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[Landmark Commission Meeting on May 5, 2025.]
WELCOME TO THIS MEETING OF THE DALLAS LANDMARK COMMISSION.THE TIME IS ONE OH FOUR, AND I CALL THIS PUBLIC MEETING TO ORDER.
I AM EVELYN MONTGOMERY, THE CHAIR OF THE COMMISSION, AND OUR VICE CHAIR IS COURTNEY POLICY.
AND WE HAVE A QUORUM OF COMMISSIONERS PRESENT AND ONLINE TO PROCEED WITH THE MEETING.
IF ELAINE COULD PLEASE CALL A ROLL CALL OF THE COMMISSIONERS.
DISTRICT ONE COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, PRESENT, DISTRICT TWO.
COMMISSIONER MONTGOMERY PRESENT, DISTRICT THREE.
COMMISSIONER COX? DISTRICT 11.
COMMISSIONER REEVES AND COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS.
COMMISSIONER OFFIT IS NOW ONLINE.
ALRIGHT, WE BEGIN WITH OUR CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS, UM, WHICH WE GENERALLY VOTE ON AS A GROUP TO WHETHER WE'RE GONNA FOLLOW STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS ON THEM, UNLESS ANYBODY NEEDS TO SAY ANYTHING OTHERWISE ABOUT IT.
UM, SO COMMISSIONER SPEY HAS A MOTION.
I, YEAH, I'D LIKE TO PULL A, UM, A CONSENT ITEM TO DISCUSSION.
WHAT CONSENT ITEM WOULD YOU LIKE TO NUMBER FIVE? UH, TWO 10.
SO WE'RE MOVING CONSENT ITEM NUMBER FIVE ON NORTH CLINTON TO OUR DISCUSSION.
AND THAT IS COMMISSIONER RENE WHO REQUESTED THAT.
WHO WAS THAT ONE ASSIGNED TO? WHO, WHO WAS THE STAFF MEMBER? YEAH.
SO I'M GONNA PUT IT LAST THEN ON THE AGENDA SO THAT THERE, IF THERE'S ENOUGH TIME TO EMAIL AND LET THEM KNOW AND THEN MAYBE THEY COULD POP ONLINE OR SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES AND HANDLE IT THAT WAY REALLY QUICKLY BEFORE PUTTING THESE IN ORDER TO MAKE CERTAIN WE HAVEN'T MISSED ANY.
I HAVE THE FOLLOWING INDIVIDUALS THAT HAVE INDICATED A DESIRE TO SPEAK TODAY.
THAT WOULD BE, UM, PAM YANG OR YANG AND, UM, AIDEN CHAVEZ, KATIE HAN, BRENT, ALFRED, COLLEEN KELLY, JESSICA GARCIA, AND ARCHIE AND CAN'T, UH, AS WELL AS CASEY TRIP ONLINE.
UM, AND SHANNON KEY ONLINE AS WELL.
IF YOUR NAME WAS NOT CALLED AND YOU WANT TO SPEAK IN PERSON, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE GO ON AHEAD AND FILL OUT ONE OF THESE AND PROVIDE IT TO US.
UM, I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE, UH, COURTESY ITEMS C ONE THROUGH C FOUR C SIX THROUGH C EIGHT SECOND, AND THE SECOND WAS COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER.
UM, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THIS, PLEASE SAY YES.
ANY OPPOSED TO THIS MOTION? ALRIGHT, THE MOTION IS CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
STAFF WILL PLEASE NOTIFY THE APPLICANTS OF THE DECISIONS AND HELP THEM WITH ANYTHING THEY NEED TO CARRY OUT THEIR AUTHORIZATION.
OKAY, I MOVE THAT WE REARRANGE THE AGENDA TO THE FOLLOWING.
WE'LL BEGIN WITH COURTESY REVIEW ITEM ONE, FOLLOWED BY COURTESY WITH YOU, ITEM TWO.
AND WE'LL TAKE, UH, DISCUSSION ITEM FOUR, DISCUSSION FIVE, DISCUSSION ONE, THEN DISCUSSION ITEMS TWO AND THREE WITH CO UH, CONSENT ITEM FIVE AT THE END.
I SECOND DO I HAVE THREE SECONDS ON THIS.
COMMISSIONER GAY HAS SECONDED THAT ONE.
WE HAVE, UH, FOR THE APPLICANT IS ONLINE FOR TO, SHE JUST, SHE WASN'T, THEY WERE NOT SIGNED
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UP, SO I KNOW.OKAY, THAT'S, I WANTED TO BOTH THAT'S FINE.
IF SHE'S ONLINE, UM, THAT'S, I WOULD'VE TAKEN IT AFTER DISCUSSION.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THIS MOTION WE MADE BEFORE WE STOP AND TALK.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY YES.
THAT IS OUR ORDER FOR THE DAY.
SO WE BEGIN WITH CR ONE STAFF.
WE NEED SOMEONE TO READ THE TASK FORCE REQUEST.
RHONDA DUNN, SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF AND I HAVE WATER, UH,
ITEM NUMBER ONE, THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS AT 2 0 1 EAST NINTH STREET.
THE CASE NUMBER IS CR 2 45 DASH 0 1 8 RD, THE REQUEST.
IT'S A COURTESY REVIEW TO DEMOLISH THE MAIN BUILDING, THE STANDARD BEING REQUESTED OR USED THIS IMMINENT THREAT TO PUBLIC HEALTH OR SAFETY.
THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION, SINCE THIS IS A COURTESY REVIEW, NO ACTION IS REQUIRED.
SO IT'S THAT A REQUEST TO DEMOLISH MAIN BUILDING, STANDARD IMMINENT THREAT TO PUBLIC HEALTH OR SAFETY.
BE DISCOURSED WITH THE UNDERSTANDING THAT A FINAL PLAN AS WELL AS ANY ASSOCIATED ENGINEERING AND ARCHITECTURAL REPORTS AND DETAILS ARE TO BE SUBMITTED FOR LANDMARK PERMISSION REVIEW.
ALSO, MEMBERS OF THE LANDMARK COMMISSION I DID PRINT OUT AND EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE A LETTER, RIGHT? EVERYONE IN THE ROOM? OKAY.
TASK FORCE FEEDBACK, COURTESY REVIEW, COMMENTS ONLY.
NON-SUPPORTED TASK FORCE CONSIDERS A DEMOLITION REQUEST TO BE DE DEMOLITION BY NEGLECT AND IS NOT IN FAVOR OF THE REQUEST.
AND WE DO HAVE SEVERAL SPEAKERS LINED UP TO DISCUSS THIS WITH US.
UM, LET US GO IN THE ORDER OF THIS, DO YOU HAVE ANY RECOMMENDATION? OKAY.
KATIE LENAHAN, JUST COME UP TO THE MICROPHONE.
WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THE MICROPHONE IS ON, WHICH MEANS THERE WILL BE A GREEN LIGHT.
I I ALSO, HANG ON, I KNOW WE GOT YOUR NAME NOW WE ALSO NEED YOU TO GIVE US YOUR ADDRESS AND THEN YOU HAVE TO, UM, TELL US YOU'RE GONNA TELL THE TRUTH.
9,400 NORTH CENTRAL EXPRESSWAY AND I'M DID YOU SAY TELL THE TRUTH? YEAH, JUST TELL ME.
OKAY, MA'AM, YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES TO TELL US WHAT YOU NEED TO TELL US ABOUT YOUR EXCELLENT.
I'M THE DESIGN DIRECTOR FOR DALLAS ISD.
WE APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO LISTEN AND RESPOND TO YOUR QUESTIONS TODAY.
OUR GOAL IS TO BE RESPONSIBLE STEWARDS OF OUR HISTORIC BUILDING STOCK.
UH, WE ACTUALLY DO, UM, WORK WITH ALL OF OUR ARCHITECTS TO MAKE SURE THEY'RE AWARE OF THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR OF STANDARDS FOR TREATMENTS AND SUPPORT PROPERTIES.
THEY LOOK AT THE PRESERVATION BRIEFS.
WE'VE HAD RECENT SUCCESS, SUNSET HIGH SCHOOL, WOODROW WILSON HIGH SCHOOL, LONG NORTH DALLAS, MADISON, BOOKER T WASHINGTON, LIPSCOMB ELEMENTARY SCHOOL.
UH, WE ARE ACTUALLY ACTIVELY LOOKING TO FIND WAYS TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE TAX CREDITS.
WE LISTEN TO THE BRIEFING THIS MORNING.
IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A PASSION PROJECT, SO IF THERE ARE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THAT, I WOULD LOVE TO FOLLOW UP AND FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAKE THAT WORK FOR A PUBLIC.
ISD 'CAUSE I THINK DALLAS COULD SET A GREAT EXAMPLE THERE.
WE'VE BEEN ACTIVELY WORKING ON SOLUTIONS FOR WH EDEN FOR THE PAST 18 YEARS.
UH, WE'VE HAD MULTIPLE STRUCTURAL REPORTS.
THE MORE WE INVESTIGATE, THE MORE DEFICIENCIES WE SEEM TO UNCOVER.
WE'VE BEEN DEALING WITH FOUNDATION ISSUES.
THE SCHOOL HAS BEEN SUBSIDING SINCE IT WAS BUILT IN 1915.
WE'VE APPLIED FOR CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS TO FIX THE PROBLEMS. CURRENTLY WE HAVE A GC ON SITE, ON SITE.
THEY WERE GOING TO SHORE THE FRONT FACADE, THE PROTECTED FACADE IN ORDER TO REPAIR THE FOUNDATION AND THE SELECTED DEMOLITION.
THEY DISCOVERED THAT THE FACADE DOES NOT HAVE A CONTINUOUS BOND BEAM AS ASSUMED IN THE CONSTRUCTION.
IT WAS DEEMED TO BE AT A A PUBLIC SAFETY HAZARD.
UM, IN ORDER TO REPAIR THE FOUNDATION, WE HAVE BEEN TOLD THAT WE NEED TO DISMANTLE AND RECONSTRUCT THE FRONT FOF, WHICH IS CHALLENGING, UH, STUDENT STAFF AND PUBLIC SAFETY IS OUR MANDATE AND OUR PRIORITY.
SO WE'RE HERE TO RESPECTFULLY REQUEST THAT YOU ALLOW US TO PURSUE A SOLUTION WHERE WE REPURPOSE THIS AS A PUBLIC PARK THAT CELEBRATES THE HISTORIC SIGNIFICANCE OF THE SCHOOL, THE COMMUNITY, THE ALUMNI, AND THE ARCHITECTURE ITSELF.
UM, WE SEE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR STUDENTS, OUR STUDENTS, AND OUR STAFF
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TO PARTNER WITH THE ALUMNI, THE COMMUNITY, THE LANDMARK COMMISSION AND PRESERVATION DALLAS, TO DEVELOP THIS SOLUTION THAT RESPONDS AND ADDRESSES THESE, UM, THE IMPORTANCE OF THIS SITE AND HOPEFULLY DEVELOP A NEW GENERATION OF PRESERVATIONS.UM, RENT ALFRED AGAIN, SIR, I NEED YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS AND YOUR PROMISE TO TELL ME THE TRUTH.
MY ADDRESS IS 9,400, UH, NORTH CENTRAL EXPRESSWAY.
UH, AND I'M HERE TO TELL THE TRUTH.
YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES TO DO THAT, SIR.
UH, AND THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING US THE TIME TO BE HERE.
UM, WE ARE HERE BECAUSE WE KNOW THIS BUILDING MEANS SOMETHING TO THE COMMUNITY, TO CITY AND TO THE ALUMNI WHO WALK THE HALLS.
AND WE WANT TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT FROM THE ONSET.
UH, WE'RE NOT HERE TO GIVE A LENGTHY DISCUSSION BECAUSE WE CAME TO LISTEN, BUT WE ALSO WANT TO BE TRANSPARENT ABOUT THE STEPS WE'VE TAKEN AND THE REALITY WE ARE FACING.
UH, OVER THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS AND REALLY OVER THE SEVERAL DECADES, THE MULTIPLE ENGINEERS HAVE DONE ASSESSMENTS AND HAVE SHOWN THAT THE STRUCTURE CONTINUES TO SHIFT, CRACKED AND SETTLE.
UH, DESPITE PAST REPAIR EFFORTS, THE RATE OF MOVEMENT HAS ACCELERATED IN RECENT YEARS.
AND OUR MOST RECENT STRUCTURAL REPORT MAKES IT CLEAR THAT OUR ISSUES ARE MORE COMPLICATED THAN WE ORIGINALLY ASSUMED.
UH, THAT'S A HARD CONCLUSION TO REACH, BUT IT'S ALSO OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO ACT ACCORDINGLY.
WE'RE REQUESTING APPROVAL OF PROCEED WITH A, UH, DEMOLITION, BUT WE'RE NOT LOOKING THE ERASE HISTORY.
UM, AS MS. LENAHAN MENTIONED, YOU KNOW, WE, WE PROPOSE CREATING A, A FULL RECORD OF THE STRUCTURE, UH, USING EXISTING ARCHITECTURAL AND PHOTOGRAPHIC DOCUMENTS.
AND WE WANT TO INVOLVE OUR STUDENTS, OUR COMMUNITY AND ALUMNI IN THAT PROCESS.
AND THAT WAY WE TURN THIS MOMENT, UH, NOT INTO JUST PRESERVATION, BUT ALSO INTO EDUCATION.
SO AGAIN, THANK YOU FOR HEARING US.
YOU KNOW, WE'RE HERE TO LISTEN, LEARN, AND RESPECTFULLY SHARE, UH, THESE DIFFICULT REALITIES.
AND YOU DID MENTION YOU WERE LOOKING FOR APPROVAL TO TAKE IT DOWN.
WE WILL NOT BE VOTING ON ANYTHING TODAY.
THIS IS A COURTESY REVIEW TO DISCUSS, WHICH IS USUALLY USED USUALLY WHEN SOMEONE'S PLANNING TO BUILD SOMETHING AND WE GIVE 'EM AN IDEA OF HOW THEIR PLANS ARE GOING.
BUT SO WHAT YOU'LL KNOW TODAY IS HOW WE'RE INCLINED AND WHAT PROOF WOULD BE LOOKING FOR TO ADEQUATELY, UH, LEAD US TO JUDGE THAT WE COULD TAKE THIS BUILDING DOWN AND, UM, WHAT OUR STANDARDS WOULD BE, HOPEFULLY IS WHAT YOU'LL GET OUT OF THIS.
COLLEEN KELLY AND YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, MA'AM? COLLEEN KELLY.
AND YES, I'M HERE TO TELL THE TRUTH.
STARTING WITH, I'M ONE OF THOSE ALUMNI.
I'M CURRENTLY THE TREASURER OF THE ADAMSON, UM, ALUMNI ASSOCIATION.
I AM THE SEC, THE, UH, EXCUSE ME.
I'M THE PRESIDENT NOW OF THE ADAMSON SCHOLARSHIP FOUNDATION, WHICH IS ABOUT TO AWARD $120,000 SCHOLARSHIPS TO, UH, GRADUATING SENIORS.
I AM HERE HOPING THAT WE CAN SAVE AT LEAST A PORTION OF THE BUILDING.
WE UNDERSTAND THAT THE FACADE ON THE FRONT IS NOT ADEQUATELY ATTACHED, BUT WE'RE IN HOPES THAT WE CAN SAVE THE BUILDING.
OUR ALUMNI ASSOCIATION BOARD HAS BEEN FIGHTING FOR THIS SINCE 2012, AND SO I'M REPRESENTING THE BOARD TODAY.
AND STAY AROUND IN CASE WE HAVE QUESTIONS.
AND THE, THE LAST, OH, NO, NO, THIS OKAY.
I'M AT 4 0 1 NORTH HOUSTON STREET AND I WILL BE TELLING THE TRUTH TODAY.
UM, I'M AN ARCHITECT AT CORGAN AND I'VE BEEN INVOLVED IN THE PROJECT WITH ADAMSON PERSONALLY THE LAST FIVE YEARS.
UM, BUT MEMBERS OF MY TEAM HAVE BEEN INVOLVED AS FAR BACK AS 2003.
UM, I'M HERE JUST TO SERVE OR TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE FROM ARCHITECTURAL PERSPECTIVE.
SO WE, WE ARE, I HAVE, I HAVE ONE QUESTION THAT WAS JUST BROUGHT UP BY NOT FOR YOU.
FOR THE, FOR UM, THE PEOPLE WHO TALKED ABOUT THE POTENTIAL PARK.
HAVE YOU WORKED WITH PARKS AND REC AND THEY ALREADY HAVE BUY-IN ON A POTENTIAL PARK? 'CAUSE OTHERWISE, YOU KNOW, AN IDEA OF A PARK ISN'T GOING ANYWHERE WITHOUT THEIR, AND I'D GET 'EM TO SIGN A CONTRACT IF THEY'RE SAYING THEY'LL BUY IN.
MS. LINEHAN MENTIONED PARK, BUT I THINK SHE WAS LEANING LIKE A GREEN SPACE FOR OUR STUDENTS, UH, RIGHT NOW.
SO NOT A CITY PARK, BUT A GREEN SPACE FOR OUR STUDENTS.
SO HOW WOULD THAT BE PROTECTED AS REMAIN GREEN SPACE? UH, WE, WE, WE WERE THINKING ABOUT, UH, OUR ARCHITECT HAD BEEN WORKING ON RENDERING FOR US, MAKE IT, UM, I GUESS LEAVE SOME OF THE FOOTING, LIKE LET'S SAY ABOUT THREE FOOT
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HIGH AND HAVE A TRAIL WALKING THROUGH IT TO TALK ABOUT THE HISTORY OF THE BUILDING.SOME PLAQUES AROUND THERE, SOME BENCHES WHERE THEY COULD READ ABOUT THE HISTORY OF THE BUILDING, SEE PHOTOGRAPHS OF, OF THE BUILDING.
SO IT WOULD LOOK LIKE A PARK, BUT MORE LIKE A MEMORIAL STUDENTS AND THEY COULD KIND OF GO THERE FOR LUNCH AND LEARN ABOUT THE BUILDING.
AND I KNOW EVERYBODY HAS QUESTIONS, BUT I HAVE ONE MORE FOR THE LADY FROM OREGON, JUST BECAUSE YOU SAID Y'ALL HAVE BEEN LOOKING AT THIS SINCE 2014.
YOU'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS PROJECT? UH, PERSONALLY I'VE BEEN INVOLVED IN THE PROJECT SINCE 2020.
UM, BUT MEMBERS OF MY TEAM HAVE BEEN INVOLVED AS FAR BACK AS 2003.
2003 BECAUSE IN 2011 WAS WHEN THIS WAS LANDMARKED AND I DON'T RECALL ANYTHING COMING UP ABOUT THERE BEING SOME INHERENT DEFICIENCIES THAT WOULD LEAD TO DEGRADATION.
UM, WE HAVE SEVERAL STRUCTURAL REPORTS FROM OUR ENGINEERS.
UM, LIKE MS. LENAHAN MENTIONED, UM, AS FAR BACK AS 1938, THERE WAS ALREADY MOVEMENT THAT WE SAW THE BUILDING.
UM, GIVEN THAT IT WAS BUILT IN 1915, WE'RE SEEING MOVEMENT AS SOON AS 20 YEARS AFTER THE FACT.
UM, AND THEN WE HAVE REPORTS FROM 2008, 20 10, 20 18, 20 21.
UM, MORE IS MORE THE MORE RECENT THAT WE HAVE.
THANK YOU FOR CLARIFYING THAT.
COMMISSIONERS, COMMISSIONER, POLICY.
UH, SO I HAVE UH, TWO, TWO DIFFERENT QUESTIONS.
THE FIRST ONE, AND, AND I'M NOT CERTAIN IF THIS IS UM, ANSWERED BY THE CITY ATTORNEY OR IF THIS WOULD BE BY THE STAFF, BUT THERE, UM, IN, IN REGARDS TO THE TEST FORCE FEEDBACK ABOUT CONCERN OVER A, A DEMOLITION BY NEGLECT, UM, SITUATION, WHENEVER WE'VE HAD THAT IN THE PAST, THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN THE CONTEXT OF, YOU KNOW, A FINDING OF THAT PRIOR THEN TO PERHAPS PUTTING THE PROPERTY INTO RECEIVERSHIP.
I THINK COMMISSIONER ANDERSON HAS WORKED ON SOME OF THOSE BEFORE.
SO COULD YOU EXPLAIN A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT SORT OF THE TASK FORCE COMMENTS, WHAT THAT WOULD LOOK LIKE? I DON'T EVEN KNOW PROCEDURALLY, I'M TRYING TO, I CAN'T REALLY RECALL IF WE MADE A MOTION FOR DEMO BY NEGLECT OR HOW THAT EVEN GOT INVOLVED.
I FEEL LIKE STAFF WAS ALREADY INVOLVED AT THAT POINT OR THERE WAS ALREADY LITIGATION THAT THAT'S TRUE.
USUALLY STAFF WAS ALREADY INVOLVED AT, AT THAT POINT.
USUALLY THERE IS SOME RES REQUEST FROM, UM, UH, IT CAN BE AN INDIVIDUAL LETTER TO US ASKING IT TO BE CONSIDERED.
UM, AND THEN WE GO THROUGH A SERIES OF MEETINGS WITH THE PROPERTY OWNER, UH, TRYING TO FIGURE THINGS OUT.
BUT IT WILL EVENTUALLY WOULD COME TO YOU ALL, UM, TO, TO ACTUALLY PROCEED BEYOND THAT POINT.
UM, DR. DUNN, WOULD YOU, YOU, YOU'VE ACTUALLY HAD THE CONVERSATION WITH THE TASK FORCE? I HAVE, RIGHT? I DON'T THINK THEY WERE MEANING THE ACTUAL PROCESS THAT WE HAVE ON RECORD THAT WE REFER TO AS THE DEMOLITION BY NEGLECT CERTIFICATION, I THINK THEY WERE JUST TRYING TO EXPRESS THAT THEY FELT AS IF WHAT WAS GOING ON WAS DEMOLITION BY NEGLECT.
SO YOU WOULD THINK THAT WAS NOT THE APPROPRIATE, UM, PROCESS NECESSARILY, OR, OR COURSE ACTION? NO, NOT AT THE, NO.
AND THEN MY NEXT QUESTION IS, WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THE DIFFERENT REASONS IN TERMS OF GRANTING THE TION, YOU KNOW, OF COURSE WE HAVE PUBLIC HARM, BUT THEN THERE'S ALSO IN TERMS OF REPLACEMENT WITH SOMETHING EQUALLY APPROPRIATE AND AND WHATNOT.
SO IF THIS SIDE IS PROPERLY SECURED, DOES IT STILL QUALIFY FOR THAT EMINENT THREAT OR WOULD THAT NOT MOVE IT INTO THE OTHER CATEGORY OF NEEDING TO REPLACE IT WITH SOMETHING APPROPRIATE WHERE WE WOULD HAVE TO APPROVE THAT PRIOR TO GRANTING THE, THE DEMO PERMIT, IF I'M UNDERSTANDING CORRECTLY.
SO FOR THE STANDARD IMMINENT THREAT, UM, YOU HAVE TO FIRST DECIDE ON THAT WHETHER IT IS AN IM IMMINENT THREAT THAT CANNOT BE REMEDIED.
UM, IF THERE IS A REMEDY AND THEY CHOOSE TO GO FORWARD WITH THAT, WELL THEN, UM, I'M NOT SURE I'M UNDERSTANDING THE QUESTION COMPLETELY BECAUSE THEN THERE'S NO REASON TO DO THAT.
WELL, SOME OF WHAT WE'VE, WE'VE DISCUSSED, YOU KNOW, THERE HAVE BEEN, UM, PEOPLE THAT HAVE ASKED FOR IT IN THE PAST WITH THE HOUSE, SO THAT KIND OF THING.
AND, UH, YOU'RE JUST TALKING WITH AN INDIVIDUAL, UM, A HOMEOWNER THAT THERE'S, THERE'S NOT FENCING AROUND THE, THE HOUSE OR THINGS LIKE THAT.
I MEAN, IT'S CLEARLY NOT AN INSTITUTION LIKE DISD.
AND SO THIS IDEA OF IT CREATING THIS HAZARD, 'CAUSE YOU CAN'T REALLY PROPERLY SECURE IT IN THAT WAY MAKES SENSE IN A WAY THAT, UM, A LARGE ORGANIZATION PROPERLY SECURING A SITE.
AT WHICH POINT YOU WOULD SAY, WELL, IS IT AN IMMINENT THREAT TO THE, TO THE PUBLIC IF IT'S A PROPERLY SECURED SITE AND YOU HAVE IT WITHIN YOUR CAPABILITIES TO DO THAT? THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT YOU JUST SAID.
EXACTLY WHAT I WOULD SAY THAT IF IT CAN BE PROPERLY SECURED, THEN IT IS NOT AN IMMINENT THREAT NECESSARILY.
ALSO, UM, EVEN IN A COUPLE OF, I CAN REMEMBER A COUPLE OF CASES OF RESIDENTIAL WHERE Y'ALL BASICALLY SAID, IF YOU CAN, IF YOU CAN SECURE IT AND, AND NOBODY CAN GET IN AND GET HURT, THAT IT'S BY THE TIME THERE'S ANY DAMAGE, THEN YEAH, IT'S, YOU CAN, A LOT OF PLACES ARE GONNA BE AN IMMINENT
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THREAT.UNLESS YOU KEEP IT, UNLESS YOU KEEP IT FROM HURTING SOMEONE, THEN IT'S NOT AN IMMINENT THREAT.
UM, IF IT CAN BE REPAIRED, THAT COULD, BECAUSE THAT'S YOUR, YOUR STANDARD, YOU HAVE TO SAY IT'S NOT ONLY AN IMMINENT THREAT, BUT THERE'S, THERE'S NO WAY TO, UH, TO, TO ARCH YEAH.
TO REMEDY IT WITH WITHOUT DEMOTION.
SO IT SOUNDS LIKE A LOT OF OUR JUDGMENT WILL BE BASED ON WHAT, WHETHER IT'S A THREAT AND WHETHER IT CAN BE REMEDIED.
UM, I'D LIKE OUR CITY ATTORNEY, NOT THE SECOND IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT, BUT TELL US THE EXACT LANGUAGE OF WHAT WE MAKE THAT JUDGMENT ON, WHETHER IT CAN OR CANNOT BE REMEDIED.
BECAUSE MUCH OF THE ARGUMENT HERE DIDN'T SAY THERE'S NO WAY TO FIX IT.
IT JUST SAID IT WOULD BE PROHIBITIVELY EXPENSIVE.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW HOW THAT GOES INTO OUR MANDATED RULES OF HOW WE RULE THINGS.
QUESTIONS, COMMISSIONER PREZI? OH, YES.
UH, SO MY QUESTION WAS THE, UM, UH, INFORMATION IN THE LETTER THAT WE HAVE IN CORGAN DATED MARCH 19TH, 2025, WHEN IT TALKS ABOUT THE SHORING COSTS FIVE MONTHS AFTER FIVE MONTHS, HOWEVER, COULD Y'ALL EXPLAIN TO US WHAT THE SHORING WOULD INVOLVE AND HOW MUCH OF THE STRUCTURE WOULD BE REQUIRED TO BE SHORE? SURE.
SO, UM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO DO IS, UM, SHORE UP THE PERIMETER OF THE BUILDING.
UM, LIKE MS. LENAHAN MENTIONED, OUR UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT WAS THERE, THERE WAS A CONTINUOUS BOND BEAM SUPPORTING THAT FRONT FACADE.
UM, OUR INVESTIGATIVE DEMO REVEALED THAT THAT BOND BEAM IS NOT CONTINUOUS AND IT'S ACTUALLY JUST LENTILS OPENING, HOLDING UP OPENINGS FOR WINDOWS.
UM, SO THE SHORING THAT WILL BE REQUIRED WOULD BE A LOT MORE EXTENSIVE.
UM, AND I BELIEVE THERE WILL BE A BIT MORE OF A DANGER OF THE, UM, THE WALL LOSING ITS LOW BEARING CAPACITY ONCE WE START MOVING AND TRYING TO REPLACE THE FLOORS AND THE FOUNDATION.
SO, BUT WHAT ACTUALLY WOULD THE SHORING ENTAIL? WOULD THAT BE BUILDING AN EXOSKELETON OF STEEL BEAMS OR HOW, WHAT WOULD THAT BE SPECIFICALLY? SO IN OUR PROLI PRELIMINARY DESIGNS, THIS WAS ALL KIND OF, UM, THEORETICAL, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD.
UM, BUT IT WOULD BE BRACING ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE STRUCTURE, UM, KIND OF LARGE, UM, KICKERS, UM, OF STEEL THAT WOULD BE BRACING AND SUPPORTING THE STRUCTURE OF VERDICT.
AND HAS ANY DESIGN WORK BEEN DONE TO, AT THIS POINT? NO.
THAT'S BASICALLY WHERE I'M GOING TO FOLLOW UP.
IS ANY OF THIS, OTHER THAN A PARAGRAPH OR TWO, IS THE DOCUMENTATION GOING TO BE PRESENTED, UM, UM, THE ASSESSMENTS FROM YOUR STRUCTURAL, UM, CONTRACTOR ASSESSMENTS, UH, DOCUMENTATION TOO? YES.
WE HAVE STRUCTURAL REPORTS, UM, FROM THE LAST COUPLE YEARS.
WE WILL INCLUDE THOSE IN OUR APPLICATION.
UM, AS FAR, WERE YOU LOOKING FOR HOR AND DESIGN? IS THAT YOUR QUESTION? I'M LOOKING FOR ALL DOCUMENTATION THAT WE CAN TO MAKE A, AN EDUCATED DECISION.
UM, WITH, YOU KNOW, REMOVING MATERIALS, IT'S ONE THING, REMOVING A BUILDING FROM ANOTHER, UM, WITHOUT DOCUMENTATION, IT'S HARD FOR AN ENTITY LIKE THIS TO MAKE A, A DECISION WITHOUT, YOU KNOW, JUST BLURBS OF PARAGRAPHS OR RIGHT.
UH, SO, UM, YOU HAD HIRED, UH, OR A CONTRACTOR HAD COME OUT AS WELL? YES.
UM, SO DID THEY PUT TOGETHER A DOCUMENTATION FOR YOU OF ANY OUR REPORT AS WELL? UM, OUR CONTRACTOR SPECIFICALLY, NO.
THEY JUST WORKED IN CONJUNCTION WITH OUR STRUCTURAL ENGINEER.
AND THEN AT ONE POINT WE DID GET, UM, SO OUR MAIN ENGINEER WAS AG AND E AND THEN WE HAD JQ, WHICH WAS THE, UM, HISTORIC PRESERVATION SPECIALIST.
UM, THEIR STRUCTURAL ENGINEER CAME OUT AND THEY PROVIDED SOME RECOMMENDATION AND OBSERVATION REPORT AS WELL.
AND THEY, IN TURN PROBABLY TALKED ABOUT, UH, BRINGING ON THE OTHER CONTRACT THAT THEY'VE WORKED WITH BEFORE.
AND DID THEY ACTUALLY ENTER INTO A CONTRACT OR DID THEY JUST COME OUT AND WALK THE BUILDING AND HAVE SOME QUESTIONS AND THEN NOTHING WENT FORWARD? 'CAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE THEY WERE, THEY BACKED OUT, BUT IT KIND OF, IT WAS ALMOST SOUNDS LIKE THEY BACKED OUT BECAUSE OF THE, UH, WHAT THE FINDINGS WERE.
SO THE, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT, WHAT THAT WAS IN A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAIL.
UM, SO, UM, THE MAIN ISSUE WAS SAFETY.
UM, AND THIS IS A REALLY, UM, COMPLICATED AND COMPLEX PROCESS IN ORDER TO SHORE THIS BUILDING UP, STABILIZE IT, UM, REMOVE THE OLD STRUCTURE, PUT NEW STRUCTURE IN.
UM, THAT PROCESS WILL BE DETAILED IN OUR FORMAL APPLICATION A BIT MORE BEYOND THAT LETTER.
UM, AND BASICALLY WHAT WE WERE RUNNING INTO IS WE COULD COME UP WITH A PLAN, UM, BUT THEN OUR CONTRACTOR, THEIR SCOPE AND THE JOB IS THE MEANS AND METHODS.
THEY FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET IT DONE.
UM, AND THEY WERE RUNNING INTO ISSUES WHERE THEY WEREN'T ABLE TO FIND SUBS WHO FELT CONFIDENT IN THE
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SAFETY OF THE BUILDING, UM, AS THEY WOULD BE.'CAUSE UM, MY UNDERSTANDING IS ALL THAT EQUIPMENT CREATES A LOT OF VIBRATIONS AND MOVEMENT, AND THERE WERE SOME CONCERNS THAT THE BUILDING WOULDN'T BE ABLE POTENTIALLY TO WITHSTAND JUST SETTING UP THE SHORING BREAST TO MOVE FORWARD WITH STRUCTURAL REPAIR.
SO THEY BACKED OUT ON THEIR OWN, NOT FOR ANY OTHER REASONS THAT THE PROJECT STALLED.
SO THE PROJECT STALLED BASED UPON A CONTRACTOR NOT BEING ABLE TO, WANTING TO GO FORWARD WITH THEM.
BASICALLY WE RAN TO A POINT WHERE WE WEREN'T ABLE TO FIND ANYONE WILLING TO MOVE FORWARD BECAUSE OF THE SAFETY CONCERNS.
SO IT'D BE NICE TO SEE ALL THE DOCUMENTATION WHEN YOU'RE READY, PROBABLY INCLUDING THOSE.
I WON'T WORK ON THIS PLACE
NOT ONLY, NOT ONLY THE, UH, THE EXISTING REPORT AND SURVEY OF THE ADDITION OF THE BUILDING, BUT THE ASSESSMENT WHERE, HOW ONE WOULD PROCEED.
UH, AS WELL AS SHORING, I MEAN, THE WHOLE PIT CABOODLE.
COMMISSIONER GAY, COULD YOU, UM, TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE, THE 70 5K IN PERPETUITY FOR SHORING COSTS, NOT BEING AN ENGINEER? I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE SORT OF NECESSITY THERE AFTER YOU DO THAT INITIAL AND, YOU KNOW, IT'S PRETTY HIGH, I THINK FOR ONGOING AND PERPETUITY, SO I'D LOVE TO HEAR SOME MORE DETAILS THERE.
UM, AND TO BE CLEAR, I AM AN ARCHITECT AND NOT A STRUCTURAL ENGINEER.
SO, UM, THE SHORING COSTS THAT WE E LISTED IN PERPETUITY WAS REALLY JUST, UM, TO SECURE THE BUILDING AND STABILIZE IT WHILE WE'RE WORKING ON THAT FINAL SHOR DESIGN.
UM, THIS WAS KIND OF LIKE THE IMMEDIATE, WE NEED TO GET OUT THERE AND HOLD THIS BUILDING UP.
UM, THAT WOULD BE THAT $75,000 A MONTH WHILE WE'RE WORKING ON THE, THE FINAL DESIGN FOR SHORING AND THEN THE STRUCTURAL REPAIR THAT COMES.
SO IT'S JUST DURING THE TERM OF THE CONTRACT? YES.
UH, COMMISSIONER ANDERSON, UM, AND THEN COMMISSIONER HOHO, ICU.
I, I SEE IN OUR DOCKET THAT THERE WERE FOUR CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS APPLIED FOR EITHER TO THE STAFF OR TO THE LANDMARK COMMISSION FROM 2018, 22 AND 23 2018.
REPLACED 178 WINDOWS FOUNDATION REPAIR, TODD POINTING OF RICK CASTSTONE REPAIR, REPLACE MASONRY WALLS AND RESTORE THE BASTER 2022, REPLACE DAMAGED BRICK ON THE SOUTHWEST WALL, 2023, UM, UH, RESTORE THE EAST FACADE, INTERIOR COURTYARD, BRICK AND WEST, UM, MAINTENANCE YARD WORK.
CAN YOU TELL ME, OF ALL THOSE APPLICATIONS, HOW MUCH OF THAT WORK WAS COMPLETED OR, OR NOT COMPLETED? IT WAS NOT COMPLETED.
SO YOU CONTINUED TO GET APPLICATIONS THROUGH THIS INSTITUTION, BUT YOU DON'T DO THE WORK.
SO, UM, TO GO BACK A LITTLE BIT AND GIVE SOME HISTORY ON THE PROJECT, UM, MOST ALL OF THIS WORK IS FUNDED THROUGH BONDS.
UM, AND I BELIEVE THE LATEST BOND, I'M NOT SURE WHAT YEAR THE BOND WAS, BUT THE FIRST PROJECT IN 2018, UM, WE WERE PROPOSING ALL OF THAT WORK, AND THEN WE RAN INTO THAT ISSUE OF REALIZING THAT THE STRUCTURAL REPAIR ON THAT SOUTH FACADE WAS BEYOND WHAT THE BOND COULD FUND.
SO THAT PROJECT WENT ON HOLD, UM, AND THEN WE RESTARTED AFTER THE 2020 BOND, THAT'S WHEN WE HAD THE 20 20, 21, 23 APPLICATIONS AND ONWARD.
UM, SAME THING, TRYING TO GET STUDENTS IN A PROGRAM BACK INTO THAT BUILDING WHILE MAKING THE STRUCTURAL REPAIRS.
BUT AS WE'RE MOVING ON IN TIME, WE'RE FINDING THAT THE PROJECT COSTS ARE BEYOND WHAT IS FUNDED IN THE BOND.
IT GIVES THE IMPRESSION TO US AND THE COMMUNITY THAT DSD IS WORKING ON THIS PROPERTY BECAUSE YOU CONTINUE TO MAKE APPLICATIONS FOR WORK THAT NEVER GETS DONE.
SO WHEN I LOOKED AT THIS, I SAID, WOW, THIS BUILDING MUST BE IN PRETTY GOOD SHAPE.
LOOK AT ALL THE WORK THEY'VE DONE.
SO IT SEEMS TO BE A LITTLE BIT INTERESTING THAT YOU CONTINUE TO ASK FOR WORK THAT CAN'T BE FUNDED.
DO YOU, YOU REQUEST MORE MONEY IN 2018 TO FIX THINGS THAT NEED TO BE FIXED THEN, OR, I, I DON'T QUITE UNDERSTAND HOW WE DEFER ALL OF THIS WORK AND SUDDENLY WE'RE AT A DEMOLITION SITUATION AT THIS POINT.
IF YOU COULD EXPLAIN THAT, PLEASE.
WE, WE'VE BEEN TRYING TO FUND THE PROJECT.
EVERY TIME WE GET A CONTRACT THAT GETS ON, LIKE OUR ENGINEERS OR ARCHITECTS WILL DESIGN SOMETHING, AND THEN WHEN WE ACTUALLY HIRE THE PEOPLE TO DO THE WORK, THEY FIND SOME MORE
WE LOOK FOR FUNDING, WE APPLY AGAIN, AND WE, WE'VE BEEN IN THE CYCLE FOR OVER A DECADE.
SO YEAH, THOSE, THOSE WERE OUR INTENTS.
WE'VE BEEN TRYING TO SAVE THE BUILDING FOR A VERY LONG TIME.
SO VERSION, NONE OF THIS WORK WAS EVER COMPLETED.
IT WAS IN THE PROCESS WHEN THE PROJECT STOPPED BECAUSE THEY FIND A SAFETY ISSUE THAT THEY HAVE TO COME BACK TO THE ENGINEERS TO FIND A NEW SOLUTION.
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HINOJOSA.UH, I'D LIKE THE GENTLEMAN TO STAY THERE TOO, TO COME BACK AND, AND HER ALSO, UM, DURING THIS TIME THAT, UH, I'D LIKE TO KNOW HOW MANY, UH, BIDS Y'ALL RECEIVED OR HOW MANY CONTRACTORS YOU REACHED OUT TO, UH, TO DO THIS WORK.
AND IN PARTICULAR, I KNOW WE REACHED OUT TO TWO, UM, BACK IN 2017, I BELIEVE WE HAD MULTIPLE BIDS.
I DON'T HAVE THE EXACT NUMBERS, UH, FOR YOU.
UH, SAME THING IN 2020 WHEN WE DID IT AGAIN, UH, WE HAD MULTIPLE CONTRACTORS WHO IT, UM, BECAUSE WE, WE ADVERTISE IT PUBLICLY.
UH, WE AVERAGE ABOUT THREE TO FIVE PER BID.
BUT LIKE, I, I HAVE TO PULL UP THOSE DIRECTLY, GIVE YOU THAT SPECIFIC NUMBER, BUT SURE.
SO IF, IF, UH, ONE BID THAT Y'ALL SELECTED DIDN'T COME THROUGH BECAUSE OF THEIR HESITANCY ABOUT THE SHORING, UH, COST OR THE, UH, SAFETY, WERE THERE OTHER BIDS THAT, UH, BIDDERS THAT YOU WENT TO NEXT OR Y'ALL JUST STOPPED IT AT THAT POINT? WE, WE STOPPED AT THE SECOND CONTRACTOR WAS VERY HIGHLY RECOMMENDED.
UH, THE FIRST CONTRACTOR WHO HAD IT, UM, HE, LIKE I SAID, HE SAID IT WAS A SAFETY CONCERN.
AND WHILE WE WERE LOOKING AT THE MARKET WE WERE, WE RECOMMENDED A CONTRACTOR WHO DID THIS TYPE OF WORK WAS FAMILIAR WITH IT.
AND WHEN WE BROUGHT HIM ON BOARD, THEY ALSO EXPRESSED THE SAME CONCERNS AS THE FIRST ONE.
SO WE STOPPED REORGANIZED AND DECIDED TO, UH, UH, SUBMIT AN APPLICATION TO YOU GUYS TO, TO GET YOUR FEEDBACK.
AND I NEED TO NOTE FOR A MOMENT THAT COMMISSIONER TAYLOR NEEDS TO BE VISIBLE ONLINE WITH THAT PESKY STATE LAW THAT SAYS EVERYBODY HAS TO BE, AND ALSO TO MAKE SURE WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT, UM, OUR CPC LIAISON, JOHNNA HAMPTON IS ALSO JOINING US ONLINE.
UH, COMMISSIONER, NO, THANK YOU.
UM, I HAVE SOME QUESTIONS REGARDING THE, ANY ADDITIONAL DESIGN STUDIES THAT HAVE BEEN DONE TO AT LEAST KEEP PORTIONS OF THE BUILDING, UM, INTACT, UH, TO QUOTE ONE OF OUR PAYMENT OR, UH, FORMER COMMISSIONERS OF WHOM I HAVE A, A GREAT DEAL OF RESPECT, THE ARTIFACT IS WORTH SO MUCH MORE THAN A PLAQUE OR A PART OR SOME OTHER TYPE OF MEMORIAM.
UM, SO AGAIN, BACK TO THE QUESTION.
HAVE THERE BEEN ANY STUDIES TO KEEP AT LEAST PORTIONS, MAJOR PORTIONS OF THE ELEVATION INTACT AND DEMOLISH THE, THE OTHER PORTIONS WITH A AND REPLACE WITH A NEW, UH, VERY, YOU KNOW, FUNCTIONAL BUILDING AND, AND KEEP AT LEAST PORTIONS OF THE, OF THE BUILDING INTACT? YEAH.
THE, WHAT WE ARE REVEALING, THE, THE MAIN DEFICIENCY IS THE FACADE NOLEN BEAN AND THE FOUNDATION IS SHIFTING.
SO WHAT WE'D LIKE TO DO IS WORK WITH THE STUDENTS, THE ALUMNI COME WITH LIKE, DO A DESIGN CHARETTE AND GET COMMUNITY INPUT.
LIKE I SAID, WE THREW OUT THE IDEA ABOUT THE MEMORIAL GREEN PARK SPACE, BUT THAT, THAT WE'RE NOT BEYOND SCHEMATIC DESIGN WITH THAT ONE.
UH, BECAUSE WE WANTED TO SEE IF IT WAS EVEN FEASIBLE, UH, TO DO SOMETHING ELSE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, KEEPING FOUNDATIONS OR, UM, OR THE PORTIONS THAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THREE OR FOUR OR FIVE FEET TALL AREN'T IN MY MIND ENOUGH TO TELL THE STORY.
UH, AND AGAIN, IF YOU'RE REPLACING IT WITH PLAQUES, IT'S, IT'S, UM, IT'S A SAD COURSE TO TAKE.
UM, I WAS JUST WONDERING AGAIN, IF THE DESIGN, UH, ANY OF THE DESIGN ARCHITECTS HAD HAD DEVELOPED ANY THOUGHTS OF, OF, UH, REUSING PORTIONS OF THE BUILDING? UM, ONE OF THE NOTABLE FEATURES ON ADAMSON IS ALL THAT CAST STONE DETAIL WORK ON THE FRONT, THE MAIN, OVER THE MAIN ENTRY AND SOME CORNICE PIECES ALONG THE TOP.
UM, IF WE WERE TO DEMO THAT FACADE, WE WOULD DO WHAT WE CAN TO SAVE THOSE PIECES.
UM, AND UM, LIKE BRENT ALFRED WAS SAYING, UM, IT'S ALL SCHEMATIC AT THIS POINT.
UM, BUT IDEALLY WE WOULD LOVE TO KEEP THOSE AND INCORPORATE THOSE IN WHATEVER MEMORIAL THAT WE THANK YOU.
UM, IS THE STAFF FOR OUR CITY ATTORNEY PREPARED TO, UH, EXPLAIN TO US AND TO THE APPLICANT WHAT OUR STANDARD OF JUDGMENT IS TO APPROVE A REQUEST LIKE THIS ORDINARY REQUEST LIKE THIS? CERTAINLY MADAM CHAIR, I CAN READ THAT.
SO THIS, UH, STANDARD COMES TO US FROM CHAPTER 51, A SECTION 4.501 H FOUR C, AND READS THAT THE LANDMARK COMMISSION MUST DENY AN APPLICATION TO DEMOLISH OR REMOVE A STRUCTURE THAT POSES AN IMMINENT THREAT TO PUBLIC HEALTH OR
[00:35:01]
SAFETY.UNLESS IT FINDS THAT ONE, THE STRUCTURE CONSTITUTES A DOCUMENTED MAJOR AND IMMINENT THREAT TO PUBLIC HEALTH AND SAFETY.
SECONDLY, THAT THE D DEMOLITION OR REMOVAL IS REQUIRED TO ALLEVIATE THE THREAT TO PUBLIC HEALTH AND SAFETY.
AND LASTLY, THAT THERE IS NO REASONABLE WAY OTHER THAN DEMOLITION OR REMOVAL TO ELIMINATE THE THREAT IN A TIMELY MANNER.
SO REASONABLE SEEMS TO BE THE KEY WORD, THEREFORE WE, UM, MAKE OUR JUDGMENT CALL NOT TO SAY WHAT'S REASONABLE.
SO THAT SHOULD INFORM BOTH US AND THE APPLICANT THAT WHEN THEY, WHEN OR IF THEY MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS REQUEST, WHAT WE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT.
ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS? MR. SHERMAN, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE TWO OF YOU.
UM, AND THIS MAY SOUND STRANGE, BUT HAVE BOTH OF YOU BEEN INSIDE THE BUILDING, WALKED THE BUILDING, WERE YOU FEARFUL FOR YOUR SAFETY BASED ON WHAT YOU'VE BEEN TOLD ABOUT THIS BUILDING? THE LAST TIME I WAS IN THE BUILDING WAS A COUPLE YEARS AGO, AND, UM, WE HAVE NOT BEEN BACK OUT INTO THE BUILDING SINCE THEN BECAUSE OF EVERYTHING THAT WE, AND, UM, MY OTHER QUESTION IS, UM, WELL, AND LET ME FOLLOW UP ON YOUR ANSWER THEN.
WHAT WAS THE THREAT EXACTLY THAT BEING IN THE BUILDING MIGHT CAUSE ITS COLLAPSE UPON YOU? IS THAT WHAT YOU WERE TOLD? WELL, YEAH, AND THAT'S, THAT'S OUR UNDERSTANDING IS BECAUSE OF THE CONTINUED MOVEMENT.
UM, IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS WHERE WE DON'T KNOW WHEN SOMETHING COULD HAPPEN.
SO IT'S NOT WORTH THE RISK TO GO INTO THE BUILDING IF WE DON'T UNDERSTAND.
AND THAT COULD, SO AT THIS TIME, NO ONE GOES INSIDE THE BUILDING.
UM, I'VE BEEN IN THERE BEFORE I KNEW ABOUT THIS SITUATION, BUT THERE, THERE'S HOMELESS PEOPLE.
OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT IS ALWAYS RUNNING OUT THE BUILDING, ALSO HEAR FROM THE SCHOOL THAT SOMETIMES TEENAGERS OR SNEAKING, YOU KNOW, IN THERE JUST TO, YOU KNOW, BE TEENAGERS.
UM, SO I DON'T THINK IT'S A SAFE CONDITION BECAUSE OF PEOPLE MAY BE HIDING IN THERE.
COULD IT BE SECURED? UH, WE WITH A CONSTRUCTION FENCE? YEAH.
WE, WE PUT CONSTRUCTION FENCE, WE PUT LOCKS AND CHAINS.
OH, YOU DID SURROUND IT WITH A CONSTRUCTION FENCE? YES.
'CAUSE I DROVE BY THE OTHER DAY AND DIDN'T SEE IT.
UM, THEY'VE MOVED, THEY'VE UH, OUR CONTRACTOR HAS PULLED SOME OF THAT STUFF BACK, UH, AT THIS POINT, BUT HE HAD A CONSTRUCTION FENCE AROUND DURING THIS PERIOD.
AND THEN SECONDLY, IN THE LETTER FROM, UM,
SO ARE YOU DENYING THAT IT CAN BE RESTORED OR BASED ON INFORMATION YOU'VE HAD SINCE THIS BEEN WRITTEN ON MARCH 19TH? SO BASED ON THE INFORMATION THAT WE HAVE, OUR UNDERSTANDING IS, UM, THAT IT WOULD JUST BE EXTREMELY POSSIBLE.
I BEEN TO THE DISTRICT, LIKE YOU MENTIONED BEFORE, ALL THE TIMES THAT THE DISTRICT HAS TRIED THE SAFETY BUILDING, UM, ALL THE REPAIRS HAVE EXCEEDED ANY OF THEIR BUDGETS.
UM, AND THIRDLY, I'D LIKE TO KNOW OF THE $6 MILLION THAT, UM, THE PRINCIPAL STATES AND LETTERS BEEN SPENT ON THE BUILDING, IS THAT, UM, WHAT'S THAT BEEN SPENT ON JUST STUDIES AND GETTING BIDS OR WHAT? UM, AND THEN THE DESIGN, UM, THERE WERE TWO DIFFERENT DESIGNS STRUCTURALLY THAT WE HAD TO GO BACK AND REWORK ON ONCE WE REALIZED THE CONDITION OF THE BUILDING, UM, SECURING THE BUILDING AND THEN STRUCTURAL REPAIRS AND INVESTIGATION UP INTO THAT POINT AS WE'VE BEEN STARTING ENVELOPE REPAIR, SECURING THE SITE, I'VE BEEN ONGOING FOR ABOUT THREE YEARS AGO.
THAT SEEMS CURIOUS, BUT I'M NOT IN THIS BUSINESS, BUT IT SEEMS CURIOUS TO ME.
COMMISSIONER ANDERSON, I'D LIKE TO GET BACK TO THE BOND FOR A SECOND.
UH, THERE WERE THREE DIFFERENT YEARS THAT RENOVATION WAS GONNA HAPPEN TO THIS BUILDING.
UM, HOW MANY TIMES DID DI YOU GO TO DIC BOND PROGRAM BEFORE THIS BUILDING? THREE THAT I CAN RECALL? THREE THAT I RECALL.
AND HOW MUCH MONEY APPROXIMATELY WAS ALLOTTED IN THOSE THREE BONDS? I'D HAVE TO GET THAT EXACT 30.
OVER 20 MILLION IN THE 2020 BOND FOR SURE.
IS THAT MONEY STILL EARMARKED FOR THIS BUILDING? IT IS.
SO THERE IS MONEY, YOU KNOW, FUND FOR THE RENOVATION OF THIS BUILDING? NOT TO COMPLETE IT, NO.
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ALLOTTED FOR THIS? THERE IS, YES.IT WOULD BE INTERESTING TO KNOW WHAT THAT AMOUNT IS, IF YOU COULD FIND THAT.
I THINK THAT WOULD BE GREAT TO KNOW.
BUT THE MONEY HAS NOT BEEN REALLOCATED SOMEWHERE ELSE AT THIS POINT.
HAS A CONTRACTOR PROVIDED A BUDGET FOR THE COMPLETION OF THE PROJECT? I SEE NINE 3 MILLION HERE AND I'M JUST CURIOUS WHAT THAT ENTAILS.
UM, WE HAVE A FULL, UH, COST ANALYSIS RUNNING THROUGH THE DIFFERENT OPTIONS OF WHAT IT WOULD TAKE TO RESTORE ADAMSON TO VARYING DEGREES.
UM, AND WE PULL ALL THOSE FACTS AND FIGURES, UM, FROM OUR COST ESTIMATORS AND THEY WORK WITH THE LATEST DATA AVAILABLE TO THEM.
UM, 'CAUSE WE KNOW THE MARKET'S CHANGING ALL THE TIME, SO WE REGULARLY GO BACK AND ABOUT UPDATE THOSE FIGURES.
MS.
SO MY SKEPTICISM CANDIDLY IS SOME OF THE HISTORY OF DSDS TREATMENT OF THEIR HISTORIC BUILDINGS THAT YOU'VE LISTED IN HERE.
UM, SO MY QUESTION IS, I GUESS AROUND THE ONGOING MAINTENANCE, SINCE YOU MENTIONED IT SINCE 1938, IT WAS ALREADY MOVING.
WHAT KIND OF EXPENSES HAVE YOU GUYS HAD IN A REALM OF ONGOING MAINTENANCE OF THE BUILDING PRIOR TO IT BEING SHUT DOWN IN 14? WE BUILT A NEW SCHOOL IN, I'M SAY, IN THE 2008 BOND.
SO THEY, IT IS BEEN VACANT SINCE LET'S SAY 2012, 2014 AS YOU MENTIONED.
SO, UH, IT'S REALLY SECURE IN THE BUILDING, OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT.
UM, AND WE STILL HAVE OTHER BUILDINGS ADJACENT TO IT.
UH, SO JUST KEEPING UP WITH THE ELECTRIC BILL, ANNUAL EXPENSES, UH, AND WHATNOT.
SO THE GYMNASIUM, THE OTHER PARTS OF THE, OF THE SCHOOL FROM THAT ORIGINAL CONSTRUCTION ARE STILL INTACT? YEAH.
AND WHEN YOU GUYS DID THE BUDGET FOR THE NEW CONSTRUCTION, DID YOU GET QUOTES AND COST ANALYSIS TO REPAIR THIS AREA? YES.
THAT, THAT'S THE INITIAL PROJECT.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE YOU'RE SAYING THEY KEPT MOVING THE BALL ON THE PRICE AS YOU GOT READY TO IMPLEMENT CONSTRUCTION? NO, WHILE WE WERE ACTIVELY IN THE CONSTRUCTION PROJECT, THEY DISCOVERED UNFORESEEN, UH, STRUCTURAL ISSUES THAT THEY CREATED.
RFI DOING CONSTRUCTION, GAVE IT BACK TO THE ENGINEERS, CAME BACK WITH A SOLUTION, UH, TRIED TO IMPLEMENT IT AND FELT IT WAS TOO DANGEROUS FOR THEM TO IMPLEMENT AND WE ENDED, ENDED UP IN THIS CYCLE.
AND IS IT YOU ALL'S POSITION HERE TODAY THAT IT'S NOT THE COST OR THE FACT THAT WHETHER THE BUILDING CAN BE REPAIRED AND TO BE SAFELY SECURED, IT'S THAT YOUR POSITION IS RESPONSIBLY BEING FIDUCIARY OF CITY DISD FUNDING? YOU DON'T RECOMMEND EXPENDING THAT AMOUNT OF FUNDING TO RESTORE THE BUILDING? LOOKING AT IT IN TOTALITY, THE COMPLETE HISTORY, IT JUST DOESN'T SEEM FEASIBLE.
EVERY TIME WE THINK WE HAVE A SOLUTION, WE UNCOVER MORE AND WE FIND OUT, LIKE SAY THE LITTLE BEAMS CAME UP IN THIS LAST FOUR ROUND, IT JUST DOESN'T SEEM PRACTICAL.
EVEN THOUGH MY ENGINEERS ARE GIVING ME THESE ONE-OFF SOLUTIONS, WE, WE, IT KEEPS GETTING MORE AND MORE UNLIKELY THAT WE CAN REPAIR THAT FROM THE SIDE.
IN MY PROFESSIONAL, I, I SHARE THE, THE REQUESTS FROM COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS, I'D LIKE TO SEE SOME OF THE RELEVANT RECENT ENGINEERING, UH, STUDIES AND DETAILS AS WELL AS SOME CONTRACTOR COSTS ON, UM, KIND OF SOME, YOU KNOW, UP TO DATE COST ON RESTORATION.
A QUESTION THAT I HAD, UM, I I THINK PERHAPS FROM MR. ALFRED, MS. KELLY SAID THAT THE ALUMNI ASSOCIATION HAS BEEN TRYING TO COMMUNICATE WITH THE SCHOOL OR DISCUSS, UM, YOU KNOW, PRESERVATION OF IT SINCE I THINK IT WAS 2012.
SO MY QUESTION IS, UM, HAVE YOU SAT DOWN WITH THEM JUST TO DETERMINE LIKE, WHAT ARE THE SACRED COWS ON THE PROPERTY? YOU KNOW, LIKE ARE THEY WANTING TO KEEP EVERYTHING AS IS OR IS IT LIKE, YOU KNOW WHAT, REALLY THE ONLY THING THAT'S IMPORTANT TO US IS THIS FRONT PORTION, THE STEPS, THE SIGN, YOU KNOW, JUST TO DETERMINE SORT OF AT THAT LEVEL WHAT THEY
[00:45:01]
WOULD FIND ACCEPTABLE IN, IN THAT WAY.WE, WE'VE HAD A MEETING WITH THE ALUMNI, UM, BUT WE DIDN'T WALK AWAY WITH ANY ACTIONABLE STEPS.
I WANTED TO CONTINUE THAT PROCESS.
ONCE I DID SOME MORE FACT FINDING.
AND THIS THING HAS BEEN SLOWLY EVOLVING.
UH, BUT, UH, AGAIN, LIKE I SAID, I DO WANNA APPROACH THE ALUMNI AGAIN, MEET WITH THEM AND SEE WHAT'S FEASIBLE, WHAT CAN BE DONE, AND WHAT MY ARCHITECT AND ENGINEER THEY'RE TELLING ME ABOUT THE BUILDING.
'CAUSE YEAH, WE DO WANNA PARTNER WITH THEM.
I MEAN, I GUESS MY, YOU KNOW, SOME OF MY THOUGHTS ARE THAT, UM, I I THINK WE HAVE TO BE VERY, UM, AWARE AND WILLING TO DISCUSS THE, THE COST TO PRESERVE THE BUILDING AND WHATEVER FORM YOU WANNA TAKE IT, WHETHER THAT IS FOR CONTINUING EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES OR IF YOU WANNA PROGRAMMATICALLY DO SOMETHING ELSE WITH IT.
ALSO MINDFUL OF THE FACT THAT EVERYTHING GOING ON IN AUSTIN, THE LAST THING YOU NEED FROM THE CITY OF DALLAS IS OPPOSITION.
SO MY RECOMMENDATION, I I, I THINK IT WOULD BE A SIZABLE TASK AT THIS POINT FOR YOU TO COME IN, UM, IN A, IN THE NEAR FUTURE WITH AN APPROPRIATE STRUCTURE TO REPLACE IT SO THAT THE DEMO PERMIT CAN BE DONE.
AT THE SAME TIME, IT DOESN'T SEEM UNREASONABLE TO BE ABLE TO SECURE THE SITE, NOT RELYING ON THE CONTRACTOR, BUT SECURING THE SITE YOURSELVES TO PREVENT IT FROM, YOU KNOW, HARM TO THE PUBLIC OR THINGS LIKE THAT.
BUT I, I CERTAINLY WOULD BE OF THE OPINION IF, IF YOU CAME IN AND SAID, LOOK, I DON'T KNOW WHAT NECESSARILY I'M GONNA DO WITH IT, BUT I KNOW I'LL BE ABLE TO GET A LOT MORE DONE.
UM, IF I HAVE X AMOUNT OF THE BUILDING GONE, THE ALUMNI ASSOCIATION AND, AND UH, YOU KNOW, JUST USING THEM SORT OF SOMEWHAT SYMBOLICALLY.
I UNDERSTAND THEY'LL DO A COUPLE DIFFERENT PUBLIC MEETINGS.
IT SEEMS LIKE THE ONLY THING THAT'S IMPORTANT ON THIS ARE, ARE THESE COUPLE OF SIDES.
COMMISSIONER IS SOMEONE ONLINE? YES.
UH, I HAVE A ONE FINAL QUESTION.
UM, ONE OF A FOLLOW UP TO WHAT COMMISSIONER SP WAS DOING WAS ASKING, UH, AND DURING, DURING ALL THIS TIME, DID UH, ANYBODY PROPOSE OR, OR PRESENT ANY CONSIDERATIONS OF WHAT THE BUILDING MIGHT BECOME IF IT WAS RESTORED SIMILAR TO WHAT, UH, CROSIER TECH, UH, HIGH SCHOOL BECAME AN OFFICE BUILDING, ET CETERA? I KNOW THAT'S IN DOWNTOWN, BUT WAS THERE ANY CONSIDERATION FOR WHAT, UH, ADAMSON COULD HAVE BECOME OR COULD BECOME IF, UH, IT WAS RESTORED TO, YOU KNOW, BRING IN FUND FUNDING FOR DISD? YEAH.
OUR DESIRE TO KEEP IT AN EDUCATIONAL FACILITY, SOMETHING LIKE BOOKER T UH, BOOKER T IS OUR PERFORMING ARTS.
WE WANTED THIS TO BE A, A VISUAL ARTS ACADEMY, AND THAT WAS OUR VISION IN THE 2020 BOND TO MAKE IT A VIABLE EDUCATIONAL SPACE.
UM, SO WE, WE WANTED TO KEEP IT AS A SCHOOL AND SOMETHING FOR, UH, OUR COMMUNITY TO BE EDUCATED IN.
AND CORGAN CAN TELL YOU MORE ABOUT THE PROGRAM AND THE TYPE OF SPACES THAT WERE GOING IN THERE.
TO ELABORATE ON THAT, UM, THE LATEST BOND PROGRAM, UM, LIKE MR. THAR WAS SAYING, WAS A VISUAL ART SCHOOL.
UM, WE HAD PLANS TO RENOVATE THE, UM, AUDITORIUM TO BE A STATE-OF-THE-ART, UH, GRAY BOX OR BLACK BOX, UM, TECHNICAL THEATER, UM, ALL SORTS OF DIGITAL, UM, PROGRAMS AS WELL THAT SUPPORT THE VISUAL ARTS.
UM, YEAH, I THINK THAT IS IT POSSIBLE THEN THAT, UH, OR HAVE Y'ALL APPROACHED ANY, UH, CORPORATIONS LIKE, UH, TOYOTA DID WITH, UH, UH, PINKSTON PINKSTON HIGH SCHOOL TO HELP IN THIS ENDEAVOR? UH, I ASKED OUR REAL ESTATE DEPARTMENT IF THEY HAD RECEIVED ANY REQUESTS FROM, UH, DEVELOPERS.
SOMETIMES THEY RECEIVE UNSOLICITED, UH, PROPOSALS.
UH, AND, YOU KNOW, HE, HE LOOKED THROUGH HIS RECORDS AND, UH, MOST OF THE DEVELOPER CONTACTS HE HAD, UH, THEY WEREN'T INTERESTED FOR, FOR VARIOUS REASONS OF THAT BUILDING.
SO WE, WE DIDN'T THINK THERE WAS A MARKET FOR IT, BUT WE HAVE NOT OFFICIALLY PUT IT OUT FOR SALE OR ANYTHING OF THAT NATURE.
I, I THINK IT MIGHT BE WORTH, UM, DISD LOOKING INTO, UH, SOME, UH, CORPORATIONS, NOT DEVELOPERS, CORPORATIONS THAT WOULD BE INTERESTED IN, UH, PARTNERING IN EDUCATIONAL, UH, WITH VISUAL ARTS, LIKE YOU SAID, UH, FOR THIS BUILDING.
COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS, ARE YOU JUST WAVING YOUR PEN AT ME? NO, I COULD BE
I HAVE COMMISSIONER CUMMINGS, COMMISSIONER RENO COMMISSIONER PRE COMMISSIONER ANDERSON.
WE'LL START FROM LEFT AND GO RIGHT.
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I SAW THAT, UH, JQ, UH, WAS INVOLVED IN SHORING DETAILS ON THIS PART OF IT.SO MY QUESTION, AND I KNOW THIS HAS KIND OF BEEN ON AND OFF ON WHAT'S THE HISTORY OF THIS, THE, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE DON'T HAVE A PIECEMEAL APPROACH TO YOUR, YOUR ANALYSIS AS WELL AS, AND AS WELL AS THE BUILDINGS STILL SITTING THERE AND POSSIBLY DETERIORATING AND BEYOND THE, ANYWAY, I'M JUST LOOKING FOR MAKE SURE WE HAVE A, UH, IN COMPREHENSIVE TOTAL, UH, SURVEY ANALYSIS FROM STRUCTURAL.
AND IT'S NOT JUST A PORTION OR PORTION, IT'S NOT JUST SHORING, IT'S NOT JUST THIS, BUT A COMPREHENSIVE IN TOTAL.
UM, SO DO WE HAVE THAT OR IS THAT SOMETHING THAT'S GONNA BE LOOKED AT AS WELL? YEAH, FOR OUR DECISIONS, YOU KNOW, IN ANY RENOVATION YOU HAVE UNFORESEEN YOU'RE ALWAYS MAKING ASSUMPTIONS.
UH, LIKE I SAID, WHEN WE LOOK BACK AT THE DRAWINGS, WE CAN'T TELL IF ALL OF THE WORK THEY, UH, PRESCRIBED THE 1938 WAS ACTUALLY FULFILLED.
UH, SO DURING THAT PART OF THE INVESTIGATION, AGAIN, THAT'S WHEN OUR CONTRACTORS BACKED OUT AND THOUGHT IT WAS UNSAFE.
WE, EVERY TIME WE, WE COME HERE, WE FEEL LIKE WE HAVE A SOLID PLAN, BUT WHEN ACTUAL WORK IS DONE, THEY UNCOVER MORE UNFORESEEN THAT CALLS US TO GO BACK TO THE
SO, SO SOMEONE'S BEEN HIRED BEFORE OR APPROACHED BEFORE TO DO A, IN TOTAL STRUCTURAL ANALYSIS SURVEY, BUT THEY HAVE STOPPED BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T FEEL SAFE AND THEY PULLED BACK AND THEY HAVE NOT GIVEN YOU ONE AT ALL AT THIS POINT, CORRECT.
THE STRUCTURAL ENGINEER WITH THE REQUEST AND YOU, AND YOU'VE BEEN ASKING FOR IT, UH, COMPREHENSIVE TOTAL SURVEY ANALYSIS FROM SOMEBODY AND, AND THEY, THEY, THEY WON'T GIVE IT TO YOU.
I GUESS OUR ENGINEERS REQUESTED SOME MORE TESTING AND HE ASKED THE CONTRACTOR TO DIG DOWN TO THE FOUNDATION SO THEY COULD, HE COULD TAKE PICTURES OF IT AND SEE, RIGHT.
THAT'S WHEN THEY, THEY REFUSED.
WELL, IN MOST CASES WHAT WE DO IS WE DO EXPLORATORY SELECTIVE, SOMETIMES SELECTIVE DEMOING AND EXPLORATORY APPROACHES, AND WE'LL ALWAYS BE ABLE TO ASCERTAIN THAT.
IS THERE A CERTAIN AMOUNT THAT'S POSSIBLY HIDDEN? THERE ALWAYS IS THOSE CASES, BUT THAT'S WHY WE DO A VERY DETAILED EXPLORATION SURVEY.
JQ IS ONE OF THE ONES THAT YOU'VE STATED.
SO, BUT I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND.
WE DON'T HAVE A TOTAL ASSESSMENT OF THE STRUCTURE FROM THEM AS IT IS TODAY.
NOT FROM FIVE YEARS AGO, 10 YEARS, 20 AGO, BUT AS IT, WHEN WAS THE LAST, IF THERE EVER WAS ONE DONE? WELL, I'LL LET COR THEM RESPOND BECAUSE THEY WERE WORKING DIRECTLY WITH JQ AND THEY, THEY, SHE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE MORE OF THOSE DETAILS.
SO, UM, THE LAST REPORT THAT WE HAVE FROM JQ WAS 2023, I BELIEVE.
UM, AND THAT WAS WHEN WE DID THE INVESTIGATIVE DEMO BECAUSE WE WERE TRYING TO DETERMINE WHERE OUR SHORING COULD TIE INTO THE BUILDING AND BE SUPPORTED YEAH.
TO DO MORE OF THE, UM, INVESTIGATIVE DEMO AND EXPLORATORY, UM, WORK SO THAT WAY WE COULD PROPOSE A STRUCTURAL SOLUTION THAT WAS MORE VIABLE.
UM, AND THAT'S WHERE WE, BUT IT'S, IT'S COMPREHENSIVE.
IT'S NOT JUST A PIECEMEAL IN CERTAIN AREAS OF THE BUILDING, IT'S MORE OF IT'S THAT'S, IT'S A WHOLE SHELL ANALYSIS BASICALLY, NOT THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW.
SO THERE COULD BE OTHER AREAS THAT ARE COMPROMISED THAT YOU HAVEN'T LOOKED AT YET.
SO IF WE MAKE A DECISION BASED UPON THE FACADE, THIS AND THAT, THERE'S POSSIBLE OTHER AREAS THAT YOU MIGHT GET INTO THAT COULD STOP AGAIN IF, IF YOU WENT FORWARD? YES, IT'S POSSIBLE, BUT WITH OUR UNDERSTANDING OF THE CURRENT DRAWINGS AND HOW THE BUILDING WAS, UM, PHASE AND ADDITIONS WERE ADDED ON, THERE ARE SECTIONS OF THE BUILDING THAT ARE STRUCTURALLY INDEPENDENT FROM THE SOUTH FACADE THAT WE FEEL ARE SAFE.
UM, BUT YES, TO YOUR POINT, WE HAVEN'T DONE A FULL, AND THE ENGINEERS FEEL SAFE FROM THEIR REPORTS THAT THEY FEEL SAFE ON THE, THE REST OF THE BUILDING FROM THEIR ANALYSIS OF THE EXISTING DRAWINGS.
BUT, UM, GOING OUT AND INVESTIGATING THE STRUCTURE OF IT IS BUILT, UM, THAT HAS, BUT THEY HAVEN'T DONE A DETAILED EXPLORATION ON ALL PARTS? CORRECT.
AND I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE LIMITS OF, OR THE BOUNDARIES OF THE, UM, THE PORTIONS OF THE, THE BUILDING THAT ARE IN THE WORST CONDITION.
UM, THE FOUNDATION, UH, I GUESS ANALYSIS WAS, UH, DONE ON THE FIRST BAY COMING OFF OF, UM, THE SOUTHERN STREET.
I, I DON'T REMEMBER THE NAME OF IT.
UM, BUT ARE THERE PORTIONS BEYOND THAT THAT YOU FEEL NEED TO BE DEMOLISHED AS WELL? IN OTHER WORDS? SO EVERYTHING IS GONNA COME DOWN, RIGHT? THAT'S, THAT'S SHOWN ON THE SITE PLAN, UM, IN THE DARK GRAY, UH, IF YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO PULL THAT UP ON THE SCREEN, IT'S NOT SURE WHAT SHEET IT IS.
CR UH, ONE TO ACTUALLY, UM, SO BECAUSE WHAT I'M IMAGINING IS, OKAY, SO THAT
[00:55:01]
FIRST BAY MAY BE THE, IN THE WORST CONDITION, BUT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TAKING THE ENTIRE BUILDING DOWN.SO THE PROTECTED FACADE OF THE FACADE, WE HAD THE ONE PROTECTED FACADE ALONG MAIN STREET.
AND THE OTHER PROTECTED FACADE, JUST THE ONE, SO THE, THE PROBLEM WE HAVE WITH THE, THE, IT'S A PROTECTIVE FACADE MM-HMM
AND THE FOUNDATION THAT'S SUPPORTING THE PROTECTIVE FACADE.
SO WHEN YOU WERE ASKING EARLIER IF YOU FEEL UNSAFE WHEN YOU'RE IN THE BUILDING, I'VE BEEN IN THERE NUMEROUS TIMES, YOU DO FEEL A LITTLE BIT UNSAFE BECAUSE IT'S SLOPED LIKE THAT.
AND YOU CAN SEE AND, AND SEE THE, THE DOORFRAMES PULLING AWAY FROM THE WALL AND THINGS LIKE WHEN YOU ARE WALKING INTO THE BUILDING.
SO THE ORIGINAL STRUCTURE WAS BUILT IN 1915.
THAT'S A PROTECTED, THAT'S THE FRONT IN 1918, I BELIEVE.
THEY BUILT THE AUDITORIUM IN THE GYM.
AND THEN IN 1938, THEY CAME BACK WITH THE TWO CLASSROOM ADDITIONS ON THE SIDE, WHICH ARE THE SCIENCE LABS AND THE ART CLASSROOMS. THEN IN 1953, THEY BUILT A COMPETITION GYM, WHICH IS CURRENTLY SO UTILIZED BY THE ADAMSON STUDENTS.
AND THEN BEYOND THAT AND THE 1980, THEY BUILT A COLLEGIATE ACADEMY AND A PUBLIC HEALTH CLINIC.
THEY'RE STILL UTILIZED BY THE PUBLIC AND IT'S OUR P TECH FOR THIS CAMPUS AS WELL.
SO IT'S DEFINITELY A LAYERED SITE FROM FRONT TO BACK.
AND THE, THE PROBLEMS WE'RE HAVING IS WITH THE FRONT PROTECTED POSITION.
UM, BUT SO FOR INSTANCE, IN THE, IN THE BUDGETS, IN THE CONSTRUCTION COSTS TO, UH, TO BOTH SHORE UP THE EXISTING AND THEN, AND THEN REPLACE IT, UM, IT'S PRIMARILY ON THAT, UM, ON THE ELEVATION.
SO I GUESS MY NEXT QUESTION IS, AT WHAT POINT, GOING BACK INTO THE BUILDING, DOES IT BECOME STABLE? IS IT JUST THAT FIRST BAY STRUCTURAL BAY COMING THAT'S PARALLEL WITH, UH, NINTH STREET? IT'S, YEAH, IT'S THE, WITH THE FRONT ALONG NINTH STREET MM-HMM
I WOULD DEFER TO THE ARCHITECT AND THE ENGINEER TO SAY AT WHAT POINT IT UNSTABLE BUT OBSERVATIONALLY IT'S, IT, RIGHT.
IT SLOPES FROM THE AUDITORIUM FORWARD.
SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING RIGHT THERE AT THAT CONNECTION BETWEEN THE 1915 STRUCTURE AND AUDITORIUM.
UM, WE DID HAVE TO DO SOME INVESTIGATIVE DEMO IN THE AUDITORIUM FOR SOME WORK THAT WAS RELATED TO THE PROPOSED GRAY BOX TECHNICAL THEATER.
UM, AND WHILE WE WERE WORKING ON THAT, THE, THE CONTRACTOR DID POST SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT IS THIS SAFE? WILL ALL OF OUR CONSTRUCTION NOISE AND RATTLING THINGS AROUND AND THE AUDITORIUM IMPACT THAT SOUTHERN FACADE? AND OUR STRUCTURAL ENGINEER READ THE DOCUMENT THAT THEY HAD ON HAND AND THEY FELT THAT EVERYTHING FROM THE AUDITORIUM NORTH, UM, WAS INDEPENDENT AND SAFE AND WOULD NOT BE IMPACTED BY, UM, THE FAILURES HAPPENING ALONG THE SOUTH SIDE.
AND, AND THE MOVEMENT FROM THE FRONT FACADE CREATES FEATHER ISSUES THAT WE HAD, FOG, SEA WATER INTRU ACHIEVED.
UH, SO MY RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE TO ALSO FOR WHEN YOU COME BACK TO US IS TO BRING THE ENGINEERS WITH YOU BOTH AG AND E AND J TWO SO THEY CAN ANSWER THE MORE TECHNICAL ENGINEERING QUESTIONS.
UM, FOR US TO BE ABLE TO MAKE A DECISION ONE WAY OR THE OTHER, I I WOULD LIKE YOU TO REVISIT THE, UH, THE, EXCUSE ME JUST LISTED ON THE NATIONAL REGISTER.
I WOULD LIKE YOU TO, UM, REVISIT THE TAX CREDITS.
YOU CAN GET 45% TAX CREDIT, WHICH CUTS THE RENOVATION COSTS IN HALF.
UH, MAYBE PARTNERING, BUT IT HAS TO BE INCOME PRODUCING GENERALLY SPEAKING.
BUT IF YOU'D GONE THE TEXAS TO COMMISSION IN AUSTIN, FIND THE WAY WE CAN GET CREATIVE WITH THAT.
BUT EVEN IF IT WOULD BE LEASED TO SOME OTHER ENTITY THAT IS, UM, INCOME PRODUCING, POSSIBLY THE BUILDING COULD BE SOLD TO SOMEBODY WHO WANTS TO MAKE IT INTO OFFICE OR OR ANOTHER SCHOOL.
UM, BUT IF IT'S INCOME PRODUCING, YOU CAN GET 45% TAX CREDIT, 20 FROM NATIONAL REGISTER AND 25 FROM THE STATE.
YOU PROBABLY KNOW THAT ALREADY.
I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING YOU MIGHT EXPLORE.
IF THERE STILL IS MONEY IN THE BOND PACKAGE FOR THIS, YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO LEVERAGE THAT MONEY WITH THE OTHER.
UM, IT'S KIND OF A CREATIVE SOLUTION, BUT I THINK WE NEED TO EXPLORE THAT ALSO BEFORE WE SAY THE BILLING'S GOTTA GO.
I THINK WE HAVE EXHAUSTED WHAT WE CAN SAY TO, TO SUM UP.
YOU HAVE LEARNED OUR BASIS FOR JUDGMENT WHEN YOU COME BACK AND ASK FOR DEMOLITION OF THIS.
YOU HAVE ALSO LEARNED THAT WE WANNA SEE DOCUMENTATION FROM ALL THE EXPERTS WHO SAY IT'S GOING TO FALL DOWN AND THINGS
[01:00:01]
LIKE THAT.BECAUSE WELL, PEOPLE JUST SAY THINGS, WE WANNA SEE SOMEBODY WITH A STAMP, MAKE AN OFFICIAL DOCUMENT, STAKE THEIR REPUTATION ON IT.
WE ALSO ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE HISTORY OF THE CARE OF THIS BUILDING BECAUSE DEMOLITION BY NEGLECT IS WHEN YOU FAIL TO CARE FOR YOUR HISTORIC STRUCTURE AND THEN IT JUST GETS WORSE.
WE DID LANDMARK THIS IN 2011 AND BY 2012 IT WAS CLOSED AND DOESN'T SEEM LIKE MUCH HAS HELPED IT YET.
SO THAT WE CANNOT HELP BUT BE CONCERNED ABOUT THAT.
YOU KNOW WHAT, WE KNOW ABOUT THAT HISTORY.
AND FINALLY, I KNOW IT'S A REAL BIG THING TO THINK ABOUT, BUT IF THERE WAS A WAY YOU COULD GET SOMEBODY TO WANT TO PUT A FOR-PROFIT USE IN THERE AND GET THE TAX CREDITS, THAT MIGHT SOLVE EVERYTHING TO EVERYBODY'S SATISFACTION.
'CAUSE CLEARLY THE ALUMNI AND OTHER PEOPLE, THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMUNITY WILL HAVE AN INTEREST IN THIS.
I SUSPECT THAT WHEN IT'S ON THE AGENDA, IF YOU COME BACK AND ASK FOR IT TO, FOR THE FINAL RULE OF DEMOLITION, WE WILL HAVE MORE SPEAKERS HERE WHO HAVE OTHER THINGS TO SAY ABOUT IT THAN, THAN WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY ABOUT IT.
SO YOU ARE NOW PREPARED AND WE WILL, WE'D LOVE TO SEE YOU BACK WITH A SOLUTION, BUT WE LIKE WHAT WE KNOW.
YOU'LL PROBABLY HAVE TO COME BACK WITH WHAT YOU'RE READY TO ASK FOR AND WE'LL SEE WHAT HAPPENS THEN.
AND WE'RE ALL REAL NICE, BUT NOT ALWAYS.
IF YOU LEAVE WITH AN IMPRESSION, WE'RE NOT.
NOW WE CAN DO CR TWO AND I THINK COMMISSIONER TAYLOR HAS TO RECUSE.
COMMISSIONER TAYLOR IS RECUSING ON THIS ONE.
RHONDA DUNN PRESENTING ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF.
THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS CITED AT ONE 19 ANTHONY STREET IN THE 10TH STREET NEIGHBORHOOD HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE CASE NUMBER IS CR 2 4 5 DASH 0 1 9 RD, THE REQUEST.
THIS IS A COURTESY REVIEW, SO THE REQUEST IS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT CORNER LOT WITH A REAR ATTACHED ONE CAR GARAGE.
STAFF RECOMMENDATION, SINCE THIS IS A COURTESY REVIEW, NO ACTION IS REQUIRED AND THE RE RECOMMENDATION IS THAT, OR IT'S NOT REALLY A RECOMMENDATION.
BUT ANYWAY, THAT A REQUEST TO CONSTRUCT A NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT CORNER LOT WITH A REAR ATTACHED ONE CAR GARAGE BE CONCEPTUALLY APPROVED.
SANDS, THE ATTACHED GARAGE WITH THE UNDERSTANDING THAT THE FINAL DESIGN AS WELL AS ASSOCIATED SITE PLANS, ELEVATIONS, RENDERINGS, AND DETAILS ARE TO BE SUBMITTED FOR LANDMARK COMMISSION REVIEW.
TASK FORCE FEEDBACK, COURTESY REVIEW, COMMENTS ONLY, SUPPORTIVE COMMENTS.
NUMBER ONE, DETACHED GARAGE FROM MAIN BUILDING.
NUMBER TWO PAIR WINDOWS ON FRONT PORCH AND CENTER THEM BETWEEN PORCH COLUMNS.
NUMBER THREE, ADD A THIRD WINDOW TO RIGHT FRONT BUMP OUT CREATING A YANG WINDOW.
NUMBER FOUR, VERIFY SELECT PAINT COLORS, BODY AND TRIM FIVE, VERIFY ROOF PITCH.
ALRIGHT, AND WE DO HAVE, UM, A REGISTERED SPEAKER FOR THIS SHANNON KEY, WHO WE'VE ALL MET BEFORE ONLINE
I'M ALSO MISSING ADRIAN TO TELL ME WHETHER OR NOT MS. KEY IS ONLINE.
I, THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE MOVING PEOPLE OVER PANELIST, BUT I DON'T SEE AGAINST KEITH.
I'M JUST WAITING FOR MY, UM, CAMERA, UM, IMAGE TO BE ON CAMERA TO BE UNLOCKED.
CAM, YOU KNOW HOW I LOST ONLY WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO MOVE THAT STUFF.
WHAT'S THE NAME OF THE PERSON, SHANNON? SHE'S GOT HER PHONE THERE.
SHE JUST TOLD ME
I LEFT MY REGISTERED SPEAKERS LIST UP THERE, SO I'M TRYING TO PULL IT UP.
WELL, I DON'T SEE SHANNON KEY, BUT I DO SEE HER SQUARE ON THE SCREEN.
SO IF YOU COULD TURN YOUR CAMERA
[01:05:01]
ON MS. KEY.UM, I NEED YOUR NAME, YOUR ADDRESS, AND, UM, YOU PROMISE YOU THE, TELL THE TRUTH.
UM, 1409 HAM Z, APARTMENT 5 0 3, DALLAS, TEXAS 7 5 2 1 5.
NOW YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES TO TELL US ANYTHING FURTHER YOU WANT TO TELL US ABOUT YOUR PROJECT, AND THEN WE WILL ASK YOU SOME QUESTIONS AND GIVE YOU SOME FEEDBACK ABOUT WHAT WE THINK OF YOUR PROPOSAL SO FAR.
SO, UM, FOR 1 1 9 ANTHONY, UM, WE HAVE A HOUSE THAT WE'RE DEVELOPING ON THE CORNER OF ANTHONY AND NOAH.
UM, WE HAVE A SIMPLE THREE BEDROOM, TWO BATH WITH A PORCH FRONTING ON ANTHONY STREET.
UM, DURING OUR COURTESY REVIEW PROCESS, WE, UM, HAD RECOMMENDATIONS TO ADJUST THE WINDOW PLACEMENTS IN THE FRONT, WHICH WE'VE DONE LOWERED THE PITCH ROOF, WHICH WE'VE DONE AND DEF AND REDEFINED OUR PAINT COLORS MORE.
UM, AND THEN ADD AN ADDITIONAL COLUMN ON THE, ON THE PORCH.
UM, ONE OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS WE'RE STILL WORKING ON IS THE REQUEST TO CRASH THE GARAGE.
UM, WE FEEL THAT THE UNIQUE CORNER POSITION OF THIS LOT WOULD ALLOW US TO ENTER FROM THE REAR SIDE OF THE PROPERTY.
UM, AND WE DON'T WANNA AFFECT THE ARCHITECTURAL STYLE OF THE HOME FROM THE STREET VIEW.
WE ALSO FEEL THAT DETACHING A GARAGE MAY CAUSE A CONFLICT WITH BUILDING IN INSPECTIONS DUE TO SETBACK REQUIREMENTS.
SO WE'RE ASKING FOR THAT TO DEFINITELY BE, UM, PUT IN CONSIDERATION ON THE, UM, ON THE DETACHING, ON DETACHING THE GARAGE.
BUT WE HAVE, UM, MADE THE ADJUSTMENTS THAT WERE REQUESTED OR, UM, OR REQUIRED OF US FROM THE, UM, LAST, UM, MEETING WE HAD WITH COURTESY REVIEW.
NOW, COMMISSIONERS, WHAT QUESTIONS OR ADVICE DO YOU HAVE FOR OUR APPLICANT COMMISSIONER RENO? UM, I HAVE A COUPLE OF CON, UM, SUGGESTIONS.
I REALIZE THAT'S A KITCHEN THERE ON THE FRONT, UM, UH, UNDERNEATH THE PORCH, BUT TYPICALLY A GANGED WINDOW THERE WHERE THE GAP OF ABOUT FOUR INCHES BETWEEN EACH WINDOW RATHER THAN ONE FOOT EIGHT INCHES WOULD BE A LOT MORE, UH, KEEPING IN CHARACTER, UM, WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, ANOTHER SUGGESTION WAS ON THE, I KNOW YOU HAVE A LIMITED LOT SIZE.
UM, I'M NOT QUITE SURE WHAT THE DIMENSION IS RIGHT NOW BETWEEN THE, THE REAR LOT LINE AND, AND THE, THE EDGE OF THE GARAGE, BUT GENERALLY IT CAN BE THREE FEET TO FIVE FEET.
SO I THINK THERE WOULD BE A REASONABLE GAP BETWEEN A A A ONE CAR GARAGE AND THE BUILDING ITSELF IF YOU WERE TO DETACH IT.
UM, AND THEN, UM, I ALSO NOTICED, AND I'M NOT SURE IF MAYBE TASK FORCE OR OR ANOTHER GROUP HAD PICKED THIS UP, BUT THE, UM, THE WINDOW HEADS ON ALL THE WINDOWS EXCEPT FOR THE ONES ON THE FRONT ALIGNED WITH THE FRONT DOOR AND THEN THE ONES ON THE SIDE ARE AT LEAST A FOOT HIGHER IF THOSE HEAD HEIGHTS COULD BE ALIGNED INSTEAD OF, BECAUSE EVEN IN ONE IN THE LIVING ROOM YOU HAVE TWO DIFFERENT HEIGHTS OF, OF WINDOWS, SAME SIZE WINDOWS, BUT THEY'RE A LOT HIGHER ON THE WALL.
AND WHAT WAS THE LAST ONE? UNIFORMITY ALL AROUND THE HOUSE.
I, I THINK IT WOULD, YEAH, IT WOULD JUST LOOK A LITTLE MORE HARMONIOUS.
UM, THEN THE LAST ONE, WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE WAY THAT THE, THE, THE LOWER ROOF ON THE PORCH, UH, TIES INTO THE, TO THE NEXT MAIN PIECE OF THE ROOF, UM, THERE'S NO OVERHANG THERE.
I KNOW IT'S A CONTINUOUS SLOPE OR RATHER TWO DIFFERENT SLOPES, BUT, UM, IT LOOKS LIKE THE HIP ON THE, THE MAIN PORTION OF THE HOUSE STOPS FLUSH WITH THE WALL AND IT OUGHT TO COME FORWARD TOO AND THEN CONTINUE ONTO THE PORCH.
DOES THAT, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? I WAS LOOKING AT IT FROM THE SIDE ELEVATION.
IT LOOKS LIKE THE, THE, THE OVERHANG IS EVEN, THERE IS NO OVERHANG.
UH, AND THEN IT CONTINUES INTO THE PORCH.
IT'S JUST GONNA BE AN ODD CONDITION WHEN YOU BUILD IT IN THREE DIMENSIONS.
ANYBODY ELSE? COMMISSIONER ANDERSON? I DO HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT THE MASSING OF THE BUILDING.
I THINK THE ATTACHED GARAGE MAKES THIS LOOK MUCH LARGER THAN IT REALLY IS.
AND IT ALSO APPEARS THAT THE PROPERTY IS SLAB ON GRADE AND IT NEEDS TO HAVE AT LEAST AN 18 INCH FOUNDATION HEIGHT.
I THINK BY BREAKING APART THE GARAGE FROM THE HOUSE, GIVING THE HOUSE THE PROPER FOUNDATION HEIGHT, BECAUSE I KNOW THE FOUNDATION IS PROBABLY DICTATED BY THE SLAB FOR THE GARAGE.
[01:10:01]
I WOULD LIKE TO EX EXPLORE A DETACHED GARAGE AND RAISING THE FOUNDATION AT LEAST 18 INCHES TO GIVE IT A LITTLE MORE PRESENCE AS THEY ARE TYPICALLY IN THAT NEIGHBORHOOD.I BELIEVE WE ORIGINALLY HAD IT AS SLAB ON GRADE, BUT I BELIEVE, AND DR. DUNN CAN CORRECT ME THAT WE WERE INSTRUCTION INSTRUCTED TO CHANGE IT TO APPEAR ON BEAM.
YEAH, THAT'S WHAT HE'S SAYING.
IT APPEARS THAT THE, THE, THE FOUNDATION IS SET BY THE GARAGE UHHUH
THE FOUNDATION, I BELIEVE WE WERE CONSIDERING THAT, UM, WE WERE JUST WAITING FOR THE RECOMMENDATION, BUT I BELIEVE WE WERE ALREADY DISCUSSING, UM, CHANGING THE, UM, FOUNDATION TYPE.
I JUST WANTED TO ELIMINATE THAT, THAT DESIGN.
THERE IS A, THERE IS A FOUNDATION DRAWING THAT INDICATES A FOUNDATION DRAWING, UM, THAT INDICATES A, A POST IN BEAM, UM, WHICH IS VERY TYPICAL TO TO 10TH STREET, UM, WHICH IS BETTER THAN A SLAB.
IT'S EVEN BETTER THAN PIER AND BEAM, UH, IN TERMS OF THE WAY THAT THE OTHER HOMES IN THAT, THAT NEIGHBORHOOD WERE BUILT.
SO IT IS CONSISTENT, UM, AS IT'S DRAWN.
I THINK I NEED A CLARIFICATION.
ARE WE SAYING THAT THERE IS A DIFFERENTIATION BETWEEN THE HOUSE FOUNDATION AND THE SLAB FOR THE GARAGE OR IT ALL THE SAME DIMEN, SAME HEIGHT? I DON'T THINK THEY CAN BE, THERE SHOULD BE ONE SLAB, WHICH WOULD MEAN THAT IT WOULD BE, THE GARAGE IS DICTATING THE HEIGHT OF THE HOUSE.
UM, THE HOUSE RIGHT THERE ARE MISSING SOME STEPS BECAUSE THE, THE HOUSE IS NOT A SLAB, THE ONLY, THE GARAGE IS, I THINK SOME OF THE EXTERIOR DRAWINGS MAKE IT LOOK LIKE IT'S ALL KIND OF SITTING ON THE GROUND, EVEN THOUGH THE ACTUAL PLAN FOR THE FOUNDATION JUST SHOW IT BEING A OG BEAM AT 18 INCHES OF OAK GRAVE.
WELL, LET ME ASK YOU ANOTHER QUESTION THEN.
WHAT IS THE FOUNDATION HEIGHT AT THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE? WHAT IS THE HEIGHT OF THE FOUNDATION? GIVE ME ONE SECOND TO PULL UP.
SO CAN I SHARE MY SCREEN BECAUSE I, I LEAVE MY SCREEN, IT'S GONNA GO DARK.
SHOULD I SHARE IT OR SHOULD I LOOK MY SCREEN? OH,
SHE SHOULD BE ABLE TO SHARE BECAUSE SHE'S A PANELIST.
UH, IS KIND OF BASED ON HOW SHE, WHAT IS SHE ON A COMPUTER OR A PHONE? I'M NOT SURE.
SHANNON, ARE YOU ON YOUR COMPUTER? SHE'S ALSO NO LONGER ON SCREEN.
YEAH, IT, IT SHOULD ALLOW HER, 'CAUSE IT, SHE'S A PANELIST SO SHE SHOULD BE ABLE TO SHARE AT THIS POINT.
IT SEEMS LIKE SHE'S NOT WHAT LOOKS LIKE A EXTENSION.
IF Y'ALL COULD HANG ON A MINUTE, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE ARCHITECTS.
BECAUSE THIS FOUNDATION PLAN SAYS PIERRON BEAMED 18 INCHES ABOVE GRADE.
DOESN'T THAT MEAN THAT THE FOUNDATION HEIGHT AT THE FRONT IS 18 INCHES? OR DOES IT SOMEHOW NOT MEAN THAT TO ME? OKAY, SO THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION IS ALREADY HERE IT'S 18 INCHES HIGH.
THE DRAWINGS DON'T LOOK AT THE, THE RENDERINGS DON'T LOOK LIKE IT'S 18 INCHES, BUT THE PLANS THAT MATTER SAY IT WILL BE 18 INCHES, WELL THEN THE, THEN THE EL, THEN THE ELEVATION, YOU REFLECT THAT AND NOT LOOK LIKE A SLAB.
SO ALL WE REALLY ACTUALLY NEED MS. KEY, ASIDE FROM YOUR FACE TO BE BACK ONLINE IS THAT, UM, THE FUTURE, UH, DEPICTIONS OF WHAT IT WILL LOOK AT FROM THE OUTSIDE WILL ACCURATELY REFLECT THINGS LIKE HOW THAT IT'S 18 INCHES OFF THE GROUND SO THAT WE CAN REALLY SEE WHAT IT'S GONNA BE.
AND THAT'S PROBABLY A COMPUTER ISSUE AS WE ALL KNOW, THEY'RE AT FAULT FOR EVERYTHING.
ARE YOU STILL WITH US MS. KEY? ARE YOU STILL WITH US? I SEE HER TOWEL.
I'M WONDERING WHETHER SHE'S STRUGGLING WITH A COMPUTER ISSUE OR, I STILL THINK IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO HAVE THE, THE GARAGE DISCONNECTED FROM THE HOUSE SO IT WOULD NOT BE AS MASSIVE AS IT IS 'CAUSE IT'S REALLY
[01:15:01]
MORE MASSIVE THAN A 10TH STREET HOUSE TYPICALLY IS.OH, THIS IS WHEATLEY PLACE I THINK, RIGHT? NO, THIS IS 10TH STREET.
OKAY, SO, UM, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN STILL HEAR US MS. KEY.
UH, ARE THERE ANY OTHER COMMENTS THAT WE'RE HAVING A LITTLE TROUBLE NOW COMMUNICATING? OKAY, SO I THINK THAT THOSE ARE OUR SUGGESTIONS FOR, FOR WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE WHEN THIS PLAN COMES BACK FOR ITS REAL APPROVAL AND, UM, ANY, ANY QUESTIONS MS. KEY HAS SINCE OF OUR COMMUNICATION ISSUES, SHE CAN WORK WITH DR. DUNN FOR THAT.
IN THAT CASE WE'LL MOVE ON TO DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER FOUR, WHICH I KNOW IS INTENSE.
DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER FOUR IS INTENSE STREET.
ALL RIGHT, GOOD AFTERNOON AGAIN, THIS IS DR.
RHONDA DUNN PRESENTING DISCUSSION ITEM D FOUR.
THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS CITED AT 1 0 2 NORTH CLIFF STREET IN THE 10TH STREET NEIGHBORHOOD HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE CASE NUMBER IS CA 2 4 5 DASH 360 6 RD, THE REQUEST, THERE'S SIX BUT THE FIRST ONE, THE FIRST REQUEST IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL PERIMETER FENCING, LANDSCAPING AND HARDSCAPING IN REAR AND SIDE YARDS.
THE SECOND REQUEST IS FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REMOVE AND OR REPLACE UNDOCUMENTED SECOND FLOOR REAR ADDITION WITH METAL LANDING AND RAILING.
MAINLY IT'S REMOVE AND REPLACE ON THAT ONE.
REQUEST NUMBER THREE, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE NON HISTORIC WINDOWS WITH ALUMINUM CLAD REPLACEMENT WINDOWS LIGHT CONFIGURATION NINE OVER ONE ON FRONT ELEVATION AND ONE OVER ONE ON SIDE AND REAR ELEVATIONS TOTAL 33 WINDOWS.
THE FOURTH REQUEST IS A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE SECOND STORY FRONT BALCONY AND RAILING.
THE FIFTH REQUEST IS FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE EXTERIOR DOORS INCLUDING REPLACING SECOND STORY REAR RIGHT REAR RIGHT WINDOW COVERED BY ABOVE MENTIONED ADDITION WITH A DOOR FOR EGRESS FROM SECOND FLOOR DWELLING UNIT.
TOTAL NUMBER OF DOORS TO BE REPLACED.
REQUEST NUMBER SIX, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REMOVE PAINT FROM MASONRY ON ALL ELEVATIONS AND FROM METAL ROOF TILES OVER FRONT BALCONY.
THE STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS ARE AS FOLLOWS FOR REQUEST NUMBER ONE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL PERIMETER FENCING, LANDSCAPING AND HARDSCAPING IN REAR INSIDE YARDS BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 4 22 20 25 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
ONE THAT AN ABOVE GRADE MASONRY PAVER SYSTEM, NOT GRAVEL BE INSTALLED FOR THE REAR YARD PARKING SURFACE TO PROTECT EXISTING MATURE TREES.
THE NEXT CONDITION THAT NATIVE GROUND COVER AS OPPOSED TO TREES BE PLANTED IN THE PARKWAY ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF MAIN BUILDING FACING EAST 10TH STREET.
AND THREE THAT THE LEFT WEST SIDE YARD, GATE AND FENCE BE A MINIMUM OF 10 FEET BACK FROM THE FRONT FACADE OF THE MAIN BUILDING.
IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA SECTIONS C, FH AND K UNDER SITE AND SITE ELEMENTS, THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
THE SECOND STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REMOVE AND REPLACE UNDOCUMENTED SECOND FLOOR REAR ADDITION WITH METAL LANDING AND RAILING BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 4 22 20 25.
THE PROPOSED WORK IS CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERION, SECTION C UNDER FACADES THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
[01:20:01]
THREE THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE NON HISTORIC WINDOWS WITH ALUMINUM CLAD REPLACEMENT WINDOWS LIGHT CONFIGURATION NINE OVER ONE ON FRONT ELEVATION AND ONE OVER ONE ON SIDE AND REAR ELEVATIONS TOTAL 33 BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 4 22 20 25 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.ONE THAT REPLACEMENT WINDOWS BE EITHER ALL WOOD FRAMED OR ALL ALUMINUM FRAMED NOT CLAD.
AND TWO, THAT EXISTING WINDOW OPENINGS NOT BE INFIL OR ENCLOSED IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA SECTIONS A AND B UNDER UNDER FENESTRATION AND OPENINGS THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 SUBDIVISION G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
RECOMMENDATION FOUR THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE SECOND STORY FRONT BALCONY AND RAILING BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 4 22 20 25 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
ONE THAT REPLACEMENT WOOD IS AN EXACT MATCH IN PROFILE DIMENSIONS AND MATERIAL TO THE EXISTING WOOD.
AND TWO, THAT CENTRAL COLUMN BE PLACED ON EACH SIDE OF THE BALCONY TO TOTAL TO MATCH THE EXISTING LAYOUT OR DESIGN.
AND FOR STRUCTURAL SUPPORT, IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA SECTIONS A AND B UNDER PORCHES AND BALCONIES.
THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 SUBDIVISION G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION RECOMMENDATION FIVE THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE EXTERIOR DOORS INCLUDING REPLACING SECOND STORY REAR RIGHT WINDOW COVERED BY ABOVE MENTIONED ADDITION WITH A DOOR FOR EGRESS FROM SECOND FLOOR DWELLING UNIT.
TOTAL EIGHT DOORS BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 4 22 20 25.
THE PROPOSED WORK IS CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERION, SECTION A UNDER FENESTRATION AND OPENINGS THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBSECTION G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
AND FINALLY, OKAY
THE PROPOSED WORK IE METHOD IS INCONSISTENT WITH PRE WITH PRESERVATION CRITERION SECTION I UNDER FACADES THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 SUBDIVISION G SIX C ROMAN ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR REHABILITATION.
OKAY, COMMISSIONER TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION NUMBER ONE THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL PERIMETER FENCING, LANDSCAPING, AND HARDSCAPING IN REAR INSIDE YARDS BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION THAT PAVER SYSTEM BE USED AS OPPOSED TO GRAVEL FOR PARKING SURFACE IN REAR YARD.
NUMBER TWO, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REMOVE REPLACE UNDOCUMENTED SECOND FLOOR REAR EDITION WITH METAL LANDING AND RAILING BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED.
NUMBER THREE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE NON HISTORIC WINDOWS WITH ALUMINUM CLAD REPLACEMENT WINDOWS LIGHT CONFIGURATION NINE OVER ONE ON FRONT ELEVATION AND ONE OVER ONE ON SIDE AND REAL ELEVATIONS TOTAL 33 BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION THAT WINDOWS SPECIFICATIONS BE PROVIDED.
NUMBER FOUR, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE SECOND STORY FRONT BALCONY AND RAILING BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED.
[01:25:01]
FIVE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE EXTERIOR DOORS INCLUDING REPLACING SECOND STORY REAR RIGHT WINDOW COVERED BY ABOVE MENTIONED EDITION WITH A DOOR FOR EGRESS FROM SECOND FLOOR DWELLING UNIT TOTAL EIGHT BE APPROVED AS SUBMITTED.NUMBER SIX, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS TO REMOVE PAINT FROM MASONRY ON ALL ELEVATIONS AND FROM METAL ROOF TILE TILES OVER FRONT BALCONY BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITION THAT SPECIFICATIONS AND DETAILS OF THE CLEANING REMOVAL PROCESS BE PROVIDED.
THERE'S A NOTE APPLICANT REQUESTS THAT LANDMARK COMMISSION CONSIDER ALUMINUM CLA REPLACEMENT WINDOWS.
ALL RIGHT, WE ALSO HAVE, UH, TWO SPEAKERS SIGNED UP FOR THIS.
UM, WHO CAN COME FORWARD? UH, PEEN YANG.
AND I'LL ASK YOU TO TELL US YOUR NAME PROPERLY PRONOUNCED, I'M SURE I MISSED, AND YOUR ADDRESS AND THEN PROMISE SWEAR AFFIRM YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH.
MY NAME IS B YANG, MY ADDRESS IS 5 1 7 SOUTH BEND AVENUE.
SO YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES NOW TO TELL US MORE ABOUT YOUR PROJECT.
SO I AM WITH BILLING COMMUNITY WORKSHOP.
WE ARE A 5 0 1 C3 NONPROFIT COMMUNITY DESIGN CENTER BASED HERE DALLAS.
AND WE'RE THE ARCHITECT AND DESIGNERS FOR 1 0 2
UM, AND SO I'D LIKE TO USE THIS TIME TO ADDRESS SOME ITEMS LISTED IN THE CONDITIONS OF APPEAL.
OH, THEY WANT ME TO ASK YOU TO RESTART, JUST TO ANNOY YOU.
NO, BECAUSE THE RULES SAY YOU MUST RESTART WITH YOUR NAME, ADDRESS, AND PROMISE AND ALL THAT.
I LIVE AT 5 1 7 SOUTH VERNON AVENUE AND I PROMISE TO TELL THE TRUTH.
OKAY, NOW,
WE ARE A 5 0 1 C3 NONPROFIT COMMUNITY DESIGN CENTER BASED HERE IN DALLAS.
AND WE ARE THE ARCHITECTS AND DESIGNERS FOR THIS PROJECT.
UM, AND I'D LIKE TO USE THIS TIME TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE ITEMS LISTED IN THE CONDITIONS OF APPROVAL AND REQUEST FROM THE LANDMARK COMMISSION TO CONSIDER SOME ALTERNATIVES TO A FEW OF THE CONDITIONS.
UM, SO CONDITION ITEM NUMBER FOUR AROUND THE REPLACEMENT OF THE EXISTING GUARDRAIL TO MATCH WHAT IS CURRENTLY THERE.
UM, WE DON'T FEEL LIKE THAT WOULD BE THE BEST OUTCOME FOR THE BUILDING.
UM, THROUGH OUR HISTORIC RESEARCH, WE FOUND A CLEAR PHOTO OF THE EXISTING BUILDING THAT SHOWS THE ORIGINAL CONDITION OF THE RAILING.
UM, THERE ARE RELATIVELY FEW DEFINING CHARACTERISTICS ON THE BUILDING AND THE RAILING BEING ONE OF THEM.
AND SO WE FEEL IT'S IMPORTANT TO RETAIN THOSE ASPECTS AS THEY WERE ORIGINALLY.
UM, WE DON'T CONSIDER THE RAILING THAT IS CURRENTLY THERE TO BE HISTORIC.
UM, IT IS AN OFF THE SHELF PRODUCT, SOMETHING THAT YOU COULD FIND FROM HOME DEPOT.
UM, AND WE ARE LOOKING TO REPLICATE THE RAILING AS IT'S SHOWN IN THE PHOTO AND ARE LOOKING INTO PROPRIETARY RAILING SYSTEMS TO MITIGATE ANY STRUCTURAL CONCERNS AROUND THE RAILING NOT HAVING A COLUMN.
UM, I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO ADDRESS CONDITION ITEM ONE AROUND THE FENCE ON THE NORTHERN SIDE.
UH, WE'D LIKE TO REQUEST IF IT'D BE POSSIBLE TO INCLUDE IN OUR CONDITIONS TO LEAVE THE FENCE IN ITS CURRENT LOCATION IF THE HEIGHT IS REDUCED TO THREE FOOT SIX AS IT'S REQUIRED IN THE ORDINANCE.
AND THEN LASTLY, UM, ITEM NUMBER THREE, AROUND THE MATERIAL OF THE REPLACEMENT WINDOWS.
WE ARE REQUESTING THE COMMISSION CONSIDER ALUMINUM CLAD WOOD, EXTERIOR WOOD, INTERIOR WINDOWS, MAINLY AROUND OUR CONCERN FOR THE LONG-TERM DURABILITY AND MAINTENANCE FOR THE WINDOWS.
UM, AND THERE WAS A CONCERN AROUND, UM, WATER INFILTRATION BETWEEN THE ALUMINUM AND THE WOOD.
UM, WE HAVE BEEN SPEAKING WITH THE WINDOW MANUFACTURER, MARVIN, UH, WHO WE'VE SPECKED IN OUR APPLICATION WHO HAS LET US KNOW THAT THE WEATHER STRIPPING AND THE WINDOW PREVENTS ANY WATER INFILTRATION.
AND THE WINDOW PRODUCT HAS ALSO BEEN TESTED BY AN INDEPENDENT MANUFACTURING AGENCY THAT TESTS THESE WINDOWS PERFORMANCE AGAINST HIGH WINDS AND WATER TO ENSURE IT CAN WITHSTAND THESE CONDITIONS, WHICH WE HAVE ALSO INCLUDED IN OUR APPLICATION.
UM, IF THE COMMISSION WOULD LIKE, UM, DENIES THIS REQUEST, UM, WE HAVE PROVIDED AN ALL WINDOW SPEC AS AN ALTERNATIVE.
UM, WE ARE NOT CONSIDERING ALL ALUMINUM OR ALL METAL.
AND WE'LL PROBABLY HAVE QUESTIONS.
MA'AM, WE HAVE A SECOND SPEAKER REGISTERED AIDEN CHAVEZ.
HELLO, MY NAME IS LAN CHAVEZ AND MY ADDRESS 1414 BELL BU STREET AND I PROMISE YOU TO TELL THE TRUTH.
AND I'M HERE MERELY TO ANSWER ANY, UH, INSTRUCTION QUESTIONS REGARDING THIS PROJECT.
[01:30:01]
THE CONTRACTOR OR IN CHARGE OF OVERSEEING? NO, I'M WITH BUILDING COMMITTEE WORKSHOP AND, UM, YOU KNOW, OFFICE PAYING.ALRIGHT, COMMISSIONERS QUESTIONS.
I HAD A QUESTION FOR STAFF ACTUALLY.
UM, ON ITEM NUMBER FOUR OR REQUEST NUMBER FOUR, CONDITION NUMBER TWO, UH, THAT A CENTRAL COLUMN BE PLACED ON EACH SIDE OF THE BALCONY TO TOTAL.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE HISTORIC PHOTOGRAPHS, THERE IS NO CENTRAL COLUMN.
ANYBODY ELSE? COMMISSIONER PREZI
SO THERE WAS A, A QUESTION THAT CAME UP IN THE BRIEFING THIS MORNING ABOUT THE MEDIA BLASTING AND WHAT THE MEDIA WOULD ACTUALLY BE.
SO IF YOU COULD GIVE US SOME INFORMATION ON IT.
AND FIRST I WANNA SAY THANK YOU FOR WORKING TO REMOVE THE PAINT 'CAUSE I THINK THAT'S GONNA MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE IN THIS BUILDING AND I'D LOVE TO SEE WHEN PAINTED PAINTED BRICK COMES BACK TO ITS ORIGINAL BRICK.
AND, UM, SO THANK YOU FOR DOING THAT.
UH, SO WE ARE WORKING WITH A HISTORIC PRESERVATION CONSULTANT POST OAK.
UM, THEY, UH, CONSULT ON A LOT OF HISTORIC PROJECTS ACROSS THE NATION.
UM, WE WILL NOT, UH, WE WILL NOT BE MEDIA BLASTING THE BRICK.
UM, WE WILL BE FOLLOWING THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE GUIDELINES AND THE GENERAL SERVICE ADMINISTRATION GUIDELINES AROUND REMOVAL OF PAINT, WHICH TO MY UNDERSTANDING STARTS WITH, UM, A LOW PRESSURE WATER AND A SOFT BRUSH BRUSH, SOFT BRISTLE BRUSH INITIALLY, UH, TO BEGIN WITH.
AND THEN IF WE'RE NOT ABLE TO REMOVE THE PAINT USING THAT METHOD, UM, MOVING INTO A NON IONIC DETERGENT OR CLEANING PRODUCT OF SOME KIND, UM, WITH THE INTENTION THAT, YOU KNOW, AS NO DAMAGE OR ABRASION HAPPENS TO THE BRICK.
UM, AND ALL OF THIS WILL BE UNDER GUIDANCE OF POST OAK.
UM, BUT, UM, WE, WE WOULD ALSO BE OPEN TO A RECOMMENDED LIST OF, UM, MEDIA THAT HAS BEEN USED BEFORE FOR REMOVING PAINT ON BRICK.
UM, AND I KNOW DR. DUNN ALSO MENTIONED, UM, RON SEABERT HAS RECENTLY GONE THROUGH THIS PROCESS, SO WE'RE OPEN TO RECOMMENDATIONS.
I WOULD ALSO RECOMMEND, UM, THE KNIGHTS OF PITUS BUILDING IN DEEP OEM WAS THEY REMOVED THE PAINT OFF OF THAT TO GET DOWN TO THE BRICKS.
SO, UM, TALKING TO THAT, UH, UH, CONTRACTING COMPANY THAT, THAT, UM, UH, WOULD BE GREAT.
THAT WAS A, UM, PERKINS AND WILL WAS THE ARCHITECT RECORD ON THAT PROJECT.
UM, JUST A COUPLE OF THINGS I WANNA ASK THAT SINCE THE BRICK, SINCE WE'RE ON THAT NOW, I, I, I HAVE A FAIR AMOUNT OF EXPERIENCE OF REMOVING BRICK ON HISTORIC COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS.
SHARE THE CONCERNS ABOUT MEDIA BLAST.
I MEAN, THERE ARE SOME MORE GENTLE MEDIA, ICE BLASTING, SODA BLASTING, BUT WHERE WE'VE HAD THE MOST SUCCESS HERE LOCALLY FIRST UNITED METHODIST CHURCH IS A GOOD EXAMPLE, IS A PRODUCT CALLED PEEL A.
SOMEBODY JOKED EARLIER ABOUT CITRUS DRIP AND SARAN WRAP.
IT'S BASICALLY THE COMMERCIAL VERSION OF THAT.
THEY'RE LARGE SHEETS THAT YOU APPLY AND YOU LET IT SIT BEHIND THERE AND KIND OF INCUBATE AND IT JUST PEELS THE PAINT RIGHT OFF AND IT ACTUALLY CAN GET INTO PRETTY DEEP FOREST TOO.
SO WE'VE HAD GOOD LUCK WITH THAT.
SO THERE MAY BE SOMETHING TO LOOK INTO.
IT'S NOT THE LEAST EXPENSIVE METHOD TYPICALLY, SO MAYBE SOME OF THE, THE CLEANING, UH, MIGHT BE A GOOD FIRST APPROACH, BUT HAD GOOD LUCK WITH THAT.
I CAN GIVE YOU A NAME OF A CONTRACTOR THAT HAS DONE THAT WORK LOCALLY TOO, IF YOU WANTED TO REFERENCE.
UM, THE SECOND THING, JUST ASK ABOUT THE WINDOWS.
UM, FIRST OF ALL, I JUST WOULD REALLY LIKE TO COMMEND Y'ALL'S APPROACH ON THIS BUILDING AND THE RES THE HISTORIC RESEARCH YOU'VE DONE.
AND BRINGING BACK THOSE ORIGINAL WINDOW PATTERNS AND SOME OF THE DETAILS THAT REALLY WILL MAKE THIS BUILDING INCREDIBLE.
PERSONALLY, I DON'T HAVE A STRONG OPINION ON WOOD VERSUS ALUMINUM VERSUS WOOD CLAD.
I THINK MAYBE WE SHOULD HAVE SOME FLEXIBILITY THERE.
TO ME, THE IMPORTANT THING IS TO MATCH THE PROPORTIONS OF THE SASHES, THE BUTTONS, ALL THE DETAILS SO THEY LOOK HISTORICALLY APPROPRIATE AND HOPEFULLY IN A HIGH QUALITY MATERIAL THAT'LL LAST A LONG TIME.
AND I THINK ANY OF THOSE SOLUTIONS CAN GET THERE.
WE DID COMPLETE ALUMINUM REPLACEMENT ON THE MELROSE HOTEL AND WE MATCHED EXACTLY THE ORIGINAL ONE WINDOWS IN EVERY SINGLE DETAIL, SO IT CAN BE DONE.
UM, BUT TO ASK ABOUT THE PRODUCT THAT YOU'RE PROPOSING, I SEE THAT THEY'RE NOT TRULY DIVIDED LIGHTS, BUT ARE YOU RECOMMENDING, IS IT, IF IT'S AN APPLIED TON? WE'LL IT ON EXTERIOR GLASS, YES.
[01:35:01]
WE HAVE SPECED IS A SIMULATED DIVIDED LIGHT ON THE FRONT FACADE.ANYBODY ELSE? INCLUDING ANYBODY AT HOME THAT I HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO SEE? COMMISSIONER ANDERSON, I JUST WANTED TO THANK YOU.
I THINK THIS IS AN ICONIC BUILDING AND IT'S GONNA MAKE A BIG DIFFERENCE TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
I SHARE THE CONCERNS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, GETTING THE BRICK, UH, PAINT OFF, PAINT UP CAREFULLY, AND ALSO THAT THE MALLON BE AS EXPRESSED AS POSSIBLE.
SO YOU HAD THE DIMENSION, BUT I THINK YOU'RE GOING THE RIGHT DIRECTION.
I JUST WANTED TO EXPRESS, UH, AGAIN, JUST COMMEND YOU ON THE RESEARCH THAT YOU'VE DONE AND THE, THE TIME YOU'RE TAKING ON THE BUILDING.
LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING THE FINISHED PRODUCT.
MR. RENO, DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING? YEAH, TWO MORE QUESTIONS.
UM, SO I SAW THE COMPARISON OF THE, THE PRAIRIE STYLE NEW THAT YOU'RE PROPOSING, UM, TO, TO EXISTING.
I DIDN'T SEE ONE AND MAYBE I OVERLOOKED IT, UH, FOR THE STOREFRONT BELOW WITH THE NINE OVER ONE.
UM, IS THAT, UH, MARVIN IS ABLE TO MATCH THAT ONE AS WELL.
SO MY UNDERSTANDING OF THE, THE GLAZING ON THE GROUND FLOOR.
SO, UM, WHILE WE WERE DOING SELECT, SO ORIGINALLY THOSE OPENINGS WERE COVERED UP IN THE INSIDE WITH A LAYER OF DRYWALL.
AND SO WE WENT THROUGH A PROCESS OF SELECTED DEMOLITION AND UM, THE EXISTING WINDOW FRAMES ARE STILL INTACT.
AND SO, UH, WE'D LIKE TO MAINTAIN THOSE AND REPAIR THEM AS NEEDED.
AND THEN INFILL THEM WITH GLAZING.
SO THEY WOULD BE LIKE DIRECT SET.
UM, SO WE WOULD WORK WITH A WINDOW CONTRACTOR TO SIZE THAT GLAZING AND THEY WOULD BE JUST PUT INTO THE EXISTING OPENINGS USING, YOU KNOW, WOOD STOPS AND GLAZING PUTTY AND THAT WHOLE THING.
UH, SECOND QUESTION IS, I KNOW YOU'VE PROPOSED SOME NEW TREES AND I WAS LOOKING TO SEE WHAT THE MATURE HEIGHTS WOULD BE THAT WERE DIRECTLY UNDERNEATH THE, THE POWER LINES UP ABOVE ON, UH, 10TH STREET IN PARTICULAR, UM, IN THE RENDERINGS, THEY ALL SHOW LIKE PROBABLY MAX HEIGHT IS LIKE EIGHT FEET.
BUT I WAS WONDERING IF THAT'S REALISTIC.
UM, WE WERE, WE WERE LOOKING TO, TO USE TREE SPECIES THAT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE FOR THE PEDESTRIAN SCALE.
SO LOOKING AT MATURE HEIGHTS OF 20 TO 30, BUT WE WOULD NEED TO LOOK INTO WHERE THAT SITS.
LOOKS THE POWER LINE'S DIRECTLY UNDERNEATH THE POWER LINES IN THE LAST SEE AS A TREE DRAWING, LIKE BOTH.
ANYONE ELSE? BECAUSE IF WE ARE DONE WITH ALL OF OUR QUESTIONS, THEN THAT MEANS IT'S TIME FOR SOMEONE CAN MAKE A MOTION.
UM, REGARDING DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER FOUR, UH, ALSO KNOWN AS 1 0 2 CLIFF STREET CA 2 4 5 DASH 360 6 RD, UH, FOR REQUEST NUMBER ONE THAT WE, UM, FOLLOW STAFF RECOMMENDATION INCLUDING CONDITIONS ON, UH, ITEM NUMBER TWO THAT WE FOLLOW STAFF RECOMMENDATION, UH, NO CONDITIONS ON THAT.
ITEM NUMBER THREE THAT, UM, LET'S SEE.
WE ACTUALLY, WE ALLOW, UH, THE REPLACEMENT OF, UM, ALUMINUM CLA WINDOWS ON THE SECOND FLOOR.
UM, UH, WHAT IS IT, SIX OVER ONE, NINE OVER ONE.
AND THEN ON THE ELEVATIONS, UH, ON NORTH STREET, UH, ONE OVER ONE THAT THEY BE, UM, APPROVED AS SUBMITTED ITEM NUMBER FOUR.
I'D LIKE TO EXCLUDE CONDITION NUMBER ONE THAT WE, UM, ACCEPT, UM, AS THE, UH, AS THE, UH, PROPOSER HAS SUBMITTED AND WE ELIMINATE, UM, OMIT, UM, ITEM NUMBER TWO OR RATHER CONDITION NUMBER TWO ON ITEM NUMBER FIVE,
[01:40:05]
UM, THAT WE ACCEPT AS, UH, UH, STAFF RECOMMENDATION AND ITEM NUMBER SIX THAT WE, UM, ACCEPT AS, UH, PROPOSED BY THE PROPOSAL.PARDON ME? COULD YOU CLARIFY THAT? I'M SORRY, I DON'T REMEMBER THAT THE CLEANING SIX WERE ACCEPTING WHAT THE NO, THE WELL THAT THE CLEANING METHOD THAT, UH, THAT PROPOSER HAD SUGGESTED, UM, BE FOLLOWED RATHER THAN, UH, DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
YOU MEAN WHAT THEY SUGGESTED HERE TODAY? CORRECT.
UM, SO WELL TO CLARIFY THAT, UM, WE WOULD NEED TO ADD THAT TO, UM, UM, TO THE PROPOSAL.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU DESCRIBED EXACTLY AS IN THERE.
I MEAN WHAT YOU DE DESCRIBED TODAY.
YEAH, I CAN WRITE THAT IN THE CONDITIONS.
AND I SECOND THE MOTION MADAM CHAIR.
I HAVE A QUESTION, HOWEVER, HANG ON.
I NEED TO MAKE SURE ELAINE KNOWS WHO WAS THE SECOND.
WAS THAT COMMISSIONER TAYLOR? YES.
AND COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, I HAVE A QUESTION.
THE APPLICANT BY HER, UM, OPENING STATEMENTS WANTED TO REQUEST THAT THE DEFENSE ON THE LEFT SIDE, UM, AS OPPOSED TO BEING PULLED BACK 10 FEET FROM THE FRONT FACADE, SHE WAS ASKING IF THERE COULD BE INSTEAD, UM, REMAINING ITS SAFE CONDITION AT IF THE HEIGHT WERE NO HIGHER THAN THREE FEET SIX INCHES.
BUT WHAT ISN'T CLEAR ABOUT WHAT YOU REQUESTED IS, ARE YOU, UM, WHERE DOES THAT THREE FOOT SIX STOP AND START? I MEAN, IS IT WRAPPED A CORNER OF THE FENCE LINE OR DOES IT WHAT, OR YOU WANT IT TO BE THREE FOOT SIX ALL THE WAY BACK? UM, SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE FENCE THAT'S NOTED IN THE CONDITIONS IS THE PORTION OF THE FENCE THAT IS PARALLEL TO THE FRONT FACADE.
AND SO THAT FENCE IS SHOWN AT THE SAME HEIGHT AS THE, UH, FENCE THAT'S RUNNING ALONG THE RETAINING WALL.
UM, AND SO WE WOULD LIKE TO REQUEST THAT THE FENCE SETS PARALLEL TO THE FRONT FACADE, UM, CAN REMAIN AT THAT LOCATION, NOT, NOT SET BACK 10 FEET IF IT'S LOWERED TO THREE FOOT SIX.
I THINK THE PRIMARY CONCERN WITH FIT'S PLACEMENT HAS TO DO WITH, UM, ESSENTIALLY RHYTHM OF THE BLOCK FACE, BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY PERHAPS, UM, IS THE, UM, WAY IT IS RIGHT NOW.
IT, IT OBSCURES THAT CHIMNEY, WHICH IS AN ARCHITECTURAL FEATURE.
THAT'S WHY I'M TRYING TO GET CLEAR ON IF THE INSIGHT WERE TO BE CHANGED AND AN EXCEPTION, WOULD IT BE MADE? IS THAT APPROVABLE OR DO WE NEED THE MOTION JUST TO STAND LIKE IT IS COMMISSIONER RENO, DOES THAT MAKE SENSE OR HAVE I TALKED IN CIRCLES? I PROBABLY DID.
NO, I'M TRYING TO FIND IT SPECIFICALLY IN THE DRAWINGS SO I CAN SPOT IT.
AND THE AREA WHERE IT'S MENTIONED IS, UM, STAFF RECOMMENDATION ONE ITEM THREE BENEATH, UM, REQUEST ONE IN TERMS OF LANGUAGE, SORRY, IT'S THE FENCE THAT ALIGNS WITH THE SIDEWALK THAT'S LEANING, BLEEDING FROM THE BOTTOM OF THE STAIR TO THE DRIVEWAY? NO, IT'S THE LEFT SIDE FENCE.
SO IF YOU'RE LOOKING ON THE SCREEN, I SEE IT'S THE SECOND PICTURE OF THE TOP BECAUSE THE 10 FEET, UM, FROM THE FRONT, THE SIDE WOULD PUT IT ALMOST IMMEDIATELY RIGHT BEHIND THE CHIMNEY.
SO THAT MAKES IT JUST ABOUT RIGHT.
YEAH, I'M FINE WITH THAT AMENDMENT.
I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF I AMENDED IT.
NO, THAT THAT MAKES, THAT MAKES SENSE.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT EVER SHOWED UP IN ANY, UM, ORIGINAL PHOTOGRAPH.
I MEAN LIKE HISTORIC PHOTOGRAPH.
I DON'T THINK THERE WAS A PHOTO PROVIDED OF THAT ELEVATION ON THAT SIDE.
YEAH, IT WAS JUST THE OTHER, TOWARD THE RIGHT HAND SIDE OF THE ELEVATION.
YEAH, BUT I DO AGREE MOVING IT TO THE, JUST TO THE BACKSIDE OF THE FIRE PLATE OR THE, THE CHIMNEY, UM, WOULD BE A, A REASONABLE UH, REQUEST.
AND IT WOULD HIGHLIGHT THEN IN TURN HIGHLIGHT THE, UM, THAT ARCHITECTURAL
[01:45:01]
SO CAN WE LEAVE IT AT A MINIMUM OF 10? YES.UM, IS THE SECOND COMMISSIONER TAYLOR IN AGREEMENT WITH THIS? YES.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS BEFORE WE VOTE? ALRIGHT THEN.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THIS MOTION, PLEASE SAY YES.
IT DOES NOT APPEAR THAT WE HAVE ANY OPPOSITION.
UM, GO ON WITH YOUR GOOD WORK.
AND WE DO APPRECIATE WHAT ALL THE PC WORKSHOP DOES.
THEY'VE BEEN DOING A LOT OF GOOD THINGS FOR YEARS.
MAY I SAY ONE MORE THING? YEAH, SURE.
I WOULD LOVE TO BE IN INVITED TO COME SEE THIS WHEN IT'S FINISHED.
SO IF YOU WOULD LET STAFF KNOW AND THEN STAFF COULD TELL US THAT IT'S DONE, WE WOULD LOVE TO HAVE YOU COME BY AND REJOICE WITH YOU.
ALRIGHT, NEXT UP WE'RE GOING TO DO DD FIVE.
I I I WAS, I WAS ASKING FOR A BRIEF
STAFF AGREES WITH SOME OF THE BODIES SITTING UP HERE THAT WE WOULD LIKE A BRIEF RESTROOM BREAK.
WE ARE SORRY TO KEEP THE AUDIENCE WAITING, BUT YOU KNOW, WE DO SIT HERE THE WHOLE TIME.
SO, SO, UM, I ALWAYS SAY FIVE MINUTES, PLEASE TRY TO MAKE IT THAT 2 56 'CAUSE WE DON'T WANNA GO HOME SOMETIME TODAY.
[01:52:31]
UM, OKAY, WE ARE READY TO RECONVENE IF EVERYBODY WOULD SIT DOWN AND TURN THEIR ATTENTION TO THE BUSINESS AT HAND.THE BUSINESS AT HAND BEING DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER FIVE.
OH, WELL WE DON'T HAVE MUCH OF POLICY.
GOOD AFTERNOON AGAIN, THIS IS DR.
RHONDA DUNN PRESENTING ON BEHALF OF CITY STAFF.
THE SUBJECT PROPERTY IS LOCATED AT 36 27 HAVANA STREET IN THE WHEATLEY PLACE, HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE CASE NUMBER IS CA 2 4 5 DASH 3 6 5 RD.
THE REQUEST IS FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT WITH AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, A REAR YARD CARPORT.
THE STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT WITH AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, A REAR YARD CARPORT BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 4 22 20 25 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
ONE, THAT FRONT PORCH GABLE ROOF BE EXTENDED, IN OTHER WORDS MADE WIDER TO ALLOW THE FOUR FRONT PORCH COLUMNS TO BE EQUALLY SPACED.
TWO, THAT THE FREEZE BOARD BE EXTENDED ACROSS THE ENTIRETY OF THE FRONT PORCH.
THREE, THAT THE DEPTH OF FRONT PORCH BE A MINIMUM OF SIX FEET BEHIND PORCH COLUMNS.
FOUR, THAT CAPS OF PORCH COLUMN BASIS AND WING WALLS BE OF CAST STONE.
AND FIVE, THAT A WINDOW OR WINDOWS SINGLE OR PAIRED BE ADDED TO THE LEFT AND RIGHT SIDE ELEVATIONS IN THE FRONT.
50% IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
SECTIONS 9.2, 9.3 9.7, AND NINE POINT 11 SUBSECTION A UNDER NEW CONSTRUCTION AND ADDITIONS AND SECTIONS 10.1, 10.2, AND 10.3
[01:55:01]
UNDER ACCESSORY BUILDINGS.THE STANDARDS AND CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 SUBDIVISION, G SIX C ROMAN TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES.
AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIORS GUIDELINES FOR SETTING DISTRICT AND OUR NEIGHBORHOOD TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A NEW MAIN RESIDENTIAL BUILDING ON A VACANT LOT WITH AN ACCESSORY STRUCTURE, A REAR YARD CARPORT BE APPROVED WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
THE DELIVERED EVENT BE ADDED TO TOP OF PORCH GABLE.
THAT FOUNDATION BE A MINIMUM OF 15 TO 18 INCHES ABOVE GRADE.
THAT BRACKETS BE INSTALLED AT TOP OF BOTH GABLES, THAT A FREEZE BOARD WITH DENTAL ORNAMENTATION BE ADDED ABOVE PORCH COLUMNS.
THAT EXTERIOR LIGHTING BE CRAFTSMAN STYLE.
THAT WINDOWS BE WHITE ALUMINUM ONE OVER ONE THAT A BRICK EXTERIOR CHIMNEY BE ADDED TO THE LEFT OR RIGHT ELEVATION THAT WINDOWS BE ADDED TO THE LEFT AND RIGHT ELEVATIONS THAT LOOKOUT BRA BRACKETS BE ADDED TO THE SIDE WALLS.
AND THAT EXTERIOR SIDING BE NOVELTY PATTERN NUMBER 1 1 7.
AND WE HAVE ONE SPEAKER SIGNED UP TO SPEAK ON THIS.
THE HANDWRITING IS SIMILAR TO MINE, SO I'M GOING TO TAKE A GUESS AT ARCHIE KANE.
OKAY, SO SAY THAT AGAIN,
AND THEN TELL US YOUR ADDRESS AND YOUR PROMISE OR AFFIRMATION TO, UH, TELL US THE TRUTH.
SO MY NAME IS ARCHIE CANOE AND, UH, PROMISE YOU TO TELL THE TRUTH.
UH, MY ADDRESS IS 60 24 TOIT DRIVE IN PROVIDENCE VILLAGE, TEXAS.
SO YOU, YOU GO AHEAD AND YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES TO TELL US FURTHER ABOUT YOUR PROJECT.
SO I'M HERE TODAY AS A, AS A, AS A STAKEHOLDER IN A HISTORICAL COMMUNITY.
UM, UM, I'M SPEAKING IN REGARDS TO PROPOSED CONSTRUCTION ON 36 27 HAVANA.
WE SIT IN THE DISTRICT DEEPLY VALUED BY ITS, UH, CULTURAL AND ARCHITECTURAL HERITAGE.
UM, WHILE I UNDERSTAND THE NEED, UH, FOR DEVELOPMENT OF MODERNIZATION, I URGE THE COUNCIL TO ENSURE THAT, UH, ANY CONSTRUCTION ALIGNS WITH THE CHARACTER AND THE PRESERVATION STANDARDS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
UM, YOU KNOW, THIS AREA TELLS A STORY THROUGH ITS ARCHITECTURE AND ITS GENERATIONS THAT HAVE LIVED THERE.
AND, UH, YOU KNOW HOW WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING IS TO, YOU KNOW, MAINTAIN AND BE IN LINE WITH THAT.
UH, WITH THAT HISTORY, I ASKED THE COUNCIL TO CAREFULLY CONSIDER THE SCALE AND MATERIALS AND DESIGNS FOR THE PROPOSED PROJECT AND HOW IT INTEGRATES WITH THE SURROUNDING HISTORICAL FABRIC, UM, DEVELOPMENT.
UM, SO THIS, THAT WE'RE PROPOSING TO PUT THE, UH, STRUCTURE ON IS CURRENTLY, UH, EMPTY.
UM, AND WE HAVE ACTUALLY GONE THROUGH THE PRELIMINARY, UH, REVIEW.
UM, UH, WHICH WE'VE MADE A LOT OF THE RECOMMENDED, UH, A LOT OF, WE'VE MADE A LOT OF, UH, THE PROPOSAL RECOMMENDATIONS INCLUDING ADDING A WINDOW TO THE, UH, TO THE BOAT, TO THE BOAT RIGHT.
UM, THAT'S, THAT, THAT'S PRETTY MUCH IT.
AND I'M HERE WITH, UH, I, WHO'S ACTUALLY APPLICANT.
SO SOME OF THE QUESTIONS, IF I'M NOT ABLE TO ANSWER IT, I WILL DEFER TO, UH, TO HIM.
AND IF EITHER OF THOSE GENTLEMEN END UP NEEDING TO SPEAK, THEY WILL HAVE TO FILL OUT A YELLOW FORM LIKE YOU DID.
I WOULD KEEP TRACK OF, OF WHAT CITIZENS CAME TO VICE THEMSELVES AT OUR PUBLIC MEETINGS.
UH, COMMISSIONERS, WHAT QUESTIONS DO YOU HAVE? I LOOK TO MY LEFT JUST TO SEE IF ANYBODY OVER THERE WANTS BE HEARD.
UH, I KNOW WE DON'T HAVE PURVIEW OVER THE INTERIOR, BUT AS REVIEWING THIS APPLICATION AND LOOKING AT THE FLOOR PLANS, IT SEEMS THAT THE LIVING ROOM, DINING ROOM, AND KITCHEN HAVE NO WINDOWS, UH, IN THEM.
IS THAT, I MEAN, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT'S A, THAT'S WHAT YOU WANT TO DO OR THAT, YOU KNOW, AT SOME POINT YOU DON'T WANNA COME BACK AND CHANGE THE PLAN TO, TO ALTER THAT.
NO, I THOUGHT THEY WILL ACTUALLY, THEY WILL HAVE WINDOW THEN.
UM, MAYBE BECAUSE WE'VE HAD TO CHANGE THE ARCHITECTURE STRUCTURE A COUPLE TIMES, BUT THAT'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING THAT, UH, THAT, THAT THEY WILL HAVE.
AND THEN WE'LL MAKE SURE THAT IT'S INCORPORATED IN THERE.
SO HOW IS THAT GONNA BE DONE? 'CAUSE THAT SEEMS ALL, THAT SEEMS TO BE IN THE CENTER OF THE BUILDING AND THEN YOU'VE GOT THE LAUNDRY ROOM IN THE FRONT AND THE KITCHEN IN THE BACK.
AND WOULD FIRE CODE IN FACT, REQUIRE AT LEAST ONE, I MEAN, HAVE A BACK DOOR, SO I GUESS THAT COUNTS AND IT COULD BE GLASS, BUT IT'S LIKE A WINDOW, RIGHT? THERE'D BE THERE.
YEAH, THERE'S A WINDOW IN THE BACK.
ARCHITECTURE TALKING AMONG YOURSELVES INSTEAD OF
[02:00:02]
WELL, I'M, I'M ON THE SAME TOPIC.TYPICALLY, THERE ARE MORE WINDOWS IN THE FRONT.
I MEAN, YOU ONLY HAVE ONE, ONE WINDOW AND A LITTLE ONE ON THE RIGHT ELEVATION AND TWO WINDOWS ON THE LEFT, TYPICALLY TOWARDS THE FRONT PORCH, WHICH YOU CAN SEE FROM THE FEET.
THERE SHOULD BE PROBABLY ANOTHER WINDOW ON EACH, THAT FRONT CORNER AREA, WHICH WOULD PROBABLY HELP GIVE THE BUILDING A LITTLE BIT MORE LIFE AND THE MORE LIGHT INSIDE.
WHAT OTHER QUESTIONS? OKAY, WELL, I, WELL, I HAVE A QUESTION.
ABOUT THE WAY YOUR FRONT PORCH IS.
UM, IT, IT'S SO, SO SHALLOW AT ONE POINT.
IT'S ONLY THREE FEET DEEP, IT LOOKS LIKE, WHICH IS NOT REALLY A PORCH.
UM, IS THERE ANY WAY TO, TO MAKE THE PORCH BIGGER? UH, USUALLY PORCHES IN A NEIGHBORHOOD LIKE THIS WERE WHERE PEOPLE SOCIALIZED A LOT, SO IT HAD TO BE BIG ENOUGH TO SIT OUT THERE.
AND MAYBE HAVE SOME NEIGHBORS DROP BY AS THEY WALK PAST.
IT MIGHT ALSO ALLOW YOU TO DO SOMETHING WITH THE FRONT FACADE, KINDA MAKE IT JUST STRAIGHT ACROSS A LITTLE BIT MORE ROOM.
IS THERE, ARE YOU HAVE ROOM CONSTRAINTS THAT KEEP YOU FROM MAKING THIS PORCH A BIT MORE OF A LIVABLE SPACE? UH, NO MA'AM, WE DO NOT.
IT'S ACTUALLY SOMETHING, UH, OR HAVE OUR ARCHITECT BE INCORPORATED INTO THE DRAWING.
IT WOULD PROBABLY BE NICER FOR THE, UM, THE PEOPLE WHO END UP LIVING HERE TO HAVE, HAVE THAT OUT THERE.
ESPECIALLY IF THEY HAVE A LOT OF KIDS.
YOU CAN SEND 'EM OUT ON THE PORCH.
BE NOISY OUT THERE OR SOMETHING.
WHAT OTHER CONCERNS HAVE WE, ANYBODY ONLINE? QUICK QUESTION.
UM, DO WE HAVE, I WAS LOOKING THROUGH IT.
DO WE, IS IT IN LINE WITH ALL THE OTHER BUILDINGS ON THE STREET? I KNOW THIS IS A NEW BUILD, RIGHT? AND ALSO THAT MY OTHER QUESTION IS, I'M, I MAY, I'M MAYBE CONFUSED.
UM, WAS THIS ONE OF THE ONES THAT, UH, WAS DROPPED AND THIS IS IN CONSTRUCTION TO BUILD IT? IS THAT THIS PROJECT THAT THE PREVIOUS HISTORY WAS DEMOED? YEP.
RIGHT? THE PREVIOUS ONE WAS TAKEN DOWN WITHOUT PERMISSION UNDER ANOTHER OWNER, NOT THIS GENTLEMAN.
SO THAT KIND OF MAKES ME GO ONTO OUR NEXT QUESTION.
UM, I GUESS THIS WOULD BE FOR STAFF IS WHEN THAT HAPPENS, UH, I THINK THIS WAS MENTIONED BEFORE COMMISSIONER ANDERSON POSSIBLY ALLUDED TO, TO THIS TO A CERTAIN DEGREE.
UM, DON'T, WOULD WE NOT HAVE IT IN OUR BEST INTEREST TO TRY TO RECON, RECONSTRUCT, YOU KNOW, RECONSTRUCTION IN PRESERVATION TERMS IS RA IS RARE, BUT IT'S ALSO UTILIZED WHEN WE KNOW THAT A BUILDING WAS STORED AND THE FEATURES WERE INTACT, THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT WE COULD ACTUALLY HAVE A GO BY TO ACTUALLY BUILD IT BACK.
I KNOW RESTORATION IS A LITTLE BIT, BUT IT DOES HAVE A PURVIEW AND, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE NPS GUIDELINES FOR RECONSTRUCTION.
I THINK THAT WOULD, WHEN THESE THINGS HAPPEN, IN MY OPINION, IT SEEMS LIKE THIS WOULD FALL UNDER THAT UMBRELLA OF NPS GUIDELINES OF, OF RECONSTRUCTION.
AND WOULD IT NOT, UH, IN YOUR EYES ON STAFF'S THOUGHTS? YES.
BECAUSE IT WAS CONTRIBUTING MM-HMM
AND TO BE HONEST, THAT WAS COMMUNICATED TO THE APPLICANT AND THIS IS THE APPLICANT'S RESPONSE.
WOULD BE THE BEST WAY TO SAY IT.
AND DO WE HAVE THE, I GUESS WE HAVE DRAWINGS FROM GOOGLE OR SOMETHING, OR DO WE HAVE DOCUMENTS IN OUR PILES? WE DON'T, WE DON'T, WE DO NOT HAVE MEASURED DRAWINGS.
WE DON'T HAVE MEASURED DRAWINGS.
WE DO HAVE THE PICTURE OF THE FRONT ELEVATION FROM GOOGLE.
TO ME, IT'S, I THINK IN MY THOUGHT, IN MY OPINION, THIS WOULD TRIGGER RECONSTRUCTION, UH, TERMS FOR THE NPS GUIDELINES THAT INSTEAD OF TRYING TO REINVENT SOMETHING, IF WE KNEW THAT WAS CONTRIBUTING AND IT WAS HISTORIC HOUSE, IT, IT WOULD, IT WOULD TRIGGER THE FACTORS TO THINK ABOUT DOING RECONSTRUCTION, UH, FOR THAT.
UM, THAT'S WHERE I WOULD BE LEANING.
SO I'D KIND OF LIKE TO GET THAT SORTED OUT MAYBE AMONG US, IF ANYBODY CHOOSES TO, BEFORE WE ACTUALLY GO ON TO LOOKING AT WHAT NEW, WHAT THE NEW PLANS WOULD BE FOR THIS SEEMS LIKE THERE'S, WE'RE, WE'RE, YOU KNOW, SPLITTING THE ATOM ON TWO DIFFERENT SIDES HERE.
SO, UH, THAT'S WHAT I, THAT'S MY
[02:05:01]
OPINION.SO IF I COULD INTERJECT, UH, A LITTLE BIT.
SO WHAT WE DID WAS, SINCE WE COULDN'T ACTUALLY FIND THE ORIGINAL PLAN, WHAT WE DID WAS WE ACTUALLY WENT TO GOOGLE AND WENT BACK AS FAR AS WE COULD TO SEE A STANDING BUILDING ON THERE AND WE TRIED TO REPLICATE THE MIRROR, WHATEVER STRUCTURE IT IS THAT WAS ON THERE AT THE TIME.
SO YOU'RE SAYING WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS YOU AND YOUR THOUGHT, UH, AN EXACT REPLICA OF THE FRONT FACADE? TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE, ABSOLUTELY.
IT IT'S NOT AND THAT'S WHY IN MY CONDITIONS I TRIED TO MOVE IT MORE TOWARD THAT DIRECTION.
SO THAT'S WHY I'M SAYING THINGS LIKE THE FOUR.
DO WE HAVE A PHOTO? I'M SORRY, GO AHEAD.
NEED TO BE EQUALLY SPACE IF WE HAVE A PHOTO, UH, FROM STREET VIEW AND THAT.
MAYBE, UH, AND ALSO MAY, DO WE HAVE ANYTHING AROUND THE, ON THE SHOWING ON ANY OF THE SIDE BY ANY INTENT? IS THAT ALL WE GOT? SO, SO THIS IS COMMISSIONER
WELL THAT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE WHAT YOU'VE PRESENTED.
DO YOU WANT EXPLAIN YOUR DESIGN ON WHAT YOUR THOUGHTS ARE? SO IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT WE'VE, UH, PRESENTED, WE'VE ACTUALLY MADE A LOT OF MODIFICATIONS AS TO, YOU KNOW, REPLICATE THIS AS MUCH AS WE COULD.
THE FRONT PORCH THAT WE HAVE ON OUR DESIGN WASN'T INITIALLY THERE.
THE CHIMNEY WASN'T INITIALLY THERE.
THE, UH, THOSE POLES, UH, ON, ON THE FRONT PORCH AS WELL, THE STAIRS LEADING DOWN TO THE LISTING, THOSE WERE NOT INITIALLY THERE.
SO WE WENT BACK AND WE ADDED THOSE AFTER WE, UH, MET WITH DR.
THIS IS COMMISSIONER TAYLOR? MM-HMM
I HAD A QUESTION LOOKING JUST FROM A, IN DISCREPANCY OF THE DRAWINGS AND ON SOME DRAWINGS IT SHOWS A EXTRA WINDOW IN THE FRONT VERSUS THE OTHER DRAWINGS IN THE SET SHOW THE WINDOW MISSING.
AND THEN WITH LOOKING AT, GOING BACK TO 2007 WITH THE GOOGLE IMAGERY, THE CHIMLEY WAS ON THE FAR SIDE OF THE HOME VERSUS CENTRALLY LOCATED, UM, VERSUS THE HOME JUST KIND OF BEING MIRRORED.
SO I'M JUST NOT SURE IF WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE THE HOME MOST SIMILAR TO WHAT WAS EXISTING OR ALLOW FOR A DIFFERENT DESIGN AND SIGNIFICANT ITEMS TO BE MOVED.
SO I CAN, AND I'M NOT TRYING TO BE DEFENSIVE, BUT I DO NOT REALLY SEE A CLEAR PICTURE OF THE SIDE WHERE IT'S INDICATING THAT THE CHIMNEY IS ALL THE WAY IN THE BACK OF THE BUILDING.
SO HE'S SAYING IT'S ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE BUILDING.
MAYBE YOU COULD POINT TO WHERE WE SEE THE LITTLE TOP OF IT AND THIS IS, OH, THERE'S A FLOOD WARNING RIGHT NOW.
SO DOWN THE, AND THEN TURN BACK.
OH, NOW'S UNDER THE, WE SLIDE IT OVER.
OH, THAT'S, SO THAT'S KIND OF TOWARDS THE MIDDLE OF THE BUILDING, ISN'T IT? AND I THINK THAT'S THE SAME WAY WHERE WE PUT THE ONE THAT IS REFLECTED IN OUR DRAWING.
THE, THE ONE ACTUALLY IN YOUR DRAWING IS IN THE ACTUAL MIDDLE OF THE WHOLE BUILDING INSTEAD OF GOING TO THE SIDE LIKE THAT OFF TO THE SIDE IS EXTREMELY COMMON AND THE WAY IT BURSTS THROUGH THE ROOF AND ALL OF THAT, IT'S SORT OF A, IT'S A DISTINGUISHING FEATURE THAT WE LOOK TO SEE ON THOSE.
I THINK, UH, WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO ASK, I GUESS WHAT WE'RE COMING AT, IS THERE ANY WAY YOU COULD MAKE THE FRONT AND THE FRONT HALF OF EACH SIDE LOOK EXACTLY LIKE THIS AND THEN FIT WHAT YOU NEED IN BEHIND THAT APPEARANCE? BECAUSE YOURS DOESN'T LOOK EXACTLY LIKE IT.
THE FRONT PORCH SUPPORTS ARE A LITTLE DIFFERENT.
AND I THINK YOUR ROOF IS A LITTLE TALLER TOO.
SO THE, AND THAT WAS THE INTENT FROM THE ONSET, YOU KNOW, WAS TRY TO, YOU KNOW, GET AS CLOSELY AS POSSIBLE THAT WE CAN GET TO THIS DRAWING THAT WE PULLED FROM WILL, GIVEN THAT IT'S IN A HISTORICAL DISTRICT.
WELL, I, I THINK SOME HAVE EXPRESSED AN IDEA THAT IT HAS NOT ACHIEVED THAT.
I I'M JUST SAYING THAT, THAT I'M SAYING THAT AND THAT OTHER PEOPLE FIRST SORT OF HINTED AT IT.
SO I DON'T KNOW IF, IF IT IS THE, UM, THE GENERAL WILL HERE THAT WE THINK IT OUGHT TO BE CHANGED TO MORE REFLECTED OR NOT.
BUT IT IS, THE QUESTION THAT WE'RE TRYING TO CONSIDER IS WE, WE GOTTA TRY HARDER TO MAKE IT APPEAR AS IF NO ONE EVER KNOCKED THAT FOUR HOUSE DOWN.
I DO UNDERSTAND IT JUST GOT FIXED UP.
GOOGLE WILL HAPPILY DRIVE US DOWN THE STREET AND THEN TURN AROUND AND
[02:10:01]
LOOK AT THE YEAH, THERE THE TREE IN THE CAR RIGHT IN AWAY OF WHAT WE NEED.THAT GOOGLE WILL NOT DO THAT FOR US.
WELL IT DOES SHOW THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY WINDOWS NEAR THE FRONT ON THE SIDE.
THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANY WINDOWS NEAR THE FRONT ON BOTH SIDES.
BUT YEAH, BECAUSE DIFFERENT THAN
IT'S HARD TO TELL ON THIS, BUT YEAH.
ALRIGHT, WELL I'VE GOT A COUPLE COMMENTS.
LET'S HAVE SOME MORE COMMENTS AND, AND, AND I HOPE MR. CANOE IS THINKING ABOUT WHAT HE CAN SAY, WHETHER HE IS WILLING TO TRY TO DO WHAT I JUST ASKED TO.
IF HE WOULD THINK ABOUT DOING ACTUALLY AFTER THEY MATCHING MR. LIVING.
UM, IS THE SCHOOL ACROSS THE STREET OPEN? I'M JUST CURIOUS.
PHYLLIS WHEATLEY ACROSS THE STREET, IS THAT THE SAME STREET? IT'S O YEAH, IT'S OPEN, BUT UH, NOT THE ENTIRE BUILDING.
IN OTHER WORDS, THERE'S A, UH, WHAT DO YOU CALL THE SCHOOLS? IT'S SPORTED.
SO THEY'RE USING THE GYM AS A SCHOOL.
SO I JUST COMMEND YOU ON TRYING TO ADDRESS THIS, FIRST OF ALL.
'CAUSE THIS IS NOT AN EASY TASK.
COMING INTO A HISTORIC DISTRICT, THERE'S A VACANT LOT THAT'S BEEN THERE FOR A WHILE NOW.
BEHIND THIS HOUSE IS ANOTHER VACANT LOT.
SO I COMMEND YOU FOR TRYING TO TACKLE THIS CHALLENGE.
UM, FIRST OF ALL, LEMME JUST SAY THAT
I THINK I THINK THE WINDOWS, THE NUMBER OF WINDOWS, IF WE COULD CLARIFY, IS IT THREE OR IS IT FIVE? I THINK THAT NEEDS TO BE CLARIFIED.
UM, BUT I THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE AS FAR AS THE NEIGHBORHOOD TO HAVE THOSE, UH, WINDOWS ON THAT OTHER DESIGN.
BUT IN THE BACK, I THINK THAT'S, UH, IT'S HARD TO GET IN.
IT'S HARD TO DISCUSS, YOU KNOW, YOUR INTERIOR DESIGN WITHOUT, WITHOUT A KIT WINDOW IN THAT KITCHEN.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU COULD REDO, PUT THAT LAYOUT BECAUSE IT LOOKS LIKE THE REFRIGERATOR IS THERE, GOT SOME CEILING CABINETS IN THERE ON THAT BACK WALL, WHICH IS NORMALLY WHERE YOU WOULD HAVE THAT NATURAL LIGHT COMING IN.
UM, YOU'RE SURROUNDED AND IT LOOKS LIKE YOU HAVE AN ISLAND KIND OF DISHWASHER AND, AND THE OR CABINET IN THE CENTER.
SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU CAN DO WITH THAT CONFIGURATION TO GET LIGHT IN THE BACK, BUT I DO THINK THAT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE AS WELL.
UM, AND THEN THE CHIMNEY, I, I, I'M NOT ARCHITECT SO I CAN'T VISUALIZE HOW YOU'RE DOING THAT CHIMNEY IN THE CENTER OF THE LI LIVING ROOM.
I'VE SEEN 'EM, BUT I CAN'T PICTURE THAT.
BUT I DO THINK THAT THAT'S GONNA TAKE A LITTLE BIT MORE CONFIGURATION TO TRY TO PUT THAT ON THE WALL, LIKE THE PHOTO.
BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT, I'M NOT SOLELY SOLD THAT IT'S NEEDS TO BE A TOTAL REPLICATION.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, I DON'T WANNA BLAME THE, THE, THE DEVELOPER NOW FOR WHAT'S, WHAT, WHAT HAPPENED, WHICH WAS IT WAS TORN DOWN AND IT SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN TORN DOWN.
UM, SO I THINK MY COMMENT IS JUST MAINLY AROUND TRYING TO MAKE IT AS, UM, REPLICATIVE OF AS POSSIBLE AS THE, AS THE PHOTO THAT YOU PROVIDED.
UM, BUT I'M, I AM A LITTLE BIT, UH, CONSIDERATE BASICALLY BECAUSE THERE'S A VACANT LOT BEHIND THERE AND THE SCHOOL ACROSS THE STREET IS, IS BOARDED UP.
ALRIGHT, ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS WITH QUESTIONS? I HAVE A QUESTION.
UH, IS, UH, DR. DUNN, IS THERE ANY WAY THAT YOU CAN MINIMIZE THAT ARCHITECTURAL DRAWING THERE AND PUT THE OTHER, UH, ACTUAL PHOTO, UH, SO I CAN COMPARE BOTH, UH, LET'S SIDE BY SIDE IF THERE'S ANY WAY TO DO THAT.
DR. DUNN IS A COMPUTER GENIUS.
THE, THE FRONT, UH, NOT THAT ONE, BUT THE ONE THAT'S SHOWING IT.
THE FRONT, UH, YEAH, YOU ARE TO GO DOWN THE STREET AND TURN AND LOOK AT IT AS IF YOU RIGHT IN FRONT OF IT.
NOW CAN YOU PUT THEM SIDE BY SIDE? OKAY.
UM, JUST TURN THIS ONE LIKE IT A LITTLE BIT.
[02:15:01]
OKAY.IT'S A, IT'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT, BUT, BUT I AGREE WITH THE, UH, COMMISSIONER THAT JUST SPOKE THAT, YOU KNOW, WITH SO MANY EMPTY LOTS AND BOARDED UP HOUSES, UH, SOMEONE TRYING TO, UH, BUILD A NEW PROPERTY IN THAT AREA SHOULD BE COMMENDED.
UH, THE ONLY, THE ONLY THING THAT, THAT I SEE IS KIND OF UNUSUAL IS ALSO THAT FIREPLACE IN THE MIDDLE.
UM, I WOULD PUT IT BACK WHERE, WHERE THE ORIGINAL WAS ON THE SIDE, ON THE, UM, RIGHT SIDE.
BUT WITH THE CURRENT PLAN THAT WOULD PLACE IT, I BELIEVE IN THE BATHROOM OR
I MEAN, PEOPLE LIKE A POWER PLACE IN THE BEDROOM.
IF THERE, I KNOW I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THAT.
UM, WOULD YOU CONSIDER MOVING THE UTILITY TO THE BACKSIDE OF THE KITCHEN SO THAT THE LIVING ROOM COULD FACE THE STREET AND THE FRONT PORCH? THEN IF THE, UH, UTILITY'S ON THE BACK, THEN YOU COULD HAVE A WINDOW IN, IN THAT ROOM STILL BE ACCESSIBLE.
ALL YOUR SERVICES ARE RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER.
YOU'RE COMING IN FROM THE GARAGE OR FROM THE CARPORT AND YOU KNOW, YOU'RE, YOU'RE WASHING YOUR, DRYING, YOUR KITCHEN AND EVERYTHING WOULD BE TOGETHER INSTEAD OF SPLIT ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE LIVING ROOM.
I THINK THAT WOULD SOLVE A COUPLE OF ISSUES.
THAT ONE WOULD BE THE FRONT ELEVATION TO HAVE AN ADDITIONAL WINDOW.
IT ALSO LETS YOU PUT ANOTHER WINDOW ON THE BACK ELEVATION, WHICH IS WHAT WE'RE MORE INTERESTED IN IS THE, IS THE EXTERIOR CONDITION.
UM, I DON'T HAVE A SOLUTION FOR THE FIREPLACE OTHER THAN ELIMINATING IT.
UM, I KNOW THERE ARE VENTLESS, BUT VENTLESS FIREPLACES, BUT I DON'T PROPOSE, I DON'T, UH, I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF USING THOSE.
UM, THERE WOULD BE THE OPTION OF PUTTING A FIREPLACE IN THE MASTER BEDROOM, SO YOU'D HAVE IT ON THE SIDE.
SO WITH THE FIREPLACE, IT'S ACTUALLY AN, A A**L, UH, FIREPLACE.
IT'S NOT GOING TO BE FUNCTIONAL.
NO, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE A FUNCTIONAL FIREPLACE.
UM, SO YEAH, SO THE QUESTION ABOUT THE UTILITY AND THE WINDOWS, UM, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT I WOULD WANT TO ASK THE ARCHITECT AND SEE HOW MUCH OF A, YOU KNOW, DISCUSSION FROM THE INITIAL PLAN IT, IT'S GOING TO BE.
BUT I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY, LIKE I STATED EARLIER, YOU KNOW, OUR MAIN GOAL IS TO TRY TO GET AS CLOSELY AS POSSIBLE.
YOU KNOW, GIVEN THE HISTORIC NATURE OF THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT COMMUNITY AS CLOSELY AS POSSIBLE TO WHAT IT WAS.
SO IF IT, IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN DO WITHOUT ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, UH, DEVIATING TOO FAR FROM WHAT WE HAVE, I ABSOLUTELY WILL.
UM, I MEAN, I, I UNDERSTAND THAT PUTTING A WINDOW IN THE FRONT, IN THE UTILITY ROOM WOULD GET US ANOTHER WINDOW ON THE FRONT.
UH, AND I, I AGREED WITH ALL THE CONDITIONS THAT DR.
DUN HAS PLACED, I THINK ALL THOSE MAKE A LOT OF SENSE WITH, UH, PROPORTIONS AND GETTING THE PORCH WIDER AND THE PORCH DEEPER AND, AND ALL OF THAT.
UM, BUT AGAIN, GETTING A LITTLE BIT MORE FUNCTIONAL, AND I KNOW THAT'S NOT OUR PURVIEW, THE FUNCTION OF THE INTERIOR, BUT IT, IT SOLVES A NUMBER OF ISSUES ON THE EXTERIOR.
NO, IT TOTALLY, IT TOTALLY MAKES SENSE.
UM, I'M GLAD TO MAKE A MOTION.
I LIKE TO TALK A LITTLE FURTHER ABOUT NO, SURE.
I, I'VE GOT JUST, UH, SOME ISSUES WITH THE FACADE.
IF I COULD JUST TAKE A MOMENT, UH, COULD I MAKE IT TO STAND UP AND POINT TO BE YES, YOU CAN DO THAT.
THAT'S GOING MORE IN THE MIDDLE, RIGHT? YEAH.
THAT, THAT'S WHAT THE CONDITIONS ALREADY HIGHLIGHT.
[02:20:01]
YEAH.SO THAT'S WHAT ONE CONDITIONS ARE THAT YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO DO IN THE CONDITIONS.
BECAUSE, BECAUSE IN FACT, TO, TO YOUR POINT, IF, UH, IF THE, IF THOSE WERE THEN EQUALLY SPACE THREE YEAH.
BECAUSE THEN YOU'D HAVE A DOOR AND WINDOWS IN THE EITHER SIDE OF THE, SO THAT'S A NICE HALF OF THE YEAH.
THIS DOESN'T SHOW UP ON THE, THERE'S INCONSISTENCIES BETWEEN OKAY.
WE, WE'LL MAKE SURE THEY'RE, UM, CORRECT.
AND THERE IS SOME, THERE IS SOME DETAILS THAT IT JUST SEEMS LIKE THE FASCIA BOARD'S SIMPLE.
IT SEEMS LIKE THERE'S AN EXTRA DETAIL IF ON THE FASCIA BOARD, UM, UH, THE, UH, THE, THE TOP OF THE LITTLE GABLE WINDOW HAS A LITTLE BIT DETAIL THAT COULD BE PICKED UP.
IT WOULD BE NICE IF THERE WERE CERTAIN DETAILS THAT COULD ACTUALLY GET PICKED UP FROM WHAT, WHAT USED TO BE THERE.
THAT COULD BE SOME SIMPLE THINGS TO PICK UP.
DOES THAT MEAN, OH, COMMISSIONER PREZI NOW HAS THAT NUMBER? I JUST HAD ONE MORE SMALL ITEM.
UM, THE, THE WING WALLS FOR THE STEPS, THOSE SHOULD REALLY BE IN LINE WITH THE COLUMNS OR THE, OKAY, SO IT'S A, YEAH.
COMMISSIONER RENE, NO PRESSURE, BUT EVERYONE HAS A TIP.
HE'S ALWAYS VERY BRAVE ABOUT THESE COMPLICATED EXCUSE.
CASE NUMBER CA 2 4 5 DASH 3 6 5 RD, ALSO KNOWN AS 36 27 HAVANA STREET THAT WE, UM, FOLLOW STAFF RECOMMENDATION AND APPROVE WITH THE CONDITIONS AS STATED WITH, UM, SOME ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS THAT, UM, THE APPLICANT CONSIDER, UM, REDESIGN OF THE, UM, UTILITY TO ALLOW FOR AN ADDITIONAL WINDOW ON THE FRONT.
ALLOW FOR AN ADDITIONAL WINDOW ON THE REAR ADD BRACKETS AS SHOWN ON THE ORIGINAL HOME, UH, THAT WAS, UH, THAT WAS DEMOLISHED.
SO THERE'S AN ADDITIONAL CORE BRACKETS THAT ARE ADDED AT THE, UM, AT THE ROOF RAKES.
THAT THE CHEEK WALLS, THE BRICK CHEEK WALLS THAT COME OUT, THOSE ARE THE, THE, THE TWO WALLS ON THE SIDE OF THE STEPS MM-HMM
THAT THEY ALIGN WITH THE COLUMNS THAT ARE IMMEDIATELY BEHIND THEM.
AND THAT CONCLUDES THE CONDITION.
ARE WE ON THE
IS THERE A SECOND, MR. LIVINGTON A SECOND? ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? ALL RIGHT, THEN IT'S TIME FOR A VOTE.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION FOR YES, YES, YES, YES.
THE MOTION HAS CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
AND, UM, IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT LENGTHY, UH, BUNCH OF, UM, CONDITIONS, DR.
DOWN WOULD BE HAPPY TO HELP YOU WITH THAT
SO PROCEED WITH YOUR WORK AND WE WISH YOU WELL.
OKAY, NEXT UP IS D ONE, WHICH WE HAVE SOMEONE SIGNED UP TO BE HERE ONLINE.
SO SOMEBODY CHECK ON THAT
HEY, YOU MUST STOP LEAVING US.
WE JUST LEAVE YOU DESPERATELY
CHRISTINA PEREZ, ON BEHALF OF STAFF DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER 1 7 1 4
[02:25:03]
HUNTLEY STREET, JUNIOR HEIGHTS HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 4 5 3 6 7 CP REQUEST NUMBER ONE, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO EXTEND DRIVEWAY REQUEST NUMBER TWO, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT CARPORT, EXCUSE ME, REQUEST NUMBER THREE, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL A FENCE AND SWING GATE STAFF RECOMMENDATION NUMBER ONE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO EXTEND DRIVEWAY BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 3 20 20 25.THAT PROPOSED WORK IS CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
SECTION 3.2, THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 G SIX C ROMAN I FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR SETTINGS, NEIGHBORHOOD AND DISTRICT NUMBER TWO, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT CARPORT BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 3 20 20 25.
THE PROPOSED WORK IS CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA SECTION NINE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 G SIX C ROMAN I FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR SETTINGS, NEIGHBORHOOD DISTRICT NUMBER THREE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL FENCE AND SWING GATE BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE WITH THE FINDING THE FACT THAT THERE IS NOT SUFFICIENT EVIDENCE TO DEMONSTRATE SAFETY CONCERNS, THE LANDMARK COMMISSION MAY ALLOW A FENCE TO BE LOCATED FIVE FEET BEHIND PORCH OF THE HOUSE REQUESTING THE FENCE.
HOWEVER, AS PROPOSED THE WORK, THE WORK IS INCONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA SECTION 3.6 A TWO, THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 G SIX C ROMAN I FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF INTERIOR STANDARDS TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION NUMBER ONE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO EXTEND DRIVEWAY BE APPROVED.
NUMBER TWO, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS CONSTRUCT CARPORT BE APPROVED WITH RECOMMENDATION.
THE ROOF PITCH WILL MATCH ROOF, PITCH OF HOUSE AND COLOR AND SHINGLE SAMPLES BE SUPPLIED.
NUMBER THREE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL FENCE AND SWING GATE BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
FENCE GATE AT SIDE YARD MUST BE AT 50% MARK.
AND WE HAVE, UH, ONE SPEAKER FOR THIS ONLINE, CASEY TRIPP.
IF YOU WOULD BEGIN BY GIVING US YOUR NAME, YOUR ADDRESS, AND YOUR PROMISE OR AFFIRMATION OR SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH.
MY NAME IS CASEY TRIPP, RESIDENT OF 7 1 4 HUNTLEY STREET IN DALLAS, WHICH IS THE PROPERTY BEING DISCUSSED HERE TODAY.
AND I WILL TELL THE TRUTH DURING MY TIME.
UM, MAY I PROCEED? YES, GO AHEAD.
UM, SO I WAS ABLE TO ATTEND THE BRIEFING THIS MORNING, AND I THINK THAT WILL HELP SPEED UP THE DISCUSSION QUITE A BIT FOR US TO EXPLAIN THE REQUEST FOR THE VARIANCE ON THE GATE LOCATION, UM, WHEN WE WERE CONSIDERING A PROJECT WHICH INCLUDES THE CARPORT, WHICH INCLUDES THE DRIVEWAY EXTENSION AND THE ABILITY TO ACCESS THE BACKYARD FROM BOTH THE FORWARD AND REAR GATES TO BE CONSTRUCTED AND ONE'S ALREADY IN PLACE TO BE REPLACED.
UM, FURTHER, UH, COMPLICATING MATTERS IS THE FACT THAT OUR DRIVEWAY IS SHARED WITH OUR NEIGHBOR.
THEY ARE SET SEPARATELY DEEDED, HOWEVER, IT'S ONE SHARED DRIVEWAY, ONE SHARED DRIVEWAY GATE APPARATUS WITH TWO IN INDEPENDENTLY SWINGING MANUAL WOODEN GATES.
UM, AND SO IN CONSIDERATION FOR OUR NEIGHBOR, UM, AS WELL AS OUR OWN SECURITY FOR PRIVACY, UM, THE REQUEST WAS MADE UNDERSTANDING THAT THE, WHAT, WHAT THE ORDINANCE STATES WITH RESPECT TO THE LOCATIONS THAT THE NATURE OF THE GATE BEING IN THE SAME PLACE TODAY.
UM, AND THINKING THROUGH HOW POTENTIALLY MOVING OUR OWN DRIVEWAY GATE BACK 10 TO 12 FEET, UH, WHATEVER THE, THE DISTANCE IS TO COMPLY, WOULD THEN LEAVE OUR NEIGHBOR'S YARD EXPOSED, UM, FOR THAT SECTION WHERE HIS GATE IS HANGING IN FRONT OF OURS.
AND SO THAT WAS, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S NOT A MATTER OF NECESSARILY WHERE WE WANTED THE GATE OR WHERE IT IS TODAY.
FOR US, IT'S REALLY JUST, UM, THINKING THROUGH THE HARMONY OF COEXISTING WITH, WITH, UM, OUR NEXT DOOR NEIGHBORS.
SO, AND BEYOND THAT, HAPPY TO ASK A, A ANSWER.
UH, THE PANEL MAY HAVE, UM, I DO HAVE, UH, ON THE LINE, THEY'RE NOT REGISTERED TO SPEAK THE APPLICANT WHO IS OUR BUILDER, BRYCE BARTLETT.
UM, HE'S AT THE READY TO PREPARE, UH, ANY RESPONSES THAT I CAN THEN RECITE, UM, FOR THE ORDER, UM,
[02:30:01]
BEYOND THAT.UM, THANKS FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION.
UM, WE, WE CAN ALLOW THE OTHER SPEAKER TO SPEAK IF, UH, THEY'RE MOVED OVER AND THEY DO THE WHOLE GIVE ME THEIR NAME AND ADDRESS AND SWEAR STUFF.
UH, SO STAFF HAS TO MAKE THEM A PANELIST.
WHAT WAS THE NAME AGAIN, SIR? LAST NAME IS BARTLETT.
SO WE'LL SEE IF WE CAN GET BRYCE BARTLETT.
ARE YOU THERE? AND WE NEED TO SEE YOUR FACE, SIR.
WE HAVE TO SEE YOU OR MA'AM, I HAVE NO IDEA, BUT WE HAVE TO SEE YOU.
THERE YOU ARE WITH, WITH A NICE SIGN BEHIND YOU.
UH, IF YOU COULD GIVE ME YOUR NAME, ADDRESS, AND YOUR, UH, THAT YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM OR PROMISE TO TELL THE TRUTH.
BRYCE BARTLETT TEN SEVEN TWENTY MILLER ROAD, SUITE TWO 18 IN DALLAS.
AND I DO SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH.
IS THERE ANYTHING YOU'D LIKE TO ADD ABOUT, UM, ABOUT THIS PROJECT THAT WE SHOULD CONSIDER? NO, I MEAN, THE AGREEMENTS WITH CASEY, I DO WANNA ADD THAT WE PUT TO THE, UM, THE GATE WHERE IT CURRENTLY IS.
WE DID NOT CHANGE THE EXISTING POSITION.
UH, WE JUST KEPT IT WHERE IT WAS AND JUST CREATED A NEW GATE, A NEW FORTIFIED GATE.
UH, THEN HANG ON FOR QUESTIONS, COMMISSIONERS QUESTIONS, COMMISSIONER HARPER? YEAH, JUST TO CLARIFY, UH, I UNDERSTAND WHAT THE APPLICANT SAID ABOUT THE ADJACENT PROPERTY.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I'M, SO THERE'S NOT A DEMISING FENCE BETWEEN YOUR PROPERTY AND THEIRS BEHIND THE GATE.
CURRENTLY, THERE IS A, THERE IS A FENCE, HOWEVER, THE CURRENT CONDITION IS, IS SUCH THAT THEY'RE MISSING PLANKS, MISSING BOARDS THAT WOULD LEAVE, UM, SOME EXPOSURE IF MOVED BACK.
SO, SO THERE IS A FENCE THERE.
SO MY, MY SECOND QUESTION IS GONNA BE IF THERE'S NOT A FENCE THERE, IS IT CONCEIVABLE TO, TO BUILD IN THAT PORTION OF FENCE IF YOU MOVE THE GATE BACK SO THAT THEIR YARD WOULD BE SECURED? UH, AS, AS I SEE IT, I THINK THAT WOULD BE, UM, A DISCUSSION BETWEEN MY NEIGHBOR AND MYSELF.
BECAUSE IF OUR GATE IS FURTHER BACK AND IT'S, YOU KNOW, UM, HE WILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE SAME PROCESS IF HE WOULD LIKE TO DO ANYTHING OTHER THAN MINOR MAINTENANCE, I THINK TO THAT EXISTING STRUCTURE, WHICH COULD INCLUDE THE PANELS AND WHATNOT.
UM, AT THAT POINT I THINK WE WOULD HAVE TO HAVE A DISCUSSION ON WHO BEARS THE COST THERE.
I JUST WANTED TO PULL UP THE PICTURE OF THE SHARED DRIVEWAY, JUST SO WE CAN SEE THE PROPOSED LOCATION IN ITS ENTIRETY.
IT LOOKS LIKE ON THE NEIGHBORING STRUCTURE THAT THAT MIGHT BE RIGHT IN FRONT OF A BUMP OUT.
UM, 'CAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE THIS PHOTO.
UM, I JUST WANTED YOU TO HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION SINCE THEY SAID IT WAS A SHARED DRIVEWAY, THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT CONSIDERATION.
AND, AND WHAT SHE IS SAYING, SIR, IS THAT, UM, YOUR NEIGHBOR'S FENCE IS NOT WHERE WE WOULD'VE PREFERRED THEY PUT IT.
IF THEY HAD ASKED US, WE'D RATHER HAVE IT FURTHER BACK.
SO YOU OWN A WIDE ENOUGH SLICE OF DRIVEWAY THAT YOU CAN DRIVE A CAR DOWN IT.
YOU DON'T JUST DON'T HAVE A WIDTH OF A CAR.
IT'S, IT'S A SINGLE CAR WIDTH THAT WE OWN.
BUT IN TERMS OF, IT'S NOT A, IT'S NOT A SHARED, UM, ACCESS, BUT IT IS IN PRACTICE.
YOU'VE GOT A LITTLE MORE ROOM TO RUN THERE.
WE HAVE ABOUT, IT APPEARS TO BE TWO SEPARATE DRIVEWAYS.
THE PAVING DOESN'T EVEN LOOK LIKE IT MATCHES, BUT THEY, THEY MEET.
UM, IS THERE A POSSIBILITY, SIR, THAT WE COULD GO WITH A GATE THAT IS, UM, INSTEAD OF WOOD, IT'S METAL? I DON'T, I DON'T EVEN REMEMBER WHAT THIS ONE LOOKS LIKE THAT YOU PROPOSED.
SO SOMETIMES WHEN WE ALLOW, WHEN WE OCCASIONALLY ALLOW SOMEONE TO HAVE SOME FENCE FURTHER FORWARD, WE ASK IT TO BE A THROUGH FENCE SO THAT IT IS NOT COVERING UP THE FEATURES OF THE HOUSE.
IS THAT SOMETHING YOU WOULD DO? SO LIKE THE METAL BARS PUT TOGETHER INTO THE SHAPE OF A OKAY.
WE CAN CONSIDER IT THOUGH, WITHOUT THINKING THROUGH MY HUSBAND'S DESIGN AESTHETIC, AESTHETIC.
I THINK HIS PREFERENCE WOULD BE TO BUMP, BUMP THE GATE BACK.
BUT WE COULD CERTAINLY CONSIDER IT IF THAT WOULD HELP, UM, KEEP THE FOOTPRINT THE SAME.
AND BRYCE, THAT, YOU KNOW, WE, WE'D NEED TO TALK ABOUT A CHANGE ORDER WITH RESPECT TO THAT.
BUT YOU KNOW, I, I THINK IT WOULD BE WORTH TALKING ABOUT.
UH, THAT'S, THAT'S GOOD TO KNOW.
'CAUSE THERE ARE, WE DO TRY TO SEEK SOME COMPROMISES THAT MEET THE NEEDS OF PRESERVATION AND THE NEEDS OF THE OWNER OF THE, THE BUILDING.
ANY FURTHER? YES, I HAVE A COMMENT.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THE, THE WINDOW DIRECTLY BEHIND THE GATE, UH, IS A BEDROOM AND IT'S, IT'S A BEDROOM.
AND SAFETY IS A, IS A CONCERN IF, IF THE GATE IS PUSHED BACK 'CAUSE THAT BEDROOM IS OCCUPIED.
JUST WANTED TO SHARE THAT WITH THE COMMITTEE.
[02:35:02]
OKAY.YEAH, WE, WE, WE HEAR, UH, THAT OCCASIONALLY ABOUT PEOPLE'S CONCERNS ABOUT THOSE WINDOWS OF THE FRONT BEING SOME ROOM.
THEY DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO GET NEAR.
WE ALWAYS DO REMIND THEM THAT A NICE WOODEN FENCE IS, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE CAPABLE OF CLIMBING OVER A FENCE AS MANY PEOPLE ARE, SUCH A FENCE IS REALLY A BOON FOR BREAK IN ARTISTS BECAUSE THEY HAVE TIME TO WORK WITHOUT ANYBODY NOTICING THEM OUT FRONT.
YOU KNOW, WHY YOU'RE STANDING OUT IN THE OPEN, WHO WOULD WANNA STAND THERE FOREVER, TIME TO BREAK IN.
SO THERE, THERE IS NO PERFECT SAFETY ANSWER.
COMMISSIONER ANDERSON, I NEED SOME CLARIFICATION.
IT APPEARS THAT THE APPLICANT WE'RE TALKING TO TODAY IS AMENABLE TO MOVING THE FENCE BACK, BUT THE OTHER NEIGHBORING FENCE WOULD STILL BE THERE GATE.
IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT.
IT'S AN INTERESTING SITUATION 'CAUSE WE HAVE TWO OWNERS OF KIND OF THE SAME FENCE.
AND IT IS AN INTRIGUING QUESTION.
WOULD THE OTHER OWNER BE AMENABLE TO MOVING THE FENCE BACK OR NOT THE GATE AT THIS TIME? I DON'T THINK THAT'S IN HIS CURRENT PLAN.
UM, HE'S UNDERGOING A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT RENOVATION PROCESS HIMSELF.
UM, IT COULD BE FURTHER ON THE TABLE.
ON THE TABLE, BUT IT'S NOT SOMETHING HE AND I HAVE DISCUSSED.
HE'S NOT EVEN OCCUPYING THE HOUSE YET AS A POSSIBLE COMPROMISE.
AND I, THIS IS NOT SOMETHING I NORMALLY SUPPORT.
COULD WE LOOK AT DOING A ROD IRON FENCE ACROSS THE WHOLE FRONT TO KEEP PEOPLE AWAY FROM THAT ONE BEDROOM WINDOW BUT ARE STILL ALLOWING PEOPLE TO SEE INTO THE PROPERTY FOR SECURITY AND ALSO THIS WOOD FENCE IS TOO FAR FORWARD AND REALLY IS NOT WHERE THEY SHOULD BE.
AND MY FEAR IS THAT OTHER PEOPLE MAY WANT FENCE IN THAT LOCATION IF WE PUT A NEW FENCE IN THAT LOCATION, WE'RE SORT OF OPENING THE DOOR FOR OTHERS TO HAVE FENCES THAT FAR FORWARD.
I I'M THINKING AS A POSSIBLE COMPROMISE DOING A WROUGHT IRON FENCE THROUGH THE GENTLEMAN WHO'S HERE TODAY AND AND TIME PUTTING ANOTHER WR IRON FENCE ON THE OTHER SIDE.
IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WE COULD BE CONSIDERED? YEAH, WE COULD CONSIDER THAT.
AND HEARING THAT, YOU KNOW, OPTION A WOULD BE TO MOVE THE, A WOODEN, UH, FENCE BACK TO BE WHERE IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE IN THE BACK 50% OR OPTION B BEING LEAVING A METAL, A WROUGHT IRON FENCE, AUTOMATIC, UH, WITH AUTOMATIC DRIVEWAY CAPABILITY OR GATE CAPABILITY IN THE EXISTING FOOTPRINT.
I THINK THOSE, EITHER OF THOSE WOULD BE UP FOR CONSIDERATION.
UM, LIKE WE'D BE FINE WITH, WITH ONE OR THE OTHER.
UM, BUT JUST IN IN CONSIDERATION WE MAY UM, HAVE TO HAVE SOME DIFFICULT CONVERSATIONS WITH OUR NEIGHBOR IF IT'S NOT GONNA BE IN THE SAME PLACE OR OF A DIFFERENT MATERIAL FOR THAT MATTER.
AND, AND REMIND ME THERE IS A FENCE BETWEEN THE TWO PROPERTIES BEHIND THE FENCE WE SEE.
SO THERE'S A DIVISION DOWN THE MIDDLE.
BUT IT'S IN POOR CONDITION AND NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED ANYWAY.
SO IF INDEED WE WOULD MOVE THE FENCE, THAT'S THE APPLICATION TODAY.
BACK FURTHER BACK THERE STILL WOULD BE A WOOD FENCE OR WOOD FENCE THAT COULD BE RESTORED BETWEEN THE TWO PROPERTIES.
SO WE DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO DEAL WITH BOTH GATES AT ONE TIME.
BUT IT WOULD BE A MATTER OF WHO COST.
WHO'S BEARING THE COST? BECAUSE IF YOU TOOK DOWN, IF YOU MOVED YOUR SIDE FURTHER TO THE REAR 50%, BUT YOU'RE THE ONE THAT'S CHANGING THE FENCE, YOU WOULD ONLY FENCE IT TO THE 50% AND THEN THERE WOULD BE AN OPEN, ESSENTIALLY AN OPEN SECTION.
'CAUSE YOU WOULD, AND I THOUGHT THERE WAS, I THOUGHT THERE WAS A WOOD FENCE DOWN THE MIDDLE.
THERE IS, BUT HE'S PROPOSING TO REPLACE ALL THE FENCE ALL THE WAY UP TO INCLUDE THAT.
DO YOU SEE WHAT I'M SAYING? SO HE'S PROPOSING TO TAKE DOWN THE SIDES AND THE REAR REPLACING ALL OF IT.
SO THEN HE'D BE TAKING DOWN THAT DIVIDER.
WELL COULDN COULDN'T KEEP IT UP, BUT HE COULD STILL REPLACE IT AND PUT THE GATE FURTHER BACK.
HE COULD, BUT THEN THERE WOULD BE A, IT WOULD GAP.
AND THAT'S WHAT HE WAS SAYING IT WOULD BE WHO WOULD THEN BIRD BEAR THE PRI YOU KNOW, THE BURDEN OF THE COST BECAUSE THE NEIGHBOR WOULD SAY, WELL I WANT IT TO BE ALL THE WAY UP, BUT TECHNICALLY WE CAN'T PUT THAT ON THE CA IF YOU'RE ASKING HIM TO REMOVE IT BACK.
DO YOU SEE WHAT I'M SAYING? YEAH, I HAVE AN IDEA.
I THINK WE'RE A LITTLE PREMATURE.
THERE IS ANOTHER WHOLE ENTITY INVOLVED IN THIS.
I WOULD PREFER THAT WE DELAY THIS, DENY IT WITHOUT PREJUDICE THAT THE TWO OWNERS COME TOGETHER AT A LATER DATE AND HAVE A SOLUTION BECAUSE WE CAN'T, WE CAN'T FIX ONE FENCE AND LEAVE THE OTHER ONE ALONE.
WELL WE ALL TIME, I UNDERSTAND WHY YOU'D BE GOING FOR THAT.
I JUST DON'T SEE THAT WE CAN HOLD THIS APPLICANT RESPONSIBLE FOR NOT GETTING TO HAVE A POSITIVE OR NEGATIVE MOVING FORWARD WITH THAT UNTIL THEIR NEIGHBOR SAYS SOMETHING.
'CAUSE THEIR NEIGHBOR'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PERSON.
THEIR NEIGHBOR DOESN'T EVER HAVE TO DO ANYTHING.
WELL THE TWO ABOUT THIS SITUATION, THEY CAN SAY, GO AWAY.
I DON'T EVEN WANNA THINK ABOUT THIS.
[02:40:01]
OKAY, THE TWO OPTIONS, BUT THIS PERSON NEEDS TO HAVE THE TWO OPTIONS ARE WE APPROVE THE FENCE WE HAVE TODAY AND WE MOVE IT BACK TO THE MIDPOINT AND THEY CAN DECIDE AMONG THEMSELVES HOW TO FIX THE OTHER PART OR WE CAN DE NOT DELAY IT TO A LATER DATE AND THEY COME TOGETHER.ACTUALLY OUR, OUR TWO OPTIONS ARE THAT, THAT OUR APPLICANT HAS SAID HE WOULD BE WILLING TO DO, DEPENDING ON WHETHER HE OR HIS HUSBAND'S VIEWPOINT ABOUT WHAT IS BETTER PREVAILS.
UM, WE HAVE A WOODEN FENCE MOVED BACK TO THE APPROPRIATE LOCATION, RIGHT.
LEAVING THE, THE CURRENT DIVIDING FENCE THAT IS NOT IN GREAT SHAPE AND THEN SOMEHOW THE NEIGHBORS WORK THAT OUT.
OR WE HAVE A FENCE UP AT THE FRONT IF WE WERE TO PROVE IT, THAT IS METAL AND YOU CAN SEE THROUGH AND DOESN'T MATCH THE ONE NEXT TO IT.
WHICH ALSO THEN IT'S AFTER THAT'S DONE, THE NEIGHBOR DECIDES WHAT THEY WANT TO DO ABOUT THEIR FENCE, WHICH CAN BE NOT CHANGE IT DO THE SAME THING.
THESE PEOPLE HAVE ASKED US TO GIVE THEM AN ANSWER.
IT IS UNFORTUNATE THAT THEIR NEIGHBORS, THEIR NEIGHBORS ARE SO CLOSE THAT THEIR NEIGHBORS, YOU KNOW, VISUALS ALSO REPEAT IT.
BUT THAT SEEMED TO BE OUR TWO CHOICES AND THEY HAVE INDICATED A POTENTIAL TO GO WITH EITHER ONE OF THOSE.
WELL I WOULD RECOMMEND DOING WHAT YOU SAID FIRST, MOVING THE FENCE BACK TO WHERE IN THE MIDPOINT WHERE HE'S AGREED TO MOVE IT AND THEY CAN WORK ON THE OTHER SITUATION THEMSELVES.
I'D RATHER HAVE A WOOD FENCE BACK WHERE IT BELONGS AND A METAL FENCE OR DOESN'T BELONG.
JU, JUST TO POINT OUT IS THIS ONE THAT YOU MIGHT POSSIBLY BE WILLING TO USE THE WIGGLE ROOM FOR WHERE IT'S ONLY MOVED BACK FIVE FEET BEHIND THE PORCH INSTEAD OF ALL THE WAY TO THE BACK AND THAT MIGHT SATISFY THE BEDROOM WINDOW.
WE COULD MOVE THE WOODEN FENCE BACK FIVE FEET IF WE WANTED TO.
THAT'S THIS PARTICULAR ORDINANCE ALLOWS THAT.
SO I JUST WANTED TO DO THEY ALLOW A C THROUGH FENCE, YOU KNOW, A VISIBLE FENCE YOU CAN SEE THROUGH RIGHT AT THE FRONT IF WE WANT TO.
SO WE HAVE THREE OPTIONS AND CONTRACTOR HAS AN IDEA.
OKAY,
ALL THE HOUSES ACROSS THE STREET PRE THREE TO FOUR.
THE, THE FENCES ON THE HOUSES DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET.
THE GATES AND FENCES ARE ALL UP CLOSE.
ANYBODY SEE THAT? I COULDN'T BELIEVE THAT THAT HAPPENED, BUT IT COULD HAVE HAPPENED IN SEVERAL WAYS.
AS WE DISCUSSED EARLIER, IT WAS THERE BEFORE IT BECAME A HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THEY HAVE BUILT IT ILLEGALLY AND WE NEVER NOTICED.
AND UM, SO IT DOESN'T REALLY SERVE AS PRECEDENT.
IT DOES SERVE AS AN ILLUSTRATION OF WHY WE DON'T WANT THEM TO DO THAT.
BECAUSE YOU DON'T GET TO SEE SO MUCH OF THE FRONT OF THE HOUSES AND THE SIDE OF THE HOUSES 'CAUSE OF ALL FENCES IN THE WAY.
ALRIGHT, WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT THREE POSSIBLE THINGS WE CAN DO TODAY THAT AFFECT ONLY THIS APPLICANT AND ONLY THEIR PROPERTY.
DOES ANYBODY WANT TO GO AND MAKE A MOTION NOW? AND WE NEVER EVEN TALKED ABOUT THE BIG STRUCTURE IN THE BACK, WHICH WOULD SEEM TO BE THE BIGGER IDEA, BUT YOU KNOW, IT'S IN THE BACK.
WELL YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE A MOTION NOW, NOW.
SO CAN YOU COMMENT IN THE FORM OF A QUESTION? UM, I HAVE TO ASK THE, MAKE A COMMENT IN THE FORM OF A QUESTION.
SO THAT, THAT'S PART OF THE QUESTION.
OH, WELL LEMME JUST SAY I'M, I FOR ONE, I END UP BEING ALONG THE CENTER, BUT I'M NOT GONNA BE VOTING IN SUPPORT OF, UH, PERPETUATING AN ADVERSE CONDITION THAT OBSCURES AN ARCHITECTURAL FEATURE.
UM, AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE SOLUTION IS, BUT ALLOWING THE FENCE TO STAY IN ITS CURRENT POSITION IS NOT GONNA BE ONE OF THE THINGS ALSO.
WHAT ABOUT ALLOWING A MOSTLY OPEN FENCE TO STAY IN THAT POSITION? I THINK IT STILL PERPETUATES THE PROBLEM.
MAYBE NOT FOR THE APPLICANT, BUT THE SITUATION IT SEEMS, UM, BEYOND JUST THE APPLICATION EXPENSE, IT'S SHARED DRIVEWAY.
YOU'RE NOT UNCOMMON IN THESE AREAS.
BUT THEY STILL DON'T, THEY STILL DON'T POSE EXEMPTIONS TO THE ORDINANCE.
AND WHAT WE SEE NOW WOULD, I MEAN WOULD LIKE EVERYBODY TO BEAR IN MIND IS WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT NOW IS EITHER ROGUE BEHAVIOR OR BEHAVIOR THAT TOOK PLACE BEFORE THE ORDINANCE OR, UM, NO ENFORCEMENT OF THE ORDINANCE IN FIRST PLACE.
AND SO THIS IS WHY FENCES ARE IMPORTANT.
THEY'RE EVERYBODY'S IMPORTANT AS LANDSCAPES AND COLOR.
THOSE ARE THOSE THREE THINGS ARE THE EASIEST THINGS YOU CAN DO TO HELP PRESERVE AN AREA.
SO, UM, I THINK THAT SIDE GABLE IS AN ARCHITECTURAL SIGNIFICANT FUTURE.
UM, I THINK THE FOR IS AN ARCHITECTURAL SIGNIFICANT FUTURE.
NOT ALL OF US HAVE A WRAPAROUND SURE WOULD BE NICE TO MAKE SURE IT BRAGS AND SHOWS FOR THE SIDE.
BUT I'LL LET, UM, I'LL LET SOMEBODY ELSE MAKE A MOTION THAT THEY JUDGE
[02:45:01]
YOU'RE NOT INTERESTED IN MAKING A MOTION.WE DO HAVE THE ALTERNATIVE OF PUSH THE FENCE BACK TO THE 50% LINE OR BACK BY FIVE FEET AND HAVE IT BE FOLLOWED.
MAKES THE MOTION, LET SOMEBODY ELSE DO IT.
ABOUT FIVE FEET? NOPE, WE HAVE A FOURTH THAT YEAH,
OKAY, NOW I AWAIT SOMEONE TO MAKE A MOTION.
OH, COMMISSIONER RENO, THIS LINE UP.
OH, WHAT, IT'S ANOTHER QUESTION THOUGH.
SO IF THE, IF THE APPLICANT'S FENCE MOVES BACK, WHY WOULDN'T THERE STILL BE A FENCE CLOSING OFF THE NEIGHBOR'S PROPERTY? THEY SAID THERE IS A FENCE, IT'S JUST THAT SOME BOARDS ARE FALLING OFF SO IT'S NOT A GOOD FENCE.
I UNDERSTAND, BUT WHY? BECAUSE ARE YOU GONNA JUST ONLY TAKE DOWN AND LEAVE LIKE WHATEVER THE BEEF? YEAH, JUST LEANING OVER FALLING.
IF WHAT? IT'S, WHAT IF IT'S IN THE MIDDLE OF A PANEL
SEE, I'LL SEE WHERE IT GOES IN THE CASE.
DO YOU HAVE YOUR LITTLE SHEET FROM OUR ATTORNEY TO YOUR SHEET SHEET? I I WILL PUT IT ON THE SHEET LATER.
UM, NO, I MEAN YOUR CHEAT SHEET HE GAVE US FOR HOW HE'D LIKES US TO SAY IT.
IF THEY DON'T LIKE IT, SOMEBODY ELSE WILL MAKE THE MOTION.
NO
AND I'LL ADD IF THE FENCE BETWEEN THE PROPERTY NEEDS REPAIR, UH, THEY EITHER NEIGHBOR CAN APPLY FOR A ROUTINE MAINTENANCE AID, REPAIR THAT FENCE, APPROVE THE REST OF THE APPLICATION PER STAFF RECOMMENDATION.
ALRIGHT, MADAM CHAIR, I, CAN I ASK A QUESTION? COMMISSIONER ANDERSON, I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE IN SUMMARY, YOU'RE ESSENTIALLY APPROVING, UH, THE REQUEST WITH THAT ONE EXCEPTION ABOUT THE, THE FENCE BEING PUSHED BACK DID SHORT.
SO THE DRIVEWAY EXTENSION, THE STRUCTURE PROPOSED FOR THE BACK ARE BOTH APPROVED? YES.
AS, AS THE, AS STAFF RECOMMENDED.
AND THEN IN THE FRONT, A SWING GATE WILL BE APPROVED IF IT IS AT THE 50% MARK.
DO WE HAVE A SECOND ON THIS THAT I DIDN'T HEAR? OR SECOND? I'LL SECOND.
COMMISSIONER SHERMAN HAS SECONDED ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION.
COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER? UM, I, I WON'T, I WON'T SUPPORT THE MOTION.
UM, I DEAL WITH FENCES EVERY DAY IN A, IN A COMMUNITY WITH THESE KIND OF ISSUES.
AND UM, SO I THINK MY HEARTBURN IS THAT THE NEIGHBOR HOU THE NEIGHBORING HOUSE NEXT DOOR IS SO MUCH SHORTER.
AND SO THEREFORE ULTIMATELY WHEN WE PUSH IT BACK TO 50% AT SEVEN 14, WHICH IS A LONGER HOUSE TOWARDS THE REAR YARD, I THINK ULTIMATELY THE NEIGHBOR NEXT DOOR IS NOT GOING TO ALIGN ONE DAY WITH THIS FENCE THAT'S NEXT DOOR AT SEVEN 14.
AND SO I THINK IT WILL BE JAGGED, IT WON'T BE IN LINE WITH ONE ANOTHER.
I WOULD'VE PREFERRED THE FIVE FOOT FROM THE PATIO, UH, PORCH.
THAT PROBABLY WOULD'VE ALLOWED IN THE FUTURE THE NEIGHBOR TO PUT THEM MORE IN LINE.
SO, UH, THAT'S WHY I'M STANDING ON THIS ONE.
WELL, DOESN'T THE FIVE FOOT PUT THE FENCE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE WINDOWS OF THE CURRENT HOUSE? I'M JUST SAYING I WOULD'VE RATHER IT BE IN THAT POSITION RATHER THAN THE HALFWAY FRONT.
I WOULD'VE MUCH RATHER IT JUST STAY WHERE IT'S ALRIGHTY.
ONE AND TWO ARE TO FOLLOW STAFF SUGGESTIONS FOR APPROVAL.
THREE IS TO APPROVE WITH A WOOD FENCE.
50% BACK ON THE HOUSE AT THE 50% HALFWAY BACK POINT OF THE HOUSE.
OKAY, MR. SHE MAY I ADD TO THE DISCUSSION IF WE WERE TO APPROVE MOVING THE APPLICANT'S FENCE BACK TO THE 50%, LIKE IT STILL DOESN'T MANDATE THAT HE HAS TO DO IT, IT ALSO STILL DOESN'T MANDATE THAT THE NEXT DOOR NEIGHBOR HAS TO DO ANYTHING.
WE CANNOT MANDATE THAT THE NEXT DOOR NEIGHBOR DOES ANYTHING AT ALL.
SO THE ROOM REMAINS IN THE FUTURE FOR THE TWO NEIGHBORS TO ASCERTAIN WHAT POSES THE BEST SOLUTION FOR BOTH AND HOPEFULLY THE BEST SOLUTION FOR THE DISTRICT ITSELF.
WELL, LET ME A COMMENT ACTUALLY, IF THEY WANNA KEEP THE FENCE LIKE THEY ARE TODAY, THEY'RE FINE.
IF THEY WANT TO DO ANYTHING TO THOSE FENCES, THEY ARE NOT LEGAL.
[02:50:01]
THEY NEVER GOT A CA THEY DON'T EXIST.ONCE THEY START MESSING WITH THEM, WE GO WITH WHAT WE SAY.
SO THEY WANNA KEEP THE FENCES WHERE THEY ARE UNTIL THEY FALL DOWN.
BUT WHEN THEY FALL DOWN, THEY GOTTA COME BACK AND PUT 'EM WHERE THEY BELONG.
BUT MY POINT WAS IF WE WERE TO, UM, APPROVE MOVING THE FENCE BACK WITH A 50% MARK, UM, IT STILL DOESN'T MEAN THE APPLICANT HAS TO DO IT.
HE HAS APPROVAL TO DO IT, BUT HE ISN'T MANDATED TO DO IT.
BUT UNTIL A FENCE FALLS DOWN, THEN YOU CAN'T PUT IT BACK.
THAT'S BEEN THE CASE ALL ALONG.
ALRIGHT THEN IS THERE ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? 'CAUSE IF NOT WE CAN VOTE ON THIS.
UH, UH, ONE MORE SUGGESTION, COMMISSIONER.
UM, INSTEAD OF 50% OR FIVE FEET, COULD IT BE 20 FEET? UM, IN OTHER WORDS, ANOTHER DIMENSION THAT'S THAT'S MORE, UH, AMENABLE TO BOTH HOMES IS 20 FEET LESS THAN 50% BACK.
WELL THAT'S UP TO THE, UM, THE MAKER AND THE SECOND, UH, I'M FINE WITH ANYTHING THAT MAKES THIS BETTER.
I I JUST THREW THE MIDPOINT OUT TO MAKE IT SIMPLE.
BUT IF WE THINK 20, 20 FEET BACK IS MORE AMENABLE TO BOTH PROPERTY OWNERS, I FINE WITH THAT.
UM, AND WE'RE TALKING, UNLESS WE KNOW THE EXACT, UNLESS WE KNOW THE EXACT MEASUREMENT, IT MIGHT BE EASIER TO SAY SOMETHING LIKE JUST BEHIND THOSE, THE FRONT PAIR OF WINDOWS.
OR SOMETHING TO THAT EFFECT RATHER THAN STICK A A VERY DEFINITE 20 FEET ON IT.
SO DO YOU WISH TO CHANGE YOUR MOTION TO SAY JUST BEHIND THOSE FRONT PAIR OF WINDOWS? SO BEHIND THAT FRONT BUMP OUT AT THE BACK OF THE, THERE'S A, THERE'S A BUMP OUT THERE.
THERE'S A BUMP OUT ON THE NEIGHBOR.
NO, ON THE, ON THE GRAY HOUSE THERE IS AN, THERE'S A GABLE WITH TWO WINDOWS BEHIND IT, BUT MAYBE IT'S NOT A BUMP OUT.
BUT AT THAT GABLE IT'S NOT A BUMP OUT.
I MEAN THAT MAY MAKES SENSE ARCHITECTURALLY TO BE BEHIND THAT GABLE.
YEAH, WELL THERE'S A GABLE BEHIND THE, THERE'S THE GABLE.
YOU WANT IT BEHIND THE GABLE? THAT'S MORE THAN 50% BACK? WELL, NO, THE, NO, WELL, FROM THE BACK OF THE PORCH YOU HAVE TO COUNT FROM, THERE'S THE BACK OF THE PORCH FROM THE BACK REAR OF THE PORCH.
OKAY, SO JUST AT THE BACK OF THE GABLE? YES.
NO, THAT'S WHERE YOU WOULD, YOU WOULD BE WILLING TO CHANGE THE THAT MAKES SENSE.
DOES THE SECOND DEGREE WITH THAT? WELL, I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IF, UM, COMMISSIONER RENO AGREES WITH THAT.
BUT OF COURSE I CAN'T CALL ON COMMISSIONER RENO 'CAUSE THAT'S NOT MY JOB.
UM, COMMISSIONER RENO, DID YOU WANT TO SPEAK? I'M SURE YOU DID.
UM, WOULD IT BE IN FACT FROM THE FRONT OF THE HOME? NOT IN THIS, NOT THE FRONT OF THE PORCH, BUT THE, THE FRONT OF THE MAIN BODY OF THE HOME? OR IS IT AT FROM THIS RECESS? BECAUSE THE IMPORTANT THING IS TO BE BEHIND LIKE THE GABLE I THINK, OR AT LEAST THE WINDOWS, BUT LIKE WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHICH IS 50%.
WELL I GUESS AGAIN, UM, WHERE'S THE 50% COUNTED FROM? IS IT FROM THE, THE FACE THAT'S ON THE STREET OR THE ONE THAT'S BEHIND IT? IT, AND I KNOW THIS IS NOT A, A GOOD ANSWER, BUT IT'S USUALLY COUNTED ON THE HOUSE, USUALLY INCLUDES THE BOOKS, BUT YEAH.
UM, WHAT YOU WERE SAYING, RIGHT.
AND I GUESS IF WE'RE SAYING, WELL THAT'S THE SAME AS 50%, IT'S CLOSER.
ALRIGHT, SO I ASKED AGAIN, COMMISSIONER ANDERSON, LET ME READ WHAT I THINK IS WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
I MOVED, I MOVE THAT THE WOOD GATE BE MOVED BACK BEHIND THE GABLE AT THE TWO WINDOWS ON THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE.
COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT? YES MA'AM.
SO SHE SHE CONTINUES TO SECOND.
ALRIGHT, SO I THINK IT'S TIME WE CALL FOR A VOTE ON THIS ALL IS IN FAVOR OF THIS MOTION.
PLEASE SAY YES, YES, YES, YES.
COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERG, COMMISSIONER SP ANYBODY AT HOME SAID NO.
ANYBODY ELSE HERE SAID NO AND I WAS NOT AWARE.
OKAY, SO IT APPEARS THE, THE MOTION STILL CARRIES, BUT WITH TWO PEOPLE WHO DISAGREED WITH IT.
SO, UM, SO, UM,
IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT WHAT WE FINALLY DECIDED HERE, STAFF WILL BE HAPPY TO HELP YOU FIGURE THAT OUT.
AND AS WE POINTED OUT, YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO ANYTHING RIGHT NOW.
YOU CAN SPEND SOME TIME TALKING TO YOUR NEIGHBOR AND SEE WHAT YOU WANNA DO.
AND WE ARE SORRY THAT YOUR CASE TURNED OUT TO BE SO CONFUSING AND COMPLICATED, BUT THAT'S HOW THE REAL WORLD WORKS.
SOMETIMES PEOPLE BUILT STUFF AND WE
[02:55:01]
DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO ABOUT THAT FACT.COMMISSIONER SP AND COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER SAID NO.
ALL RIGHT, NOW WE CAN MOVE ON TO DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER TWO.
DO WE HAVE TO SPEAK WITH THE TWO? SOMEBODY SAID THERE'S NOTHING ON HERE.
SUSAN STITCH, SHE'S ON, SHE'S ONLINE AND NEEDS TO BE MOVED TO A PANELIST.
SO WE DO HAVE SOMEONE ON LINE.
AND WHAT IS THE PERSON'S NAME? SUSAN STITCH.
OKAY, SO FIRST, UM, STAFF NEEDS TO READ THIS INTO THE YES RECORD.
CHRISTINA PEREZ ON BEHALF OF STAFF.
DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER 2 5 0 1 6 VICTOR STREET, MUNGER PLACE, HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 4 5 3 7 1 CP REQUEST NUMBER ONE, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL GUTTERS IN THE IN THE COLOR BRONZE CERTIFICATE.
NUMBER TWO, A CERTIFICATE TO CHANGE EXISTING PAINT COLOR TO SW 6 2 5 8 TRICO BLACK STAFF.
RECOMMENDATION NUMBER ONE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL GUTTERS IN THE COLOR OF BRONZE BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
THE PROPOSED WORK IS INCONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA SECTION 51 P DASH 97 1 11 C ONE FOUR, THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 G SIX C ROMAN TWO, OR I TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR SETTINGS, NEIGHBORHOOD AND DISTRICT REQUEST NUMBER TWO THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CHANGING EXISTING PAINT COLOR TO SW 62 58 TRICO BLACK BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
THE PROPOSED WORK IS INCONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA SECTION 51 P DASH 97 1 11 C SEVEN FOUR.
THE STANDARDS ENROLLMENT AT, EXCUSE ME, THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODES SECTION 51 A DASH 4.501 G SIX C ROMAN TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR SETTINGS, NEIGHBORHOOD AND DISTRICT TASK FORCE.
RECOMMENDATION NUMBER ONE, THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS TO INSTALL GUTTERS IN THE COLOR BRONZE BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
GUTTER COLOR MUST BE PAINTED OR COLOR TO MATCH THE PORTION OF THE STRUCTURE TO WHICH THEY'RE ATTACHED TO.
AND COLOR DOES NOT MEET ACCEPTABLE COLOR RANGE STANDARDS CONTAINING EXHIBIT 97 G.
NUMBER TWO, THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS TO CHANGE EXISTING PAINT COLOR TO SW 6 2 5 8 TRICO BLACK BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE PAINT TRIM COLOR DOES NOT MEET ACCEPTABLE COLOR RANGE STANDARDS CONTAINED IN EXHIBIT 97 G.
AND WE HAVE ONE SPEAKER ONLINE.
UM, I'M NOT SEEING HER ON A, HAS SHE BEEN MOVING OVER? HAVE YOU MOVED SUSAN OVER
OKAY, WE WILL NEED TO SEE YOU ON CAMERA MA'AM.
IT IS A STATE LAW THAT WE HAVE TO SEE YOU IF YOU'RE GOING TO SPEAK AT A PUBLIC MEETING.
SO NOW I'M SEEING THE NAME AND IF YOU CAN GET YOUR CAMERA ON THEN WE'LL BE READY.
I NEED YOU TO BEGIN WITH YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS AND TO SWEAR, AFFIRM OR PROMISE THAT YOU WILL TELL US THE TRUTH.
STILL MUTED AFTER YOU UN UNMUTE.
50 16 VICTOR STREET, SUSAN STICK AND I SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH.
OKAY MA'AM, YOU HAVE HAVE, UH, THREE MINUTES TO TELL US, UM, WHAT YOU THINK WE NEED TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR PROJECT.
YEAH, I MEAN BASICALLY I'M JUST TRYING TO, RIGHT NOW MY TRIM COLOR ON MY HOUSE IS TWO DIFFERENT COLORS.
I'M NOT SURE WHY, BUT I'M NEEDING TO REDO MY ROOF SO I CAN GET MY HOUSE INSURED.
AND SO WHILE I'M DOING THAT, I'M GONNA PAINT THE TRIM AND SO JUST TRYING TO FIND A COLOR THAT WILL BE APPROVED AND I'M WILLING TO CHANGE IT.
UM, I, I KNOW CHRISTINA SAID, YOU KNOW, TO FIND A COLOR WITHIN THE ZEL COLOR.
SO I'VE BEEN LOOKING FOR THAT AND HAVE FOUND ONE KIND OF BRONZE BASED WHERE THEN THE GUTTERS WILL MATCH.
UM, AND THAT'S URBAN BRONZE AND I'M WOULD LOVE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT IF THAT'S ALLOWED.
OKAY, MA'AM, DO YOU HAVE, UM, WITH YOU THE NAME, THE MAKER AND THE NUMBER OF THE COLOR SO WE COULD SORT OF LOOK AT IT OURSELVES? IT'S SHERMAN WILLIAMS. YEAH, IT'S SHERMAN WILLIAMS URBAN BRONZE 7 0 4 8 URBAN, I, I'M GONNA LOOK UP ON ELL.
DO WE HAPPEN TO HAVE A, I'M LOOKING RIGHT NOW.
I'M LOOKING RIGHT NOW YOU HAVE A FAN DECK TOO?
[03:00:01]
YEAH.STAFF IS GONNA CHECK AND SEE IF THEY MIGHT BE ABLE TO SHOW US SOMETHING BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY THE NAME ONLY SORT OF TELLS US WHAT THIS COLOR LOOKS LIKE.
WELL IT DOESN'T, IT'S RIGHT OUTSIDE.
MOST IMPORTANTLY IS WE HAVE TO KNOW THAT FIRST FALLS WITHIN MONTHS OUT.
I CAN SHOW WELL THEN LET US SHOW IT TO YOU.
WE MIGHT BE DOING IT BUT WE ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE.
YEAH, I DID LOOK ONLINE TO SEE IF THAT'S ALL WITHIN THE MUNSELL COLOR SCHEME AND IT SAID YES.
UM, AND I KNOW OTHER NEIGHBORS HAVE USED THAT COLOR ON THEIR HOUSE AS WELL.
IS THAT WHERE HE WENT TO GO LOOK FOR IT? MIGHT'VE GONE TO CHECK.
LET ME JUST GO AHEAD AND PULL UP.
OH YOU CAN, YOU WANT, I'M JUST GOING UP.
OH, THEY'LL WANNA SEE IT IN PERSON.
WE HAVE THE PAINT CHIPS RIGHT HERE.
IT NEEDS TO BE BETWEEN THREE AND NINE FOR THE ELL.
AND I MEAN I CAN SHOW YOU WHAT I'M DOING.
SO EVERYBODY SEE WE'RE NOT SEEING ANYBODY ON THE SCREEN RIGHT NOW 'CAUSE THE SCREEN IS SHARING.
SO IT JUST FALLS WITHIN THE VALUE PORTION.
IT HAS TO BE BETWEEN THREE AND NINE.
AND THEN FOR CHROMA IT'S OUTSIDE OF IT.
IT'S OUTSIDE OF IT A LITTLE BIT.
SO IT'S SHOULD BE BETWEEN ONE AND SIX AND IT'S 0.62.
SO IT'S YOUR CALL AND WE HAVE, WHAT'S THAT, 70 48? LET ME PULL IT OUT.
IT'S NOT SOMETHING WE NORMALLY DO ON THE FLY, BUT YOU'RE ADAPTABLE AND WE APPRECIATE THAT.
THE COMMISSIONERS ARE NOW LOOKING, ARE PASSING AROUND A SAMPLE OF IT, MA'AM, SO THAT WE CAN SEE IT IN PERSON.
AND I, AND I DON'T KNOW IF IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE, BUT OTHER HOUSES IN MUNGER PLACE HAVE BEEN APPROVED FOR THIS COLOR.
WE JUDGE EACH CASE SEPARATELY.
SO, BUT CURRENTLY IT'S
WELL, WELL IN THAT CASE, LET ME SHARE A LITTLE BIT MORE.
MY HOUSE IS CURRENTLY LISTED AS A, UM, IT'S NOT A CONTRIBUTING FACTOR IN MUNGER PLACED.
IT'S A OBTRUSIVE FACTOR IS WHAT IN INTRUSIVE IS WHAT IT'S LISTED AS.
I'M TRYING TO MAKE MY HOUSE, UH, MORE COMPLETE.
RIGHT NOW I HAVE TWO TRIM COLORS.
IT'S GREEN IN SOME PLACES AND GREEN AND THE OTHER.
I CAN HAVE MORE THAN ONE TRIM COLOR.
NO, I MEAN LIKE ONE WIND, ONE WINDOW IS TRIM IS GREEN AND THE ONE ABOVE IT, THE TRIM IS GRAY.
I MEAN I UH, PERHAPS THEY DIDN'T FINISH PAINTING IT COLOR.
LET ME ASK YOU MA'AM, THIS THIS URBANE BRONZE COLOR, WILL THAT MATCH THE GUTTER COLOR THAT YOU ARE CONTEMPLATING? UH, I
AND I WANT THAT TO BE THE CASE.
AND I WANT THAT TO BE THE CASE.
I DON'T WANT MY GUTTER TO BE A DIFFERENT COLOR.
AND SO I WILL TRY THE BEST I CAN TO GET THE BEST MATCHING COLOR TO, IT DOESN'T STAND OUT.
I DON'T WANT MY GUTTERS TO BE THE FOCUS OF THE HOUSE.
ALRIGHT, NOW WE HAVE ALL SEEN THIS PROPOSED COLOR.
DOES ANYBODY HAVE FURTHER QUESTIONS OR WISH TO MAKE A, A MOTION A QUESTION? COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, I'D BE VERY INTERESTED TO KNOW, SINCE WE DO REVIEW COLOR FOR PLACEMENT WHERE, UM, THIS URBAN BRONZE IS SUPPOSED TO GO, IT'S NOT BEEN CALLED OUT, IT'S NOT BEEN SKETCHED OUT.
I CAN SEE THE EXISTING FRONT FACADE, BUT DOES THAT MEAN THAT, UM, THE UPPER SECTION OF THE FRONT GABLE IS GONNA REMAIN DARK OR IS THE, UM, IS IT ONLY GONNA BE THE, UH, SOFFIT VENT THAT'S UM, OR GABLE VENT THAT'S GONNA BE PAINTED THE DARK COLOR? UM, WILL ALL THE MOVABLE PARTS OF THE WINDOWS REMAIN A LIGHTER COLOR OR IS UM, IN OTHER WORDS, WHAT ARE WE DEFINING AS TRIM? IS THIS TRIM OR IS THIS EVERYTHING THAT'S NOT STONE
[03:05:01]
OR, UM, MASON OR, OR YEAH.EVERYTHING THAT'S NOT MASONRY LIKE TO KNOW.
AND I THINK THAT KIND OF DETAIL IMPORTANT WHEN WE'RE TALKING COLOR.
SO FOR RIGHT NOW, IT'S UP ON MY ROOF.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'D CALL THAT 'CAUSE BUT THE, THE BOARD WHERE THE GUTTERS BEHIND THE GUTTERS, IT'S THAT PART.
AND IT WOULD ALSO BE THE FRONT DOOR THAT ONCE I GET THAT APPROVED AND CHANGED, I'M NOT READY TO GO THERE YET.
UM, AND THEN IT'LL ALSO BE THE OUTSIDE, THE VERY OUTSIDE OF THE WINDOWS.
IT'LL BE THE TRIM COLOR THROUGHOUT.
AND AND WHAT ABOUT, UM, CAN YOU SEE MY THI OH SORRY, LEMME GO BACK TO THE YEAH, I JUST WANNA SEE IF YOU CAN SEE IT AT THE VERY TOP.
WHAT ABOUT THIS SECTION RIGHT HERE? OR YOU HAVE THE VENT? OH, OKAY.
YEAH, THAT PART, THAT PART WILL BE THE SAME.
GIGGLING OVER A LITTLE ACCIDENT IF THAT HAPPENED.
SO EVERYWHERE THAT LOOKS DARK NOW IS GONNA BE THIS COLOR.
IS THAT PRETTY MUCH WHAT WE COME UP WITH? THAT'S THAT'S, THAT'S THAT, THAT'S CORRECT.
AND THE GABLE, THE GABLE VENT WILL BE REMAINING AND LIKE HARD TO SEE.
YEAH, AND LIKE I SAID THAT YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW THE BOTTOM WINDOW THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT IS GREEN AND THE TOP ONE IS GRAY.
THIS ARE TWO DIFFERENT COLORS RIGHT NOW.
WELL, THEY LOOK KIND OF SIMILAR.
WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT THEM ON THE SCREEN, I'LL THINK YOUR WORD.
THE ONE IS GREEN AND ONE IS GRAY, BUT THERE AND THERE'S WHITE TRIM ON THE BOTTOM WINDOW AND THERE'S NOT WHITE TRIM ON THE TOP.
SO IT'S VERY MUCH NOT IN UNIFORM.
ALRIGHT, SO WE HAVE ALL SEEN THE COLOR NOW IF YOU HAVE NO FURTHER QUESTIONS, DOES ANYONE HAVE A MOTION OR DO YOU HAVE A FURTHER QUESTION? COMMISSIONER HARPER? YEAH, SORRY, I HAVE A QUESTION.
SO THIS COLOR DOES NOT FALL WITHIN THE APPROVED RANGE FOR IT'S DISTRICT.
IT'S A WEE BIT OUT, BUT SO NO.
THERE'S A SHADE ONE LIGHTER ON THAT COLOR CHART YOU PASSED AROUND.
I WONDER IF THE APPLICANT WOULD BE OPEN TO THAT WITH THAT NET REQUIREMENT.
I CAN TELL YOU ONE SECOND WHILE YOU LOOK AT THAT, I WAS ALSO THE, THE APPLICATION ADDRESSES GUTTERS.
IT DOES NOT ADDRESS DOWNSPOUTS.
IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THE HOME HAS GUTTERS AT ALL.
SO OBVIOUSLY IT WILL BE DOWNSPOUTS REQUIRED AS WELL.
AND THE MUNGER ORDINANCE REQUIRED THE GUTTERS AND DOWNSPOUTS MATCH THE ADJACENT MATERIAL COLOR.
SO THE VERTICAL DOWNSPOUT WOULD'VE TO MATCH THE BRICK.
SO WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO PAINT DOWNSPOUTS REGARDLESS OF THE COLOR THAT'S SELECTED.
SO I I MEAN THIS IS A NORMAL THING AND LONGER THAT WON'T.
YEAH, AND I'VE, I'M TOTALLY ON BOARD WITH THAT.
SO THE NEXT COLOR IS TWO UP THAT FALLS WITHIN THE ELL AND IT WOULD BE THIS ANONYMOUS.
SO THIS WAS HER AND IT'S TWO UP, WHICH GETS TO THE, THE, I'M NOT LOOKING, THE PURPOSE IS BILL 0.9.
OH, I, I KNOW I'LL SHOW YOU IN JUST A SECOND.
SUSAN, I'M JUST SHOWING COMMISSIONER AT THIS POINT.
AND IF YOU CAN JUST, I CAN PULL IT UP ON MY PHONE TOO.
IT'S TWO UP FROM THE URBAN BRONZE, UH, ANSWERING OF COMMISSIONER HARPER'S QUESTION, HOW FAR LIGHTER DO YOU HAVE TO GO FOR IT TO BE WITHIN SEL SO THAT FULLY MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS THAT FULLY MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS.
MS. STITCH, HAVE YOU FOUND ANONYMOUS YET TO SEE WHAT YOU I DID.
AND, AND WHILE I'M, YOU KNOW, I'M OPEN TO OTHER COLORS, I JUST FEEL MY BRICK IS A YELLOW BRICK AND I JUST, I I THINK THE DARKER COLOR GOES BETTER WITH THE YELLOW BRICK THAN THAT, THAN THE LIGHTER ANONYMOUS.
MY, MY, MY, MY HOUSE WASN'T, WHEN
AND SO THIS YELLOW BRICK IS KIND OF AN ANOMALY, PERHAPS A COLOR THAT'S NOT IN THAT BROWN BLACK FAMILY.
YOU HAVE TO GO TWO DEGREES LIGHTER TO REACH ONE THAT FULLY MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS FOR THE ORDINANCE.
HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE COLOR THAT'S IN BETWEEN THEM? MS. FISH IT WOULD BE 70 47.
[03:10:03]
YEAH, I MEAN MY PREFERENCE WOULD STILL BE THE, THE DARKER COLOR.IF YOU, MY AP YOU KNOW, MY APPLICATION WAS FOR THE TRICO BLACK, WHICH WAS SUPER DARK AND I DON'T, I DON'T NEED TO BE THAT DARK.
I JUST FEEL LIKE WITH THE YELLOW BRICK, THE DARKER COLOR WOULD LOOK MUCH BETTER.
SANDRA, LET ME ASK YOU THIS, MA'AM.
I DO NOT KNOW WHAT THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS ARE THINKING.
I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT I'M THINKING YET.
BUT IF IT TURNED OUT THAT WE SIMPLY WOULD NOT GIVE YOU THAT DARKEST ONE, WOULD YOU GO DOWN BY AT LEAST ONE STEP? WOULD THAT BE ACCEPTABLE FOR YOU AS A COMPROMISE IF YOU CAN'T GET THE ONE YOU PREFER? UM, WELL I NEED TO GET MY HOUSE PAINTED SO I NEEDED, I NEED TO GET SOMETHING THAT'S APPROVED.
SO I GUESS THE ANSWER WOULD BE YES, THE ANSWER WOULD BE NO.
IS THAT WHAT YOU SAID? NO, I SAID THE ANSWER WOULD BE YES BECAUSE I, I NEED TO GET A NEW ROOF TO GET MY HOUSE INSURED, SO I GOTTA GET THINGS MOVING.
YEAH, I GOT ONE OF THOSE LETTERS STUFF RIGHT NOW OR WE DON'T GET ANY MORE INSURANCE.
SHE HAS, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THREE DIFFERENT COLOR IDEAS.
THERE'S A DARK ONE SHE'D LOVE, ONE SHE'D SETTLE FOR AND ONE THAT'S WITHIN THE ORDINANCE.
DOES SOMEBODY HAVE READY TO MAKE A MOTION ABOUT THIS? WHAT IS THE CORPUS? RIGHT? SO COMMISSIONER SHERMAN, ARE YOU GETTING READY TO MAKE A MONKEY? MAYBE.
UM, BUT WITH THAT SAID, UM, JUST TO PUT IT OUT THERE, IF THAT SUGGESTION WAS MADE AND SHE DID COME WITH A COLOR SCHEME THAT WAS WITHIN MONTHS THOUGH, THIS PARTICULAR ORDINANCE ALLOWS US TO DO THAT VIA ROUTINE AS A MINOR EXTERIOR CHANGE IF IT FITS WITHIN AND IS APPROPRIATE.
SO THEN SHE WOULDN'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS AND IT WOULD BE ROUTINE.
AND WE HAVE A LOT OF THIS, UM, SAME BRICK, UM, IN OUR DISTRICT AND, UM, THE, THE SOFTER HUES, THE SAGE GREENS AND THE UM, LIGHTER GRAYISH COLORS WITH THE HINTS OF PURPLE ACTUALLY WORK BEAUTIFULLY WITH THIS HOUSE, AS DO SOME OTHERS.
BUT ONCE AGAIN, WE WOULD SHY AWAY FROM THE DARKER AUSTERE BLACKS AND OBVIOUSLY WE DON'T, UM, YOU DON'T ENHANCE THE ARCHITECTURAL INFINITY.
BUT I MEAN, I DON'T THINK WE CAN APPROVE THE GUTTERS TODAY BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE A COLOR FOR THE GUTTERS.
WE'RE NOT STANDING THERE AT THE HOUSE TRYING TO MATCH A COLOR TO THE BRICK.
WE'RE SHOOTING FROM THE HIP, WHICH I DON'T THINK IS FAIR.
SO I THINK SHE COULD STILL GET A ROOF ON, UM, UM, IF HER TRIM COLOR IS APPROVED AND THE PLACEMENT IS CALLED OUT AND THEN SHE COULD COME BACK AND ASK FOR A GUTTER COLOR THAT COINCIDES WITH, WELL ONCE, NOT JUST WHERE IT TOUCHES THE TRIM, BUT ALSO WHERE IT TOUCHES THE HOUSE IN ORDER TO COMPLY WITH THE DISTRICT GUIDELINES ONCE THE THE COLOR IS, UM, AGREED UPON FOR THE TRIM.
UM, AND SHE, IF SHE BRINGS IN A COLOR THAT STAFF STAFF AND SHE CAN SHOW THAT IT'S STAFF'S BRICK, UH, YES.
THAT IT MATCHES THE BRICK STAFF CAN DO ROUTINE.
UM, SO WHAT'S THE SHERWIN WILLIAMS NUMBER FOR ANONYMOUS? ANONYMOUS IS 7 0 4 5 4 6, PARDON ME? 7 0 4 6.
JUST SUSAN ALSO AS A NOTE, IF YOU DO AS MUCH AS YOU CAN TO BRING THIS BACK TO CONTRIBUTING, THEN THAT HELPS YOU IF YOU WANNA HAVE TAX EXEMPTION APPLICATION SUBMITTED, WHICH WILL THEN REVIEW.
SO THE, IF WE CAN PUSH AND DO WHAT WE CAN TO MOVE THIS CLOSER TO CONTRIBUTING AND HAVE IT DEEMED CONTRIBUTING, THEN YOU'LL QUALIFY FOR THE TAX EXEMPTION PROGRAM.
JUST SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT.
IN THE MATTER OF CA 2 4 5 DASH 3 71 CP 50 16 VICTOR STREET, I MOVE THAT WE, UM, APPROVE FOR ITEM NUMBER ONE, UM, THE TRIM COLOR ANONYMOUS, WHICH IS SHERWIN WILLIAMS 7 0 4 6.
AND THAT WE DENY WITHOUT PREJUDICE, UM, THE GUTTER COLOR LEAVING THE APPLICANT THE OPPORTUNITY TO RETURN AND GET THE GUTTER COLOR APPROVED BY STAFF, UH, THROUGH ROUTINE
[03:15:02]
SECOND.ALRIGHT, THE SECOND WAS COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER.
UM, SO NOW IT'S A PERIOD OF COMMENT.
UM, I WILL SAY TO COM TO COMMISSIONER STITCH TO OUR APPLICANT MS. STITCH, THAT UM, YOU CAN OF COURSE GO AHEAD AND DO YOUR ROOF IF YOU HAVE NOT SETTLED ON THE OTHER.
SINCE WHILE WE'RE RIGHT NOW, THE MOTION ON THE FLOOR IS FOR THE COLOR THAT YOU SAID YOU REALLY DIDN'T WANT, BUT THAT'S THE ONE THAT WE'RE APPARENTLY RIGHT NOW GOING TO DECIDE WHETHER WE WANT TO GIVE YOU OR, BUT EVEN IF WE DO THAT, YOU COULD GET YOUR ROOF DONE, YOU COULD COME BACK WITH ANOTHER COLOR IF YOU WANT.
I SUSPECT THAT COULD BE SOME ADDITIONAL COST BECAUSE YOU MAY NEED SCAFFOLDING TO GET IT FOR THIS ROOF, IN WHICH CASE I'M GONNA CHARGE YOU THE PAPER, BUT THE DEVIL DIDN'T PUT IT TOGETHER.
OR YOU COULD GO WITH OUR COLOR OR FIND SOMETHING ELSE.
I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY WE CAN'T SAY, IF WE APPROVE A TRIM COLOR, WE SAY THAT ALL THE GUTTERS HAVE TO MATCH THE COLOR OF THE THING THAT'S BEHIND THEM BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THE ORDINANCE SAYS AND THEN STAFF HAS TO APPROVE IT WHAT THEY SEE.
WE DON'T HAVE TO KNOW THE NAME OF THE COLOR OF THE GUTTER SO LONG AS WE SAY IT MUST MATCH THE COLOR BEHIND IT.
BECAUSE WE DO COLOR MATCH ALL THE TIME WITH PAINT AND WE DO COLOR BECAUSE YOU CAN PAINT A GUTTER, COLOR MATCH EXISTING.
THERE'S NOT A GUTTER TO MATCH EVERY COLOR.
YOUR TRIM COULD BE, YOU CAN PAINT A GUTTER.
SO IS THERE ANY CHANCE THAT THE MAKER OF THE MOTION WOULD ALLOW US TO SAY, WE COULD GO AHEAD WITH THE GUTTERS SO LONG AS THEY MATCH THE MATERIAL BEHIND THEM IN COLOR WITH STAFF REVIEWING, THEY, THEY MUST MEET THAT CONDITION, MATCH THE COLOR BEHIND, THAT'S PER ORDINANCE.
AND IF THEY WERE WILLING TO DO THAT BEFORE AND NOT JUST WANT ALL BRONZE, WE WOULD'VE DONE THAT AS ROUTINE.
QUITE HONESTLY, YOU, YOU CAN MAKE PART OF THAT CONDITION, THAT STAFF MUST TAKE A LOOK AT IT.
I MEAN, I DON'T SEE WHY, BUT I MEAN, IT DOESN'T AFFECT ANYTHING TO SAY THAT.
SEEMS A LITTLE SILLY, BUT OKAY.
AND WELL, I'M JUST TRYING TO, IF, IF, IF SHE WILL GOES FORWARD WITH THIS COLOR THAT WE'RE SAYING, THEN SHE COULD GO AHEAD AND GET THE GUT IS PUT UP AT THE SAME TIME, WHICH MIGHT BE A CONVENIENCE FOR HER AND PERHAPS LESS COST FOR SCAFFOLDING.
'CAUSE I KEEP HAVING TO PAY FOR SCAFFOLDING IN MY HOUSE.
SO WE ARE GIVING YOU AN OPTION IF WE VOTE ON THIS MOTION AND APPROVE IT.
THERE ARE ANY OTHER COMMENTS? ALL RIGHT THEN I'M GONNA CALL FOR A VOTE ON THIS MOTION.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY YES.
ANY OPPOSED THIS MOTION? OKAY MA'AM, WHAT HAS HAPPENED HERE IS A MOTION HAS PASSED.
IT WOULD ALLOW YOU TO PROCEED TO PAINT ALL YOUR TRIM IN THE COLOR ANONYMOUS, WHICH I KNOW IS NOT YOUR FIRST CHOICE, BUT MAYBE YOU GET A THOUGHT AND SEE IF MAYBE YOU COULD LIVE WITH THAT.
IT MIGHT MAYBE THINK THEY'LL LOOK GOOD OR YOU CAN COME BACK AND REQUEST A DIFFERENT COLOR.
AND IF YOU HAVE TO GET THE ROOF PUT UP, YOU COULD GO AHEAD AND DO THAT.
I'M SORRY WE COULD NOT COME TO SOMETHING THAT WAS EXACTLY WHAT YOU WANTED, BUT WE DORY TO TAKE IN ALL THE CONSIDERATIONS, BOTH THE HOUSE, THE NEIGHBORHOOD, AND THE OWNER'S REFERENCES.
AND THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE TODAY WITH US.
JUST TO CLARIFY, THE GUTTERS ARE STILL DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE? NO, WE MOVED IT TO, OKAY.
THE GUTTERS CAN BE DONE AND THEY MUST MATCH THE MATERIAL BEHIND IT.
I JUST 'CAUSE IT DIDN'T SEEM OKAY, SO ONE COULD, ONE COULD PROCEED TO COMPLETE THIS WHOLE PROJECT RIGHT NOW.
ALL RIGHT, WE NOW MOVE ON TO DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER THREE FOR WHICH THERE ARE NO SPEAKERS, RIGHT? CORRECT.
DISCUSSION ITEM NUMBER THREE IS 26 20 HIBERNIA STREET IN THE STATE THOMAS HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 4 5 DASH 3 6 3 MW.
AND I'M MARCUS WATSON PRESENTING THE REQUEST IS FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE TWO WINDOWS ON THE NORTHWEST SIDE.
THE FRONT FOUR WINDOWS ON THE SOUTHWEST SIDE AND EIGHT WINDOWS ON THE NORTHEAST SIDE OF THE MAIN STRUCTURE.
STAFF RECOMMENDATION IS THAT THE REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO REPLACE TWO WINDOWS ON THE NORTHWEST SIDE FRONT, FOUR WINDOWS ON THE SOUTH SOUTHWEST SIDE AND EIGHT WINDOWS ON THE NORTHEAST SIDE OF THE MAIN STRUCTURE BE DENIED WITHOUT PREJUDICE.
WITH A FINDING OF FACT THAT THE SUBMITTED EVIDENCE IS NOT SUFFICIENT TO SUPPORT THE NEED FOR WINDOW REPLACEMENT AND THAT THE PROPOSED WINDOWS DO NOT HAVE EXPRESS BUTTONS AND HAVE CLADDING OVER WOOD, WHICH IS NOT TYPICAL OF THE STYLE AND PERIOD OF THE BUILDING OR THE DISTRICT.
THE PROPOSED WORK IS THEREFORE NOT CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
51 E DASH 2 25 0.109 A 16 F DOES NOT MEET THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A 4.501 GC PERMANENT ONE FOR CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES OR THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR'S STANDARDS OVER YOUR
NO QUORUM COMMENTS, ONLY NOT ENOUGH EVIDENCE TO PROVE NEED FOR REPLACEMENT SUGGESTS THE APPLICANT CONSULT SPECIALISTS IN HISTORIC PRESERVATION AND OR WOOD WINDOWS.
THE WINDOWS ARE ALLOWED TO BE REPLACED.
REPLACEMENTS MUST BE ALL WOOD INSIDE AND UP WITH NO
[03:20:01]
CLADDING.MUST EXACTLY MATCH THE CONFIGURATION AND SIZE OF THE EXISTING WINDOWS.
THE ONES MUST BE EXPRESSED ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE GLASS.
ONE ONE JUST FOR ONE CLARIFYING ITEM.
I JUST REALIZED IN MY RECOMMENDATION, UH, IT'S DOES NOT MEET THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A 4.501.
OKAY, WELL I WAS WONDERING ABOUT THAT MISTAKE I YOUR PART BUT
ALRIGHT, SO DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OF STAFF? IF NOT, IT WOULD BE MOTION.
QUESTION OF STAFF? PARDON ME? QUESTION FOR STAFF? NO.
MR. OSI, QUESTION FOR STAFF OR PERMISSION? OH, I MEAN I DID, I JUST HAVE A QUESTION.
I MEAN, IN MY OPINION, LOOKING AT THE PHOTOS, IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S MOSTLY PAINT BUT NOT PAINT PEEL OFF AND NOT ACTUALLY ROT TO THE WOOD MEMBERS.
THAT'S PRETTY MUCH WHAT WE, WHAT THE TASK FORCE AND I SAW AND SO WE ENCOURAGED THE APPLICANT.
YOU KNOW, AGAIN, IF, IF THERE IS REAL ROT THEY NEED TO TO PROVIDE BENEFIT.
ALRIGHT THEN DOES SOMEONE HAVE A MOTION? NOT A MOTION.
COMMISSIONER ROTHENBERGER IN THE MATTER OF DISCUSSION.
ITEM 3 26 20 HIBERNIA STREET CA 2 4 5 DASH 360 3.
I MOVE THAT WE DENY WITHOUT PREJUDICE TO THE REQUEST FOLLOWING STAFF RECOMMENDATION.
UM, THE SECOND WAS COMMISSIONER GAY.
IF THERE IS NO FURTHER DISCUSSION SEEING NONE, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THIS MOTION, PLEASE SAY YES.
THERE APPEARS TO BE NO OPPOSITION.
NOW THE APPLICANT DID GET A DENIAL, SO STAFF WILL LET THEM KNOW ABOUT THE OPTION
WHO'S FAMILIAR WITH WINDOWS? THOSE OLD WINDOWS CAN LOOK PRETTY SCARY JUST WHEN THE PAINT'S PEELING OFF, BUT THERE'S REALLY NOT A PROBLEM YET.
BUT I CAN SEE, I KNOW FIRST TIME I LOOKED AT ONE I WAS LIKE, OH MY GOSH, IT'S HORRIBLE, BUT YOU KNOW, NEVER KNOW.
ALL RIGHT, C FIVE IS OUR LAST CASE.
CHRISTINA PEREZ ON BEHALF OF STAFF.
AND UH, BEFORE I WRITE IT IN JOHN BURNS, THE OWNER IS ONLINE AND I NEEDS TO BE MOVED OVER.
UM, OKAY, THIS, UH, CONSENT ITEM NUMBER 5 2 10 NORTH CLINTON AVENUE, WINNETKA HEIGHTS HISTORIC DISTRICT CA 2 4 5 3 7 7 CP.
REQUEST A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A TWO CAR GARAGE WITH ATTIC STORAGE.
RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A TWO-CAR GARAGE WITH ATTIC STORAGE BE APPROVED IN ACCORDANCE WITH DRAWINGS AND SPECIFICATIONS DATED 5 5 20 25 WITH THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS.
ONE, THE ROOF SLOPE BE STEEPER TO MATCH THE SLOPE OF THE MAIN STRUCTURE AND TWO, THE ROOF OVERHANG BE SHORTENED TO MATCH MAIN STRUCTURE.
IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS WOULD ALLOW THE PROPOSED WORK TO BE CONSISTENT WITH PRESERVATION CRITERIA.
THE STANDARDS IN CITY CODE SECTION 51 A DASH 4 5 0 1 G SIX C ROMAN AT TWO FOR NON-CONTRIBUTING STRUCTURES AND THE SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR STANDARDS FOR SETTINGS, NEIGHBORHOOD AND DISTRICT TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATION THAT THE REQUEST FOR CERTIFICATE APPROPRIATENESS TO CONSTRUCT A TWO CAR GARAGE WITH ATTIC STORAGE BE APPROVED WITH CONDITIONS.
ROOF NEEDS TO BE STEEPER, ROOF OVERHANG NEEDS TO BE SCALED DOWN FOR SMALL STRUCTURE.
CONSIDER SIX FOOT SLOPE PER MAIN ROOF.
2.5 FOR INSURANCE FOR DORMER AND BACK NOTE, FINAL DRAWINGS REFLECT TASK FORCE REVISIONS.
UM, SO WHAT I NEED YOU TO DO, WELCOME.
I NEED YOU TO START BY TELLING US YOUR NAME, YOUR ADDRESS, AND SWEARING, AFFIRMING OR PROMISING YOU WILL TELL US THE TRUTH OF YOUR TESTIMONY.
MY ADDRESS IS 2 1 0 NORTH CLINTON AVENUE AND I PROMISE TO TELL THE TRUTH.
SO NOW YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES TO UH, TELL US ANY ADDITIONAL INFORMATION THAT YOU THINK WE MIGHT NEED ABOUT YOUR PROJECT AND THEN WE WILL ASK YOU QUESTIONS.
UM, I DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL INFORMATION.
JUST, UM, JUST BUILD THE, UH, GARAGE IN THE BACK.
YOU WANNA BUILD THE GARAGE IN THE BACK? YES.
WE SEE THAT AND ONE OF THE COMMISSIONERS REQUESTED THIS BE REMOVED FROM CONSENT SO THAT WE COULD TALK ABOUT IT MORE FULLY AND I'M GLAD YOU WERE ABLE TO JOIN US FOR THAT.
SO COMMISSIONERS, WHAT QUESTIONS DO YOU HAVE AS WELL? WAS BEEPING, I HOPE WE CAN STOP BEEPING.
I HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE APPLICANT.
I REALIZE YOU'RE TRYING TO GET AS MUCH SPACE AS POSSIBLE IN THE ATTIC, BUT I FEEL LIKE THE PLATE HEIGHT IN PARTICULAR IN OTHER, WHERE THE, THE BOTTOM OF THE ROOF STARTS TO SLOPE UP, UH, BEING SET AT 14 FEET, UM, IS OUT OF SCALE WITH THE, WITH THE, THE HOME IN FRONT.
[03:25:01]
BUT WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO, UH, YOU CAN KEEP THE RIDGE LINE, BUT TO DROP THE UM, THE UM, OVERHANG DOWN TWO FEET FROM WHERE IT IS TODAY FROM WHERE IT IS SHOWN IN THE DRAWING, YOU WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO SHARE IT SO YOU CAN SEE WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO? YEAH, LET'S, LET'S SHOW IT ON SCREEN.SO POINT TO WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT.
'CAUSE IT IS KIND OF HARD TO IMAGINE.
OKAY, LET ME SHARE AND WE UNDERSTAND PROBABLY WE KIND OF WISH CHRIS WAS HERE.
UM, YOU WANNA 0.0, WE CAN'T SEE WHAT, OKAY, HE CAN'T SEE LINE IF WE POINT BUT OKAY.
RENE COULD POINT WHILE YOU POINTED ONLINE
IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO POINT WHERE YOU'RE JUST YES.
POINT WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT AND I WILL RELAY WHAT YOU ARE REFERRING TO ONLINE.
CAN YOU SEE, UH, MY CURSOR JOHN MOVING AROUND? YES.
IS SHE POINTING IN THE RIGHT SPOT? THIS RIGHT, THAT PART UP THERE.
IS IT BETTER? I CAN SEE ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE OVERHANG THERE? HE, HE'S TALKING ABOUT LOWERING THIS, WHICH WOULD THEN MAKE THE SLOPE STEEPER.
AND DIDN'T THEY MAKE THAT, DIDN'T THEY CHANGE IT TO SIX? THEY DID CHANGE IT.
THEY, THEY MADE IT, IT WAS LESS, UM, BEFORE IT.
LETS SEE IF I CAN PULL UP THE OTHER ONES JUST SO THAT, BECAUSE HE'S ASKING.
LET ME SEE IF YOU CAN SEE THAT.
SO INITIALLY THE SLOPE WAS 12, 12 5 FOR THE FRONT PART AND THEN 12.15 ON THIS KINDA.
OKAY, SO THEN THAT'S THE INITIAL ONE.
LET ME GO BACK TO THE OTHER ONE.
YES, BUT BY ALL MEANS YOU CAN CONDITION IT FOR MORE.
SO I DON'T KNOW IF THAT, MAYBE THE DRAWINGS DON'T REFLECT IT.
UM, YOU PROBABLY KNOW IN YOUR HEAD WHAT IT SHOULD LOOK LIKE.
UM, DO YOU HAVE A SUGGESTION FOR WHAT THE SLOPE SHOULD BE? COMMISSIONER, I NEED YOUR MICROPHONE ON IT.
IT MIGHT BE THAT IT JUST DOESN'T REFLECT.
OKAY, WELL YOU CAN, WE'LL CERTAINLY DO A CONDITION AND I'M ASSUMING THE GARAGE IS 24 FEET DEEP, SO THAT WOULD MAKE IT 12 IN EACH.
UH, IT'S A, IT'S SIX DOWN THEN IT WOULD BE 12.
ISN'T THE GARAGE 20 BY 20? YEAH.
THE SOUNDS AVERAGE FOR A TWO CARGO OPEN, HOLD ON, LET ME GET ME GO BACK UP TO HERE FOR OH FIVE COVERAGE.
YEAH, ON PAGE 78, RIGHT WITH THE OVERHANG IT'S 11 FOUR, SO IT'S VERY CLOSE TO 12.
UM, BUT EIGHT FEET WOULD REDUCE THE PLATE HEIGHT BY, OR SORRY, EIGHT AND 12 WOULD REDUCE IT APPROXIMATELY TWO FEET, WHICH IS WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET.
ALRIGHT, SO ARE YOU PREPARED TO MAKE A MOTION TO THAT THING OR ARE THERE ANY OTHER CONCERNS THAT SOMEONE ELSE HAD? SEEMS TO BE, YOU'RE THE ONLY CONCERN, SO.
UM, LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION ON, UM,
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LET'S SEE, UH,AND THAT THE DORMERS BE FOUR AND A HALF AND 12 SECOND.
WHAT WAS THE SECOND? COMMISSIONER SHERMAN WAS THE SECOND.
COMMISSIONER ANDERSON, I HAVE A QUESTION JUST TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND.
SO THE PONY WALLS WOULD BE LOWERED.
I, I THINK THAT, I JUST LIKE TO SUPPORT THAT BECAUSE THOSE, THOSE WALLS ARE CALLED PONY WALLS AND THE LOWERING THEM MAKES IT MORE OF A STORY AND A HALF.
THOSE LITTLE WALLS KIND OF ARE CHEATERS A LITTLE BIT.
SO IT, IT MAKES IT MORE ARCHITECTURALLY APPROPRIATE.
ALRIGHT, NUTCASE, WE'RE TO CALL FOR A VOTE.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THIS MOTION, PLEASE SAY YES.
ANY OPPOSED? ALL RIGHT, MR. BURNS, YOU HAVE, UM, AN APPROVAL WITH A SLIGHT CHANGE, WHICH IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT STAFF WILL HELP YOU WITH THAT.
UH, YOU CAN HAVE CHRIS CALL ME.
YOU KNOW, ON THE, UH, TAX ABATEMENT YES.
DOES IT HAVE TO BE ON THE INITIAL STRUCTURE OR IS IT ANY IMPROVEMENT? SO THE QUESTION IS, WHEN I BUILD THIS, CAN I USE IT TOWARD TAX ABATEMENT? NO, SIR.
THANK YOU FOR JOINING US TODAY, SIR.
AND UM, GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR GARAGE.
I HOPE YOU ENJOY PARKING IN IT.
ALRIGHT, I THINK THAT LEAVES US WITH NOTHING TO DO EXCEPT OUR MINUTES.
I WANNA GO HOME TOO AFTER WE VOTE 'EM THE MINUTES.
ANYBODY HAVE ANY CHANGES THEY WANTED TO SEE TO THE MINUTES? ALRIGHT, IN THAT CASE, DOES ANYBODY HAVE A MOTION? SO MOVED.
COMMISSIONER PEL MOVED TO APPROVE.
DID YOU SECOND COMMISSIONER HINOJOSA? YES.
COMMISSIONER HINOJOSA HAS SECONDED ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF APPROVING THE MINUTES? YES.
I BELIEVE THAT COMPLETES OUR BUSINESS FOR THE DAY.
SO IT IS 4 37 AND THIS MEETING IS ADJOURNED.