHERE.

A BUILDER HAS A, A VACANT LOT AND WANTS TO PUT A MEGA MANSION.

SO THERE, THERE COULD BE A WHOLE LOT OF OPPORTUNITY TO IDENTIFY, UM, HIGH RISK FOR DIS AREAS OF HIGH RISK FOR DISPLACEMENT.

THAT COULD BE, IT COULD BE ALMOST IN ANY NEIGHBORHOOD.

SO I I, AND I DON'T WANT, AND I, I WOULD, I WOULD RA I WOULD LOVE TO USE A BROADER BRUSH THAN WHAT THE CITY HAS TO OFFER.

UM, SOMETIMES THE DEFINITIONS ARE DIFFERENT.

ARE LOOKING AT IT, WE'RE LOOKING AT IT, I WOULD SAY THAT WE WOULD, WE WOULD CHANGE THOSE AREAS ON A REGULAR BASIS.

AND THERE, SO THIS AN SO AREAS AT RISK OF DISPLACEMENT IS SORT OF UNDER CONSTRUCTION AND I THINK NEARING TOWARD THE END OF THE DRAFT PHASE BY MULTIPLE ENTITIES.

I THINK BUILDERS OF HOPE IS WORKING ON A PIECE.

I KNOW THAT I'VE TALKED TO THEM, YOU KNOW, STAFF HAS TALKED TO THEM REGULARLY ABOUT ALL OF THE DIFFERENT DATA LAYERS THAT THEY'RE USING AND THEY'RE TRYING TO BE AS QUANTITATIVE AS POSSIBLE.

AND IT'S NOT JUST ONE SIZE FITS ALL DISPLACEMENT RISK.

IT IS MOVING.

WE HAVE TO LOOK AT WHAT AREAS WHERE YOU CAN STILL INTERVENE AND THERE WILL BE AN IMPACT AREAS THAT MAY, WE PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE INTERVENED 10 YEARS AGO.

SO NOW THERE'S ANOTHER SET OF TOOLS THAT WE HAVE TO USE AND THEN AREAS WHERE WE SHOULD BE LOOKING OUT FOR BECAUSE IN FIVE YEARS THIS COULD BE AN ISSUE.

SO THERE'S THE NONPROFIT WORLD THAT'S LOOKING INTO THIS.

I THINK WE HAVE SOME UNIVERSITIES THAT ARE LOOKING INTO THIS, HOUSING DEPARTMENTS ALSO LOOKING INTO THIS.

WE'VE DONE SOME OF IT OF OUR OWN LAYERING BASED ON WHAT THE EXISTING CONDITIONS THAT WE HAVE AND THEN ALSO THE, UM, SORT OF SOME OF THE PROPOSALS.

SO I WISH IT WERE FINALIZED, BUT WE DON'T HAVE A FINALIZED, FINALIZED MAP YET.

SO WHAT I, AND, AND CORRECT ME IF, IF I'M WRONG, WHAT I HEAR YOU SAYING THAT THIS COULD BE A MOVING DEFINITION.

SO COULD I MAKE A RECOMMENDATION THAT INSTEAD OF SAYING HIGH RISK, YOU CAN SAY IT, BUT THEN GIVE US THE TOOLS OR THE LINKS TO GO TO WHERE YOU'RE PULLING THE INFORMATION FROM.

AND IF THAT INFORMATION IS KEPT CURRENT, THEN WE WOULD ALWAYS HAVE THE MOST CURRENT BECAUSE AREAS OF RISK MAY CHANGE FROM THIS MONTH TO, WELL THIS FROM FROM TODAY TO UNTIL TOMORROW.

AND IF UNIVERSITIES

[04:25:01]

SO IF WE JUST PUT THE LINK, WE CAN GO AND LOOK AT IT OURSELVES AND THEN SAY, OKAY, THIS IS WHERE, WHERE WE'RE LOOKING, UM, TO RETAIN THE HOUSING STOCK.

SO THERE, THERE'S A STABILIZATION OF IT AND NOT TO, TO DESTABILIZE IT.

COMMISSIONER WHEELER PLEASE.

I THINK THREE EXAMPLES BEING IN, IN AREAS OUTSIDE OF THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT OR THE PARKS.

AND THAT'S GOING TO BE ARLINGTON PARK, NORTH PARK AND HAMILTON PARK, ALL THREE OF THOSE.

AND THEN YOU LOOK AT LOVEFIELD WEST, THAT IS HISTORIC.

THAT'S UH, UM, NORTH PARK EL THICKETT.

SO THEY DO, SO WE CALL INTO THE PARKS.

SO EL THICKETT BECAUSE OF THE PROXIMITY TO HIGHLAND PARK, CRESTON WOOD, AND AND UNIVERSITY PARK GENTRIFIED QUICKER THAN LOVE.

FIELD WEST, WHICH IS ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE, WHICH IS A, ALMOST A TOTAL HISPANIC DISTRICT ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF, OF, UH, LOVEFIELD.

AND THEIR GENTRIFICATION CAME IN, BUT THEY WERE ABLE TO QUICKLY DO AN OVERLAY, A NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION OVERLAY.

BUT THEIRS CAME IN BECAUSE A DEVELOPER BOUGHT A STREET, STARTED BUYING A STREET OF DUPLEXES, AND BECAUSE OF THOSE DUPLEXES, IT CAUSED A, A SPUR, A A, A, UH, WHAT IS A SPUR? WHAT IS, UH, IT CAUSED A DISPLACEMENT, A GROWTH IN, UM, TOWN HOMES TO COME INTO A COMMUNITY THAT THE DUPLEXES THEY WERE COOL WITH.

AND WHAT THAT DID WAS THEY WERE NOT SEEN, THEY DIDN'T SEE THAT.

I DON'T EVEN THINK THAT IT WAS ABLE TO BE COME.

NO ONE SAW THAT COMING.

BUT ONE STREET THAT WERE, THAT WAS ALREADY ZONE MULTIFAMILY CAUSED A, A UPTICK IN THEIR GROWTH QUICKLY.

WHEREAS ELM THICKETT HAPPENED BECAUSE OF WHERE THE PROXIMITY AND THERE LITERALLY ON TWO SIDES OF THE AIRPORT.

AND IT ONE HAPPENED BECAUSE OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES.

THE OTHER ONE HAPPENED BECAUSE OF TOWN HOMES, BUT ONE DIDN'T SEE THE GROWTH COMING.

WELL, THE OTHER ONE DID, BUT IT WAS TOO FAR.

WEST DALLAS IS THE SAME WHEN YOU COMPARE WEST DALLAS, AND YOU COULD COMPARE SOUTH DALLAS COVID SAVED SOUTH DALLAS, BUT IT WASN'T ABLE TO SAVE WEST DALLAS.

BUT WE ARE ABLE TO INTERVENE NOW.

BUT I BELIEVE IF COVID NEVER HAPPENED, WE MIGHT'VE SAW HAPPEN IN SOUTH DALLAS, HAPPEN IN WEST DALLAS, THAT HAPPENED TO WEST DALLAS, WHERE IT'S ALMOST TOTALLY GENTRIFIED, BUT JUST, IT'S NOT JUST SOUTH OF 30.

SO THAT MOVING PART IS YOU HAVE THOSE THREE LITTLE AREAS THAT EITHER HISPANIC OR, OR MAJORITY OF AFRICAN AMERICAN THAT HAS BEEN GENTRIFIED IN SOME KIND OF WAY THAT WERE SET ASIDE FOR JUST THAT FOR, FOR THAT, UM, AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR THOSE DIFFERENT TYPE OF PEOPLE.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, I APPRECIATE COMMISSIONER WHEELER'S COMMENTS.

UM, I THINK IT HIGHLIGHTS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HOPEFULLY THIS PLAN WILL HELP MITIGATE, WHICH IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SEEING IN LEFT FIELD WEST IN PARTICULAR IS THAT ONE AREA IS ZONED R 75.

ANOTHER SECTION OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT HAD HISTORICALLY THE SAME TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT PATTERN WAS REZONED A MULTI-FAMILY MANY YEARS AGO.

PREDATING EVERYTHING WITH THIS GROUP.

AND WE ARE NOW SEEING THE RESULTS OF THAT.

IT HAPPENS THROUGHOUT EAST DALLAS, IT HAPPENS THROUGHOUT OUR CITY AS SHE IS, UM, ALLUDING TO, ONE OF THE THINGS I DO HOPE THAT COMES OUT OF THIS, AND I'M, I WILL GET TO THE LANGUAGE IN A MINUTE, BUT HOW WE STRENGTHEN NSOS LEFT FIELD WEST HAS BEEN WORKING ON AN NSO FOR, TO MY KNOWLEDGE, EIGHT YEARS.

AND I WAS, AND THAT'S HOW I IDENTIFIED, LEARNED ABOUT NSOS BECAUSE, AND I BROUGHT IT TO SUSPECTED SOUTH DALLAS HAD NEVER HEARD OF IT BECAUSE OF THAT ONE STREET THAT WAS ALREADY DUPLEXES AND THREE STREETS OVER WERE ALREADY DUPLEXES.

THE REST OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATION HURRIED UP AND THEY LEARNED ABOUT THEIR, THEIR NSO, BUT IT WAS THOSE THREE STREETS THAT TRIGGERED IT AND THEY NEVER WOULD'VE NEEDED.

SO I, I THINK THIS SPEAKS TO STRENGTHENING THE LANGUAGE CLARITY OF OUR LANGUAGE IS, IS REALLY CRITICAL.

AS WE'RE, UM, REVIEWING THESE COMMENTS, UM, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE DISPLACEMENT, UM, I WILL LOOK FORWARD TO MAYBE UNDERSTANDING HOW WE THINK ABOUT LINKS OR HOW WE MIGHT TRACK THAT.

AGAIN, THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT WE ALSO LOOK AT IN THE IMPLEMENTATION AREA IN THE FIRST SENTENCE UNDER LOCATIONAL STRATEGY.

LAST OR FIRST PARAGRAPH, LAST SENTENCE.

UM, ONE QUESTION I HAVE IS THAT IT STATES, UM, WELL THE LOCATIONS WHERE IT MIGHT BE, AND

[04:30:01]

IT ENDS BY SAYING, SHOULD BE CONSIDERED FOR ADDING THESE HOUSING TYPES, BUT I DON'T SEE WHERE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WHAT THESE ARE.

AND I'M WONDERING IF THAT SHOULD BE ALTERNATIVE OR SOME OTHER WORD THAT SPEAKS TO THE SECONDARY USES THAT, THAT WE'RE REFERRING TO.

AND I'M HAPPY TO MAKE A MOTION OR TO JUST SUBMIT THAT TO STAFF FOR A SEPARATE REVIEW.

I KNOW WE'VE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION ON IT, SO IT SEEMS LIKE THERE MIGHT BE A, A MORE HOLISTIC REVIEW OF, OF THAT.

SO I DON'T WANT TO GET AHEAD OF MY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS.

I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT.

PLEASE.

I THINK ALTERNATIVE HOUSING TYPE WORKS, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, UH, PAGE THREE 19, I I I SEE SOME, UM, DISCREPANCIES BETWEEN LIKE NUMBER 13, 19, I'M SORRY, 13, 20, 21, 13.

IN MORE GRIDED COMMUNITIES ESTABLISH COMPACT BLOCKS AND LOCATE BUILDINGS TOWARD THE FRONT PROPERTY LINE.

NUMBER 20.

BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED AWAY FROM STREETS AND HAVE FRONT YARDS, AND THEN FRONT YARDS ARE SEMI-PRIVATE AND MAY INCLUDE FRONT STOOPS AND PORCHES.

SO WE'RE MOVING FORWARD, BUT WE'RE ALSO MOVING BACK AND HAVING FRONT YARDS AND PUTTING IN PORCHES AND STOOPS.

I MEAN, IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DIFFERENT TYPES OF PLACES, I THINK WE NEED MORE LANGUAGE TO YEAH, I UNDERSTOOD THAT.

IT'S MORE COMMERCIAL, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING ON, YEAH.

COMM, COMM, COMMISSIONER, UH, CARPENTER, WHEN WE ARE LOOKING AT COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, THIS, I THINK OF THIS AS A TYPICAL R FIVE, R SEVEN FIVE NEIGHBORHOOD.

AND WHEN I LOOK AT THIS WORDING, UM, WHERE YOU SAY FRONT YARDS ARE SEMI-PRIVATE AND YOU'RE THINKING, AND IT MAY INCLUDE FRONT STOOPS PORTION CONTRIBUTE TO NEIGHBORHOOD CHARACTER.

UM, ARE YOU, I I WOULD, I WOULD LOOK AT THAT AS SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE MORE LIKE TOWNISH WHERE YOU HAVE BROWNSTONES WITH STOOPS, BUT, BUT WHERE YOU SAY, BUT, BUT WHEN I SEE T BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED AWAY FROM THE STREETS AND HAVE FRONT YARDS, THAT WOULD BE, I, I DO SEE THAT IN SINGLE FAMILY R FIVE ARE, ARE SEVEN FIVE WITH 25 FOOT SETBACKS AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE.

UH, WHERE TOWN HOMES MAY NOT, MAY ONLY HAVE 10 FEET, FIVE FEET, SMALL FRONT YARDS, NO FRONT YARDS.

SO ARE YOU SAYING THAT THE FRONT YARDS ARE SEMI-PRIVATE NUMBER 21, 20 21 SHOULD BE RE REWORDED FOR JUST R SEVEN FIVE, R FIVE? I, I'M NOT SURE THEY, I MEAN, IT JUST SEEMS LIKE THEY'RE WE'RE SAYING OPPOSITE THINGS, YOU KNOW? 'CAUSE NUMBER 13, IT, IT'S VERY SPECIFICALLY CALLING OUT GREETED COMMUNITIES AND, UM, LOCATING BUILDINGS TOWARD THE FRONT PROPERTY LINE.

SO THAT SEEMS TO ME THAT WE'RE SAYING IN THESE PARTICULAR COMMUNITIES, UM, IT, IT SOUNDS LIKE, YOU KNOW, SOME NEIGHBORHOODS ARE BEING SINGLED OUT FOR MORE DENSITY, YOU KNOW, CLOSER TO THE STREET A MORE, YOU KNOW, URBAN SORT OF, UM, DEVELOPMENT PATTERN.

BUT THEN I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW IT, IT GOES WITH NUMBER 20 SAYING BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED AWAY FROM STREETS AND HALF FRONT YARDS.

I MEAN, THOSE TWO THINGS ARE ANTITHETICAL.

I I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU.

AND THEN, SO I THINK 13 SHOULD BE, UM, SHOULD BE STRICKEN.

IT SEEMS TO ME THAT IT, IT'S MORE, UM, CHARACTERISTIC OF A MIXED USE ENVIRONMENT.

ARE YOU SAYING THAT THAT, UM, WELL THERE'S BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY, FIRST OF ALL.

SO IF YOU HAVE INFILL DENSER ANYWAY, SORRY.

13 IS PROBABLY FOCUSED MORE ON THE, THE GRIDED TYPES OF NEIGHBORHOODS.

YEAH, SO I THINK, UH, JUST GOING BACK TO EVEN THAT FIRST, UH, THE PREVIOUS SPREAD WHERE IT TOUCHES ON THE, THE TWO DIFFERENT TYPES OF FORMS THAT WE HAVE IN THIS PARTICULAR PLACE TYPE THIS, THIS PLACE TYPE IS, UH, DESCRIBING A LOT OF DIFFERENT TYPES OF SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS THAT WE HAVE.

IT'S NOT JUST THE SUBURBAN, IT'S NOT JUST THE, THE MORE GRIDED, IT'S, IT'S TALKING ABOUT BOTH.

SO I THINK THAT NUMBER

[04:35:01]

AND NUMBER 2021 SPEAKS MORE MAYBE TO THAT MORE SUBURBAN TYPE OF, UH, UH, FORM THAT YOU HAVE.

BUT THEY'RE STILL PART OF THIS PLACE TYPE.

SO MAYBE WE CAN PROVIDE MORE SPECIFICITY AS TO WHICH ONE, OR IF YOU'RE TRYING TO BE MORE GENERAL, LIKE YOU MENTIONED COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, WE CAN GO THAT DIRECTION.

BUT I THINK THAT'S KIND OF THE IDEA IS THAT THIS PLACE TYPE IS SPEAKING TO DIFFERENT FORMS. UH, SO WE CAN EITHER CLARIFY WHAT THAT FORM IS LOOKING LIKE OR WE CAN BE A MORE GENERAL WITH THERE'S, THIS IS DESCRIBING, WELL, I THINK THERE'S, THERE'S MORE TO IT THAN THAT.

'CAUSE IT ALMOST LOOKS LIKE WE'RE GOING BACK TO OUR, UH, THE, THE PRELIMINARY, UM, DICHOTOMY THAT WE HAD WHERE WE'RE, UM, ADVOCATING, PUSHING MORE DENSITY INTO THE GRIDED NEIGHBORHOODS AND, YOU KNOW, ALLOWING THE, THE NON GRIDED TO BE MORE SUBURBAN.

AND THAT, THAT'S I MY UNDERSTANDING FROM WHAT WE DECIDED AT CLUB WAS THAT WAS THE DIRECTION WE DID NOT WANT TO GO IN.

COMMISSIONER HAN FOLLOW UP, COMMISSIONER KINGSTON.

UM, I, I WOULD JUST SAY I, I LIVE IN A GRIDED COMMUNITY AND I WOULD SAY, UM, 20 AND 21 SPEAK DIRECTLY TO THE DEVELOPMENT PATTERN OF MY COMMUNITY.

BUT I COULD ALSO SEE AREAS, UM, I'LL USE STATE THOMAS.

THAT'S PROBABLY ONE WHERE THE BUILDINGS ARE PLACED CLOSER TO THE STREET ALSO ON A GRIDDED PATTERN.

I THINK YOUR POINT IS IT REALLY COULD OCCUR IN EITHER, BUT I THINK BY USING THE TERM GRIDDED, IT'S WHAT IS CREATING MAYBE A, A CONFLICT THERE THAT THAT ISN'T NECESSARILY THERE BECAUSE THEY, THEY CAN BOTH COEXIST REALLY IN ANY OF THE AREAS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

SO I DON'T, I THINK IF WE COULD COME UP WITH WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DEFINE BY SAYING COMPACT BLOCKS, LOCATE BUILDINGS TOWARD THE FRONT OF THE PROPERTY.

I THINK COMPACT BLOCKS IS COVERED WHEN YOU GET DOWN TO 19 WHERE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT BLOCK LENGTH.

AND I GUESS REALLY WHAT I'M GETTING TO IS DO WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT BUILDINGS TOWARD THE STREET OR IS THAT ALREADY COVERED ELSEWHERE? RIGHT.

AND I THINK WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TOO, POSSIBLY, YOU KNOW, 13 IS IF THAT'S EVEN NEEDED.

THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN TALK ABOUT TOO AS WELL.

'CAUSE I THINK IT'S COVERED IN, IN SOME OTHER ELEMENTS, BUT JUST CURIOUS WHAT Y'ALL THINK ABOUT.

SO COMMISSIONER KINGSTON.

OR IT MAY BE THAT 20 IS EXPANDED TO JUST NOTE THAT DEPENDING ON THE ESTABLISHED CHARACTER OR, YOU KNOW, AS COMMUNITIES EVOLVE, NOT QUITE SURE WHERE THAT MIGHT BE, BUT THAT BOTH COULD BE CORRECT, BUT IT SHOULD BE, UM, COMPREHENSIVE ISN'T THE WORD I'M LOOKING FOR, BUT THERE SHOULD BE CONTINUITY IN THE PATTERN.

SO IT MAY BE IT'S COMBINING 13 AND 20 AND THEN ARTICULATING HOW THEY WOULD BE IMPLEMENTED.

UM, I I HAVE TWO OTHER COMMENTS NOT RELATED TO THAT.

SO I THINK OTHERS HAVE COMMENTS ON THIS ITEM.

YEAH, I'M SORT OF WONDERING IF WE'RE GETTING COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL AND CITY RES RESIDENTIAL CONFLATED.

COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL IN MY MIND IS DESIGNED MORE LIKE OUR SORT OF SINGLE FAMILY TRADITIONAL THAT WE THINK ABOUT WHERE YOU WOULD HAVE KIND OF BLOCK FRONT CONTINUITY AND THE FRONT YARDS AND THIS IDEA THAT YOU WOULD HAVE, YOU KNOW, CATERING TO STOOPS AND THE BUILDINGS BEING AT THE FRONT SEEMS MORE IN LINE WITH COMMUNITY.

I MEAN THE CITY RESIDENTIAL AND TO COMM COMMISSIONER HAMPTON'S EXAMPLE, I'M GUESSING STATE THOMAS IS LABELED CITY RESIDENTIAL AND NOT COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, WHICH WOULD MAKE SENSE.

SO I MEAN, IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT PLACES WHERE WE'RE GOING TO ALLOW GENERAL DENSITY, LIKE DUPLEXES AND AND SUCH, WOULDN'T THOSE, WHAT ISN'T THE GOAL OF THAT? THAT THEY FIT INTO THE EXISTING FRAMEWORK OF THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS? SO SHOULDN'T THE BUILDING FORM AND CHARACTER AND THE SETBACKS AND THE PARKING AND ALL FIT IN AS WELL, WHICH IS I THINK TO COMMISSIONER CARPENTER'S POINT THAT THERE'S A LOT OF INCONGRUITY IN THIS.

WHAT AM I MISSING? ARE WE THINKING MAYBE COMBINE 13 AND 20 AND STRIKE 21? NO, KEEP 21.

KEEP 21, MR. CHAIR, CAN I MAKE A PLEASE MOTION AND I'LL SPEAK TO WHY I THINK WE .

WAIT, WAIT, THIS, THIS WILL WORK.

UM, ON PAGE THREE 19, STRIKE ITEMS 13 AND 20 INTO THE FINAL PARAGRAPH ON THAT PAGE, WHICH READS FRONT SIDE AND REAR SETBACKS, UM, MAY VARY IN SIZE ACROSS NEIGHBORHOODS, VARY IN SIZE ACROSS NEIGHBORHOODS, BUT ARE GENERALLY CONSISTENT WITH AN INDIVIDUAL NEIGHBORHOOD

[04:40:04]

AT, ACTUALLY I'LL, I'LL JUST STRIKE 13 AND 20 BECAUSE I THINK THAT'S WHERE THE CONFUSION IS COMING FROM.

WE ADDRESS MOST OF WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO GET AT, IF NOT ALL OF IT THROUGH THE REST OF THE PROVISIONS.

COMMISSIONER HARBERT? OKAY.

DISCUSSION COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, I DO HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT GENERALLY CONSISTENT.

DOESN'T BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY REQUIRE AND, AND JUST ZONING REGULATIONS REQUIRE CONSISTENCY.

I MEAN, WHAT YOU, YOU, RIGHT AND SIDE AND ROUTE SETBACKS.

I SEE THAT THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CONTINUITY AND A SINGLE BLOCK FACE AND CONTINUITY THROUGHOUT THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

SO I, I SEE THIS AT A HIGHER LEVEL.

WE'VE GOT THE BLOCK BASED CONTINUITY POLICY AND THE DEVELOPMENT CODE.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THAT? DIGESTING YOU OKAY WITH THAT? OKAY.

AND THE OPPOSED AYES HAVE IT.

HERBERT RUBEN HERBERT, NEXT PAGE, OH, PARDON ME, COMMISSIONER HAMPTON.

SORRY.

UM, BACK ON THREE 18, CRB FOUR.

UM, IS THERE A REASON WHY WE'RE REFERENCING MID TO HIGHRISE WHEN THE DEFINITION OF MIDRISE IS, UM, LESS THAN 10 STORIES AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A LOWER SCALED, UM, AREAS, IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE HIGHRISE IS APPROPRIATE IN THAT CONTEXT.

WHICH NUMBER? I'M SORRY.

UH, THREE 18 UNDER ADJACENCIES.

CRB FOUR.

LAST, LAST ELEMENT, LAST SENTENCE.

SUGGESTING THEY'D BE MORE SENSITIVE ABOUT WHERE THEY LOCATED.

ALRIGHT, MR. RUBEN.

THIS DOES NOT, I I DON'T SEE THIS AUTHORIZING MID OR HIGH RISE WITHIN COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL ITSELF.

THIS TALKS ABOUT WHAT'S ALLOWED IN, IN ADJACENT PLACE TYPE.

SO IF YOU HAVE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL AND YOU HAVE SOME OTHER PLACE TYPE THAT CALLS FOR HIGHER HEIGHTS NEXT TO COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, YOU CAN STEP UP AND I SEE CITY STAFF NODDING ALONG WITH ME, SO I'M GLAD I'M NOT COMING OUTTA LEFT FIELD.

YOU STEP UP TO MIDRISE NOT IN COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, BUT ADJACENT TO IT.

AND THEN IF THERE'S HIGHRISE, IT'S COMING EVEN FURTHER AWAY FROM COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL.

I, I UNDERSTAND AND I, UM, AGREE WITH ALL THAT.

I'M JUST ASKING THAT IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WHAT'S GONNA BE IMMEDIATELY ADJACENT TO A LOW-RISE PLACE TYPE, AND WE'RE SAYING THAT UP TO 10 STORIES, WOULDN'T YOUR HIGHRISE THEN BE ADJACENT TO WHERE YOU HAVE MID-RISE IN OTHER, THAT WHOLE IDEA OF YOU'RE STEPPING UP, YOU'RE TRYING TO THINK THROUGH HOW THIS, UM, BODY WOULD USE IT MOVING FORWARD.

SO IF THERE WAS, UM, REGIONAL MIXED USE ADJACENT TO COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL AND SOMEONE HAS A ZONING CASE THAT PROPOSES A HIGH RISE RIGHT NEXT TO COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, THIS WOULD BE A POINT TO SAY, WAIT A MINUTE.

NO, THE PLACE TYPE SAYS THAT IF IT'S ADJACENT, YOU KNOW, REGARDLESS.

'CAUSE REGIONAL MIXED USE WOULD SAY YES, THIS IS APPROPRIATE FOR MID TO HIGH RISE, BUT THIS WOULD BE THE POINT WHERE YOU WOULD GO BACK IN THE DOCUMENT AND SAY, THE REASON WHY WE'RE STAFF OR CPC COUNCILS COMMENDING, YOU KNOW, DENIAL OF THAT ZONING REQUEST.

IT'S BECAUSE IT'S YES, THAT THAT HEIGHT MIGHT BE ALLOWED IN THAT PLACE TYPE OR SUGGESTED IN THAT PLACE TYPE, BUT BECAUSE OF THE ADJACENCY TO THIS PLACE TYPE, IT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT STAFF OR CPC MAY RECOMMEND DENIAL OF, IF THAT AGAIN MAKES SENSE.

AND IT, IT MAY BE THAT, UH, AND AGAIN, I, I BELIEVE THAT SAME LANGUAGE IS IN SOME OF THE OTHER MIXED USE PLACE TYPES WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT THAT ADJACENCY.

BUT AGAIN, TRYING TO SOMETIMES MAKE IT REDUNDANT SO IT'S EASY TO TO BE USED AS A DOCUMENT MOVING FORWARD.

I'LL GIVE SOME THOUGHT TO ANY FURTHER LANGUAGE CLARIFICATIONS.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER BLAIR.

UM, THREE 19 ITEM NUMBER 12, PLACE SURFACE PARKING AT THE REAR OR INTERIOR OF THE LOT TO ENHANCE THE PEDESTRIAN EXPERIENCE.

IF THIS IS ON SINGLE FAMILY COM RESIDENTIAL, HOW DO WE PLACE PARKING IN THE INTERIOR, UM, OF A LOT? THAT'S TRUE.

AND HOP IN ON THIS ONE AS WELL, HAVING THOUGHT THROUGH THAT QUITE A BIT.

SO WITHIN COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, IT'S, YOU KNOW, NOT SOLELY SINGLE FAMILY LOTS.

THERE ARE SCHOOLS, THERE ARE CHURCHES, SO ON AND SO FORTH, INSTITUTIONAL USES.

SO THOSE SORTS OF COMMUNITY SERVING USES, WHICH ARE ALREADY IN OUR EXISTING COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL AREAS TODAY, SOME OF 'EM, WE SEE THEM PUSH THEIR PARKING RIGHT UP AGAINST THE STREET, WHICH MAKES FOR A VERY UNPLEASANT PEDESTRIAN ENVIRONMENT.

SO WE'RE ASKING THEM AND

[04:45:01]

SO THEN IF THAT'S THE CASE, CAN WE REWRITE THAT TO SAY IN, IN THE TYPE OF HOUSE, THE TYPE OF DEVELOPMENTS YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT? SO IN, IN WHEN CHURCHES ARE CO-LOCATED IN, UM, IN THIS PLACE TYPE THAT THEIR PARKING IS PLACED IN THE REAR OR ANTERIOR OPPOSED TO THE FRONT, CAN THAT BE WORDSMITH TO, TO DO THAT? AM I, AM I NON RESIDENTIAL? NON, OKAY.

NOT TO LIMIT IT TO JUST CHURCHES, ANY TYPE OF INSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT IN THE, IN THIS, I THINK COMMISSIONER CARPENTER HAS A NONRESIDENTIAL, BUT FOR NON-RESIDENTIAL USES, COMMISSIONER WEER GOOD.

YES, SHE IS.

COMMISSIONER WE, SO PATRICK AND UM, ANDREA, YOU KNOW THAT THAT'S GOING TO BE AN ISSUE IN AREAS THAT ARE LANDLOCKED.

AND SO WE HAVE ENOUGH PARKING ISSUES, UM, AND, AND IN, IN, AGAIN, SOUTH DALLAS.

AND OUR ISSUE IS THAT THAT'S THE REASON WE DON'T HAVE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, OUR PARKING ISSUES.

AND WE PUT ANY MORE CONSTRAINTS ON AREAS THAT ARE LANDLOCK IN SOME OF THESE OLDER COMMUNITIES THAT, THAT, THAT, UM, ALREADY HAVE NOT ADDRESSED PARKING REQUIREMENTS BECAUSE WE WAITED ON ZAC FOR FIVE YEARS, SIX YEARS TO MAKE THAT DECISION.

HOW WILL THAT AFFECT THOSE AREAS? UM, WE ALREADY HAVE THAT.

WE CAN'T FRONT PARK IN THE FRONT OF OUR NA COMMUN IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

THOSE, UH, PARKING, THAT'S COUNT THAT'S SIMILAR TO, UM, BISHOP PARK IN GREENVILLE IS NOT EVEN CONSIDERED IN OUR PARKING, OUR PARKING, UM, UM, REQUIREMENTS.

EVEN THOUGH THAT OUR CUSTOMERS PARK OUT FRONT, THEY DO NOT PARK IN THE REAR FOR SAFETY ISSUES.

SO THEY USE ONLY OUR FRONT PARKING.

WE CAN'T CONSIDER IT IN OUR PARKING, UM, WHEN WE GO TO, TO GET CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCIES.

SO HAVING THAT TYPE OF LANGUAGE, AND THIS CONCERNS ME GREATLY, WHERE WE GREATLY, IT'S A MAJOR ISSUE WITHIN, IN, IN THOSE, IN THESE TYPE OF COMMUNITIES.

NOWHERE ELSE DO I REALLY KNOW THAT THAT'S AN ISSUE.

BUT IN PD 5 95, SO, SO COMMISSIONER WHEELER DOES MAKE A GOOD POINT THAT, UM, THOSE CAN BE A LIMITING FACTOR, ESPECIALLY IN REDEVELOPMENT OF OLDER AREAS.

UM, OTHER THAN FOR DALLAS BEING A GUY THAT SAYS YOU SHOULD TRY TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN.

IF THAT CASE COMES UP AND SOMEONE SAYS, WELL, WE CAN'T MAKE IT HAPPEN BECAUSE OF X, Y, AND Z, AGAIN, THEY'RE NOT HELD, IT'S NOT THE ZONING.

SO IT'S NOT GONNA PREVENT THEM FROM GETTING AN SUP, IT'S JUST WHEN THE ZONING CASE COMES UP AND THEY CAN DESCRIBE THE REASONS WHY.

YES, THERE IS GENERAL GUIDANCE OF FORD DALLAS THAT SAYS THAT CHURCH, THAT OFFICE, THAT RETAIL, WE, YOU KNOW, WE SHOULD FIGURE OUT A WAY TO NOT HAVE ALL THAT PARKING UP FRONT.

UM, SOMEONE CAN SAY, WELL THE REASON WHY IT IS IN THIS CASE IS BECAUSE WE HAVE A SMALLER LOT AND YOU KNOW, IT WAS DEVELOPED IN THE 1940S AND SO IT IT FITS A DIFFERENT URBAN FORM WHERE THAT PARKING BEING BEHIND THAT BUILDING IS NOT, NOT CONDUCIVE.

SO MY CONCERN IS THAT WE ALREADY ARE OVERSATURATED WITH SUVS AND PD FIVE NINE FOR ME.

UM, YEAH, SUVS AND PD 5 9 5, WHICH IS THE Q WAY FOR THOSE WHO DEVELOP PD 5 95 TO ALMOST SAY NO.

UM, ANY PARKING.

THERE WAS TWO MAJOR BEFORE HOUSING NEVER TOOK SHAPE ON THE ISSUE IN SOUTH DALLAS.

IT WAS PARKING AND THE SUVS.

I BELIEVE THAT THAT WILL CAUSE A GREATER RESTRAINT BE BECAUSE MOST OF OUR PROPERTIES ARE, AGAIN, I CAN'T, I GOT A COUSIN WHO OWNS A PROPERTY ON REED AND, AND, AND, AND MALCOLM X.

WE, AT ONE POINT WE HAD TO MAKE AN AGREEMENT WITH DEVELOPMENT SERVICES SAYING WITH THE CITY SAYING SHE WOULDN'T RENT OUT TWO OF HER SUITES BECAUSE OF PARKING.

SHE WAS AT HER PARKING MAX ON A BUILDING THAT FOR 50 YEARS WAS FILLED BECAUSE OF PARKING RESTRAINTS.

SO ANY, ANY OTHER PARKING RESTRAINTS IN OUR LEGACY AREAS, I AM GONNA BE 100% AGAINST BECAUSE OF WHAT HAS HAPPENED IN OUR COMMUNITY.

MR. CHAIR? YES SIR.

CAN I PROPOSE AN AMENDMENT? PLEASE DO.

THAT SOME AREAS MAY HAVE UNIQUE CHALLENGES THAT PREVENT SURFACE PARKING FROM BEING LOCATED IN THE REAR OR INTERIOR OF THE LOT AND ALLOWS FOR GREATER FLEXIBILITY WHEN WE ACTUALLY MAKE ZONING DECISIONS AND CODE DECISIONS MOVING FORWARD.

ON ITEM 12, ON PAGE THREE, UH, 19, UM, INSERT THE WORDS WHEN FEASIBLE BEFORE PLACED SURFACE PARKING.

I'LL SECOND THAT AND PLEASE SIMPLY PUT THAT ADDRESSES

[04:50:01]

DISCUSSION.

COMMISSIONER BLAIR? UM, CAN I ASK THAT WHEN YOU SAY, UM, PLACE WHEN FEASIBLE PLACE SERVICE PARK IS AT THE REAR, UM, OR INTERIOR OF NON-RESIDENTIAL USES? I YOU DON'T, I'M THINKING BACK TO MY COMMENTS EARLIER AND CERTAINLY I THINK THAT THE WORST OFFENDERS FOR PUTTING PARKING NEXT TO THE STREET OR PROBABLY THE NON-RESIDENTIAL USES, BUT, AND I, I, I GUESS I'D LIKE TO REVISE WHAT I SAID EARLIER THAT THAT'S PRIORITY NUMBER ONE, BUT NO, YOU COULD PUT IT IN ALSO.

OR, OR EVEN FOR, FOR A SINGLE FAMILY HOME.

YOU KNOW, SOME OF THE FRONT LOADED HOUSES THAT WE SEE ARE, ARE VERY INHOSPITABLE TO THE STREET, TO THE STREETSCAPE.

SO IF WE CAN ENCOURAGE THEM TOO TO REAR LOAD OR SIDE LOAD OR MOVE THEIR PARKING MORE INTERIOR, I THINK I'M, I'M FINE WITH THIS AS IS, AS AS MY YES.

SO THANK YOU COMMISSIONER WHEELER.

SO I THINK THAT, UH, WITH OUR COMMUNITY, WE'VE HAD, WE'VE HAD THAT WITH OUR, THAT'S ONE OF OUR DESIGN STANDARDS AND WE, WE, THEY'RE LOOKING INTO THAT, BUT THAT DESIGN STANDARD IN AREAS WE WOULD HAVE WHEN THEY'RE BUILDING GARAGE WANTED IT IN THE ALLEY, BUT THE CITY MAKES THEM PAVE THE WHOLE ALLEY .

SO IT MAKES THEM PAVE THE WHOLE ALLEY.

BUT THESE ARE COM THESE ARE ALL RESIDENTIAL, BUT WHAT WE DID SAY WAS WHEN PARKING THAT, THAT THE GARAGE WOULD NOT SIT OUT WHAT WILL BE FRONT OF THE FRONT, IT WILL NOT, UM, WHAT WAS IT? UM, PATRICK AND P, IT, IT HAS TO BE SETBACK.

IT'S NOT, WHAT IS IT? YEAH.

SO IN, IN SOUTH DALLAS PD 5 95, THE RECOMMENDATIONS ARE AGAIN, PORCHES IN THE FRONT, GARAGES IN THE BACK, UM, TWO STORIES IN HEIGHT, IT'S A PITCHED ROOF.

AND WHEN WE SAY GARAGES IN THE BACK, THAT COULD BE ALLEY ACCESS, REAR ACCESS, THAT COULD BE SIDE ACCESS, THAT COULD BE, IF IT'S A DETACHED GARAGE, IT'S IN THE REAR 30%.

IT COULD ALSO BE THAT THE GARAGE FACADE IS OFFSET A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF FEET FROM THE FRONT FACADE.

SO AGAIN, IT'S TRYING TO SAY THAT IF YOU WALK DOWN THE STREET, REGARDLESS OF THE LANE USE, YOU SHOULDN'T JUST SEE A BUNCH OF DRIVEWAYS AND CARS.

AND SO WE ALSO, AND, AND NOW THAT THAT'S ALSO, 'CAUSE WE ASKED FOR FRONT PORCHES, WE HAVE FRONT PORCHES.

WE WANT THE GARAGE WHERE THE GARAGE NOW IS SITTING HALFWAY INTO THE DRIVEWAY.

WE WANT IT TO SIT BACK AND THE HOUSE PROTRUDE FORWARD.

AND SO MAKING SURE THAT THAT HAPPENS BECAUSE YOU DO HAVE, WE WOULD LOVE TO HAVE GARAGES, BUT THE ONLY ALLEY THAT'S PAID IN OUR, IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD IS THE ONES THAT'S NOW WALKABLE, UH, WALK.

YOU CAN WALK AS A WALKING TRAIL .

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, JUST POINT OF CLARIFICATION.

AND I'M HOPEFUL BETWEEN WIND FEASIBLE IN THE REFERENCE TO INTERIOR PARKING AS OPPOSED TO AT THE FRONT.

HOPEFULLY THAT STRIKES THE RIGHT BALANCE.

SO RECOGNIZING THAT PD 5 95 AND SOME OTHER AREAS MAY FACE UNIQUE CHALLENGES, HOPEFULLY THERE'S ENOUGH FLEXIBILITY WITH THE LANGUAGE CEMENTED.

IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING, AND I WILL APOLOGIZE, I CAN'T GET 51 A UP AT THE MOMENT THAT, UM, PARKING IS NOT, IS PROHIBITED IN THE FRONT YARD IN OUR DISTRICTS.

IT IS ALLOWED IN MULTI-FAMILY DISTRICTS AND THEN FOR INSTITUTIONAL USES.

AND SO I THINK WHAT I UNDERSTOOD THE INTENT OF THIS IS THAT WHERE WE HAVE, AGAIN, WHETHER IT'S A DUPLEX, WHATEVER IT MAY BE, THAT THAT'S WHERE WE WANNA FOCUS HAVING INTERIOR REAR.

NOW GRANTED THAT WOULD BE A NON-RESIDENTIAL USE, BUT I I I THINK IT'S ALREADY PROHIBITED IN THE, IN THE FRONT YARD.

THEREFORE I DON'T THINK IT HAS THAT SAME CHALLENGE THAT WE SEE IN OTHER DEVELOPMENT TYPES.

AND I THINK BY INCLUDING NON-RESIDENTIAL, IT SPEAKS TO WHERE WE SEE IT PERHAPS GOING IN THE OTHER DIRECTION WHERE YOU DO HAVE PARKING IN THE FRONT YARD THAT'S TAKING AWAY FROM THE PEDESTRIAN REALM AND WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACHIEVE WITH THIS.

SO I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND YOU WANNA HAVE IT EVERYWHERE, BUT I THINK WE'VE ALREADY GOT THAT COVERED IN OUR CODE AND ARE TRYING TO ADDRESS WHERE IT'S NOT CURRENTLY COVERED IN THE CODE AS FUTURE GUIDANCE.

SO I CERTAINLY THINK INCLUDING NON-RESIDENTIAL MAY JUST AGAIN, SPEAK TO WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO ACHIEVE.

SO MY THOUGHTS, THANK YOU.

I DON'T KNOW BECAUSE THE DU A DUPLEX WHERE THAT WE JUST APPROVED HAS A, UH, HAS A CURVE DRIVE LIKE THAT WAS PLACED THAT, THAT THAT, THAT HAS THE MAJORITY FRONT YARD IS, IS, IS PARKING AND SO I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT WAS APPROVED.

IT IT'S, IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF BOTH COMMISSIONERS.

SO THE REQUIRED PARKING FOR, UM, RESIDENTIAL OR FOR SINGLE FAMILY AND DUPLEX LAND

[04:55:01]

USE CAN'T BE IN THE FRONT YARD.

DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU CAN'T PUT PARKING THERE.

SO YOU CAN PAVE THE ENTIRETY OF YOUR SINGLE FAMILY LOT RIGHT NOW FOR PARKING, YOU DON'T EVEN NEED A PERMIT TO DO IT.

UM, AND YOU CAN PARK THERE, BUT REQUIRED PARKING HAS GOTTA BE BEYOND THE FRONT YARD SETBACK.

THAT'S FOR DUPLEX THOUGH, CORRECT? FOR SINGLE FAMILY AND DUPLEX.

I HAVE A SINGLE FAMILY HOME IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD THAT I CAN SHOW YOU PICTURES WHERE THEY'VE PAVED THE WHOLE FRONT PARKING LOT, WHOLE FRONT YARD AND THEY GOT PARKED EIGHT CARS THERE.

I, I FULLY AGREE AND I LOOK FORWARD TO OUR DEBATE OF IMPERVIOUS, IMPERVIOUS COVERAGE THAT'S COMING BEFORE US SOON.

I'M CHECKING ON THE OTHER REQUIREMENTS.

COMMISSIONER HERBERT BY COMMISSIONER CARPENTER.

UH, YEAH, SO THE CRESCENT PARKING LOTS I'VE SEEN OF PARKING LOTS IN SEVERAL NEIGHBORHOODS TO LOW END NEIGHBORHOODS.

UM, AND I'VE ALSO SEEN THE ENTIRE FRONT YARD PARK, UM, THOSE CRESCENT SHAPED, UM, SPOTS TO ME MAKE MORE SENSE IN NEIGHBORHOODS, ESPECIALLY ONES THAT ARE GRIDED, UM, FOR LONG DRIVEWAYS ON ONE SIDE AND SHORT DRIVEWAYS ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STREET.

UM, SO I THINK INTERIOR PARKING DEFINED, UM, IS IMPORTANT.

I ALSO AM SUFFERING IN DISTRICT FOUR AND THREE IN MY RESIDENCE NEIGHBORHOODS WHERE THE GARAGES ARE SERVING AS THE FRONT FACE CONTINUITY.

MM-HMM, .

SO THE FRONT, THE FRONT DOOR IS BACK WHERE THE OTHER HOMES ARE, BUT THE GARAGE POKES OUT THIS CAMEL STYLE.

UM, AND I, I THINK IF WE DON'T ADDRESS THAT HERE OR SOMEWHERE, IT, IT WILL CONTINUE.

UM, AND, AND IT JUST, IT JUST DOESN'T CALL NEIGHBOR.

AND AS WE MOVE FORWARD TO CODE, I THINK GIVING THEM SOME KNOWLEDGE OF WHAT'S HAPPENING ON THE GROUND IS IMPORTANT.

BYSTANDERS.

THIS IS, BY THE WAY, THE DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION ON THE TABLE TO ADD WHEN FEASIBLE THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE NON RESIDENTIAL AT THIS POINT.

BUT WE CAN, YOU KNOW, SOMEONE WANTS TO ADD THAT FOR AMENDMENT.

WE CAN, IF NOT, THAT'S THE MOTION ON THE TABLE.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER? NO, I WAS ONTO THE NEXT TOPIC.

SORRY, WE HAVE NOT VOTED ON IT.

SO ANY OTHER DISCUSSION ON THAT ITEM? COMMISSIONERS SEEN NONE.

A OPPOSED? MOTION PASSES.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, SEGUEING ON THE DISCUSSION OF IMPERVIOUS AND IMPERVIOUS, UM, UNDER ON THREE 18 MOBILITY AND ACCESS NUMBER THREE, LOCAL STREETS TYPICALLY HAVE SIX FOOT SIDEWALKS WITH PLANNING STRIPS AND LOCATIONS WITH LESS INTENSE DEVELOPMENT AND HAVE EIGHT FOOT AND SIDEWALKS AND LOCATIONS WITH MORE INTENSIVE DEVELOPMENT.

UM, WITH GETTING POTENTIALLY, YOU KNOW, DENSER WHAT WE CALL WELL COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS.

WHERE IS THE RECOMMENDATION FOR SIX FOOT SIDEWALKS COMING FROM? IT ALMOST SEEMS LIKE IT'S GOING THE OPPOSITE WAY FROM OUR DESIRE GENERALLY TO HAVE, UM, LESS IMPERVIOUS SURFACE AND TO HAVE, UH, YOU KNOW, TO DEAL WITH THE URBAN HEAT ISLAND EFFECT.

UM, AND NORMALLY OUR LOCAL STREETS HAVE FOUR FOOT SIDEWALKS.

SO WHAT, WHAT'S DRIVING THIS? YEAH, BOTH OF THAT.

SO I THINK, UM, IN ADDITION TO THE A DA, UH, BEST PRACTICES, ALSO OTHER COMP PLANS THAT FOCUSED ON WHAT HAPPENS ON THE LOCAL STREETS BEING A BIT MORE, A BIT WIDER.

UM, BUT I THINK 80 IS ONE OF THOSE, UM, REASONS THAT THAT IS WIDER THAN THE TYPICAL, UH, THREE, FOUR FEET THAT WE HAVE IN, IN THE INTERIOR OF A, OF A NEIGHBORHOOD.

IT'S CURRENTLY ONLY FOUR FEET ARE REQUIRED IN, WHAT WAS THAT? EXCUSE ME.

CURRENTLY ONLY FOUR FEET ARE REQUIRED IN IN MOST, YEAH, BUT ISN'T IT TRUE THAT WITH A DA YOU, YOU HAVE TO HAVE A MINIMUM OF FIVE FEET IN ORDER FOR A WHEELCHAIR TO BE ABLE TO GET DOWN, TO BE WHEELED DOWN THE STREET, IT HAS TO BE A MINIMUM OF FIVE FEET.

FROM IS THE SAFETY AND WALKABILITY OF NEIGHBORHOODS THAT THEY HAVE NOT HAD, ESPECIALLY AROUND ALONG MAJOR CORRIDORS.

SO THEN THAT MEANS THAT WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT OUR CODE, THIS IS ANOTHER ITEM THAT SHOULD BE UPDATED THAT SAYS THAT ALL SIDEWALKS SHOULD BE A DA COMPLIANT, WHICH MEANS THEY SHOULD BE A MINIMUM OF, OF, UH, FIVE, FIVE TO SIX FEET.

WELL REALLY MORE, UM, ON COURSE'S GONNA SUCK UP THREE FEET.

YEAH, WELL, .

SO, OKAY, NEXT ITEM.

COMMISSIONER, COMMISSIONER, ER, WOULD THE, WOULD THE SIX FEET ONLY APPLY TO THE, THE OUTER COMMUNITY COMMERCIAL CORRIDORS AND THE FIVE FEET, THE INTERIOR? UM, BUT I KNOW THAT PART OF THE DRIVING FACTORY IS THAT PEOPLE WANT SAID THAT THEY ARE THE MAJORITY.

THE GOOD, THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE THAT I'VE HEARD

[05:00:01]

THE TRADITIONAL, I WANNA SAY THEY'RE 3 36 FEET THAT JUST HAVE BEEN IMPROVED BY THE CITY UP TO, UM, FIVE TO SIX FEET ALONG OUR MAJOR CORRIDOR SO THAT PEOPLE CAN WALK BECAUSE OF THE SAFETY.

BUT INSIDE THE COURT.

SO DO WE LOOK AT, IN THE INTERIOR STREETS, FIVE UP FIVE FEET AND THE EXTERIOR STREETS SIX FEET.

SO GOING TO YOUR, UH, COMMENT ABOUT SAFETY, I THINK THESE CORRIDORS THAT ARE TYPICALLY HEAVIER TRAFFIC, THE MORE LOCAL STREETS, UH, THE IDEA OF THE BUFFER, THE IDEA OF IT BEING WIDER IS TO PROVIDE JUST A, A, A, A, A LARGER BUFFER, UH, FROM THE VEHICLES AND, AND THOSE WHO ARE WALKING ON IT.

UH, IN ADDITION TO THOSE USING WHEELCHAIRS, TALKING ABOUT THE RADIUS WHEN YOU TURN AROUND, AND ALSO IF YOU, IF TWO WHEELCHAIRS ARE COMING, UH, WITH EACH OTHER, JUST PROVIDING THAT, THAT WIDTH.

SO, UM, GOING BACK TO YOUR, YOUR POINT IN THE INTERIOR, TYPICALLY IT'S USUALLY LESS, UH, WHEN YOU GO, WHEN YOU GO CLOSER TO THOSE LOCAL STREETS IS TYPICALLY GONNA BE MORE, THESE ARE MORE JUST BEST PRACTICES.

THEY'RE NOT CODE.

SO WE CAN, UM, ADD EITHER ADD LANGUAGE IN TERMS OF WHAT THE DEVELOPMENT CODE SHOULD SAY, IF YOU HAVE ANY SUGGESTIONS.

UH, BUT THE INTENT IS TO PROVIDE SOME SAFETY, UH, FOR THOSE THAT ARE CLOSER TO LOCAL LOCAL STREETS.

ANY OTHER CHANGES ON ON THAT PAGE? COMMISSIONERS.

OKAY, LET'S KEEP GOING.

NEXT PAGE.

NOT MUCH RED THERE.

UH, WELL FIRST, WELL ON THE PAGE 3 22 PLACE TYPE APPLICATION, CU A SIX, EMPLOYING ANTI DISPLACEMENT TOOLS WHEN AGING MULTIFAMILY HOUSING STOCK GETS REDEVELOPED SHOULD BE CONSIDERED TO REDUCE DISPLACEMENT.

I MEAN, SHOULD'S KIND OF A WORD.

I MEAN, SHOULD WE JUST SAY THOSE TOOLS SHOULD BE USED TO REDUCE DISPLACEMENT AS, AS OPPOSED TO SHOULD BE CONSIDERED? I MEAN WE, WE SEEM TO MAKE THAT POINT THROUGHOUT THE DOCUMENT THAT WE'RE SUPPOSEDLY DOING EVERYTHING WE CAN DO TO PREVENT DISPLACEMENT.

SO DOES THAT NEED TO BE STRENGTHENED? I SO I THINK WE COULD, I THINK THAT WORKS EMPLOYING ANTI DISPLACEMENT TOOLS WHEN AGING MULTIFAMILY HOUSING STOCK GETS REDEVELOPED.

SHOULD BE USED, YES.

BECAUSE WE CAN'T SAY MUST IN A PLAN, RIGHT? WE CAN'T SAY MUST OR SHALL JUST FOR REFERENCE.

THAT WAS A MOTION.

AND WE HAVE A SECOND, BUT COMMISSIONER, WE HAVE COMMISSION SECONDED BY SOMEONE OVER THERE.

AND I'LL TAKE IT.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, I APPRECIATE IT.

WE, WE AT, CAN YOU PLEASE CLARIFY WHERE ON SURE.

THAT WE ARE ON PAGE 3 22 UP AT THE TOP IN THE ORANGE AREA, CU EIGHT SIX.

IT, THE MOTION IS TO EMPLOYING ANTI DISPLACEMENT TOOLS WHEN AGING MULTIFAMILY HOUSING STOCK GETS REDEVELOPED.

SHOULD BE USED TO REDUCE DISPLACEMENT CHANGING.

CONSIDER TO, CONSIDERED TO USED, CHANGING, CONSIDERED TO USE.

WAS IT CARPENTER? OKAY WITH THAT COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, UH, MADE THE MOTION.

COMMISSIONER TON SECOND.

ANY OPPOSED? AYES HAVE IT PLEASE.

AND MIXED USE BUILDINGS TOWARD THE FRONT PROPERTY LINE TO ACTIVATE SIDEWALKS AND ENHANCE THE PUBLIC REALM.

UM, ITEM NUMBER FIVE, LOCAL AND ARTERIAL STREETS HAVE EIGHT FOOT SIDEWALKS WITH A PLANNING STRIP.

SO ARE WE GOING TO EIGHT FEET HERE INSTEAD OF SIX FEET? SO WE, WE, IS THAT A, WAS THAT INTENTIONAL OR JUST AN INCONSISTENCY BECAUSE WE HAD LOCAL STREETS BEING SIX AND ARTERIAL EIGHT.

UNDER COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, IS IT A DECISION THAT LOCAL STREETS IN CITY RESIDENTIAL NEED TO BE AS WIDE AS THE ARTERIAL STREET SIDEWALKS? YEAH, THIS IS INTENTIONAL.

UH, 'CAUSE AT THIS PLACE I WAS ACTUALLY DENSER BETWEEN MORE PEOPLE PROBABLY WALKING THESE STREETS.

SO THAT'S THE, THE IDEA OF KEEPING THIS AT EIGHT.

UM, GOT THE SAME KIND OF PROBLEM HERE WITH 13, 17, AND 18.

UM, 13, LOCATE COMMERCIAL

[05:05:01]

NUMBER 17, BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY AWAY FROM THE STREET WITH LINES BETWEEN THE BUILDING AND THE SIDEWALK.

AND THEN 18 WHEN LOCATED ALONG ARTERIAL OR COMPLETE STREETS, BUILDINGS ARE SET BACK FARTHER FROM THE STREET TO REDUCE NOISE OR OTHER TRAFFIC IMPACTS AND TO PROVIDE PRIVACY.

SO IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S BOUNCING ALL AROUND.

SO LAWRENCE, DO YOU KNOW WHERE THOSE, THOSE LAST THREE? BECAUSE IT, SO I THINK WHAT I WILL SAY, PROBABLY BLANKET STATEMENT I'M IMAGINING FOR THESE IS THIS IS TRYING TO PIECE TOGETHER MULTIPLE COMMENTS FROM MULTIPLE FOLKS.

SO THIS IS GOOD THAT WE'RE REVIEWING IT, UM, WITH THE ENTIRE BODY BECAUSE I IMAGINE THAT SOME OF THAT IS THIS.

SO WHAT IF WE ARE LOOKING AT, OR OR OKAY, IS THIS SOMETHING TO, TO TALK ABOUT CITY RESIDENTIAL AND THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A SUBURBAN VIEW VERSUS A URBAN VIEW? BECAUSE IN A SUBURBAN VIEW ARE WE DO, ARE WE SETTING THINGS BACK FURTHER IN A URBAN VIEW? THINGS ARE, ARE UP CLOSER.

SO IF WE'RE SAYING THAT LOCATE COMMERCIAL AND MIXED USE BUILDING NUMBER 13, UH, TOWARDS THE FRONT, THAT WOULD BE AN URBAN VIEW.

BUT WHEN YOUR BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED IN, IN, SO IN A SUBURBAN VIEW, BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED AWAY FROM THE STREETS WITH LAWNS BETWEEN THE, THE BUILDING AND SIDEWALK.

HOWEVER, BUILDINGS IN MORE URBAN CONTEXT WITH GROUND FLOOR RETAIL MAY BE LOCATED CLOSER TO THE STREET.

SO, SO FROM WHAT I'M READING ON NUMBER 17, IT'S TRYING TO TO DISTINGUISH SUBURBAN FROM URBAN.

SO WE STRIKE OUT 13 YES.

BECAUSE OF, HOWEVER, IF YOU, IF YOU USE SEVENTEENS, BUT, BUT IF EVEN, SO IF YOU STRIKE OUT THIR 13 AND 17, YOU HAVE TO DIFFERENTIATE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING FROM THAT'S SUBURBAN, FROM URBAN.

SO YOU'RE SAYING IF YOU STRIKE OUT 13 BUILDINGS, UH, IN A SUBURBAN VIEW, BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED AWAY FROM THE STREETS WITH LAWNS BETWEEN THE BUILDINGS AND SIDEWALKS.

HOWEVER, IN AN URBAN VIEW OR URBAN COMMUNITY, BUILDINGS ARE MORE, WELL, HOWEVER, BUILDINGS ARE IN A MORE URBAN CONTEXT IT WOULD BE THE SAME.

BUT IN THE FIRST SENTENCE, YOU NEED TO PUT THE WORD SUBURBAN.

SO BUILDINGS IN A SUBURBAN VIEW, BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED AWAY FROM THE STREETS WITH LAWNS BETWEEN THE BUILDINGS AND SIDEWALKS.

HOWEVER, BUILDINGS IN A MORE URBAN CONTEXT OR WITH GROUND FLOOR RETAIL MAY BE LOCATED CLOSER TO THE STREET.

I JUST THINK SO IF YOU PUT IN A SUBURBAN SUBURBAN CONTEXT VERSUS THE URBAN CONTEXT.

WHERE WE, WHAT ARE WE FEELING IN THERE AND STRIKE OUT 13.

CORRECT.

HOW DO WE FEEL THAT, IS THAT A MOTION? THAT'S A MOTION.

AND I SEE A SECOND.

IT'S COMMISSIONER, UH, BLAIR SECOND BY COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, PLEASE.

POINT OF CLARIFICATION.

SO WITHIN 13 IT TALKS ABOUT ACTIVATING SIDEWALKS AND ENHANCING THE PUBLIC REALM.

AND I DON'T THINK I SEE THAT IN 17.

SO IT SEEMS LIKE THAT I'M TRYING TO READ THE OTHERS AND MAKE SURE IT'S NOT PICKED UP SOMEWHERE ELSE.

COULD WE, IF YOU WANTED TO KEEP THAT IN, COULD WE SAY, HOWEVER, BUILDINGS IN MORE URBAN CONTEXTS OR WITH GROUND FLOOR RETAIL MAY BE LOCATED CLOSER TO THE STREET TO ACTIVATE SIDEWALKS AND ENHANCE THE PUBLIC REALM? YES.

WAS IT WHAT YOU SUGGESTED BEFORE, JUST DIFFERENT SUGGESTIONS FROM DIFFERENT PEOPLE THAT GOT SPLICED TOGETHER SOMEHOW? I, I THINK IT'S A SPLICING TOGETHER BECAUSE THE 13 HAS BEEN THERE FOR A WHILE, RIGHT? AND SO YES, I BELIEVE IT'S SPLICING.

COULD I, COULD I ASK A QUESTION HERE PLEASE? WAS THERE A REASON IN 13 WHY, WHY IT SPECIFICALLY CALLED OUT COMMERCIAL AND MIXED USE OF BUILDINGS? 'CAUSE 17 AND 18 JUST SAY BUILDINGS.

SO WAS THERE SOME POINT, OTHER POINT THAT WAS TRYING TO BE MADE?

[05:10:02]

I HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION.

UM, NUMBER, OH, I'M SORRY.

OH WAIT, YEAH, WE GOTTA VOTE ON THAT ONE.

YEAH, IF BEFORE WE MOVE ON.

SO WE'RE STRIKING OUT 13 AND THEN ADDING THE ADDITIONAL LANGUAGE TWO 17.

IS THAT, IS THAT THE MOTION? YES.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR PLEASE SAY AYE.

ANY YOU OPPOSED AYES HAVE IT.

MR. CARPENTER, OUR ITEMS TWO AND 11 TRYING TO GET TO THE SAME PLACE.

UM, YOU KNOW, TWO SAYS DEVELOPMENTS ARE DESIGNED TO INCLUDE DRIVEWAYS FOR LOW-RISE, MULTI-UNIT BUILDINGS, AS WELL AS FOR LARGER MID-RISE, MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENTS.

I, I DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND WHY WE'RE CALLING THOSE OUT TO LIMIT THE NUMBER OF INDIVIDUAL ACCESS POINTS FROM LOCAL STREETS.

AND 11 SAYS LIMITING THE NUMBER OF DRIVEWAYS PROVIDES A SAFE AND INVITING PUBLIC REALM ALONG STREETS THAT ENCOURAGES WALKING AND CYCLING.

IS THERE SOME WAY TO SPLICE THOSE TWO TOGETHER AND WHY DOES NUMBER TWO SPECIFICALLY CALL OUT THE LOW RISE AND THE LARGER MULTI? BECAUSE WE'RE REALLY TRYING TO MAKE THAT POINT FOR ALL DEVELOPMENTS IS THAT WE'RE TRYING TO MINIMIZE THE ACCESS POINTS TO ENCOURAGE WHATEVER ABILITY.

AND AM I MISSING SOMETHING? YEAH, I THINK, UH, NUMBER TWO COULD BE REMOVED, UH, JUST BASED ON THE CONTEXT OF THIS PLACE TYPE.

UM, BUT THE OTHER SINGULAR LEATHER, UH, MAKES SENSE TO, TO KEEP IS THAT A MOTION COMMISSIONER CARPENTER? WELL, DID DID YOU ALSO WANT TO, UM, TAKE THE PART FROM NUMBER TWO THAT SAYS LIMITING THE NUMBER OF INDIVIDUAL ACCESS POINTS FROM LOCAL STREETS? 'CAUSE I MEAN THE OTHER ONE SAYS ENCOURAGING WALKING AND BICYCLING OR YOU JUST, IF IF WE'RE ENCOURAGING WALKING AND CYCLING, THAT'S BECAUSE WE'RE LIMITING THE NUMBER OF INDIVIDUAL ACCESS POINTS.

I MEAN, I'M FINE WITH ELIMINATING TWO AND KEEPING 11, RIGHT? I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL THE POINTS YOU'RE TRYING TO MAKE ARE INCLUDED.

I THINK THE LAST SENTENCE OF TWO COULD BE MOVED INTO MAYBE THREE.

TALKING ABOUT, UM, YOU KNOW, NUMBER OF, UH, DRIVEWAYS AND ACCESS POINTS.

WE COULD, WE COULD ADD THAT TO THAT TOO AS WELL.

REMOVE TWO AND THEN YOU KEEP 11.

OH, THAT MAKES SENSE.

ADD DRIVEWAYS TO TO THREE, DROP TWO ENTIRELY AND ADD DRIVEWAYS TO THREE AND THEN KEEP 11.

I SECOND THAT.

YOUR OPPOSED AYES HAVE IT.

CARPENTER.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, WHAT'S THE PURPOSE OF 19? WHY IS THAT TRUE? SO I THINK IT GOES BACK TO THE, THE SUBURBAN CONTEXT OF, UH, THIS PLACE TYPE.

UM, AND I, I BELIEVE COMMISSIONER, UH, BLAIR MENTIONED GET MY NOTES REAL QUICK.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON SECOND .

SO JUST, YOU KNOW, SPEAKING MORE TO THE SUBURBAN CONTEXT OF THIS PARTICULAR PLACE TYPE.

BUT, UM, IF WE WANT TO FOCUS ON JUST ON A MORE COMPACT OR REMOVING IT, UH, WE, WE CAN, BUT IT'LL FOCUS ON JUST ON THE MORE SUBURBAN NATURE OF THAT.

I, I THINK WE'VE COVERED THAT AND THE CHANGES ARE ALREADY MADE.

A MOVE THAT WE STRIKE 19.

MOTION AND A SECOND.

MR. RUBIN TO STRIKE NUMBER 19.

ANY COMMENTS? SEE NONE.

ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

OPPOSED? MOTION CARRIES.

UH, QUESTION ON 14 ON THE COMPACT PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY BLOCKS.

UM, I HAD A NOTE THAT WE TALKED ABOUT THE SIZES ON THAT SIMILAR TO WHAT WE INCLUDED IN THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL.

AND I WILL SAY MY NOTES HAD A 1600 FOOT PERIMETER BLOCK WITH A 400 FOOT FRONTAGE.

AND AGAIN, THAT MAY BE TOO LIMITING, BUT WE USED 400 800 IN THE EARLIER PLACE TYPE, WHICH SEEMS MIGHT BE A GOOD

[05:15:01]

REFERENCE.

UH, JUST TO CLARIFY, YOU WANT THINKING ABOUT ADDING THAT SAME BLOCK DIMENSION INTO THIS PLACE ITEM? OKAY.

IF THERE'S NO EXCEPTION, I'M HAPPY TO MAKE A MOTION.

WHAT PAGE IS THAT TO ADD? UH, ON PAGE 3 23, ITEM 14, COMPACT PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY BLOCKS.

STANDBY.

WE'LL FIND THE NOTE AGAIN.

BETWEEN 400, UM, FEET AND BLOCK LENGTHS, TYPICALLY NOT EXCEED 800 SHOULD BE FRAMED BY RESIDENTIAL STREETS.

SO ALSO TOO, JUST UH, AS WE'RE REFERENCING, UH, THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE, I'M JUST, I'M JUST GOING FORWARD TO THE COMMUNITY MIXED USE PLACE TYPE.

UM, AND THAT BLOCK LENGTH IS 500 TO SIX 50.

UM, IN TERMS OF YOU A LITTLE BIT LARGER.

SURE, THAT'S TRUE.

SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE SAYING UNDER 14 TO MAKE IT 500 MINIMUM? NO, JUST TO GIVE CONTEXT IN TERMS OF LIKE, UM, THE, THE SIZE YOU'RE LOOKING FOR.

SO I JUST WANTED TO PROVIDE THE CONTEXT FROM THE SINGLE FAMILY, UH, COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL AND THEN THE MIXED USE.

UM, IF, IF THAT'S EVEN HELPFUL.

SO JUST PROVIDING CONTEXT.

CAN YOU SAY IT ONE MORE TIME? SORRY.

SO IN TERMS OF CONTEXT, SO WE'RE JUST REFERENCING THE COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPE AND THAT BLOCK LENGTH, UH, WHICH IS LESS DENSE THAN THIS PARTICULAR CITY RE CITY RESIDENTIAL.

SO JUST PROVIDING ANOTHER EXAMPLE FROM THE COMMUNITY MIXED USE JUST TO GIVE AN IDEA OF WHAT THAT BLOCK LENGTH LOOKS LIKE.

IF THE BODY WANTED TO DISCUSS THE SIZE OF THAT.

SO I THINK THE REFERENCE BACK TO COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL, I THINK THAT COULD ALSO FIT INTO THIS ONE.

JUST WANTED TO PROVIDE SOME CONTEXT.

MAY I MAKE A SUGGESTION? , SINCE UM, ALL THE OTHER, UM, PLACE TYPES HAVE A SEPARATE ITEM FOR THE PREFERRED BLOCK LENGTH, SHOULD, SHOULD MM-HMM, WE FOLLOW THE SAME PATTERN HERE AND NOT, NOT, NOT, UM, COBBLE IT ONTO THE STATEMENT ABOUT LOW VEHICLE SPEEDS AND ALL THAT.

I WOULD BE DELIGHTED TO ADD A NEW ITEM THAT SPEAKS TO THE PREFERRED BLOCK LENGTH SUGGESTION.

TO ADD THE PREFERRED BLOCK LENGTH IS 400, WHATEVER YOU WANNA SAY, 400 FEET IN BLOCK LENGTHS TYPICALLY DO NOT EXCEED.

AND I'M GONNA LOOK AT MR. AGU, WHAT WAS THE MAXIMUM YOU MENTIONED SIX 50.

YOU WANNA USE SIX 50? I'M GOING BACK TO COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL.

UH, WE HAVE THIS ONE IS 400 FEET, UH, NUTS EXCEEDS 800 FEET, BUT I WOULD, I WOULD KEEP 400 TO SIX 50.

I WAS GONNA SAY 'CAUSE WE USED 500 TO SIX 50 AND THE MIXED USE, WHICH SEEMS MORE WALKABLE, WHICH, RIGHT.

FINAL STATEMENT, .

READ WHATEVER YOU LIKE, BUT IN WHATEVER NUMBERS THE PREFERRED BLOCK LENGTH IS 400 FEET AND BLOCK LENGTHS TYPICALLY DO NOT EXCEED 650 FEET AS A NEW ITEM UNDER BUILDING FORM CHARACTER.

PAGE 3 23.

I'LL SECOND THAT.

ANY COMMENTS? DISCUSSION? SEEING NONE.

WE'LL MAKE IMPLEMENTATION STEPS.

OPPOSED? AYES HAVE IT.

WHAT? OH, SORRY.

OKAY, LET'S TAKE A BREAK.

COMMISSIONERS, LET'S GO BACK AT FOUR.

I'M, IF WE'RE RECORDING, WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD AT 4 0 2 AND WE WILL, WE'LL KEEP WORKING THROUGH THE DOCUMENT.

UM, WE WILL TABLE THE, UH, ITEM NUMBER EIGHT, CLARIFICATION OF ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE.

I KNOW WE HAVE A TON OF CHANGES THERE, SO WE'RE GONNA RECEIVE THEM BY MAIL AND THAT WAY WE CAN HAVE A CHANCE TO LOOK AT THEM.

BUT WE ARE STILL BACK AT NUMBER SEVEN GOING THROUGH THE PAGES.

BUT JUST LETTING YOU KNOW, NUMBER EIGHT WILL BE TABLED.

IS THAT CORRECT? I THOUGHT WE WERE GONNA TABLE A OR THE, THE INDUSTRIAL PLACE TYPE I THOUGHT THAT WAS, AND THEN WE'LL MOVE TO AT LEAST GET STARTED ON EIGHT.

THAT'S COOL.

BUT THEN YOU SAID CABLE INDUSTRIAL PLACE.

INDUSTRIAL PLACE TYPE PLACE TYPES.

OKAY, I GOT YOU THEN.

SO WE'RE ESSENTIALLY ON, UH, NEIGHBORHOOD MIXED USE.

IS THAT WHAT WE'RE YES.

[05:21:43]

OH, PLEASE.

I DON'T KNOW IF NOW'S THE TIME TO BRING IT UP, BUT I STILL HAVE A BIG PROBLEM WITH THE MAP WHEN IT COMES TO THIS BECAUSE IT INCORPORATES WHAT'S TRADITIONALLY BEEN SINGLE FAMILY OR I GUESS WHAT WE'RE NOW CALLING THE YELLOW NEIGHBORHOOD IN THE BROWN.

IT'S OVERREACHING ON THE MAP.

DO YOU WANNA PROPOSE A CHANGE? I DO, YEAH.

OKAY, LET ME PLEASE.

WELL, IT'S ON, IT'S, IT'S IN THE MAP SECTION, SO I CAN WAIT UNTIL WE GET TO THAT IF YOU WANT, BUT I THINK IT'S FINE IF YOU HAVE IT.

LET'S GO.

ALL RIGHT.

LET ME, WE'RE GONNA, SHE'S GONNA CALL IT OUT.

IS IT ON, UH, IT'S THE MAP ON, UM, THREE SIX, YEAH.

OH 3 56.

OH, THE BIG ONE.

3 56.

YEAH, I COULDN'T GET IT TO PULL UP ON MY COMPUTER.

SO LET ME SEE IF I CAN FIND THE PAPERWORK.

I THINK IT'S 3 56.

WHAT IS IT? 3 56? NO.

OR YOUR INDIVIDUAL.

WE HAVE THE BLOW UP HERE.

GOTCHA.

IS NO GOING THINKING SOMETHING DIFFERENT? NO, IT'S NOT.

NO, NO.

SHE'S GOING INTO THE INDIVIDUAL BOX.

OH, ON THE BACK.

I THINK IT'S MAP NE ZIP ONE, MAYBE A 12.

IT'S ON PAGE 8 39 OR SOMETHING.

A 12.

THE E ONE MAP NORTHEAST DALLAS ON PAGE A 12.

IT'S IN THE, THE PEN A MAPS A 12.

I DON'T, I AM NOT SURE I, OKAY.

I AM NOT SURE IF I UNDERSTAND IT.

'CAUSE THE MAP I SAW HAD LOIS GREENVILLE AND BROWN AND THAT'S WHAT IT SAYS ON 3 25.

SO WHAT, WHICH IS IT, IS IT IN ORANGE OR BROWN? THAT SHOULD BE BROWN.

I THINK THAT'S BECAUSE BASED ON SOME CONVERSATIONS THAT WE HAD, THEY, UM, OUR STAFF CHANGED WHAT WAS BROWN TO ORANGE, WHERE WHAT SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED IS SOME OF THE BROWN SHOULD HAVE BEEN CHANGED TO, UH, TO YELLOW.

SO THAT'S NOT WHAT'S AFFECT I, UNLESS I'M READING THIS WRONG.

THAT'S NOT WHAT IT SAYS ON A 12.

THAT SHOULD BE, AM I SEEING IT WRONG THAT IT NEEDS TO BE, IT, IT APPEARS TO BE ORANGE, BUT I, UH, COMMISSIONER,

[05:25:02]

SOME OF THE BROWN SHOULD HAVE BEEN CHANGED TO ORANGE AND SOME OF THE BROWN SHOULD HAVE STAYED BROWN.

THAT ON PAGE PAGE 12, ON PAGE A 12, IF IT'S ON THE LOWEST GREENVILLE AREA, THAT THERE IS A PART OF LOIS GREENVILLE THAT'S NEIGHBORHOOD MIXED USE.

AND THEN THERE'S A PART OF LOIS GREENVILLE THAT'S MORE CITY RESIDENTIAL.

AND THEN THERE'S A PART, UM, AND AGAIN, IF WE WERE LOOKING AT THIS ON A GA'S BEST BASED MAP, SO WE COULD ZOOM IN AND GET SOME CLARITY ON SOME OF THOSE PARCELS THAT SOME OF THE PARCELS PROBABLY SHOULD BE YELLOW, NOT ORANGE OR BROWN.

SO WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT THIS ON THE COMPUTER, AND I CAN'T GET IT TO PULL UP HERE AT CITY HALL, IT LOOKED TO ME LIKE THERE WAS A DISCREPANCY IN THE MAPS.

IS THAT TRUE? SO RIGHT NOW I CAN'T GET THE ONLINE MAP TO, TO PULL UP EITHER ON MY MACHINE.

UM, BUT I CAN RE I CAN LOOK INTO THAT AND GET YOU AN ANSWER BY, UH, TOMORROW, UM, IF NOT TOMORROW BY THE MEETING, THE CPCS MEETING ON THURSDAY TO PROVIDE SOME CLARITY ON THAT.

COMMISSIONER KINGTON, COULD YOU, WE CAN REVISIT THIS.

WELL, WHAT YOU, WHAT WE CAN DO IS, UH, MAYBE THROUGH A MOTION SET WHAT YOU THINK THEY SHOULD BE AND THEN THAT WAY THAT COULD BE REFLECTED ON THE, ON THE MAP EITHER ON THURSDAY OR COMING BACK IN JULY.

SO THAT APPEARS TO BE ORANGE.

LAKEWOOD LOOKS TO BE THE ONLY BROWN.

I DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND THAT WHAT THAT IS.

IT'S COLUMBIA.

WELL, I I GUESS I'M GOING TO MOVE THAT THE MAP THAT IS MARKED NE ONE BE THE REFLECTION OF WHAT THE COLORS SHOULD, WHAT THE DESIGNATIONS FOR THE PLACE TYPE SHOULD BE.

YEAH, THAT'S, THAT'S AT PAGE A 12.

SO TO THE EXTENT THAT ANY OF THE OTHER MAPS ARE INCONSISTENT WITH MAP N ONE LOCATED AT PAGE A 12, THEY SHOULD BE BROUGHT INTO COMPLIANCE WITH THIS.

I'LL SECOND THAT.

SO THE OTHER MAPS ALIGN WITH THIS ONE? CORRECT? THIS IS A MASTER MASTER PLAN MATCH.

A 12 IS THE RIGHT MAP.

YES, THAT'S WHAT I PERFECT.

ALL THE COLOR DESIGNATION SHOULD MATCH.

ON ALL THE OTHER TO THIS ONE.

TO TO A 12.

VICE CHAIR RUBEN, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT I UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS IS GONNA LOOK LIKE.

SO NOW ALL OF LOIS GREENVILLE WILL BE EITHER YELLOW OR ORANGE, IS THAT RIGHT? CORRECT.

CAN YOU JUST SPEAK TO THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN NEIGHBORHOOD MIXED USE VERSUS CITY RESIDENTIAL AND WHY YOU THINK THAT FOR EVEN LOWEST GREENVILLE ITSELF, I'M NOT TALKING ONE BLOCK AND EITHER DIRECTION, BUT JUST THAT SOLE BLOCK.

WHY NMU IS PROBABLY IS NOT THE RIGHT CALL IN YOUR VIEW? WELL, I, THERE ARE SWATHS OF, SO LOWER GREENVILLE STARTS AT MOCKINGBIRD AND GOES TO ROSS AND THERE ARE SWATHS ALL ALONG THE WAY THAT ARE JUST RESIDENTIAL.

AND THEN THERE ARE NODES OR WHATEVER THAT HAVE COMMERCIAL AND LOWEST GREENVILLE STARTS AT BELMONT AND GOES TO ROSS.

AND THAT APPEARS TO BE WHAT'S IN THE ORANGE.

AND IT DOES HAVE, AND I THINK THAT THAT MORE CLOSELY MEETS, UM, WHAT IS DEFINED AS CITY RESIDENTIAL BECAUSE IT DOES HAVE MIXED USE, BUT IT'S MOSTLY NEIGHBORHOOD SERVING, MIXED USE.

IT'S, UH, BARS, RESTAURANTS, GROCERY, BARBER SHOPS, COFFEE SHOPS.

IT IS NOT THE BROADER CATEGORY OF THINGS THAT YOU FIND IN WHAT WE'VE DEFINED AS NEIGHBORHOOD MIXED USE, WHICH INCLUDES A BUNCH OF OTHER USES.

GREAT.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR EXPLAINING THAT.

THE INNER CORRIDORS THAT'S MOSTLY SINGLE FAMILY.

COMMISSIONER WEER.

IS THIS THE, IS THIS THE PART OF LOWER GREENWOOD THAT'S CLOSEST TO ROSS? YES.

ONE TOWARD ROSS? YEAH, SO I THINK THAT THAT THAT PART, THAT PART ACTUALLY SPEAKS TO WHAT KINDA LIKE WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IN OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY WHERE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THAT CORRIDORS, THAT OUTER CORRIDORS BEING THAT MIXED USE IN THE INNER CORRIDORS, BUT STILL SERVING

[05:30:01]

AND THAT, THAT, THAT'S A GOOD EXAMPLE OF WHAT, WHAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT, UM, HAVING THAT MULTI-FAMILY ON THE OUTSKIRTS AND PROTECTING THE INCURS WITH THAT.

I, I, I DO LIKE THAT END OF GREENVILLE, COMMISSIONER HERBERT, NOT TO MUDDY THE WATERS MORE, BUT IT'S OUR NEAREST SALAD AND GO, IT'S OUR NEAREST CHICK-FIL-A IT'S OUR NEAREST TOM THUMB.

IT'S, IT'S A LOT OF NEAREST FOR US.

UM, IN DISTRICT FOUR.

IN DISTRICT SEVEN.

UM, THERE'S ANOTHER ONE NEAR, THERE'S A TRADER JOE'S NEAR OH NO, I LIKE JOVI.

OH, I LIKE JOVIE TOO NOW JOVIE JUST GOT THERE.

GIMME A SECOND.

NO, BUT UM, SO I GET, I GET, UM, IT IS USED BY A LOT OF RESIDENCES SOUTH OF 30.

UM, FYI YOU CAN'T EVEN AT 12 NOON TODAY, I GOT A MESSAGE THAT THE PARKING LOT WAS PACKED AT JOVIE.

FYI, BUT YES, COMMISSIONER HEMPTON, PLEASE.

UM, THERE'S A SECTION ALONG HENDERSON THAT APPEARS TO BE SHOWN AS CITY RESIDENTIAL THAT IS PRIMARILY RESIDENTIAL, UM, THAT SEEMS MORE IN KEEPING WITH THE, UM, COMMUNITY RESIDENTIAL VERSUS CITY.

SO I'M HAPPY TO PROVIDE A MORE DETAILED REVIEW, BUT I BELIEVE THERE'S A SECTION OF THIS THAT SHOULD ALSO HAVE BEEN COLOR CODED TO THE YELLOW, UM, TO REFLECT CURRENT AND COMMUNITY VISION FOR THAT AREA.

AND AGAIN, THIS IS A MORE OF A VERY GRANULAR, SO I'M, I'M SUPPORTIVE OF COMMISSIONER KINGSTON'S, UM, RECOMMENDATION ON THIS, BUT I DO THINK THAT THERE'S A SECTION OF HENDERSON THAT IS PERHAPS NOT CORRECTLY IDENTIFIED.

I, I, I AM GONNA WITHDRAW MY MOTION.

I JUST THINK THIS NEEDS MORE WORK.

I'M GONNA GET A MARKER AND A, A BLOW UP MAP AND DO IT RIGHT AND GIVE IT TO YOU NEXT TIME.

WE'LL TABLE IT FOR NOW.

WELL I'LL START BY SAYING I USED TO LIKE TO PLAY THE GAME CONCENTRATION WHEN I WAS A KID.

WHEN YOU FOUND PAIRS THAT MATCHED.

SO, UM, , UH, ON PAGE 3 27, ITEMS 14 AND 16 SEEM TO SAY PRETTY MUCH THE SAME THING.

14 SAYS COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS ARE LOCATED CLOSER TO THE STREET ON MAIN LOCAL STREETS, BUT MAY HAVE GREATER LANDSCAPING AREAS WHEN SITUATED ON ARTERIALS.

16 SAYS BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED NEAR THE BACK OF THE SIDEWALK ON LOCAL AND MAIN STREETS ON ARTERIAL STREETS.

GREATER SEPARATION BETWEEN THE BUILDING AND STREET TRAVEL LANES AS PROVIDED.

SO IS THERE SOME WAY WE CAN MERGE THOSE TWO? I MEAN, ONE SAYS COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS AND ONE SAYS JUST BUILDINGS AND THEN LOCATED CLOSER ON MAIN LOCAL.

DOESN'T SPECIFY LANDSCAPING NECESSARILY.

LOCATED NEAR THE BACK OF THE SIDEWALK ON LOCAL IN MAINE.

AND THEN ONE GREATER LANDSCAPING AREA, ONE SITUATED ON ARTERIALS.

THE OTHER ONE'S GREATER SEPARATION BETWEEN THE BUILDING AND STREET TRAVEL LANES IS PROVIDED.

AND THAT IT ALSO TIES INTO NUMBER 19 WHERE IT SAYS SPACE BETWEEN THE SIDEWALK AND THE FACE OF THE BUILDINGS CONTAIN OUTDOOR SEATING OR USABLE OPEN SPACE.

AND JUST FYI THERE'S A TYPO.

THERE'S TWO NUMBER SIXTEENS.

UH, SO JUST WE CAN THE SECOND 16.

THE SECOND 16.

SO, UM, THE SECOND 16 AND THE FIRST THE THIRTEENS AND 14.

14.

SEEMED TO SAY JUST ABOUT THE SAME THING.

YEAH, I THINK WE CAN DO THAT.

PREFERENCE OR IF WE NEEDED TO MERGE THE TWO SOMEHOW THEY DO LOOK LIKE THEY READ THE SAME.

AND THEN, BUT I THINK 19 SPEAKS TO A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT ISSUE ABOUT THE SPACE BETWEEN THE SIDEWALKS AND THE BUILDINGS THEMSELVES, RIGHT? YEAH.

IT, IT JUST TALKS ABOUT HAVING ENOUGH SPACE TO, I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT NUMBER NMB THREE ON 3 26 TALKS ABOUT COMMERCIAL AND MIXED USE AREAS SHOULD HAVE INCREASED.

COMMISSIONER DISTANCE.

COMMISSIONER, I'M SORRY.

I'M SORRY.

BEFORE WE MOVE ON, CAN WE DECIDE, ARE WE JUST GOING BETWEEN 14 AND THE SECOND 16? I THINK THAT'S, ARE WE GOING WITH ONE OR THE OTHER? WELL, I GUESS MY, YEAH, THE QUESTION, WELL, IT'D BE FINE WITH ME IF WE GO FROM ONE ONE OR THE OTHER.

BUT I, I WAS ASKING STAFF IF, IF THEY, IF THERE WAS A

[05:35:01]

I WOULD RECOMMEND 16.

THE SECOND 16.

GET RID OF 14 AND JUST GET TO GET RID OF 14.

LOSE 14.

SOUNDS LIKE COMMOTION TO STRIKE 14.

I'D LIKE, YES.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER CARPENTER FOR YOUR MOTION.

I GO BACK.

COMMISSIONER RUBIN, ANY COMMENTS? SEE NONE OF THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

OPPOSED? AYE.

ABBOT, I GUESS ACTUALLY THE SECOND 16 COULD BECOME 14 .

THE SECOND 16 IS GONNA BECOME 14.

OKAY, MOVING ON.

NB THREE AND 18 SEEM TO SAY ABOUT THE SAME THING.

UM, ALTHOUGH LEMME START WITH 18 'CAUSE THE FIRST SENTENCE OF 18 SAYS BUILDINGS ARE LOCATED NEAR THE SIDE AND REAR PROPERTY LINES.

AND THAT SEEMS TO CONFLICT WITH WHAT WE JUST DECIDED ABOUT 14 AND 16, WHICH SAYS THEY'RE CLOSER TO THE STREETS.

BUT THEN IT GOES ON TO SAY WHEN A BUDDING NEIGHBORHOODS, THE BUILDINGS ARE FURTHER FROM THE PROPERTY LINE AND THERE'S ROOM FOR LANDSCAPE BUFFER.

YOU LOOK OVER ON 3 26 NB THREE COMMERCIAL AND MIXED USE AREAS SHOULD HAVE INCREASED DISTANCES FROM A BUDDING PROPERTY LINES TO ALLOW FOR ENHANCED LANDSCAPING BUFFERS WHEN ADJACENT TO EXISTING RESIDENTIAL AREAS.

SO I GUESS THERE'S TWO QUESTIONS HERE.

THE, THE FIRST SENTENCE OF 18 SEEMS TO CONFLICT WITH WHAT WE JUST SAID ABOUT THE BUILDING SHOULD BE CLOSER TO THE STREETS.

'CAUSE THIS SAYS THE BUILDINGS ARE LOCATED NEAR THE SIDE AND REAR PROPERTY LINES.

SO IS IT A DIFFERENT KIND OF BUILDING A DIFFERENT PLACE OR JUST A ANOTHER SPLICING PROBLEM? YEAH, IT'S UP.

IT, IT CAN BE ALL, ALL THREE.

IT CAN BE CLOSE TO THE FRONT, CLOSE TO THE REAR, CLOSE TO THE SIDES TO, TO SAY THAT WHEN YOU HAVE A NUMBER OF MIXED USE BUILDINGS NEXT TO EACH OTHER, THEY CAN, THAT THE SETBACK ISN'T NEEDED NECESSARILY UNLESS YOU'RE CLOSE TO RESIDENTIAL AREAS.

AND THAT'S THE CASE WHERE YOU MIGHT NEED INCREASED SETBACK FROM THOSE MIXED USE OR COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS.

STRIKE 18.

18 WOULD BE FINE WITH ME BECAUSE I THINK WHAT YOU JUST SAID IS COVERED BY NMB THREE.

MY, BUT I, THAT STILL LEAVES ME WITH THE, THE FIRST SENTENCE OF 18.

I'M OKAY WITH STRIKING IT, BUT I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT YOU WERE, YOU WERE, WHERE YOU WERE GOING WITH THAT.

'CAUSE BUILDINGS ARE LOCATED NEAR THE SIDE AND REAR PROPERTY LINES, BUT WE JUST SAID THE OPPOSITE THAT THE BUILDINGS ARE SHOULD BE LOCATED CLOSER TO THE STREET.

SO IT, IT, SORRY, I WAS GONNA SAY THEY'RE, THEY'RE, UM, LOOKING TO, UH, MOVE THE BUILDING IN DIFFERENT PARTS OF, OF THE OR ENVIRONMENT.

SO THE FIRST PIECE ON 16 FOCUSES MORE ON THE STREET RELATIONSHIP.

UH, 18 IS MORE ABOUT THE BUILDING, THE BUILDING RELATIONSHIP.

SO I THINK WHAT, UH, PATRICK WAS WAS SAYING IS THAT WE CAN ADD ALL OF THAT TO TOGETHER.

UH, SO MAYBE THIS ONE IS JUST MORE CLEAR IN TERMS OF THE BUILDING RELATIONSHIP TO EACH OTHER, AND THE SIXTEENS IS FOCUSED JUST ON, UH, THE RELATIONSHIP TO THE STREET.

SO JUST ONE, ONE CLARIFI.

PARDON ME.

COMMISSIONER C UH, JUST ONE CLARIFICATION, JUST FOR MYSELF, FRANKLY.

THE, THE PINK ITEMS HERE WERE, UH, WERE BORN FROM, FROM US, FROM SOMEONE SOMEHOW GOT THIS ON THE RADAR AND IT MADE IT TO THIS PAGE.

SO IT SEEMS NATURAL THAT AT SOME POINT IT MAY CONFLICT WITH SOMETHING THAT WAS A WORK OF CLUB OR IT CAME ALONG FROM STAFF AND THAT'S WHAT, YOU KNOW, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER IS SO GOOD AT FINDING CORRECT.

BUT THAT'S WHY IT MAY, IT MAY BE A LITTLE BIT DIFFICULT FOR YOU TO, TO JUSTIFY, YOU KNOW, WHY IS IT LIKE THIS? BECAUSE IT DIDN'T COME FROM YOU, IT CAME FROM US, CORRECT.

YOU WANNA STRIKE 18? I DO.

I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT WE WEREN'T STRIKING, UM, IN THAT FIRST SENTENCE.

WE WEREN'T STRIKING SOMETHING THAT, THAT NO.

WAS IMPORTANT.

THAT NO, I'M FINE WITH.

MY MOTION IS TO STRIKE 18.

AND WE DO HAVE A SECOND BY, UH, VICE CHAIR RUBIN.

ANY DISC MOTION CARRIES STRIKING NUMBER 18.

MR. CHAIR, PLEASE.

COMMISSIONER HUNTER AND COMMISSIONER CARPENTER MAY HAVE COVERED THIS.

DO, DO WE SPEAK TO WHERE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT LANDSCAPE BUFFER AND SOME OF THE OTHER ELEMENTS, AND I'M TRYING TO FIND IT WITHIN OPEN SCREEN AND OPEN SPACE, AND I'M NOT SURE THAT IT'S, I GUESS WE HAVE UNDER ITEM SIX INCORPORATE LANDSCAPE BUFFERS TO MINIMIZE, BUT IT'S TALKING ABOUT, UM, ESTABLISHED RESIDENTIAL AREAS, WHICH IS MORE ABOUT TRANSITION THAN SPEAKING TO THE CHARACTER OF THESE DEVELOPMENTS.

AS I EXPECTED, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER HAD ALREADY COVERED IT.

, IT'S A FAST TRAIN ALL OF US TODAY.

[05:40:03]

SO WE'RE STILL ON 3 28, PLEASE.

I HAVE A SORT OF A GENERAL PHILOSOPHICAL OVERVIEW QUESTION ABOUT THIS BECAUSE IT SEEMS TO ME WHEN READING THIS COMMUNITY MIXED USE THAT WE'RE REALLY COMBINING TWO TYPES OF PLACES.

ONE, THAT IS THE, THE TYPICAL COMMUNITY MIXED USE THAT WE'RE, WE'RE, WE'RE ENVISIONING.

AND THE OTHER IS A PLACE THAT HAS TRANSITIONED FROM, FROM A SITUATION WHERE THEY HAD INDUSTRIAL PROXIMITIES BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ALLOWING SOME, LOOKING AT THE PLACE TYPES, WE'RE ALLOWING SOME KINDS OF INDUSTRIAL, BUT THAT MIGHT BE APPROPRIATE FOR PLACES THAT ARE TRANSITIONING AWAY FROM INDUSTRIAL.

BUT I'M NOT SURE WE REALLY WANNA INTRODUCE INDUSTRIAL USES INTO PLACES THAT ALREADY HAVE A, A FAIRLY ESTABLISHED COMMUNITY MIXED USE, UH, IN THE MORE TRADITIONAL SENSE.

ARE YOU, IS THAT CLEAR AT ALL? SO IN THIS PARTICULAR PLACE TYPE, I THINK WHEN WE TALK ABOUT INDUSTRIAL, I FEEL LIKE THAT TERM JUST IN THE LAST FEW YEARS, UM, CAN HAVE A NEGATIVE CONNOTATION, I GUESS RIGHTLY SO.

BUT IN SOME AREAS WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE EXAM THAT COMES UP IS LIKE MAKER SPACE OR SOME TYPE OF MAYBE BACKHOUSE, UM, YOU KNOW, KITCHEN OR SOMETHING THAT'S SMALLER IN, IN SCALE, SECONDARY AGAIN TO THE PRIMARY USE.

BUT I THINK THAT'S STILL INDUSTRIAL, UM, IN TERMS OF THE LAND USES.

UM, BUT I GUESS IN TERMS OF THE SCALE, MAYBE THAT'S, MAYBE WE CAN KIND OF PROVIDE SOME MORE CLARITY ON WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE.

BUT THERE'S GONNA BE SOME OF THAT IN THIS PARTICULAR PLACE TYPE, AGAIN, GOING BACK TO THE DESIGN DISTRICT, UH, THAT IS COMMUNITY MIXED USE, BUT THERE ARE STILL SOME SUPPORTING SMALLER SCALED, UH, INDUSTRIAL USES THAT AREN'T HAZARDOUS OR ARE NEGATIVE TO THE COMMUNITY, BUT ARE STILL PART OF THAT, THAT AREA.

SO IF YOU WANT NO, I I GET THAT.

BUT IT JUST SEEMS LIKE THERE ARE ALSO PLACES, SAY LIKE THE WEST VILLAGE THAT NEVER HAD ANY INDUSTRIAL, DON'T HAVE ANY LONGING FOR IT.

SO IT JUST SEEMS LIKE WE'RE KIND OF BLURRING IT.

'CAUSE YOU KNOW, KIND OF THE, THE BABY STEPS, IF YOU'VE BEEN INDUSTRIAL OF SOME SORT AND THEN WE'RE AT ASPIRING TO BE FLEX COMMERCIAL AND THEN WHEN YOU GROW UP, MAYBE YOU CAN BE COMMUNITY MIXED USE OR SOMETHING THERE, THERE'S SOME STAIR STEPS THERE, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE WE'RE WE'RE BLENDING THINGS A LITTLE BIT.

SO AGAIN, THAT THAT POINT, UM, OR, UM, CMB TWO MM-HMM.

AND WHAT I WOULD SUGGEST IS THAT, UM, ON 3 29 ON THE PLACE STEP APPLICATIONS, UM, I THINK IT'S, UM, CMA FIVE AND CMA SIX, IT STARTS TO TALK ABOUT THAT LANGUAGE.

I, I THINK WE CAN PROBABLY, AGAIN, UM, IF THERE IS BETTER LANGUAGE TO TALK ABOUT THOSE LEGACY, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE CALL 'EM LEGACY INDUSTRIAL AREAS AS THEY ARE TRANSITIONING.

UM, OR WE CAN LOOK AT THAT OR REVIEW THAT OR, UM, WE'RE OPEN TO HAVING MORE PROPOSED LANGUAGE FROM YOURSELF OR OTHER COMMISSIONERS TO DO A BETTER JOB OF TALKING ABOUT THAT AREA WHERE OKAY, IT'S NOT, UM, 'CAUSE YES, THERE ARE, YOU KNOW, SHOPPING CENTERS THAT DON'T HAVE ANY INDUSTRY OVER HERE THAT IS THIS ARE THIS PLACE TYPE AND THEN WE HAVE OTHER AREAS THAT USED TO HAVE WAREHOUSING THAT ARE TRANSITIONING INTO THIS PLACE TYPE.

AND SO PERHAPS HAVING THAT LANGUAGE IN THERE TO SPEAK TO BOTH OF THOSE PLACES WOULD BE HELPFUL.

OKAY, WELL I WILL WORK ON THAT, BUT I DID NOT COME PREPARED TO DO THAT TODAY.

BUT I, I DID NOTICE WHEN I READ THE, THE, UM, DESCRIPTION THAT IT SEEMED TO ME THAT WE HAD KIND OF ANEA COBBLED TOGETHER SOME PLACES THAT THERE MIGHT BE SOME FRICTION, PLEASE.

SORRY ABOUT THAT.

UH, I'LL HAVE TO COME BACK BETTER PREPARED WITH, UM, EXACT LANGUAGE LATER.

BUT ON THREE 30 CM B TWO ADDITIONAL INDUSTRIAL USES SHOULD NOT BE ADDED TO AREAS TRANSITIONING AWAY FROM INDUSTRIAL.

BUT THE CHART ALLOWS LIGHT INDUSTRIALIST SUPPORTIVE USES BECAUSE REALLY THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IN THE LAND USE MIX BETWEEN NEIGHBORHOOD MIXED USE AND COMMUNITY MIXED USE IS THAT THERE'S A LOT INDUSTRIAL THAT'S,

[05:45:03]

IS INTENDED TO CAPTURE THE, AN AREA THAT IS BECOMING COMMUNITY MIXED USE THAT HAS EXISTING INDUSTRIAL LAND USES.

MM-HMM THAT IF SOMEONE COMES IN WITH A ZONING CASE TO REZONE PROPERTY FOR MORE INDUSTRIAL LAND USES UNDER THIS PLACE TYPE, THAT WOULD BE THE POINT OF GUIDANCE TO SAY THAT SHOULDN'T, YOU KNOW, ONE THING FOR THE CPC AND STAFF TO CONSIDER IS THIS POINT IN THIS LANGUAGE IN HERE THAT SAYS, NO, WE SHOULDN'T HAVE, THIS AREA SHOULD BE MORE MIXED USE AND LESS INDUSTRIAL.

JUST BECAUSE IT'S ACROSS THE STREET FROM AN INDUSTRIAL DOESN'T MEAN IT'S ANOTHER GOOD LOCATION FOR POSSIBLY ANOTHER GOOD LOCATION FOR, UH, INDUSTRIAL LAND USE TO MOVE IN.

I FOLLOW THAT, BUT CONSIDERING THAT THIS PLACE TYPE WE'RE APPLYING TO AREAS THAT ARE TRANSITIONING AWAY AND HAVE INDUSTRIAL, THAT MEANS THAT, YOU KNOW, IN THE FUTURE, EVEN IN FUTURE LAND USE MIX, WE HAVE LIGHT INDUSTRIAL AS A SECONDARY USE.

SO IF WE'RE ALLOWING IT AS A SECONDARY USE, EVEN IN THE FUTURE TO SAY THAT INDU ADDITIONAL INDUSTRIAL USES SHOULD NOT BE ADDED SEEMS, MAYBE IT'S JUST A LANGUAGE SITUATION AGAIN.

I WOULD THINK IT'S A LANGUAGE SITUATION.

I PERSONALLY WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME FLESHING OUT OF.

WHAT DO WE MEAN BY INDUSTRIAL USES? LIKE ADDITIONAL? IS IT MORE, I I WOULD ASSUME INTENSE.

IT'S MORE EXACTLY, YES, BECAUSE AGAIN, MAKER SPACES ARE TECHNICALLY INDUSTRIAL USES AND DO WE NOT WANT, I THINK THOSE ARE PERFECTLY APPROPRIATE IN THIS KIND OF, SO I THINK WE JUST NEED TO CLARIFY WHAT WE MEAN BY THAT.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, PLEASE.

WE'LL COME BACK TO THAT.

THIS IS, UH, CMB TWO CLARIFICATION OF DIGITAL INDUSTRIAL PAGE THREE 30.

WELL, ONCE AGAIN, UH, 11 AND 13 SEEM TO BE SAYING OPPOSITE THINGS.

YOU KNOW, WE HAVE 11 SAYS BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED NEAR THE BACK OF THE SIDEWALK, AND NUMBER 13 SAYS BUILDINGS ARE LOCATED NEAR THE SIDE AND REAR PROPERTY LINES.

UM, SO IF YOU THINK ABOUT DEEP EL A, A STRUCTURE IN DEEP EL A BUILDING IS GENERALLY LOCATED TOWARDS THE SIDEWALK.

YOU KNOW, IT'S TO THE FRONT, BUT ALSO A LOT OF BUILDINGS IN DEEP ALLEN DON'T HAVE A SIDE SETBACK AND DON'T HAVE A REAR SETBACK.

SO IT'S NOT SAYING THAT THE BUILDING SHOULD BE PUSHED TO THE VERY BACK OR THE SIDES, BUT SAYING THAT IT SHOULD BE, YOU KNOW, THE STRUCTURE SHOULD BE CLOSE TO THE FRONT, TO THE SIDEWALK, BUT CAN ALSO BE, YOU KNOW, REAR AND, AND, AND SIDE SETBACKS.

IT COULD BE PUSHED BACK TO THOSE AS WELL TO TAKE UP FULL UTILIZATION OF THE SITE.

I CAN SEE THAT IN DEEP, UM, SOME OF THE OTHERS, BUT I'LL JUST LET THIS GO 'CAUSE I THINK WE JUST NEED TO SIT DOWN AND, AND DO THE LANGUAGE.

THERE'S NO SENSE IN IN SPENDING MORE TIME ON THIS RIGHT NOW.

THANKS, PLEASE.

OH YES, PLEASE.

I DID HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT ON PAGE 3 34, WE ADDED A NUMBER SIX, INCORPORATE MORE TRANSIT AWARE LANDSCAPING MATERIALS AT BUS STOPS, SUCH AS THE INCREASED UTILIZATION OF PERMEABLE PAVEMENT PADS WHILE REDUCING RIVER ROCKS USAGE.

THAT'S JUST A MYSTERY TO ME.

I'M NOT, YEAH, I CAN SPEAK TO THAT.

THAT'S, THAT WAS DIRECTLY FROM DART.

SO IN TERMS OF WHEN WE'RE LOOKING TO, UM, INTEGRATE TRANSIT INTO THESE AREAS, UM, WHEN YOU'RE SPEAKING OF TRANSIT AWARE, THERE ARE A LOT OF STOP, A LOT OF BUS STOPS THAT ARE BY SOME NICE LOOKING, UH, LANDSCAPE, BUT IT'S NOT USABLE FOR THOSE WHO ARE STEPPING OUT OF THE BUS AND THEN STEPPING INTO PEBBLE ROCKS OR OTHER TYPES OF, UH, LANDSCAPING MATERIALS THAT AREN'T CONDUCIVE TO MOVING ABOUT THOSE TRANSIT, UH, STOPS OR FACILITIES.

SO THIS WAS MORE DIRECTION TO PROVIDE MORE TRANSIT AWARE LANDSCAPING THAT'S

[05:50:01]

MORE CONDUCIVE FOR NAVIGATING AROUND THOSE FACILITIES.

I SHOULD, DOES THAT, ARE WE SAYING THAT ANY DEVELOPMENT THAT WE ARE DOING IN THIS LOCATION, IS IT THE RECOMMENDATION THAT WHEN THE DEVELOPER DOES THE DEVELOPING THAT THEY INCORPORATE MORE TRANSIT AWARE? OR IS IT THAT DART WILL INCORPORATE MORE TRANSIT AWARE, ESPECIALLY SINCE THIS CAME FROM DART, IT'S A TWO-WAY STREET.

SO IN TERMS OF FOR DART TO BE ABLE TO PROVIDE WHAT, UH, THE, THE TRANSIT NEEDS FROM, FROM THIS AREA, UM, THEY, THEY AREN'T THE, THE DEVELOPERS TYPICALLY, BUT WHEN DEVELOPERS COME IN, THEY CAN SAY, OKAY, YOUR PROPOSAL SHOULD HELP US AS DART TO BE ABLE TO KIND OF PROVIDE, UM, A PLACE OR AN ENVIRONMENT THAT WE CAN GO IN AND OUT TO THE BUS FACILITIES AND, AND, AND LIKEWISE.

SO I THINK IT IS TWO-WAY STREET.

IT'S NOT JUST DART, IT'S NOT JUST THE CITY, IT'S KIND OF BOTH AND, AND DEVELOPERS TOO AS WELL.

SO IT'S A SO CAN WE, SO, HMM, LET ME THINK ABOUT IT FOR A SECOND.

MR. CHAIR , UM, WOULD IT PERHAPS MAKE SENSE INSTEAD OF BEING SO MATERIAL SPECIFIC THAT WE REVISE THE LANGUAGE TO SAY REDUCING NON PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY MATERIAL USAGE ESSENTIALLY INSTEAD OF CALLING OUT RIVER ROCKS? BECAUSE I THINK THE INTENT IS THAT IT, AGAIN, IT'S TRANS AWARE, INVITING, USABLE PEDESTRIAN, AND BY ADDING PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY, IT SPEAKS TO, I THINK THE DESIRE TO ENCOURAGE THE USES OF, OF THESE SPACES.

IS THAT FAIR? I THINK THAT'S A MOTION.

HAPPY TO TURN THAT INTO A MOTION.

MOTION.

I THINK THAT'S A MOTION.

I WILL SECOND THAT.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, PLEASE.

I JUST FEEL LIKE WE SHOULDN'T BE DISCRIMINATING AGAINST RIVER ROCKS.

, UH, IF I CAN COMMISSIONER HERBERT, I TOO THINK WE SHOULDN'T BE DISCRIMINATING.

UM, I THINK THAT THE TERM STILL LEAVES ROOM FOR LOOPHOLE.

SO WHAT'S PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY TO ME MAY NOT BE TO ROB BALDWIN.

NO, HE'S NOT HERE.

GOOD.

UM, YOU KNOW, SO THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S JUST MY THOUGHT, BUT I I STILL SUPPORT THE MOTION.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, PLEASE.

ON PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY TO PAGE 3 34.

NUMBER SIX, UTILIZATION PERAL PAYMENT PADS WHILE PRODUCING NON REDUCING NON PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY MATERIAL.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON SECONDED BY ME.

POOR THING.

WE'RE ALL GONNA COME AND WATCH.

READ THE TRANSCRIPT WITH YOU MS. YOLANDA'S NOTE ON THAT WAS LISTENING TO THE AUDIO LATER.

NON PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY MATERIAL AT THE END OF THE, INSTEAD OF RIVER ROCKS, REPLACE RIVER ROCK INSTEAD OF RIVER ROCKS.

ITEM SIX, STRIKE RIVER ROCKS.

STRIKE RIVER ROCKS ADD NON PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY MATERIAL.

YESTON.

SHE DID, YES.

ANY FURTHER? ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? ALTHOUGH IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

I OPPOSE.

MOTION PASSES.

OKAY, PAGE, OH, I'M SORRY.

NO, NO, PLEASE.

OH, 3 34 UNDER PLACE TYPE APPLICATION.

THE RM A NINE.

THERE'S, THERE'S, THERE'S SOME TEXT AT, THERE'S WHERE IT SAYS OVERALL COMPOSITION OF THE PLACE TYPE.

I THINK THAT HAS BEEN LEFT FROM SOME PREVIOUS, UM, INCARNATION BECAUSE THE PREVIOUS SENTENCE ENDS WITH A PERIOD AND THERE'S JUST THIS FLOATING PHRASE, OVERALL COMPOSITION OF THE PLACE TYPE.

SO MY MOTION IS TO STRIKE OVERALL COMPOSITION OF THE PLACE TYPE FROM THAT ITEM.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, CAN YOU REMIND US WHERE YOU ARE? RM A NINE ON PAGE 3 34.

IT SAYS MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT INCLUDING MIXED INCOME HOUSING OPTIONS, SHOULD BE INTEGRATED INTO REGIONAL COMMERCIAL AREAS TO REDUCE THE NEED TO COMMUTE LONG DISTANCES BETWEEN WHERE PEOPLE LIVE, WORK, AND SHOP PERIOD.

AND THEN IT JUST SAYS OVERALL COMPOSITION OF THE PLACE TYPE.

SO MY MOTION IS TO STRIKE OVERALL COMPOSITION OF THE PLACE TYPE FROM RMA NINE, UH, COMM MOTION BY COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, SECONDED BY MYSELF.

OPPOSED? THE AYES HAVE IT.

UM, ON PAGE 3 35 UNDER BUILDING FORM AND CHARACTER ITEM 15, I SEE THAT WE EDITED AND IT THAT MATCHES MY NOTES TO BRING CLARITY THAT THE USE SCALE APPROPRIATE INTERSECTIONS TO SERVE AS A FOCUS OF REGIONAL COMMERCIAL HUBS CONCENTRATING, UM, INTENSE USES ALONG MAJOR ROADWAYS.

I KNOW WE'VE ADDED SOME DIAGRAMS ON THE FRONT

[05:55:01]

END.

THIS IS ONE THAT I'M NOT SURE THOSE WORDS HELP CONVEY THE INTENT OF THAT.

AND MY SPECIFIC NOTE WAS STREET SECTION.

SO I JUST, IS, IS THERE SOMETHING THAT COULD HELP EITHER THROUGH WORDS OR A DIAGRAM BRING MORE CLARITY TO THAT? SO PERHAPS MORE OF A, UM, AN EXAMPLE TO, TO SHOW WHAT THOSE WORDS MEAN.

I THAT, AND AGAIN, 'CAUSE I, I'M NOT SURE THAT I CAN READ THAT AND TELL YOU EXACTLY.

I THINK WHEN I DO READ IT, WHAT I THINK I HEAR IS I'M AT A MAJOR INTERSECTION AND I WANNA PUT THE DENSITY CLOSER TO THAT AND THEN STEP BACK DOWN AS IT'S GOING OUT AT THE PERIMETER.

I'M NOT ACTUALLY SURE THAT'S WHAT YOU INTENDED TO SAY.

I I THINK IT COMES OUT OF A MORE PLACEMAKING APPROACH TO GIVE DIFFERENT SIZE AND SCALES INTERSECTIONS A A DIFFERENT FEEL TO LET YOU KNOW THAT YOU'RE IN A CERTAIN AREA.

UM, SO IS THAT MORE ABOUT GATEWAYS AS ONE EXAMPLE? YES.

GATEWAYS COULD BE ONE EXAMPLE, BUT UM, AGAIN, IT'S TRYING TO SAY THAT, UH, TRYING TO GIVE A SENSE OF PLACE TO SOME PLACES THAT DON'T HAVE A SENSE OF PLACE AND USING SCALE APPROPRIATE INTERSECTION DESIGN IS ONE WAY TO DO THAT.

UM, I THINK WE CAN LOOK AT THAT LANGUAGE AND SEE IF THERE'S A BETTER WAY TO SAY WHAT, WHAT THAT POINT IS TRYING TO SAY.

OR TO YOUR POINT, IF THERE IS A BETTER EXAMPLE THAT WE CAN EITHER POINT TO THAT, YOU KNOW, COMPLETE STREETS HAS ALREADY DONE OR SOMETHING TO SAY, YOU KNOW, IN REFERENCE TO THIS OR TO, TO HAVE SOMETHING THAT, THAT BETTER REFLECTS WHAT THAT POINT IS TRYING TO MAKE.

I, I THINK THIS IS, SO TO ME AS I'M READING IT, I AM TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WE'RE ACTUALLY TRYING TO, SO I, TO ME IT'S LIKE THE FLIP CONCENTRATE, MORE INTENSE CONCENTRATE.

BASICALLY IF YOU'RE GOING TO DO A RE REGIONAL COMMERCIAL HUB, IT SHOULD BE CONCENTRATED ALONG THE MORE INTENSE IT, IT CONCENTRATE THE MORE INTENSE USES WITHIN THAT REGIONAL HUB ALONG THE MAJOR ROADWAYS AND THEN SCALE BACK AS YOU MOVE AWAY FROM THE MAJOR ROADWAYS.

SO TO START IT WITH USE SCALE APPROPRIATE INTERSECTIONS TO SERVE AS THE FOCUS.

IT DOESN'T THAT, THAT'S NOT REALLY THE POINT.

THAT'S NOT THE POINT.

IT'S BASICALLY IF YOU'RE, YOUR MOST INTENSE USES AND BUILDINGS IN A REGIONAL HUB SHOULD BE AT THE HIGHEST ORDER INTERSECTIONS AND THEN SORT OF SCALE AWAY FROM THAT AS YOU GET TO LOWER ORDER STREETS.

NOT SAYING IT LIKE THAT, BUT I THINK THAT'S THE INTENT OF WHAT THIS IS.

BUT HOW DOES THAT WORK AT EXAMPLES SUCH AS NORTH PARK AND RED BIRD AND APPROPRIATE INTERSECTION? THE ORIGINAL SENTENCE SAID USE KEY SCALE APPROPRIATE INTERSECTIONS TO SERVE AS THE FOCUS OF REGIONAL COMMERCIAL HUBS CONCENTRATING MORE INTENSE, INTENSE USES ALONG MAJOR ROADWAYS.

AND SO AGAIN, I THINK THIS IS TRYING TO TALK ABOUT WHERE THE, THE MORE INTENSE OF THESE TYPES OF USES ARE ON MAJOR ROADWAYS.

AND I'M NOT, AND NOT I FULLY SUPPORT HAVING ACTIVE AND WELL-DESIGNED INTERSECTIONS, BUT I'M JUST NOT QUITE SURE IT FITS WITH WHAT THE INTENT OF WHAT THIS ITEM IS.

I WAS TRYING TO FIND TO SEE IF THAT MAKES MORE SENSE HERE.

AND IT'S ALMOST LIKE IT NEEDS TO BE BROKEN INTO TWO.

SO WHAT WOULD BE THE INTENT OF THE INTERSECTION DESIGN TO SERVE AS A GATEWAY TO SERVE AS A, UM, PLACEMAKING OPPORTUNITY? SO I THINK, YEAH, SO I THINK I'M, I'M LOOKING AT THIS TOO, 'CAUSE THAT AS I'M LOOKING AT THAT PARTICULAR ITEM DOESN'T MAKE TOO MUCH SENSE TO ME AS I'M JUST REREADING IT.

UM, LIKE FOR EXAMPLE, UM, CM B ONE TALKS ABOUT THE INTENSITY OF THE, THE BUILDING AND WHERE THAT'S LOCATED FROM AN ADJACENCY STANDPOINT.

UH, I THINK THIS ONE'S SUPPOSED WAS SUPPOSED TO FOCUS ON KIND OF THE GROUND PLANE.

EXCUSE ME, JUST KEEP ZOOMING IN OUT, UM, IN TERMS OF THE GROUND PLAN THAT THE PLACEMAKING COMPONENT, I THINK WE HAD LANGUAGE IN OTHER PLACE TYPES.

[06:00:01]

'CAUSE I, I THINK THIS IS THE FIRST TIME THAT WE'VE CRAFTED THE LANGUAGE THIS WAY.

UM, SO LET ME DO A QUICK CANVAS.

UH, 'CAUSE I THINK THE WAY THAT THIS IS SAYING, IT DOESN'T ADDRESS OR SPEAK TO WHAT WE WERE THINKING OF.

SO I THINK WE CAN JUST RE EITHER REMOVE THIS AND RE REINTRODUCE ANOTHER, UH, VERSION THAT TOUCHES ON THAT PIECE.

SO IF I CAN TRY THIS ON ITEM.

SO PAGE 3 35, ITEM 15, REVISE TO SAY YOU SCALE APPROPRIATE INTERSECTIONS TO SERVE AS PLACEMAKING OPPORTUNITIES, PERIOD.

AND THEN STRIKE THE FOCUS OF REGIONAL COMMERCIAL HUBS, ET CETERA.

BECAUSE THAT'S COVERED BY CMB ONE.

I'M, I'M SEEING NODS.

SO, SO ON PAGE 3 35, ITEM 15, REVISED TO READ YOU SCALE APPROPRIATE INTERSECTIONS TO SERVE AS PLACEMAKING OPPORTUNITIES.

PERIOD.

STRIKE THE BALANCE OF THAT SENTENCE.

MOTION BY COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER CARPENTER.

COMMISSIONER BLAIR, PLEASE.

IN YOUR OPPOSED I HAVE IT CARPENTER.

ITEM NUMBER 16.

BUILDINGS ARE TYPICALLY LOCATED NEAR THE BACK OF THE SIDEWALK.

I I DON'T UNDER IT.

DOES, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THAT THERE WOULD BE, IF YOU'RE WALKING ALONG THE SIDEWALK, THE FRONT OF THE SIDEWALK WOULD BE ON THE STREET, THE BACK OF THE SIDEWALK.

YOU WOULD THEN HAVE A BUILDING THAT'S PUSHED UP CLOSER TO TOWARDS IT.

LEMME SAY.

SO.

WE CAN, WE CAN JUST SAY THE, THE SIDEWALK.

JUST THE SIDEWALK ON THE BACK OF THE SIDEWALK.

COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, MAY I JUST ADD THAT, I MEAN, 16, 17, 18 AND 19 SEEMED TO, UM, APPLY TO CERTAIN REGIONAL MIXED USE PERHAPS THE CEDARS, WHICH IS AN EXAMPLE.

IT DOESN'T REALLY APPLY TO NORTH PARK MALL OR RED BIRD MALL OR, OR THAT SORT OF THING.

UM, ARE WE SUPPOSED TO INTERPRET THIS TO MEAN WE'RE DISCOURAGING THAT SORT OF DEVELOPMENT? SO I THINK THESE PLACE TYPES ARE MORE ASPIRATIONAL.

SO SOME OF THOSE AREAS THAT YOU MENTIONED, UH, CURRENTLY MIGHT NOT LOOK LIKE THAT.

BUT THAT COULD BE A, A DIRECTION THEY'RE LOOKING FOR THIS PLACE TYPE TO GO OR TO BE IN THAT AREA.

BUT I THINK IT'S MORE ASPIRATIONAL WHAT, WHAT IT COULD BE, UH, IN THE FUTURE.

UH, NUMBER 11, LOADING AND SERVICE AREA SHOULD BE LOCATED TOWARD THE REAR OF THE BUILDING AND SCREEN FROM PUBLIC VIEW.

UNLESS LOCATED AGAINST A NATURAL FEATURE SUCH AS A CREEK OR GREEN OPEN SPACE.

I MEAN, IF YOU DO, UM, YOU KNOW, WE DO ENCOURAGE THE DESIGN THROUGHOUT THIS DOCUMENT FOR PEOPLE TO, UH, FOR DEVELOPMENTS TO INTERACT WITH OPEN SPACE AND GREEN SPACE.

WHY WOULD WE WANT TO HAVE UNSCREENED BACK OF HOUSE NEXT TO THOSE AMENITIES? I THINK THAT'S A GREAT POINT.

SO WE CAN EITHER REMOVE THAT LAST, SO IS THE MOTION TO STRIKE 11 THE LAST PART OF 11? OR, OR JUST AS LESS LOCATED AGAINST A NATURAL FEATURE? MM-HMM, .

SO, UH, MY MOTION IS FOR 11 TO READ.

LOADING AND SERVICE AREA SHOULD BE LOCATED TOWARD THE REAR OF THE BUILDING AND SCREEN FROM PUBLIC VIEW PERIOD.

SECOND.

COMMISSIONER, MOTION BY COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, SECOND BY COMMISSIONER BLAIR.

ANY OPPOSED? AYE.

HAVE IT.

COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, JUST ONE QUESTION FOR THE BODY.

MY NOTES ON 3 31.

SO THE FIRST PAGE OF THIS, UNDER THE, UM, LOCAL EXAMPLES I HAD NOTED UPTOWN TO BE ADDED.

AND I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S NECESSARILY CORRECT, BUT, MM-HMM, , AND AGAIN, I'M ASKING, I'M ASKING THE QUESTION 'CAUSE I'M NOT QUITE CLEAR WHERE I WOULD'VE COME UP WITH THAT.

WHAT PAGE? 3 3 31.

3 33.

WELL, JUST UNDER LOCAL EXAMPLES.

AGAIN, I'M, I'M ASKING THE BODY BECAUSE I'M 3 39.

3 33.

[06:05:02]

WELL, SORRY.

OLD PAGE 3 33, CORRECT.

IN THE CURRENT DRAFT.

I LOOKED AT THE OLD DRAFT NUMBER.

SO AGAIN, I'M NOT SURE THAT IT NECESSARILY APPLIES.

I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHY I HAVE THAT NOTE.

JUST TO GET SOME CLARIFICATION.

SO FOR THE COMMUNITY MIXED USE EXAMPLE OR THE REGIONAL MIXED USE EXAMPLE, WHICH, WHICH PLACE TYPES ARE WE LOOKING AT? I HAD IT UNDER THE REGIONAL MIXED USE.

REGIONAL MIXED USE.

AND AGAIN, I'M, I'M TRYING TO GET SOME CLARITY FROM THE BODY ON HOW THAT MIGHT HAVE BEEN A DISCUSSION POINT BECAUSE IT SEEMS A LITTLE COUNTER A LITTLE COUNTERINTUITIVE OTHER THAN IF IT WAS IN REFERENCE TO SOMEWHERE LIKE THE CEDARS, BUT I THOUGHT WE HAD MOVED THE CEDARS.

UM, WELL ACTUALLY I KNOW WHERE IT CAME FROM.

IT CAME FROM THE MAP BECAUSE THE MAP SHOWS THE FLANKING BOTH THE CEDARS AND UPTOWN IN THE SAME COLOR, UH, IN THE, UM, CENTRAL DISTRICT.

AND SO THE QUESTION WAS WOULDN'T THEY BOTH BE LISTED OR BOTH NOT BE LISTED? WE HAVE UPTOWN AND CITY CENTER, UPTOWN AND DOWNTOWN IN THE SAME CATEGORY.

SO THEN WE SHOULD, IT'S THE NEXT SECTION WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT.

SO THEN THE CORRECTION IS TO STRIKE THE CEDARS FROM THIS AREA OR, OR MAYBE POTENTIALLY MOVE IT.

SO, OR MOVE IT.

MOVE IT, CORRECT.

YEAH, I THINK THE CEDARS PROBABLY BELONGS IN A DIFFERENT AREA.

AND I THINK THAT'S MORE CONSISTENT WITH THE MAP.

SO I GUESS, SO THE, THE FEEDBACK THAT WE GOT ON THE CEDARS WAS THAT THE CEDARS WAS THE REGIONAL MIXED USE PLACE TYPE THAT THE FUTURE VISION FOR THAT AREA THAT THEY'VE DONE HERE FAIRLY RECENTLY IS FOR MID TO HIGH RISE DEVELOPMENT OF A MIXED USE VARIETY IN THE CEDARS.

THERE 100% ARE SOME LOW RISE, UH, RESIDENTIAL AND MIXED USE THAT ARE PART OF THAT VISION.

BUT THAT THE, AND AGAIN, THEY HAVE A MORE DISTINCT AND, UH, FINITE, UH, VISION THAN FORD DALLAS CAN GET TO.

UH, BUT THEIR VISION WAS MORE RELATED TO A REGIONAL MIXED USE PLACE TYPE THAN THE OTHER PLACE TYPES.

AND AN EARLIER IN THE, THE PROCESS WITH THE COMMUNITY, THEY, THAT AREA THAT ACTUALLY WANTED, SOME PEOPLE WANTED THAT AREA TO BE DESIGNATED AS CITY CENTER.

UH, SO I THINK, UH, THE, EITHER THE COMPROMISING THE DISCUSSION WAS TO KEEP THIS AS REGIONAL OPEN SPACE.

'CAUSE A LOT OF THE, THE DENSITY AND THE FORM AND THE LAND USES STILL FALL WITHIN THAT.

UM, SO KEEPING THIS WITH KEEPING THE CEDARS WITHIN HERE IS KIND OF, UH, FALLING IN LINE WITH WHAT THE COMMUNITY PROVIDED US DIRECTION TO.

AND THAT JUST, AGAIN, WE HAVE SOME TIME BEFORE THE PLAN IS ADOPTED.

SO IF THERE'S FURTHER DISCUSSION IN THE CEDARS THAT'S NEEDED MORE THAN HAPPY TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION.

WELL, AND AGAIN, I FINALLY FOUND MY, MY BRAIN IS CAUGHT UP WITH MY NOTES ON A 24.

WITHIN OUR MAPS, BOTH UPTOWN AND THE CEDARS ARE BOTH SHOWN AS REGIONAL MIXED USE, WHICH, SO THE CEDARS IS CORRECTLY LISTED.

SO THIS MAY BE A QUESTION MORE FOR COMMISSIONER KINGSTON IS IF UPTOWN IS SHOWN AS IT WISHES TO BE REFLECTED.

AND HAVING BEEN INVOLVED IN THE RECENT ADOPTION OF THE REVISED PDV THREE 17, I WILL FULLY EMBRACE THAT THE CEDARS HAS A CLEAR COMMUNITY VISION FOR HOW THEY'D LIKE TO GO.

UM, AND I'VE BEEN WORKING WITH SOME PEOPLE IN THE CEDARS, AND ESPECIALLY WITH THEM BEING ON THE END OF THE, THE SIDE CLOSEST TO WHAT IT'S GOING TO BE, THE NEW, UM, HIGH SPEED ROAD, THE NEW, UH, HIGH SPEED ROAD.

WHAT DO WE, WHAT IT, MY BRAIN IS I'M ASLEEP.

LIKE, SO, UM, THE NEW CONVENTION CENTER.

THE NEW CONVENTION CENTER AND WHAT IT'S ALL ENTAILS IN THAT.

AND SO THAT IT'S PART OF THAT ALSO.

SO JUST SO IT'LL BE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE WANTING TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE LIKE FOLLOWING INTO THAT NEW VISION.

AND SO IT'S CONTINUOUS.

SAY, SHOULD SOME AREAS BE CITY CENTERS, SHOULD SOME AREAS BE REGIONAL MIXED USE.

I HAVE NO RECOMMENDATIONS ON THIS ITEM AT THIS TIME.

THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR.

SO I, I WILL SAY AS FAR AS UPTOWN, UM, WE'VE HAD A NUMBER OF CONVERSATIONS AND THERE'S DIFFERENT, UM, THIS, IT HAS STARTED OUT AS THE CITY CENTER.

OTHERS SAID IT SHOULD BE REGIONAL, THEN IT SHOULD BE CITY.

AND THERE HAS BEEN SOME CONVERSATIONS THAT HAVE CONTINUED TO EVOLVE IN THAT AREA.

UH, RIGHT NOW, UM, IT'S LISTED AS THE ENTIRETY OF UPTOWN AND THE AREA AROUND THE, UM, AMERICAN AIRLINE CENTER HAS BEEN LISTED AS REGIONAL, UM, MIXED USE.

UM, AGAIN, THERE'S TIME TO EVOLVE THAT CONVERSATION BEFORE WE ADOPT THE PLAN TO

[06:10:01]

UM, BUT RIGHT NOW, BOTH THE CEDARS AND UPTOWN ARE LISTED AS REGIONAL MIXED USE.

WE CAN USE BOTH OF THOSE EXAMPLES IN OUR LOCAL EXAMPLES.

UM, BUT AGAIN, TRYING TO GET TO THE GREATER VARIETY OF GEOGRAPHIC VARIETY OF THOSE OF, OF THIS PLACE TYPE THROUGHOUT DALLAS.

UM, AND NOT WANTING TO LIST ALL OF THE PLACES.

I THINK THAT'S WHY WE, WE, WE WENT AND, AND LISTED SOME STUFF LIKE THE INTERNATIONAL DISTRICT OR, OR ENERGY SQUARE, UM, OR THE REDBURN MALL SITE AS OPPOSED TO JUST SAYING UPTOWN AND THE CEDARS COMMISSIONER SLEEPER.

WELL, I THINK THE QUESTION WAS ASKED EARLIER IS, IS, IS THIS THE PROPER DESIGNATION FOR UPTOWN? AND I, I WOULD SAY BASED ON MY, MY DISCUSSIONS WITH UH, UH, THE CONSULTANTS AND, UM, NOT, I'M TRYING TO BE VERY CAREFUL NOT TO STEP ON THE TOES OF COMMISSIONER KINGSTON, BUT I BELIEVE THAT UPTOWN IS PROPERLY DESIGNATED NOW, UH, AS A, UH, UH, REGIONAL MIXED USE AREA.

I THINK, I THINK THAT MAKES THE MOST SENSE FOR THAT AREA.

IT REFLECTS WHAT'S THERE TODAY AND WHAT'S LIKELY TO COME IN THE FUTURE, PLEASE.

ALRIGHT, WE'RE ONTO INSTITUTIONAL CAMPUS PUBLIC UTILITY.

I, I REALIZE THIS WAS A, A KIND OF A LATE EDITION MASHUP AND UNFORTUNATELY MOST OF IT DOESN'T SEEM TO APPLY TO PUBLIC UTILITY AT ALL.

THERE'S, YOU KNOW, VERY LITTLE.

I MEAN, THERE'S, THERE'S ONE SENTENCE ON PAGE THREE 40.

THIS PLACE TYPE ALSO HOUSES CIVIC UTILITY CAMPUSES AND FACILITIES THAT PROVIDE ESSENTIAL SERVICES TO THE CITY.

AND THEN ON PAGE 3 42, IPB SIX SAYS, PUBLIC UTILITY CAMPUSES AND FACILITIES SHOULD NOT BE REDEVELOPED, ADJACENT OR ABUTTING RESIDENTIAL PLACE TYPES.

AND WHILE THAT APPLIES TO PUBLIC UTILITIES, IT REALLY ISN'T TRUE BECAUSE SOME OF THESE THINGS SUCH AS WATER PUMPING STATIONS ARE IN RESIDENTIAL AREAS AND PRETTY MUCH HAVE TO BE, UM, FUNDAMENTAL PROBLEM HERE IS YOU HAVE A LOT OF RESIDENTIAL USES ALLOWED IN THIS PLACE TYPE, BUT PUBLIC UTIL THERE ARE, THERE ARE NOT RESIDENTIAL USES THAT GO ALONG WITH PUBLIC UTILITY USES.

I MEAN WATER TREATMENT PLANTS AND ELECTRICAL SUBSTATIONS AND UH, PUMPING STATIONS AND THAT SORT OF THING.

SO, UM, I, I DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH THIS, THE INSTITUTIONAL CAMPUS, THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN, BUT I THINK COBBLING TOGETHER THE PUBLIC UTILITY DOESN'T REALLY MAKE SENSE.

ALSO, THE FUTURE LAND USE MIX, IT DOESN'T ALLOW ANY INDUSTRIAL IN THIS PLACE TO, BUT A LOT OF THESE PUBLIC UTILITIES, I THINK ARE, ARE REALLY INDUSTRIAL USES.

SO TO ME THE SOLUTION IS THEY JUST NEED TO BE UNCOUPLED.

THAT'S MY MOTION OR THAT'S MY SUGGESTION TO STAFF TO TO, AND THAT THAT WAS A MOTION.

IN FACT.

SECOND, UH, VICE CHAIR RUBIN AND WE HAVE A THIRD, ALTHOUGH IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

OPPOSED? AYES HAVE IT.

REMOVE PUBLIC UTILITY FROM THIS PLACE, TYPE THE FIRST, THAT'S THE FIRST PART, OR TO SPLIT IT? WELL, MY, UM, MOTION WAS ACTUALLY TO DECOUPLE THE TWO.

AND JUST FOR CLARITY, UM, SO LIKE IF THE MOTION WAS TO

[06:15:01]

SO BASICALLY JUST UTILITY TRANSPORTATION.

SO I THINK SO, SO YOU WOULD HAVE A SEPARATE, UM, SO AN INSTITUTIONAL CAMPUS PLACE TYPE.

AND THEN, UH, TO ME YOU PUBLIC UTILITY IS A UNIQUE PLACE TYPE.

I KNOW IT'S A HEADACHE TO CREATE ANOTHER PLACE TYPE, BUT I MEAN WE HAVE A, AN AIRPORT PLACE TYPE WITH A LITTLE ASTERISK, RIGHT? BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW THAT PUBLIC UTILITY REALLY NEEDS A LOT OF EXPLANATION.

THAT'S DESIGN WHAT WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT.

I THINK THIS, I'M THINKING IF YOU WANT ME TO MAKE A MOTION TO MAKE PUBLIC UTILITY OF AN ASTERISK TYPE, SO YEAH, LIKE AIRPORT, THAT WOULD BE FINE WITH ME.

YEAH, I THINK SOME BACKGROUND TOO.

I THINK, UM, WHEN WE WERE LOOKING AT THAT PARTICULAR LANE USE, THAT WAS ALSO ANOTHER SUGGESTION THAT WE ACTUALLY HAD HAD A DISCUSSION ON WITH CLUB IN TERMS OF HOW TO ADDRESS THAT.

UM, SO I THINK THAT COULD BE ANOTHER WAY IS JUST TREATING IT SIMILAR TO THE AIRPORT, UH, WHERE WE JUST, WE HAVE IT AS A, UH, CATEGORY, BUT THERE'S NO ELABORATION IN TERMS OF WHAT IT'S, ALL OF THIS INFORMATION ABOUT BUILDING FORM AND CHARACTER AND ALL THAT.

IT JUST DOESN'T REALLY APPLY TO THOSE.

'CAUSE THEY JUST LOOK THE WAY THEY LOOK AND, YOU KNOW, AND THEY HAVE TO BE THE WAY WHERE THEY ARE.

SO OKAY, WE CAN DO THAT.

UH, SOME OF THESE SECTIONS HAVE EXTENSIVE CHANGES, UH, THAT THAT MIGHT TAKE HOURS TO DO.

SO I THINK WHAT WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO IS COMMISSIONER CARPENTER IS GONNA SEND IN HER RECOMMENDATIONS AND THEN WE WILL ALL SEE THEM ALL IN ONE AND DIGEST THEM AND THEN, UH, AND THEN IT'LL BE MUCH FASTER.

NOW WE'RE JUST KIND OF TAKING THE, YOU KNOW, THE LOW HANGING FRUIT IN TERMS OF THE SECTIONS WE'RE GONNA, UH, SKIP UNDER EJ.

WHATEVER YOU THINK.

YOU'LL HAVE SOME OLD HANGING FRUIT VICE CHAIR, RUBEN.

ON THE, UM, ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE PIECE.

I HAVE A COUPLE OF AMENDMENTS THAT I WANT TO, OKAY.

SO ARE WE, ARE WE SKIPPING THE REST OF THIS? YES, WE'RE SKIPPING FLEX COMMERCIAL LOGISTICS AND INDUSTRIAL HUB BECAUSE I, I DON'T THINK ANYONE AT THIS TIME OF NIGHT WANTS TO LISTEN TO EXTENSIVE COMMENTS ABOUT THIS.

AND I THINK IT'D BE MORE EFFICIENT FOR ME JUST TO, SINCE, SINCE WE'RE MOVING ON TO WRITING EXPLICIT, UH, LANGUAGE PROMOTIONS, IF I JUST TAKE THE TIME AND DO THAT AND, AND GET IT DISTRIBUTED SO THAT STAFF AND THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS HAVE TIME TO DIGEST IT, IT'LL BE, UM, LESS PAINFUL FOR EVERYONE.

AND THANK YOU FOR THAT.

OKAY, VICE, PLEASE.

ON PAGE FOUR SIX, WHICH IS THE ENVIRONMENT SUSTAINABILITY GOALS, I WOULD LIKE TO MOVE THAT WE AMEND ITEM TWO UNDER EIGHT.

ITEM A TWO TO READ AS FOLLOWS, COORDINATE WITH CITY DEPARTMENTS, LOCAL AGENCIES, COMMUNITIES IMPACTED BY ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE ISSUES, ENVIRONMENTAL JUSTICE ORGANIZATIONS, AND OTHER APPROPRIATE EXPERTS TO IDENTIFY AREAS OF EJ CONCERN, UM, TO I OR SORRY, TO IDENTIFY AREAS OF EJ CONCERN, GATHER AND TRACK DATA AND ADDRESS EJ ISSUES.

UM, SO REALLY THE, THE INTENT THERE IS AFTER SPEAKING WITH SOME PEOPLE WHO ARE VERY STRONG ADVOCATES IN THIS AREA IS THAT WE NEED TO DO MORE TO CENTER THE IMPACT OF COMMUNITIES AND THOSE WHO ARE REALLY ON THE GROUND WORKING ON THOSE ISSUES AND THOSE WITH EXPERTISE WHO MAY NOT BE WITHIN INSIDE THE CITY AS WE MOVE FORWARD AND ADDRESS THE SIGNIFICANT EJ ISSUES THAT OUR CITY FACES.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER RUBEN FOR YOUR MOTION.

AND COMMISSIONER CARPENTER FOR YOUR SECOND.

ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT? MR. HANON? PLEASE.

AND I JUST, I'M, I WAS TRYING TO LISTEN AND READ .

SO ARE WE KEEPING THE ELEMENT THAT TALKS ABOUT PROVIDING RESOURCES? I'M JUST SAYING I, I STRUCK PROVIDE RESOURCES AND I SAID ADDRESS EJ ISSUES, SO I WANNA BE EVEN MORE DIRECT THERE.

[06:20:01]

THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

PAGE 4 7 4 6 4 6 4 7 4 6 4 6 4 7.

ME OPPOSED? AYE SABOT.

IT'S TRUE.

ONE MORE.

UM, ON PAGE FOUR SEVEN, WHICH IS THE PAGE WE'RE ALREADY ON UNDER PART A, ADD A NEW GOAL, CONSIDER THE DEVELOPMENT OF ADDITIONAL TOOLS TO ADDRESS INCOMPATIBLE INDUSTRIAL NON-CONFORMING USES IN LIGHT OF RECENT STATE LAW MODIFICATIONS.

THE CITY'S AMORTIZATION ORDINANCE WHERE, I'M SORRY, WHICH NUMBER ARE WE ON? IT'S NEW.

IT'S A NEW GOAL.

I'M SORRY, WOULD YOU READ IT AGAIN? YEAH, SLOWER.

CONSIDER THE DEVELOPMENT OF ADDITIONAL TOOLS TO ADDRESS INCOMPATIBLE INDUSTRIAL NON-CONFORMING USES IN LIGHT OF RECENT STATE LAW MODIFICATIONS TO THE CITY'S AMORTIZATION ORDINANCE.

PAGE FOUR SEVEN.

SURE.

THAT SPREAD OF TWO PAGES.

, I DO HAVE A QUESTION.

ARE WE ONLY ADDRESSING HERE CHALLENGES PRESENTED BY NON-CONFORMING USES? WOULD THERE BE A REASON? I MEAN, I UNDERSTAND THAT AMORTIZATION HAS TO DO WITH NON-CONFORMING, BUT ARE WE DOING, DO WE NEED NEW TOOLS TO DEAL WITH CHALLENGES PRESENTED BY USES THAT ARE CONFORMING? I'M FINE STRIKING THE WORD NON-CONFORMING IF THAT'S THE FRIENDLY AMENDMENT THAT YOU'D LIKE TO MAKE.

ANY OTHER DISCUSSION OF THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

AND THAT INCLUDED, UM, A COUPLE PEOPLE WHO, UM, ARE IN THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY.

OPPOSED? I HAVE IT SECOND.

ORIGINAL AND THEN SHE CHANGED THE LANGUAGE, MADE AN ADJUSTMENT, WHICH WAS ACCEPTED THAT HE WAS IN, HE WAS IN ADDITION.

YEAH, IT WAS IN, YEAH.

I DO HAVE COMMISSIONER ER PLEASE.

I DO HAVE A QUESTION 'CAUSE I KNOW THIS IS, THIS WAS A, A KIND OF A TENSE DISCUSSION AT CLUB, UM, ITEM NUMBER 11, TALKING ABOUT UPDATING THE DEVELOPMENT CODE AND ARTICLE 10 TO PRIORITIZE THE PROTECTION OF MATURE TREES, THE CITY'S TREE CANOPY COVERAGE, UH, YOU KNOW, ET CETERA.

BECAUSE THE ARTICLE 10 REVISION MADE IT EASIER TO DEVELOP PIECES OF LAND THAT HAD EXTENSIVE TREE CANOPIES.

AND I KNOW, UM, BASED ON CONVERSATION WE HAD AT CLUB, THERE WILL BE PUSHBACK FROM THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY TO, TO CHANGE THAT.

BUT, UM, SO I'M NOT SURE WHERE, I MEAN, I GUESS THE QUESTION IS, WAS THIS ITEM DISCUSSED ACROSS THE SPECTRUM OF, OF VARIOUS PARTIES THAT WILL HAVE DIFFERENT VIEWPOINTS ABOUT IT? SO YEAH, SO THIS ITEM, UH, WITHIN INTERNAL STAFF, UH, THIS WAS KIND OF VETTED BY OUR, UM, CURRENT PLANNERS, OUR OEQS TEAM AND OUR CONSULTANT.

UM, IN TERMS OF, OH, AND WE ACTUALLY, UH, CONSULTED BRIEFLY WITH, UM, I'M FORGETTING IT.

OUR, OUR ARBORIST, UM, PHILIP.

PHILIP, YEAH.

UH, SO THERE WERE NO ISSUES THAT WERE BROUGHT UP TO OUR ATTENTION REGARDING HOW THIS IS, UH, PHRASED.

BUT, UM, BASED ON WHAT YOUR EXPERIENCE IS WITH ARTICLE X, IS THERE ANYTHING THAT PROVIDES OR GIVES YOU CONCERN REGARDING ARTICLE X? OH, NO, I, I'M COMPLETELY SUPPORTIVE OF THE, OF THE, UM, INTENTION OF THIS.

I JUST REAL, I I'VE BEEN AROUND LONG ENOUGH THAT I REMEMBER WHAT AN INTENSE FIGHT IT WAS AND WHAT, UM, WHAT A STRUGGLE IT WAS TO REACH A COMPROMISE.

UM, SO I, I WAS WONDERING, YOU KNOW, HOW VETTED THAT LANGUAGE WAS AND IF IT, IF IT COMES FROM THE CONSULTANTS AND STAFF.

I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND IT AND I SUPPORT IT.

I JUST, UH, I JUST KNOW THAT THIS IS GOING TO BE CONTROVERSIAL.

UM, IT, IT IS A LARGE DOCUMENT.

I THINK THE FOLKS THAT, UM, WOULD, WOULD LOOK AT THIS AND HAVE SOME CONCERN ABOUT IT, UM, YOU KNOW, WE CAN PUT IT IN FRONT OF THEM, BUT I, I DON'T THINK WE'VE HAD THOSE IN DETAIL CONVERSATIONS WITH THOSE PARTIES.

WELL, AND I, I WOULD JUST EMPHASIZE THAT THE REAL FIGHT WILL COME AT THE UPDATE THE DEVELOPMENT CODE.

THIS JUST POINTS TO, WE NEED TO PRIORITIZE TAKING THESE INTO CONSIDERATION WHEN WE DO UPDATE THE DEVELOPMENT CODE.

IT'S AT THAT POINT WHERE I'M ASSUMING IT'LL REALLY, AND, AND NOW OF COURSE WE'VE HAD ENOUGH EXPERIENCE WITH THE REVISION OF THE CODE AND WE'VE SEEN, YOU KNOW, UH, PARCELS OF LAND WITH MATURE TREES BEING REDEVELOPED INTO TRUCK PARKING LOTS.

AND ALSO THERE'S ROOM FOR ADJUSTMENT NUANCE HERE.

MR. CHAIR, I ALSO HAD THE HAD ADD THAT WE HAD A, A DIVERSE MEMBERSHIP OF CLUB

[06:25:01]

AND I DON'T RECALL ANY OF THEM WAVING THE RED FLAGS ABOUT THIS.

NOT THAT THEY WON'T IN THE FUTURE, BUT, UM, I, I REMEMBER DIFFERENTLY .

THAT'S OKAY.

MAYBE, UH, WE WEREN'T, UH, I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW.

NO, BUT I, I DO RE I I HAVE A CLEAR MEMORY OF THIS COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, UM, TWO QUESTIONS ON ITEM FIVE, MAKE SURE I'VE GOT THE RIGHT ONE.

UM, DEVELOPMENT, I'MA UPDATE THE DEVELOPMENT CODE TO REDUCE PERCENTAGE OF IMPERVIOUS SURFACE AREAS WERE APPROPRIATE.

AND THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION ABOUT, AS WE'RE LOOKING AT ADDITIONAL DENSITIES AND INFILL, WHETHER OR NOT THERE SHOULD BE, UM, MONITORING OF RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITIES, UM, FOR STORM WATER.

AND IT SEEMS LIKE THIS WOULD POTENTIALLY BE THE PLACE TO DO THAT.

AND I AM HAPPY TO MAKE A MOTION WITH SOME LANGUAGE.

I WOULD MAKE A MOTION TO ADD MONITORING OF RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITIES FOR STORM WATER IMPACTS, INCLUDING MONITORING OF RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITIES FOR STORMWATER IMPACTS.

ITEM FIVE, I'M NOT SURE IT'S THE BEST PLACE TO PUT IT, BUT IT'S, AND QUICK, I, I GUESS QUICK QUESTION AS WE WERE LOOKING TO THAT, JUST SO WE GET SOME CLARITY FROM OUR SIDE.

SO I KNOW THE END OF NUMBER FOUR SPEAKS ON EXCESSIVE STORM WATER RUNOFF.

UM, AND THEN NUMBER SIX, YOU MENTIONED THAT KIND OF TOUCHES ON SOME OF THAT WATER QUALITY PIECE.

JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THERE'S, UH, THOSE THREE, UM, DO THEY SPEAK TO WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING TO, UM, IF WE'RE ADDING THAT LANGUAGE TO NUMBER FIVE? JUST WANNA ADD SOME MORE CONTEXT.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON HAVE A QUESTION.

OH, CAN YOU REPEAT IT? COMMISSIONER HAMPTON, PLEASE? YES.

AND GIVE ME ONE SECOND.

I'M TRYING TO MAKE, WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO READ IT, COMMISSIONER? WELL, I CAN'T, I'M JUST STILL TRYING TO MAKE SURE FIVE IS THE RIGHT PLACE.

SO ON PAGE FOUR SIX, ITEM FIVE, UNDER UPDATED THE DEVELOPMENT CODE TO REDUCE THE PERCENTAGE OF IMPERVIOUS SURFACE AREAS WHERE APPROPRIATE, INCLUDING MONITORING OF RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITIES FOR POTENTIAL STORM WATER IMPACTS.

THERE WAS A MOTION BY COMMISSIONER HAMPTON SECOND ABOUT COMMISSIONER HERBERT DISCUSSION.

MR. RUBIN, I THINK THIS IS A REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT TOPIC AND, AND SO IMPORTANT THAT IT MAY DESERVE ITS OWN LINE ITEM.

AND NOT ONLY THAT, BUT YOU KNOW, CERTAINLY THERE ARE STORMWATER RUNOFF CONCERNS WITH, WITH NEW RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, BUT I, I THINK WE ALSO SEE THEM WITH, YOU KNOW, COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT AS WELL.

SO I WOULD THINK THAT MAYBE IF WE EITHER COME UP WITH SOME GOOD COMPREHENSIVE LANGUAGE NOW, THAT WOULD BE GREAT.

OR MAYBE WE HAVE TAKE ANOTHER SHOT AT THIS, STICK A PIN ON IT AND DO IT AT OUR NEXT MEETING.

BECAUSE I, I DON'T THINK TACKING THIS ONTO FIVE IS, IS THE, IT'S CERTAINLY NOT THE ONLY APPROACH.

I'M MORE THAN HAPPY TO CREATE A SEPARATE ITEM.

AND I'M, YEAH, SO I, I THINK I WOULD SUGGEST DOING THAT.

I WOULD DRAW THE MOTION AND SUBMIT LANGUAGE FOR OUR NEXT MEETING.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, COMMISSIONER AND INFILL.

OKAY, COMMISSIONER HERBERT, I JUST WANNA SAY MY SOUTHWEST CORNER HAS A LOT OF TROUBLE WITH TOPOGRAPHY, SO THIS IS VERY ESSENTIAL TO OUR, OUR AREA.

YEAH, WE HAVE TWO VERY QUICK TWEAKS, MR. CHAIR.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER.

[06:30:04]

OKAY, GOING BACK TO PAGE ONE FOR THE INTRODUCTION, UM, THERE ARE JUST A COUPLE ITEMS I WANTED.

PAGE 4, 1 1 4 4, 1 DASH FOUR ALL.

UH, JUST A COUPLE OF IMPORTANT THINGS THAT I'D LIKE TO CLARIFY WHILE WE'RE STILL ALL HERE TODAY.

UM, IF OKAY, ON THE WHAT, THIS IS NOT PARAGRAPH OR SECTION ON PAGE ONE, FOUR, THE SECOND PARAGRAPH.

UM, BEFORE, BETWEEN THE TERMS OF AND DESIGN CHARACTERISTICS.

ADD THE WORDS USES OR, OH, I THE SAME HERE? YES.

UM, YEAH.

IT'S THAT THE FIRST PINK PARAGRAPH FROM THE WHAT? THIS IS NOT COLUMN.

RIGHT NOW IT READS.

DOES DOC GUARANTEE THAT INDIVIDUAL PROPERTIES ARE SUITABLE FOR THE FULL RANGE OF DESIGN CHARACTERISTICS DESCRIBED WITHIN EACH DESIGNATION? IN ADDITION TO DESIGN CHARACTERISTICS? I WANTED TO ADD THE WORD USES THERE.

USES AND THE USES.

USES, USES, UH, USES.

AND DESI.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER CARPENTER USES AND DESIGN CHARACTERISTICS.

I'LL SECOND, YOUR HONOR.

I'LL SECOND THAT SECOND ABOUT COMMISSIONER CARPENTER AND TRITON .

TRIPLE LUCK COMMISSIONER BLA.

GO AHEAD COMMISSIONER.

COMMISSIONER KINGSTON.

YEAH, LET'S DO IT.

I'M GONNA SUGGEST WE FIX THE GRAMMAR WHILE WE'RE AT IT.

UM, I THINK ON THE THIRD LINE, NOR SHOULD INCLUDE DOES IT? OR, OR DO THEY? YEAH.

THIS IS JUST NOT THIS PLAN AND MAPS CONTAINED HEREIN DO NOT ESTABLISH ZONING DISTRICT BOUNDARIES OR REGULATIONS, NOR DO THEY GUARANTEE BLAH, BLAH, BLAH.

I'LL SECOND THAT.

OPPOSED? MOTION PASSES.

THEN ONE MORE TWEAK TO THIS AND THEN ONE COMMENT I THINK ON THE FINAL PARAGRAPH UNDER WHAT THIS IS NOT, UM, STRIKE THE WORDS WITH OTHER HOUSING TYPES.

JUST ONE MORE TIME.

FURTHERMORE, TEARING DOWN EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY STRUCTURES FOR REPLACEMENT IS NOT ENCOURAGED BY THIS PLAN, PARTICULARLY IN AREAS AT RISK OF DISPLACEMENT.

EXISTING HOUSING, REED'S, EXISTING HOUSING.

AND I'LL SPEAK TO MY RATIONALE, COMMISSIONER CARPENTER SECOND THAT COMMENTS THERE? YEAH.

SIMPLY, YOU KNOW, OUR, OUR PROBLEM IS NOT THAT WE'RE SEEING TODAY IS NOT SIMPLY TEARDOWNS OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES TO BE REPLACED WITH OTHER HOUSING TYPES.

WE ALSO SEE TEARDOWNS OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES THAT ARE PERFECTLY GOOD HOMES FOR PEOPLE THAT GET REPLACED BY MUCH LARGER SINGLE FAMILY HOMES THAT, THAT LEAD TO DISPLACEMENT.

SO, WELL, I MEAN, SHOULD WE, ARE WE LIMIT IT TO TEARING DOWN EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY HOMES? I MEAN, AREN'T WE TEARING DOWN A BUNCH OF OLDER, SMALLER APARTMENT BUILDINGS AND STUFF TOO? YES.

THEY TEARING DOWN EXISTING HOMES, OLDER HOUSING.

THAT'S A GREAT FRIENDLY AMENDMENT.

ANY FURTHER COMMENTS? OKAY, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

ANY OPPOSED? THY HABIT COMMERCIAL CARPENTER, PLEASE.

UH, THE, THE PINK PARAGRAPHS ON THE SAME PAGE, UH, THE ONE, THE THIRD PARAGRAPH SAYS THE, THIS PLAN DOES NOT RECOMMEND A CITY INITIATED ZONING OF SINGLE FOUND NEIGHBORHOOD.

DOES THAT MEAN REZONING? I HAD THE SAME COMMENT.

MOTION BY COMMISSIONER CARPENTER, SECOND VICE CHAIR.

RUBIN, ANY DISCUSSION? ALL IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

UM, ALREADY JUST WITH OUR EXISTING LAND USE AND ZONING.

OPPOSED? AYE.

HAVE IT.

I HAVE ONE MORE COMMENT ON THIS, THIS THIRD PARAGRAPH.

UM, IT IS ANTICIPATED THAT ESTABLISHED NEIGHBORHOODS WILL REMAIN LARGELY UNCHANGED.

UM, I UNDERSTAND THE INTENT THERE, BUT ESTABLISHED NEIGHBORHOODS HAVE ALREADY SEEN LOADS OF CHANGE,

[06:35:02]

UM, AS WE HAVE IT ON THE GROUND TODAY.

I DON'T KNOW IF THIS NEIGHBORHOOD OR THIS LANGUAGE REALLY REFLECTS THE TRUTH ON THE GROUND OF WHAT WE'RE ALREADY SEEING.

SO PERHAPS LANGUAGE ACKNOWLEDGING THAT CHANGE IS ALREADY HAPPENING, THAT CHANGE SHOULD BE SENSITIVE, CHANGE SHOULD BE THOUGHTFUL.

I DON'T HAVE IT WITH ME TODAY, BUT I WANTED TO FLAG THAT FOR DISCUSSION AT OUR NEXT MEETING.

I AGREE.

COMMISSIONERS, ANY OTHER ADJUSTMENTS AT THIS TIME? OKAY.

I NEED A MOTION TO HOLD THE ITEM TO JULY 11TH.

THANK YOU COMMISSIONER BLAIR.

SECOND COMMISSIONER, UH, KINGSTON TO HOLD THIS MATTER UNDER ADVISE.

I'M KEEPING NOTE.

SECOND BY COMMISSIONER KINGSTON.

AND THAT'S AS AMENDED TODAY, CORRECT? AS AMENDED.

OH MY, WE DON'T HAVE TO GO BACKWARDS AS AMENDED.

KEEPING THE PUBLIC HEARING OPEN TO JULY 11TH.

ANY DISCUSSION? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.

OPPOSED? AYES HAVE IT.

MOTION TO ADJOURN.

SO MOVE.

REALLY GREATLY APPRECIATED.

UH, COMMISSIONERS, THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR HARD WORK TODAY AND FOR TAKING YOUR TIME FOR THIS SPECIAL SESSION AND FOR ALL THE COMPROMISE TODAY.

IT IS FIVE 19.

OUR MEETING IS, OR ADJOURN? WE HAVE PIZZA IN THE BACK.

THE, THE MEETING, THIS IS, THIS WAS NOTICED AS A BRIEFING ON THURSDAY, JUST AS A PLACEHOLDER IN CASE SOMEONE HAS A QUESTION.

[3. 24-2031 Discussion of upcoming review/public hearing schedule]

WE'LL BE ABLE TO TAKE THAT ON THURSDAY, BUT IF NOT, WE'LL WE'LL SEE YOU BACK ON JULY 11TH.

AND THEN BY THEN, COMMISSIONERS, PLEASE SEND IN ALL YOUR PROPOSED CHANGES.

ALL OF THEM, THE STAFF SO WE CAN SEE THEM AND DISPOSE OF THEM QUICKLY.

NOT BY THURSDAY.

NO, AS SOON AS YOU CAN.

BUT NOT BY THURSDAY TO STAFF.