* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [Board of Adjustments: Full Board Meeting on October 28, 2025] [00:00:02] GOOD MORNING. EVERYONE NEEDS TO TURN THEIR VOLUME OFF OF THEIR, ON THEIR LAPTOPS, THE VOLUME, THE LAPTOPS OR IPADS NEED TO HAVE THE VOLUMES OFF. OTHERWISE, THERE'LL BE AN ECHO CHAMBER. GOOD MORNING. THE FULL BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT IS HEREBY CALLED TO ORDER AT 9:00 AM ON TUESDAY, OCTOBER 28TH, 2025, HERE AT DALLAS CITY HALL. COUNCIL CHAMBERS, MY NAME IS DAVE NEWMAN. I'M HONORED TO SERVE AS CHAIRMAN OF THE FULL BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. WE HAVE 13 MEMBERS AND ALTERNATE MEMBERS IN ATTENDANCE IN PERSON THIS MORNING, WHICH EXCEEDS OUR QUORUM REQUIREMENT OF 10 UNDER OUR RULES OF PROCEDURE FOR A FULL BOARD MEETING. AND THEREFORE, A QUORUM IS DECLARED PRESENT TO CONDUCT BUSINESS. WE'RE EXPECTING TWO ADDITIONAL MEMBERS TODAY, MR. HOPKOS AND MS. EVANS. TWO ADDITIONAL MEMBERS WILL JOIN US, SO WE'LL BE AT THE FULL STRENGTH OF 15 MOMENTARILY. THANK YOU BOARD MEMBERS SINCERELY FOR MAKING THE A PRIORITY AND EFFORT TO BE HERE TODAY. AS YOU HOPEFULLY HAVE REVIEWED IN THE AGENDA, IT IS PACKED. UM, IT IS PACKED AND IT IS DESIGNED TO BE EDUCATIONAL FOR YOU INDIVIDUALLY AND FOR THE BOARD. UM, THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING AND WILL BE RUN CONSISTENT WITH OUR RULES OF PROCEDURE AND ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER. PLEASE ASK FOR RECOGNITION TO SPEAK. I WILL DO MY BEST TO ALLOW EVERY BOARD MEMBER EQUAL TIME AND OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK. WAVE YOUR HAND. I'LL TRY TO KEEP SOME SORT OF, UH, RUNNING LIST TO THE PUBLIC. THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT IS A QUASI-JUDICIAL BOARD CREATED BY THE TEXAS LEGISLATURE, CODIFIED BY THE CITY OF DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE AND THE BOARD'S RULES OF PROCEDURE TO MAKE DETERMINATIONS OF A PROPERTY OWNER'S REQUEST FOR ZONING VARIANCES. SPECIAL EXCEPTION AMORTIZATION OF NON-CONFORMING USES AND APPEALS OF DECISIONS OF ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIALS CONCERNING THE DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE, LAND USE IS THE BEST WAY OF ZEROING IN ON WHAT OUR FOCUS AND OUR AUTHORITY IS. COMMUNICATION TO AND FROM MEMBERS, THEREFORE IS RESTRICTED TO SOLELY PUBLIC HEARING, SUCH AS TODAY'S MEETING. THE BOARD ADJUSTMENT IS COMPOSED OF 15 MEMBERS AND SIX ALTERNATE MEMBERS. THE BOARD FURTHER DIVIDES INTO THREE HEARING PANELS OF FIVE EACH TO ADJUDICATE APPEALS OF THE DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE ON A MONTHLY BASIS. MEMBERS AND ALTERNATE MEMBERS ARE NOMINATED BY INDIVIDUAL CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS FROM THROUGHOUT THE CITY, MANY OUTSIDE A SPECIFIC DISTRICT. WE DO NOT REPRESENT A SPECIFIC DISTRICT. WE REPRESENT THE CITY AS A WHOLE. WE SERVE THE CITY AS A WHOLE. UM, WE RECEIVE NO FINANCIAL COMPENSATION FOR OUR VOLUNTEER TIME. UH, FOR EVERYONE TO KNOW THERE'S COFFEE AND LIGHT BREAKFAST IN THE BACK. UH, WE'LL BE HAVING LUNCH SERVED AT AN APPROPRIATE TIME WHEN, WHEN YOU RUN OUT OF MORNING ENERGY. UM, OUR FULL BOARD IS CONVENED AT LEAST ANNUALLY. I MENTIONED THIS TO, UH, EMERITUS ATTORNEY, UM, UH, DANIEL MOORE THAT THE BOARD HAD HAD NEVER MEETING, HAD NEVER MET IN FULL UNTIL FOUR YEARS AGO. AND NOW IT'S A REGULAR DEAL WHERE THE FULL BOARD COMES TOGETHER ONCE A YEAR IN ORDER TO GET TRAINING AND APPROVE A CALENDAR AND REVIEW RULES AND PROCEDURES. OUR AGENDA IS PUBLISHED BY THE, UH, ON THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AT CITY SECRETARY'S WEBSITE SEVEN DAYS PRIOR TO THE MEETING ON OCTOBER 21ST. CONSISTENT WITH OUR RULES IN THE TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT, ALLOW ME NOW TO PREVIEW THE AGENDA. EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN AN EMAIL WITH, UH, A HYPERLINK TO THE AGENDA. UH, WE'RE WE, BETWEEN 8 39, WE DID COFFEE, REGISTRATION AND MEET AND GREET. THE MEETING WAS CALLED ORDER AT NINE. IN A MOMENT, WE'RE GONNA DO INTRODUCTIONS AND I'LL SPEAK ABOUT THAT FOR THOSE THAT WERE HERE LAST YEAR, YEAR BEFORE, YEAR BEFORE. YOU'LL REMEMBER WHAT THAT'S ABOUT FOR THE NEW ONES. WELL, YOU'LL GET AN OPPORTUNITY, UH, THEN WE'LL TAKE PUBLIC TESTIMONY AND THEN WE'LL GO THROUGH THE DOCKET, WHICH IS 250 PAGES, NOW, 250 PAGES. WE'RE NOT GONNA READ EVERY PAGE OR EVERY LINE. WE'RE GONNA DO IT AS BEST AS POSSIBLE, UH, TO ENGENDER YOUR QUESTIONS, YOUR FEEDBACK. SO THE CHAIRMAN'S REPORT, ONE PAGE. THEN WE HAVE TWO GUEST SPEAKERS TODAY, EMILY LI, WHO'S THE DIRECTOR OF PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT, AND BARON ELIASON, WHO'S THE INTERIM INSPECTOR GENERAL TO SPEAK TO US ABOUT ETHICS AND CONFLICT OF INTEREST THROUGHOUT THEIR PRESENTATION, AS WELL AS THE, THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE AND THE BOARD ADMINISTRATIVE PRESENTATION TODAY. I'M GONNA PAUSE. SO IT GIVES EVERYONE AN OPPORTUNITY TO ASK QUESTIONS. THAT'S WHAT'S MOST IMPORTANT TODAY, IS TO ASK QUESTIONS. THEN WE'LL GO INTO BOARD TRAINING. DR. KAMIKA MILLER HOSKINS, OUR BOARD ADMINISTRATOR WILL INTRODUCE HER TEAM. UH, WE'LL GO THROUGH A LITERAL MEMBER ORIENTATION. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE HAVE STRUGGLED WITH IN PAST YEARS IS HOW DO WE BRING NEW MEMBERS ONTO THE BOARD? EACH ONE OF YOU THAT ARE NEW IN THE LAST FOUR TO FIVE YEARS, YOU'LL RECALL ME GETTING TOGETHER WITH YOU HAVING COFFEE AND GOING THROUGH A BUNCH OF THINGS. WELL, NOW WE HAVE AN ACTUAL MEMBER ORIENTATION GUIDE, AND TO SOME OF YOU TODAY, IT [00:05:01] WILL BE REDUNDANT TO AT LEAST HALF OF YOU. IT'LL BE BRAND NEW INFORMATION. SO, UH, WE'RE GONNA TAKE US THROUGH THAT. UH, WE THEN WILL HAVE A PRESENTATION ON PARKING CODE. OH MY GOSH, I READ THAT THREE TIMES AND I'M STILL HAVE LOTS OF QUESTIONS. SARAH MAY WILL BE JOINING US. THEN ZONING CHANGES, THEN DALLAS ZONING REFORM. THAT'S THE FUTURE OF THE DEVELOPMENT CODE GOING FORWARD. THEN WE'LL SWITCH GEARS AND GO TO OUR BOARD ATTORNEY, UH, THERESA CARLISLE, WHO WILL INTRODUCE HER TEAM AND TALK ABOUT STANDARDS FOR VARIANCES, SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, COMPLIANCE APPEALS AND COMPLIANCE CASES, TEXAS CASE LAW. AND THEN OUR FAVORITE SUBJECT, UH, FROM OUR EMERITUS BOARD ATTORNEY TEXAS OPEN MEANS ACT AT SOME POINT IN TIME, WHETHER IT'S AFTER MS, UH, DR. OUR BOARD ADMINISTRATOR'S PRESENTATIONS, UH, WE WILL TAKE A BREAK FOR LUNCH. IT'LL ALL DEPEND ON THE PROGRESS WE GO. UM, THEN WE WILL HAVE ACTION ITEMS. OUR ACTION ITEMS ARE REVIEWING AND ADOPTION, OUR ANNUAL REPORT. UH, THIS CHAPTER EIGHT REQUIRES EVERY BOARD AND COMMISSION TO SUBMIT TO THE CITY COUNCIL THEIR ANNUAL REPORT BY FEBRUARY 1ST OF THE FOLLOWING YEAR. AND SO, UM, THE OFFICERS AND I, UM, AND OUR BOARD SECRETARY AND BOARD ADMINISTRATOR HAVE WORKED ON ACCOMPLISHMENTS, GOALS, AND OBJECTIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS. WE'LL REVIEW AND HOPEFULLY APPROVE A MEETING CALENDAR AND RULES OF PROCEDURE. THAT IS THE PREVIEW OF OUR AGENDA QUESTIONS ON THE AGENDA. AND AGAIN, I'M GONNA DO MY BEST TO DO WHIPLASH ALL DAY TO KEEP EYES ON ANY, IF ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK. ALRIGHT, SO THE NEXT ON THE AGENDA IS INTRODUCTIONS. SO WHAT I'M, WHAT I'M ASKING, WHAT I'M GONNA ASK EACH MEMBER AT THE TABLE IS TO BRIEFLY INTRODUCE THEMSELVES. UH, TELL US WHAT AREA OF THE CITY, GEOGRAPHY WISE YOU LIVE IN. TELL US THE NAME OF YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD. SO, AND I'LL START OFF TO GIVE EVERYONE AN EXAMPLE OF THIS. NOW WE HAVE 15 MEMBERS PLUS THREE OFFICERS, SO THAT'S 18 PEOPLE THAT ARE GONNA BE SPEAKING. SO DON'T GO TOO LONG, BUT GO LONG ENOUGH. ALRIGHT, SO INTRODUCTIONS. I'M DAVE NEWMAN. I'VE LIVED IN THE CITY SINCE 1982. I WAS A BANKER AND THEN EXECUTIVE WITH FIDELITY INVESTMENTS. UM, THEN MY WIFE AND I STARTED AND OPERATED A WOMEN'S APPAREL MANUFACTURING COMPANY FOR 25 YEARS. SOLD THE COMPANY, GOT INTO POLITICS, WAS, UH, AN ALTERNATE TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT 20 YEARS AGO WITH THAT YOUNG MAN IN THE AUDIENCE AS MY BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. UM, AND SO THAT'S WHERE I LEARNED ABOUT THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT 20 YEARS AGO AS AN ALTERNATE MEMBER WAS VICE CHAIRMAN OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION, SERVED ON THE CITY COUNCIL. AND FOUR YEARS AGO, MAYOR JOHNSON ASKED ME TO TAKE THE LEADERSHIP ROLE AS CHAIRMAN OF THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. I LIVE IN NORTH DALLAS, NEAR PRESTON AND FOREST IN THE PRESTON HOLLOW NEIGHBORHOOD, THE NORTH END OF PRESTON HOLLOW. SO DO NORTH PRESTON AND FOREST IS OUR HOME. WE'LL GO TO MR. GRAHAM. GOOD MORNING, EVERYBODY CLOSE TO CLOSER TO THE MICROPHONE. PULL THAT MICROPHONE TO YOU. THANK YOU. CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW? UM, GOOD MORNING EVERYBODY. MY NAME'S PARKER GRAHAM. UH, I LIVE IN EAST DALLAS, SO IN THE KIND OF M STREETS, GREENLAND HILLS NEIGHBORHOOD. I'M A LAWYER AT A FIRM HERE IN TOWN CALLED CARRINGTON COLEMAN, AND I'VE BEEN ON THE BOARD SINCE JANUARY OF THIS YEAR. SO I'M JUST REALLY, UH, HAPPY AND EXCITED TO BE HERE. PERFECT. THAT WAS PERFECT. GOOD MORNING. I'M CANDY EVANS. VERY HAPPY TO BE HERE. UM, LOVED THE CITY OF DALLAS. MOVED HERE IN 1980, WAS DRAGGED BY MY THEN FIANCE, NOT HUSBAND FROM NEW YORK CITY AND NEVER WANTED TO LEAVE. I AM IN, UH, NORTH DALLAS, VERY CLOSE TO MR. NEWMAN. UH, WE ARE IN A LITTLE BIT OF A DISCOMBOBULATION RIGHT NOW BECAUSE WE'RE MOVING FROM OUR HOME OF 25 YEARS INTO A DOWNSIZED COMMUNITY. SO WE'RE MOVING FROM THE RICK CIRCLE AREA TO LAKE FOREST, AND THAT WILL HAPPEN BY NOVEMBER 15TH. THEN I'LL BE NORMAL AGAIN. UM, BUT IT'S LOVELY TO MEET YOU ALL. AND, UM, IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN RICK CIRCLE IN NORTH DALLAS, IT IS A BEAUTIFUL LITTLE HAMLET. THANK YOU. AND THIS IS MS. EVANS FIRST MEETING YES. WITH THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. THANK YOU. GOOD MORNING. MY NAME'S MIKE QUINT. I LIVE AT THE INTERSECTION ROUGHLY OF SPRING VALLEY AND PRESTON ROAD, SO A LITTLE BIT NORTH OF DAVE AND CANDY. UM, I'VE BEEN A RESIDENT OF DALLAS SINCE 1976, SO ABOUT 49 YEARS, I GUESS, IN THIS TOWN. UM, HAVE A COUPLE OF KIDS THAT ARE GROWN ADULTS AND I'M VERY HAPPY TO BE PART OF THIS BOARD. MR. QUINCE FIRST MEETING FOR THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AS WELL. GOOD MORNING. UH, MY NAME IS ANDREW FINNEY. UM, I HAVE LIVED IN DALLAS FOR OVER A DECADE. [00:10:01] I LIVE IN WEST OAK CLIFF, AND, UH, MY BACKGROUND IS IN ARCHITECTURE AND PLANNING. GOOD MORNING. MY NAME IS RACHEL HAYDEN. I MOVED TO DALLAS IN 1990 WHEN I GRADUATED FROM A AND M WITH A CIVIL ENGINEERING DEGREE. AND I WORKED IN CIVIL ENGINEERING, PUBLIC INFRASTRUCTURE, MOSTLY A LOT OF CONTRACTS WITH THE CITY OF DALLAS BACK IN THE DAY. UM, STARTED MY OWN FIRM IN 2000, SOLD IT IN 2018, RETIRED FROM CIVIL ENGINEERING, UM, IN 22, JOINED THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT THAT YEAR. UM, I LIVE IN EAST DALLAS IN THE LITTLE FOREST HILLS NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH IS OVER BY THE ARBORETUM. EXCELLENT. HELLO, MY NAME IS STUART CAMPBELL. UH, I AM A ATTORNEY BY TRADE. I RUN THE DALLAS EVICTION ADVOCACY CENTER HERE THAT REPRESENTS, UH, AT TENANTS FOR FREE IN EVICTION COURT IN DALLAS. AND, UH, THIS IS MY FIRST MEETING. VERY EXCITED TO BE HERE. AND I LIVE IN THE CASA VIEW OAKS AREA. THANK YOU. GOOD MORNING EVERYBODY. I'M KATHLEEN DAVIS. I MOVED TO DALLAS SIX YEARS AGO WITH MY THEN BOYFRIEND, NOW HUSBAND, AND IT'S GOING TO BE OUR FOREVER HOME. I RUN THE, UH, DESTINATIONS, TEXAS, WHICH IS AN ASSOCIATION FOR DESTINATION ORGANIZATIONS THROUGHOUT THE STATE. AND I LIVE, UH, JUST SOUTH OF DOWNTOWN IN THE NORTH CL NORTH OAK CLIFF NEIGHBORHOOD OF KESSLER PARK. AND I'VE BEEN ON THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS FOR FOUR YEARS. PA THANK YOU. UH, JARED SLADE. I'M YET ANOTHER LAWYER. UH, MY LAW FIRM IS OLSON AND BIRD. UM, I STARTED SERVING ON THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AS AN ALTERNATE, I GUESS ABOUT SIX YEARS AGO. UH, I LIVE IN A NEIGHBORHOOD CALLED GREENWAY PARKS THAT'S RELATIVELY CLOSE TO LOVE FIELD. GOOD MORNING. I'M DR. CAMIKA MILLER HOSKINS, AND I SERVE AS THE CHIEF PLANNER BOARD ADMINISTRATOR FOR, UM, THE CITY OF DALLAS BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. I AM NOT A RESIDENT OF THE CITY OF DALLAS. I LIVE, UM, IN TERRELL, TEXAS, AND I'VE BEEN WITH THE CITY FOR THREE YEARS AND WITH THE BOARD FOR ABOUT TWO AND A HALF YEARS NOW. THAT'S THE FIRST I KNEW SHE LIVED IN. I FLY INTO TARRELL ALL THE TIME. YOU IN MUNICIPAL AIRPORT? YES, ABSOLUTELY. OKAY, FABULOUS. NEXT TIME YOU'LL HAVE TO TELL ME EXACTLY WHERE YOU LIVE AND I'LL DO A FLY BY . I WON'T DO THAT. I'M JUST KIDDING. OKAY, GO AHEAD. THANK YOU. THERESA CARLISLE. I AM THE BOARD ATTORNEY. I'VE BEEN WITH THE CITY FOR NINE YEARS NOW, AND THIS IS MY SECOND ROTATION ON THE BOARD. OUR SECTION, UM, ROTATES THROUGH THE DIFFERENT BOARDS EVERY TWO YEARS. AND SO THIS IS MY SECOND ROTATION. GOOD MORNING. MY NAME IS MARY WILLIAMS. I AM THE, UM, SORRY, THE BOARD COORDINATOR AND BOARD SECRETARY FOR THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. I'VE BEEN WITH THE CITY OF DALLAS FOR 11 YEARS, SO ONE. THANK YOU, MARY. ONE COMMENT BEFORE WE GO TO MR. DORN. UM, THE COMPOSITION OF THE BOARD IS 15 MEMBERS, SIX ALTERNATE MEMBERS, AND THREE OFFICERS BESIDES THE CHAIRMAN AND THE TWO VICE CHAIRS. SO KAMIKA SERVES, EXCUSE ME, DR. MILLER. HOSKINS SERVES AS THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND OFFICER, NON-VOTING. THERESA CARLISLE SERVES AS AN OFFICER, BOARD, BOARD ATTORNEY, NON-VOTING, AND MARY WILLIAMS SERVES AS BOARD SECRETARY NON-VOTING. THEY'RE AT THE PANEL HERE BECAUSE THEY ARE PART OF THE OFFICER CORPS OF THE BOARD. OKAY. VERY IMPORTANT, VITAL, DIFFERENT ROLES. UM, SO, OKAY, MR. DORN. GOOD MORNING. UM, MY NAME'S MICHAEL DORN. I HAVE JOINED THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT BACK IN APRIL. UM, I'VE LIVED IN THE DALLAS AREA, STARTING IN COPPEL, TEXAS FIRST AND NOW DALLAS FOR THE, FOR 30 YEARS COMBINED. UM, I ALSO SERVE AS A CHIEF AUDIT EXECUTIVE FOR A COUPLE OF HOSPITALITY REITS, WHICH I KNOW CANDACE FROM ONE OF THOSE. UM, THAT'S IT. WHAT AREA OF THE CITY DO YOU LIVE IN? OH, SORRY. IN THE, UH, COOPER'S AEROBIC CENTER AREA. JUST SOUTH OF THERE, NORTH OF FOREST. OKAY. EXCELLENT. GOOD MORNING. I'M RODNEY MILLIKEN, UH, LIFE TIME RESIDENT OF DALLAS SINCE 1963, SO THAT'S A LONG TIME. SO YOU'RE THE SENIOR IN THE ROOM RIGHT NOW BY NAME? I, I AM YOU'RE THE SENIOR, RIGHT? I DIDN'T MEAN AGE, I JUST SAID SENIOR. I WAS ABOUT BY THAT TENURE. YES. AND I LIVE IN SOUTHEAST DALLAS IN THE PARKDALE NEIGHBORHOOD. GOOD MORNING. UH, MY NAME IS DR. MANEL GLOVER. I LIVE IN WEST ALLIES IN THE LOS ALTOS AREA. UH, THIS IS MY SECOND TIME ON THE BOARD. I WORK WITH THE FEDERAL RESERVE. GOOD MORNING. UH, MY NAME IS [00:15:01] LINDA GARNER. UM, I AM A LIFELONG DALLAS RESIDENT. I LIVE, I MOVED TO THE CEDARS ABOUT 2002. BOOKER T WASHINGTON GRAD EL CENTRO GRAD. UM, I'M BASICALLY SOUTHERN DOWNTOWN, SO IT'S A PLEASURE TO BE HERE. MORNING, UH, ROGER ING, I LIVE IN THE FAR SOUTHWEST CORNER OF DALLAS. UH, USED TO BE CHAIRMAN NEWMAN'S DISTRICT AT ONE TIME. UM, I JOINED THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT IN 2018, I BELIEVE. UM, UH, SO I MOVED MY FAMILY HERE FROM ALABAMA ROLL TIDE, UH, IN 2006. UM, AND, UH, RACHEL, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO RESPOND TO THAT. WHOOP WHOOP. OKAY. UH, 2006, UM, THAT WE HAVE FOUR KIDS. ONE GRADUATED IN THREE YEARS, UH, THIS PAST SUMMER, UH, FROM COLLEGE AND, UH, TWO YOUNGER KIDS, UM, THAT, WELL, THREE, UH, THREE YOUNGER KIDS THAT ARE STILL IN GRADE SCHOOL. SO, UM, ALWAYS A PLEASURE. LOVE WORKING WITH MR. STEVE OVER THERE. HE'S, UH, PROBABLY THE ONE OF THE BEST. OKAY, SO EVERYONE PASSED. NO ONE MENTIONED THE DISTRICT THAT THEY'RE IN. THAT IS FABULOUS BECAUSE VERY TRULY, WHEN WE SERVE HERE AS A FULL BOARD OR WE SERVE IN A PANEL HEADING, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT DISTRICT OR ADDRESS YOU'RE IN, YOU'RE A MEMBER OF A ADJUDICATING PANEL MAKING A DECISION ON LAND USE. SO THAT'S WHAT'S IMPORTANT THROUGHOUT TODAY, YOU'RE GONNA HEAR MANY THINGS ABOUT MANY DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE CITY. AGAIN, IT'S NOT SPECIFIC TO A DISTRICT, IT DEALS WITH THE ENTIRE CITY. SO THIS IS WONDERFUL. ALRIGHT, INTRODUCTIONS. SO WE'RE GONNA DO THE ADDITIONAL STAFF INTRODUCTIONS WHEN THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND THE BOARD ATTORNEY DO THEIR TRAINING PORTION, THEY'LL INTRODUCE THEIR FOLKS. UM, NEXT ON OUR AGENDA IS PUBLIC TESTIMONY. A REQUIREMENT FOR ALL BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS AND CITY COUNCIL MEETINGS IS THERE'S PUBLIC TESTIMONY AT THE BEGINNING OF THEIR MEETING. UM, AND SO, MS. BOARD, SECRETARY, I'M SORRY. GO AHEAD, MR. LONG. OKAY. MR. STEVE, LONG BEFORE HE BEGINS, I'LL, I'LL TRY TO EMBARRASS HIM AS MUCH AS I CAN. UH, MANY OF US REMEMBER STEVE LONG FROM HIS SERVICE. MANY OF US REMEMBER STEVE LONG AFTER HIS SERVICE. UH, STEVE AND I HAVE GOTTEN TOGETHER MANY TIMES FOR LUNCH, UM, AT NORMA'S ON EIGHTH STREET IN OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY, JUST TO PICK HIS BRAIN ABOUT WHAT DID HAPPEN, WOULD HAPPEN, SHOULD HAPPEN. UM, I, MY RECALL FROM 20 YEARS AGO WHEN I STARTED, I WAS AN ALTERNATE, WAS BASED ON THE TRAINING FROM STEVE LONG. SO STEVE, I CAN'T TELL YOU ENOUGH, JUST LIKE I SAID TO YOU WHEN YOU WALKED IN, HOW FORTUNATE IT IS THAT IT IS FOR THE BOARD FOR YOU TO BE WITH US TODAY. PLEASE. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. MEMBERS OF THE BOARD, MY NAME'S STEVE LONG, MY ADDRESS IS 9 0 2 THOMASON. AND, UM, I KNOW THAT THE, I'M NOT REALLY TO GIVE YOU MY BIO, BUT I THINK I AM TO A POINT WHERE I THINK IT'S, IM, UM, WILL BE RELEVANT FOR YOU TO UNDERSTAND WHERE I'M COMING FROM WHEN I ACTUALLY CONCLUDE BY SAYING WHAT I CAME TO SAY. UM, I'VE BEEN HERE SINCE 1986. I'M FROM OHIO. UM, I CAME IN 86. I CAME TO THIS BUILDING IN 1980 6TH OF JANUARY. THIS WONDERFUL IM PAY BUILDING THAT, UM, I LOOK AT DIFFERENTLY NOW GIVEN THE, WHAT'S GOING ON WITH OUR CITY AND THE CONDITION OF IT. I STARTED, UM, UH, AT THE CITY OF DALLAS PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT IN 1986. I, UH, BOUGHT A HOME IN NORTH OAK CLIFF IN 1989. I'M STILL THERE. AND I STARTED THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AROUND 1995. AND I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT IN TERMS OF A CONTEXT. AND WHAT I'M TELLING YOU IS THAT, UM, FROM 1995 TO 2019, WHEN I RETIRED IN MY RETIREMENT SPEECH, I ACTUALLY, UM, CALCULATED THAT I HAD DEALT WITH OVER ABOUT 3000 APPLICANTS, UM, SEVERAL CITY MANAGERS, DIRECTORS, BOARD MEMBERS, BOARD APPLICANTS. AND IT WAS, UH, MY HONOR TO BE A, A SERVANT AND, UM, A PERSON THAT PROVIDED INFORMATION TO THE CITIZENS OF DALLAS AND, UM, TO THE, TO THE BOARD. AND, UM, IT WAS A, JUST ONCE AGAIN, A GREAT HONOR. UM, I DO HAVE A DEEP UNDERSTANDING OF YOUR ROLE HERE AS BOARD MEMBERS, HAVING BEEN YOUR ADMINISTRATOR, HAVING BEEN THE ADMINISTRATOR FROM 1995 TO 2019. [00:20:02] UM, I UNDERSTAND WHAT COMES BEFORE YOU IN AN APPLICATION, SOMETIMES 10 PAGES AND SOMETIMES OVER A THOUSAND PAGES OF INFORMATION THAT YOU ARE SO DILIGENT WITH REVIEWING AND, UM, ASSESSING. I ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT WHILE INFORMATION'S GIVEN YOU IN A DOCKET MATERIAL REPORT, I WAS ALWAYS VERY CLEAR TO THE APPLICANTS AND THE PUBLIC AT A PUBLIC HEARING OR A BRIEFING ACTUALLY, TO TELL THEM THAT WHILE THERE'S CERTAIN INFORMATION THAT'S MAYBE CONVEYED, THAT'S ALL PUBLIC INFORMATION TO THE PUBLIC PRIOR TO THE PUBLIC HEARING. IT'S NOT OVER UNTIL ALL EVIDENCE AND TESTIMONY HAS BEEN PRESENTED TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AT THE PUBLIC HEARING PROCESS. UM, I THINK WITH THAT BEING SAID, I REALLY WANT TO THANK YOU 15 MEMBERS FOR YOUR, UM, WILLINGNESS TO VOLUNTEER ON THIS BOARD. I UNDERSTAND AS A PERSON INVOLVED WITH THE PROCESS THAT IT'S IMPORTANT. SOMETIMES IT'S IMPORTANT WITH A HIGH PROFILE APPLICATION TO MANY PEOPLE, BUT IT'S ALWAYS IMPORTANT TO AT LEAST ONE PERSON, THE PERSON THAT MADE THE APPLICATION TO YOU. AND I APPRECIATE YOU, UM, MAKING SURE PER YOUR ATTORNEY AND YOUR STAFF, PEOPLE THAT YOU CAREFULLY REVIEW THE APPLICATION, THAT YOU CAREFULLY USE THE STANDARD THAT'S IN THE DEVELOPMENT CODE THAT GRANTS YOU CERTAIN, UM, POWERS TO FLEX CHAPTER 51 A, VOLUME THREE, THE DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE, WITH MOSTLY VARIANCES AND SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS. SO WITH THAT, I REALLY GIVE YOU A VERY SINCERE, UM, THANK YOU FOR YOUR WILLINGNESS TO SERVE ON THIS BOARD. AND I THINK WITH THE, MAYBE A BOTTOM LINE OF MAKING THE CITY A BETTER PLACE TO LIVE AND DO BUSINESS. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, STEVE. WE APPRECIATE YOU. THANK YOU MS. WILLIAMS. I THINK MR. VINCENT NEXT, MR. JONATHAN VINCENT. THANK YOU, UH, MR. CHAIR, MEMBERS OF THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT, MY NAME IS JONATHAN VINCENT. UH, I'LL GIVE MY ADDRESS. I'M JUST USED TO IT. 2323 ROSS AVENUE. UM, AND FIRST OF ALL, UM, AND I WON'T TAKE UP TOO MUCH OF YOUR TIME, BUT I REALLY APPRECIATE THIS OPPORTUNITY TO COME BEFORE YOU, NOT IN THE CONTEXT OF PRESENTING A CASE, BUT JUST TO SPEAK IN GENERAL TERMS ABOUT THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT PROCESS AND ABOUT YOU AS BOARD MEMBERS. UM, BEFORE I GO ANY FARTHER, I DON'T WANNA FORGET TO DO THIS TO RECOGNIZE MR. STEVE LONG. UM, I THINK THE FIRST TIME I DID A BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT CASE WAS PROBABLY ABOUT 1998, AND STEVE WAS JUST A TERRIFIC, UM, COMPANION ON THAT JOURNEY, YOU KNOW, A HUNDRED PERCENT TOTALLY PROFESSIONAL ALL THE TIME, EXTREMELY HELPFUL, KIND OF KEPT ME ON THE RIGHT PATH, YOU KNOW, IN A FAIR KIND OF WAY, NOT TELLING ME WHAT TO DO, BUT CERTAINLY FROM A PROCESS STANDPOINT, YOU KNOW, HELPING ME UNDERSTAND THAT I, I HAD BEEN ON THE PLAN COMMISSION IN THE EARLY NINETIES, SO I KNEW THE ZONING PROCESS PRETTY WELL, BUT BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT, AS YOU'RE WELL AWARE, IS A KIND OF A DIFFERENT ANIMAL. SO, UM, IT'S GREAT TO SEE STEVE. UM, HE WAS, HE WAS A WONDERFUL PERSON TO WORK WITH ON THESE BOARD CASES, AND IT'S, IT'S NICE TO SEE HIM, NICE TO SEE HE'S DOING WELL, UM, FROM A STANDPOINT OF, YOU KNOW, AN OCCASIONAL CURRENT APPLICANT. UM, YOU KNOW, I DON'T OFTEN GET A CHANCE TO, TO SAY THIS, SO I APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY, BUT I'M ALWAYS HUGELY IMPRESSED BY ALL OF YOU AS BOARD MEMBERS IN TERMS OF YOUR DILIGENCE AND YOUR FOCUS AND YOUR SERIOUSNESS. I KNOW YOU'RE ALL CITIZEN VOLUNTEERS. THIS IS VERY TIME CONSUMING. UM, SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO MAKE DECISIONS THAT DON'T PLEASE PEOPLE, SOMETIMES DON'T PLEASE ANYBODY. BUT, UM, I'M ALWAYS EXTREMELY IMPRESSED BY THE SERIOUSNESS AND THE FOCUS THAT YOU BRING TO THIS. SO, UM, YOU KNOW, I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT I, I APPRECIATE YOUR SERVICE VERY MUCH. UM, I LIVE IN DALLAS MYSELF. I'M A CITIZEN OF DALLAS. I'VE BEEN HERE PROBABLY ABOUT 65 YEARS OF MY LIFE, UH, OFF AND ON BACK SINCE 1980 AFTER SCHOOL. SO, UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S IMPORTANT TO ME AS A CITIZEN THAT YOU ALL DO SUCH A GREAT JOB AS WELL. UM, I DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY OTHER COMMENTS. I DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM. I THINK THE PROCESS RUNS VERY WELL CONSIDERING THE VOLUME OF CASES AND THE COMPLEXITY OF THESE CASES. UM, I ALSO DON'T WANNA FORGET TO COMPLIMENT THE CITY STAFF, UM, SOME OF WHOM I KNOW BETTER THAN OTHERS, UM, BUT ALSO VERY IMPRESSED BY THEIR DILIGENCE. UM, YOU KNOW, THEY, UH, KIND OF LIKE DRINKING FROM A FIRE HOSE, TRYING TO HANDLE THESE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT CASES, SOMETIMES LONG AGENDAS, COMPLEX CASES. UM, SOMETIMES THEY MAKE RE, YOU KNOW, ON VARIANCE CASES, THEY MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS ON SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, SOMETIMES NOT, BUT THEY STILL HAVE TO DO THE INTAKE AND [00:25:01] DO THE ANALYSIS AND PRESENT YOU WITH A CASE REPORT. UM, SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE PROCESS RUNS WELL CONSIDERING ALL THE FACTORS INVOLVED IN THE VOLUME OF CASES. THE ONLY, I, I DO HAVE ONE. I WAS TRYING TO THINK OF IF, IF I HAVE ONE SUBSTANTIVE COMMENT OR SUGGESTION, WHAT WOULD THAT BE? UM, AND I JUST BRIEFLY, THE, UH, PRE-SCREEN INTAKE PROCESS, UM, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD THING. I THINK THAT'S, UM, AN INNOVATION THAT WAS DONE, YOU KNOW, IN THE LAST TWO, THREE YEARS. AND I THINK THAT HELPS, YOU KNOW, KIND OF HELPS THE STAFF AND HELPS THE APPLICANTS UNDERSTAND THAT SOMETIMES THESE APPLICATIONS THEMSELVES ARE VERY COMPLEX AND THERE ARE THINGS THAT NEED TO BE INCLUDED THAT MAYBE, YOU KNOW, AN APPLICANT THAT'S NOT DOWN HERE A LOT DOESN'T REALLY UNDERSTAND. I THINK THAT'S A VERY HELPFUL PROCESS. UM, I THINK POSSIBLY CONSIDERATION MIGHT BE GIVEN TO EVEN MAYBE SYSTEMATIZING THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE IN TERMS OF TIMELINES. LIKE, IF YOU GET YOUR PRE-SCREEN MATERIALS IN ON X DATE, THEN MAYBE YOU'LL GET COMMENTS BY Y DATE, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. UM, BECAUSE THE ACTUAL APPLICATION DEADLINE 12 NOON FOURTH FRIDAY OF EACH MONTH, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, THAT'S A FIRM DEADLINE AS FAR AS I KNOW. IT'S ALWAYS BEEN IN MY EXPERIENCE. SO I THINK IT'S HELPFUL TO GET THOSE COMMENTS AS SOON AS POSSIBLE AND TURN 'EM AROUND, BECAUSE SOMETIMES THERE'S SOME BACK AND FORTH, YOU KNOW, STAFF NEEDS SOMETHING ELSE, YOU KNOW, AND THEN IT'S ON THE APPLICANT TO PROVIDE THAT. SO THAT'S REALLY THE ONLY SUBSTATIVE COMMENT I HAVE. BUT AGAIN, YOU KNOW, IT'S ALWAYS A PLEASURE TO WORK WITH YOU ALL. ALWAYS VERY IMPRESSED BY YOUR DILIGENCE AND YOUR FOCUS CITY STAFF, UM, IS GREAT TO WORK WITH, HIGHLY PROFESSIONAL, AND I APPRECIATE THEM. AND, UH, LASTLY, I APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE HERE TODAY, SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MR. VINCENT. MR. SINGTON HAS A COMMENT OR A QUESTION? UH, CHAIR NEWMAN, I JUST WANNA TAKE AN OPPORTUNITY TO, TO, TO PUT A PIN HERE. WHILE WE DO ALWAYS APPRECIATE, UH, MR. UH, MR. LONG AND HIS EFFORTS IN HIS WORK, HIS ABILITY TO TEACH AND TRAIN AND RELAY INFORMATION, I DO WANT TO TAKE A MOMENT TO, UM, GIVE PRAISE TO OUR CURRENT STAFF, UM, DR. MILLER HOSKINS AND THE REST OF THE TEAM, UH, WITH THE WAY THEY PRESENT THE INFORMATION, THEY GIVE THE INFORMATION, THE EFFICIENCY AT WHICH, AT WHICH THEY WORK. I WANT TO, YOU KNOW, UM, TAKE THE OPPORTUNITY TO, UH, GIVE THEM PRAISE FOR THE WAY THAT THE BOARD IS CONDUCTED, UM, NOW. SO, UH, THANK YOU TO THE TEAM. ABSOLUTELY. I'M GONNA SPEAK TO THAT VERY, VERY ISSUE ON MY CHAIRMAN'S REPORT NEXT. SO, UH, THANK YOU, MR. VINCENT. UM, THANK YOU. YOU KNOW, AS YOU ONE, ONE COMMENT I'LL MAKE, OKAY. AS YOU SPOKE TO, NOT A SPECIFIC CASE, I STARTED THINKING OF ALL THE CASES I'VE HEARD FROM YOU AS AN APPLICANT AND THINKING, OH, THAT WAS DIFFICULT BECAUSE OF THIS, AND THAT WAS DIFFICULT BECAUSE OF THAT, AND WE HAD TO HOLD THIS OVER BECAUSE OF THIS ISSUE OR THAT ISSUE. UM, UH, IT IS A WORK IN PROCESS, AND PART OF THAT IS BOARD MEMBERS, THE BOARD PANELS, STAFF, ATTORNEYS, APPLICANTS, SAYING, OKAY, HOW CAN WE DO BETTER EACH NEXT TIME? SO, UM, UH, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT, AGAIN, IS IN MY CHAIRMAN'S REPORT, AND I WILL REITERATE TO THE ENTIRE BOARD, IS EVERY SINGLE MONTH, UM, DR. MILLER HOSKINS AND I AS BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND MS. WILLIAMS GO THROUGH THIS COUNTDOWN ON THE DEADLINE FOR CASES. AND YES, WE HAVE A HARD, FAST COUNT, UH, DEADLINE DATE, BUT I'M ALWAYS SAYING, CAN'T WE EXTEND IT? CAN'T WE EXTEND IT? LET'S EXTEND IT ANOTHER WEEK SO WE GIVE MORE TIME SO WE CAN SHRINK THAT DELAY TIME. SO THE, THE ISSUE OF INTAKE AND TIMELINES IS, I'M TAKING NOTES. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. APPRECIATE IT, MR. VINCENT. THANK YOU, MR. HERE. AND PLEASE DON'T MISUNDERSTAND ME. NO, NO, THAT'S, THAT'S NOT A CRITICISM. THAT'S JUST, THIS IS A VERY COMPLEX PROCESS FOR ALL OF US. OF COURSE, IT'S NOT TAKEN AS CRITICISM. I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, UH, HAS DONE IS TO TRY TO STREAMLINE THE PROCESS. AND I THINK SHE'S GONNA SPEAK TO THAT IS PART OF HER PRESENTATIONS. UM, IN ORDER TO GIVE THE APPLICANT NOT, IT'S A FINE LINE BECAUSE THE APPLICANT, THE BURDEN IS ON THE APPLICANT. AT THE SAME TOKEN, THE BIG CITY HALL CAN BE VERY INTIMIDATING. SO IT'S PART OF THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR'S STAFF'S JOB TO ASSIST WITHOUT DIRECTING. AND I CAN'T TELL HER TO ASK HER HOW SHE, HOW THAT HAPPENS, BUT IT'S THIS LINE OF ASSISTING WITHOUT DIRECTING. AND SO THAT'S THE HOPE. NO, I APPRECIATE THAT. AND I A HUNDRED PERCENT AGREE, AND, AND I, I SOMETIMES FEEL BAD FOR AN AVERAGE CITIZEN WHO'S DOWN HERE TRYING TO ASK FOR A VARIANCE WHO'S NEVER DONE THIS BEFORE. AND IT, IT'S, IT CAN BE, UH, CHALLENGING, I'LL PUT IT THAT WAY. AND I THINK THAT'S A GOOD POINT FOR ALL BOARD MEMBERS. WHEN YOU HEAR A PANEL, WHEN YOU'RE ON A PANEL AND YOU HAVE A CASE AND YOU HAVE A PRIVATE CITIZEN, NOT A BIG GUN, A JACKSON WALKER, BIG GUN HERE, UH, BUT AN AVERAGE CITIZEN, THINK ABOUT WHAT THAT AVERAGE CITIZEN'S GOING THROUGH. A LOT OF TIMES WHAT I'LL TRY TO DO IS SAY, LET'S SLOW IT DOWN. TAKE YOUR TIME. THERE'S NO RUSH. I'M GONNA GIVE YOU AS MUCH TIME AS YOU WANT TO SO THAT, THAT APPLICANT CAN ADJUST TO THE INTIMIDATION. 'CAUSE LEMME TELL YOU GUYS, STANDING THERE LOOKING THIS WAY, [00:30:01] WE'RE HIGHER UP THAN THAT PERSON. IT'S INTIMIDATING. SO, UH, SO I AGREE SO THAT THE, YOU HIRED GUNS, THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE PAID FOR. BUT THE AVERAGE CITIZEN, IT'S, THAT'S WHY YOU'LL SEE IN OUR GOALS AND OBJECTIVES, THE COMMENT ABOUT USER FRIENDLY, USER FRIENDLY, HOW ARE WE BEING USER FRIENDLY? NOT FOR THE HIRED GUNS. THEY KNOW HOW TO DO IT, BUT THE REST OF THE PEOPLE USER FRIENDLY. SO THANK YOU, MR. VINCENT. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR EITHER TWO SPEAKERS TODAY? OKAY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU FOR THE OPPORTUNITY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. APPRECIATE IT. OKAY, SO WHO'S CLICK, WHO'S, WHO'S DOING THE POWERPOINTS FOR TODAY? IS THAT YOU, MARY? MR. WILLIAMS? SO IF I'M GONNA, MR. BRIAN THOMPSON, WILL THOMPSON ASSISTING IN SOME, IN SOME, OKAY. SO WE NEED TO GO TO PAGE FIVE, WHICH IS THE CHAIRMAN'S REPORT. I DON'T KNOW, WHOEVER, WHOEVER'S GONNA BE DOING THE CLICKING, WE NEED TO GO TO THE CHAIRMAN'S REPORT. THAT'S NEXT IN THE AGENDA. OKAY, GOOD. THANK YOU. AND AGAIN, THE FULL BOARD WAS GIVEN THE ENTIRE AGENDA A WEEK AGO. SO WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO TODAY IS NOT READ EVERY PAGE OR EVERY LINE ITEM. ABSOLUTELY NOT. WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO IS HIGHLIGHT, ALRIGHT, THE PURPOSE OF THE CHAIRMAN'S REPORT IS TO GIVE FROM THIS CHAIR TO THE BOARD KEY THINGS THAT WERE ACCOMPLISHED AND OR WERE EXPERIENCED IN THE LAST CALENDAR YEAR. AND WE RUN ON A FISCAL YEAR, THAT'S OCTOBER ONE OF 24 TO SEPTEMBER 30TH OF 25. SO IN THAT 12 MONTH PERIOD, FOCUS WAS ON FAIRNESS, TRANSPARENCY, TIMELINESS, AND ACCURACY ADVOCACY. SEVERAL TIMES THROUGHOUT THE YEAR, I'VE MET WITH ROBIN BENTLEY, WHO'S THE ASSISTANT CITY MANAGER FOR, UH, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, AND ALSO MS. EMILY LIU, WHO'S GONNA BE PRESENTING HER MOMENTARILY. IT, IT'S, I WILL TELL YOU, UM, MS. LOU AND I WILL SEE EACH OTHER AT CITY HALL AND ALL OF A SUDDEN SHE'LL SAY, DAVE, CAN YOU STEP IN? OR, SHE'S, SHE'S PROPER, SHE'S MR. CHAIRMAN, CAN STEP IN AND HALF HOUR LATER WE FINISH. SO IT, IT HAS BEEN QUITE ENJOYABLE AND IT'S A GREAT ACCESS FOR YOUR BOARD TO HAVE TO THE DIRECTOR. SHE SPOKE LAST YEAR, SHE, WE ASKED HER TO SPEAK AGAIN THIS YEAR. THAT'S PART OF ADVOCACY. UM, THE SAME THING AS IT RELATES TO CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. UH, SEVERAL CONVERSATIONS THROUGHOUT THE YEAR WITH NOT ONLY BERT VANDENBERG, BUT ALSO CASEY BERGES, THE TWO OTHER EXECUTIVES THAT ARE ON THE SEVENTH FLOOR TALKING ABOUT THE BOARD'S EXPRESSED AND IMPLIED AUTHORITY TO HANDLE CASES. UM, AND ALSO ADDITIONAL BRIEFINGS TO THE BOARD EMPOWERMENT. UH, MYSELF AND THE VICE CHAIRS HAVE WORKED VERY CAREFULLY TO TRY TO FURTHER EMPOWER CITIZEN LEADERS ON THE PANELS AS OPPOSED TO STAFF. NOTHING AGAINST STAFF, BUT THIS IS A CITY COUNCIL CREATED BOARD AND PANEL, UM, CITY STAFF LEADERSHIP. IT'S BEEN REMARKABLE THIS YEAR. THE, OF THE PROGRESS THE STAFF HAS MADE KEY, AND SHE'LL SPEAK TO THAT IN A LITTLE BIT. KEY IS OUR HEARING DAYS ARE DOWN TO 54 DAYS. OH MY GOSH, FOUR YEARS AGO IT WAS 93 DAYS WHEN AN APPLICANT WOULD COME TO MAKE AN APPLICATION BEFORE THEY GET A HEARING BEFORE THE BOARD. FOUR YEARS AGO, 93 DAYS WE'RE DOWN TO 54. AND I THINK WE'VE IMPROVED THE QUALITY AS WE'VE REDUCED THE TIME. NOW, I'D LIKE TO KEEP SAYING TO MISS, TO OUR BOARD MINISTER, CAN WE DO 50? CAN WE DO 45? CAN WE DO 40? I DIDN'T, I DON'T THINK THAT'S REASONABLE. BUT THE SAME TOKEN, TREMENDOUS PROGRESS ON THAT FRONT. ALMOST EVERY MONTH THE BOARD MINISTER AND I GET TOGETHER AFTER MY PANEL HEARING AND WE KIBBITZ WE TALK ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON, WHAT THINGS I NEED TO KNOW, WHAT THINGS SHE NEEDS TO KNOW, WHAT THINGS WE CAN DO TO IMPROVE PIS BACK AND FORTH. SO THAT IS A REGULAR COMMUNICATION I MENTIONED EARLIER, REGULARLY, I'M ASKING HER, EXTEND THE DEADLINE. CAN YOU EXTEND THE DEADLINE? AND SHE CAN DO THAT AS LONG AS SHE CAN MAINTAIN THE QUALITY OF THE WORK. SO THAT'S A VERY INTERESTING BALANCE. LAST AND NOT LEAST IS FURTHER LEVERAGING THE BE IT BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT WEBSITE. THAT IS A KEY COMPONENT OF TECHNOLOGY AND ACCESS. THAT IS OUR FRONT DOOR IS THE WEBSITE, UM, FOR THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT QUESTIONS ON THE CHAIRMAN'S REPORT. SEEING NONE, WE WILL NOW GO TO OUR PRESENTATIONS. OUR FIRST SPEAKER TODAY IS EMILY LIU, THE DIRECTOR OF PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS. AND WHO I DON'T KNOW WHO'S RUNNING HER POWERPOINT. OKAY, VERY GOOD. MS. LOU, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US AGAIN. GOOD MORNING, CHAIR NEWMAN, A MEMBER OF THE BOARD. UM, DID I, DID I SPEAK CORRECTLY ABOUT HOW WE RUN INTO EACH OTHER AND THEN I HAVE A HAVE A A GET TOGETHER MEETING REGULARLY? [00:35:01] ABSOLUTELY. THAT'S A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO CATCH UP RIGHT THERE. YES. YOU KNOW, WE GOT A LOT OF THINGS DONE WITHIN THAT 30 MINUTES. THANK YOU SO MUCH. AND, UH, I WOULD LIKE TO FOLLOW THE TRADITION A LITTLE BIT. INTRODUCE MYSELF A LITTLE BEYOND MY TITLE SO YOU KNOW ME A LITTLE BIT MORE. AGAIN, MY NAME IS EMILY LIU. I'M A PROFESSIONAL PLANNER BY TRAINING AND BY PRACTICE. SO I GRADUATE FROM THE GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY WITH A MASTER DEGREE IN URBAN REGIONAL PLANNING. AND THEN I FOLLOWED MY FAMILY TO OHIO AND GOT MY FIRST JOB THERE. I WAS SO EXACT, IT TOOK ME MORE THAN A YEAR THOUGH, . BUT ANYWAY, AND THEN, UM, I FOLLOWED MY FAMILY AGAIN TO ILLINOIS, THEN MY FAMILY AGAIN TO LOUISVILLE, KENTUCKY. SO WE LIVED THERE FOR 21 YEARS AND 10, UH, MORE THAN 10 YEARS OF THAT, I, I SERVE AS THE PLANNING DIRECTOR FOR LOUISVILLE METRO GOVERNMENT. AND THEN, UH, A LITTLE LESS THAN A YEAR AND A HALF AGO, I FOLLOWED MY FAMILY AGAIN TO DALLAS. LIKE MANY OF YOU MOVED TO DALLAS FOR SOMEWHERE ELSE. I DID THAT TO LET YOU KNOW, I DID NOT COME HERE. JUST TAKE THIS CHALLENGING JOB. . I FOLLOWED MY FAMILY. AND, UH, CURRENTLY I LIVE, UM, IN OAK CLIFF NEIGHBORHOOD. UM, LOVE IT. UH, VERY DIVERSE AND ALSO CLOSE TO, UM, MY OTHER OFFICE IN MONT. UH, MOST OF MY STAFF ACTUALLY STATIONED THERE. SO THAT'S KIND OF MY BACKGROUND WHERE I LIVE A LITTLE BIT. I'M TRYING TO CONNECT WITH YOU A LITTLE BIT MORE. AND PLEASE, WHEN YOU COME CITY HALL, STOP BY A LOT OF TIME I'M AT MEETINGS ON THE PHONE, BUT I CAN ALWAYS MAKE TIME. AND JUST, UH, LAST WEEK I MET ANDREW AT THE STATE, A PA CONFERENCE. SO KNOW HIM A LITTLE BIT MORE. I GUESS YOU KNOW ME A LITTLE BIT MORE. WE PRESENTED THERE, WE HAD OUT TOGETHER, SO IT'S GREAT. JUST LET YOU KNOW NEXT YEAR, THIS TIME, UM, AND TEXAS AMERICAN PLANNING ASSOCIATION GOING TO HOLD THEIR STATE CONFERENCE HERE IN THE DALLAS FORWARDS METROPLEX. SO WE'LL SEE, UH, HOW MANY OF YOU'LL BE INTERESTED AND WE'LL TRY TO ACCOMMODATE AS MANY AS WE CAN. THAT'S A GREAT TRAINING OPPORTUNITY. AND ALSO CONNECT WITH OTHER CITIES AND PLANNERS TO SEE HOW THEY DO THEIR JOB. UM, SO WITH THAT, I'M GOING TO GET TO THE TOPIC. UH, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. SO THIS IS A MISSION STATEMENT DEVELOPED BY OUR STAFF THE LAST YEAR. UM, AS YOU KNOW, THE TWO DEPARTMENT MERGE PLANNING, URBAN DESIGN AND DEVELOPMENT SERVICES MERGED INTO ONE. UM, IT IS A, A LOT OF WORK AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE DID AT THE VERY BEGINNING TO, UH, DEVELOP A MISSION STATEMENT. THIS IS OUR STAFF MANAGERS AND LEADERSHIP CAN, UM, UH, UP WITH, UH, TOGETHER WE'RE PLANNING AND BUILDING A BETTER DALLAS FOR ALL. SO THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT FOR OUR STAFF TO KNOW THE LONG-TERM PICTURE, THE BIG PICTURE, WHY THEY'RE HERE, WHAT THEY'RE WORKING FOR, AND THIS REALLY GIVE THEM SOME PURPOSE. UM, AND THAT'S OUR MISSION STATEMENT. NEXT ONE, PLEASE. I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE A LITTLE BIT INTRODUCTION ABOUT, UH, THE STRUCTURE. I KNOW IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO READ HERE, BUT THIS IS OUR ORGANIZATIONAL CHART. AS I MENTIONED EARLIER, TWO DEPARTMENT MERGE INTO ONE. UM, SO AS A RESULT, RESULT, WE HAVE TWO, UH, DEPARTMENT, DIFFERENT FUNCTIONS. AND THAT'S ONE OF THE REASON WE MERGED BECAUSE TRYING TO BREAK DOWN THE SILOS USED TO BE A LOT OF SILOS IN ONE DEPARTMENT. THEY'RE NOT TALKING TO EACH OTHER NOW IT'S OLD, UH, OLD UNDER ONE UMBRELLA. UNDER THE CURRENT ORGANIZATIONAL, WE HAVE FOUR DIFFERENT SECTIONS. ONE IS A PLANNING LED BY ANDREW GILLIS, AND THAT'S MOSTLY LONG RANGE PLANNING. YOU HEARD ABOUT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, ALL THREATS, HEARING DATA, RESEARCH, GS MAPPING, URBAN DESIGN, HISTORIC PRESERVATION, AND ALSO CONSERVATION DISTRICT. THAT'S A LOT UNDER ONE. UM, UH, DEPUTY DIRECTOR. AND THEN THE ZONING ZONING SECTION IS LED BY DR. ANDREA RIA AND WITH, UH, SUPPORT FROM MEGAN AND WEER. UH, DR. ANDREA WOODROW IS A DEPUTY DIRECTOR OVERSEEING ALL THE ZONING FUNCTION IN THE CITY OF DALLAS. SO PREVIOUSLY WE HAVE TWO DEPARTMENTS, UH, PLANNING AND URBAN DESIGN AND DEVELOPMENT [00:40:01] SURVEY. EACH OF THEM HAVE, UH, HAD A, UM, ZONING FUNCTION. SO ONE TIME YOU GO THROUGH ALL THE REZONING PROCESS OR SOME, YOU KNOW, ALL THE WAY TO THE PERMITTING STAGE, ONLY TO BE TOLD YOU HAVE TO START OVER BECAUSE THERE ARE DIFFERENT INTERPRETATION. THOSE DAYS ARE GONE. WE WANT TO MAKE SURE OUR DEPARTMENT HAVE ONE INTERPRETATION AND, UH, ONE VOICE. SO THAT'S VERY HELPFUL. THAT'S KIND OF BREAK DOWN THE SILOS WHEN SOMETHING WAS ADOPTED AS AUTHORIZED HERE, AIR WIDE REZONING, MAKE SURE OUR PERMITTING STAFF KNOWS WHAT THAT IS. SO WE ARE NOT GOING TO MAKE, UH, SYSTEMIC MISTAKES ANYMORE. SO THAT'S ONE OF THE BIG BENEFIT ABOUT BIG ONE, UH, UH, DEPARTMENT. THEN WE'LL HAVE PERMITTING ALL KINDS OF PERMITTING, COMMERCIAL, RESIDENTIAL, UH, REROOFING, SOLAR PANEL, ALL OF THAT AND INSPECTION ALL UNDER ONE. AND THEN ALSO WE HAVE ANOTHER SECTION, UM, CUSTOMER EXPERIENCE AND ALSO TEAM EXCELLENCE. THOSE ARE THE BUDGET. AND, YOU KNOW, BUDGETING, HR ISSUES, SUPPORT, YOU KNOW, UH, VEHICLES, MAINTENANCE, THAT'S A BIG JOB. UM, CUSTOMER SURVEY, UM, AND, UH, ARCHIVES, TRAINING, TECHNOLOGY, ALL OF THAT. AND, UH, HERE TODAY IS, UH, NO STRANGER TO YOU. JASON POOLE IS ONE OF THE ASSISTANT DIRECTORS UNDER THAT, THAT SECTION IS LED BY, UM, WERNA YOUNG. UH, THE PERMITTING IS LED BY, UM, SAM ES GONDER. SO THOSE KIND OF FOUR BIG SECTION. I WANNA FOCUS ON THE SECTION, THE ZONING SECTION, WHICH IS VERY IMPORTANT. AS MENTIONED, THAT'S WHERE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT FUNCTION, UH, LIES UNDER. SO UNDER THE ZONING, UH, WE HAVE, UH, BOARD ADJUSTMENT. CURRENTLY WE HAVE SIX MEMBERS. I THINK WE'RE FULLY STAFFED, KNOCK ON WOOD. UM, THEY, THEY'VE DONE AMAZING JOB. I'M GONNA TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THAT. UH, CAMIKA AND SARAH MAY, UH, SARAH MAY SUPERVISE SEVERAL TEAMS. BOARD ZONE ADJUSTMENT IS ONE OF THEM AS ONE OF A VERY IMPORTANT FUNCTION. AND I REALLY, REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR WORK. THIS IS THE VOLUNTEER WORK, NOT LIKE I COME TO WORK, THAT'S MY PROFESSIONAL WORK. I HAVE TO PAY FOR IT. BUT YOU AS A VOLUNTEER, COME TO HERE, UH, YOU KNOW, EVERY MONTH SOMETIME YOU HAVE TO READ YOUR, UH, YOU KNOW, REPORT AND, UH, HAVE TO UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING, HAVE TO MAKE VERY TOUGH DECISION. SO MY HEAD IS OFF TO YOU ALL AND I'M REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR SERVICE TO OUR COMMUNITY. SO THAT'S ORGANIZATIONAL CHART. UH, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. BEFORE YOU GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE. YES, ALTHOUGH GO TO IT, BUT I WANT TO GIVE A SHOUT OUT TO JASON POOLE. UM, I REACHED OUT TO HIM A COUPLE DAYS AGO AND I SAID, OF COURSE YOU'RE GONNA BE AT THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT FULL MEETING. AND HE QUICKLY RESPONDED, YES. AND I TOLD HIM THIS MORNING, I'M GONNA EMBARRASS YOU, JASON, IN FRONT OF THE BOARD, IN FRONT OF YOUR BOSS BOSS. WE CANNOT TELL YOU ENOUGH HOW VALUABLE JASON'S IMPACT WAS ON THE BOARD. IT WASN'T THIS LAST YEAR PIECE. YOU TOOK HIM FROM US, YOU TOOK HIM FROM US, PROMOTED HIM AND TOOK HIM FROM US. BUT HE'S ONE OF THE ENDEARING, IMPACTFUL PEOPLE THAT HELPED TURN THE BOARD AROUND. AND I JUST CAN'T SAY ENOUGH. UH, WE'LL TAKE HIM BACK. ANYTIME YOU WANT TO GIVE HIM TO US, GIVE HIM ANOTHER PROMOTION. JUST KIDDING. BUT NO, JASON HELPED AUTOMATE THE WEBSITE. HE HELPED PUT US, GIVE US NEW SIGNS THAT WERE, HE CREATED UNDER HIS LEADERSHIP, THE PENDING CASE LOG WHERE CITIZENS CAN GO TO THE WEBSITE AND LOOK AT EXACTLY WHAT'S PENDING ON A CASE WITH A SIGN IN THE YARD. THE LIST GOES ON AND ON AND HE GETS ALL THE CREDIT AND HE GETS SOME BLAME TOO. WE WENT THROUGH SOME, HOW, HOW DO I SAY? WE WENT THROUGH SOME THICKETS. WE WON'T TELL HIM WHAT TYPE OF THICKETS. SOME OF US KNOW BETTER THAN WORSE. WE WENT THROUGH SOME THICKETS. BUT I WILL TELL YOU, KUDOS TO JASON POOL AND, AND YOU GET THE CREDIT FOR HIM AND HE GETS THE CREDIT FOR THE TEAM HE HANDLED. SO, BUT I JUST WANTED TO MAKE THAT ONE COMMENT. SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU FOR THAT RECOGNITION. I AGREE A HUNDRED PERCENT. UH, JASON IS A GREAT ASSET, NOT FOR OUR DEPARTMENT, BUT FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS. VERY COMMITTED, VERY. HE WORK LIKE FIVE O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING TILL LATE AT NIGHT. AND SOMETIME MY ONLY REQUEST IS, PLEASE TAKE A BREAK. I YOU TO GO TO HIM, NOT ASK HIM TO DO MORE. I SAID, HAVE YOU TAKEN A FEW DAYS OFF YET? THAT'S MY QUESTION. AND JASON IS AMAZING, AMAZING, UH, VERY FORTUNATE. UM, SO I WOULD LIKE TO BRAG A LITTLE BIT ABOUT OUR DEPARTMENT ACHIEVEMENT. I KNOW YOU HAVE A LOT OF CONCERNS TOO, UH, BUT I THINK, [00:45:01] UM, THE, THE DEPARTMENT AS A WHOLE OVER A LITTLE YEAR HAVE, UM, HAS A ACCOMPLISHED A LOT. SO I'M GOING TO HIGHLIGHT THOSE. MY PRESENTATION IS VERY HIGH LEVEL. ONE OF THEM IS FORWARD DALLAS, I THINK YOU PROBABLY AT LEAST HEARD ABOUT IT AND GET INVOLVED SOMEWHAT FORWARD. DALLAS IS THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, COMPREHENSIVE LAND USE PLAN FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS. THAT TELLS YOU WHAT'S, UH, THE FUTURE, UH, IN THE, IN, IN, IN THE CITY. AND WITH A LOT OF TREMENDOUS PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT. IT'S A POLICY, IT'S A RECOMMENDATION. AND UM, IT'S, UM, NOT A REQUIREMENT. I WANT TO DISTINGUISH THAT A LITTLE BIT. SO, FORWARD DALLAS IS A LAND USE PLAN, IS A POLICY. UM, GIVE YOU THE GUIDE FOR THE FUTURE GROWTH IN THE CITY OF DALLAS. SO THIS WAS ADOPTED SEPTEMBER, UH, OF LAST YEAR, A LITTLE OVER A YEAR AGO. I WANNA PUT IN HERE BECAUSE I WANT GIVE YOU THE CONTEXT AND HOW IMPORTANT THIS DOCUMENT IS. IT'S A PAST CITY COUNCIL, UM, UH, SEPTEMBER, 2024. UM, AND NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. IT PROVIDE A LOT OF GUIDANCE AND FOR THE FUTURE GROWTH. AND ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT DOCUMENT THAT HAS TO UH, IMPLEMENT FORWARD DALLAS IS THE ZONING. ZONING. AS YOU KNOW, YOU DEALING WITH ZONING EVERY DAY, RIGHT? THEY COME TO YOU BECAUSE THEY CANNOT FULLY COMPLY WITH THE ZONING. THEY ASK FOR EXCEPTIONS. THEY ASK FOR VARIANCE, THEY ASK FOR INTERPRETATION. THE LAW IS NOT MEANT TO BE PERFECT. I HAVE YET IN MY 30 YEAR CAREER TO FIND A PERFECT ZONING ORDINANCE. THEY DO NOT EXIST. THEY EVOLVE ALL THE TIME TOO. SO THE DALLAS ZONING REFORM, THE FRAMEWORK WOULD PRETTY MUCH DEVELOP IN 1960. THERE'S SOME CHANGES IN 1980S, BUT IT'S PRETTY, UM, OUTDATED. SO ONE OF THE, THE GOAL IS TO MODERNIZE, UH, THIS, UM, ZONING REFORM TO MAKE IT SIMPLE RIGHT NOW IT'S VERY COMPLEX. UM, AND UM, MAKE IT CLARIFY THAT, AND ALSO MAKE IT FUTURE READY BECAUSE THIS WAS DEVELOPING THE CITIES FOR THAT TIME BEING AND GUIDE THE CITY FOR DECADES. BUT WE ARE MORE THAN 60 YEARS LATER RIGHT NOW. UM, SO AS SOON AS THE FORWARD DATA GOT ADOPTED, ONE OF THE IMPLEMENTATION, UM, UH, ADAM IS TO DO THE ZONING REFORM. CITY COUNCIL PASSED A, UH, CONTRACT. UH, THIS SOMETHING IS BEYOND OUR DEPARTMENTS, A LOT OF WORK. SO THE CITY COUNCIL AUTHORIZED A DEPARTMENT TO HAVE A CONTRACT WITH THE CONSULTANT IS A BIG CONTRACT. SO EARLY THIS YEAR, THIS PROCESS STARTED, I'M NOT GONNA GET INTO DETAIL BECAUSE YOU'RE GONNA HEAR FROM MICHAEL WADE LATER TODAY ABOUT, UM, WHAT'S IN IT. SO A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAIL AT THAT TIME. UH, THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT. JUST WANT TO KNOW. VERY IMPORTANT. WE ARE ONLY AT THE BEGINNING STAGE. SO I WILL ENCOURAGE YOU AND YOUR NEIGHBORS, PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, TO GET INVOLVED BECAUSE THIS IS LAW. THIS IS A REQUIREMENT, THIS IS A MANDATORY, UM, UH, THING THAT WE HAVE TO DO. SO IT'S GOING TO DICTATE OR GOING TO IMPACT DALLAS FOR DECADES TO COME. AND THAT'S WHY IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO GET INVOLVED. AND I ASK YOU, I REACH OUT TO YOU TO HELP US GET THE WORD OUT. WE HAVE A WEBSITE, UH, CALLED DALLAS ONLY REFORM.COM. A LOT INFORMATION, A LOT TO UPTODATE INFORMATION ARE, UM, UH, LISTED IN THERE. SO I ENCOURAGE YOU TO TAKE A FEW MINUTES TO LOOK AT IT, GET YOURSELF FAMILIAR WITH IT IN CASE YOUR NEIGHBORS OR YOUR CONSTITUENTS COME TO YOU AND WANT TO KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON. YOU CAN REFER THEM AND GET MORE INFORMATION. OF COURSE, YOU CAN ALWAYS CONTACT ME OR OUR STAFF DIRECTLY FOR ANY QUESTION YOU MAY HAVE. ONE OF THE THINGS I THINK WE'RE PROUD OF, I WANNA MAKE SURE OUR STAFF ARE VERY ACCESSIBLE, VERY HELPFUL, NICE TO THE BOARD COMMISSION AND TO THE CITIZENS. AND THE CUSTOMERS AS WELL. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. AND, UH, WE'VE BEEN WORKING VERY HARD AND THIS IS SOMETHING, UH, GENERALLY IT'S NOT A PLANNING FUNCTION BECAUSE WE ALSO OVERSEE THE PERMITTING. UM, THIS WORK, UM, IS A LITTLE TECHNICAL. ALLOW ME TO EXPLAIN THAT A LITTLE BIT. SO CURRENTLY OR PREVIOUSLY BEFORE THIS PASSES OR MOST OF THE CITY, ALMOST THE ENTIRE COUNTRY, UM, THERE ARE TWO BUILDING CODE. ONE IS INTERNATIONAL RESIDENTIAL CODE THAT ONLY DICTATE OR REGULATE SINGLE FAMILY AND DUPLEX INTERNATIONAL RESIDENTIAL CODE. THAT STILL THE CASE TODAY ACROSS THE COUNTRY. THERE IS NOT THE [00:50:01] BUILDING CODE ANYTHING MORE THAN A DUPLEX, TRIPLEX, FOURPLEX, EIGHT PLEX, 20 PLEX, ALL THE WAY TO THE BANK AMERICA TOWER HAVE THE SAME BUILDING CODE. DO YOU THINK TRIPLE IS A CLOSER DUPLEX OR CLOSER TO 200 APARTMENT OR BANK AMERICA TOWER? THAT IS WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE. SO THERE'S THIS MOVEMENT ACROSS THE COUNTRY THAT WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF DIVERSE HOUSING TYPE. YOU SEE A LOT OF, UH, SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH IS GREAT IN DALLAS, BUT YOU ALSO SEE THESE NEW MULTI-FAMILY BUILDINGS ACROSS DALLAS, RIGHT? WE'RE BUILDING LIKE 30,000 UNITS A YEAR. UM, THEY ARE HUGE. THEY OCCUPY THE ENTIRE BLOCK, HAVE A PARKING THE CENTER, AND 200 UNIT MORE. BUT YOU DON'T SEE ANYTHING IN BETWEEN. THAT IS CALLED MISSING MIDDLE HOUSING. THERE'S A NUMBER OF REASON WHY MIDDLE HOUSING IS MISSING. ZONING IS DEFINITELY PART TO BLAME, BUT IT'S ONLY, IT'S JUST ONE PIECE OF THE PUZZLE. A LOT OF PEOPLE RECENTLY YEAR FIGURED OUT THAT THIS BUILDING CODE IS REALLY A BARRIER BUILDING A TRIPLEX HAVE TO FOLLOW THE SAME STANDARDS AS BUILDING 200 UNITS. UM, SO IN CITY OF DALLAS FOR EXAMPLE, WE HAVE SOME MULTIFAMILY ZONING ADDRESS. MOSTLY OUR ZONE SINGLE FAMILY AND SINGLE FAMILY ONLY IN THE CITY OF DALLAS FOR THE LIMITED, UM, YOU KNOW, UH, AREA THAT ZONE MATI FAMILY SAY THEY ARE ALLOWED BY ZONING TO BUILD PLEX. GUESS WHAT? ALMOST ALL OF THEM DO NOT BUILD A PLEX. THEY BUILD EITHER A LUXURY SINGLE FAMILY OR LUXURY DUPLEX. WHY? BECAUSE THEY MAKE MORE MONEY BUILDING SINGLE FAMILY AND DUPLEX. THEY ARE INTERNATIONAL RESIDENTIAL CODE, WHICH IS MUCH EASIER, WHICH IS MUCH CHEAPER TO BUILD THAN EVEN TRIPLEX OR EIGHT PLEX BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO COMPLY WITH ALL THESE OTHER STANDARD. YOU ARE REQUIRED TO HAVE A SPRINKLER SYSTEM IN THE TRIPLEX VERSUS PLEX. UM, SO THAT'S ONE OF THE REASON WE START LOOKING AT THIS. I HAVE TO GIVE CREDIT TO, UM, A COUPLE OF OUR CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS. UH, TWO COUNCIL MEMBERS ARE REALLY CHAMPIONING ON THIS. AS A MATTER OF FACT, THE FIRST MONTH I STARTED HERE, I WAS CALLED TO THE CITY COUNCIL, UH, OFFICE AND A LIST OF THINGS THEY WOULD LIKE ME TO TAKE A LOOK AT. AND THIS IS ONE OF THEM. WITHOUT OUR COUNCIL MEMBER CHAMPION ON THIS, THIS WILL NOT PASS. SO AFTER THE CITY COUNCIL DIRECTOR, OUR DEPARTMENT TO TAKE A LOOK AT THIS, WE QUICKLY ASSEMBLE A STAKEHOLDER GROUP AND WE WORK WITH STAFF WITHIN FOUR MONTHS. WE GOT THE DRAFT, WE GO THROUGH, UH, THE BUILDING CODE BOARD, WHICH IS UNANIMOUSLY APPROVED. IT SOUNDS VERY EASY AT THIS POINT, BUT IT'S NOT EASY. THERE'S A LOT, A LOT OF BACK AND FORTH. BUT EVENTUALLY IT GOT ADOPTED AT THE CITY COUNCIL UNANIMOUSLY. I DID NOT REALIZE HOW BIG A DEAL THIS IS UNTIL I GOT ALL THESE CALLS FROM ALL OVER THE COUNTRY. OBVIOUSLY CITY OF DALLAS, IT'S THE FIRST CITY HAVE EVER GONE THIS FAR UP TO EIGHT UNITS ALLOWING THEM IN THE INTERNATIONAL RESIDENTIAL CODE, WHICH MAKES LOTS OF SENSE, IT'S RESIDENTIAL. UM, WE GOT NATIONAL NEWS, MEDIA SLATE MESSAGING, STRONG TOWNS, NATIONAL LEAGUE, A CITY WROTE AN ARTICLE ABOUT THIS DUE TO THIS DAY. GOT LOT CALLS AND EMAIL FROM CITIES AND BIG AND SMALL FROM EVEN DEVELOPER FROM OTHER CITY WANT TO KNOW. AND I HAVE CALLS FROM MY OTHER PLANNING DIRECTOR SAY, HEY, OUR DEVELOPER CONTACT ME AND SAY YOU ARE DOING SOMETHING THERE. THEY WANT ME TO DO SOMETHING HERE IN MY CITY. HOW DID YOU DO THAT? SO THOSE ARE THE THINGS WE DID HAVE AN IMPACT, NOT ONLY TO THE STATE OF DALLAS, BUT ALSO AT THE NATIONAL LEVEL. GUESS WHAT? WHEN PEOPLE KNOW THOSE THINGS, GREAT INNOVATIVE, CREATIVE THING WE'RE DOING IN THE STATE OF DALLAS, IT GOT ATTENTION OF OUR INVESTORS. WE ALL WANT PEOPLE COME TO INVEST IN THE STATE OF DALLAS. WE ALL WANT TO ATTRACT PEOPLE TO MOVE TO DALLAS, RIGHT? MOST OF YOU MOVE FROM SOMEWHERE ELSE. THAT IS AN IMAGE WE WANT TO PROJECT TO THE REST OF THE COUNTRY. I'M GONNA TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THAT LATER IN THE GOAL SECTION. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. UH, NEXT SLIDE. THIS IS ONE TO EIGHT NEW PARKING REFORM. I KNOW EVERYBODY HAVE OPINION ABOUT THIS ONE. OH, I'M SORRY, TOO QUICK COME. CAN I COME BACK TO THE PARKING REFORM? WHICH ONE? OKAY, PARKING REFORM. I HAVE DOCTOR ANDREA WOODROW HERE. SHE WORKED TIRELESSLY FOR THE LAST FIVE YEARS. SO [00:55:01] FINALLY, UH, IN MAY, UH, THIS YEAR, IT CROSSED THE FINISH LINE. UM, THIS IS NOT ELIMINATE PARKING PER SE, IT'S REALLY PARKING REFORM FOR FLEXIBILITY. IT BASIC SAYS IN CERTAIN CASES YOU'RE NOT REQUIRED TO HAVE A MINIMUM PARKING, BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN PEOPLE ARE NOT BUILDING PARKING. AS A MATTER OF FACT, I'M STILL TRYING TO FIND ONE PROPOSAL RECENTLY THAT HAVE ZERO PARKING. MOST OF 'EM STILL COME IN WITH A PARKING, BUT EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED, RIGHT, THEY HAVE TO MAKE SURE THEY CAN, UM, ATTRACT THEIR CUSTOMERS, MAKE SURE THEIR TENANT HAVE A SPACE. IT'S STILL DALLAS, STILL VERY AUTO ORIENTED. SO WE HAVE TO ACCOMMODATE THAT. BUT THIS SET THE TONE AND GRADUALLY PEOPLE WILL REALIZE THAT WE DON'T NEED THAT MANY PARKING. UM, SO, UH, THIS IS SOMETHING IS TREMENDOUS. I BELIEVE DALLAS IS A BIGGER CITY THAT HAVE ADOPTED SOMETHING IN THIS, UH, EXTENT. BASICALLY IN CERTAIN CASES GOT ELIMINATED AND AT LEAST GOT REDUCED. UH, FOR EXAMPLE, UH, HOUSING IS A TIER SYSTEM. OF COURSE SINGLE FAMILY AND DUPLEX, IT STILL REQUIRE USED TO BE PER BEDROOM, LIKE THE, SOME OF SOME OF THESE. BUT NOW IT'S JUST ONE PER UNIT. AND, UM, THREE UNITS, 20 UNITS NOT REQUIRE MINIMUM. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THEY'RE NOT GONNA HAVE PARKING. BUT THIS WILL HELP ACTUALLY THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, UM, THE, UM, THAT WERE BUILT WITHOUT A CAR BACK A HUNDRED YEARS AGO. AND WE FIND THAT, UM, THESE FLEXIBILITY PROVIDE ADAPTIVE REUSE. UH, SO MY EXPERIENCE IN THE PAST IS YOU REQUIRE A CERTAIN, UH, PARKING IF YOU WANT TO DO LIKE SAY A FOURPLEX OR A SMALL CORNER COMMERCIAL RESTAURANT IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT AND YOU TOLD THEM NO, YOU CANNOT MOVE FORWARD BECAUSE YOU HAVE LIKE 20 PARKING REQUIREMENTS. THEY DON'T HAVE IT BECAUSE THE BUILDING ARE NOT BUILT FOR AUTOMOBILES. THEY'RE BUILT TO THE STREET WITH THE ALLEY. SOMETIMES WHAT HAPPENS IS THEY'RE, THEY EITHER GIVE IT UP OR THEY BUY THE BUILDING NEXT DOOR, TAKE IT DOWN AND MAKE IT A PARKING LOT. IT HAPPENS ALL OVER THE COUNTRY. THAT'S NOT SOMETHING WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE. SO THIS PARKING REFORM FOR FLEXIBILITY IS AWESOME. UH, THAT REALLY GAVE PEOPLE THE FLEXIBILITY. I'VE GOT SO MANY COMPLIMENTS, UH, LAST FEW MONTHS ABOUT THIS GREAT THING H MART. EVERYBODY KNOWS ABOUT H MART. FIRST H MART OPENED IN THE CITY OF DALLAS LAST WEEK. LAST WEEK. GUESS WHAT? WHAT OBSTACLE THEY HAVE. THEY WERE STUCK IN THE PERMIT. THEY TOLD US WE HAVE 550 PARKING SPOTS AND WE TOLD THEM, YOU DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH. AND IT WAS STRUGGLE, IT WAS STUCK IN THE PERMIT. EVENTUALLY WE HAD TO COME UP WITH SOMETHING VERY CREATIVE WAY TO ACCOMMODATE THAT. BUT NOW THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED AND THEY STILL HAVE 550, UH, PARKING SPOT, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED. SO THE PARKING IS THERE TO HELP THE CUSTOMERS. SO BACK TO MY TIERED RESIDENTIAL UP TO 20 UNIT, YOU'RE NOT RE UM, REQUIRED EVEN THOUGH YOU STILL PROVIDE THEM. 21 TO 199 IS HALF SPACE PER UNIT. ABOUT 200 IS ONE PER UNIT, REGARDLESS, OVER 200. EVEN THOUGH YOU DON'T REQUIRE THEM, THEY'RE STILL GONNA HAVE PROBABLY AT LEAST ONE. SO THOSE KIND OF THING. AND THEN WITHIN THE TRANSIT ORANGE EVENT, WE HAVE THE, UM, SEWER LINE JUST OPENED. IT'S AMAZING. 26 MILES JUST OPENED THIS PAST SATURDAY. ALONG THOSE STATIONS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT CITY DALLAS. RIGHT NOW WE ONLY HAVE ONE TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT JUST APPROVED. A LOT OF THEM STILL HAVE A LOT OF REQUIRED FOR PARKING BEFORE, BUT NOW AFTER THE REFORM WITHIN A HALF MILE, YOU NO LONGER REQUIRED TO PROVIDE PARKING WITHIN A HALF MILE. IF YOU ARE, THEY PROBABLY STILL WILL HAVE PARKING. SO WE'RE HOPING PEOPLE WILL TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION. WE'LL PROVIDE MORE MIXED USE. SO YOU MINIMIZE THE REQUIREMENT FOR FOR CARS. UM, THERE ARE SOME OTHER AREA THAT WITH, UM, PARKING IS NO LONGER REQUIRED. UM, ANYWAY, THE NEXT ONE PLEASE. AND ALSO THIS YEAR I ALSO WANT TO GIVE, UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. UM, BIG SHOUT OUT TO JASON PAUL. SO ALSO IN MAY THIS YEAR WE LAUNCHED A BIG PROGRAM. THIS IS A HUGE PROGRAM. BASICALLY DIGITIZE OUR ENTIRE PROCESS. IN THE PAST, PEOPLE HAVE THE SUBMITTING PAPER. DR. ANDREA WOODER KNOWS PEOPLE LIKE HAVE A BIG ROW PAPER COME HERE AND IT'S VERY HARD TO DISTRIBUTE OR EVEN REVIEW. SO STARTING IN MAY, EVERYTHING IS STREAMLINED, EVERYTHING [01:00:01] IS DIGITIZED. IT'S A BRAND NEW PROGRAM. BUT OF COURSE THERE ARE SOME GLITCHES AND JASON IS SO FOCUSED ON FIXING, UM, SOME OF THE GLITCHES. UM, SO WE ARE VERY, VERY, UM, GLAD THIS PROGRAM, UH, ROLLED OUT, UM, IN MAY. AND IT WILL CONTINUE TO MAKE, IMPROVE, MAKE IT BETTER IF YOU HEAR ABOUT SOMETHING. YEAH, YEAH, GO AHEAD. UH, QUESTION. SO I, WE HAVE, WE'VE GOTTEN A LITTLE BIT OF BRIEFING ON DALLAS NOW FROM MS. MAY AND OUR BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. WHAT'S THE FEEDBACK FOR THE AVERAGE PROPERTY OWNER THAT IS NOT EXPERIENCED IN THE CITY PROCESS? HAS IT, DO THEY FEEL IT'S USER FRIENDLY? I MEAN AS OPPOSED, AS OPPOSED TO THE OLD STYLE OF COME IN WITH YOUR PAPER AND ALL THAT SORT OF THING. IT'S DEFINITELY A DIFFERENCE. I WOULD USE THIS. I USED TO GO TO FLY TO BANK, UH, NO BACK MY AMERICAN AIRLINE. I JUST, I LIKE TO GO TO THE COUNTER AND LAST FEW TIME I WENT TO THE COUNTER. THEY SHOW ME, HERE'S A KIOSK YOU NEED TO DO. SO IT'S DEFINITELY CHANGED. I DIDN'T LIKE IT FIRST. UH, BUT I GET USED TO IT. IT'S SIMILAR. USED TO BE I JUST COME TO A PIECE OF PAPER, YOU HELP ME, I DON'T, YOU KNOW, NOW YOU CAN HAVE THAT PIECE OF PAPER AT YOUR BASE, BUT IT'S ALL ONLINE. YOU GO TO THE ONLINE, PUT IT IN THERE. I WANT TO TELL YOU, WE ARE ALL ABOUT CUSTOMER SERVICE. OUR CUSTOMER CENTER OPENS, YOU KNOW, DURING THE BUSINESS HOUR. IF YOU NOT FAMILIAR WITH A SPECIAL IN ITALY, YOU CAN COME HERE AND OUR STAFF ARE HOLDING YOUR HAND FROM BEGINNING TO END IF YOU GOT STUCK SOME OF THE WAY, YOU KNOW, IT'S A TECHNOLOGY, NEW TECHNOLOGY AND YOU CAN CHOOSE. JASON AND I CALL JASON ALL THE TIME. SOMETIMES HE CALL, CALL ME AND I DON'T KNOW THE DETAILS. I GET JASON, JASON WILL SQUARE SQUARED AWAY LIKE IMMEDIATELY. SO THEY ARE, UM, A CHANGE. THIS IS A DIFFERENT, IT'S TOTALLY DIFFERENT FROM PAPER TO DIGITAL. IT'S A BIG CHANGE. BUT THAT IS A DIRECTION, UH, EVERYTHING IS GOING. UM, IN THIS COUNTRY. SO, UM, I THINK, UH, THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN GIVE YOU A LITTLE BIT MORE IF NEEDED. I UNDERSTAND WE HAVE TIME CONSTRAINED TODAY. NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. AND ALSO, UM, I WOULD LIKE TO TALK, THIS IS A SENATOR BILL EIGHT 40. THERE'S A NUMBER OF BILLS THAT IMPACTED OUR PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT OFFICE. I WANT TO FOCUS A LITTLE BIT THE SENATOR BILL EIGHT 40 HIGH LEVEL. I KNOW YOU HAVE A BRIEFING TODAY FROM JENNIFER AUGAR ABOUT WHAT THIS IS, HOW WE APPLY THIS. SO THIS IS A STATE, BASICALLY, UH, STATE PASSED THIS LAW THAT SUPERSEDE THE LOCAL ZONING. UH, A LOT OF PEOPLE FEEL LIKE, YEAH, THIS IS ZONING AUTHORITY, BUT KEEP IN MIND, ABOUT A HUNDRED YEARS AGO, THE STATE OR THE STATE IN THE UNITED STATE DELEGATE THAT POWER TO THE CITIES OR TOWNS WHO HAD ZONING AUTHORITY. AND, AND SOME OF THESE, UM, CHALLENGES WE'RE FACING TODAY, MOSTLY HOUSING SHORTAGES. AND THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS STATE DID THIS. PREEMPTIVE LAWS TO, UM, TELL CITY THAT YOU NEED TO DO CERTAIN THING FOR STATE BILL 8 42 THINGS, I WON'T BE VERY QUICK. ONE IS THE USE. BASICALLY IN THE PAST COMMERCIAL OFFICE, RETAIL LIGHT WEAR, UH, WAREHOUSE LIGHT, INDUSTRIAL, UH, NOT MOST OF THE CASES DO NOT ALLOW MULTIFAMILY, OR MULTIFAMILY WAS MIXED USE. IN THE CITY OF DALLAS. THIS IS NOT THE BEST PRACTICE, BUT WAY A LOT OF THE CITY ALLOWED IT. UH, IT'S CALLED CUMULATIVE ZONING. LIKE THE HIGH INTENSITY ZONING ALLOWS LOWEST INTENSITY, LIKE OFFICE USUALLY ALLOW. UM, MULTIFAMILY COMMERCIAL ALLOWS OFFICE ACCUMULATIVE ZONING. BUT CITY OF DALLAS, WE HAVE THIS EXCLUSIVE ZONING, MULTIFAMILY, MULTIFAMILY OFFICE, OFFICE, COMMERCIALS, COMMERCIAL WHERE, SO STATE NOTICED THAT THIS IS SOMETHING, SOMETIME IT, IT BECOME A BARRIER. SO THEY PASSED THIS LAW. BASIC SAYS, HEY, CITY OF DALLAS AND EVERYBODY ELSE WHO HAVE A POPULATION OF 150,000 MORE, THERE ARE 19 CITIES ACROSS THE STATE THAT FIT INTO THIS CRITERIA, AND 10 OF THEM IN THIS METROPLEX. SO WE HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THIS LAW. BASICALLY, MULTIFAMILY IS NOW WE HAVE TO ALLOT THEM IN OLD COMMERCIAL, UH, OFFICE, RETAIL AND, UH, WAREHOUSE OR LEAD INDUSTRIAL, EVERYWHERE. THOSE USES ALLOW, WE HAVE TO ALLOW MULTIFAMILY OR MIXED USE, UH, WITH, UH, RESIDENTIAL AS A COMPONENT. SECOND ONE IS THEY ALSO, UM, HAS A STANDARD IN PLACE THAT YOU CANNOT, A MINIMUM HEIGHT HAS TO BE 45 FEET. IF YOU ARE ZONE INDUSTRY, ALLOW 35 FEET. NOW YOU HAVE TO ALLOW 45 FEET NOW. UM, AND [01:05:01] ALSO THE DENSITY INTENSITY, WHATEVER THE CITY ALLOW, THE MAXIMUM DENSITY INTENSITY, THIS, UM, MULTIFAMILY HAS TO BE ALLOWED. AND THEN FLOOR AIR RATIO. SO, UH, JENNIFER WILL GIVE YOU A LITTLE BIT MORE. THIS IS TREMENDOUS. IT HAVE A HUGE IMPACT FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS. UM, IT BECAME EFFECTIVE SEPTEMBER 1ST. WE START TO SEE A LOT INTEREST IN THIS. UH, BASICALLY IT TAKES AWAY THE DISCRETIONARY PROCESS IN THE PAST. IF YOU WANT BUILD MULTIFAMILY AND COMMERCIAL, A SHOPPING CENTER, FOR EXAMPLE, REDEVELOP OF YOU HAVE TO DO REZONING GOING THROUGH LENGTH PROCESS. THE PUBLIC, BASICALLY THE STATE SAID YOU CAN NO LONGER REQUIRE A PUBLIC REVIEW DIS DISCRE PROCESS. IT HAS TO BE ADMINISTRATIVELY MANAGED, BASICALLY GOES STRAIGHT TO THE PERMITTING, AND SOMETIME THEY REVIEW, UH, REQUIRE A SET PLAN. THAT SET PLAN HAS TO BE REVIEWED AND APPROVED BY STAFF, NOT THROUGH A DIFFERENT PROCESS. SO THAT'S KIND OF, UM, THE BIG, UM, UM, HIGH LEVEL SUMMARY OF WHAT SENATOR BILL EIGHT 40. THERE'S ALSO SENATOR BILL EIGHT 15, WHICH HAS A HUGE IMPACT ON OUR SPECIFIC SMALL LOT SMALL HOME LEGISLATION. THE CITY CAN NO LONGER REQUIRE THE MINIMUM LOSS SIZE MORE THAN 3000 SQUARE FEET IF THEY'RE IN THE RESIDENTIAL ANYWHERE. SINGLE FAMILY IS ALLOWED. WE HAVE TO ALLOW, UH, LOSS AS SMALL AS, UH, 3000 SQUARE FEET. THAT'S A DIFFERENT, UH, CENTER BILL. UH, I THINK, UH, NEXT ONE PLEASE. I THINK THAT'S, UM, ALL I HAVE, UH, FOR THIS PRESENTATION. OH, I FORGOT THIS. THIS IS IMPORTANT. THIS IS 20, 26 GOALS EVERY YEAR, JUST LIKE THE BOARD OF JASMINE, WE COME UP WITH GOAL LAST YEAR. WE HAVE SEVEN GOALS. UH, WE ARE GLAD TO REPORT WHERE WE'RE SUCCESSFUL IN PLANNING THOSE GOALS, EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM. SO THIS YEAR WORKING WITH OUR TEAM, WE, UM, COME OUT WITH SIX DIFFERENT GOALS. BASICALLY WE'LL CONTINUE TO IMPLEMENT FORWARD DALLAS, BUT MAINLY FOCUS ON THE, UM, YOU KNOW, TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, MIXED USE CORRIDOR WITH EIGHT 40, I THINK WE'RE GONNA SEE A LOT OF REDEVELOPMENT IN THESE MIXED USE CORRIDOR COMMERCIAL CORRIDORS. AND ALSO, UM, STANDARDS, SOME RESIDENTIAL DESIGN STANDARD. WE HURT A LOT OF PEOPLE. EVEN SOMETIMES YOU BUILD SINGLE FAMILY A DUPLEX, UH, WITHOUT DESIGN STANDARD THAT COULD BE AUTO CHARACTER WITHIN OUR, YOU KNOW, COMMUNITY. SO THAT'S ONE THING WE'D LIKE FOCUS ON TO, I IMPLEMENT FORWARD DALLAS, BUT FOCUS ON THOSE AREA. OF COURSE, I MENTIONED WE JUST STARTED THE DALLAS ZONING FORUM. SO WE WILL CONTINUE, ESPECIALLY ENGAGE THE COMMUNITY, UM, IN SHAPING THE INITIAL DRAFT OF THE DALLAS ONLY REFORM. WE GOT THIS STARTED EARLY THIS YEAR. WE, IN THE PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT, UH, PHASE, WE'LL CONTINUE TO BE IN PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT PHASE THROUGHOUT THE PROCESS, BUT WE ANTICIPATE A FIRST DRAFT TO BE RELEASED NEXT SUMMER. SO, AND THEN WE WILL GET, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF FEEDBACK ABOUT THAT FIRST DRAFT. AND WE'RE HOPING, UH, MAYBE TWO YEAR DOWN THE ROAD, UH, WE CAN BRING IT TO THE, UM, UH, PLANNING COMMISSION AND THEN, UM, THE CITY COUNCIL, UH, AND ALSO WE'LL CONTINUE TO WORK ON STREAMLINE THE DEVELOPMENT REVIEW PROCESS. THAT IS A GOAL. LAST YEAR WE DID A LOT WORK INTERNALLY WITHIN OUR DEPARTMENT LOOK LIKE HOW WE CAN MAKE IT EASIER, MAKE IT BETTER FOR OUR, UH, CUSTOMERS, UH, THE DEVELOPERS, CITIZENS WHO WANT A PERMIT. SO WE FOCUS A LOT ON THAT. WE'LL CONTINUE TO FOCUS ON THAT, BUT THIS YEAR WE WANT TO EXPAND A LITTLE BIT. PEOPLE THINK, OH, MY PERMIT STUCK IN THE, YOU KNOW, PLANNING DEVELOPMENT SOMETIME. THERE'S EXTERNAL AGENCY. WE HAVE TO WORK. WE CANNOT JUST MAKE OUR DECISION ALL BY OURSELF. THERE'S OTHER DEPARTMENTS. SO THIS YEAR WE ALSO WANT TO WORK WITH OTHER EXTERNAL AGENCIES, UM, THAT CAN EVOLVE IN WHAT WE DO. WE'RE TRYING TO STREAMLINE AND COLLABORATE WITH THEM. SO THAT'S A VERY IMPORTANT GOAL. AND ALSO CUSTOMER SERVICE IS KEY TO THE SUCCESS OF OUR DEPARTMENT. THAT'S WHY JASON POST'S TITLE IS CUSTOMER EXPERIENCE, UH, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR. SO HIS GOAL, AND HE'S DOING A VERY GOOD JOB, UM, TRYING TO HELP OUR CUSTOMERS ALL LEVEL. CUSTOMER, BIG DEVELOPER, UH, SMALL PROJECT BY CITIZEN. A RESIDENT CAN BE YOU COULD BE YOUR NEIGHBOR. WE'RE HELPING THEM ALL, BUT WE CANNOT JUST DOING THE SAME OLD, SAME OLD WHAT THIS YEAR WE'RE LOOKING AT DIFFERENTLY. WE WANT TO, UH, START LOOKING AT THE TECHNOLOGY, ESPECIALLY, UM, LIKE AI. UH, JASON'S ALREADY WORKING WITH A PROFESSOR, UH, IN THE TEXAS SYSTEM TO SEE WHAT WE CAN USE AI TO IMPROVE, UH, EFFICIENCY AND ALSO ACCURACY. THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT TOO. SO WE'RE TRYING TO, UM, UH, USE TECHNOLOGY [01:10:02] AND TO CONTINUE, UH, TO DELIVER A FASTER, MORE TRANSPARENT, THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT. TRANSPARENT CUSTOMER EXPERIENCE AT THE SPEED OF BUSINESS. THIS IS A REQUEST OF A CITY COUNCIL AND CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE FOR THIS DEPARTMENT. WHEN WE MERGE, THEY WANT US TO BE AT THE SPEED OF BUSINESS BECAUSE OTHERWISE WE MAY LOSE THEM TO OTHER CITIES. WE ARE VERY FORTUNATE, A LOT OF THESE BIG COMPANIES COME TO THE CITY OF DALLAS, INVEST THE CITY OF DALLAS, BUT WE ALSO NEED TO DO, UH, A, YOU KNOW, CONTINUE TO MAKE IMPROVEMENT TO MAKE IT EVEN EASIER TO DO BUSINESS HERE IN THE CITY OF DALLAS. SO THAT WILL ALWAYS BE A CORE, UM, GOAL FOR OUR DEPARTMENT. UM, AND THEN ALSO, UM, TEAMWORK. THAT'S AMAZING. I WANT TO SAY ALL THE ACCOMPLISHMENT I ADDRESSED EARLIER, THAT'S NOT ME. THAT'S THE TEAM. THE LEADERSHIP, THE MANAGERS, EVERY SINGLE MEMBER OF THE PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT TEAM CONTRIBUTED TO THAT SUCCESS. THERE ARE SO MANY, THERE'S LIKE 400 NAMES, I JUST CAN'T SAY THEM OUT HERE, BUT THEY ARE THE ONE WHO ARE DOING THE DAY-TO-DAY WORK. THEY ARE THE ONE TO MAKE SURE THE CUSTOMERS, UH, GOT HELP. THEY ARE THE ONE TO MAKE SURE THE PHONE CALLS GOT ANSWERED. AND THEY ARE THE ONE TO MAKE SURE THAT, UM, WHERE REACH OUT TO OUR COMMUNITY TO THE ENGAGEMENT. ALL THESE ARE COMPLIMENT. THEY'RE NOT BECAUSE OF ME, THEY'RE BECAUSE OF OUR TEAM AND BECAUSE OF, YOU KNOW, UH, THE CITY COUNCIL AND CITY MAGIC BECAUSE OF THEIR LEADERSHIP AND THEIR VISION. SO I WANT TO EMPHASIZE THAT. UH, BUT WE HAVE, UM, REALLY FOSTER GOOD CULTURE LAST YEAR. THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN FOCUSED AT THE HIGH LEVEL FOSTER THAT CULTURE. BUT THIS YEAR WE WANT TO ADVANCE THE CULTURE OF TEAMWORK AND ACCOUNTABILITY. THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT WITHIN THE DEPARTMENT. WITH THE SAME TIME WE WANT TO COLLABORATE WITH OTHER DEPARTMENT FOR PROBLEM SOLVING. AND THE LAST ONE, UM, I'M PRETTY SURE WE'LL HAVE MORE GOALS COMING UP ALONG THE WAY, BUT THAT'S OKAY. WE, OUR DEPARTMENT KEEP REVOLVING. SO LAST ONE ON THIS LIST IS ELEVATE THE DEPARTMENT TO THE NATIONAL LEVEL. AND BASICALLY, UM, YOU KNOW, FOR ALL THE WORK WE'VE BEEN DOING EXCELLENT IN PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT, THIS IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE SEND A MESSAGE TO OTHER BUSINESSES, SEND MESSAGE TO THE TALENTS ACROSS THE COUNTRY THAT DALLAS IS A PLACE TO BE. THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE CAN JUST DO IN OUR WORK WITHOUT THIS IMPACT COULD BE BROADER, UM, THAN THE DEPARTMENT. SO I WANNA MAKE SURE WE, UH, AS A DEPARTMENT ALSO HELP THE CITY TO RECRUIT BUSINESSES, TO ATTRACT TALENTS SO WE CAN INCREASE OUR TECH SPACE, RIGHT? WE ALL HEARD ABOUT THE BUDGET CHALLENGES, MORE INVESTMENT WE HAVE THE MORE, UM, YOU KNOW, TECH SPACE WE CAN CREATE. THE MORE PEOPLE MOVE HERE, THE MORE RETAIL, UH, SERVICE WILL BE NEEDED. THAT WILL ALSO HELP OUR TECH SPACE. AND WE ARE CITY OF POSSIBILITY. SO IT'S VERY, VERY, UH, EXCITING TO BE PART OF DALLAS. UM, NOW THAT'S END THE END OF MY PRESENTATION. I'M SURE YOU HAVE TONS OF QUESTION FOR ME. IF THE TIME ALLOWS, I'LL BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY ONE OF THEM. AND AGAIN, PLEASE DO NOT HESITATE TO REACH OUT TO ME. CALL ME, EMAIL ME. OH, STOP BY. I REALLY LIKE, I THINK I NEED TO DO A BETTER JOB TO CONNECT WITH EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU. UH, THAT'S MY GOAL. THIS YEAR I WAS REALLY FOCUSED ON INTERNAL, THE FIRST YEAR. MAKE SURE STAFF IS OKAY. MAKE SURE THE TEAM IS OKAY. THIS, THIS YEAR I'M GONNA REACH OUT TO MANY, MANY DIFFERENT, UM, UH, BOARD COMMISSIONS ORGANIZATIONS DEPARTMENT. THAT IS MY GOAL FOR THIS YEAR. THANK YOU. WHAT QUESTIONS DO WE HAVE FOR DIRECTOR LIU? I DON'T WANNA GET WHIPLASH HERE. MR. SLATE. UH, THANK YOU CHAIRMAN NEWMAN. UM, DIRECTOR LOU, I APPRECIATE THE FOCUS ON CUSTOMER SERVICE. HOW DO YOU AND YOUR DEPARTMENT BALANCE SERVING THE CUSTOMERS OF TODAY VERSUS THE CUSTOMERS OF THE FUTURE IN TERMS OF HELPING CITIZENS OF DALLAS FIGURE OUT WHAT SORT OF DEVELOPMENT SHOULD OCCUR, NOT JUST NOW, BUT IN THE FUTURE? THAT IS A GREAT QUESTION FOR THE PLANNING DIRECTOR. . AND I'LL SAY OUR DEPARTMENT DO BOTH PLANNING AND PERMITTING. PERMITTING IS MORE ABOUT TODAY, BUT IT'S ALSO ABOUT MAKE SURE THE LAWS ARE FORWARD LOOKING. OKAY. ONE THING I MENTIONED ABOUT IS ONE TO EIGHT IN RESIDENTIAL. THAT IS A FORWARD LOOKING ACTION. WE TOOK, IN ADDITION, JUST BE REACTIVE, YOU KNOW, I GOT A [01:15:01] PERMIT. LET'S JUST, SO WE ARE ALSO FOCUSING ON LITTLE BIT PROACTIVE WHAT COULD HAPPEN NEXT YEAR OR NEXT FIVE YEARS. THAT'S THE JOB THE DIRECTORS AND AND LEADERSHIP NEED TO DO. SO WE ARE COMING UP WITH A LOT OF DIFFERENT INITIATIVE BEYOND OUR DAY-TO-DAY OPERATIONS. SO MY GOAL IS CONTINUOUS IMPROVEMENT ON A DAILY BASIS, AND THEN HOW OUR DEPARTMENT HAS TO DO BREAKTHROUGH WORK TO SERVE THE CUSTOMERS, TO SERVE THE FUTURE OF THE STATE OF DALLAS. AND ALSO, LUCKILY WE HAVE THE PLANNING FUNCTION. THE, THE PLANNERS THERE I JUST MENTIONED FORWARD DALLAS. THAT IS A FORWARD LOOKING DOCUMENT POLICY GUIDE. WE ARE ALL THE ENTIRE DEPARTMENT UNDER THAT GUIDE. THAT GUIDE IS LOOKING, UH, CITY OF DALLAS LONG TERM, AT LEAST 10 YEARS OUT. AND ALSO LOOKING AT THE CITY OF DALLAS COMPREHENSIVELY, NOT JUST ONE ASPECT. TALK ABOUT HOUSING, TALK ABOUT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, TALK ABOUT LAND USE. ALL OF THOSE HAS TO BE VERY COMPREHENSIVE. SO EVERY DAY WE'LL CONTINUE TO DO THE PROCESS IMPROVEMENT, CONTINUE TO SERVE OUR CUSTOMER SERVICE EVERY DAY. PHONE ONE PHONE CALLS AT A TIME, ONE EMAILS AT A TIME. BUT WE ALSO HAVE TO ELEVATE, THIS IS WHAT I ASKED OUR LEADERSHIP TO HELP ME WITH, TO LOOK AFTER THE CITY IN THE LONG TERM. SO EVERY DAY WE'RE LOOKING AT THAT. THANK YOU. IT'S A GREAT QUESTION. YOU REMIND ME. I NEED TO FOCUS SOMETIME EASY TO BE DRAWN TO THE DAY TO DAY, PUT OUT THE FIRES AND THINGS LIKE THAT. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, I TOLD STAFF WE HAVE TO LOOK AT LONG TERM. WHAT ARE THE QUESTIONS? I'VE GOT ONE OR TWO, BUT I DON'T WANT TO CUT. MS. EVANS, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. IT'S LOVELY TO SEE YOU. I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT, UM, PROTECTION OF EXISTING, UH, CONSUMERS OR RESIDENTS IN THE CITY OF DALLAS. HOW MUCH WEIGHT DO YOU PLACE ON THAT? I MEAN, THESE ARE THE, THE FOLKS WHO ARE HERE, THEY'VE GOT A CONTRACT WITH THE CITY, THEY LIVE HERE AND THEY'RE PAYING TAXES. SO WHAT IS YOUR FOCUS ON THAT? AND DO YOU CONSIDER THAT ALSO? OBVIOUSLY THAT'S GOOD QUESTION. IT COUPLED WITH, UH, LAST QUESTION, I THINK THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S EVERYTHING IS LAID OUT IN FORWARD DALLAS. AND I THINK IF TIME PERMIT, I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE ONE OF DEPUTY DIRECTORS WHO IS IN CHARGE OF THAT TO COME HERE AND TALK ABOUT FORWARD DALLAS. THAT IS A DOCUMENT. THERE IS A BALANCE PROTECTING, YOU KNOW, COMMUNITY AT THE SAME TIME. ALLOW DALLAS TO CONTINUE TO GROW. AS I SAID, WE HAVE MORE, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, WE NEED MORE DIVERSE HOUSING TYPE, BUT IT HAS TO BE STRATEGIC WHERE THEY'RE LOCATED. AND DESIGN HAS ALSO BEEN PART, IT'S NOT JUST ABOUT YOU. OH, I HAVE DUPLEX NEXT TO ME. I'M NERVOUS. BUT IT'S ALSO ABOUT WHAT KIND DUPLEX DO YOU HAVE? GOOD DESIGN. IF YOU LOOK AT THE HISTORY IN DALLAS, THE HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD, IT'S VERY WELL COMPATIBLE. IT'S FOURPLEX AND DUPLEX. YOU CANNOT EVEN TELL UNLESS YOU REALLY GO AND COUNT HOW MANY METERS THEY HAVE. IT'S A DUPLEX, TRIPLEX, IT'S BLEND IN SO WELL. AND THAT IS THE PROTECTION WE'RE TRYING TO SEE TO MAKE SURE THEY ARE VERY COMPATIBLE AND TO MAKE SURE SOME OF THE DEVELOPMENT NEED TO BE IN CERTAIN GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION WITH SOME DESIGN. I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING, UM, A BOARD MEMBER SLATE ALSO ASKED. FORWARD LOOKING. WE HAVE TO GO BEYOND JUST WHAT ON THE GROUND. WE HAVE TO LOOK AT WHAT THE FUTURE GENERATION WANTS. I THINK THE FUTURE GENERATION MAY WANT SOMETHING DIFFERENT THAN ME, LIKE THE DALLAS. NOW I AM A BABY BOOMER AND I GREW UP WITH PAPER, BUT THAT'S A TRANSITION FOR ME. BUT THE FUTURE PEOPLE, THEY DON'T CARRY PAPERS. MY KIDS DON'T CARRY PAPERS EVERYWHERE. THAT'S ALL THEY HAVE IS A PHONE. EVERYTHING IS DIGITAL. AND NOW I THINK WE HAVE TO ADAPT TO THAT. AND THAT'S ONE WE LAUNCHED, UH, DALLAS NOW. AND THAT'S ALSO, WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE FUTURE RESIDENTS OF DALLAS. RIGHT? YOU KNOW, WE, A LOT OF PEOPLE, YOU'VE BEEN HERE A LONG TIME, BUT WHAT ARE FUTURE RESIDENT WANTS? AND THAT COULD INCLUDE OUR CURRENT RENTERS EVENTUALLY BECOME OWNERS, HOMEOWNER, WHAT KIND OF HOUSING THEY WANT. I'M PRETTY SURE NEXT GENERATION MAY HAVE A DIFFERENT HOUSING NEED THAN MY GENERATION. UM, SO THOSE ARE THE THING WE CONSTANTLY, CONSTANTLY, UM, LOOKING AT, TRYING TO SEEK A BALANCE. YES. THANK YOU FOR THAT QUESTION. OTHER QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? I'LL MAKE A COMMENT AND THEN A COMMENT. UM, THE FIRST IS, IT KIND OF FOLLOWS A LITTLE BIT OF MR. SLATE'S DEAL, AND I'M GLAD IN YOUR GOALS ELEVATING THE DEPARTMENT TO NATIONAL RECOGNITION. SO I'VE BEEN HERE JUST A FEW YEARS AND I REMEMBER COMING TO DALLAS AND DALLAS WAS BIG D AND PEOPLE WOULD SAY BIG D AND IT KIND OF WAS, UH, CONSISTENT WITH THE DALLAS COWBOYS. THEY WERE AMERICA'S TEAM. AND WE'VE ALL EXPERIENCED [01:20:01] WHAT THAT IS NOT. BUT IT IS, I THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT NOT JUST THE DIRECTOR OF PLANNING DEVELOPMENT, BUT THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE AND THE CITY COUNCIL WORK TOWARDS REESTABLISHING DALLAS AS A PIVOTAL CITY OF THE FUTURE. UM, IT WAS DEPRESSING TO ME WHEN WE BECAME THE NINTH LARGEST CITY IN SAN ANTONIO. PASSED A FEW YEARS AGO FROM THE EIGHTH LARGEST CITY. BUT MAKING DALLAS COMPETITIVE AGAIN. AND I I IT JUST, AND THAT SLICES LIKE MS. EVANS QUESTIONS RELATING TO SINGLE FAMILY NEIGHBORHOODS, BUT IT'S ALSO AS IT RELATES TO DEVELOPMENT, I DON'T WANT TO SAY BUSINESS FRIENDLY, BUT I DON'T WANT TO SAY FRIENDLY AND OPEN FOR IDEAS AND GROWTH. THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT. THAT ASIDE, SO NOW I'M GONNA REPEAT FOR THE BOARD'S BENEFIT. A CONVERSATION YOU AND I HAD IN YOUR OFFICE TWO WEEKS AGO. I SAID, EMILY, THE BOARD IS VERY FRUSTRATED ABOUT PERMITTING MISTAKES. WE SEEM TO BE DEALING WITH A LOT OF PERMITTING MISTAKES WHERE AN APPLICATION COMES IN AND FOR SOME REASON MACH APPROVES IT AND THEN REVOKES IT LATER ON, WHETHER IT'S DAY ONE OR DAY 20 OR A YEAR AND A HALF AND THAT SORT OF THING. AND I SAID TO MS. LOU, I SAID, THERE'S VIS VISCERAL FRUSTRATION OF WHY WE ARE DEALING WITH A PERMIT ISSUED REVOKED. AND THEN THEY HAVE TO COME TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT OR CERTIFICATE OCRACY ISSUED AND THEN REVOKED. AND THEY HAVE TO COME TO BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. NOW, MIND YOU, BOARD MEMBERS, AND YOU KNOW THIS, ANDREA KNOWS THIS BY STATUTE, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR. THAT IS WHAT WE ARE, WE ARE AN ADJUDICATING BODY TO CORRECT MISTAKES. AND WE DO IT ARMS LENGTH IN A QUASI ISSUE FASHION. SO I WAS BEATEN UP ON HER NICELY, DOOR CLOSED, IT WAS A NICE BEAT UP. SHE'S SMIRKING AND SHE PUT HER HEAD DOWN JUST LIKE THAT. AND I SAID, OH, THESE PERMITTING MISTAKES, THEY'RE JUST FRUSTRATING. AND THEN SHE PULLED OUT HER ANNUAL REPORT AND SHE SAID, MR. CHAIRMAN, ARE YOU AWARE OF HOW MANY PERMITS THE CITY OF DALLAS ISSUED LAST YEAR? AND I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THE NUMBER WAS AND I'M GONNA LET HER TELL US THE NUMBER AGAIN. AND I, I DIDN'T EVEN GUESS HOW MANY MS. LU YEARLY 50,005. FIVE ZERO THOUSAND. SO I SAT BACK IN MY CHAIR IN HER OFFICE AND WENT, I'M GONNA HAVE TO EAT ALL MY WORDS. IT STILL IS VERY FRUSTRATING, I UNDERSTAND, BUT IT GIVES US PERSPECTIVE. AND, AND I'M REPEATING THIS TO THE BOARD SO YOU ALL HEAR WHAT YOUR CHAIRMAN IS ADVOCATING FOR YOU. AND I SAID, MS. LOU, PLEASE STILL OWN THOSE MISTAKES. AND SHE SAID, OH, I WILL. I SAID, BUT NOW I GET A PERSPECTIVE. YOU KNOW, WE COME ACROSS, I DON'T KNOW, 2025, WHATEVER THE NUMBER THAT MAKE IT TO US IN PERMITTING AREAS. AND WE GET ANGRY 50,000 PERMITS A YEAR. I'M NOT AN UH, ANALYST, BUT I, YOU COULD DO A REGRESSION ANALYSIS TO SAY THAT'S STATISTICALLY INSIGNIFICANT, BUT WE'RE NOT GONNA SAY THAT. SO IT IS IMPORTANT FOR US THAT YOU UNDER THAT YOUR TEAM, UNDER YOUR LEADERSHIP, DO THE BEST YOU CAN TO PREVENT THOSE SORT OF THINGS. LEARN FROM YOUR MISTAKES. WE INDIVIDUALLY DO NOT SHRINK FROM OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO ADJUDICATE THOSE MISTAKES. WHETHER IT'S OFFENSE, WHETHER IT'S A SETBACK, WHETHER IT'S AN AO APPEAL, ADMINISTRATIVE APPEAL, WHETHER IT'S A COMPLIANCE ISSUE, WHETHER IT'S A, A CERTIFICATE OCCUPANCY. WE DO NOT SHRINK FROM THAT. WE JUST ARE IN PAIN TO SEE THE COMMUNITY IMPACTED BY THOSE THINGS. BUT IT DOES GIVE US PERSPECTIVE THE NUMBER THAT WE HEAR VERSUS 50,000 PERMITS EACH YEAR. AND I'M GUESSING THAT'S GONNA GO UP TOO IN TIME. WELL, YOUR CASE CERTAINLY GO UP. I STILL NEED TO LOOK AT OUR OVERALL NUMBER. I DON'T HAVE IT YET, BUT NO, IT'S USUALLY AROUND 50,000 PERMITS A YEAR. SO I JUST WANTED TO SHARE WITH THE BOARD WITH THAT. I TOLD HER I WAS GONNA TALK ABOUT IT TODAY. I'LL GO TO MS. DAVIS NEXT. I TOLD HER I WAS GONNA TALK ABOUT IT 'CAUSE I DON'T WANT TO AMBUSH HER. IT'S FRUSTRATING FOR US, BUT IT DOES PUT IT INTO PERSPECTIVE. MS. DAVIS. I I HAVE A TWO PART QUESTION AND I APOLOGIZE IF I MISSED THIS. THE FIRST ONE IS, WHAT'S THE PERCENTAGE OF PERMITS THAT ARE ISSUED IN ERROR? AND THEN NUMBER TWO, I'D LOVE TO KNOW THE PROGRESS OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS. HAS THAT NUMBER DECREASED OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS? HAS IT REMAINED STEADY? WHAT, WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE? I THINK THE PERMIT, YOU KNOW, UH, THE MISTAKE. I MEAN IF YOU, UH, THE ARROWS, UM, IT'S A VERY SMALL SIZE. I THINK IF YOU PUT IT LIKE TWO DAYS BEFORE THE ZERO, IT IS PROBABLY NOT EVEN GOING TO SHOW BECAUSE OUT OF 50,000, A FEW, AND I SEE THOSE AS TWO CATEGORY, RIGHT? THERE'S SOME ISOLATED MISTAKE. THOSE ARE THE ONE THAT IS ONE OFF MISTAKE. AND, AND SOMETIME IT'S, IT'S, WE'LL DO THE BEST WE WE CAN TO CATCH THOSE. BUT THEY ALSO, THERE'S SYSTEMIC MISTAKE. THE THE THE SECOND , I'M NOT DONE EITHER. SO THOSE ARE THE ONE WE HAVE REALLY WORKED HARD, UH, IN THE PAST. [01:25:01] BUT I JUST WANNA CLARIFY THE QUESTION. I'M NOT, I'M NOT ASKING WHY THERE WERE MISTAKES. I'M ASKING FOR WHAT IS THE PERCENTAGE OF PERMITS THAT WERE ISSUED IN ERROR AND WHAT IS THAT HISTORY OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS. I'M JUST LOOKING FOR THOSE STATS AND I WILL SAY ALL THE ERRORS CAME TO YOU, BUT THE BOARD, RIGHT, THE MISTAKE ISSUE THE ERROR. WE HAVE TO, UM, EITHER, UH, REVOKE IT AND THEY APPEAL. SO THOSE ARE DO COME TO YOU, BUT VERY FEW, I DON'T HAVE THE EXACT NUMBER, MS. DAVIS, I CAN TRY TO FIND THEM AND GET IT TO YOU, BUT I DON'T SEE AN INCREASE IN ERROR UNLESS YOU CAN GIVE ME A DIFFERENT NUMBER. BUT I THINK THAT'S BEEN THE FOCUS FOR THE LAST FEW YEARS MM-HMM . AND WILL CONTINUE TO BE OUR FOCUS IN THE NEXT FEW YEARS. SO I THINK OUR GOAL IS REALLY TRYING TO PREVENT THE SYSTEMIC ERRORS THAT HAPPENED IN THE PAST. THERE'S NO EXCUSES. SURE. THE ISOLATED AREA WILL DO OUR BEST AGAIN. UM, AND, AND I DON'T HAVE NUMBERS. I'M THINKING THAT'S SOMETHING THAT SHOULD BE TRACKED. WE, WE SHOULD SEE WHAT THAT PERCENTAGE IS EVERY YEAR AND IF THAT'S GETTING BETTER OR NOT. I DON'T CARE WHAT THE MISTAKES ARE. I'M NOT ASKING QUALITATIVELY, I'M JUST ASKING FOR QUANTITATIVE. WHAT ARE THOSE PERCENTAGES? BECAUSE THAT'S HOW YOU, I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S A GOOD SUGGESTION. BUT THAT, BUT THAT'S HOW YOU TRACK HOW IT'S WORKING. I THINK WE HAVE, I MAY, WE MAY HAVE SOME. I NEED TO CHECK WITH OUR STAFF ON THAT ONE. BUT IF WE DON'T HAVE IT, UH, THAT'S A GOOD SUGGESTION. I MEAN, SOMETIME THE ARROW DEPENDS HOW YOU INTERPRET THAT TO ME. I INTERPRET DIFFERENT WAY TO OTHERS INTERPRET LIKE THE BOARD AND THE STAFF DO NOT SEE THAT. SO IT'S A MISTAKE. THE ERROR IS REALLY HAS TO HAVE A CONTACT. SO I HAVE TO REALLY LOOK HARD. WHAT IS THE ERROR? SOMETIME IT'S CLEARLY AN ERROR, SOMETIME IT'S INTERPRETATION AND, AND REALIZE I'M GONNA GO TO MS. DR. GLOVER NEXT. AND THEN I AND THEN MR. QUINT, UM, REALIZE ALSO THAT NOT ALL THE ERRORS MAKE IT TO US. SOMETIMES THE ERRORS ARE, ARE COMMUNICATED TO THE PROPERTY OWNER AND THEN THE ISSUE CLOSE. EITHER THE PROPERTY OWNER SAYS, FORGET IT, OR, UH, THEY REARRANGE, REARRANGE THE REQUEST. SO, UM, OKAY. DR. GLOVER, THANK YOU. MY QUESTION IS, UH, WHAT INFORMED THE DECISION YOUR, UH, THE DEPARTMENT'S DECISION TO WAIVE PARKING? 'CAUSE IT CREATES A SOCIAL PROBLEM WHERE, UM, THERE IS LESS PARKING, BUT THE CITY HAS POSITIONED ITSELF TO ACTIVELY ENFORCE PARKING BY TICKETING PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY DURING THE WEEKENDS. UM, I THINK, UH, AS I MENTIONED, UH, NO PARKING MINIMUM REDUCED PARKING LIMIT DOES NOT MEAN THERE'S NO PARKING. I I IT, IT, UH, WE HAVE A APPLICATION. THE DAY CAME IN, NOT ONLY THAT REQUIRES ZERO. NOT ONLY THEY DID NOT HAVE ZERO PARKING. THEY WERE DOUBLING THE NUMBER OF PARKING THAT WAS REQUIRED PREVIOUSLY. IT'S CONSTANTLY. SO I HAVE NOT SEEN ANY AREA THAT JUST LIKE, BECAUSE OF PARKING REFORM CREATE AN ISSUE. BUT WE, IF THAT HAPPENS, WE HAVE TOOLS, UM, WE HAVE THE RESIDENTIAL, UH, PARKING PERMIT. WE HAVE THE PARKING DISTRICT, UH, IMPROVEMENT DISTRICT, WHICH THE AREA OF THE BUSINESS WILL BENEFIT. THIS HAS BEEN PROVEN TO BE WORK VERY WELL IN OTHER CITIES. SO WE HAVE THE TOOL IN OUR POCKET. IF THERE IS A PARKING ISSUE, UM, ARISES BECAUSE OF PARKING FORM, WE HAVE OTHER, UH, WE CAN TAKE OTHER ACTIONS TO MITIGATE THAT. SO FAR, BASED ON THE APPLICATION WE SEE, I HAVE NOT SEEN A LOT OF ISSUE AT THIS TIME. ONE BENEFIT, I HAVE TO POINT IT OUT. ONE BENEFIT IS, UM, THAT, UM, IT TAKE A LOT LESS TIME FOR STAFF TO REVIEW, UH, THE PLAN. I JUST TALKED TO A PLAN, UM, SUPERVISOR YESTERDAY. I SAID, BECAUSE OF PARKING REFORM, HOW MUCH TIME SAVE YOU? HE SAID, SAVE ME MORE THAN 50% OF MY TIME. BECAUSE IN THE PAST THEY HAVE TO CALCULATE, YOU KNOW, ONE PER BEDROOM, HOW MANY BEDROOM DO I HAVE, HOW MANY SQUARE FEET DO I HAVE? HOW DO WE INTERPRET IT? A SMALL COFFEE SHOP IN THE GROCERY STORE. ALL OF THAT REQUIRE INTERPRETATION. AND A LOT OF TIME WE HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, TURN THE O AWAY AND SMALL BUSINESS COME IN AND SAY, I ONLY HAVE FIVE PARKING SPACE, BUT YOU COULD REQUIRE SEVEN. I'M SHORT OF TWO. AND THEY'LL SAY, WELL FORTUNATELY IT'S A CODE YOU HAVE TO COME WITH SEVEN. AND THEY ENDED UP EITHER NOT OPENING THE BUSINESS OR IT TAKE ANOTHER THREE MONTHS TO FIND A, UM, CONTRACT WITH SOMEBODY TO HAVE A PARKING AGREEMENT. IT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME. OR THEY FILE A CASE OR THEY FILE A CASE WITH THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AND GET A SPECIAL YEAH, OR YOU CAN GET A, BUT THAT'S A LONG PROCESS, YOU KNOW. AND UH, UM, A LOT OF TIME PEOPLE WANT DON'T WANT [01:30:01] TO TAKE THAT ROUTE BECAUSE IT MAKE, YOU KNOW, NEIGHBOR FEEL LIKE, OH, YOU HAVE PARKING REDUCTION AND WHAT THAT MEAN TO MY STREET AND THINGS LIKE THAT. UM, BUT I DO, UH, I DON'T HAVE THE OVERALL NUMBERS FOR MS. DAVIS, BUT I DO THINK WHEN KAMIKA IS PRESENTING, UH, MORE DETAILED INFORMATION, WE KNOW HOW MANY, UH, CASES WE HAVE ABOUT THE BOARD ADJUSTMENT. RIGHT. UH, BUT, UM, AND OUT OF THAT, UH, OR THOSE NUMBERS YOU REVIEWED OVER 200, I THINK 230 IS A NUMBER OF CASES YOU REVIEWED. AND THAT'S A TOTAL REQUEST OUT OF THOSE, I THINK THERE ARE A FEW THAT CAN BE QUANTIFIED. UH, CAMIKA, , I THINK THERE MIGHT BE THREE, UH, WITH NOT ISSUE THE ERROR, BUT JUST BOARD ADJUSTMENT WE TAKE IN AND THEY, WE FIND OUT THEY NO LONGER NEED. SO IT'S ABOUT 1% OR LESS THAN 1% FOR THE BOARD ADJUSTMENT CASES. UH, OF COURSE I NEED TO WORK A LITTLE BIT MORE ON THESE OTHER CASES. MR. QUINT, YOU HAD A QUESTION. THANK YOU MR. CHAIRMAN. MS. LOU, GIVE ME AN, YOU MENTIONED THAT PERMITTING ERRORS, THAT YOU CORRECTED SOME SYSTEMIC ERRORS THAT WERE IN PLACE. CAN YOU GIVE US AN EXAMPLE OF WHAT SYSTEMIC ERRORS WERE CORRECTED? ACTUALLY, TRY NOT TO REVISIT THAT. IT'S KIND OF HURTING . UH, SO THERE WAS ONE, UH, BEFORE THE MERGER, THIS HAPPENED BEFORE THE TWO DEPARTMENT MERGED. UM, THERE WAS ERROR WIDE REZONING OF A CERTAIN AREA DOWN ZONE. YOU WERE UP ZONE. YOU REALLY DO NOT CREATE THIS AREA, BUT WHEN YOU DOWN ZONE, YOU SHOULD ALLOW DUPLEX. NOW YOU ONLY ALLOW SINGLE FAMILY USED TO BE ALLOWING, UM, MORE LOCK COVERAGE, BUT NOW YOU HAVE LESS LOCK COVERAGE. THAT AREA WIDE REZONING PASS BY ONE DEPARTMENT. IT IS NOT COLLABORATED WITH THE OTHER DEPARTMENT, WITH THE OTHER DEPARTMENT DID STILL USING THE OLD CODE AND USING THE OLD STANDARD BECAUSE OF DOWN ZONING. SO THEY ENDED UP APPROVING QUITE A FEW, UM, YOU KNOW, ISSUE QUITE A FEW PERMIT THAT DOES NOT COMPLY WITH THE LATEST, LATEST ORDINANCE. SO THAT'S, I CAUSED SYSTEMIC MISTAKE. AND THAT'S SOMETHING WE WORK VERY HARD TO BREAK DOWN THE SILOS TO MAKE SURE, UM, SOMETHING PASSED AWARENESS THIS WAY WILL TRANSLATE TO PERMITTING RIGHT AWAY. SO OUR PERMITTING STAFF KNOWS, OKAY, THE LAW HAVE CHANGED EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NOT POSTED. IT TAKE A WHILE FOR THOSE LAW TO BE POSTED ONLINE, TO BE SIGNED BY THE SECRETARY. AND SO WE HAVE INTERNAL SYSTEMS. ACTUALLY, I'M REALLY GLAD JASON PAUL IS IN, IN, IN CHART OF THAT AND TO MAKE SURE WE COLLABORATE, WE MAKE SURE WE TRANSLATE. THOSE ARE THE MISTAKE. UM, I WAS REALLY THINKING JUST BY COMBINING THE DEPARTMENT, BY COLLABORATING WITH EACH OTHER, BY BEING ONE TEAM, UH, WILL REALLY PREVENT, UM, SOMETHING LIKE THAT IN THE FUTURE. SO THAT'S SOMETHING IS VERY IMPORTANT. WE DO NOT REPEAT OUR MISTAKE THAT SCALE. SO, SO MR. QUINT, THE NEIGHBORHOOD WAS ELM THICKET, THE BOARD MET AND MADE A DECISION TO EXPEDITE THE HEARING OF THE ISSUES RELATING TO THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. UM, AND IT LOOKED AT OVER 170 INSTANCES WHERE THERE WAS QUESTIONS AS IT RELATES TO WHETHER PERMITTING WAS CORRECT OR NOT. UM, I THINK THAT'S OVER NOW. MR. POOLE, IS THAT, IS THAT CONCLUDED NOW? IS THE ELM THICKET? YES. OKAY. UM, I, SO THAT I, I WOULD SAY THAT THAT IS AN EXAMPLE OF A SYSTEMIC PROBLEM THAT LOOKS LIKE WE HOPE HAS BEEN SOLVED AND THE DIRECTORS SAYING HOPEFULLY WILL NOT REPEAT ITSELF. UH, AND THE BOARD HAD TO DEAL WITH, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NUMBER WAS OF ACTUAL CASES, WHETHER IN VARIANCE REQUESTS OR, UH, APPEALS OF A BUILDING OFFICIAL AND THAT SORT OF THING. SO I'M NOT BELABORING IT, BUT I SHE DIDN'T WANNA MENTION THE NAME OF IT. I'LL GO AHEAD AND SAY IT. IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE DEALT WITH AND HOPEFULLY THAT DOES NOT REPEAT ITSELF. MR. CHAIRMAN. SORRY. THANK YOU. WE HAVE ONE MORE CASE THAT THEY'RE TRYING TO OH, OKAY. THEN WE SHOULDN'T REALLY TALK ANY FURTHER ABOUT THAT. 'CAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO PREJUDICE THE OUTCOME. UM, OKAY. DID, DID THAT CLOSE YOUR QUESTION? MR. SASHING? THANK YOU. UM, DIRECTOR LU, UM, A, A STATEMENT AND THEN A QUESTION. SO, UM, AS A, IN A PREVIOUS LIFE, LIFE BEING A CUSTOMER OF THE PERMITTING PROCESS AND UNDERSTANDING THE VARIOUS TYPES OF CLIENTS THAT YOU GET IN STATE AND OUT STATE, UM, UM, I DO APPRECIATE THE DIGITAL OPTION. UM, YOU KNOW, HAVING, YOU KNOW, BEEN A CONTRACTOR TRYING TO PERMIT IN, YOU KNOW, CITIES LIKE SACRAMENTO AND SAN DIEGO AND LA THE DIGITAL OPTION REALLY CREATES A LOT OF, UM, INCENTIVE TO [01:35:01] WANT TO DO BUSINESS WITHIN THE CITY. SO, UH, THANK, THANK YOU TO YOU AND YOUR TEAM FOR, FOR, UH, CREATING THAT. UM, I WILL ASK, UM, FROM A LONG-TERM, UM, YOU KNOW, YOUR WHEELHOUSE, URBAN DEVELOPMENT FROM A LONG-TERM, UM, UH, COORDINATION, UH, STANDPOINT WITH OTHER DEPARTMENTS. YOU TALKED ABOUT BREAKING DOWN SILOS IN THIS, IN THE AREA OF THE CITY THAT I LIVE IN, WHAT WE'VE, WHAT WE EXPERIENCED WHEN I WAS ON THE, UM, UH, WHAT WE EXPERIENCED IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD IS THAT AS THE CITY GREW AND IN THAT SECTOR OF THE CITY, UM, YOU KNOW, IT WAS FARMLANDS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, TRAFFIC EXPONENTIALLY GREW. UM, BECAUSE WE'RE BORDERED BY GRAND PRAIRIE, CEDAR HILL, DUNCANVILLE, UM, AND FURTHER, AND AS THAT AREA GREW, THE TRA IT BECAME INCREASINGLY DIFFICULT FOR US TO GET OUT OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. YOU KNOW, UH, PEOPLE ON CERTAIN, ON ONE SIDE OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD WOULD HAVE TO DRIVE ALL THE WAY AROUND TO THE BACK JUST TO GET TO THE FRONT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD TO GET OUT BECAUSE THE TRAFFIC WAS SO BAD AND IT WAS, IT IS A RESULT OF MAYBE THE VISION NOT CONSIDERING THE TRAFFIC AND HOW THAT WOULD GROW. AND WHAT YOU'RE DOING NOW IN DEVELOPING IN THE FUTURE OF DALLAS, HOW ARE YOU WORKING WITH OTHER DEPARTMENTS TO MITIGATE THAT TYPE OF, UH, UH, POTENTIAL RISK? I THINK I WANT TO SPEAK A BROADER FROM INFRASTRUCTURE PERSPECTIVE, BECAUSE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TRANSPORTATION, RIGHT? TRAFFIC WE'RE TALKING ABOUT COULD BE WATER AND SEWER CAPACITY, ALL OF THAT. THAT IS ONE OF THE FOCUS FOR US TO DO THIS YEAR TO WORK WITH OTHER DEPARTMENT BECAUSE OUR LAND, WE, WE MAINLY, OUR DEPARTMENT MAINLY DEAL WITH LAND USE, BUT LAND USE TRANSPORTATION IS KIND OF HAND IN HAND OR CHICKEN OR EGG. SO WE HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER. UM, WE ARE SCHEDULED TO MEET WITH PUBLIC WORKS TRANSPORTATION IN THE NEXT FEW WEEKS. TALK ABOUT A, A FEW THINGS AND THAT COULD BE ONE OF THEM. WE WORK CLOSELY WITH WATER, UM, UTILITIES. THERE ARE THE WATER ENSURE, UM, PROVIDER. UM, THERE'S A LOT OF OTHER THINGS WE WORK CLOSELY WITH. DART PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION HAS TO BE PART OF THE SOLUTION AS WELL. WE CANNOT JUST BUILD A ROAD OUT OF THIS TRAFFIC ISSUE. AND DART AND I, UH, OUR DEPARTMENT WORK VERY CLOSELY TO DEVELOP SOME STRATEGIES ABOUT DEVELOPMENT AROUND TRANSIT STATIONS, OVERALL, PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION. WE ALSO WORK WITH, UH, THE, THE LOCAL, UH, REGIONAL PLANNING AGENCY. THEY DO HAVE SOME FUNDING AVAILABLE. SO WE WANT MAKE SURE WHAT'S STRATEGIC, ESPECIALLY CITY OF DALLAS. UH, WE WANT TO CONTINUE TO GROW, WHICH IS GREAT, UM, THAT THE MORE STATE OF DALLAS IS READY TO GROW, THE LESS SPRAWL WE'LL HAVE FOR THE REGION BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO PUSH DEVELOPMENT GO FURTHER AND FURTHER AND FURTHER. AND THAT IS A LONG TERM BURDEN FOR OUR REGION BECAUSE THOSE NEW DEVELOPMENT, THEY MAY NOT PAY FOR THEMSELVES IN THE FUTURE. THEY HAVE A SUBDIVISION HAVE DROVE A 20, 30 YEAR DOWN THE ROAD WHO IS GONNA MAINTAIN THAT. SO THAT HOPEFULLY WE'LL WORK TOGETHER BEYOND OUR DEPARTMENT OR EVEN AMONG THE REGION, TO TRYING TO DO A LOT OF IN FIELD DEVELOPMENT AS INFRASTRUCTURE. ALREADY THERE IS A ROAD ALREADY THERE TRYING TO DO REDEVELOPMENT AND ALSO ADAPTED REUSE. UM, CITY OF DALLAS STILL HAVE A LOT OF POTENTIAL, A LOT OF POTENTIAL TO DEVELOP UP TO DEVELOP, REDEVELOP AND TO INFILL. UH, SO I THINK THAT THIS IS SOMETHING CRITICAL. IT'S A GREAT QUESTION. WE TALK ABOUT LAND USE, WE REALLY HAVE TO LOOK AT THESE OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE INCLUDING ROADWAY. SO THOSE ARE THE THINKING THAT WE ALL HAVE TO WORK TOGETHER. THERE IS NO SOLUTION FOR ME TO OFFER TO YOU. AND I DON'T THINK JUST THIS MEETING WILL RESOLVE, BUT IT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO WORK TOGETHER, UH, PROBABLY FOR A FEW YEARS TO GET THAT RESOLVED AND WORK WITH CITY COUNCIL, WORKING WITH DIFFERENT DEPARTMENT, EVEN NEED TO WORK WITH SOME OTHER CITY AROUND US. I WAS GONNA SAY, TO BE ORDER TO RESOLVE THOSE ORIGINAL ISSUES. RIGHT. THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION. I WAS GONNA SAY THAT BECAUSE ONE THING THAT WE RAN INTO DURING THAT WHOLE PROCESS, AND THANKS TO, UM, DIRECTOR K CARLY, UH, WORKING WITH THE CITY OF DUNCANVILLE BECAUSE THERE WERE, THERE WERE, UH, MAINTENANCE ISSUES, UH, WITH WITHIN THE MEDIAN BECAUSE I'M ON THE DALLAS SIDE AND DUNCANVILLE IS ACROSS THE HIGHWAY ON THE DUNCANVILLE SIDE, AND THE MEDIAN BELONGED TO DUNCANVILLE. SO THERE WAS A WHOLE MULTI-YEAR CONVERSATION THAT WENT ON WITH GETTING, UM, A, A PARTICULAR PROJECT. SO YEAH, THAT, THAT'S A GOOD POINT. WORKING NOT ONLY INTERNALLY TOGETHER, BUT OTHER MUNICIPALITIES AS WELL. THANK YOU FOR THE, FOR THE ANSWER AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR PRESENTATION TODAY. OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MS. LU? THANK YOU VERY MUCH. OH, MS. GARNER. THERE WE GO. UM, THANK YOU FOR YOUR PRESENTATION. UM, IF [01:40:02] BUILDING ON, UH, MR. ASHTON'S QUESTION, THERE IS A TRAFFIC ISSUE WITH DECREASING PARKING SPACES AND THE ANSWER IS TO WORK WITH THE TRANSPORTATION DEPARTMENT. THERE ARE CITIZENS WHO ARE INHERENTLY RELUCTANT TO USE, UH, MASS TRANSIT BECAUSE OF THE PUBLIC SAFETY ISSUE. ARE YOU ALSO BRINGING, UH, DALLAS POLICE DEPARTMENT INTO THE DISCUSSION? DALLAS, WHAT DEPARTMENT DO YOU SAY? THE DALLAS POLICE DEPARTMENT FOR PUBLIC SAFETY ON MASS TRANSIT. BECAUSE A LOT OF PEOPLE WANT TO DRIVE THEIR VEHICLE BECAUSE OF, THERE MAY BE SOME, UM, THAT SEE SOME SAFETY ISSUES ON MASS TRANSIT. VERY REAL QUESTION. DALLAS IS STILL, I SAID AUTO, UH, CENTRIC CITY. YOU KNOW, I DRIVE, YOU DRIVE, I HAVE A CAR, UM, TO GET AROUND. UM, AND WE DON'T EXPECT EVERYBODY OR MOST PEOPLE WILL TAKE PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION. I, I UNDERSTAND THERE ARE FEW OF MY STAFF ARE CAR FREE FOR A WHILE AND IT'S STILL VERY CHALLENGING, ESPECIALLY OUR TRANSIT. YOU KNOW, THERE'S UM, UM, YOU KNOW, THE FREQUENCY OR THE LOCATION. SO WE'RE STILL WORKING, UM, WITH, YOU KNOW, EVERYONE ON THAT. THE POLICE DEPARTMENT IS DEFINITELY SHOULD BE A FACTOR. SO HERE IS MY TAKE ON THE SAFETY, UH, SIDE OTHER THAN TRAFFIC DEFINITELY WORK SOMETIME WE DO, UH, WORK WITH THE POLICE. PEOPLE PARK MOSTLY WITH TRANSPORTATION BECAUSE PEOPLE PARK IN THE WRONG SPOT. THAT'S A TRAFFIC ISSUE OF TRANSPORTATION. BUT IN CERTAIN CASES IN MY PREVIOUS CITY, WE DO WORK WITH A POLICE DEPARTMENT TO DO. BUT A LOT OF TIME YOU WOULD LIKE THE POLICE DEPARTMENT TO FOCUS ON MORE URGENT ISSUE THAN TRAFFIC. THEY DEFINITELY PART, THEY GIVE TICKETS, RIGHT? THEY GIVE LOTS OF TICKETS. SO FOR SPEEDING AND THINK YOUR VIOLATION OF THE LAW. UM, YES, I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO FOCUS A LITTLE BIT MORE WORKING WITH THE POLICE. AND ALSO JUST WANT TO KNOW I'M A PLANNER. UH, MY PERSPECTIVE ON SAFETY BEYOND THE TRAFFIC IS PUT MORE EYES ON THE STREET. YOU ALL KNOW ABOUT JANE JACOBS, UM, UH, KIND OF, UM, IS VERY IMPORTANT WHEN WE DO ESPECIALLY DEVELOPMENT, UM, THAT FIRST UH, FLOOR, THAT INTERACTION, UH, THE PUBLIC RUN BETWEEN THE STREET AND THE BUILDING, THAT AREA IS VERY IMPORTANT. AND THAT COULD CREATE AN A, A UH, SCENARIO THAT PEOPLE JUST ARE SCARED TO WALK IN THE AREA BECAUSE IT'S COULD RELATED TO WHAT WE DO DESIGN AND DEVELOPMENT. BECAUSE THAT DEVELOPMENT IS NOT REALLY A SUPPORTIVE OF WALKABLE COMMUNITY OR EVEN SAFE COMMUTERS. THERE, THERE'S OTHER WAYS BEYOND JUST THE POLICE TO ENHANCE PUBLIC SAFETY. AND I'M REALLY GLAD THAT PLANNERS CAN CONTRIBUTE THAT TO THAT CONVERSATION. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? HEARING NONE. THANK YOU. VERY. OH, I JUST WANT TO SAY, I HAVE A FEW OTHER SLIDE ABOUT THE DATA, BUT I THINK YOU ALREADY MENTIONED THAT IF YOU NEEDED, UM, OUR CHIEF PLANNER KAMIKA CAN EMPHASIZE THAT. BASICALLY JUST TELL YOU, YOU ALREADY MENTIONED WE REDUCE, UH, THE, UH, TIMELINE FROM 60 DAYS TO 54 DAYS. THAT'S 10% REDUCTION. WELL, LET'S, LET'S GET A REALITY CHECK. FOUR YEARS AGO, IT WAS 93 DAYS. OH, AND TWO YEARS AGO WAS 76. YES. SO FOUR YEARS AGO WAS 93 DAYS TO GET A DECISION. AND I WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT 93 DAYS IS NOT LIKE OUT OF LINE WITH OTHER CITIES. SO WE ARE WAY UNDER COMPARED TO OUR PEER CITIES. EVERY TIME THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR BRINGS A CASE TO THE PANEL, TO THE BOARD, I ALWAYS MAKE A BIG DEAL WHEN SHE GETS UNDER 50 OR WE USED TO BE WHEN IT WAS A BIG DEAL WHEN SHE WAS UNDER 60, THEN IT WAS WHEN SHE DID 55. IT MEANS SO NO, BUT, BUT THERE IS MIGHT BE WE, WE STILL HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE STATE LAW. EVERYTHING, OF COURSE, EVERYTHING. THERE'S NOTICE REQUIREMENTS YOU NEED TO, YEAH, I JUST, BUT IT'S PROB YOU'RE NOT GONNA SEE LIKE 10% EVERY YEAR, OTHERWISE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING TO IMPOSSIBLE TO DO THE WORK. WE ARE VERY PLEASED WITH THE DIRECTION. BUT FOR REFERENCE, IT WAS 93 4 YEARS AGO. ALRIGHT, OKAY, SO WE'RE DOWN TO 54. THAT IS FABULOUS. AND YOUR WORKLOAD HAS INCREASED 15% DURING THAT TIME. REDUCING THE TIMELINE INCREASED 15% OF THE CASES. SO THAT'S AMAZING WORK. BIG KUDOS TO ALL THE ENTIRE TEAM AND ALSO THE BOARD. MR. YOU ARE DOING AMAZING WORK. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR LEADERSHIP. WE HOPE TO SEE YOU HERE NEXT YEAR TO GIVE US QUESTION ANSWERS AGAIN. AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR LEADERSHIP. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME. THANK YOU. ALRIGHT, OUR NEXT SPEAKER TODAY IS BARON ELIASON. HE'S THE INTERIM INSPECTOR GENERAL FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS. UH, BARON HAS SPOKEN AT THE LAST TWO FULL BOARD MEETINGS AND HE'S GONNA GIVE US SOME [01:45:01] ENLIGHTENING DISCUSSION ON ETHICS TRAINING. UM, AND AS YOU'VE, IF, AS YOU, AS YOU WOULD'VE PREVIEWED HIS SLIDES, THEY'RE ALL OVER THE PLACE WITH SOME OF THE COMICAL EXAMPLES. UM, I'M STALLING TILL YOU GET YOUR SLIDE DECK LOADED. I APPRECIATE THAT. YOU'RE, ARE YOU GOING TO, YOU'RE, YOU'RE NOT GONNA SPEAK TO THE BONUS DECK, ALTHOUGH WE COULD GET THERE DEPENDING ON HOW THE CONVERSATION GOES, RIGHT? CORRECT. THAT'S CORRECT. PERFECT, PERFECT. OKAY. PLEASE REINTRODUCE YOURSELF, SIR. OKAY. THANK YOU. WELL, UH, GOOD MORNING AND WELCOME TO THIS, UH, REALLY INSPIRATIONAL TALK ON ETHICS. I WANT YOU ALL TO GET READY. THIS IS GONNA CHANGE YOUR LIFE. . UH, PLEASE HOLD YOUR APPLAUSE UNTIL THE END. OKAY. MY NAME'S BARON. I'M THE, UH, INTERIM INSPECTOR GENERAL. I'M HERE TODAY BECAUSE WHAT YOU DO IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE YOU WORK INCREDIBLY HARD. IT WAS REALLY INTERESTING TO HEAR HOW MUCH YOU DO DO AND HOW MANY, UH, TYPES OF ZONING CASES YOU HAVE. IT'S VERY IMPORTANT. IT CHANGES LIVES. AND IF ETHICS ISN'T WORKING, WE CAN UNTIE ALL THE WORK THAT YOU ALL HAVE DONE. OR IF IT IS WORKING, WE CAN LIFT THE CITY OF DALLAS UP. SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I'M HERE AND THAT'S WHY THE OFFICE OF INSPECTOR GENERAL IS HERE. WHAT IS COMING AROUND BEFORE YOU NOW IS WHAT I CALL A POCKET REFERENCE GUIDE. IT IS, UH, SOMETHING YOU CAN THROW IN YOUR BRIEFCASE OR YOUR FILE FOLDER FOR YOUR WORK HERE WITH THIS BOARD. UH, IT'S LIKE A TABLE OF CONTENTS. IT'S GONNA HELP YOU TO NAVIGATE THE CODE WHEN YOU NEED THAT. SO THE OFFICE OF INSPECTOR GENERAL HAS A COUPLE OF FUNCTIONS, UH, BUT WE DEAL WITH NOT JUST ETHICS, BUT ALSO FRAUD, WASTE AND ABUSE. BUT I'M HERE TO TALK ABOUT ETHICS SPECIFICALLY. AND ETHICS IS A BROAD TOPIC, BUT FOR YOUR PURPOSES AND FOR ALL OF US AT WORK OR SERVE AT THE CITY, ETHICS IS WHAT'S IN THIS BOOK. SO THAT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER, AND WE'LL TALK MORE ABOUT THAT AS WE GO ALONG. AND THAT PIECE OF PAPER, THAT POCKET REFERENCE GUIDE, IS GONNA HELP YOU TO UNDERSTAND, UH, WHAT IS IN THE BOOK AND GET YOU THERE FASTER. SO ETHICS JUST IN GENERAL IS, IS PRETTY SIMPLE. IT, AND YOU ALL ALREADY HAVE IT. I JUST WANT TO GET SOME THINGS, UM, IN FRONT OF YOUR MINDS WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE BOARD THAT ARE TYPICAL PLACES WHERE YOU'RE GONNA RUN INTO IT SO THAT YOU'LL KNOW WHAT TO DO. BUT ETHICS IS JUST, UH, FOR US, THE WAY WE PREVENT THE APPEARANCE OR THE FACT THAT THE THINGS THAT YOU DO ARE NOT ABOVE BOARD. THAT THE THINGS THAT YOU DO ARE NOT OBJECTIVE, THAT THEY'RE SUBJECTIVE, THAT SOMEBODY'S GOT AN INTEREST THAT THEY SHOULDN'T HAVE. AND ETHICS IS THERE TO TRY AND MAKE SURE THAT THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN. AND SO, MICHAEL BARON, ONE SECOND. YEAH. IS SOMEONE RUNNING HIS SLIDE DECK? WOULD YOU BRING IT UP ON THE SCREEN SO THAT WE HAVE THAT? OKAY. ONE SECOND. HE'S SHE'S GONNA LOAD IT. THAT WAS IN THE DOCKET. I THOUGHT I WAS ALREADY SENDING IT. SO I, I APOLOGIZE. WELL, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW IF, IF MS. WILLIAMS NEEDS TO DO THAT, OR YOU OR WHO, BUT I I WANNA MAKE SURE WE FOLLOW ALONG. YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. SO LET ME TRY AGAIN TO SHARE. 'CAUSE I THOUGHT THAT WAS HAPPENING. HERE WE GO. THAT'LL DO IT. YOU HAVEN'T MISSED MUCH IN TERMS OF SLIDES. LET'S SEE IF THAT, IF THIS WILL BRING IT UP. THERE YOU GO. OKAY, LET ME SCROLL DOWN. ARE YOU DOING THE CLICKING? I'M DOING THE CLICKING. ALL RIGHT, PROCEED. I'M GLAD. THANK YOU FOR CATCHING THAT. PROCEED. SO THIS IS THE SLIDE THAT WE JUST HAD. LET ME GET RID OF THIS, THIS BIT RIGHT HERE. NO, I CAN'T DO THAT. IT'S NOT SHOWING FOR YOU. OKAY. SO ETHICS IS SIMPLY THE WAY WE PREVENT THE FACTOR OR APPEARANCE THAT THINGS AREN'T ABOVE BOARD. AND SO MY GOAL TODAY, WOW, IS TO INCREASE YOUR SPIDER SENSE. ALL, ALL I NEED TO DO IS, IS AGAIN, GET IN YOUR MIND THE KINDS OF THINGS THAT A BOARD LIKE THIS IS GONNA RUN INTO. INTRODUCE YOU TO SOME KEY TERMS. I KNOW THERE'S A LOT OF ATTORNEYS THERE. YOU ALL KNOW WORDS MATTER. ONE LITTLE WORD CAN MEAN A LOT. AND THAT'S TRUE WITH ETHICS. SO I'M GONNA HIGHLIGHT SOME CONFLICT PROVISIONS FOR YOU AND PROVIDE SOME RESOURCES AND THEN TAKE SOME QUESTIONS. UH, THIS IS, I LIKE PICTURES. I LIKE METAPHORS. I THINK THIS IS A GREAT ONE. THIS IS NOT ONLY WHAT YOU ARE DEALING WITH AS, UH, BOARD MEMBERS, BUT ALSO HOW THE CITY AND PEOPLE IN THE CITY SEE GOVERNMENT IN GENERAL AND, AND SEE THE WORK THAT WE ALL DO. AND, AND YOU SEE THE, THE HAND ON THE SCALE THERE. UH, THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT THINK IN CITY GOVERNMENT OR COUNTY GOVERNMENT, STATE AND FEDERAL, THAT, THAT THERE'S ALWAYS A HAND ON THE SCALE SOMEWHERE. AND THAT'S WHY ETHICS IS SO IMPORTANT, IS IT'S, IT'S THE, THE MORE ETHICAL WE ARE AND TRANSPARENT ABOUT THE FACT THAT WE ARE, THE MORE THAT WE CAN MEET THE GOALS THAT THE CHAIRMAN TALKED ABOUT, [01:50:01] MAKING PEOPLE WANT TO DO BUSINESS IN THE CITY OF DALLAS, ELEVATING US, UH, IN THEIR EYES BECAUSE THEY THINK WE DON'T HAVE OUR HANDS ON THE SCALE. THEY THINK IT THINGS ARE DONE HERE OBJECTIVELY. SO, UH, HERE'S THE KEY, HERE'S THE BIG PICTURE. BECAUSE WE HAVE ACCESS TO MONEY, POWER, AUTHORITY, INFLUENCE, DECISION MAKING IN THOSE KINDS OF THINGS. PEOPLE WHO ARE SUSPICIOUS OF, OF WHAT WE DO ARE THINKING THAT WE'RE USING THAT MONEY, POWER, INFLUENCE, AND AUTHORITY TO PUT OUR FINGER ON THE SCALE. AND THAT'S THE CLASSIC BLUNDER. AND THAT'S AT THE HEARTBEAT OF ALL THE ETHICAL RULES. JUST DON'T DO THAT. JUST DON'T PUT YOUR FINGER ON THE SCALE. AND THAT'S, I CAN'T PUT IT ANY, ANY, UH, MORE SIMPLE THAN THAT. BUT OUR CODE GETS VERY SPECIFIC. AND SO, UH, A LITTLE HINT ABOUT THE CODE. IT'S 80 OR 90 PAGES LONG. IT HAS ABOUT 11 ARTICLES IN IT, BUT IT'S AS EASY AS 1, 2, 3. AND I SAY THAT BECAUSE 95% OF THE RULES THAT YOU NEED TO KNOW ARE IN THE FIRST THREE ARTICLES, ONE, TWO, AND THREE. THERE'S ANOTHER ARTICLE THAT'S IMPORTANT TO YOU BECAUSE OF YOUR SPECIFIC ROLE. AND THAT'S, UH, ARTICLE SIX THAT HAS TO DO WITH REPORTING THINGS. AND I'LL TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THAT. WHEN THE CODE OF ETHICS BEGINS, LIKE MOST THINGS OF THIS TYPE, IT BEGINS IN BIG, BROAD STROKES WITH, UH, WHAT ARE OUR STANDARDS OF BEHAVIOR AND WHAT ARE OUR STANDARDS OF CIVILITY. AND IF WE WANTED TO, IN FIVE MINUTES, WE COULD WRITE SOMETHING VERY SIMILAR TO WHAT'S IN THE CODE. YOU'LL SEE IT THERE HIGHLIGHTED ON THE SCREEN. YOU'LL SEE WORDS LIKE INTEGRITY AND TRUST AND, UH, SUPPORT OF THE PUBLIC, THE APPEARANCE OF A CONFLICT OF INTEREST, UH, TO CAREFULLY CONSIDER PUBLIC PERCEPTION, ALL THOSE KINDS OF THINGS, NOT ROCKET SCIENCE. NONE OF YOU ARE HERE BECAUSE THIS IS NEWS TO YOU, RIGHT? AND YOU WOULDN'T BE HAVE BEEN PUT ON A COMMITTEE LIKE THIS IF YOU DIDN'T UNDERSTAND IT, BUT IT GETS TO THE HEART OF WHAT WE'VE GOT TO PAY ATTENTION TO IN ETHICS. SO BE ON YOUR BEST BEHAVIOR. NOW, THERE ARE SOME WORDS I SAID, UH, THERE, THERE ARE CERTAIN WORDS THAT CARRY A LOT OF WEIGHT, AND YOU'RE ONE OF THOSE BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS THAT BUMP INTO THOSE WORDS. SO HERE'S SOME OF THEM. UH, YOU'RE A QUASI-JUDICIAL BODY. SO WHEN YOU SEE THAT IN THE CODE, IT MATTERS. AND WHAT THAT MEANS IS YOU'RE NOT ADVISOR. YOU MAKE DECISIONS AND, AND YOU KNOW THAT. BUT THAT IS A DISTINGUISHMENT IN THE CODE THAT DIFFERENT DECISIONS AND, AND DIFFERENT OBLIGATIONS, UH, HINGE OFF OF. SO REMEMBER THAT OF COURSE, YOU ARE CITY OFFICIALS AND THE CODE OF ETHICS APPLIES TO CITY OFFICIALS, IT APPLIES TO, UH, EMPLOYEES AND IT APPLIES TO LOBBYISTS AND PERSONS DOING BUSINESS OR EVEN TRYING TO DO BUSINESS, UH, WITH THE CITY. SO THAT'S THE APPLICATION OF THE CODE. NOW, HERE'S SOME GOOD TO KNOWS. UM, AND WE ARE WORKING ON THIS AND MAKING IT EASIER FOR EVERYBODY. BUT YOU NEED TO KNOW, ESPECIALLY THE NEW MEMBERS, THAT WITHIN, I'LL JUST READ IT TO YOU, THE ETHICS PLEDGE. THERE'S SOMETHING CALLED AN ETHICS PLEDGE. AND IF YOU'RE NEW TO THE BOARD, NEW, A NEW CITY OFFICIAL, UH, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO TURN THIS PLEDGE IN TO THE CITY SECRETARY'S OFFICE. UH, WITHIN 30 DAYS, YOU'RE ALSO SUPPOSED TO HAVE FILED A, A FINANCIAL DISCLOSURE REPORT. AND SO IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT, LET ME KNOW AND I'LL LEAD YOU THROUGH THAT PROCESS. ALSO, THE CITY SECRETARY CAN HELP YOU WITH THAT KEY DEFINITION IN THE CODE THAT COMES INTO PLAY BECAUSE OF THE ROLE THAT YOU HAVE IS THE DEFINITION OF THE WORD RELATIVE AND WHO IS A RELATIVE TO YOU. AND SO I'VE PUT THE DEFINITION IN YOUR SLIDES HERE. YOU CAN READ IT FOR YOURSELF, BUT YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND THAT BECAUSE FROM TIME TO TIME, 'CAUSE YOU'RE ALL IN BUSINESS, YOU ALL ARE ACTIVE, UH, IN WHATEVER YOU DO OUTSIDE THIS BOARD, WHO YOUR RELATIVE IS MIGHT AFFECT WHAT THE ETHICS ARE FOR YOU. SO READ THAT DEFINITION. SEE HOW BROAD THAT THAT IS. HOLD ONE, HOLD ONE SECOND. MR. ELIASON, IF ANY MEMBER HAS A QUESTION, GET MY ATTENTION AND I'LL GENTLY INTERRUPT HIM. I LIKE QUESTIONS AS WE GO, AS OPPOSED TO THE END. OKAY? I DON'T SEE ANY YET, SO PROCEED. OKAY, OTHER GOOD TO KNOWS, THERE'S SOMETHING CALLED 82 14. UM, IF I DIDN'T SAY IT ALREADY, I, I WANT TO EMPHASIZE WITH YOU ALL, UH, THAT ETHICS IS A TEAM SPORT. UH, I NEED YOU, YOU NEED ME. WE NEED ALL THE EMPLOYEES AND ALL THE OFFICIALS. AND SO SOMETIMES BECAUSE YOU WORK HERE OR NOT WORK HERE, BUT YOU SERVE HERE, YOU'RE GONNA RUN INTO SOME INFORMATION, UH, NOT JUST ABOUT ETHICS, BUT MAYBE ABOUT ABUSE OR ABOUT WASTE OR ABOUT FRAUD. AND WE NEED TO STAND TOGETHER FOR WHAT'S RIGHT IN THE CITY. AND SO I BRING THESE DEFINITIONS, UM, IN FRONT OF YOU BECAUSE THIS IS ALSO SOMETHING THAT THE OFFICE OF INSPECTOR GENERAL DEALS WITH. BUT [01:55:01] AGAIN, I'M HERE TODAY TO TALK ABOUT WHAT'S IN THE CODE OF ETHICS, BUT LOOK AT THOSE, UH, DEFINITIONS FOR ABUSE AND WASTE. AND THERE'S ONE FOR FRAUD IN YOUR PRESENTATION. NOW, IN THE CODE OF ETHICS, THERE ARE REALLY, UH, THREE KINDS OF RULES. UH, THERE'S, UH, RULES THAT ARE, THERE'S, THERE'S SITUATIONS YOU SHOULD CAREFULLY CONSIDER. IT'S NOT A CONFLICT, IT'S NOT A VIOLATION, BUT SOMETHING YOU SHOULD CAREFULLY CONSIDER. THEN THERE ARE ALL THE TIME RULES IS THE WAY I THINK OF THEM. THERE'S NO IF TO IT, IT'S JUST ALL THE TIME. THIS IS GONNA BE THE RULE. AND THEN THERE ARE IF THEN RULES. SO WE'LL LOOK AT THOSE NOW KEY ALL THE TIME RULES. UH, YOU'VE ALL HEARD, I'M SURE OF FIDUCIARY DUTY. IT'S THE HIGHEST DUTY UNDER THE LAW. WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT A DOCTOR AND A PATIENT, A LAWYER AND A CLIENT, CERTAIN FINANCIAL RELATIONSHIPS, THAT FIDUCIARY DUTY IS THERE AND EVERYONE THAT SERVES AND WORKS AT THE CITY OF DALLAS OWES THAT LEVEL OF DUTY TO THE PEOPLE OF THE CITY OF DALLAS. SO, SO REMEMBER THAT THAT'S THE STAT STANDARD THAT WE'RE UNDER CIVILITY. WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? IT MEANS PLAY NICELY, UH, TREAT OTHER PEOPLE THE WAY YOU WANT TO BE TREATED. AND AS CITY OFFICIALS, THERE'S AN EXTRA BURDEN THAT THE CODE OF ETHICS PUTS UPON YOU WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH EMPLOYEES IN THE CITY. AND SO I'M GONNA TALK ABOUT THAT, UH, IN A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAIL. UM, HERE'S AN INTERESTING ONE, TOMA, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU HAVE TO PAY ATTENTION TO. AND I'M NOT HERE TO PRESENT ON THAT, BUT SOMETIMES EVEN IF IT'S NOT COVERED IN THE CODE OF ETHICS, UH, THERE'S A CATCHALL THAT IF THERE IS A RULE OR A LAW OR AN ORDINANCE THAT PERTAINS TO ETHICS, THEN IT IS COVERED UNDER THE JURISDICTION OF, OF WHAT THE OIG DOES. AND IT JUST SO HAPPENS THAT WOULD BE ONE OF THOSE AS AN EXAMPLE. SO IF, IF, IF, AGAIN, IF YOUR SPIDER SENSE STARTS GOING OFF, AND, AND I KNOW THAT'S NOT, UH, LEGALESE, UH, BUT YOU KNOW, WHEN YOUR GUT STARTS GOING OFF, WHEN SOMETHING NO LONGER PASSES THE SMELL TEST, THAT'S WHEN YOU NEED TO START THINKING ABOUT THE CODE AND GETTING OUT THAT POCKET REFERENCE GUIDE. AND THAT'S WHY I PUT THAT EXAMPLE IN THERE. HERE IS THE, THE WAY CIVILITY IS DEALT WITH IN THE CITY OF DALLAS WHEN IT COMES TO THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN CITY OFFICIALS AND EMPLOYEES. IT'S, IT'S AN UNEVEN RELATIONSHIP, AND WE ALL KNOW A LOT OF TIMES IN THE LAW. GO AHEAD. GOT A QUESTION, MR. QUINTON? YES. WHAT IS TOMA TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS AT? THANK YOU. WE WILL BE BRIEFED ON IT A LITTLE BIT LATER TODAY BY THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. YEAH, THANK YOU. YEAH, SO IT, IT'S JUST A GREAT EXAMPLE OF SOMETHING THAT'S NOT IN THE CODE EXPLICITLY, BUT, UH, IT MIGHT PERTAIN TO ETHICS IF IT'S VIOLENT, BUT THAT'S NOT WHY, WHY I'M HERE TODAY. NOW ON THIS, THERE IS AN ISSUE OF HOW CITY OFFICIALS AND EMPLOYEES, UH, SHOULD INTERACT. AND I SAY THERE'S AN ISSUE BECAUSE IT'S THE CITY COUNCIL HAS PUT IT IN THE CODE. THERE'S A POWER IMBALANCE WHEN, WHEN YOU OR OTHER CITY OFFICIALS TALK TO EMPLOYEES. AND SO AT SOME POINT, CITY COUNCIL DECIDED WE'RE GONNA STRUCTURE THAT RELATIONSHIP. IS THERE ANYTHING WRONG WITH CITY OFFICIALS AND EMPLOYEES TALKING TOGETHER ABOUT PROJECTS AND THOSE, NO. IT WOULD BE CRAZY IF YOU COULDN'T TALK TO EMPLOYEES AND, AND VICE VERSA. BUT SOMETIMES YOU HAVE CITY OFFICIALS THAT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THAT AND THEY ABUSE THAT, THAT THAT POWER DIFFERENTIAL. AND SO THERE ARE RULES. IT'S PRETTY SIMPLE. WHEN YOU WANT TO TALK TO AN EMPLOYEE, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO TALK TO TWO PEOPLE. FIRST ONE IS SOMEBODY WITH THE WORD CITY IN FRONT OF THEIR NAME, CITY MANAGER, AUDITOR ATTORNEY, INSPECTOR, GENERAL SECRETARY, AND THE SECOND PERSON IS THEIR DEPARTMENT DIRECTOR. THIS IS MY OPINION ABOUT WHY THEY MADE THIS RULE. IT'S SO THAT YOU'LL HAVE EYES IN HIGH PLACES. YOU, YOU'LL HAVE SOMEBODY ELSE IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT INTERACTION WITH THE SAME KIND OF GRAVITAS AS THE CITY OFFICIAL HAS TO MAKE SURE THAT THESE THINGS DON'T HAPPEN, THAT THE CITY COUNCIL PUT IN THE CODE TO MAKE SURE CITY OFFICIALS DON'T INTERFERE WITH EMPLOYEE'S WORK OR IMPAIR THE IMPLEMENTATION OF POLICY OR INFLUENCE A RECOMMENDATION OR INFLUENCE A DECISION THAT THE EMPLOYEE'S SUPPOSED TO MAKE OR CERTAINLY NOT TO BERATE THEM. SO HOW THAT PLAYS OUT, UH, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF ART TO IT, BUT YOU GET THE DRIFT. THE DRIFT IS YOU GET SOMEBODY ELSE TO MANAGE THAT INTERACTION SO THAT WE CAN AVOID WHAT'S HAPPENED IN THE PAST IS NOT SO GOOD. UH, OKAY, THE TWO STEP I'VE ALREADY DESCRIBED THAT THAT'S, UH, WHAT YOU DO IN ORDER TO GET HELP AND INFORMATION ABOUT PROJECTS IN VICO. SO I'LL GIVE, SO I'M, I'M SORRY. UH, I'M SO SORRY, MR. UH, CHAIRMAN. ONE SECOND. I WILL WAIT. THANK YOU. ONE SECOND. ONE QUESTION AND I'LL COME TO YOU IN A SECOND. MS. EVANS, UH, A PERFECT EXAMPLE OF THIS IS EMILY LIU, WHO JUST SPOKE WITH US, IS THE DEPARTMENT [02:00:01] DIRECTOR THAT IS CHARGED UNDER THE CITY MANAGER WITH THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AND SEVERAL OTHER THINGS. BUT SO EMILY LOU IS THE DIRECTOR THAT IS SPOKEN TO ON THIS SLIDE, JUST TO MAKE SURE WE KEEP THAT TIED TOGETHER. YES. MS. EVANS, I BELIEVE, UH, MR. CHAIRMAN, YOU ANSWERED MY QUESTION. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. GOOD. AND I, I'LL, I'LL EXTRAPOLATE JUST AN IOTA. I DON'T GO TO MS. LOU FOR EVERYTHING THAT THE BOARD NEEDS. SHE'D SAY IT'S A WASTE OF HER TIME. SHE DELEGATES THAT TO A DEPUTY DIRECTOR, TO AN ASSISTANT DIRECTOR TO SARAH MAY AS A MANAGER, TO THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR KAMIKA MILLER HOSKINS. AND ON A DAY-TO-DAY BASIS, IT'S THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR TALKING TO THE CHAIRMAN OR VICE VERSA AND THAT SORT OF THING. VERY FEW THINGS HAVE TO BE ELEVATED TO THE DIRECTOR. NOW I HAVE SPOKEN TO THE DIRECTOR ABOUT THESE PERMITTING CHALLENGES AND THOSE THINGS, UM, BUT AS A FUNCTIONAL STANDPOINT, UH, SO I JUST WANT TO TIE THAT TOGETHER. WE'RE PART OF MS. LOU'S ORGANIZATION. DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION FURTHER? OKAY, GO AHEAD, MR. SO THERE'S A COROLLARY TO IT, AND THIS HAS TO DO WITH WHAT HAPPENS WHEN CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS WANT TO INTERACT WITH CITY OFFICIALS. AND IT'S ALSO IN THE SAME PLACE IN THE, IN THE, UH, CODE OF ETHICS. BUT THERE'S SOME SHALL NOT. CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL NOT INFLUENCE YOUR DELIBERATIONS OR DEMAND YOU VOTE A CERTAIN WAY OR THREATEN YOU WITH REMOVAL IF YOU DON'T. BUT ON THE OTHER HAND, THERE'S A, THERE'S A FOOTNOTE. UH, IT DOESN'T PROHIBIT CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS FROM GETTING INFORMATION ABOUT THINGS OR PROVIDING INFORMATION OR WORKING TOGETHER WITH YOU OR EXPRESSING THEIR OPINIONS. THERE'S OBVIOUSLY A FINE LINE IN THERE. SO SEVERAL OF YOU THAT I'VE HAD ONE-ON-ONES WITH, AS YOU'VE COME ONTO THE BOARD, I'VE KIND OF GIVEN YOU A SHOCKING STATEMENT SAYING YOU REALLY SHOULDN'T HAVE CONVERSATIONS WITH YOUR COUNCIL MEMBER ANYMORE. AND SOME OF YOU HAVE LOOKED AT ME LIKE, WHAT? AND THAT'S BECAUSE OF THIS RIGHT HERE. YOU WANT TO BE VERY CAREFUL THAT PERCEPTION OF BEING INFLUENCED OR DIRECTED BY A COUNCIL MEMBER TO YOU IN A QUASI-JUDICIAL CAPACITY. NOW, NUMBER THREE TALKS ABOUT DOESN'T PROHIBIT CONVERSATION, BUT IT'S A VERY FINE LINE, MS. HAYDEN, UM, TO THIS, TO THAT POINT, WE HAD A COUNCIL PERSON THAT CAME BEFORE OUR BOARD AT ONE OF OUR, UM, MEETINGS, AND, YOU KNOW, HOW DO YOU DETERMINE IF, IF THIS PERSON IS USING THEIR POSITION TO INFLUENCE THE DELIBERATIONS OR IF THEY'RE SIMPLY EXPRESSING THEIR OPINIONS? I MEAN, I THINK IN THAT CASE, SHE WAS PROBABLY EXPRESSING HER OPINION, UM, WHICH IT SOUNDS LIKE IS OKAY. BUT IF IT GOT TO THE POINT WHERE WE FELT LIKE SHE WAS INFLUENCING THE DELIBERATIONS, THAT WOULD'VE BEEN A DIFFERENT STORY. IS THAT, IS THAT ACCURATE? SO THIS DID HAPPEN A MONTH AGO, AND IT WAS A LIVE ISSUE HERE. THE BOARD MADE A DECISION, THE CASE IS FINAL. IT WAS NOT APPEALED. SO IT CAN BE DISCUSSED. UM, AND IT WAS A UNCOMFORTABLE SITUATION. UM, AND THE COUNCIL MEMBER WAS HERE FOR THE WHOLE HEARING, WE'RE LIKE RIGHT THERE. AND THEN AT THE MICROPHONE. THAT IS VERY INTERESTING SITUATION. AND IT IS, THERE IS A BIT OF ART TO THIS. UM, IT GETS REALLY CLOSE TO THE LINE WHEN, UH, AND I'M GONNA GO OVER SOME, UH, THINGS THAT THE CODE REFERS TO AS THE PRESTIGE OF OFFICE THAT ARE GENERALLY PROHIBITED WHEN YOU'RE DEALING, WHEN YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT THINGS LIKE POLITICAL ACTIVITY OR REPRESENTATION, UH, WHICH IT SOUNDS LIKE THIS. IT'S TICKLING THAT. AND, UH, THE FACT THAT IT, YOU ARE TELLING ME IT WAS VERY UNCOMFORTABLE, THAT THAT IS JUST EXACTLY WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT WHEN I STARTED SAYING WHAT, WHAT YOU DEAL WITH HERE IS VERY IMPORTANT. AND WHEN YOU GET TO THE EDGE OF IT IN THE GRAY AREAS, A LOT OF YOUR GOOD WORK, UH, IT CAN BE HARMED BY THAT. SO WE HAVE TO BE VERY CAREFUL. I WILL TALK ABOUT WHAT YOU DO IF YOU FEEL LIKE SOMETHING HAS GONE WRONG AND BEEN VIOLATED, AND THEN IT, IT BECOMES VERY FACTUAL. SO, UM, I'LL MAKE ONE OTHER COMMENT, THEN I'LL LOOK AROUND FOR OTHER COMMENTS. UH, IN NO WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM DID THAT PARTICULAR PERSON, UM, I THINK CROSS THE LINE TO INTIMIDATE A VOTE OR A CONVERSATION. I THINK IT CAME RIGHT UP TO IT. UM, I WAS LEADING THE MEETING. I CHOSE NOT TO SAY ANYTHING OTHER THAN PLEASE RESPOND TO WHAT THE ATTORNEYS WERE SAYING AND MAKE YOUR COMMENTS TO THE PRESIDING OFFICER [02:05:02] IN ORDER TO KEEP IT CHANNELED. UM, I DON'T KNOW WHAT I WOULD'VE DONE IF IT WOULD'VE GOTTEN FARTHER. MAYBE I WOULD'VE RECESSED. I MEAN, WE ARE A BODY OF THE COUNCIL, AND SO WE ARE VERY SUBORDINATE THEREOF, EVEN THOUGH A JUDICIAL, THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED TO ME IN MY GRAY-HAIRED YEARS. AND, BUT I APPLAUD MS. HAYDEN FOR BRINGING THIS UP BECAUSE IT WAS A TENUOUS MOMENT THAT I, I HAD, I HAD MR. SLADE THEN MR. FINNEY, I'VE ALWAYS SORT OF THOUGHT OF THESE ETHICAL RULES AS WAYS TO ENCOURAGE SURFACING MATTERS THAT AREN'T SORT OF PUBLICLY AVAILABLE AS PART OF THE APPEARANCE OF IMPROPRIETY COMPONENT OF IT. AND SO I WOULD THINK IN THAT INSTANCE, IF THE COUNCIL MEMBER WERE OUT IN FRONT IN A PUBLIC SETTING OR OTHERWISE, THERE ISN'T. UM, THIS IS WHERE YOU GET INTO THAT THIRD POINT OF DOES NOT PROHIBIT EXPRESSING OPINIONS OR PROVIDING INFORMATION AS OPPOSED TO, WHAT I WOULD NATURALLY ASSUME IS THAT THE POSITION TO INFLUENCE TALKS ABOUT DOING THINGS BEHIND THE SCENES INSTEAD OF IN FRONTING IN FRONT OF THE DAIS AS IT AS IT WERE. AND JUST SORT OF HOW I SORT OF NAVIGATE THAT. I ALWAYS THINK OF THESE AS THINGS THAT, LIKE, WOULD I HAVE AN OBLIGATION AS A BOARD MEMBER TO RAISE IT TO EITHER THE CHAIR OR COUNSEL IF I WAS CONCERNED ABOUT SOMETHING CROSSING THE LINE? WELL, AGAIN, I DON'T THINK IT CROSSED THE LINE. NO, NO, I WAS JUST ONE OF FIVE IN THE ROOM. THE OTHER FOUR CAN SPEAK THEIR TERM. THIS IS ALL ABOUT TRAINING. WE'RE NOT POINTING F WE'RE NOT POINTING ANY FINGERS. UH, I DON'T THINK IT CROSSED THE LINE. IT FALLS IN NUMBER THREE, MAYBE MR. FINNEY. UM, SO I'M A LITTLE STILL A LITTLE CONFUSED ABOUT WHERE THAT LINE IS AND THE FACT THAT THERE IS EVEN A POSSIBILITY OF A LINE SPECIFICALLY WITH REGARDS TO THE SITUATION WITH A COUNCIL MEMBER. 'CAUSE ISN'T THE PURPOSE OF EXPRESSING YOUR OPINION TO SWAY THE OUTCOME OF THE RULING. SO I I CAN'T UNDERSTAND HOW THERE IS A LINE. WELL, TO MR. SLADE'S COMMENT, HE SAID THAT IF IT WAS IN A PUBLIC FORUM, THEN IT'S NOT BEHIND THE DOOR. IT'S IN A PUBLIC FORUM. AND THAT INDIVIDUAL, UM, DID SWEAR IN, I THINK WE DID MS. WILLIAMS. YES, WE SWORE IN LIKE, AND IT WAS A LITTLE STRANGE, BUT THAT'S OUR RULES. EVERYONE WHO SPEAKS GETS SWORN IN. AND WE CHANNELED IT WITH COMMENTS TO THE PRESIDING OFFICER, BUT IT STILL WAS RIGHT TO THE LINE. NOW, OTHER PEOPLE CAN COMMENT ABOUT IT. I WELCOME THAT. UM, THIS IS NOT, I'VE GOT YOU ON THE LIST, MR. SINGTON. UH, THIS IS NOT ABOUT DEMEANING ANYONE OR ANYTHING. THIS IS ABOUT LEARNING AND TRAINING. AND MR. ELIAS SAID, THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT. THIS IS THE MEAT THAT I WANT TO COME OUT OF THIS. I WANT MEMBERS TO SAY, WHAT ABOUT THIS MR. KOVICH, THEN MR. ASHTON? WELL, I WAS DIRECTLY INVOLVED IN THIS SITUATION BECAUSE I'M ON THE PANEL THAT WAS SITTING AND HEARING THAT. AND COUNCILWOMAN MENDELSSOHN IS WHO APPOINTED ME, AND IT WAS, I'LL SAY, IMPLIED BY THE APPLICANTS OR THE, UH, OPPOSING THE, THE, THE PARTY INVOLVED IN THE CASE THAT I MIGHT HAVE BEEN INFLUENCED OR SWAYED OR COORDINATED IN SOME WAY. MY VOTE. UM, MY, MY RESPONSE TO THAT, WHAT I DID, AND YOU CAN TELL ME IF I, THAT'S WHAT I SHOULD HAVE DONE OR WHAT I COULD HAVE DONE DIFFERENTLY, WAS TO BASICALLY SWEAR MYSELF IN AND CATEGORICALLY DENY ANY COORDINATION OR INFLUENCE INVOLVED IN HOW I WAS VOTING. OKAY? WOW. THERE'S A, THERE'S A LOT GOING ON. RESPOND BRIEFLY TO THAT, THEN I'M GONNA GO MR. SASHING AND MS. DAVIS. OKAY. SO, SO BRIEFLY SOME OF THE THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON AND, AND, UH, THERE'S A NOTE IN THE BOTTOM OF THIS PAGE HAS TO DO, AND IT SAYS, BIG FOOTNOTE, AND, UH, IT SAYS EX PARTE. AND THAT'S THE KIND OF THING THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. AND THERE IS A DIFFERENCE. AND THERE ARE SOME CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUES, FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUES OF FREE SPEECH THAT ARE IN PLAY. AND THAT'S WHY A LITTLE BIT LATER, UH, ALTHOUGH I CAN ADDRESS THEM, UM, NOW I MIGHT, MIGHT AS WELL, I, I USE THE TERM PRESTIGE OF OFFICE. UH, THAT'S, THAT'S LIKE, UH, HEY, I'M, I'M JUST MAKING THIS UP. SO DON'T, YOU KNOW, I'M COUNCIL MEMBER ELIASON, AND I'M HERE TO TELL YOU WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN. YOU KNOW, AT SOME POINT I'M USING THE PRESTIGE OF MY OFFICE, AND IT, IT'S AS OPPOSED TO, HELLO, I'M BAR ELIASON AND I LIVE AT 33 37 MILTON AVENUE. AND THIS IS, THIS IS WHAT I PERSONALLY THINK ABOUT THIS. AND SOMEWHERE IN BETWEEN, UH, AS OFTEN HAPPENS. AND THAT'S WHY YOU [02:10:01] NEED LAWYERS. UH, YOU, YOU FIND A GRAY SPOT, UM, IN TERMS OF WHAT, WHAT YOU MIGHT HAVE DONE IN THAT SITUATION. UH, ONE THING THAT'S VERY INTERESTING, AND I, ON ONE HAND, I MISS IT. ON THE OTHER HAND, I DON'T, UM, IF YOU EVER COME ACROSS A SITUATION LIKE THIS IN ADVANCE, AT LEAST, UH, WHAT YOU CAN DO IS YOU CAN ASK THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. NOW, YOU DIDN'T HAVE THE CHANCE AT THIS MEETING. I UNDERSTAND, UH, FOR AN ADVISORY OPINION. UH, WHAT I CAN GIVE YOU IS AN OPINION. WHEN WE WERE WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, I COULD GIVE YOU AN ADVISORY OPINION, YOU COULD TAKE IT TO THE BANK, BUT AT THIS POINT, IT'S JUST, IT WOULD JUST BE AN OPINION. BUT YOU WERE, YOU WERE IN A DIFFICULT SITUATION. I DO THINK IT'S ALWAYS APPROPRIATE WHEN YOU'RE IN A DIFFICULT SITUATION AND THERE'S NOT A RULE ON POINT. IT'S FAIR GAME TO DISCLOSE WHAT YOU NEED TO DISCLOSE AND LET A CHAIRMAN WALK THE GROUP THROUGH WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN. WHY? BECAUSE ETHICS MATTERS AND PEOPLE NEED TO SEE THAT WE'RE AT LEAST TRYING TO BE TRANSPARENT AND, AND DO WHAT'S RIGHT. UM, DOES THAT FINISH YOUR, YOUR STATEMENT COMING? OKAY, MR. SINGEN AND MS. DAVIS, UM, UNFORTUNATE SITUATION. I, I WOULD SAY, UM, IN THAT CASE, BUT TO WHAT'S BEEN SPOKEN, THE COUNCIL PERSON HAD EVERY RIGHT TO COME, RIGHT? THEY'RE A CITIZEN OF, OF, OF THE CITY. THEY HAD EVERY RIGHT TO COME AND BE AT THE PODIUM. UM, IT WASN'T DONE BEHIND, YOU KNOW, CLOSED DOORS IN SECRECY TO TRY TO PERSUADE ANYONE'S VOTE. SO DON'T REALLY HAVE AN ISSUE OF THAT. BUT WHAT WE CAN BE RESOLUTE IN IS THAT, UM, WE TAKE AN OATH, RIGHT? AND WE, WE WERE APPOINTED BY THE COUNCIL MEMBERS THAT APPOINTED US BECAUSE THEY TRUST YOU TO DO A JOB, WHETHER THEY'RE STANDING THERE OR WHETHER THEY'RE NOT RIGHT. THEY TRUST YOU TO, UH, MAKE DECISIONS BASED ON THE EVIDENCE AND THE INFORMATION THAT WE HAVE. AND IF WE HAVE QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS OF THAT, WE CAN ALWAYS LEAN ON CITY STAFF, ON THE LEGAL TEAM, ON THE, UM, ON, UH, DR. MILLER HOSKINS TEAM, UH, TO GUIDE US THROUGH THAT. BUT WE, WE CAN BE RESOLUTE IN THE FACT THAT WE CAN MAKE DECISIONS BASED ON THE GUIDANCE THAT WE GET FROM THE CHAIR AND FROM CITY STAFF, AND NOT BE INTIMIDATED BECAUSE A CITY COUNCIL PERSON IS THERE BECAUSE YOU WERE APPOINTED TO DO A PARTICULAR JOB IN THE SERVE IN A PARTICULAR CAPACITY. SO THAT'S, THAT'S MY COMMENT THERE. MS. DAVIS, I HAVE A COMMENT AND THEN A QUESTION ABOUT THAT SAME SITUATION, BECAUSE I WAS PART OF THE PANEL, AND I'M GONNA DISAGREE WITH A LOT OF MY COLLEAGUES. I, I, I DON'T KNOW IF IT CROSSED THE LINE, UM, BUT IT WAS REALLY, REALLY CLOSE, OR IT JUST DID A LITTLE BIT. AND THE REASON, UM, I I'M SAYING THIS IS BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, FOR MR. KOVICH TO HAVE TO DEFEND HIMSELF WITH HIS DECISION, BECAUSE SHE WAS THERE, PUT HIM IN A VERY DIFFICULT POSITION, I THINK THAT WOULD BE AN EXTREMELY DIFFICULT POSITION TO ANY MEMBER WHOSE, UM, WHO, YOU KNOW, WHOSE COUNSEL PERSON APPOINTED YOU TO GET THAT PRESSURE. NOT ONLY THAT, I MEAN, MY, I MY HUSBAND WORKS IN THE CITY, NOT FOR THE CITY, WITH THE CITY, AND IT, IT WAS A LITTLE, IT WAS VERY, VERY UNCOMFORTABLE. UM, THE OTHER THING THAT HAPPENED IN THAT MEETING WAS, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THIS DEALS WITH ETHICS OR LEGAL, BUT THERE WAS SORT OF A, AN INTIMATION THAT, UH, DEPENDING ON HOW OUR PANEL RULED, WE COULD GET SUED. SO THOSE TWO THINGS REALLY MADE IT FOR QUITE AN INTERESTING PANEL DISCUSSION. SO I GUESS MY QUESTION IS, IS THERE ANYBODY THAT, THAT REVIEWS THIS AFTERWARD TO LOOK AT, OKAY, THIS REALLY WASN'T THE WAY IT WAS SUPPOSED TO GO, AND LIKE, WHAT, WHAT HAPPENS AFTER THAT? BECAUSE WE WERE, WE ALL JUST SORT OF WERE LOOKING AT EACH OTHER WITH THESE TWO BIG THINGS THAT HAPPENED DURING THAT MEETING. AND, YOU KNOW, WHAT, DID ANYBODY TALK TO THE BUILDING OFFICIAL WHO INCLUDED THAT IN THEIR, UM, AND I'M SORRY, CHAIRMAN, I DON'T REMEMBER THE NAME OF THE REPORT, BUT IN THEIR SUMMARY OR WHAT, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT HAPPENS NOW AFTER THAT HAPPENED, WHEN TWO THINGS HAPPEN DURING THAT DISCUSSION TO MAKE THE PANEL MEMBERS FEEL VERY UNCOMFORTABLE, UH, I, I'LL MAKE THIS COMMENT TO THE BOARD, TO THE PUBLIC THAT'S WATCHING, AND I SAY THIS AT PANEL MEETINGS. THE BOARD DELIBERATES IN PUBLIC, THE BOARD DISCUSSES IN PUBLIC, WE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO GO TO THE BACK ROOM UNLESS WE CALL AN EXECUTIVE SESSION THAT HAS SPECIFIC LEGAL COMPONENT REQUIREMENTS. THEREFORE, HERE WE ARE DISCUSSING THIS IN PUBLIC. AND I WILL TELL YOU FOR ONE, I'M A LITTLE UNCOMFORTABLE, BUT GUYS, THIS IS WHAT I WANT. I WANT US TO HAVE HIM HERE NOT JUST TO DO POWERPOINTS, BUT TO DISCUSS THINGS. I WANT TO MAKE SURE WE KEEP THIS VERY PROFESSIONAL AND NOT ACCUSE NO ONE HAS YET NOT ACCUSATORY OF ANYONE. UM, SHE'S VERY CORRECT. THERE WAS A SECOND COMPONENT TO THAT MEETING, WHICH WE WERE APPALLED AT, THAT A CITY EMPLOYEE THREATENED THE BOARD, AND WE DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO HANDLE IT AND THREATENED THE BOARD IN WRITING. [02:15:02] AND WE WERE JUST DUMBFOUNDED TO THE EXTENT THAT I HAD TO HAVE THE BOARD ATTORNEY READ ON THE RECORD THAT WE ARE INDEMNIFIED BY THE CITY AS, UH, CITY OFFICIALS. SO I'M PIGGYBACKING, MS. DAVIS'S, I HAD FORGOTTEN ABOUT THAT ONE. WOO. THAT THAT ONE IS ALMOST AS BAD AS THE OTHER. SO WE'RE THROWING THIS OUT FOR US TO CONSUME. OKAY? SO THIS IS NOT IN THE PRESENTATION, BUT, UM, THERE IS A, THERE IS A PROCESS, UM, A LITTLE BIT CLOSER TO THE MICROPHONE, PLEASE. YEAH. I JUST DON'T WANT TO BLAST YOU. BUT, BUT THERE IS, UH, THERE IS A PROCESS FOR HOW THESE THINGS GO. UH, AND IT'S OUTLINED IN THE CODE OF ETHICS. IT'S TOWARDS THE END. IT'S NOT IN ONE, TWO, AND THREE OR SIX THAT I TOLD YOU TO LOOK, BUT WHEN YOU LOOK, I THINK IT'S AROUND 47, 48, 49, THOSE AREAS OF THE CODE, IT TALKS ABOUT, WELL, HOW DOES THIS WORK WHEN SOMETHING GOES WRONG? UH, SOME OF THE RULES THAT, AND THIS IS IN THE, IN THE PRESENTATION LATER, IF YOU KNOW THE CODE HAS BEEN, UH, VIOLATED IN SOME WAY, THAT'S NO, NOT THINK IF, YOU KNOW, WE ARE ALL OBLIGATED TO MAKE A REPORT, AND THERE'S A MECHANISM FOR THAT. IT, UH, IT'S CALLED THE WHISTLE. IT'S CONFIDENTIAL. WELL, NO ONE COULD SAY THEY KNEW YOU JUST NO, I KNOW. THINKING, OKAY. NO, I'M JUST, I'M GONNA OUTLINE THE WHOLE THING. OKAY. DON'T GO TO STERN DEEP DETAIL. I DON'T WANT TO CUT YOU OFF. SO, YEAH. OKAY. I'M JUST GOING STEM TO STERN. SO, UM, THAT'S HOW THE CODE WORKS. IF YOU THINK YOU, YOU COULD MAKE A REPORT OR NOT. ALSO, THE INSPECTOR GENERAL HAS THE AUTHORITY TO INITIATE THEIR OWN INVESTIGATION IF THEY WANT TO. ONCE THAT HAPPENS, UH, FOR, FOR REASONS OF REPUTATION AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS, IT IN A SENSE GOES DARK. IT BECOMES CONFIDENTIAL. INVESTIGATIONS ARE CONFIDENTIAL. SO IF YOU EVER, AS AN EXAMPLE, MAKE A COMPLAINT, THEN DON'T TURN AROUND AND EMAIL THE CHAIR OR ANYBODY ELSE, OH, I JUST MADE A COMPLAINT. OR AT THAT POINT, IT'S CONFIDENTIAL, AND WE ARE ALL BOUND BY THOSE RULES. THAT'S A GOOD THING WITH US BECAUSE, UH, REALLY IN A WAY THAT NO OTHER DEPARTMENT IN THE CITY HAS, WE CAN KEEP THE ALLEGATION SEPARATE UNTIL A THOROUGH, UM, LOOK INTO IT, YOU KNOW, GETTING DOCUMENTS, ALL THAT STUFF, REVIEWING VIDEO, WHATEVER IT IS HAS BEEN DONE TO EITHER SAY THERE WAS A VIOLATION OR TO CLEAR THE PERSON, UH, OR THERE WAS NO VIOLATION EITHER WAY. THAT'S, THAT'S HOW THE PROCESS WORKS. UH, SOMETIMES I'M AWARE, UH, SINCE I AM IN THIS ROLE, UM, AT LEAST FOR AN INTERIM BASIS, MAYBE AFTER TODAY, WHO KNOWS , BUT, UM, US TOO. . YEAH. YEAH. EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS, I'M JUST KIDDING. I'M JUST KIDDING AROUND. AND I SHOULDN'T DO THAT IN A PUBLIC MEETING, AS WAS I, BUT THAT'S THE REALITY IN A PUBLIC MEETING, I SHOULDN'T DO THAT. UM, DON'T, I'M NOT ALWAYS AWARE OF, OF EVERYTHING THAT'S HAPPENING. I WILL SAY THIS, I, UH, IF SOMETHING LIKE THAT IS EVER GOING ON, AGAIN, I DON'T CARRY THE WEIGHT OF THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, THE THINGS THAT I SAY YOU CAN'T TAKE TO THE BANK, LIKE, LIKE WHEN THEY SAY THINGS, HOWEVER, I DO KNOW THE CODE, AND IF SOMETHING'S GOING ON, UH, THE CHAIRMAN KNOWS HOW TO REACH ME AND CALL ME AND I'LL, I'LL COME DOWN AND, AND DO WHAT I CAN. WELL, I CHOSE NOT TO PURSUE IT. YEAH. ALTHOUGH SEVERAL OF MY PANEL MEMBERS ASKED ME, WHAT ARE YOU WE GONNA DO? UM, I'M VERY GLAD IT WAS ELEVATED, AND I'M NOT CUTTING OFF THIS DISCUSSION, BUT I'M GLAD IT WAS ELEVATED BECAUSE IT, IN BOTH OF THOSE INSTANCES, WE WERE PARALYZED AND THOUGHT, WHAT ARE WE SUPPOSED TO DO HERE? BUT WE CHARGED AHEAD. I THINK THE BOARD MADE A, UM, PROPER, UH, HAD CONDUCTED A PROPER HEARING AND STUCK KEPT TO THE FACTS, DELIBERATED IN PUBLIC, AND MADE A DECISION AND MOVED ON. WHAT ARE QUESTIONS DO WE HAVE BEFORE WE LET HIM CONTINUE? I'M NOT CUTTING HIM OFF. I'M JUST KEEPING US MOVING FORWARD. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. WE'LL, WE'LL KEEP GOING. UH, I DID SAY THERE WAS A COROLLARY, AND, AND THAT'S WHAT MR. SLAVE WAS TALKING ABOUT. AND IT'S EX PARTE, UH, DISCUSSIONS. AND IF YOU'RE NOT FAMILIAR WITH THAT TERM, WITH, WHAT THAT MEANS IN A NUTSHELL IS, UH, BECAUSE YOU ARE, REMEMBER WE SAID IT'S IMPORTANT. YOU'RE A QUASI-JUDICIAL BODY, AND THINGS COME BEFORE YOU FOR DECISIONS. THAT MEANS NO, NO CITY OFFICIAL OR EMPLOYEE SHOULD BE APPROACHING YOU INDIVIDUALLY TO TALK ABOUT THINGS THAT ARE, OR, AND I THINK IT'S, UH, I'M LOOKING AT THERESA OR REASONABLY MIGHT BE BEFORE THE BOARD. I THINK IT'S THAT. YEAH. SO IT'S BOTH OF THOSE. AND BY THE WAY, I'VE WORKED A LOT WITH THERESA, AND SHE'S THE BEST. YOU'RE LUCKY TO HAVE HER. UM, A LOT OF MY ADVISORY OPINIONS GOT A LOT BETTER THANKS TO HER, AND I APPRECIATE THAT. BUT AT ANY RATE, UM, YOU SHOULDN'T BE APPROACHED BY CITY EMPLOYEES OR OFFICIALS KIND OF OFF [02:20:01] TO THE SIDE. IF ANYBODY EVER TRIES TO DO THAT, THE RULE SAYS THEY GOTTA SIMULTANEOUSLY LET EVERYBODY ELSE KNOW. SO THAT'S EX THAT'S EX PARTE, WHICH IS DIFFERENT THAN WHAT YOU WERE DESCRIBING BEFORE. NOW, LET, LET'S KEEP THIS IN, IN, LET'S KEEP US GROUNDED HERE. CONVERSATIONS OCCUR ALL THE TIME. MM-HMM . ABOUT A CASE OR A SUBJECT. THE QUESTION IS WHETHER YOU GO INTO THE DETAILS OF THE CASE. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. I, I WILL TALK TO THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR ABOUT THE BANK OF CASES FOR NEXT MONTH, BUT I DON'T EVER GO INTO, OH, AND CASE NUMBER 1, 2, 3, 4 CAMIKA. I CAN'T BELIEVE THAT I, WE, I DON'T DO THAT. UH, SO I, THERE IS A NATURAL, BECAUSE ONE OF THE EXAMPLES I I'VE GIVEN TO SEVERAL NEW MEMBERS IS IF YOU RUN INTO SOMEONE AT A RESTAURANT AND ALL OF A SUDDEN THEY START TALKING ABOUT THE CASE, YOU NEED TO STOP THEM. SAY, WAIT A MINUTE, I CANNOT TALK ABOUT THE CASE. THAT SORT OF THING. UM, HE'S GONNA CLARIFY MY ANALOGY. OH MY GOSH. I'M JUST TRYING TO, I'M JUST TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DON'T GET PARALYZED BY INTERACTING WITH SOMEONE IF IT'S HIGH LEVEL INTERACTION AS OPPOSED TO QUESTIONS OR EDITORIAL ABOUT A PENDING OR CURRENT CASE. I THINK THAT'S FAIR. OKAY. I WILL SAY YOU, YOU CAN GET REALLY CLOSE TO THE LINE, AND YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT THAT. AND THERE IS AN, UH, MORE OR LESS AN EXCEPTION THAT SAYS THIS PROHIBITION DOES NOT APPLY TO ANY COMMUNICA. LET ME, LET ME BACK UP. NO PERSON SHALL DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY COMMUNICATE WITH ANY CITY OFFICIAL OF ANY. THAT'S YOU ALL REGARDING ANY ADJUDICATED MATTER, UH, OR ONE THAT MAY REASONABLY, UH, BE EXPECTED TO BE BEFORE THE BOARD, UNLESS A FULL DISCLOSURE IS MADE TO EVERYONE ELSE. AND THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO COMMUNICATION BY A CITY EMPLOYEE. THE WORDS MATTER WITH THE BOARD OR COMMISSION IN THE POOR, IN THE PERFORMANCE OF THE CITY. EMPLOYEE'S WORK. YOU KNOW? SO THERE'S THAT. AND JUST SAYING, UH, TALK. WELL, YOU DESCRIBED IT WELL. I DON'T NEED TO REPEAT WHAT YOU SAID, BUT, BUT IT IS SOMETHING TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT. JUST DON'T GET YOURSELF IN A POSITION WHERE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE DETAILS OF A CASE. YEAH. YEAH. AND IF YOU SOMEHOW GET SUCKED INTO IT, DISCLOSE IT AT THE BEGINNING OF THE HEARING, VERY CLEARLY IN THAT ONE CASE, MY WIFE AND I WERE AT FIRST WATCH, AND AN APPLICANT CAME UP TO ME AND SAID, THANK YOU SO MUCH, MR. NEWMAN, FOR CONSIDERING MY CASE. AND I TURNED WHITE THOUGHT, OH MY GOSH. AT THE BEGINNING, AT THE, WHEN THE, AND WE HELD THE CASE OVER, I WENT AT THE BEGINNING OF, OF THE, OF THE, THAT NEXT HEARING. I QUICKLY SAID, ON DATE X AT DATE TIME, THIS PERSON CAME UP TO ME. IT WAS INNOCENT. I IMMEDIATELY TOLD 'EM, WE CAN'T TALK ANY FURTHER. AND THEN I ASKED THE PANEL, IS THERE ANY CONCERN? AND NO ONE HAD A CONCERN. AND WE MOVED ON. SO THERE WAS DISCLOSURE. I DON'T THINK HE WAS TRYING TO, THIS PERSON WAS TRYING TO INFLUENCE ME. I THINK HE JUST WAS SINCERE SAYING, THANK YOU. NOW, IF I THOUGHT SOMEONE WAS TRYING TO INFLUENCE ME, IT'S A DIFFERENT ISSUE. SO, AND JUST BE ON YOUR GUARD IS WHAT HE'S SAYING. AND THERE IS A VECTOR TO THIS PROVISION. IT'S PEOPLE TALKING TO YOU. BUT IT, IT ALSO PRESSES WHEN, WHEN OTHER KINDS OF THE APPEARANCE OF IMPROPRIETY AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS WHEN YOU ARE, ARE REACHING OUT. IT'S SO THERE, THAT IS A DISTINGUISHMENT. WHERE'S THE, THE CONVERSATION COMING FROM? OKAY. UH, KEY ALL THE TIME. RULES, THINGS TO AVOID EX PARTE. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT. REPRESENTATION OF, OF PRIVATE INTERESTS. SO, UH, THERE ARE A LOT OF RULES ABOUT THIS. AND THIS IS, THIS IS WHERE IT MATTERS THAT YOU ARE QUASI-JUDICIAL. YOU'RE NOT ADVISORY. YOU ARE APPOINTED TO A BOARD. UH, BUT WHETHER YOU'RE, YOU'RE RECEIVING COMPENSATION OR NOT, YOU ARE A CITY OFFICIAL. AND THERE ARE RULES ABOUT REPRESENTATION. AND HONESTLY, OR FRANKLY, UM, I, I WILL GO THROUGH THEM IF, IF YOU WANT, BUT I, THIS IS AN AREA WHERE IF YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'RE REPRESENTING PRIVATE INTERESTS, YOU NEED TO GET AN ADVISORY OPINION. BECAUSE I'VE READ THIS RULE AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN, AND I'VE GONE OVER IT WITH THERESA AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN. AND, UH, I, I THINK IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF WORK TO GO THROUGH. IT'S NOT THE EASIEST RULE, UM, TO READ. BUT ONE OF THE OTHER PARTS, UH, THAT IS IN UNDER THAT RULE HAS TO DO WITH PRESTIGE OF OFFICE. SO IF YOU ARE REPRESENTING, OR EVEN SOUND LIKE YOU'RE REPRESENTING A PRIVATE INTEREST AND YOU'RE USING YOUR SIGNATURE LINE, OR YOU'RE SAYING, I'M A BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT MEMBER, SO-AND-SO, AND THOSE KINDS OF THINGS, YOU'RE NOT SPEAKING AS YOURSELF. THAT'S MY OPINION. THAT'S HOW I WOULD GO FORWARD IF A COMPLAINT WAS MADE ON SOMETHING LIKE THAT. SO REPRESENTATION IS THE UMBRELLA FOR CITY OFFICIALS AND EMPLOYEES. LOBBYING IS A FORM OF REPRESENTATION TO GIVE YOU SOME IDEA ABOUT THAT. BUT LOBBYING, YOU COULD BE A CITY OFFICIAL EMPLOYEE OR NOT. UM, BUT WATCH OUT FOR REPRESENTATION. SEEK AN ADVISORY OPINION. UM, AND FOR YOU, THERE'S [02:25:01] THE RULE. UH, BEFORE AS A, AS A CITY OFFICIAL ON A QUASI APPOINTED CITY OFFICIAL ON A QUASI-JUDICIAL BOARD, UM, FOR COMPENSATION OR NOT FOR COMPENSATION, THAT'S WHAT THIS ONE HAS APPLIED. YOU CAN'T SPEAK BEFORE THIS BODY. ITS STAFF OR THE BODY WITH APPELLATE JURISDICTION. THAT WOULD BE CITY COUNCIL FOR YOU. NO, THAT IS NOT, NOT, IT'S APPELLATE JURISDICTION IS A DISTRICT COURT. OH, MY APOLOGIES. OUR DECISIONS, APOLOGIES. OUR DECISIONS ARE ONLY APPEALABLE TO A STATE DISTRICT COURT. AH, I DID NOT KNOW THAT. SO THANK YOU. SO DON'T DO THAT. UH, COMPENSATION CHANGES THINGS, OKAY? UH, USE OF PRESTIGE. I'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT. NOW, KEY ALL THE TIME RULES. THIS IS THAT THIRD CATEGORY OF A RULE. UH, IF YOU BUMP INTO THIS, IT'S NOT A VIOLATION. IT'S NOT A CONFLICT THAT CAN GET YOU OUT OF SERVING ON, ON SOME ISSUE. BUT APPEARANCES MATTER IN THE CITY. AND NOTICE THIS, IT'S NOT JUST IN THE PROFESSIONAL PART, IT'S IN THE PERSONAL PART. SO, SO NOW YOU ARE ATTACHED TO THE CITY. WHAT YOU DO AFFECTS THE CITY'S REPUTATION. AND THE RULE IS YOU GOTTA CAREFULLY CONSIDER YOUR ACTIONS. OKAY? THAT DUCK IS THERE. 'CAUSE IT LOOKS LIKE A DUCK WHACK, QUACKS LIKE A DUCK WALKS LIKE A, IT'S A DUCK. OKAY? LIGHTNING ROUND. HERE'S SOME THINGS YOU NEED TO BE, UH, AWARE OF. SO YOUR SPIDER SENSE IS ACTIVE AND READY TO GO THE FIRST YEAR OF SERVICE. UH, SO FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO ARE NEW, IF YOU EVER COME UP IN A DEAL THAT YOU ARE WORKING ON, AND THAT WHOEVER'S ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT, UH, WAS, IS A FORMER EMPLOYER, YOU HAVE A RECUSAL SITUATION ON YOUR HANDS, SHOULDN'T BE WORKING ON THIS FOR THE FIRST 12 MONTHS. UH, IF YOU HAVE AN EXISTING INTEREST IN THE BUSINESS OR PROPERTY, OBVIOUSLY THAT IS GONNA BE AN ISSUE. IF YOU HAVE A, SOMETHING CALLED A SUBSTANTIAL INTEREST, WHICH BY THE WAY, UNDER THE CODE IS NOT VERY BIG. UH, SO FOR INSTANCE, A SUBSTANTIAL INTEREST IN PROPERTY IS $2,500. DOES ANYBODY, CAN ANYBODY KNOW ABOUT A PIECE OF PROPERTY YOU CAN BUY IN DALLAS FOR $2,500 ? YOU KNOW, SO IT, THE, IT'S LOW RECIPROCAL FAVORS. I'LL SCRATCH MY BACK. YOU SCRATCH YOURS. YOU KNOW THAT THAT ISN'T GONNA WORK. UH, YOU GOTTA WATCH OUT FOR YOUR RELATIVES AND BENEFITS TO RELATIVES THAT CAN COUNT. THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT SHOULD MAKE YOU ITCHY. UH, YOU WANNA BE INVOLVED IN POLITICS. WELL, THAT'S FINE, BUT THERE ARE RULES FOLLOW THEM. SOME OF THEM ARE IN THE CODE, SOME OF THEM ARE IN THE CHARTER, SOME OF 'EM ARE OUTSIDE THE CHARTER. IF SOMEONE EVER ASKS YOU TO BE THEIR CAMPAIGN TREASURER OR YOUR SPIDER SENSE SHOULD REALLY BE GOING OFF, UH, THAT'S PROBABLY A, A HARD NO. UH, OUTSIDE EMPLOYMENT, YOU'RE ALL EMPLOYED OUTSIDE THIS, UH, YOU HAVE TO BE CONCERNED WHEN THAT'S GONNA CREATE SOME KIND OF A CONFLICT FOR YOU BECAUSE OF WHAT, WHAT YOU'RE WORKING ON. NOW, THERE IS A RULE ABOUT SUBSTANTIAL INTEREST. THERE'S ALSO A RULE ABOUT ANY INTEREST FOR YOU SPECIFICALLY. IF SOMETHING COMES UP AND ON TO BEFORE YOUR BOARD AND YOU HAVE ANY INTEREST IN THAT PROPERTY, YOU CAN READ ABOUT THAT UNDER MISCELLANEOUS RULES. YOU'RE, YOU'RE LIKELY GONNA HAVE A RECUSAL SITUATION. MAKES SENSE? UM, THAT'S THE AREA OF NOTIFICATION AND PROPERTY INTEREST PART PRO TIP FOR Y'ALL. I NOTICED THAT, UM, THE CHAIRMAN SAID YOU HAD A 250 PAGE, UH, AGENDA TODAY. UH, THAT'S DAUNTING. BUT YOU NEED TO READ IT. AND I KNOW YOU DON'T HAVE MUCH TIME TO READ IT, BUT WHEN YOU'RE SITTING HERE OR, OR, OR IN YOUR OTHER MEETINGS, IF YOU HAVEN'T READ IT, YOU, YOU MIGHT JUST WALK RIGHT INTO A RECUSAL SITUATION THAT HAD YOU HAVE READ IT, YOU WOULD'VE KNOWN I CAN'T DO THAT. UH, SO THAT'S JUST A, A TIP FOR YOU. UM, ADVISORY OPINIONS, IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY ARE, UH, YOU MAKE A REQUEST IN WRITING TO THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, UH, IT HAS TO BE ABOUT FUTURE CONDUCT. IF YOU'VE ALREADY DONE IT, IT'S TOO LATE. UH, YOU GIVE 'EM ALL THE FACTS AND THEY WILL TELL YOU WHAT THE SAFE HARBOR IS, AND THEY'LL TELL YOU WHERE THE ROCKS ARE. IF YOU FOLLOW IT, YOU'LL BE FINE. OOPS, MY FINGERS. THERE WE GO. UH, NOW WHAT DO YOU DO IF YOU, IF YOU HAVE A CONFLICT, UH, LET'S JUST LET THIS ROLL OUT. THAT'S CALLED RECUSAL. FROM THE TIME YOU REALIZE YOU HAVE A, HAVE A CONFLICT. IT'S REALLY SIMPLE. IT'S, IT'S PENCILS DOWN WHERE PEOPLE MAKE A MISTAKE ON THIS. IS IT. THEY DON'T PUT THEIR PENCILS DOWN. THEY'VE BEEN WORKING ON IT. THEY WANT TO BE HELPFUL. THEY WANT TO, YOU KNOW, SO THEY START SUMMARIZING THEIR WORK. AND LET ME TELL THE NEXT PERSON THAT'S GONNA TAKE OVER WHAT I THINK AND ALL THIS STUFF. NOPE, IT'S PENCILS DOWN. YOU RAISE YOUR HAND. HOW DO YOU DO THAT? YOU TELL THE, UH, CITY SECRETARY, I'VE GOT A CONFLICT, I GOTTA RECUSE. AND YOU TELL YOUR BOARD. SO THAT'S HOW RECUSAL WORKS. LET'S, LET'S BE A LITTLE BIT MORE PRACTICAL, OKAY? IF A BOARD MEMBER, UH, WHICH GENERALLY DOES NOT KNOW ABOUT A CASE THEY'RE INVOLVED IN UNTIL SEVEN DAYS IN ADVANCE, SO I'M GONNA WALK THROUGH THIS. OUR BOARD SECRETARY SENDS THE DOCKET OUT SEVEN DAYS IN ADVANCE. YOU GET IT IN YOUR INBOX. THE BEST THING TO DO BOARD MEMBERS IS TO SCAN THE AGENDA, LOOK FOR ADDRESSES OR TOPICS ON THE AGENDA. I DIDN'T [02:30:01] SAY GO THROUGH THE WHOLE DOCKET, SCAN THE AGENDA FIRST TO SEE IF THERE IS A DEV, AN APPLICANT THAT YOU MAY OR MAY NOT KNOW A PROPERTY. YOU MAY OR MAY NOT KNOW A NEIGHBORHOOD THAT YOU MAY OR NOT NOT KNOW. THAT'S YOUR FIRST TEST. AND YOU REALLY NEED TO DO THAT AT DAY SEVEN OUT. UH, THEN IF THERE IS, OOH, I, THE SPIDER THING HE'S TALKING ABOUT, THEN YOU GO IN AND READ THE SPECIFICS OF IT. IN MOST CASES, IT'S NOT GONNA BE, BUT IT MAY BE. THE NEXT THING YOU NEED TO DO IS YOU NEED TO CONTACT EITHER MYSELF, YOUR PRESIDING OFFICER, OR THE, THE BOARD SECRETARY TO SAY, I THINK I MAY HAVE A CONFLICT. IF IT COMES TO ME, I'M GONNA QUALIFY IT QUICKLY. AND THEN I'M GONNA SAY, OKAY, TALK TO TERESA CARLA, OUR BOARD ATTORNEY, AND THEN SHE'LL HAVE A PRIVATE PRIVILEGED CONVERSATION WITH YOU ABOUT, AND SHE'LL ASK APPROPRIATE QUESTIONS. SHE MAY ELEVATE IT TO MR. ELIASON, OR SHE MAY SAY, NOPE, MR. MR. GRAHAM, YOU HAVE NO, NO CONFLICT. UM, OR YOU MAY, SO THAT, THAT'S WHAT'S IMPORTANT. I, I'VE GOT MR. I'VE GOT MR. MILLIKEN AND MR. SLADE. THAT'S WHAT'S IMPORTANT. REALLY, REALLY, REALLY, GUYS, THAT SEVEN DAY OUT, WHEN YOU GET YOUR AGENDA, SCAN THE AGENDA TO SEE IF, IF THE PROPERTY, IF THE APPLICANT HAS ANY, LIKE HIS SPIDER SENSE, BECAUSE THAT WAY WE CAN CATCH IT EARLY TO CATCH IT AT THE HEARING. WOO, YOU RISK SOMETHING THAT YOU'VE ALREADY HAD SOME CONVERSATION ABOUT IT THAT WOULD, THAT GETS IN A LOT OF ISSUES. MR. MILLIKEN. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. SO WE HEARD A CASE ON OUR PANEL WHERE, UM, I FELT THAT THERE MIGHT BE A CONFLICT OF INTEREST BECAUSE IT WAS A COMPETITOR. THAT, UH, CASE THAT WE WERE HEARING A COMPETITOR, AGAIN, FOR A COMPANY THAT I WORK WITH, AND I DID REACH OUT TO OUR, UH, VICE CHAIR AS TO WHETHER HE FELT IT WOULD BE A CONFLICT OF INTEREST OR NOT. MY QUESTION WOULD BE, IS THERE A PROPER CHANNEL? BECAUSE I DID THAT VIA TEXT. SO I DON'T KNOW IF IT HAS TO BE DONE A CERTAIN WAY OR NOT. IT'S INTERESTING THAT THE CODE OF ETHICS DOESN'T, AS I SAID, IT DOESN'T COVER EVERY ETHICAL SITUATION THAT MIGHT COME UP. IT DOESN'T, IT ALSO DOESN'T COVER EVERY SINGLE BIT OF HOW YOU MIGHT RESPOND. ALL IT REQUIRES IS THAT YOU WOULD, WELL, AND SEE YOU DIDN'T HAVE A CONFLICT. BUT IF YOU HAD A CONFLICT, IT REQUIRES YOU TO TELL THE CITY SECRETARY THERE IS A FORM FOR THAT TEXT WOULDN'T DO IT. AND TO INFORM THE BOARD, THERE'S NO DIRECTION. BUT, BUT I WANNA BE CAREFUL. NOT EVERY ISSUE HAS TO GO ALL THE WAY TO THE CITY SECRETARY RIGHT AWAY. YEAH. YEAH. LET ME, ONCE IT'S DETERMINED THAT THERE'S A CONFLICT, THEN YOU FILE IT WITH THE CITY SECRETARY. CORRECT. SO THERE'S A, SO THE, TO, TO COMPLETE THE ANSWER, THAT'S EXACTLY CORRECT. WHEN YOU HAVE A CONFLICT, THEN THERE'S THAT OTHER ONE, THE SLIDE WITH THE DUCK ON IT. AND THAT'S THAT THIRD CATEGORY OF, OF A RULE WHERE YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO CAREFULLY CONSIDER WHAT'S GOING ON. THERE'S NOTHING, IF YOU WERE TO READ THE CODE OR SEEK AN ADVISORY OPINION, YOU'RE NOT GONNA FIND A PROVISION IN THERE THAT SAYS, OH, HE'S A, HE'S A BUSINESS COMPETITOR OF YOURS. YOU, YOU CAN'T DO THIS. AND THERE'S GOOD REASON FOR THAT. WE WANT YOU TO BE ABLE TO MAKE DECISIONS FOR THINGS AND NOT BE ABLE TO RECUSE. AND THIS IS MAYBE MORE FOR CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, BUT JUST IN GENERAL, EVERY TIME AN ISSUE IS CONTROVERSIAL IN SOME WAY, OH, I, I CAN'T BE IN IT. I KNOW THE, I KNOW THE PERSON ON THE OTHER SIDE. WE WANT YOU TO DO YOUR WORK. BUT THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING WHERE YOU CAREFULLY CONSIDER IT AND YOU SAY, WELL, IT JUST DOESN'T LOOK, IT DOESN'T FEEL RIGHT. AND SO IN THAT CASE, MAYBE YOU MAKE A DISCLOSURE BY TEXT TO THE CHAIRMAN, YOU WORK IT OUT IN ADVANCE. WELL, WHAT I WOULD IMMEDIATELY DO IS TRY TO QUALIFY VERY BRIEFLY, AND THEN I WOULD PROBABLY CALL THE BOARD ATTORNEY. UH, AND SO I GOT HER AND I'D SAY, THERESA, UH, RODNEY MILLIKEN HAS THIS SITUATION, THAT SITUATION. AND I WOULD ZAP YOU BOTH SAY, OKAY, WOULD YOU PLEASE GET AHOLD OF HIM? RODNEY GET AHOLD OF HER. AND THEN I BACK AWAY AND I DON'T, AND NOT INVOLVED AGAIN. 'CAUSE THAT'S NOT MY PLAY. MY JOB AS A BOARD OFFICER IS GET YOU AS A BOARD MEMBER TO THE BOARD ATTORNEY, THEN SHE'S GONNA MAKE A DECISION. SHE'S GONNA MAKE A RECOMMENDATION. SHE DOESN'T MAKE A DECISION. YOU HAVE TO MAKE THE DECISION. SHE'S GONNA MAKE A RECOMMENDATION. YOU KNOW, YOU PROBABLY NEED TO TALK TO ELIASON OR DON'T WORRY ABOUT THAT. UH, SHE'LL, THAT'S THE GENERAL FEEDBACK. AM I CORRECT, MS. BOARD ATTORNEY IN THE, IN OUR PROCESS? YES, THAT IS CORRECT. I WILL, YOU CAN COME WITH ME WITH ANY CONFLICT QUESTION AND I WILL HAPPY TO ASSIST YOU EVEN IF IT'S THE DAY OF THE HEARING, BECAUSE THE CODE SAYS WHEN THE CONFLICT IS RECOGNIZED, AND SOMETIMES IF YOU'RE FLIPPING THROUGH OR SOMEONE'S HERE SPEAKING ON BEHALF AND YOU REALIZE YOU MAY HAVE A RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM, IT'S WHEN THE CONFLICT IS RECOGNIZED. SO THEN WE CAN HAVE THAT CONVERSATION OFFLINE. MR. SLATE, THAT IS A GREAT SEGUE BECAUSE I WAS, MY QUESTION CONCERNS, HOW [02:35:01] DO YOU NAVIGATE THE TENSION BETWEEN DOING DILIGENCE TO DETERMINE WHETHER A CONFLICT EXISTS AND THE RESTRICTION WE HAVE THAT MEMBERS MAY NOT DO THEIR OWN INDEPENDENT RESEARCH ON A CASE? YEAH, SO IT'S EXACTLY LIKE WHAT SHE SAID. THAT THE WAY THE CODE DEALS WITH THAT, IT'S, IT'S AT THE MOMENT OF, OF RECOGNITION AND THERE'S NOT A RULE. UH, AND MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU, YOU WANT TO CONSIDER, YOU KNOW, PUTTING IN THE BOARD RULES AT SOME POINT TO SAY A BOARD MEMBER WILL DO A CERTAIN CONTROL LEFT, CHECK FOR THEIR PERSONAL ADDRESSES OR WHATEVER, BUT I DON'T KNOW. THAT'S NOT MY BUSINESS. BUT THE, THE CODE SAYS THAT THE MOMENT YOU RECOGNIZE IT, AND I THINK THE CHAIRPERSON CHAIRMAN IS SAYING IT'S REALLY GOOD PRACTICE TO RECOGNIZE IT SEVEN DAYS BEFORE AS OPPOSED TO WHEN YOU'RE SITTING HERE. AND I APPRECIATE THAT. BUT TO BUILD ON IT, IF WE HAVE AN APPLICANT WHO IS AN ENTITY, USUALLY IT'S A SINGLE PURPOSE ENTITY. USUALLY IT MIGHT NOT BE CLEAR WHO IS BEHIND OR OWNS OR IS PURSUING SOMETHING. UM, SO TO, TO, UH, TAKE THE EXAMPLE THAT MR. MILLIKEN WAS RAISING, IF IT HADN'T BEEN CLEAR THAT THE COMPANY LOOKING FOR RELIEF FROM THE BOARD WAS A COMPETITOR OF HIS EMPLOYER, IF IT WAS JUST A GENERIC GROUP THAT WAS LOOKING FOR A PARKING REDUCTION, HOW WOULD YOU GUIDE US ON WHAT WE SHOULD DO, IF ANYTHING, TO TRY TO RECOGNIZE THAT IN SUFFICIENT TIME TO AFFORD, UM, THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND BOARD SECRETARY TO BE ABLE TO COME UP POTENTIALLY WITH AN ALTERNATE TO SERVE IN THAT CAPACITY? BECAUSE I THINK THAT IS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT'S DRIVING, IS THAT OUR DESIRE TO SUPPORT THE PUBLIC BY MAKING SURE WE HAVE FULL PANELS TO BE ABLE TO HEAR AND ADJUDICATE ACTIONS. THERE'S, THERE, I THINK THERE'S A POINT OF DIMINISHING RETURNS IN THE AMOUNT OF RESEARCH YOU MIGHT DO WITH, WITH A 250 PAGE AGENDA EVERY TIME YOU'RE COMING UP HERE. AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT THERE'S NOT AN ANSWER TO THAT IN THE CODE, IT'S JUST HOW FAR CAN YOU GO? BUT THE CONTROL F LET NO, WE'RE NOT GONNA DO THAT. LET'S GO BACK TO MS UH, CARLISLE'S COMMENT. THERESA, YOU SAID AS, AS SOON AS IT'S RECOGNIZED, WOULD YOU REPEAT THAT? 'CAUSE THAT I THINK IS WHAT'S KEY. YES. THE CODE SAYS AS SOON AS THE CONFLICT IS RECOGNIZED, YOU WOULD HAVE TO DISCLOSE AND RECUSE YOURSELF IF YOU HAVE A CONFLICT. SO MY ENCOURAGEMENT IS, LOOK, SEVEN DAYS OUT, MR. SLADE'S ANALOGY IS YOU MAY NOT EVEN SEE IT UNTIL THE PERSON'S IN FRONT OF YOU. WELL, WHEN YOU SEE IT, THEN YOU RECOGNIZE IT. TELL YOUR PRESIDING OFFICER AND YOUR BOARD ATTORNEY AND LET THEM FIGURE THAT OUT. NO ONE, I'LL GET YOU ONE SECOND, AMY. NO ONE'S GONNA PERSECUTE YOU. I'LL PICK ON YOU MS. GARNER, BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T CATCH IT IF IT WASN'T VISIBLE. THAT'S, I MEAN, BACK TO TERESA'S MS. THE BOARD ATTORNEY'S STANDARD AS SOON AS IT'S REC RECOGNIZED, CORRECT? YES, THAT IS CORRECT. MS. EVANS, THANK YOU SO MUCH, MR. CHAIRMAN. SO I HAVE A FEELING YOU TWO ARE GONNA BE VERY IMPORTANT PEOPLE IN OUR LIVES. WOULD YOU MIND SHARING YOUR CONTACT INFO RIGHT NOW SO WE CAN GET YOU ON SPEED DIAL? IT'S ON THE SLIDE DECK COMING UP ON SLIDE DECK. OKAY, PERFECT. THANK YOU. APOLOGIZE, BUT THANK YOU. SURE. AND, AND HONESTLY, THE, THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE MORE IMPORTANT THAN ME. WHAT, WHAT THEY SAY IS GONNA BE SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU CAN TAKE TO THE BANK. SO THERE'S THAT. I I WILL SAY IT'S INTERESTING IF YOU'RE CONCERNED ABOUT, WELL, WHAT HA I'M GONNA VIOLATE THE CODE AND, AND THIS GUY IS GONNA FILE A COMPLAINT OR HE IS GONNA RECEIVE A COMPLAINT AND COME AT ME. THERE'S A STANDARD IN THE CODE, A MENS REA STANDARD OF KNOWINGLY. AND, UH, WHAT WE'RE DESCRIBING HERE IS A SITUATION WHERE YOU, LET ME READ THE DEFINITION. IT'S IN THE DEFINITION OF THE CODE TOWARDS THE END, UM, WHERE YOUR CONDUCT OR CIRCUMSTANCE, CIRCUMSTANCES SURROUNDING YOUR CONDUCT ARE INVOLVED. IT'S KNOWING WHEN THE PERSON YOU IN THIS EXAMPLE IS AWARE OF THE NATURE OF THE CONDUCT WHERE YOU'RE NOT, 'CAUSE YOU'RE NOT AWARE OF THIS OR THAT THE CIRCUMSTANCES EXIST OR SHOULD BE REASONABLY CERTAIN TO CAUSE THE RESULT. WELL, WELL, YOU'RE NOT, BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT AWARE THAT SOMEWHERE UP IN THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE, IT SAYS JOHN DOE IS IN THIS COMPANY AND, AND HE'S YOUR BUSINESS PARTNER AND SOME OTHER BUSINESS, YOU KNOW, BUT IT'S A FAIR QUESTION. OKAY, KEEP GOING. CONFLICT. SO WE JUST FINISHED THAT. DR. GLOVER HAS A QUESTION, UH, JUST A QUICK ONE. SO IN A CASE WHERE YOU FEEL THERE'S A VIOLATION AND THE CITY ATTORNEY DOES NOT AGREE WITH YOU, HOW DO YOU PROCEED? THAT'S REALLY INTERESTING. THERE IS A PROVISION, AND IT'S NOT IN THE CODE, BUT IT, IT'S IN, UH, CHAPTER EIGHT AND I BELIEVE IT'S 26, 27, AND 28. AND IT HAS TO DO WITH, WHEN YOU GET AN OPINION ABOUT THE LAW FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, UNLESS YOU CAN HOLD UP A, A, LIKE A SUPREME [02:40:01] COURT CASE OR SOME KIND OF STATUTE THAT SAYS NO CITY ATTORNEY, YOU'RE WRONG. YOU, YOU FOLLOW THEIR ADVICE, YOU'LL FIND THAT IN 8 26, 27 AND 28. SO THAT'S HOW YOU DEAL WITH THAT. BUT THAT HAS SOME TEETH TO IT. SO, YOU KNOW, MAKE SURE YOU'VE GOT A CASE BEFORE YOU START GOING AGAINST THEIR ADVICE. IT'S A GREAT QUESTION. UH, MY ANSWER ALSO, EMMANUEL, UH, MS. DR. GLOVER, IS IT'S YOUR DECISION IN THE END, IT'S YOUR DECISION END WHETHER YOU HAVE A CONFLICT. I'M WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO THE BOARD ATTORNEY AND THE INSPECTOR GENERAL, YOUR DECISION, THEY'RE RECOMMENDING, THEY'RE GIVING YOU ADVICE. YOU'RE THE ONE THAT'S ON THE FIRING LINE ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. , THEY WILL BE CAUTIOUS, I PROMISE YOU. PROBABLY TOO CAUTIOUS, BUT, OKAY, UH, OTHER THINGS, I'VE TOUCHED ON THIS, BUT WHEN THERE IS A VIOLATION AND THERE'S A COMPLAINT AND AN INVESTIGATION BEGINS, THEN RULES THAT THAT LEAD TO AN INVESTIGATION BEING DONE IN THE RIGHT WAY COME INTO EFFECT. AND THAT'S WHAT'S ON THE SCREEN. IF YOU'RE EVER CALLED, IT'S PROBABLY 'CAUSE YOU'RE A WITNESS. WE, WE MOST PEOPLE THAT GET CALLED IS 'CAUSE THEY'RE A WITNESS. YOU, YOU HAVE, YOU, YOU HAVE TO COOPERATE. UM, MAINTAIN CONFIDENTIALITY. INVESTIGATIONS ARE A SECRET. I'LL THE NEXT SLIDE I'LL EXPLAIN WHY. UH, IF YOU EVER GIVE A A SWORN STATEMENT, YOU'LL, YOU'LL TELL THE TRUTH WHETHER IT'S SWORN OR NOT. BUT THERE'S CONSEQUENCES, YOU KNOW, TO PEOPLE. YOU CAN HELP OTHER PEOPLE. IF, IF, UH, YOU HEAR 'EM THINKING, WELL, MAYBE I CAN BE CUTE WITH THIS. TELL 'EM NO, YOU CAN'T, DON'T INTERFERE. DON'T RETALIATE UNDER THE CODE. RETALIATION MEANS SOMEBODY IS STANDING UP AND FOLLOWING THE CODE AND I DON'T LIKE IT. SO NOW I'M GONNA PUT SOME CONSEQUENCES ON THEM FOR FOLLOWING THE CODE. THAT'S RETALIATION UNDER THE CODE. THERE'S OBVIOUSLY OTHER TYPES OF RETALIATION. UH, THIS SLIDE, WHY REPORT TO THE IG AS ONE OF MY FAVORITES. THAT'S MY DOG, FRITZ. HE WAS BLAMED FOR DIGGING UP THAT GARDEN. AND GUESS WHAT? IT WASN'T FRITZ, IT WAS MY NEIGHBOR'S DOG, CARL. THAT'S AN EXAMPLE OF WHY YOU WANT TO USE THE WHISTLE HOTLINE. UH, IF THERE'S GOTTA BE AN INVESTIGATION, IT'S GOTTA BE ON THE DOWN LOW UNTIL WE FOUND OUT WHO REALLY DID IT OR REPUTATIONS CAN BE LOST ZONING DECISIONS, ALL KINDS OF THINGS CAN HAPPEN THAT SHOULDN'T HAPPEN. SO USE THE WHISTLE HOTLINE. UM, FOR YOU NEW MEMBERS PARTICULARLY, I'M UNDER AN OBLIGATION TO PROVIDE YOU WITH A COPY OR A LINK TO THE CODE. I'M DOING THAT RIGHT NOW. I'M TELLING YOU TO GO TO THE WEBSITE FOR THE INSPECTOR GENERAL DIVISION. THERE'S A LINK TO THE CODE THERE. YOU ALSO HAVE THE POCKET REFERENCE GUIDE. AND THERE'S MY EMAIL IF YOU EVER NEED TO CONTACT ME, AND I'M HAPPY TO GIVE YOU MY PHONE NUMBER, JUST NOT IN A PUBLIC HEARING. AGREED , UH, YOU'VE PROVIDED BONUS SLIDES. I'M NOT GONNA HAVE YOU GO OVER THEM. NO. 'CAUSE WE'RE ABOUT TO TAKE A RECESS, A BATHROOM RECESS. WHAT OTHER QUESTIONS DO YOU, DOES ANYONE HAVE FOR THE INSPECTOR GENERAL? THIS HAS BEEN VERY GOOD. OH, I'M GLAD. THANK YOU. THAT MAKES ME FEEL GOOD. AND, AND YOU CAN, HE'S, I'M GONNA MAKE HIM AVAILABLE AS WE RECESS HERE FOR A FEW MINUTES. UM, QUESTIONS. THE BONUS SLIDES ARE IMPACTFUL AS WELL THAT YOU'LL SEE. UM, AGAIN, MY RECOMMENDATION IS IF YOU SEE THAT THERE'S A PERCEIVED OR ACTUAL CONFIDENCE OF INTEREST, UH, BRING IT TO THE ATTENTION OF YOUR PANEL PRESIDING OFFICER OR MYSELF AS CHAIRMAN. AND I WILL IMMEDIATELY LINK TO OUR BOARD ATTORNEY AND SHE WILL LINK WITH YOU AND, OR CONNECT BACK WITH THE INSPECTOR GENERAL'S OFFICE FOR FURTHER INTERPRETATION. UH, AND THEN I WILL AGAIN, STEP OUT OF IT BECAUSE THAT'S NOT MY ISSUE, IT'S YOURS. BUT I WANT TO GET YOU TO THE DECISION MAKE TO THE PEOPLE WITH THEY CAN GIVE YOU GOOD SOUND ADVICE QUESTIONS. ALRIGHT. UH, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WOULD YOU HANG FOR A LITTLE BIT? SO IF MEMBERS WANNA ASK YOU A QUESTION, IT IS 11:43 AM ON THE 28TH OF OCTOBER. WE'RE GONNA GO TO RECESS FOR 10 MINUTES TILL 1155, AND THEN WE'RE GONNA COME AND START ON PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT. WE'RE IN RECESS UNTIL 1155. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, BARON. VERY GOOD, MARY. OKAY. UH, IT IS 11:55 AM ON TUESDAY, THE 28TH OF OCTOBER, THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT RESUMES SESSION. UH, THE NEXT COMPONENT OF OUR AGENDA IS, UH, BOARD TRAINING, PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT. DR. KAMIKA MILLER HOSKINS, BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND CHIEF PLANNER. I'M GONNA ASK HER TO DO TEAM INTRODUCTIONS, THEN. SHE'S ASKED FOR US TO DO LITTLE REARRANGING OF THE HER PRESENTATIONS. SO I'LL TURN IT OVER TO THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. GOOD MORNING. AGAIN, MY NAME IS DR. CAMIKA MILLER HOSKINS, AND I AM THE CHIEF PLANNER BOARD ADMINISTRATOR FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. AT THIS TIME, I WILL INTRODUCE BOARD STAFF, STARTING WITH OUR [02:45:01] SENIOR PLANNERS. MR. THOMPSON, PLEASE STAND. UM, WE HAVE ANOTHER SENIOR PLANNER, MS. QUA DUNN, PLEASE STAND OUR PROJECT COORDINATOR. MS. DIANA BARQUE, PLEASE STAND. AND, UM, WE HAVE ONE SENIOR PLANNER EXAMINER, MS. TARA IBAR, WHO'S ABSENT TODAY. UM, AND OF COURSE OUR BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, MS. MARY WILLIAMS. AT THIS TIME, I WILL, UM, HAVE MS. JENNIFER ALGAR COME FORWARD TO DO THE PRESENTATION ON ZONING CHANGES FROM STATE LAW. UM, STATE BILL EIGHT 40 AND SB 15. SO WE'RE GONNA MOVE TO PAGE ONE 19 IN THE DOCKET. OH, SHE'S NOT HERE. WELL, SHE BETTER SHOW UP QUICK. I'M SORRY. UM, MS. SARAH MAY IS ALSO, UM, MY BOSS. YEAH. UM, PLANNING MANAGER FOR DEVELOPMENT PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT. DID WE, WE MOVED JENNIFER UP AND THEN SHE DISAPPEARED. OKAY. WE'LL HOLD FOR A SECOND. UNCOMFORTABLE MOMENT. YEAH, SHE DID. HMM. WHAT PAGE? ONE 19 . ALRIGHT, UH, MS. BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, WOULD YOU AGAIN INTRODUCE OUR NEXT SPEAKER? OUR NEXT SPEAKER? OUR NEXT SPEAKER WILL BE MS. JENNIFER AGAR DOING, UM, THE PRESENTATION ON ZONING CHANGES FROM STATE LAW SBA 40 AND SB 15. GOOD MORNING. HOW ARE YOU? GOOD MORNING. HOW ARE YOU? I'M GOOD. OKAY. SO, AS I SAY TO EVERY ONE OF OUR LUCKY SPEAKERS, I'M LOOKING AT YOUR POWERPOINT HERE. HOLD ON A SECOND. UM, FLIPPING THE PAGES HERE. ALRIGHT. PLEASE, PLEASE DO NOT READ EVERY SLIDE OR EVERY WORD ON EVERY SLIDE. UM, BECAUSE WHAT I WANT TO ENGENDER IS THINGS THAT YOU SAY THAT DRAW QUESTIONS WITHOUT GOING THROUGH EVERY PAGE, I WANT YOU TO GO THROUGH EVERY PAGE, BANANA, EVERY LINE. HOW'S THAT? AND WE'RE AT ONE 19 IN THE DECK. DO YOU NEED TO SHARE YOUR SLIDE DECK? I'M, I'M GONNA GO AHEAD AND SHARE MY SCREEN. PERFECT. UM, THE POWERPOINT THAT WAS PROVIDED IN THE DOCKET FOR TODAY, UM, WAS ACTUALLY THE POWERPOINT, EXCUSE ME, THE POWERPOINT, UM, FROM OUR CPC BRIEFING THAT WAS HELD AUGUST 7TH. UM, I'VE MADE A FEW CHANGES TO THAT TO TAKE OUT SOME OF THE BILLS WE'RE NOT GONNA DISCUSS. AND THEN ALSO, UH, TO PROVIDE SOME ADDITIONAL, UM, EXHIBITS. IF YOU ARE INTERESTED AT ALL IN RPS, WE CAN HAVE RPS FUN AT THE END. OKAY, GOOD. THANK YOU. AND JUST FOR EVERYONE'S EDIFICATION, WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO IS WE'RE GONNA, AS MUCH AS WE CAN, POWER THROUGH, UM, THESE PRESENTATIONS THAT IS, UM, ZONING CHANGES FROM STATE LAW, PARKING CODE, UPDATE IN DALLAS ZONING REFORM, UH, AND OR MEMBER ORIENTATION, THEN GO TO LUNCH. BUT IT ALL DEPENDS ON TIME. I'M NOT GONNA STARVE YOU, BUT I'M GONNA DRIVE THROUGH THIS. WHAT WE WON'T GET TO BEFORE LUNCH IS THE CITY ATTORNEY, THE BOARD ATTORNEY'S COMPONENTS OF THE AGENDA. THAT WILL DEFINITELY BE AFTER LUNCH, JUST TELLING THAT TO EMERITUS OVER THERE WHO'S, OKAY. SO PROCEED PLEASE CERTAIN. UM, BUT PLEASE, GENTLEMEN, PLAN TO JOIN US FOR LUNCH. OKAY. UH, MY NAME IS JENNIFER ALLGEIER. I'M ONE OF THE ZONING DIVISION MANAGERS, UM, WITH PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT. UM, SARAH MAY, AS YOU ARE AWARE, UM, HAS OVERSIGHT OVER BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT TEAM AND A COUPLE OF OTHER TEAMS. UH, THE TEAMS THAT I OVERSEE CII WANNA SAY THIS PURPOSELY BECAUSE I KNOW, UM, IT'S A STICKING POINT FOR PROCESS, UM, AND QUALITY CONTROL IMPROVEMENTS. UM, ONE OF THE TEAMS THAT I OVERSEE IS THE ZONING COMMERCIAL PLAN REVIEW TEAM AT THE PERMIT OFFICE. UM, ALSO SUBDIVISION. AND THEN WE HAVE A SPECIAL ZONING PROJECTS TEAM THAT DOES SORT OF A VARIETY OF ZONING ACTIVITY, INCLUDING ZONING CASES, UH, MINOR AMENDMENTS AND DEVELOPMENT PLANS. UM, A LOT OF RANDOM THINGS. UM, WHEN THIS, UH, [02:50:01] POWERPOINT WAS INITIALLY PRESENTED AT, UH, PLAN COMMISSION, MY COLLEAGUE MICHAEL PEPPY WAS A CO-AUTHOR AND CO-PRESENTER. SO HIS NAME IS STILL ON THE POWERPOINT. UM, ALTHOUGH I WILL GO AHEAD AND, AND PRESENT THE PORTION THAT HE PRESENTED AT THAT TIME REGARDING SB 15. SO THERE, THANK YOU. UH, THERE WERE A NUMBER OF, OF, UH, IMPORTANT BILLS PASSED AT THE 89TH LEGISLATURE. UM, TWO HAVING THE MOST IMPACT, UM, FOR OUR PARTICULAR DIVISION. UM, OUR SB 15 AND SB EIGHT 40, WHICH DEAL WITH, UH, SMALL LOT SINGLE FAMILY DEVELOPMENT AND MULTIFAMILY AND MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL USES AND DEVELOPMENTS IN NEW LOCATIONS AND WITH NEW DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS. SO THOSE ARE THE ONES THAT I'LL BE BRIEFING ON TODAY. UM, THE FIRST ONE IS RELATED TO SMALL LOT SINGLE FAMILY. AND JUST TO PROVIDE A DEFINITION THAT I DON'T THINK IS SPECIFICALLY CALLED OUT IN THE POWERPOINT, A SMALL LOT UNDER THE STATE BILL IS DEFINED BASICALLY AS SOMETHING THAT IS LESS THAN 4,000 SQUARE FEET. UM, AND FOR PRACTICAL PURPOSES, UM, IN, IN DALLAS THAT'S GONNA MEAN A LOT. THAT'S BETWEEN THREE AND 4,000 SQUARE FEET. THAT'S SPECIFICALLY HOW YOU DEFINE SOMETHING AS A SMALL LOT THAT WOULD BE ELIGIBLE FOR THE REVISED DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS THAT WE SEE IN THE BILL. UM, WE'VE HAD A, A NUMBER OF PROJECTS COME IN FOR SCREENING, UM, PRE-APPLICATION SCREENING TO SEE IF THEY WOULD BE ELIGIBLE UNDER THE BILL. UM, AND HAVE LEARNED KIND OF SOME THINGS ALONG THE WAY. SO, FOR EXAMPLE, IF YOU HAVE A, UM, A FIVE ACRE, UH, PARCEL OF LAND THAT IT'S, SAY EXISTING ZONING IS R 10 A, TYPICALLY YOU WOULD BE REQUIRED TO HAVE 10,000 SQUARE FOOT LOT MINIMUM UNDER THE BILL. YOU COULD GO AS SMALL AS 3000 SQUARE FEET AND UP TO 4,000 SQUARE FEET WITH THE REVISED DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS THAT ARE SHOWN IN THE POWERPOINT, UH, IN A COUPLE OF SLIDES. BUT YOU CAN ALSO BUILD, UM, IN THAT SAME DEVELOPMENT, THE BILL AUTHORIZES THE DEVELOPER TO INCLUDE LOTS THAT ARE ANYWHERE BETWEEN THAT 3000 AND 10,000 MINIMUM THAT WOULD BE REQUIRED UNDER THE, THE TYPICAL OR THE CURRENT ZONING OF THE PROPERTY. SO IT'S NOT JUST A THREE TO 4,000 SQUARE FOOT LOT. AND THEN OTHERWISE YOU HAVE TO APPLY WITH THE STANDARDS OF THE, OF THE, THE ZONING DISTRICT. IT CAN BE ANYWHERE IN BETWEEN. SO KIND OF A BIG PICTURE HERE. UM, SOME, SOME BASIC THINGS IS THAT THE, THE TRACT OR THE PARCEL OF LAND HAS TO BE AT LEAST FIVE ACRES, HAS TO BE UN PLATTED. AND THERE ARE SOME EXCLUSIONS. UM, THESE, THESE EXCLUSIONS HAVE BEEN HELPFULLY, UH, PLACED ONTO OUR, UH, OUR ZONING MAP, OUR GIS MAP THAT'S AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC AND TO INTERNAL STAFF. SO FOR EXAMPLE, YOU SEE HERE, WHO'S RESPONSIBLE FOR MAINTAINING THAT GIS MAP OR THAT ZONING MAP? YOU SPEAK OF OUR GIS TEAM. OKAY. AND, ALRIGHT. WHICH IS WITHIN OUR DEPARTMENT. THAT'S WHAT I WAS GONNA ASK. YES. SO PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE GIS ACCURACY. YES. WE HAD ISSUES MONTHS AGO WITH THE, WHETHER OR NOT THAT WAS UPDATED CONCURRENTLY OR UPDATED ON A REGULAR ENOUGH BASIS TO BE ABLE TO BE RELIED UPON. YEAH, THERE ARE, THERE'S DEFINITELY, UM, THERE'S DEFINITELY A DELAY BETWEEN A ZONING CHANGE ON A PROPERTY, SOME SORT OF ZONING ACTION ON A PROPERTY DEPENDING ON THE SIZE OF THE AREA THAT IS INCLUDED IN THAT CHANGE. UM, AND I THINK DIRECTOR LOU MENTIONED EARLIER TODAY AN ISSUE WHERE PRIOR TO OUR DEPARTMENT JOINING, YES, THERE WAS THE ISSUE. SO I'M NOT GOING TO DIG ON THAT. I JUST WANT TO, IT'S WITH G GISS WITHIN PLANNING DEVELOPMENT AND, AND YOU UNDERSTAND THE URGENCY OF AS CONTEMPORANEOUSLY UPDATED AS POSSIBLE. I, I WILL PASS THAT ALONG TO DEPUTY DIRECTOR ANDREA GILLIS, WHO I'M SURE IS LISTENING IN TODAY, THAT IS, UH, UNDER HER PURVIEW. SO SOME EXAMPLES, LIKE I SAID, 3000 WITHIN 3000 FEET OF AIRPORTS. THOSE ARE THE PINK AREAS THAT YOU SEE HERE. AND THEN WITHIN A MILE OF POLICE TRAINING FACILITIES, THOSE WOULD BE THE ORANGE. THERE'S SOME OTHER EXCEPTIONS THAT APPLY TO THE OTHER BILL THAT WE'RE GONNA DISCUSS TODAY. THOSE ARE ALSO MAPPED ON THE GIS MAP FOR ANYONE TO KIND OF DO A QUICK SCREENING OF ELIGIBILITY. UM, OBVIOUSLY IT HAS TO PERMIT SINGLE FAMILY. WE ALREADY SAID THE SIZE AND THAT IT CAN'T BE PLATTED. UM, AND THEN [02:55:01] THE DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS CHANGE FOR THOSE SMALL LOTS THAT ARE, LIKE I SAID, BETWEEN THREE AND 4,000 SQUARE FEET, UM, 30 FEET WIDE BY 75 FEET DEEP, UM, WOULD BE, UM, LOT SIZE CHANGES. AND THEN THERE ARE ALSO SOME MODIFIED DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS WITH RESPECT TO SETBACKS. UM, WE DO HAVE SOME CASES WHERE THE SB 15 SETBACKS WILL APPLY FOR A PORTION OF THE PROPERTY AND THEN THE LESS RESTRICTIVE EXISTING ZONING WOULD APPLY TO A SETBACK ON ANOTHER PORTION OF THE PROPERTY. SO IT CAN BE A MIX AND MATCH. AND WHAT ABOUT THE WHOLE, WHICHEVER IS LESS RESTRICTED. WHAT ABOUT THE WHOLE ISSUE OF BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY? DOES THIS TRUMP BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY? UM, YES, IT WOULD TRUMP BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY. WHY? DOES EVERYONE UNDERSTAND WHAT I REFER TO WHEN I THAT? YEAH, WHICH MEANS I'LL COME TO YOU A SECOND, MR. QUINN, WHICH MEANS YOU'RE GONNA HAVE THIS, UH, POSSIBLY EXCEPT THAT REMEMBER THESE HAVE TO BE FIVE ACRE TRACKS. OKAY. SO IT'S, IT'S ON THE, THE SCALE OF A, OF AN ENTIRE SUBDIVISION. OKAY. MR. QUINN, IS THERE AN FAR RESTRICTION ON THESE SMALL LOTS? UH, NOT DIRECTLY. UM, OUR, OUR, OUR EXISTING CODE DOESN'T HAVE AN FAR RESTRICTING FOR SINGLE FAMILY. AND THIS DOESN'T DIRECTLY HAVE ONE EITHER. UM, F-A-F-A-R FLOOR AREA RATIO. UM, THERE'S NOT REALLY ANY SORT OF BULK RESTRICTIONS WHICH AN FAR WOULD BE DIRECTLY GETTING AT THE BULK OF THE BUILDING. UM, ONE THING THAT'S INTERESTING THAT WE, THAT IS PARTICULARLY INTERESTING IN TERMS OF, UH, APPLYING THIS IN DALLAS IS THE SECOND BULLET POINT THAT YOU SEE ON THIS SLIDE. UM, THE CITY CANNOT REQUIRE MORE THAN 30% OPEN SPACE OR PERMEABLE SURFACE. SO WE ARE INTERPRETING THAT, UM, ON A PRACTICAL A, UH, APPLICABILITY. BASICALLY WE WILL USE THAT EXACT LANGUAGE WHEN A DEVELOPER COMES IN, UM, TO DEVELOP ONE OF THESE SMALL LOT DEVELOPMENTS THAT ARE FIVE ACRES OR MORE. UM, BASICALLY THEY'LL BE REQUIRED TO HAVE 30% OF EACH LOT THAT IS AT LEAST PERMEABLE, UM, AND OPEN SPACE. OTHER THAN THAT, THEY CAN PUT A BUILDING, THEY CAN PUT PAVING, THEY CAN PUT WHATEVER THEY WANT IN THAT OTHER PORTION. MR. FINNEY THEN MS. EVANS, MR. FINNEY, UM, SO BACK TO THE BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY COMMENT. UM, SO IN A, THE SPECIFIC SITUATION OF A, OF A KEY LOT WHERE YOU HAVE THE LOTS AT THE END OF A BLOCK ORIENTED PERPENDICULAR TO THE REST OF THE BLOCK, UH, WOULD THE, UH, ON THE CORNER LOTS, WOULD THE FRONT YARD SETBACK OF THE REST OF THE BLOCK APPLY? OR WOULD THE, THIS SIDE YARD SETBACK OF, UM, FIVE FEET APPLY? IT? IT DEPENDS ON WHETHER THAT SIDE YARD IS ACTING AS A FRONT YARD. SO WE DID HAVE A DEVELOPMENT COME IN RECENTLY WHERE THERE WERE A HANDFUL OF LOTS IN THE DEVELOPMENT THAT HAD THAT CORNER LOT SITUATION. AND BECAUSE OF THE WAY THAT THEY HAD CONFIGURED ADJACENT LOTS ON THE SAME BLOCK FACE, THAT SIDE YARD WAS GONNA END UP BEING A 15 FOOT SETBACK. WHEREAS IF THEY REORIENTED, UM, IF THEY REORIENTED THE REMAINDER OF THE LOTS ON THAT SAME BLOCK FACE, THEN THEY COULD, UH, USE THE FIVE FOOT SETBACK. SO IN THAT SENSE, BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY WITHIN ITSELF STILL APPLIES. OKAY. SO WITHIN THAT DEVELOPMENT, BUT IF YOU HAPPEN TO BE ADJACENT TO AN R SEVEN FIVE A DEVELOPMENT, YOU DON'T SUDDENLY HAVE TO HAVE A 25 FOOT SETBACK FOR ONE OF THESE SUBDIVISIONS. GREAT, THANK YOU. YES, MS. EVANS. THANK YOU MR. CHAIRMAN. SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THE FIVE ACRE TRACKS. COULD WE JUST ELABORATE ON WHAT DEFINES THAT AND HOW THAT'S DEFINED? THE, THE, THE, IS IT A NEIGHBORHOOD THAT CONSISTS OF A FIVE ACRE TRACT OR DOES THAT HAVE TO, HOW, HOW DO YOU FIND THAT? IT IS A FIVE ACRE? UM, AN AN A A PORTION OF PROPERTY OR PROPERTY THAT HAS AN AREA OF AT LEAST FIVE ACRES, REGARDLESS OF WHERE IT'S LOCATED WITH THE EXCEPTION, IT, IT HAS TO BE A LOCATION THAT ALLOWS THE SINGLE FAMILY USE. SO IF YOU COULD FIND A FIVE ACRE UN PLATTED, UH, TRACT OF LAND IN THE MIDDLE OF AN R SEVEN FIVE A DISTRICT, THEN YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO COME IN WITH ONE OF THESE SMALL LOT DEVELOPMENTS. UM, KEYWORD THERE WAS UNPLANTED WITHOUT A CURRENT PLANT? THAT'S CORRECT. [03:00:01] OKAY. GOT YOU. OKAY. THANK YOU SO MUCH. YES MA'AM. DR. GLOVER, MY ISSUE IS ABOUT, UH, INFORMATION, ESPECIALLY WITH NSOS. UH, WE'VE SEEN AND HAD CASES WHERE THEY HAVE BEEN NSOS IN SOME AREAS, UH, NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION OVERLAYS IN AREAS, AND IT HAS NOT BEEN COMMUNICATED TO THE BOARD. WHOSE RESPONSIBILITY IS IT TO UPDATE THE DOCKETS TO PROVIDE US THIS INFORMATION SO WE CAN HAVE FULL OVERVIEW OF WHAT THE SITUATION IS? I'M NOT SURE I'M FOLLOWING THE QUESTION TO UPDATE THE DOCKET. SO BEFORE THE DOCKET IS PRESENTED, UM, INFORMATION IS GATHERED ABOUT THE CASE AND IN CERTAIN CASES THAT HAVE BEEN NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION OVERLAYS TO PROTECT THE CHARACTER OF THE AREA, BUT IT HAS NOT BEEN ADDED TO THE DOCKET WHEN IT WAS PRESENTED. SUPPORT ADMINISTRATOR? I CAN, SO I THINK HE MAY BE REFERENCING, UM, IN THE PAST, UM, SAY FOR INSTANCE, UM, A PROPERTY IS LOCATED WITH, YOU KNOW, IN A PROPERTY WHERE THERE'S AN NSO OR LOCATED WITHIN A PD, OUR STAFF GENERALLY JUST REFERENCE THE NSO OR REFERENCE THE PD WITHOUT ACTUALLY ADDING THE ENTIRE DOCUMENT. THAT INCLUDES, UM, SPECIFIC DETAILS ABOUT THAT PARTICULAR NSO OR PD. UM, WE DON'T DO THAT TYPICALLY BECAUSE IT'S, THEY'RE LARGE DOCUMENTS, RIGHT. THAT'S INCLUDED. BUT, UM, IN COMMUNICATION WITH, UM, MR. CHAIRMAN GOING FORWARD, UM, YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S A CASE, THEN WE'LL PROVIDE LIKE A SNIPPET. GOTCHA. WE STILL WON'T PROVIDE THE ENTIRE DOCUMENT BECAUSE IT'S JUST GONNA MAKE THE DOCKET ITSELF LARGER. OKAY. SO, AND I, I APOLOGIZE, I WASN'T QUITE UNDERSTANDING. I, I WILL, UM, DEFER TO DR COM, UH, DR. MILLER HOSKINS ON ANYTHING SORT OF PROCEDURE WISE WITH RESPECT TO THE BOARD CASES THAT IS, UH, NOT AN AREA THAT I AM, YOU KNOW, INTIMATELY INVOLVED WITH FOR CERTAINLY THERE TO PROVIDE INFORMATION AND SUPPORT TO THOSE PLANNERS IF NEEDED. I WOULD SAY, UM, LET ME JUST SAY THIS ON THE RECORD AND TAKE IT FOR WHAT IT IS IN A ZONING CASE, UM, UH, WE DON'T NECESSARILY, UH, INCLUDE THE ENTIRE ORDINANCE OR ANY OVERLAYS AS PART OF THE DOCKET, BUT WE DO PROVIDE A LINK TO THAT ORDINANCE OR OVERLAY ON THE FRONT PAGE OF A STAFF REPORT. SO, I MEAN, THAT WOULD BE ONE WAY TO GET IT IN THERE AND PROVIDE QUICK ACCESS FOR REFERENCE IF THERE WAS A LINK DIRECTLY TO IT. YES. AND, UM, AT SOME POINT BEFORE THE END OF THIS YEAR, OR, UM, BEGINNING IN JANUARY, WE'RE GONNA START USING REGISTRAR. IS THAT CORRECT? DID I SAY THAT CORRECTLY? AND SO THAT WAY LINKS ARE EMBEDDED IN THAT DOCUMENT, SO OKAY. THE LINK WILL BE THERE. YES, SIR. GOTCHA. UM, MOVING RIGHT ALONG. UM, WE STILL CAN REGULATE CERTAIN THINGS THAT WE HAVE ALWAYS REGULATED. IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY, THE BILL DOESN'T NECESSARILY PRECLUDE US FROM REGULATING, UM, THE ITEMS YOU SEE HERE. ONE THING OF NOTE, UM, WITH RESPECT TO DRIVEWAY SHARING WITH ANOTHER LOT, UM, THE BILL, UM, DOES SPECIFY THAT CITIES CAN REQUIRE SHARED DRIVEWAYS, UM, IN THESE SMALL LOT DEVELOPMENTS. WE IN DALLAS DO NOT CURRENTLY HAVE ANY MECHANISM IN OUR CODE THAT WOULD ALLOW US TO REQUIRE THAT. WE DON'T, I MEAN, BASICALLY THERE'S, LIKE I SAID, THERE'S NOT A CURRENT REQUIREMENT TO DO THAT. I BELIEVE THOUGH, THAT THERE ARE SOME DESIGN STANDARDS UNDER DISCUSSION, UM, YOU KNOW, TO HELP SPECIFICALLY WITH THESE SMALLER LOT DEVELOPMENTS, UM, TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE GETTING GOOD URBAN DESIGN WHEN THE DEVELOPMENT COMES IN. BECAUSE AS YOU NOTED, IT CAN HAPPEN IN THE MIDDLE OF AN EXISTING, UH, NEIGHBORHOOD OR ANYWHERE ELSE THAT WOULD ALLOW SINGLE FAMILY. SO WE, WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT IT'S GONNA BE GOOD DESIGN COMING IN. UM, I'M KIND OF JUST GONNA ROLL THROUGH THE MAP ON THIS ONE. UM, BASICALLY IT'S, IT'S JUST KIND OF GIVING SOME GENERAL INFORMATION ABOUT WHERE THIS MIGHT BE APPLICABLE, BUT I WILL CAUTION YOU ON THIS MAP. UM, IT INCLUDES, UM, PARK LAND AND ALL SORTS OF OTHER PROPERTY THAT ISN'T ACTUALLY DEVELOPABLE. THIS IS A PRETTY OLD SLIDE, SO EXCUSE ME. UM, AND WITH THAT, ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS GENERALLY ABOUT SB 15 BEFORE I GO ONTO THE NEXT BILL [03:05:02] . OKAY. UM, SO SB EIGHT 40 IS, UH, ONE THAT I'VE BEEN VERY INVOLVED IN. UM, WE HAVE A ESTABLISHED A, A PROCESS FOR PRE-APPLICATION SCREENING. UM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I KNOW THE BOARD IS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT IS MAKING SURE THAT, UH, CONSISTENT AND ACCURATE INFORMATION IS PROVIDED TO DEVELOPERS AND ALSO TO REVIEW STAFF. UM, AND SO GIVEN THE COMPLEXITY OF THIS PARTICULAR BILL AND EVEN, UM, STATE BILL 15, WE HAVE A PRE-APPLICATION SCREENING PROCESS SO THAT WE CAN MEET WITH DEVELOPERS PRIOR TO GOING TO PERMITTING. AND THEN WE HAVE ONGOING TRAINING, UM, FOR OUR REVIEW STAFF AND SUBDIVISION STAFF. THIS BILL PARTICULARLY DEALS WITH, UM, THREE MAIN THINGS. UM, ONE UNI MUNICIPALITIES, FOR EXAMPLE, THE SIZE OF DALLAS, UM, UH, MUST ALLOW MULTIFAMILY AND MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT PROJECTS IN ADDITIONAL ZONING CLASSIFICATIONS. AND THAT MEANS PLACES WHERE IT'S NOT CURRENTLY ALLOWED. SO RETAIL DISTRICTS, OFFICE DISTRICTS, THINGS LIKE THAT. UM, IT ALSO LIMITS THE CITY'S AUTHORITY TO REGULATE CERTAIN ASPECTS RELATED TO THESE DEVELOPMENTS. AND THAT'S REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THE MULTI-FAMILY IS ALLOWED UNDER THE EXISTING ZONING OR IF THE MULTIFAMILY IS ALLOWED BASED ON SB EIGHT 40. AND THEN THERE'S A THIRD PART, UM, THAT WE HAVEN'T SEEN AS MUCH TRACTION ON YET, BUT I, I, I THINK WILL COME SOON THERE. UH, IT STREAMLINES THE PROCESS FOR CONVERTING CERTAIN EXISTING OFFICE BUILDINGS AND WAREHOUSE BUILDINGS FOR USE AS MULTIFAMILY OR MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL. UM, THE ONLY THING I'LL SAY ABOUT THIS SLIDE, UM, THE BILL SPECIFICALLY SAYS THAT THE CITY CAN STILL REGULATE CERTAIN THINGS, BUT THE SECOND BULLET HERE, THE MIXED INCOME HOUSING DEVELOPMENT BONUS PROGRAM, WE TECHNICALLY CAN STILL, UM, WE CAN STILL RUN THAT PROGRAM, BUT I WILL SAY THAT MANY OF THE BONUSES THAT DEVELOPERS WOULD TYPICALLY USE THE, UH, MIXED INCOME HOUSING DEVELOPMENT BONUS PROGRAM FOR, UM, ARE ACTUALLY TAKEN CARE OF AND PROVIDED FOR THEM THROUGH SB EIGHT 40. SO WE'VE SEEN A BIT OF AN EXODUS OF PROJECTS THAT WOULD TYPICALLY GO AND USE THIS PROGRAM. THEY MIGHT GO BECAUSE THEY NEED ADDITIONAL HEIGHT OR THEY NEED ADDITIONAL DENSITY, THINGS LIKE THAT. UM, BECAUSE SB EIGHT 40 APPLIES, UM, TO SO MANY PLACES, WE'VE SEEN A NUMBER OF DEVELOPERS WITHDRAWING PROJECTS SO THAT THEY CAN RESUBMIT THEM UNDER SB EIGHT 40. YEAH. SO ONE SECOND. YES, MR. SLATE HAS A QUESTION. I HAVE A QUESTION. UM, THAT'S MORE OF KIND OF A THOUGHT EXPERIMENT FOR US TO MAYBE DISCUSS LATER AND IS NOT DIRECTED HERE. OUR STANDARDS FOR THE VARIANCE TALK ABOUT THAT WE CAN'T DEVELOP, YOU HAVE TO, IT HAS TO BE NECESSARY TO PERMIT DEVELOPMENT OF A SPECIFIC PARCEL OF LAND THAT CANNOT BE DEVELOPED IN A MATTER COMMENSURATE WITH THE DEVELOPMENT UPON OTHER PARCELS OF LAND WITH THE SAME ZONING DISTRICT. YES, SAME ZONING DISTRICT. DISTRICT. THEN I THINK WE NEED TO UPDATE OUR, UM, LANGUAGE AND OUR STANDARDS FOR REVIEW AND OUR DOCKETS. BUT PUTTING THAT ASIDE WITHIN THE SAME ZONING DISTRICT, I'M CURIOUS AS TO THINK ABOUT HOW THIS, THESE EXTENSIONS OF CERTAIN TYPE OF ZONING APPLICATIONS ARE GOING TO IMPACT THAT IN TERMS OF WHETHER WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE THINKING THROUGH RESTRICTIONS IN TERMS OF THE WAY A PARTICULAR DEVELOPER IS COMING AND ASKING FOR RELIEF VERSUS WHAT COULD BE DONE ON THE PARCEL DEPENDING ON HOW THESE APPLY. WELL, I THINK THE LONG OF, THE SHORT OF BOTH THE, UM, THE, THE SMALL LOT SB 15 AND NOW SB EIGHT 40 IS THERE'S A NEW LEVEL OF PROPERTY RIGHTS, INHERIT PROPERTY RIGHTS CREATED BY THE STATE, AND IT IMP IT INCREASED THE PROPERTY RIGHTS. YOU KNOW, SOMEONE COMES TO US TO ASK FOR A VARIANCE OF SPECIAL EXCEPTION OR OTHERWISE, WELL, A LOT OF THAT WON'T, THAT REQUEST MAY NOT COME BECAUSE THEY JUST GOT ENHANCED PROPERTY RIGHTS. SO THE, THE PRESUMPTION IS THAT PROFESSIONAL STAFF LEGAL AND PLANNING DEVELOPMENT WILL HAVE TO BETTER QUALIFY THAT APPLICATION AS IT COMES THROUGH. AND IN MANY CASES, IT'LL BE, YOU DON'T NEED TO APPLY. YOU ALREADY HAVE THAT NEW PROPERTY. RIGHT. UM, AND SO I THINK THAT IS WHAT THE, THE KEY THING'S GONNA BE IS TO MAKE SURE THAT THE STAFF IS SUFFICIENTLY FORTIFIED TO ACKNOWLEDGE THOSE NEW PROPERTY RIGHTS, UH, GIVEN PROPERTY RIGHTS. UM, DOES THAT ANSWER YOUR [03:10:01] QUESTION? I'M, IT DOES. I'M JUST CONTEMPLATING A SITUATION WHERE AN APPLICANT IS COMING TO US WANTING TO DO ONE THING IN PARTICULAR, AND OUR STANDARD IS GOING TO BE, WELL, IF YOU COULD DO IT IN THIS OTHER WAY WITH THESE ADDITIONAL RIGHTS YOU NOW HAVE, CAN YOU NOT SATISFY THAT PARTICULAR ELEMENT OF YOUR CLAIM? BECAUSE YOU COULD DEVELOP IN A MATTER COMMISERATE WITH OTHER PROPERTY OWNERS IN THE DISTRICT, JUST IN A WAY MAYBE THAT IS DIFFERENT THAN WHAT YOU WANT. SO I'LL SET THIS UP FOR THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. I WOULD PRESUME THE STAFF ON A REGULAR BASIS DOES THAT EXACT PROCESS BY, IT SAYS, OKAY, JENNIFER WANTS, I'M NOT PICKING ON YOU. JENNIFER WANTS TO DO THIS. AND YOU CAN MAY FILE A CASE FOR THAT, BUT WAIT A MINUTE, IF YOU ADJUST YOUR REQUEST THIS WAY, YOU CAN DO IT BY, RIGHT. IS THAT NOT SOMETHING THAT YOUR TEAM DOES ON A REGULAR BASIS? CORRECT. IT IS. I'M SORRY. CORRECT. IT IS. SO THAT'S THE HOPE IS THAT THEY FIGURE OUT THIS NEW ENHANCED PROPERTY RIGHTS, WHICH I'M NOT OPINING ON. I THINK IT'S CRAZY, BUT OKAY. IT'S THE LAW NOW. UM, I, I WOULD, I WOULD AGREE WITH DR. MILLER HOSKINS. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT THEIR, THEIR STAFF REGULARLY GOES THROUGH THAT EXERCISE PRIOR TO BRINGING IT. THIS WAS, NOW IT'S A VERY FINE LINE BECAUSE WE, THE BOARD DOES NOT EVER WANT AN APPLICANT, A PROPERTY OWNER TO NOT HAVE A FAIR HEARING TO BE AB AND WE DO NOT WANT THE STAFF TO TALK SOMEONE OUT OF SOMETHING. AND SOMETIMES WE FEARED THAT THAT'S CURRENT. IN THE PAST WE FEARED THAT YOU WERE TALKING PEOPLE OUT OF THEIR RIGHT TO MAKE A REQUEST. SO IT'S A FINE LINE OF INFORMING AND THEN LETTING THE APPLICANT DECIDE WHETHER THEY WANNA MOVE FORWARD OR NOT. YEP. PLEASE RESPOND TO THAT AND THEN I'M GO MR. MILLIKEN. THAT'S CORRECT. TYPICALLY, DURING OUR CONSULTATIONS AND PRESCREEN PROCESS, WE DO HOLD THOSE TYPE OF CONVERSATIONS. AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT IS LEFT UP TO THE APPLICANT AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THEY WANT TO PURSUE WHAT THEY INITIALLY COME IN FOR. MR. MILLIKEN. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. I JUST WANNA CIRCLE BACK REAL QUICK TO THE SB UH, EIGHT 15. OKAY. UM, ON THE 30% OPENNESS, UH, DOES THAT INCLUDE SOMETHING, FOR EXAMPLE, LIKE IF IT WAS A SINGLE FAMILY HOME, WOULD THAT INCLUDE, LIKE IF THEY HAD LIKE AN EXTRA WIDE, SAY 50% OF THEIR FRONT YARD WAS DRIVEWAY, IS THAT CONSIDERABLE OPEN? SO THE OPEN SPACE AND PERMEABLE SURFACE, UM, IS REQUIRING THAT IF LET'S SAY THAT THEY HAVE 70% BUILDING COVERAGE, THEN THAT REMAINING 30% IF THEY WANNA PUT A DRIVEWAY, WOULD HAVE TO BE PERMEABLE MATERIAL. RIGHT. SO 30% OF THAT LOT NEEDS TO BE LANDSCAPED OR OTHER PERMEABLE SURFACE AND CANNOT BE IMPERMEABLE CONCRETE OR, OR BUILDING. SO, SO I WANT TO, I GUESS I WANT TO RED REDIRECT MY QUESTION INTO STAFF. UM, IN A SITUATION LIKE THERE WAS AN APPLICANT WHO WAS REQUESTING, SAY LIKE AN A DU, UM, IS THAT SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD, THAT WOULD BE VISITED DURING THE APPLICATION PROCESS AS FAR AS THEY HAD THE LESS THAN 30% AND THEY WERE SAY, APPLYING TO BUILDING A DU. UM, WHERE IN THE PROCESS WOULD THAT BE VISITED BEFORE IT MAYBE CAME TO A BOARD HEARING? RIGHT, AGAIN, LIKE DURING THE REVIEW PROCESS, UM, THERE'S COMMUNICATE COMMUNICATION BETWEEN STAFF AND THE APPLICANT. SO ALL OF THAT INFORMATION IS REVIEWED AND DISCUSSED DURING THAT TIME. DR. CLOVER, I'D LIKE TO AGREE WITH, UH, MR. SLATE THAT IF WE HAVE FOUND, UH, LOOPHOLE OR, UH, AN OPPORTUNITY TO ADD INFORMATION TO WHAT WE ENFORCE, THEN WE SHOULD GO AHEAD AND, AND, AND PUT IT IN WRITING SO WE CAN ENFORCE IT VERSUS, UH, CITY STAFF TELLING THE APPLICANTS ONE THING AND THEN THEY COME BEFORE US. WE DON'T HAVE THAT AS OUR RULES AND WE CAN'T ENFORCE. I, I THINK THAT I, I AGREE WITH WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. UM, I THINK THAT, UM, IT KIND OF FOLLOWS WITH THE STAFF IN THE LAST YEAR OR TWO PUTTING IN THE CRITERIA IN THE DOCKET IN WRITING. SO IT'S VERY MUCH IN OUR FACE TO SAY, WHAT IS THE REQUEST, WHAT IS THE CRITERIA? SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, AND MR. SLAY SAYING FURTHER BOLSTER THAT WITH THIS NEW, THESE NEW PROVISIONS, ABSOLUTELY THAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN. SO IT'S VERY CLEAR. CONTINUE, PLEASE. [03:15:03] OKAY. SO, UM, THE BILL DEFINES SPECIFICALLY WHAT WE MEAN BY MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL AND MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL IN THE BILL IS DEFINED THE SAME AS IT IN IS IN OUR CITY CODE, UM, WITH THREE OR MORE DWELLING UNITS ON A LOT. THE BILL SPECIFIES THAT THOSE THREE OR MORE UNITS CAN BE IN THE SAME BUILDING OR IN MULTIPLE BUILDINGS. SO CONCEIVABLY YOU COULD HAVE THREE DETACHED DWELLING UNITS THAT, FOR ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES, MAY APPEAR TO BE SINGLE FAMILY AS IN ANY OTHER SINGLE FAMILY DEVELOPMENT. BUT BECAUSE THEY'RE ON THE SAME LOT, IT'S MULTIFAMILY AND COULD, UM, QUALIFY FOR THE DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS GAINED BY THE BILL. UM, IN TERMS OF MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL, UM, VARIOUS PIECES OF OUR CURRENT CODE, WHETHER IT'S CHAPTER 51, UM, OR ANY OF OUR PDS HAVE THEIR OWN SOMETIMES DEFINITION OF WHAT A MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL PROJECT IS IN ORDER TO QUALIFY, UM, UNDER THE BILL AS A MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL PROJECT, THE RESIDENTIAL PORTION MUST BE 65% OR MORE OF THE TOTAL FLOOR AREA ON THE PROPERTY OR IN THE DEVELOPMENT. SO IT'S CONCEIVABLE THAT YOU COULD HAVE A MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT COME IN THAT IS MEETS THE 65, 30 5% THRESHOLD. THE ENTIRE DEVELOPMENT THEN WOULD, UH, QUALIFY FOR THE DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS OR THE DEVELOPMENT BONUSES, IF YOU WILL, IN SBA 40. WHEREAS IF A DEVELOPER CAME IN AND DID NOT MEET THAT THRESHOLD, SAY THEY WERE 50% RESIDENTIAL AND 50% OTHER, THEN JUST THE RESIDENTIAL PORTION WOULD QUALIFY FOR THE BONUSES UNDER THE BILL, BUT NOT THE ENTIRE DEVELOPMENT. OKAY. SO, UM, ADDRESSING THE FIRST, UH, OF OUR THREE BULLET POINTS FROM THE BEGINNING, REQUIRING MULTIFAMILY AND MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL IN ADDITIONAL ZONING CLASSIFICATIONS AND SPECIFICALLY ANYTHING THAT CURRENTLY ALLOWS OR ANY LOCATION, IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE AN OFFICE DISTRICT, IT JUST HAS TO BE A ZONING CLASSIFICATION THAT ALLOWS ONE OR MORE OFFICE USES. UM, AND SIMILARLY, UH, COMMERCIAL RETAIL WAREHOUSE OR MIXED USE, THE CITY IS NOW REQUIRED TO ALLOW MULTIFAMILY, UH, OR MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL IN THOSE AREAS, UM, WITH CERTAIN EXCLUSIONS, UM, THAT MAY PREVENT IT. FOR EXAMPLE, YOU CAN'T BE WITHIN A THOUSAND FEET OF A HEAVY INDUSTRIAL USE, WHICH I'LL DEFINE DIRECTLY FOR YOU LATER IN THE POWERPOINT. UM, YOU CAN'T BE WITHIN A CERTAIN DISTANCE OF AN AIRPORT OR AN A ACCIDENT OR A RISK ZONE. UM, OTHER THINGS THAT ARE SHOWN ON OUR GIS WEBPAGE, UM, INTERESTINGLY AND, UM, FOR SOME OF OUR DEVELOPERS, UM, YOU KNOW, THEY'VE BEEN VERY HAPPY TO FIND OUT, UM, THAT SB EIGHT 40, UM, OVERRULES ANYTHING THAT'S WRITTEN IN A PD. UM, IF A PD CURRENTLY DOES NOT ALLOW MULTIFAMILY, BUT IT ALLOWS OFFICE OR MIXED USE OR, UH, WAREHOUSE, THE STATE LAW WOULD APPLY TO THAT PD AND REQUIRE THE CITY TO ALLOW MULTIFAMILY OR MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENTS THERE. SAME THING IN HISTORIC DISTRICTS, CONSERVATION DISTRICTS. UM, ALSO DEED RESTRICTIONS ARE OVERRULED BY, UM, EVERYTHING. YES, IT'S A VERY POWERFUL BILL. SO WE HAVE A NUMBER OF ZONING CASES THAT HAVE COME THROUGH, AND THE REZONE HAS BEEN, UM, TO SAY A MULTI-FAMILY TWO A DISTRICT. UM, BUT THEY PUT DEED RESTRICTIONS ON THE PROPERTY SAYING THAT IT CAN ONLY, YOU KNOW, HAVE A MAXIMUM OF THREE UNITS OR FOUR UNITS OR WHATEVER THE BILL OVERRIDES THAT WITH ITS DENSITY REQUIREMENTS. UM, IT'S VERY POWERFUL. UM, HERE I'M JUST GONNA HIGHLIGHT THE DISTANCE EXCLUSIONS HERE AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS PARTICULAR SLIDE. THE, UM, THE FIRST ONE, LAND LOCATED WITHIN A THOUSAND FEET OF A HEAVY INDUSTRIAL USE. UM, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE APPLICANTS, UH, DETERMINE OR DEMONSTRATE TO US WITHIN 30 DAYS PRIOR TO SUBMITTING AN APPLICATION FOR A PERMIT. THERE'S A, A DISTANCE SURVEY, A THOUSAND FOOT DISTANCE SURVEY SIMILAR TO WHAT YOU WOULD SEE ON AN ALCOHOL DISTANCE SURVEY WHERE YOU HAVE THE PROPERTY THAT YOU'RE, UH, PLANNING TO DEVELOP. YOU HAVE A THOUSAND FOOT, UH, RING AROUND THAT AND WITHIN THAT THOUSAND FEET, UM, THERE SHOULD BE NO HEAVY INDUSTRIAL USES COD. IF IT'S A, IF IT'S AN ILLEGAL USE THAT SOMEBODY [03:20:01] HAS JUST DECIDED THEY'RE GONNA OPERATE, UM, BUT HASN'T GOTTEN IT PERMITTED OR COED, THEN IT DOESN'T REALLY EXIST, UM, FOR THE EXCLUSION PURPOSES. UM, THE OTHER TWO, THE LAND LOCATED WITHIN 3000 FEET OF AN AIRPORT OR MILITARY BASE AND THE CLEAR ZONE OR ACCIDENT POTENTIAL ZONE, THOSE LAST TWO BULLETS ARE, ARE SHOWN ON OUR GIS MAP. SO ANY DEVELOPER OR MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC CAN DO THEIR OWN SCREENING FOR THOSE TWO EXCLUSIONS. UM, ALSO THE BILL DOES NOT ALLOW SB EIGHT 40 DEVELOPMENTS MIXED USE, UH, RESIDENTIAL OR MULTIFAMILY RESIDENTIAL IN A HEAVY INDUSTRIAL DISTRICT. UM, AND FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS, THOSE ARE DEFINED TO BE THE IR AND THE IM DISTRICTS. UM, SO THAT IS AN AUTOMATIC DISQUALIFIER QUALIFIER. I BELIEVE WE'VE DISCUSSED MOST OF THAT. UM, IT'S GONE TO THE SECOND BULLET, THE LIMITS TO OUR AUTHORITY TO REGULATE CERTAIN ASPECTS OF THESE DEVELOPMENTS. AND AGAIN, THAT IS IN LOCATIONS AND ZONING CLASSIFICATIONS WHERE THESE USES ARE ALREADY ALLOWED BY OUR CITY CODE OR WHERE THEY'RE ALLOWED BY THE STATE BILL. THERE'S ABOUT FIVE OR SIX DIFFERENT DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS, ONE OF THOSE, AND PROBABLY THE MOST IMPACTFUL. UM, THE BILL SPECIFIES THAT YOU MUST ALLOW THE GREATER OF EITHER THE HIGHEST RESIDENTIAL DENSITY ALLOWED IN THE MUNICIPALITY OR 36 UNITS PER ACRE. IN THE CITY OF DALLAS, WE HAVE SOME ZONING CLASSIFICATIONS THAT ALLOW UNLIMITED DENSITY. THEREFORE, THE ENTIRE CITY OF DALLAS NOW HAS NO DENSITY MAXIMUM REGARDLESS OF CURRENT ZONING. UM, NO DENSITY LIMITS. ALSO THE BOTTOM BULLET HERE, NO DIRECT OR INDIRECT RESTRICTIONS ON DENSITY MAY BE IMPOSED BY ZONING REGULATIONS. SO THINGS LIKE MINIMUM LOT AREA REQUIREMENTS, YOU SEE IN THE MULTIFAMILY USE REGULATIONS THAT THERE'S A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF LOT AREA REQUIRED BASED ON THE TYPE OF DWELLING UNIT THAT YOU HAVE. IF IT'S A ONE BEDROOM OR A TWO BEDROOM OR WHATEVER, THERE'S A CERTAIN LOT AREA REQUIREMENT THAT IS AN INDIRECT, UM, CAP ON, UH, DENSITY REGULATIONS. AND SO THOSE MINIMUM LOT AREA REQUIREMENTS ARE NO LONGER ENFORCEABLE AND MAXIMUM FLOOR AREA ALLOWED IS ALSO NO LONGER ENFORCEABLE. UM, ANOTHER EXTREMELY IMPACTFUL EXAMPLE, UM, OF A DENSITY BONUS HAS TO DO WITH HEIGHT. UM, BASICALLY THE CITY FOR THESE MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL OR MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENTS, THE CITY IS NO LONGER ALLOWED TO RESTRICT THE HEIGHT TO LESS THAN 45 FEET. UM, THAT MEANS THAT YOUR MULTIFAMILY TO A DISTRICT THAT CURRENTLY HAS A MAXIMUM HEIGHT OF 36 FEET NOW HAS A MAXIMUM HEIGHT OF 45 FEET AUTOMATICALLY. AND WITH NO RPS IMPACT, UH, TO THAT, UH, BUILDING, BECAUSE WE ARE PROHIBITED FROM EVER, UH, REQUIRING A HEIGHT FOR ONE OF THESE DEVELOPMENTS THAT IS LESS THAN 45 FEET. SO 45 FEET IS IT. NOW, IF THE DISTRICT IN WHICH THE DEVELOPMENT IS OCCURRING HAS A GREATER HEIGHT MAXIMUM ALLOWED, FOR EXAMPLE, I'LL SHOW YOU AN EXAMPLE LATER. AN RR DISTRICT WHERE SB EIGHT 40 WOULD AUTHORIZE THESE DEVELOPMENTS HAS A MAXIMUM HEIGHT OF 70 FEET. UM, SO YOU COULD POTENTIALLY BUILD MULTIFAMILY UP TO 70 FEET. UM, RPS WILL HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF AN IMPACT THERE, NOT AS MUCH AS IT CURRENTLY DOES. UM, IT COULD LIMIT IT THE TO LESS THAN 70 FEET. UM, BUT AGAIN, NOT LESS THAN 45 FEET, UH, SETBACKS AND BUFFERS. UM, WE HAD AN INTERESTING CASE, UM, COME IN FOR PRE-APPLICATION SCREENING. IT, THIS IS NOT NECESSARILY JUST YOUR STANDARD SETBACK REGULATION OR YOUR LANDSCAPE BUFFER. THINK MORE BROADLY. WE HAD A, UM, A LOCATION COME IN AND THERE WAS A BUILD LINE, A PLATTED BUILD LINE ON THE PROPERTY THAT WAS LIKE 30 FEET FOR A FRONT SETBACK. UM, THE BILL SPECIFIES THAT WE CANNOT REQUIRE A SETBACK GREATER THAN 25 FEET. SO THAT BUILD LINE WAS OUT 25 FEET IS THE MAXIMUM THAT WE CAN REQUIRE AND ENFORCE THAT WOULD INCLUDE AT UPPER STORY. SO GO BACK A SECOND, YOU SAID. SO IF IT HAS A 30 FOOT BUILDING SETBACK BUILDING LINE, THAT'S NO LONGER ENFORCEABLE. IT [03:25:01] IS NOT ENFORCEABLE THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE CITY, THROUGHOUT ALL ZONING DISTRICTS FOR THESE TYPES OF DEVELOPMENTS, WHEREVER THEY'RE ALLOWED. SO IF SPECIFICALLY FOR A MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENT OR A MIXED USE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, NOT JUST ANY OFFICE BUILDING OR WHATEVER, IT'S JUST THESE TYPES OF DEVELOPMENTS. OKAY. THAT WOULD INCLUDE, UM, SETBACK LIMITATIONS INCLUDE AT UPPER STORIES. SO WHERE YOU SEE, UH, SOME, UH, DISTRICTS REQUIRE TOWER SPACING WHERE YOU GET ABOVE A CERTAIN HEIGHT, YOU NEED AN ADDITIONAL 30 FEET OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. SO WE CAN'T REQUIRE MORE THAN 25 FEET. SO LET'S SAY THE SETBACK ON THE GROUND IS 15 FEET, AND THEN WHEN YOU GET TO A CERTAIN HEIGHT, YOU WOULD NORMALLY REQUIRE X AMOUNT ADDITIONAL. IF YOU'VE GOT 15 FEET ON THE GROUND, THE MOST ADDITIONAL YOU COULD REQUIRE WOULD BE 10 FEET AT THE UPPER STORY, BECAUSE THE MOST WE CAN REQUIRE IS 25 FEET. MAKE SENSE? I SEE STUNNED LOOKS ON SOME FACES. I'VE, I'VE . WELL, I THINK THE STUNNED LOOKS YOU'RE SEEING ARE, WE'RE STARTING TO SAY, HOW IS THIS GONNA BE IMPLEMENTED? WOW. AND THIS IS GONNA CHANGE NEIGHBORHOODS. I GO BACK TO, YOU KNOW, UH, BLOCK FACE CONTINUITY AND HEIGHTS AND TOWERING STRUCTURES SINCE THE RPS IS BEING LIMITED AS WELL. SO, I MEAN, OKAY, WE'LL GET INTO SOME IMPLE IMPLEMENTATION THINGS A LITTLE BIT LATER, BUT IT, IT DEFINITELY IS A VERY LAYERED AND COMPLICATED BILL. UM, FLOOR AREA RATIO. SOMEONE ASKED ABOUT THAT EARLIER ON THE SB 15. THE BILL SPECIFIES THAT WE CANNOT REQUIRE A MAXIMUM, UM, FLOOR AREA AS IT RELATES OR AS A FUNCTION OF THE SIZE OF THE LOT. SO FLOOR AREA RATIO MAXIMUM DOES, DOES NOT EXIST FOR THESE DEVELOPMENTS. UM, AND THEN THE LAST REGULATION, UM, PARKING. WHAT WE HAVE FOUND, UM, FOR OUR PARTICULAR CITY IS THAT BECAUSE WE'VE JUST HAD THE PARKING CODE REFORM RECENTLY, USUALLY OUR PARKING CODE REFORM IS THE LEAST RESTRICTIVE. AND SO IT TYPICALLY PROVIDES MORE RELIEF FROM PARKING THAN EVEN THE BILL. BUT REMEMBER THAT THAT PARKING CODE REFORM DID NOT APPLY TO PDS THAT HAD THEIR OWN PARKING REQUIREMENTS. SO THE STATE BILL SUDDENLY COMES IN AND, UM, IT CAN OVERRULE PDS AND ANY OTHER CLASSIFICATIONS. SO THE MOST THAT WE CAN REQUIRE IN TERMS OF PARKING FOR THESE TYPES OF DEVELOPMENTS IS THAT WE CANNOT REQUIRE MORE THAN ONE SPACE PER DWELLING UNIT. OKAY. WE ALSO CAN'T REQUIRE, UM, STRUCTURED PARKING, MULTI-LEVEL STRUCTURED PARKING. UM, THIS ONE, THE TOP BULLET HERE IS OF PARTICULAR INTEREST TO THIS BODY. THE CITY MAY NOT REQUIRE DISCRETIONARY APPROVALS, UM, FOR THESE TYPES OF DEVELOPMENTS THAT ARE ALLOWED UNDER THE STATE BILL. UH, A DISCRETIONARY APPROVAL, UM, WOULD BE A ZONING CHANGE THAT GOES BEFORE CITY PLAN COMMISSION AND THEN ULTIMATELY TO COUNCIL, UM, AMENDMENTS TO PLANS. UM, WELL AMENDMENTS TO DISTRICTS, UM, EXCEPT SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS AND VARIANCES. UM, THESE IN ORDER TO USE THE DEVELOPMENT STANDARDS THAT ARE OFFERED IN THE BILL, THEY DON'T HAVE TO COME BEFORE THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT TO GAIN THOSE BENEFITS. NOW THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU WON'T SEE CASES FOR VARIANCES BECAUSE, AND WE HAD ONE VERY RECENTLY, AND I ACTUALLY WAS JUST TALKING, UM, WITH MS. BARQUE ON THE SIDE A LITTLE BIT AGO. WE'VE HAD SOMEONE COME THROUGH, UM, AND START THE SCREENING PROCESS FOR AN SB EIGHT 40 PROJECT. I BELIEVE IT'S IN, I CAN'T REMEMBER IF IT'S CR OR CS DISTRICT, BUT IT HAPPENS TO BE A CORNER LOT AND IT HAPPENS TO BE RIGHT NEXT DOOR TO AN R FIVE A LOT. SO YOU MAY OR MAY NOT BE AWARE THAT THERE'S AN ADDITIONAL SETBACK REQUIRED WHEN YOU'RE DEVELOPING IN CR CS AND ARE ADJACENT TO AN R DISTRICT. SO WHAT, EVEN THOUGH, UM, THE DEVELOPMENT WOULD BE ALLOWED ON THIS PROPERTY, IT HAPPENED TO BE A SMALL ENOUGH CORNER LOT THAT THEY ENDED UP WITH ABOUT FIVE FEET IN WIDTH TO DEVELOP ON BECAUSE THEY HAD A 20 FOOT SETBACK AGAINST THE R DISTRICT. THEY HAD, UM, IN A CR OR CS DISTRICT, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE ON THE CORNER, BOTH OF THOSE FRONTAGES ARE FRONT YARDS, UNLIKE IN A RESIDENTIAL OR DUPLEX DISTRICT. SO THEY HAD TWO FRONT YARD SETBACKS AT 15 FEET. THEY HAD A 20 FOOT SIDE SETBACK AGAINST AN R DISTRICT. IT'S 35 AND YEAH, IT WAS A 40 FOOT WIDE LOT. SO THEY HAD FIVE FEET OF WIDTH TO DEVELOP. AND I BELIEVE THAT YOU WILL SOON , I BELIEVE THAT YOU WILL SOON SEE [03:30:01] THAT CASE. BEFORE THE BOARD, IS THERE A PARTICULAR SLIDE THAT YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO SKIP TO? I JUST, I NEED TO HAVE YOU MOVE ALONG 'CAUSE WE'RE RUNNING BEHIND. OKAY. UM, BULLET THREE. UM, IT STREAMLINES THE PROCESS FOR CONVERSION. BASICALLY, THIS APPLIES TO, UM, OFFICE RETAIL OR WAREHOUSE USES THAT EXIST IN A BUILDING THAT HAS, THAT IS AT LEAST FIVE YEARS OLD, UM, AND IS BEING CONVERTED AT LEAST 65% RESIDENTIAL OVERALL AND PER FLOOR IN THE CONVERSION. UM, AND THEN THERE'S A LOT OF NO-NOS. IT BASICALLY SAYS WE WANT YOU TO BE ABLE TO CONVERT THESE, UM, NON-RESIDENTIAL USES INTO HOUSING. SO YOU CAN'T REQUIRE ADDITIONAL PARKING BEYOND WHAT'S ON THE SITE. NO TRAFFIC IMPACT ANALYSIS. NO, I MEAN, THERE'S A LOT OF LIMITS TO THIS SLIDE IS, UM, EXACTLY MATCHING WHAT WAS IN THE DOCKET. SO I WILL MOVE ALONG UNLESS ANYBODY HAS QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR SLIDE. OKAY. SO THIS IS WHERE THE PRESENTATION IS GONNA, UH, DIVERT SIGNIFICANTLY FROM WHAT YOU SEE IN THE DOCKET. UM, IN THE DOCKET, I BELIEVE IT HAD A SLIDE CALLED NEXT STEPS. THAT WAS AS OF AUGUST 7TH. AND WE'VE IMPLEMENTED A NUMBER OF THOSE NEXT STEPS. UM, PROBABLY THE MOST IMPORTANT BEING, UM, THAT WE HAVE A STATE LAWS INFORMATION WEBPAGE, WHICH I WILL BRING UP BRIEFLY AND WE CAN PROVIDE THIS LINK TO YOU AS WELL. UM, ON THIS PAGE, THERE'S A COUPLE OF THINGS. THERE'S SOME FORMS AT THE TOP WHERE PEOPLE CAN FILL OUT TO REQUEST JUST GENERAL INFORMATION OR PRE-APPLICATION SCREENING OF THEIR PROJECT. AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS PAGE, THERE ARE SOME RESOURCES AVAILABLE. UM, THE, THE PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT HAS PUBLISHED AN SB EIGHT 40 INFORMATION SHEET AND AN SB EIGHT 15 INFORMATION SHEET. UM, I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO READ THROUGH THOSE DOCUMENTS AS FOLLOW UP AND IF YOU EVER HAVE QUESTIONS, I THINK THIS IS A, A GOOD PLACE TO GO AND FIND THOSE THINGS. WE ALSO HAVE LINKS TO THE BILLS THEMSELF, UM, AND THEN SOME EXAMPLES OF RPS UNDER SB EIGHT 40. AND KIND OF THE LAST THING HERE IS OUR PROCESS FOR, UH, WHO NEEDS TO COME THROUGH SCREENING. WE'RE IN THE PROCESS OF, UM, LOOSENING THE REINS OF THIS BECAUSE AFTER ABOUT TWO MONTHS OF THIS AND, UM, TALKING TO ABOUT 70 DIFFERENT DEVELOPERS, WE HAVE BEEN ABLE TO FINE TUNE THIS A LITTLE BIT. UM, BUT THERE IS A PRE-APPLICATION SCREENING. IT IS DESIGNED SO THAT THEY COME AND TALK TO US FIRST AND UNDERSTAND THE REGULATIONS RELATED TO THE BILL BEFORE THEY GO TO PERMITTING. UM, AND THEN THE SCREENING TEAM, UH, IS IN CONTACT WITH THE ZONING REVIEWERS WHO PROVIDE INFORMATION AT PRE-DEVELOPMENT MEETINGS OR REVIEW PROJECTS AT PERMITTING TO MAKE SURE THAT SUPPORT IS IN PLACE AND THEY UNDERSTAND, UM, HOW TO IMPLEMENT THE REGULATIONS. AND WITH THAT, WHOOPS, UM, I'LL JUST GIVE YOU A A QUICK PICTURE OF VIEW. THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF HOW RPS WOULD APPLY STANDARD AS IT CURRENTLY EXISTS. THE SCENARIO HERE IS YOU HAVE LIKE A SINGLE FAMILY OR DUPLEX DISTRICT REPRESENTED OVER HERE BY THIS TINY, TINY THING. UM, IN THIS CASE IT'S ACROSS THE STREET. RPS WOULD, THE HEIGHT RESTRICTIONS OF RPS WOULD TYPICALLY KICK IN ONCE A STRUCTURE REACHES A HEIGHT OF 26 FEET AND THEN WOULD HAVE TO SLOPE OR STEP BACK IN ORDER TO STAY UNDER THE RPS SLOPE. AND THEN IN THIS CASE, SINCE THIS IS IN AN MF TWO A DISTRICT, THE CURRENT REGULATIONS LIMITED TO 36 FEET IN HEIGHT. SO IT WOULD HAVE TO CAP OFF THERE. SO THIS IS SORT OF THE PROFILE OF WHAT YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO BUILD WITH RPS UNDER THE CURRENT ZONING REGULATIONS AS OPPOSED TO, UM, THE SAME SCENARIO NOW UNDER SB EIGHT 40. SO YOU SEE THAT THE, THE STANDARD RPS IS SUPERIMPOSED ONTO THIS SOLID RECTANGULAR TYPE SHAPE. SO THE SOLID FILL IS THE PROFILE OF NOW WHAT CAN BE BUILT IN THE SAME SCENARIO IN A MULTIFAMILY TWO A DISTRICT. UM, LIKE I SAID, WE CANNOT REQUIRE LESS THAN 45 FEET IN HEIGHT. SO THEY'RE ABLE TO GO UP TO 45 FEET IN HEIGHT AND THAT APPLIES ACROSS THE PROPERTY. THEY DO NOT NEED TO SLOPE OR STEP BACK TO STAY UNDER THE SLOPE AND QUICKLY. AND FINALLY, UM, AN EXAMPLE IN A DISTRICT THAT HAS A MAXIMUM HEIGHT. I SAID EARLIER RR REQUIRES OR HAS A MAXIMUM [03:35:01] DISTRICT HEIGHT OF 70 FEET. SO WE SEE THE STANDARD RPS AS IT WOULD BE APPLIED CURRENTLY AND THEN, WHOOPS, OOPS, THE SAME SCENARIO UNDER SB EIGHT 40. SO YOU SEE IN THIS CASE, UM, WE HAVE THE EXISTING APPLICATION SUPERIMPOSED ON TOP OF THE SB EIGHT 40 APPLICATION. IN THIS CASE, THE BUILDABLE AREA OF THE PROPERTY UNDER THE RPS SLOPE ALLOWS THIS, UH, SITE TO GET TO A HEIGHT OF 59 FEET AND STILL BE UNDER THE SLOPE. THAT SETS THEN THE MAXIMUM HEIGHT FOR THE ENTIRE PROPERTY AT 59 FEET WITH NO REQUIREMENT TO SLOPE BACK OR STEP BACK TO STAY UNDER THE RPS. AND THAT IS ALL ANY QUESTIONS. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WE VERY MUCH APPRECIATE IT. PERFECT. THANKS. UH, I WOULD SAY I WOULD SUMMARIZE THIS TO SAY THAT THE STATE HAS STEPPED IN AND BASICALLY DRAMATICALLY ENHANCED PROPERTY RIGHTS. AND SO THIS IS GONNA HAVE A RIPPLE EFFECT. WE WILL DEPEND ON OUR STAFF IN THE DOCKETS TO MAKE SURE IT CLEARLY STIPULATES THESE NEW RIGHTS, THESE NEW, UM, PROPERTY RIGHTS THAT THEY NOW HAVE AS OPPOSED TO HAVING TO ASK PERMISSION. SO, ALRIGHT, UH, WE'RE GONNA SHIFT GEARS. WE'RE GONNA GO BACK TO DR. MILLER HOSKINS, OUR BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. WE'RE GONNA DO ONE MORE SECTION ON HERS AND THEN WE'LL BREAK FOR LUNCH. I'M TORTURING YOU BY SAYING LUNCH IS COMING, BUT, AND THAT IS OUR BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT MEMBER ORIENTATION GUIDE. UH, THE DOCKET, THE DOCUMENT YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU AND IT'S PAGE, OH, YOU ALREADY LOADED IT. FABULOUS. IT'S, UH, PAGE 78 IN THE DOCKET. UM, THIS IS, THIS WAS A COLLABORATION EFFORT BY THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, MYSELF AND SARAH MAY, AND ALSO THERESA CARLISLE TO TRY TO PUT IN WRITING, UM, A HANDBOOK THAT HASN'T BEEN UPDATED IN 5, 10, 15 YEARS. SOMETHING LIKE THAT. I DON'T KNOW, IT'S LIKE DATED. SO THIS IS MEANT TO BE A GUIDE FOR EVERYONE. SO I'VE ASKED DR. KAMIKA, MILLER HOSKINS TO WALK US THROUGH THIS. I'M GONNA EDITOR TALL EYES AS WE GO. GO. WE'RE GONNA MOVE REASONABLY QUICKLY. UH, AND I'M GONNA LOOK FOR ANY QUESTIONS THAT HAVE COME UP, MS. BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, AND WE'RE ON PAGE 78 OF YOUR DOCKET. ALL RIGHT, GOOD AFTERNOON. AGAIN, I WILL BRIEFLY GO THROUGH THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT MEMBER ORIENTATION GUIDE. AND I ASK MS. WILLIAMS TO DO, GIVE EVERYONE A HARD COPY SO YOU HAVE A HARD COPY IN YOUR FOLDERED, UM, VERSION. SO THAT WAY YOU CAN WALK OUT WITH THIS. I'M STILL A PAPER GUY. UM, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE EVERYONE, NOT ONLY IN THE ELECTRONIC DOCKET, BUT YOU HAVE A HARD COPY VERSION PROCEED. ALRIGHT, SO WE'LL UM, BRIEFLY GO THROUGH THIS, UM, DOCUMENT. UM, WE'LL GO OVER EVERY PAGE, BUT WE WILL NOT READ EVERY LINE ON EVERY PAGE. SO IT'LL BE ABOUT TWO OR THREE BULLET POINTS FROM EACH SECTION. GOOD. AND KEEP IT MOVING. SO, UM, CITY OF DALLAS BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT ORIENTATION GUIDE THE, UM, PURPOSE AND AUTHORITY. AGAIN, THE CITY OF DALLAS BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT IS A QUASI QUASI-JUDICIAL BODY WITH THE ESTABLISHED UNDER THE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE IN DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE. UM, THAT'S AUTHORIZED TO HEAR AND DECIDE ON SPECIFIC ZONING RELATED MATTERS, INCLUDING VARIANCES, SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, AND APPEALS OF ADMINISTRATIVE DECISIONS. AND WE'LL GET INTO, UM, THOSE DIFFERENT ITEMS LATER ON IN THE ORIENTATION. UM, THE BOARD IS COMPOSED OF 15 MEMBERS, WHICH, UM, ALSO INCLUDES SIX ALTERNATE MEMBERS APPOINTED BY THE DALLAS CITY, UM, COUNCIL AND THE MAYOR. UM, THE PANEL MEMBERS ARE BROKEN UP INTO, UM, WELL, I WOULD SAY EACH PANEL CONSISTS OF FIVE MEMBERS, UM, WITH ALTERNATE MEMBERS ASSIGNED AS NEEDED, UM, TO ENSURE QUORUM AND CONTINUITY. SO WHEN YOU'RE APPOINTED EVERY TWO YEARS, THE CITY SECRETARY ON HER OWN ASSIGNS PEOPLE TO PANELS AND THE CODE SAYS TO THE GREATEST EXTENT POSSIBLE, GIVEN THE, UH, GEOGRAPHIC AND ETHNIC DIVERSITY OF THE CITY. AND THAT'S WHAT THE CODE SAYS. SO THE, THE CITY SECRETARY ON HER OWN OR HIS OWN, IT'S A, HER NOW ASSIGNS PEOPLE TO PANEL A, B, OR C. YES. AND EACH PANEL, UM, MEETS ONCE A MONTH WITH PANEL A MEETING ON THE THIRD TUESDAY OF EACH MONTH. PANEL B MEETING ON THE THIRD WEDNESDAY OF EACH MONTH, AND PANEL C MEETING ON THE FIRST MONDAY, I'M SORRY, THE MEETING ON THE THIRD MONDAY, UM, OF EACH MONTH. AND PLEASE NOTE THAT MEETING DAYS MAY SHIFT DUE TO HOLIDAYS LATER IN THE DOCKET. WE WILL REVIEW [03:40:01] THE CALENDAR FOR 2026. UM, ROLES AND RESPONSIBILITIES OF THE BOARD. UM, THE CHAIR, UM, OVERSEES THE FULL BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT, PROVIDING LEADERSHIP AND ENSURING CONSISTENCY ACROSS PANELS. WE HAVE THE PRESIDING OFFICE AND THE PANEL MEMBERS WHO, UM, THE PANEL MEMBERS HERE AND DECIDE THE CASES BASED ON EVIDENCE PRESENTED BY STAFF. UM, THE BOARD DOES HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO GRANT SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS AS EXPLICITLY ALLOWED BY THE CODE GRANT VARIANCES FROM ZONING REGULATIONS APPROVE CHANGES FROM ONE NON-CONFORMING USE TO ANOTHER, ALLOW ENLARGEMENTS OF NON-CONFORMING USES AND HEARING DECIDE APPEALS OF ADMINISTRATIVE RELATED, UM, ADMINISTRATIVE DECISIONS RELATED TO ZONING ENFORCEMENT. UM, WE DID A BRIEF INTRODUCTION EARLIER TODAY, UM, OF BOARD STAFF AS FAR AS CASE CYCLE, UM, CASE LIFECYCLE OVERVIEW. LET'S GO BACK ONE CLICK, AND I THINK I'VE SAID THIS TO EACH ONE OF YOU WHEN I VISITED ONE ON ONE. THE PLANNING COMMISSION MAKES ZONING RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE CITY COUNCIL FOR TRACK SEVERAL TRACKS OF LAND, SEVERAL PLATS, SEVERAL LARGE GEOGRAPHIC AREA. OUR ROLE IS SINGLE PLATS. WE DON'T MAKE DECISIONS ON MULTIPLE PLAT, MULTI PLATS. IT'S SINGLE PLATS AND IT'S A UNIQUE CIRCUMSTANCE THAT DOES NOT SET A PRECEDENT TO THE NEXT CASE. SO WE'RE ONE-OFFS. THAT'S THE BEST WAY OF THINKING. PLANNING COMMISSION DOES A A, A LAR A GEOGRAPHIC AREA. WE DO A SINGLE PLAT. GREAT. MOVING ON TO, UM, CASE LIFECYCLE OVERVIEW. I DO WANT TO GO OVER THE PROCESS, UM, OF HOW WE, UM, ACCEPT APPLICATIONS AND MOVE THEM FORWARD TO A FINAL DECISION. SO THE FIRST STEP WOULD BE THE APPLICANT OR PROPERTY OWNER COMES IN FOR A CONSULTATION. A CONSULTATION IS NOT REQUIRED, BUT IT'S HIGHLY ENCOURAGED. FROM THERE, THEY ARE ENCOURAGED TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THEIR PRESCREEN PROCESS AND THAT'S WHEN, UM, SENIOR PLAN, THE INTAKE TEAM, WHICH INCLUDES THE SENIOR PLANS EXAMINERS, UM, GO THROUGH THE REVIEW PROCESS, UM, AND ADDITIONAL COMMUNICATION WITH THE APPLICANTS. ONCE THAT'S DONE, WE MOVE FORWARD TO CASE INTAKE. ONCE IN CASE INTAKE HAS BEEN COMPLETED, THE CASES ARE RANDOMLY ASSIGNED TO A PANEL BY OUR BOARD SECRETARY. OKAY. CASE INTAKE. THE IDEA HERE IS IF DR. GLOVER HAS A REQUEST, HE, I'M JUST PICKING ON YOU, EMMANUEL. HE, HE, HE VISITS WITH THE STAFF, SAYS WHAT HE WANTS, WHAT HE THINKS HE WANTS THE STAFF HELPS THEM CULTIVATE THAT AND MAKE SURE HE HAS THE APPROPRIATE DOCKETS IN ORDER FOR THE STAFF TO ACCEPT THE APPEAL. THAT'S WHAT INTAKE IS ALL ABOUT. OKAY. ALRIGHT. SO, UM, ONCE THE CASE HAS BEEN ACCEPTED, UM, IT'S RANDOMLY ASSIGNED TO A PANEL BY OUR BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND ALSO RANDOMLY, UM, ASSIGNED TO A SENIOR PLANNER. FROM THERE, WE MOVE FORWARD TO THE HEARING AND THEN AT THE HEARING A FINAL DECISION, UM, IT'S MADE ON THAT PARTICULAR CASE. DR. GLOVER, UH, HOW LONG DOES THE INTAKE PROCESS TAKE FROM IN FROM CASE INTAKE TO HEARING IS 60 DAYS. IT'S OUR TIMELINE METRIC, BUT WE'VE BEAT THAT METRIC AND WE HAVE AN AVERAGE OF NOW 54 DAYS FROM INTAKE TO HEARING, UM, GETTING, GETTING INTO, UM, THE CASE BASICS. SO AS FAR AS SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, UM, FOR CRITERIA FOR GRANTING A SPECIAL EXCEPTION, A SPECIAL EXCEPTION VARIES ACCORDING TO THE DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE. BUT MOST OFTEN STATES THE SPECIAL EXCEPTION WOULD NOT ADVERSELY AFFECT NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES. SO IN VISITING WITH A LOT OF YOU ONE-ON-ONE, I WOULD SAY THAT THAT'S WHAT YOUR ROLE IS TO DECIDE WHETHER THIS ADVERSELY AFFECTS NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES. AND THE COMMENT I GOT BACK REGULARLY IS, WELL, HOW DO WE DECIDE THAT? AND I SAID, YOU AND THE FOUR OTHER MEMBERS OF YOUR PANEL, PERIOD, THAT'S IT. IT'S NO ONE ELSE. IT'S A VERY SUBJECTIVE ROLE IN SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS. ALRIGHT. UM, SOME COMMON TYPES OF SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, UM, THAT WE TEND TO SEE, UM, CENTERED AROUND FENCE, HEIGHT, OPACITY AND OR MATERIALS. UM, ADDITIONAL AND ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS. OPACITY IS SOLID VERSUS THROUGH, I NEVER KNEW THE TERM UNTIL A YEAR INTO IT. VISIBILITY TRIANGLE, UM, OBSTRUCTIONS PARKING REDUCTIONS, AND SOME LANDSCAPE VISIBILITY TRIANGLE. AND THAT IS THE ANGLE COMING IN AND OUTTA YOUR PROPERTY AND HOW THAT INTERSECTS THE, THE, UH, STREET. CORRECT. MOVING ON TO VARIANCES. A VARIANCE PROVIDES RELIEF FROM ZONING STANDARDS ON A PROPERTY HAS UNIQUE PHYSICAL, UM, [03:45:01] CONDITIONS SUCH AS THE SHAPE OF THE LOT, IF THERE'S A SLOPE IN OR A SIZE THAT MAY, UM, THAT MAY MAKE STRICT COMPLIANCE IMPRACTICAL OR IMPOSSIBLE. AND SOME COMMON EXAMPLES INCLUDE, UM, YARD, OUR YARD LOT, YARD LOT AND SPACE REQUIREMENTS, WHICH INCLUDES FRONT YARD, UM, SETBACKS, SIDE YARD SETBACKS, AND OR REAR YARD SETBACKS, WHICH ARE THE MOST COMMON VARIANCES WE SEE ALONG WITH, UM, SOME PARKING LANDSCAPE REGULATIONS AND THINGS OF THAT SORT. SO IN SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, THE STAFF DOES NOT MAKE A RECOMMENDATION 'CAUSE IT ALWAYS IS IN THE JUDGMENT OF THE BOARD, IN THE JUDGMENT OF THE BOARD VARIANCES, THE STAFF DOES MAKE A RECOMMENDATION AND THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS ARE MADE BASED UPON, UM, THE CRITERIA FOR GRANTING A VARIANCE. UM, A VARIANCE MAY ONLY BE GRANTED IF ALL OF THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS ARE MET. KEYWORD HERE, ALL THREE OF THESE HAVE TO BE MET. YOU CAN'T MEET TWO OR ONE OF THE THREE HAS TO BE ALL THREE, RIGHT? NOT CONTRARY TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST NECESSARY TO PERMIT DEVELOPMENT OF A SPECIFIC PARCEL OF LAND THAT DIFFERS FROM OTHER PARCELS OF LAND BY BEING OF SUCH RESTRICTIVE AREA, SHAPE OR SLOPE, AND NOT GRANTED TO RELIEVE A SELF-CREATED OR PERSONAL HARDSHIP. SO HOW DO YOU AS A BOARD MEMBER ON A PANEL, ON A CASE TO DETERMINE WHETHER IT'S NOT CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST? ONE WAY IS STATE LAW SAYS WE NOTIFY PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 200 FEET 10 DAYS PRIOR TO A HEARING TO SAY WE'RE DOING THIS, GIVE US YOUR FEEDBACK. AND AS MANY OF YOU HAVE SEEN, SOMETIMES WE GET NOTHING. WE MAY NOTIFY 25 PROPERTY OWNERS AND GET NOTHING. OTHER TIMES WE GET A GAZILLION. NOW WHAT DO YOU DO IF YOU GET FEEDBACK FROM THESE SURROUNDING PROPERTY OWNERS? AND IT'S ALL AGAINST, DOES THAT MEAN YOU VOTE AGAINST IT? I DON'T KNOW. WHAT IF IT'S ALL FOR IT? DOES THAT MEAN YOU VOTE FOR IT? I DON'T KNOW. THAT IS ONE OF THE FACTORS THAT WHERE THAT, THAT, THAT LENDS TO THIS STATE LAW DOES NOT TELL US AS A CITY WHAT TO DO WITH THAT INFORMATION. IT JUST SAYS, NOTIFY PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 200 FEET OF THE REQUEST, AGAIN, GOES BACK TO THE FIVE MEMBERS OF THAT PANEL, MS. DAVIS. SO LOOKING AT THESE, LOOKING AT THE CRITERIA, I I'VE BEEN IN CASES BEFORE, ARE YOU ON VARIANCES OR SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS? UM, SORRY, I'M ON VARIANCES. OKAY, GO AHEAD. THE THREE CRITERIA. YEP. OKAY. I'VE BEEN IN CASES BEFORE WHERE WE START TALKING ABOUT THE TREES, WHICH IS, I MEAN, THAT COULD BE, YOU KNOW, DOES IT LEND IT, YOU KNOW, DOES IT INCREASE THE, DOES IT HURT SURROUNDING PROPERTY VALUES? OR MAYBE IT'S JUST SOMEBODY WHO'S ASKING THE QUESTION BECAUSE THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, VERY, UM, CONCERNED ABOUT THE ENVIRONMENT. BUT THAT'S NOT WRITTEN IN, THAT'S NOT WRITTEN SPECIFICALLY AS A POINT OF CRITERIA. SO HOW DOES, YOU KNOW, EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE THAT WILL COME UP? I'VE HEARD PEOPLE SAY, WELL, I'M VOTING THIS WAY BECAUSE OF THIS, AND IT'S NOT OUTLINED IN THE CRITERIA. SO WHAT DOES, WHAT CAN HAPPEN WHEN THAT HAPPENS? AND HOW, YOU KNOW, WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO AS A FELLOW BOARD MEMBER WHEN SOMEONE IS NOT USING THE CRITERIA AS THEIR REASON FOR VOTING? OR DO I NOT DO ANYTHING? AND IT'S REALLY UP TO THE BOARD CHAIRMAN TO SAY SOMETHING. SO MY, MY, MY ADVICE IS THE STAFF NOW PUTS IN EVERY SINGLE DOCKET, IN EVERY SINGLE CASE THE CRITERIA FOR A SPECIAL EXCEPTION. IT GOES TO THE SPECIFIC REQUEST AND WHAT THAT CRITERIA IS, AND I ALWAYS ENCOURAGE MEMBERS TO ASK QUESTIONS OF THE APPLICANT WITH THAT CRITERIA IN MIND. EITHER YOU ASK THE QUESTION WITH THAT CRITERIA OR YOU HAVE THAT CRITERIA RIGHT HERE AS YOU'RE ASKING THE QUESTION. AND AS I DEBATE AND FORMULATE AN OPINION, I'M SAYING, WILL MS. DAVIS, IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, I'M IN FAVOR BECAUSE I DO NOT THINK IT'S ADVERSE TO NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES. AND I EXPLAIN IT THAT WAY IN THE CASE OF A VARIANCE, WHAT IS NOT CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST? WOO. HOW DO YOU DETERMINE THAT? THAT'S WHAT STATE LAW SAYS, NOT CONTRARY TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST. WOO. GUESS WHAT GUYS? IT'S UP TO THE FIVE OF YOU IN A PUBLIC HEARING. AND YOU WOULD HOPE THAT EACH ONE OF YOU ON YOUR PANEL LOOK AT THESE THREE CRITERIA THAT ARE IN EVERY SINGLE DOCUMENT, DOCKET ON A VARIANCE AND ZERO IN ON THAT AND SAY, OKAY, THESE ARE OUR STANDARDS. AND AGAIN, YOU COULD BE PERSUADED IF 25 NA PROPERTY OWNERS, I DIDN'T SAY NEIGHBORS, PROPERTY OWNERS. THAT'S THE OTHER THING HERE I'VE ENCOURAGED. THIS IS NOT ABOUT NEIGHBORS. THIS IS NOT ABOUT TENANTS, THIS IS ABOUT PROPERTY OWNERS. IF YOU GET FEEDBACK FROM PROPERTY OWNERS THAT COULD BE PERSUASIVE ABOUT NOT COUNTRY OF PUBLIC [03:50:01] INTEREST OR NOT, ONE THAT GETS US ALL THE TIME IS NOT BASED ON SELF-CREATED OR FINANCIAL HARDSHIP. OOH, HOW DO YOU DECIPHER THAT? ISN'T EVERY APPLICANT HERE FOR SELF-INTEREST? SO THAT'S A CON THAT IS A VERY DIFFICULT THING TO DEFINE. TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, AS BEST AS I CAN, MS. DAVIS, EACH ONE OF US SHOULD FRAME, FRAME OUR QUESTIONS TO THE APPLICANT AND TO STAFF AND TO BOARD MEMBERS IN TERMS OF THE WRITTEN CRITERIA. IF YOU GO OFF THE RESERVATION TO TREES, IT BETTER HAVE SOMETHING TO DO WITH UNIQUE PROPERTY CONDITIONS. OTHERWISE, IT'S REALLY NOT RELEVANT. AND I'M NOT SAYING DON'T TELL MR. CAMPBELL, YOU'RE NOT RELEVANT ON YOUR COMMENT. BUT REALLY WHAT ALL THAT MATTERS IS THESE THREE, AND IT HAS TO BE ALL THREE. KEEP GOING. , THE BOARD ALSO HAS THE AUTHORITY TO HEAR APPEALS OF DECISIONS MADE BY ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIALS. THESE APPEALS TYPICALLY INVOLVE PERMANENT DENIALS. HOLD ON ONE SECOND. ONE OTHER EDITORIAL COMMENT FROM GRAY HAIR HERE OVER THE YEARS, IT'S AMAZING HOW THE BOARD, A PANEL OF FIVE WILL DETERMINE THAT A PIECE OF PROPERTY HAS A, UH, DIFFERENT RESTRICTIVE AREA, SHAPE OR SLOPE. AND YOU'LL LOOK AT A, A RECTANGLE AND YOU GO, HOW CAN THE WORLD THAT BE DIFFERENT? THAT'S UP IN THE OPINION OF THE BOARD. OKAY. YOU COULD GO BOTH DIRECTIONS ON THAT. YOU COULD SAY A RECTANGLE IS A RECTANGLE IS A RECTANGLE ON THE OTHER. YOU CAN SAY, WELL, IT'S A SLIGHTLY SMALLER RECTANGLE, BUT IT'S STILL A RECTANGLE. NO CASE SETS A PRECEDENT. GO AHEAD. ALRIGHT. SO AS FAR AS ADMINISTRATIVE APPEALS, UM, THOSE APPEALS TYPICALLY INVOLVE PERMANENT DENIAL, CO REVOCATIONS AND ENFORCEMENT ACTION. LATER THIS AFTERNOON, UH, THERESA CARLISLE ARE ATTORNEY IS GONNA TALK ABOUT THE WHOLE AO APPEAL PROCESS THAT HAS TICKED UP THIS LAST YEAR WE'VE HAD MORE AO APPEALS AND SO WE'LL TALK FURTHER ABOUT THAT IN THE SIMPLEST WAY. EMILY LIU IS THE DIRECTOR OF PLANNING DEVELOPMENT. SHE HAS THE CHIEF BUILDING OFFICIAL, SAM ESKANDAR, WHO MAKES DECISIONS ON WHETHER THINGS GET PERMITTED, WHETHER THINGS GET A CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY. IF SOME, IF THAT PERSON MAKES A DECISION CONTRARY TO YOU AS AN APPLICANT, MR. QUINT, YOU COULD APPEAL THAT DECISION TO THE BOARD. AND WE ARE A COURT THAT DECIDES WHETHER THE BUILDING OFFICIAL MADE THE RIGHT DECISION OR NOT. AND YOU LITERALLY HAVE A TRIAL AND YOU HAVE TWO SIDES TO THE TRIAL AND YOU CALL WITNESSES. THAT'S WHAT AO APPEALS ARE ABOUT. MM-HMM . OKAY. ALL RIGHT. MOVING ON TO MEETING STRUCTURE. UM, SO IT'S KIND OF SOMEWHAT TWO PARTS. SO OUR MORNING BRIEFING, UM, IT'S A PUBLIC SESSION, ALTHOUGH IT'S A PUBLIC SESSION, ONLY STAFF AND THE PANEL MEMBERS SPEAK DURING THIS TIME, TYPICALLY 10 30. WE SOMETIMES MOVE THAT TIME A LITTLE BIT EARLIER IF IT'S A BIGGER CASELOAD. UH, USED TO BE AT 11, BUT WE'D RUN OUT OF TIME AND PEOPLE WOULDN'T HAVE TIME FOR LUNCH. SO TYPICALLY BRIEFING START AT 10 30. YES. AND DURING THIS TIME, STAFF PRESENTS, UM, EACH CASE TO THE PANEL. UM, AND THE PANEL MEMBERS TYPICALLY ASK QUESTIONS REGARDING INFORMATION THAT, THAT THEY'VE RECEIVED. THAT IS A PERFECT TIME FOR YOU AS A BOARD MEMBER TO TALK TO THE APPLICANT WITHOUT TALKING TO THE APPLICANT. HOW DO YOU DO THAT? IF THE APPLICANT, THE, IF THE STAFFS HERE PRESENTING THE DETAILS ON IT, THE APPLICANT MAY BE IN THE AUDIENCE OR MAY BE WATCHING ONLINE, AND THAT'S WHEN YOU TELEGRAPH TO YOUR FORMER, YOUR FELLOW BOARD MEMBERS OR THE APPLICANT. WELL, I REALLY HAVE DOUBTS ABOUT THE ALLEY AND HOW THE ALLEY ENCROACHES ON THE VISIBILITY TRIANGLE. I'M REALLY GONNA BE INTERESTED IN SEEING FROM THE APPLICANT THIS AFTERNOON HOW THAT'S SAFE OR NOT, OR IF IT'S A PARKING ISSUE. I'M REALLY INTERESTED IN SEEING WHETHER THEY CAN JUSTIFY HAVING A 40% PARKING REDUCTION. YOU'RE TALKING TO THE APPLICANT WITHOUT TALKING TO THE APPLICANT, AND YOU'RE TELEGRAPHING TO YOUR FELLOW BOARD MEMBERS WHAT YOUR FRAME OF MIND IS AS IT RELATES TO THE FACTS AND THE QUESTIONS OF THE CASE. AND IT'S ALL IN THE PUBLIC SESSION. ALL RIGHT. THE AFTERNOON SESSION STARTS AT 1:00 PM AND IT'S ALSO A PUBLIC SESSION. DURING THIS TIME WE HAVE PUBLIC TESTIMONY, APPLICANT PRESENTATION AS WELL AS PUBLIC INPUT. AND THEN THE BOARD, UM, HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO, UM, ASK CLARIFYING QUESTIONS OF THE APPLICANT. I I MENTIONED THIS TO YOU, TO THE NEWBIES HERE. UH, DECISIONS BY STATE LAW REQUIRE A 75% AFFIRMATIVE VOTE. THE CITY COUNCIL IN DALLAS CREATED A BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT [03:55:01] OF 15 IN THREE PANELS, WHICH MEANS THAT FOR A PANEL TO MAKE A DECISION, IT HAS TO BE 75% OF FIVE, WHICH IS FOUR, WHICH MEANS FOUR OF THE FIVE MEMBERS ON YOUR PANEL HAVE TO VOTE IN FAVOR OF THE REQUEST PERIOD. IF YOU HAVE THREE OF FIVE, DOESN'T COUNT, ACTS ACTUALLY A DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE IF IT'S LEFT ALONE. SO IT'S FOUR. SO AS I'VE MENTIONED TO SEVERAL OF YOU, PART OF THIS QUITE HONESTLY, AND I'LL SAY THIS IN THE PUBLIC VEIN, IS YOU'RE ALSO CONVINCING YOUR OTHER PANEL MEMBERS OF YOUR OPINION AND YOUR OPINION FORMULATES WHEN YOU READ THE DOCKET. THEN IT CLARIFIES DURING THE, THE BRIEFING FROM THE STAFF AND THEN THROUGH THAT PUBLIC HEARING, YOU'RE DEDUCING, I'M IN FAVOR OR I'M AGAINST. AND THEN QUITE HONESTLY, IN THE PUBLIC SETTING, YOU'RE GONNA TRY TO CONVINCE YOUR FELLOW BOARD MEMBER THAT WE SHOULD GO FOR THIS OR WE SHOULDN'T AND WHY? AND GOING BACK TO MS. DAVIS'S QUESTION, YOU SHOULD CONVINCE THEM ONE WAY OR THE OTHER BASED ON THE CRITERIA AND USE THOSE WORDS BECAUSE THE, THE LANGUAGE THAT OUR BOARD ATTORNEY WILL GIVE US ZEROES RIGHT BACK TO WHAT'S IN THE LAW AND THE CRITERIA BECAUSE THAT'S THE WAY SHE CAN DEFEND OUR DECISION IF WE DO IT CONSISTENT WITH THE CRITERIA IN THE LAW. FOUR OF FIVE. THAT'S WHY IT'S JUST DEADLY TO HAVE A FOUR PERSON HANDLE A PANEL MEETING DEADLY. 'CAUSE THAT MEANS IT HAS TO UNANIMOUS AND WE'RE ALL HUMAN. AND INEVITABLY ONE OF FOUR OR ONE OF FIVE IS GONNA BE, HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION. BUT THAT'S OKAY. THAT'S THE WAY IT'S SET UP. WE'LL TALK MORE ABOUT THAT LATER. GO AHEAD. SO BOARD MEMBERS ARE ENCOURAGED TO ASK THOUGHTFUL AND RELEVANT QUESTIONS, UM, TO HELP CLARIFY FACTS OF EACH CASE FOR SPECIAL EXCEPTION. THESE QUESTIONS HAVE DETERMINE WHETHER THE REQUEST MEET SPECIFIC CRITERIA OUTLINED IN THE CODE AND WHETHER OR NOT IT'S APPROPRIATE FOR THE CONTEXT OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD. NO FOR VARIANCES. THE QUESTION SHOULD FOCUS ON WHETHER OR NOT THE APPLICANT HAS DEMONSTRATED A LEGITIMATE HARDSHIP DUE TO THE PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTIC OF THE PROPERTY. IN ALL CASES. IN ALL CASES, THE BURDEN IS ON THE APPLICANT. NOW WE HAVE ENCOURAGED THE STAFF OVER THE YEARS TO ASSIST BUT NOT DIRECT THE APPLICANT. YOU CAN ASSIST THE APPLICANT ON MAKE SURE YOU'RE AWARE YOU NEED TO COME TESTIFY. ONE THE BUT NOT DIRECT THE APPLICANT. IT IS THE APPLICANT'S RESPONSIBILITY TO MEET THE BURDEN. ALRIGHT, UM, FOR ADMINISTRATIVE DECISIONS, THESE QUESTIONS HELP THE BOARD EVALUATE WHETHER AN ERROR OCCURRED IN THE INTERPRETATION OR ENFORCEMENT OF THE CODE. UM, AS FAR AS MEETING CONDUCT, UM, TO ENSURE FAIR AND ORDERLY DELIBERATION, THE BOARD FOLLOWS ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER. MOVING ON TO VOTING REQUIREMENTS, UM, THE CHAIR BASICALLY JUST SPOKE ABOUT IT. A SUPER MAJORITY VOTE, UM, WHICH IS 75% OF THE MEMBERS OF A PANEL IS REQUIRED TO DECIDE IN FAVOR OF THE APPLICANT OR TO REVERSE A DECISION OF AN ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL. AS FAR AS POST-DECISION PROCESS, UM, DECISION LETTERS ARE SENT TO, UM, THE APPLICANTS WITHIN ONE TO TWO DAYS OF THE FINAL DECISION. UM, THE DECISIONS, UM, THE THEY ARE BINDING DECISIONS, UM, THEY ARE FINAL UNLESS THEY ARE APPEALED TO THE DISTRICT COURT. AND THE APPEALS, IF APPEALED MUST BE FILED, MUST BE FILED WITHIN 10 DAYS, 10 CALENDAR DAYS AFTER THE DATE THE DECISION IS FILED IN THE BOARD'S OFFICE. CONFLICTS OF INTEREST, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT. UM, DOS AND DON'TS. THEY'RE FINE. GO AHEAD. I DO WANNA MAKE ONE POINT OF CLARIFICATION AS FAR AS DUES. UM, READING THE STAFF REPORTS AND OR THE, UM, ENTIRE DOCKET AS STATED EARLIER IS IMPERATIVE. IF, HOWEVER, I WANTED TO, UM, MAKE A POINT TO SAY THAT READING THE ENTIRE DOCKET PRIOR TO THE MEETING WOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED, UM, INDEPENDENT RESEARCH. UM, AND IT'S HIGHLY ENCOURAGE THAT, UM, YOU ALL DO READ THE STAFF REPORTS AND EVERYTHING THAT'S INCLUDED IN THE DOCKET. SO I'M GONNA GIVE A COUPLE ANALOGIES AND THEN WE'RE GONNA HEAD TO LUNCH HERE. IS THAT IT ON YOUR LIST? OKAY. YES. UH, I'VE MENTIONED TO MANY OF YOU, WE ALL LIVE IN DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE CITY. WE'VE BEEN HERE ONE YEAR, FIVE YEARS, 10 YEARS, 20 YEARS, 60 YEARS, A LONG TIME. YOU CANNOT BLIND YOURSELF OF BEING A CITIZEN OF DALLAS AND A NEIGHBOR AND, AND, AND, AND KNOW A NEIGHBORHOOD, WHETHER IT'S DRIVING DOWN A STREET, KNOWING A SUPERMARKET, KNOWING A BUILDING GOING UP UNDER CONSTRUCTION. YOU, YOU SHOULD, YOU'RE NOT OBLIVIOUS TO THAT. WHAT YOU CAN'T DO IS SAY, I KNOW THAT NEIGHBORHOOD 'CAUSE I'VE LIVED THERE X NUMBER OF YEARS, AND OH BOY, I'VE BEEN TO THAT GROCERY STORE AND THEY HAVE PARKING PROBLEMS. THEN YOU'RE TESTIFYING. SO IT'S ONE [04:00:01] THING TO BE A, AN ACTIVE, VIBRANT CITIZEN THAT DRIVES AND, AND KNOWS THE CITY, AND KNOWS PRESTON ROAD OR KNOWS WALNUT HILL OR OH KNOWS ROYAL LANE AND HOW IT'S SIX LANE DIVIDED. THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. WHAT YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT IS TESTIFYING TO SOMETHING YOU KNOW THAT MAYBE SOMEONE ELSE DOESN'T KNOW. SAME THING WITH YOUR PROFESSION. THERE'S SOME REAL ESTATE PEOPLE IN THE ROOM. THERE'S SOME LAWYERS IN THE ROOM, THERE'S SOME ENGINEERS IN THE ROOM. AN ENGINEER SHOULD NEVER SAY I'M A CIVIL ENGINEER. AND SO I, FOR I KNOW EXACTLY HOW, WHAT THESE THINGS SHOULD BE, X, Y, Z OR A LAWYER SAYING, WELL, I'M A LAWYER. I'M, I PRACTICE THIS TYPE OF LAW OR THIS TYPE OF THING. AND BY GOSH, THIS IS THE WAY IT SHOULD BE HANDLED. OR A REAL ESTATE PROFESSIONAL SAYING, WELL, I'VE BEEN IN REAL ESTATE AND WHAT'S TYPICAL IN NEIGHBORHOODS IS THIS, BECAUSE I'VE BEEN IN REAL ESTATE. THOSE ARE ALL COMMENTS SHOULD BE KEPT INSIDE YOURSELF, NOT SPOKEN BECAUSE WE WANT TO GIVE EVERYONE A FAIR SHAKE AT THEIR REQUEST. ANYTHING ELSE? PLEASE COME BACK TO MYSELF OR TO ME, EXCUSE ME, THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR WITH ANY QUESTIONS. UH, ANOTHER COMMENT I'LL MAKE, AND THIS SOUNDS A, THIS SOUNDS A LITTLE, UM, STUFFY, BUT I STRONGLY URGE YOU IN MEETINGS THAT ARE IN PUBLIC TO REFER TO THE PRESIDING OFFICER AS PRESIDING OFFICER OR AS VICE CHAIR OR AS CHAIR, THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, BOARD ATTORNEY, BOARD SECRETARY, MR. MILLIKEN, DR. GLOVER, MS. GARNER, MR. SING. THAT IS A WAY TO KEEP IT THE EVERYTHING ON A PROFESSIONAL BASIS BECAUSE FOR THE NEW MEMBERS, YOU WILL FIND THERE'LL BE SOME VERY CONTENTIOUS HEARINGS WHERE YOU WILL VISIBLY DISAGREE WITH SOMEONE ELSE. THAT WE'VE GOTTA KEEP IT ON A PROFESSIONAL BASIS BASIS. SO AS SNOOTY, I AM SOMETIMES I ALWAYS TELL PEOPLE, REFER TO ME IN MY ROLE, PLEASE. AND I'LL ALWAYS REFER TO MR. DORN. I SOMETIMES SLIP WITH CAMIKA, THERESA AND MARY, BUT I, I WANNA REFER TO 'EM IN THEIR ROLES BECAUSE THEY, THAT'S PART OF HOW THEY ARE ABLE TO BE EFFECTIVE. MR. MILLIKEN? THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. UM, MY QUESTION IS, AND THIS COULD BE SOMETHING, UH, LATER FOR LEGAL, BUT ONCE WE'VE TAKEN THAT VOTE, UM, WE USUALLY HAVE A PERIOD FOR COMMENT. UM, IS THERE A GUIDELINE AS FAR AS COMMENT? 'CAUSE I KNOW SOMETIMES IT, IT'S BEEN OF MY OPINION, WHERE WE'VE BORDER GIVING INFORMA OR GIVEN OUR OPINION WHERE IT COULD BE BORDERLINE AS TO SHOWING FAVORITISM IN OUR DECISION. ARE, ARE YOU ME, ARE YOU SAYING MR. MILLIKEN, AFTER THE BOARD HAS VOTED YES, SIR. OR PRIOR TO THE VOTE? AFTER THE VOTE. WELL, I, I'LL I WILL MAKE A COMMENT THEN I'LL HAVE MS. BOARD ATTORNEY REINFORCE IT ONCE. FIRST OF ALL, THE BOARD ATTORNEY'S GONNA WANT US NOT TO TALK ABOUT IT AFTER THE PUBLIC HEARING UNTIL THERE WAS A MOTION ON THE FLOOR. RIGHT? MS. BOARD ATTORNEY. THAT'S ONE THAT IS CORRECT. SO SHE, SHE WANTS US TO HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR. SO THE PRESIDING OFFICER'S JOB IS TO SAY THE CHAIR WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO GET IT TO A DISCUSSION. SOMETIMES THERE'S OPEN-ENDED DISCUSSION, BUT YOU GOTTA BE CAREFUL ABOUT THAT. ONCE A MOTION'S ON THE FLOOR, THEN IT'S AN, IT'S AN ORDERLY DEBATE AMONGST THE FIVE PEOPLE, NOT THE STAFF, NOT THE APPLICANT. AND YOU HAVE AN ORDERLY DEBATE AND YOU GO THROUGH AND YOU, PRO CON, PRO CON, YOU TRY TO, TO PERSUADE THIS PERSON VERSUS THAT PERSON. USE THE CRITERIA. WHEN A VOTE IS CALLED AND A VOTE IS MADE, IT SHOULD BE DISCUSSION OVER THERE'S, IT'S VERY DANGEROUS FOR A DISCUSSION TO OCCUR AFTER THAT. UNLESS ACCORDING TO OUR RULES OF PROCEDURE, THERE'S A MOTION TO RECONSIDER. AND THAT IS VALID. YOU COULD MAKE A MOTION TO RECONSIDER. AND THAT'S HAPPENED WHERE WE'VE APPROVED SOMETHING OR DENIED SOMETHING, THEN MADE A MOTION TO RECONSIDER OUR RULES. SAY IT HAS TO BE ON THE SAME DAY. CAN'T WE USED TO BE, WE COULD DO IT THE NEXT MONTH, BUT THEN WE THOUGHT, WAIT A MINUTE, THEN WE'RE ALL TALKING ABOUT IT OUT IN PUBLIC LAND. WE CAN'T DO THAT. SO THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION AND MS. BOARD ATTORNEY, PLEASE VERIFY THERE SHOULD NOT BE A CONVERSATION ABOUT A DECISION MADE. WE SHOULD MOVE ON. THAT IS CORRECT. SO AT THE BRIEFING, IT SHOULD BE, THIS IS BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARING AT THE BRIEFING. IT SHOULD JUST BE QUESTIONS TO STAFF ONLY. AND IF YOU ARE TRYING TO MAKE COMMENTS TO THE APPLICANT, IT SHOULD BE IN A FORM OF A QUESTION. YOU SHOULD NOT COMMENT AT THAT PERIOD AT ALL DURING THE BRIEFING AND THEN AT THE PUBLIC HEARING, AT WHEN THE APPLICANT OR MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC ARE THERE TO SPEAK, THAT SHOULD ALSO BE QUESTIONED. AND THEN AS THE CHAIRMAN SAID, IT'S WHEN A MOTION IS ON THE FLOOR, IS WHEN YOU WOULD MAKE YOUR COMMENTS AND PERSUADE THE OTHER MEMBERS TO VOTE HOW YOU [04:05:01] WOULD LIKE TO OR NOT. I I THINK THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT. I'M NOT STRETCHING YOUR LUNCH, BUT I'LL BE QUICK HERE. UM, I I WILL SAY MANY TIMES, MR. HOPKOS, WAS THAT A QUESTION YOU ASKED OR A STATEMENT? ENCOURAGING HIM TO ASK IT IN A QUESTION FORMAT. HE'S GONNA BE ABLE TO SAY WHAT HE WANTS TO SAY. JUST PUT IT IN A QUESTION. IN A QUESTION. YOU'RE NOT TAKING A POSITION WHEN YOU MAKE A STATEMENT, YOU'RE TAKING A POSITION. NOW YOU CAN TAKE A POSITION ONCE THE MOTION'S ON THE FLOOR. BUT OTHER THAN THAT, SHOULD ALL OF THESE BE QUESTIONS? MR. MILLIKEN? I GUESS MY, MY MAIN QUESTION IS, ONCE THE VOTE HAS BEEN TAKEN, A CHAIR WILL USUALLY ASK FOR COMMENT. I I DON'T THINK, OKAY. WELL, IS IS THAT A QUESTION OR A STATEMENT? ? I'M ASKING THERE NOT BE ASKING FOR AN ANSWER. THERE SHOULD NOT BE. UH, ONCE THE BOARD HAS SPOKEN, THAT ISSUE'S CLOSED. AND QUITE HONESTLY, YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO TALK ABOUT IT FOR 10 DAYS UNTIL IT COULD BE APPEALED ONE WAY OR THE OTHER PERIOD. THAT, THAT'S THE REALITY. UM, I, I THINK MR. MILLER CAN ASK ME, ASK ME A QUESTION CHAIR, PLEASE. UH, I JUST WANT TO CLARIFY. UH, SO MR. MILLIKEN, I THINK WHAT YOU ARE, I THINK WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO SAY IS ONCE A MOTION IS ON THE FLOOR, THAT IS THE OPPORTUNITY THAT WE MM-HMM . THAT WE HAVE TO GIVE OUR OPINIONS, MAKE OUR STATEMENTS, CONVINCE OUR FELLOW BOARD MEMBERS, UM, MAYBE EVEN ASK SOME CLARIFYING QUESTIONS TO STAFF. MAYBE MM. REALLY SHOULDN'T ONCE A MOTION'S ON FLOOR. BUT YOU CAN, YOU JUST SHOULDN'T BE A LOT OF THAT. IT SHOULD BE ON THE MOTION. RIGHT, RIGHT. BUT, UM, I, I, I'M, I MEAN, I SERVE ON THE SAME PANEL AS YOU. I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH ANY TIME WE'VE HAD CONVERSATIONS AFTER WE'VE, UH, A A MOTION HAS BEEN MADE. WE VOTED AND IT HAS BEEN CLOSED. I'M NOT JUST, I THINK, I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHAT I THINK YOU'RE ASKING ABOUT. THAT PERIOD IN TIME WHEN A MOTION'S ON THE FLOOR, THIS IS AFTER A VOTE HAS BEEN TAKEN A MOTION, WE HAVE OUR SECOND MOTION. WE TAKE A VOTE AND WE ASK FOR COMMENTS ON THE DECISION. OKAY? SO I'M GONNA, I I WILL SAY DEFINITIVELY, AFTER A MOTION HAS BEEN ACKNOWLEDGED BY THE PRESIDING OFFICER, A SECOND HAS BEEN ACKNOWLEDGED, DISCUSSION IS HAD AND A VOTE IS TAKEN. THE PRESIDING OFFICER RECORDS IT. A PASSES IT FAILS. IF IT FAILS, IF IT FAILS WITH PREJUDICE OR WITHOUT PREJUDICE. PREJUDICE MEANS IT CANNOT COME BACK UNTIL TWO YEARS WITH WITHOUT PREJUDICE MEANS IT CAN COME BACK TOMORROW AND NO CONVERSATION SHOULD OCCUR. NOW IF IT'S KIBITZING, YOU ARE GONNA GO TO THE BATHROOM. YOU'RE INSIGNIFICANT, IRRELEVANT, SORT OF THING. IT'S NOT A DEAL. BUT DISCUSSION ON, ON A LIVE, IN A LIVE FORM SHOULD ABSOLUTELY NOT OCCUR. THE THE VOTES HAVE BEEN TAKEN. IT CREATES, IT CREATES A SENSE TO THE APPLICANT AND OR THE PUBLIC THAT THE DEBATE IS CONTINUING. AND IT HASN'T, IT STOPPED. MS. BOARD ATTORNEY, AM I CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT. LISTEN TO HOW SUCCINCT SHE IS. I'M VERBOSE. OKAY. WE'RE GOING TO, UM, WE'RE GOING TO RECESS FOR LUNCH. LUNCH IS RIGHT BEHIND US. UH, WE'LL HAVE AMPLE TIME, BUT DON'T TAKE TOO MUCH TIME. SO, UM, IT IS ONE 19 ON THE 28TH OF OCTOBER. UH, THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT IS GONNA BE IN RECESS UNTIL, UH, 1 45. CAN WE DO IT IN 25 MINUTES OR FOUR? UH, CAN WE DO IT IN 25 MINUTES TILL ONE 40 TILL ONE 50? WE'LL DO 30 MINUTES TILL 1:50 PM THANK YOU. ARE, ARE YOU ASKING A QUESTION OR ARE YOU MAKING A STATEMENT? UH, VERY GOOD. UH, WE'RE GONNA DO IT TILL ONE 50. THANK YOU. 1:50 PM I STAND CORRECTED. WHAT WE WILL DO IS FINISH THE REST OF, UH, THE BOARD ADMINISTRATORS AND THEN DO CITY ATTORNEY THINGS, AND THEN WE'LL DO OUR, UH, UH, ACTION ITEMS. BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT, UH, IS BACK IN SESSION TUESDAY, OCTOBER 28TH AT 1:50 PM UH, FROM OUR RECESS AND LUNCH BOARD MEMBERS. WHAT WE HAVE IN FRONT OF US IS STILL A TALL ORDER. UH, WE'RE GONNA HAVE, UH, SARAH MAY SPEAK TO US ABOUT PARKING CODE UPDATES AND HOPEFULLY MORE SPECIFICALLY TO HOW IT AFFECTS THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT GOING FORWARD. THEN WE'RE GONNA HAVE, UH, DALLAS ZONING REFORM, MICHAEL WADE. UM, THEN WE'RE GONNA SHIFT GEARS AND GO TO THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE TO GO A BUNCH OF THINGS. THEN WE'RE GONNA DO ACTION ITEMS. SO THAT ALL BEING SAID, OUR QUORUM IS 10 REQUIRED [04:10:01] BOARD HAS 15 MEMBERS, 13 ARE APPOINTED, AND 75% OF 13 IS 9.75. SO 10 IS OUR QUORUM. SO 10 IS THE MAGIC NUMBER FOR THE BALANCE OF THE DAY. ALRIGHT, MS. BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. ALRIGHT, MS. SARAH, MAY, WE WILL GO OVER THE PARKING CODE UPDATE. ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU SO MUCH. UH, MY NAME IS SARAH MAY. I AM, UH, A MANAGER, ONE OF THE ZONING DIVISION MANAGERS IN THE PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT. UM, AGAIN, NOT GOING OVER THIS ORDINANCE IN FULL 'CAUSE IT'S ABOUT 171 PAGES, SO WAY TOO MUCH. UM, BUT IT DID KIND OF DO A LOT OF CHANGES IN REGARDS TO, UM, THE OFF STREET PARKING REQUIREMENTS, UM, IN OUR CODE. UM, SO JUST AN OVERVIEW OF WHAT THE PRESENTATION WILL BE. UM, GONNA HA I HAVE ONE SLIDE ON OUR FORMER PARKING REGULATIONS. UM, I TOOK OUT ALL THE WHY KIND OF SLIDES THAT I HAD. UM, BECAUSE, UM, I WANTED TO DO THIS IN ABOUT 22 MINUTES, IS WHAT MY RECORD ON, UH, CITY PLANNING COMMISSION WAS. UH, I'LL GO OVER SOME SLIDES ON THE TIMELINE OF THE CODE AMENDMENT AND THEN I'LL JUST OVERVIEW ON WHAT KIND OF AMENDMENTS WERE ADOPTED. UM, AND I'LL BE VERY BRIEF. YES. SO I'M GONNA MOVE YOU ALONG. I'M NOT TO BE RUDE, SO , BUT BECAUSE I, I WANNA MAXIMIZE INFORMATION AND QUESTIONS MM-HMM . AND THEN I'VE GOT, WE'VE GOT BUNCHES MORE. SO YEAH. AND OKAY. IN, WE'LL GO FASTER THE, THE LEAST QUESTIONS THAT I HAVE. BUT I'LL, WE'LL CERTAINLY HAVE TIME. I, I, I, FOR QUESTIONS WITH EVERYONE, WITH THE GROUP'S, UM, DISCRETION TO THE, TO MYSELF. I WILL NOT WANT TO CUT YOU OFF. I WANT TO HEAR YOUR QUESTIONS, BUT WE GOTTA KEEP MOVING. ALRIGHT. PROCEED. ALRIGHT. OKAY. SO THIS ONE SLIDE IS JUST KIND OF GOING OVER WHAT OUR FORMER PARKING REGULATIONS USED TO DO. UM, FOR AN OFFICE BUILDING, UM, IT REQUIRED, UH, PARKING SUCH THAT IF YOU JUST DID A ONE STORY OFFICE BUILDING, ABOUT HALF OF YOUR LOT WAS DEDICATED FOR PARKING. UH, A RETAIL EVEN MORE THAN YOUR, UH, RETAIL SPACE WAS DEDICATED TO PARKING. AND FOR A RESTAURANT, REALLY YOU COULD ONLY HAVE ABOUT A QUARTER OF YOUR LOT, UM, DEDICATED TO A PLACE WHERE YOU ACTUALLY GENERATE REVENUE AND INCOME. UH, AND THE REST WAS FOR STORING CARS. SO, UM, THIS WAS VERY RESTRICTIVE ON DEVELOPMENT AND IT IN, UH, ENCOURAGED, UH, CAR RIDERSHIP. AND IT JUST REALLY WASN'T, UM, A MODERN WAY THAT IN BEST PRACTICES THAT, UM, CITIES THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY. DALLAS IS THE BIGGEST ONE, BY THE WAY, THAT ADOPTED SOME PARKING REFORMS. SO IT ALL STARTED IN 2019. I THINK I HAVE A LITTLE ECHO. UM, AND THEN IN, UH, 2020 THROUGH 2021, ABOUT 18 MONTHS, I THINK WE HAD 25 ZAC MEETINGS. LOTS OF DISCUSSIONS, BEST PRACTICES. UM, AND THEN IT TOOK A PAUSE AS WE REORGANIZED OUR DEPARTMENT AND ITS LEADERSHIP. AND THEN IT WAS RESTARTED AGAIN AUGUST 23 WITH SOME PUBLIC LISTENING SESSIONS AND IT WAS REINTRODUCED TO ZONING ORDINANCE ADVISORY COMMITTEE. THAT'S WHAT ZAC IS. UM, A BRIEFING HAPPENED AT THE END OF THE YEAR IN SEPTEMBER 23. UM, IT CAME BACK IN DECEMBER, UM, AND THEN AGAIN IN JANUARY, UH, WITH A RECOMMENDATION, WHICH WAS PRIMARILY, UM, FULL ELIMINATION. UM, AND THEN, UH, WE TOOK ANOTHER PAUSE TO ALLOW FORWARD DALLAS TO GO THROUGH CPC AND COUNCIL. UM, AND THEN IT WAS BROUGHT BACK TO CPC. UM, AND IF YOU COULD SEE ALL THOSE DATES THAT IT WENT TO CPC, THERE WAS HUNDREDS OF MOTIONS TO CHANGE THE PROPOSAL IN THAT TIME. UM, AND THERE WAS EVEN CHANGES AT THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, UH, COMMITTEE AND BY COUNCIL. SO, UM, REALLY THE BRIEFING IS TO KIND OF, UH, SUMMARIZE WHAT ALL THOSE, WHAT THE END RESULT WAS, SINCE Y'ALL DO CONSIDER PARKING, UH, SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS AND WHAT THE PURPOSE AND INTENT OF THE CODE IS. UM, SO I'M JUST GONNA GO OVER SOME, A FEW SLIDES OF TABLES. UM, REALLY THE RED IS WHAT I WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT. THERE'S A LOT THAT, UM, WERE REDUCED TO NO PARKING REQUIREMENTS. UM, UH, SO YOU COULD SEE ALL THOSE CATEGORIES FOR YOURSELF. UM, AND FOR THE INSTITUTIONAL USES, WE HAD CHURCH AND, UH, PUBLIC OR PRIVATE SCHOOL HAD SOME PARKING REQUIREMENTS. SO ONLY CHURCHES WITH [04:15:01] TWO 20,000 SQUARE FEET OR MORE RETAINED THE OLD PARKING REQUIREMENTS. AND SO FOR THE SMALLER CHURCHES, THERE'S NO PARKING REQUIRED. UH, SENIOR HIGH SCHOOLS RETAINED THEIR, UH, PREVIOUS PARKING REQUIREMENT OF NINE AND A HALF SPACES PER CLASSROOM. SO NONE IS REQUIRED FOR ELEMENTARY OR MIDDLE SCHOOL AND OR MOVING ON TO RESIDENTIAL. SO SINGLE FAMILY DUPLEX, UM, IN THE RDTH AND RTN DISTRICTS JUST REQUIRE ONE SPACE PER UNIT. UM, OTHERWISE THERE'S NO PARKING REQUIRED. UM, MULTIFAMILY HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION AND, UM, EMILY EVEN, UH, TOUCHED ON THIS THIS MORNING, BUT THERE'S BASICALLY THREE TIERS OF MULTIFAMILY. UM, SO UNDER 20 UNITS, THERE'S NO PARKING REQUIRED. 21, 299 IS A HALF SPACE PER UNIT, AND 200 ABOVE IS JUST ONE SPACE PER UNIT. UM, THERE WAS ALSO A LOT OF DISCUSSION ON GUEST PARKING FROM MULTIFAMILY, AND YOU MIGHT NOTICE THAT THE TIERS ARE DIFFERENT. THAT'S BECAUSE THIS WAS ALL THE, THE, A LOT OF THE DISCUSSION, UM, AT ALL THESE MEETINGS WAS WHAT TIERS AND HOW MUCH TO REQUIRE. UM, SO ABOVE 20, THERE'S A PERCENTAGE OF THE REQUIRED SPACES THAT, UM, THAT DETERMINE HOW MUCH GUEST PARKING YOU NEED. I'M ASSUMING ALL THIS IS UPLOADED IN THIS, IN THE PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENTS, GIS AND ALL THOSE SYSTEMS. RIGHT? ALL THIS NEW CODE. WELL, IT'S CODE REQUIREMENT. IT'S NOT G IT'S A IS WELL, OKAY, NOT GIS IT'S A RHETORICAL QUESTION 'CAUSE WE'VE DEALT WITH CHANGES IN THE ORDINANCE THAT DON'T GET UPLOADED. HAS ALL THIS BEEN UPLOADED IN THE SYSTEM? IT HAS BEEN PUBLISHED TO THE CITY SECRETARY'S I KNOW, OFFICE. UM, BUT IT'S 171 PAGES. SO IT'S PROBABLY, BUT WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET TO AVOID ANOTHER THICKET MM-HMM . SO HAS ALL THIS BEEN UPLOADED SO EVERYONE WITHIN PLANNING, DEVELOPMENT AND PERMITTING IS AWARE OF ALL THESE NEW RULES? YES. THANK YOU. AND ANOTHER NICE THING ABOUT THIS IS IT'S RELAXING CODES INSTEAD OF MAKING THEM MORE RESTRICTIVE LIKE, LIKE IT HAD. UM, SO DEVELOPERS ARE HAPPY TO KNOW WHEN WE ARE RELAXING, YOU KNOW, REGULATIONS FOR THEM. YEAH. UM, OKAY. SO, UH, WE'VE GOT TWO TABLES OF RETAIL LAND USES. AND YOU'LL NOTICE THAT MOST OF THESE ARE NONE. UM, ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGE ESTABLISHMENTS, WHICH ARE LIKE YOUR BAR, BAR, LOUNGE, TAVERN, MICRO DISTILLERY, MICRO BREWERY. UM, AND OUR COMMERCIAL AMUSEMENT INSIDE WERE BASICALLY REDUCED TO ONE PER 200. IT USED TO BE ONE PER 100. UM, OUR RESTAURANTS ALSO HAD A LOT OF, UH, SPEAKING TIME AND IT WAS CHANGED TO ONE PER 200 SQUARE FEET OF FLOOR AREA, UM, AFTER, UH, 22,500 SQUARE FEET. SO NO PARKING FOR THE FIRST 2,500 SQUARE FEET. UM, AND THEN WE HAVE ALL THESE OTHER CATEGORIES THAT JUST HAVE NONE, WHOOPS, OVER HERE. UM, THIS SLIDE AND THE NEXT SLIDE ARE SIMILAR. UM, THE COMMERCIAL AND BUSINESS SERVICE USES AND THE INDUSTRIAL USES ALL HAD A MOTION TO BE REDUCED TO ONE PER 500. UM, AND THAT ONLY APPLIES WHEN THEY WERE CONTIGUOUS TO AN OUR DISTRICT. EVERYONE NEEDS TO MAKE SURE YOUR VOLUME IS OFF ON YOUR LAPTOP OR IPAD, PLEASE. UM, BECAUSE THERE'S A LITTLE ECHOING GOING ON. ALRIGHT, CONTINUE. IT DOES SOUND BETTER. THANK YOU. UM, SO THESE PARKING RATIOS FOR THIS CATEGORY AND THE NEXT INDUSTRIAL, UM, IS ONLY APPLIES WHEN THEY HAVE, IT SEEMS TO BE GETTING WORSE. I THINK I AM MUTED. HOLD ON A SECOND. LET ME JUST, UH, DANIEL MOORE, ARE YOU ON? ARE YOU CONNECTED ON, PLEASE TURN YOUR VOLUME OFF. OKAY. OKAY. PROCEED, MS. MAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. SO ONCE AGAIN, IT'S, UH, IF YOU'RE CONTIGUOUS TO SINGLE FAMILY, THEN YOU WOULD HAVE THESE PARKING REQUIREMENTS, BUT IF YOU'RE NOT CONTIGUOUS, YOU DON'T HAVE ANY PARKING REQUIREMENTS, I THINK WE'RE GONNA TRY TO TAKE HIM OUT. . OKAY. THERE YOU GO. THANK YOU. YOU'RE WELCOME. THANK YOU. OKAY. UM, SO, UM, THIS SLIDE IS KIND OF THE, ANOTHER BULKY SLIDE, BUT I'M TRYING TO, UM, DISTILL A VERY COMPLICATED SET OF MOTIONS INTO, UH, A SINGULAR CONCEPT. SO THIS SLIDE I CALL THE EXCEPTION SLIDE. SO THE THREE BULLETS ARE WHERE NO PARKING [04:20:01] IS REQUIRED, AND AN EXCEPTION TO THE EXCEPTION IS THE MODIFIED DELTA OVERLAY. SO, UM, AND I'LL, I HAVE SOME SLIDES TO BETTER EXPLAIN THIS COMING UP NEXT. SO, UM, THERE IS A MOTION FOR THE MODIFIED DELTA OVERLAY TO BASICALLY RETAIN THEIR PRE PARKING REFORM PARKING REQUIREMENTS. AND IF YOU'RE NOT FAMILIAR WITH THE MODIFIED DELTA OVERLAY, THAT'S OKAY BECAUSE IT'S A VERY SMALL PART OF THE CITY. UM, HERE YOU'LL SEE THIS, UH, GRAY, UM, AREAS OVER HERE. THERE ARE THREE LITTLE, UH, SPOTS ON LOWER GREENVILLE, AND THEY REALLY LIKED THEIR PARKING RATIOS. SO THE, THERE WAS A MOTION TO BASICALLY, UM, SPECIFY WHICH USES DON'T GET ANY CHANGES FOR PARKING REQUIREMENTS. UM, AND I'M, IT COULD TAKE A WHOLE OTHER HOUR AND A HALF, SO I'M NOT GOING OVER THOSE. UM, ALSO THERE WAS, UM, SO EVEN FOR THOSE LAND USES LIKE A RESTAURANT AND MULTIFAMILY AND LARGE CHURCHES THAT I JUST WENT OVER THAT SAID THAT THEY DO HAVE PARKING REQUIREMENTS, UM, WHEN THEY'RE IN BASE ZONING AND THEY'RE WITHIN A HALF MILE OF A TRAIN, UH, LIGHT RAIL STATION. THEY'RE EXEMPTED FROM PARKING REQUIREMENTS. UH, SAME THING WITH THE CENTRAL AREA DISTRICT, WHICH IS DOWNTOWN. UM, ALSO IF THEY HAVE ANY KIND OF HISTORIC DESIGNATION, UM, THERE IS NO PARKING REQUIREMENTS FOR THOSE SITES. AND, UM, IT ALSO AMENDED THE ADMINISTRATIVE PARKING REDUCTION, UM, AND INCREASED IT TO A MAXIMUM OF 50%. AND THIS ALLOWS THE DIRECTOR SO NOT COMING BEFORE A PUBLIC HEARING TO REDUCE THE, THE PARKING REQUIREMENT TO UP TO 50%. UM, BUT THEY WOULD HAVE TO PROVE THAT IT DOES NOT WARRANT THAT. UM, THEY CAN ALSO MS. MAY UHHUH , YOU SAID THIS CHANGE, SO PREVIOUS TO THIS, THE DIRECTOR HAD THE AUTHORITY TO UNILATERALLY GRANT AN EXCEPTION UP TO 25%. YES. HOW, HOW OFTEN WAS THAT AUTHORITY EXERCISED? AS OFTEN AS THEY COULD , BUT IT WAS A SMALL REDUCTION. IT WAS ONLY ABOUT 10%. UM, IT WAS PRIMARILY FOR WAREHOUSE AND INDUSTRIAL USES, AND THEY HAD SOME OTHER CRITERIA ABOUT WALKING DISTANCE THROUGH A TRAIN STATION. SO IT WAS PRETTY NARROW ON WHAT THE, UM, THE PREVIOUS RIGHT. THE PREVIOUS WAS PRETTY NARROW, UM, AND LIMITED. SO IT, I MEAN, AS OFTEN AS THEY COULD DO IT, THEY WOULD, BUT IT WASN'T VERY SIGNIFICANT. OKAY. UM, IT ALSO, THIS ACTUALLY WASN'T NEW, IT JUST MOVED IT UP A LITTLE BIT. UM, BUT IT SAYS APPLICANTS MAY SEEK A SPECIAL EXCEPTION TO THE PARKING REQUIREMENTS UNDER THIS CODE. UM, BUT ONLY THE GREATER WILL APPLY. BASICALLY, THEY CAN'T COMBINE BOTH THE, UM, THE ADMINISTRATIVE PARKING REDUCTION AND A REDUCTION BY THE BOARD. UM, AND IT, IT ALSO IS, WAS IMPORTANT TO CPC THAT IT'S STILL NOT AVAILABLE TO, TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THIS ADMINISTRATIVE REDUCTION, UM, IN PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS, UH, WITH SPECIFIC RATIOS UNLESS THE PD SPECIFIES THEY CAN. UM, SO THAT WAS REALLY IMPORTANT TO CPC. UM, AND THEN I JUST KIND OF WANTED TO GIVE A BRIEF OVERVIEW ON HOW ALL THIS APPLIES TO PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS BECAUSE WE HAVE SO MANY OF THEM IN THE CITY. SO I HAVE THREE EXAMPLES. SO OUR FIRST ONE, UM, IS NOT USUALLY HOW ALL THE PDS ARE DONE, BUT PD 1 93 IS A VERY LARGE PD. SO, UH, IT WARRANTS, UH, BEING POINTED OUT. SO IF A PD SPECIFIES THE PARKING RATIO OF A PARTICULAR USE, THEY CANNOT GO BACK TO CHAPTER 51 A AND SAY, OH, WE GET TO BE REDUCED. SO IF A PD IS SPECIFIC ABOUT SOMETHING, IT'S WHATEVER THE PD SAYS. UM, MOST OF OUR, LIKE IN FREQUENCY, MAYBE NOT IN AREA, BUT IN FREQUENCY, UM, MOST OF OUR PDS JUST, UH, POINT BACK TO THE DEVELOPMENT CODE FOR PARKING RATIOS. SO WHEN THEY MAKE NO MODIFICATIONS TO RATIOS OR LAND USES, THEN THEY CAN GO BACK TO THE DEVELOPMENT CODE. AND THEN A LOT OF THE TIMES WE HAVE PDS THAT IT'S KIND OF A HYBRID APPROACH. SO THEY'LL LIST, UM, RATIOS FOR PARTICULAR USES, BUT NOT EVERY SINGLE USE THAT IS ALLOWED IN THE CODE. SO THAT'S HAPPENED HERE IN PD 6 21, WHICH IS THE DESI DESIGN DISTRICT. UM, IT DOES NOT LIST THE LAND USE CALLED, UM, COMMERCIAL AMUSEMENT INSIDE. 'CAUSE IT'S NOT [04:25:01] LISTED, IF YOU'LL NOTICE HERE, IT'S AN ALPHABETICAL ORDER. AND SO, UM, SO THE ONES THAT ARE, IT'S SILENT ON, THEY CAN TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE REDUCED RATIOS, BUT WHEN THEY ARE SPECIFIED, THEY CANNOT. OKAY. IT ALSO INTRODUCED SOME PARKING DESIGN CHANGES. UM, AND THIS IS IMPORTANT TO THE BOARD BECAUSE AS I'LL GET TO IT IN A MINUTE, UM, PART OF THE, UH, SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS THAT WERE INTRODUCED, UM, HAVE TO BE CONSISTENT WITH THE PURPOSE AND INTENT. AND SO TO DISCLOSE WHAT THE INTENT IS, IT'S IN THE CODE AND IT SAYS PARKING LOTS AND STRUCTURES MUST BE DESIGNED TO PRIORITIZE PEDESTRIAN SAFETY, CONVENIENCE, AND CONNECTION TO THE EXISTING NETWORK, YADA YADA. AND SO BASICALLY IT'S IMPORTANT THAT THE PARKING LOT DESIGNS ARE THERE TO PROTECT AND, UH, PRIORITIZE PEDESTRIAN ACTIVITY. SO, UM, THIS IS PROBABLY LIKE THE MOST SIGNIFICANT DESIGN CHANGE THAT, UH, WAS INTRODUCED. AND IT SAID IN A, A PARKING LOT WITH 50 OR MORE SPACES, THEY HAVE TO HAVE AT LEAST ONE PEDESTRIAN WALKWAY THAT CONNECTS TO THE PRIMARY ENTRANCE OF THE BUILDING AND THE NEAREST PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY. SO YOU'LL SEE THAT PICTURE ON THE RIGHT. IT'LL SHOW, IT SHOWS HOW THERE'S A WALKWAY THAT CONNECTS THE STREET TO THIS, UM, UM, GROCERY STORE. THIS IS NOT IN DALLAS. UM, AND IT SAYS, WHEN CROSSING A DRIVE AISLE, THE PATHWAY MUST BE A CONTRASTING COLOR MATERIAL OR TEXTURE AND RAISED TO THE LEVEL OF THE SIDEWALK. SO, UM, AND I'LL GET BACK TO THE SPECIAL EXCEPTION AFTER THIS BRIEF, UH, TWO OTHERS. SO TREE TREES HAVE TO BE PROTECTED. UM, AND WATER SHALL NOT DRAIN ACROSS THE SIDEWALK BECAUSE IT GETS SLIPPERY, MUDDY DESTROYS THE PUBLIC INFRASTRUCTURE THAT'S IN THERE WHEN THERE'S WATER. UM, AND SO THESE WERE ADDED TO THE CODE. UM, AND SO ANOTHER ADMINISTRATIVE WAIVER SAYS THE DIRECTOR CAN WAIVE IT IF IT'S, UH, IF STRICT ADHERENCE, UH, CANNOT BE MET DUE TO THE PRESENCE OF STREET EASEMENTS, UH, UTILITIES, OR IF THERE'S AN INCREASE IN DANGER TO PEDESTRIAN CYCLISTS OR MOTORISTS RESULTING FROM STRICT ADHERENCE TO THE REGULATIONS. SO IT'S IMPORTANT TO KNOW WHAT THE DIRECTOR HAS THE ABILITY TO WAIVE, BECAUSE IF THEY CAN'T MAKE THAT, YOU KNOW, HAPPEN BECAUSE THESE, UH, THREE ELEMENTS CANNOT BE MET, THEN THEY CAN GO TO THE BOARD AND ASK FOR A SPECIAL EXCEPTION TO ANY OF THESE PARKING LOT DESIGN STANDARDS. UM, IF STRICT COMPLIANCE IS IMP PRACTICAL DUE TO SITE CONSTRAINTS THAT WOULD RESULT IN A SUBSTANTIAL HARDSHIP, UM, PROVIDED, DO YOU ENVISION A SITUATION WHERE AN APPLICANT COMES, MAKES A CASE TO THE DIRECTOR OF PLANNING DEVELOPMENT AND THEN IF THAT DOESN'T WORK, THEN FILES A CASE WITH THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT? YES. ABSOLUTELY. AND WHAT IF THE PLANNING DIRECT DIRECTOR PLANNING AND A DEVELOPMENT APPROVES, CAN THEY STILL COME TO THE BOARD OF JUSTICE FOR SOMETHING MORE? YES, IT'S POSSIBLE. THEY JUST CAN'T COMBINE, RIGHT? WELL, IT DOESN'T SAY THEY CAN'T COMBINE THE CODE DOESN'T SPECIFY. THEY CANNOT COMBINE. OKAY. BUT, BUT ONE OPTION DOES NOT NEGATE THE OTHER. RIGHT. THEY HAVE THE ABILITY TO GO EITHER DIRECTION, BUT IT WOULD BE, UM, SMARTER OR BOTH. IF THEY FAIL IN ONE, THEY GO TO THE NEXT ONE. YES. THEY CAN DO EITHER MM-HMM . UM, YES. SO IN DETERMINING, IN DETERMINING WHETHER TO GRANT A DEVIATION FROM THESE DESIGN STANDARDS, THE DIRECTOR OR BOARD SHALL CONSIDER WHETHER, SORRY, I HAVE TO MOVE THIS WINDOW, WHETHER THE RESULTING DEVELOPMENT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE PURPOSE OF THE DEVELOPMENT CODE AND WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. SO THAT WAS THAT BEGINNING SLIDE THAT I SAID THAT WE'RE PRIORITIZING PEDESTRIAN, UH, CONNECTIVITY. UM, AND THEN POSSIBLY IF THERE'S ANY SPECIFIC LITERATURE IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. UM, SO OF COURSE YOUR STAFF WILL BRIEF YOU ON ANY OF THOSE THINGS. OKAY. BACK TO THIS SLIDE. OKAY. AND ONE OTHER CHANGE IS, UM, IT WAS REALLY KIND OF AN UPDATE. UM, AND IT, AND ESSENTIALLY IT'S REQUIRING THAT, UM, WHEEL BARRIERS AND WHEEL GUARDS ARE, UM, PLACED SO THAT THE PEDESTRIAN PATHWAY, UM, LANDSCAPING OR REQUIRED SCREENING ELEMENTS ARE PROTECTED FROM CARS RUNNING INTO HIM. SO THAT PICTURE ON THE TOP IS SHOWING WHAT WE WANT TO AVOID. WE DON'T WANT CARS TO HANG OVER THE PEDESTRIAN WALK. [04:30:01] WE WANT TO PROTECT IT. OKAY. AND ONE LAST THING. UM, THIS IS, UH, AS, AS FAR AS IT, UH, RELATES TO THE BOARD, I, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE EXPERIENCE, BUT I KNOW THAT I'VE SEEN SOME VARIANCES COME THROUGH WHERE A REAR ENTRY GARAGE IS LESS THAN 20 FEET FROM AN ALLEY. AND SO THEY WOULD HAVE TO COME IN FOR VARIANCE AND PROVING THAT VARIANCE STANDARD. UM, UH, BUT ESSENTIALLY, UH, WE TOOK OUT THAT REQUIREMENT TO BE, UM, SET BACK 20 FEET FROM AN ALLEY. SO NOW PEOPLE CAN HAVE A REAR ENTRY FROM AN ALLEY, UM, GARAGE AND IT COULD BE CLOSER THAN 20 FEET TO THE ALLEY. SO WE'RE HOPING THAT WILL RESULT IN SOME MORE REAR ENTRY GARAGES AND, UM, MAYBE REDUCE OUR IMPERVIOUS SURFACES THAT WE HAVE BUILT IN THE CITY. UM, SO THAT WAS THE INTENT ON THAT. UM, IT ALSO CHANGED SOME BICYCLE PARKING STANDARDS. IT INCREASED IT AND IT CHANGED IT FROM A RATIO OF BEING BASED ON REQUIRED PARKING. SINCE THOSE ARE VERY REDUCED OR ELIMINATED, UH, IN THE REFORM TO BEING BASED OFF OF HOW MANY ARE PROVIDED. UM, IT ESTABLISHED A DISTANCE, UH, LIMIT ON HOW FAR THEY CAN PUT BICYCLE RACKS FROM THE PRIMARY ENTRANCE. IT HAS TO BE AN ACCESSIBLE LOCATION. IT CHANGED CLASS ONE AND CLASS TWO TERMS, THE SHORT TERM AND LONG TERM. SO WHAT ABOUT THE CALCULATION THAT WE'VE SEEN IN SOME PARKING SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS FOR BICYCLE, YOU GET A CERTAIN PARKING SPACE CREDIT FOR A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF BICYCLES. IS THAT STILL IN PLACE? I THINK IT IS. OKAY. I CALL THAT THIS DOESN'T ADDRESS THAT. THIS ACTUALLY SAYS THAT, THAT YOU HAVE TO HAVE TWO PER BUILDING, RIGHT? OR ONE FOR EVERY 20 CAR PARKING SPACES. THAT'S RIGHT. ALRIGHT. BUT, BUT THE WHOLE CREDIT YOU GET FOR BICYCLE SPOTS FOR PARKING SPACES IS STILL IN EFFECT. Y YES. OKAY. UNLESS, OKAY. YES, I'M GETTING A NOD OVER THERE. . UM, IT ALSO, UM, ESTABLISH SOME GRAPHICS TO OUR CODE BECAUSE, UH, WE SAW THAT IT WAS KIND OF DIFFICULT TO TRANSLATE WORDS INTO GRAPHICS. UM, AND SO IT, UH, REINFORCED THAT THE GRID STYLE AND THE WAVE STYLE BIKE RACKS ARE NOT WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR. WE'RE LOOKING FOR THESE, UM, BICYCLE RACKS WHERE THEY COULD BE SECURED IN TWO PLACES. UM, SO THAT WAS HELPFUL. AND, UH, THIS IS JUST A CATCHALL SLIDE TALK ABOUT WE UPDATED SOME LOADING STANDARDS AND ALLOW REMOTE, UH, LOADING TO HAPPEN. UM, REMOTE PARKING DISTANCES HAVE BEEN INCREASED. WE UPDATED THE DEFINITION OF PARK COMMERCIAL PARKING LOT AND ADDED AN RARA RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCY REVIEW STANDARD. UM, AND, UH, THERE WERE SOME OTHER ENFORCEMENT THINGS THAT WERE ADDED. UM, AND THAT'S, THAT'S THE PRESENTATION THAT IS OUTSTANDING, VERY EFFICIENT MODEL FOR OTHER PRESENTERS. I SHOULD HAVE SAID THAT EARLIER TODAY. THAT WAS THE FEEDBACK I HAD AT LUNCH FROM MEMBERS, BUT THAT WAS A MODEL PRESENTATION. MS. MAY THANK YOU QUESTIONS FOR MS. SARAH MAY REGARDING THE PARKING UPDATE. I'LL MAKE AN EDITORIAL COMMENT. IT IS, IT IS THE CITY COUNCIL'S DECISION TO MAKE THE POLICY AS IT RELATES TO PARKING. THE BOARD'S ROLE IS TO HEAR REQUESTS ON A SPECIAL EXCEPTION BASIS ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS. UH, WE WOULD HEAR, AND WE STILL WILL HEAR A LOT OF PARKING CASES BECAUSE OF THE PDS AND PEOPLE ARE GONNA MOAN AND GROAN. WELL, IT'S REQUIRING THIS, WELL, THE CITY COUNCIL DIDN'T CHANGE THE POLICY ON PARKING FOR PDS. SO, UH, BUT AGAIN, I I REGULARLY SAY WE DON'T SET THE POLICY. THE CITY COUNCIL SETS THE POLICY, SETS THE RATIOS. WE JUST HAVE A HEARING AND LISTEN TO A, AN APPLICANT AND HOW IT WOULD AFFECT, HOW IT WOULD CREATE A TRAFFIC OR STREET HAZARD CONDITION OR WHATEVER THE CODE SAYS IS RELATES TO THAT. OKAY. I'M JUST RE-READING THAT BECAUSE OUR ROLE IS NOT TO SET THE PARKING STANDARDS, OUR ROLE. AND IT'S A HARD THING, SARAH, I WOULD SAY MS. MAY, THE TIMES THAT WE'VE HAD PARKING CASES, IT'S LIKE, OKAY, WELL HOW DO YOU, HOW DO YOU KNOW WHETHER TO BELIEVE THIS PREPAID PARKING STUDY VERSUS WHAT WE SEE HERE VERSUS OUR PERCEPTION OF THAT PLACE IS ALWAYS PACKED AND HOW THEY CAN NEVER GET A PARKING SPACE. THAT WAS THE QUESTION. HOW DO WE, HOW CAN, HOW CAN YOU AND THE STAFF HELP US BETTER UNDERSTAND PARKING SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS? YEAH. 'CAUSE WE'RE STILL GONNA HAVE A GAZILLION OF THEM. MM-HMM . BECAUSE OF THE PDS. WELL, ONE, ONE THING TO NOTE IS THAT THE CODE REFORM DIDN'T CHANGE THE STANDARD, UH, FOR THE BOARD IN GRANTING THOSE. AND I BELIEVE, IF I CAN REMEMBER IN, PLEASE HELP ME IF I [04:35:01] GET IT WRONG, BUT I THINK THE STANDARD IS, UM, AS LONG AS IT DOESN'T CAUSE A TRAFFIC HAZARD AND CONGESTION ON SURROUNDING STREETS AND SOMETHING TO THAT EFFECT. SO YOU, YOU DO HAVE THE ABILITY TO MAKE THOSE DECISIONS BASED ON TRAFFIC AND THINGS LIKE THAT. SO, UH, THE APPLICANTS OFTEN PREPARE A TRAFFIC REPORT AND WE HAVE A TRAFFIC ENGINEER ON STAFF AND, AND THEY'RE HAPPY TO, UM, EXPRESS IF THEY AGREE WITH THAT ENGINEER OR NOT. MR. CHAIR, IF I MAY ONE SECOND. MR. FINNEY, I'M ASKING THE BOARD ATTORNEY TO, TO TELL US AGAIN WHAT THE STANDARD IS FOR THESE PARKING CASES. YOU WANT ME TO GO TO MR. FINNEY OR ARE YOU READY? MR. FINNEY? UH, JUST TO RIFF ON YOUR POINT, UM, AND WHAT MS. MAY SAID IN RESPONSE, I THINK ONE THING THAT WOULD HELP WHAT WE, WE TYPICALLY WILL BRING THE TRAFFIC ENGINEER TO COME UP AND TESTIFY. AND WHAT WE TYPICALLY GET IS VERY, UH, KIND OF QUALITATIVE ANSWERS, UM, WITHOUT DATA. I THINK WHAT ONE THING THAT WOULD STREAMLINE OUR DECISION WOULD BE ACTUAL QUANTITATIVE DATA. YOU KNOW, WE DID THIS TRAFFIC ANALYSIS AND WE GOT THESE RESULTS, BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW PRACTICAL THAT IS FOR EVERY SINGLE, UH, BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT CASE THAT, YOU KNOW, REQUIRES THIS. SO, BUT I THINK THAT HAVING HARD FACTS, HARD DATA, UM, THERE'S BEEN A LACK OF THAT WHEN WE'VE, WE'VE HAD THE TRAFFIC ENGINEERS TESTIFY. AND I THINK THAT WOULD BE ONE THING THAT WOULD HELP. I WOULD AGREE. UH, REMEMBER WHEN NOW THE, IT'S ALWAYS CASE BY CASE, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE TO ME IN THE HISTORY OF TIME, SOMEONE THAT COMES WITH THIS WITH A TRAFFIC STUDY, IT'S PREPAID AND PRE-BAKED. SO , WE WANT THIS TO COME UP WITH 235 SPACES. HOW ABOUT THAT 235 IS WHAT THE PROJECTION IS. I ALWAYS QUESTION HOW THE NEED IS CALCULATED EXACTLY TO WHAT THE SPACES ARE ON THE LOT. MS. UH, BOARD ATTORNEY, WHAT IS THE CRITERIA FROM THE CODE FOR US UNDER SECTION 51 A DASH 4.311, IT STATES THE BOARD MAY GRANT A SPECIAL EXCEPTION TO AUTHORIZE A REDUCTION IN THE NUMBER OF OFF STREET PARKING SPACES REQUIRED UNDER THIS ARTICLE. IF THE BOARD FINDS THAT THE PARKING DEMAND GENERATED BY THE USE DOES NOT WARRANT THE NUMBER OF OFF STREET PARKING SPACES REQUIRED, AND THE SPECIAL EXCEPTION WOULD NOT CREATE HAZARD OR INCREASE TRAFFIC CONGESTION ON ADJACENT OR NEARBY STREETS. SO TO APPLY THAT TO A CASE THAT COMES TO US, YOU JUST HAVE TO KEEP REPEATING THAT TO YOURSELF AND TO THE APPLICANT AND TO YOUR FELLOW PANEL MEMBERS. 'CAUSE THAT'S THE CRITERIA. IT DOES NOT REQUIRE IT BASED ON YOUR INTERPRETATION OF THE REQUEST. AND IT DOES NOT CREATE A TRAFFIC TRAFFIC HAZARD. A TRAFFIC HAZARD. TRAFFIC HAZARD OR INCREASED TRAFFIC CONGESTION. THANK YOU. AND THAT'S THE CRITERIA OVER AND OVER. AND AGAIN, IT DEPENDS ON FOUR OF THE FIVE MEMBERS. THAT'S HOW A VOTE IS CARRIED. MS. DR. GLOVER, UM, I'M JUST SEEKING A LITTLE CLARIFICATION 'CAUSE ON, UM, SLIDE 1 0 5 OF PAGE 16, IT SAYS, APPLICANT MAY SEEK A SPECIAL EXEMPTION EXEMPTION TO PARKING REQUIREMENTS UNDER 51 A DASH 4.31 AND AN ADMINISTRATIVE PARKING REDUCTION UNDER THIS SECTION, THE GREATER REDUCTION WILL APPLY, BUT THE REDUCTIONS MAY NOT BE COMBINED. CAN YOU CLARIFY THAT? YES. SO, UM, THEY CAN ASK FOR UP TO A 50% PARKING REDUCTION AS AN ADMINISTRATIVE WAIVER. UM, AND USUALLY THEY'RE LIMITED TO 25% TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS. SO THEY CANNOT GET A COMBINED 75% I THOUGHT THEN IT GOES TO A VARIANCE FOR OVER 25. RIGHT. SO THE BOARD IS LIMITED TO 25 AS A SPECIAL EXCEPTION, BUT A VARIANCE COULD BE OVER, BUT THE ADMINISTRATIVE OH, CAN GO UP TO 50%. OKAY. RIGHT. Y'ALL ARE STILL LIMITED TO 25%, BUT AGAIN, ON A VARIANCE YOU CAN DO RIGHT. 50 TRUE. YES. BUT BECAUSE WE'VE HAD SITUATIONS WHERE PEOPLE SAY, OH NO, I WANT TO DO IT AS A VARIANCE SO THEY CAN GET MORE, BUT OUR STANDARD'S DIFFERENT. IT'S NOT THE STANDARD THAT MS. CARLISLE JUST MENTIONED. IT'S THE STANDARDS OF THOSE THREE COMPONENTS. OKAY. SO, ALRIGHT, WHAT OTHER QUESTIONS? AND I THINK THERE ARE SOME USES THAT MODIFY THAT 25%. WHAT ARE THE QUESTIONS? THIS IS, THIS IS IMPACTFUL BECAUSE THESE ARE LIVE CASES THAT ARE GONNA COME TO US. SO THE ASSUMPTION IS THAT OUR GOOD STAFF HERE IS GONNA HAVE CASE REPORTS WITH THIS NEW STANDARD IN IT. NOW, ONE OF THE THINGS WE'VE [04:40:01] EXPERIENCED A COUPLE TIMES IN THE LAST SEVERAL MONTHS SINCE THIS PAST IS WE HAD APPLICANTS THAT WOULD COME TO US CASE BY CASE BASIS. NOTHING SETS A PRECEDENT THAT SAYS, WAIT A MINUTE, WE SHOULDN'T BE HELD TO A HIGHER STANDARD IN THIS PD BECAUSE THE CITY COUNCIL ALREADY LOWERED THE STANDARD FOR EVERYONE ELSE. MM-HMM. MM-HMM. THEY DIDN'T CHANGE IT FOR PDS, BUT THAT'S WHAT A TYPICAL ARGUMENT THAT'S GONNA COME IS. WELL, THE CITY RESTAURANTS OR OTHERS THAT THEY'VE CHANGED THAT. SO, BUT WITHIN A PD IT IT, IF, IF THE, THERE'S A PARKING STANDARD CALLED, IT HASN'T CHANGED. IF IT'S SILENT, I'LL GO TO YOU. ONE SECOND. MS. GARNER, IF IT'S SILENT, THEN IT IS THE NEW STANDARDS. OKAY, MS. GARNER. THANK YOU. UM, I'M JUST WONDERING IF THE CITY ATTORNEY COULD STATE THE, UM, THE, UH, DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE SECTION AGAIN SLOWLY SO I CAN WRITE IT DOWN FOR OUR STANDARD 51 A DASH 4.311 SUBSECTION A. OKAY. THANK YOU. IT WILL BE IN EVERY DOCKET YOU HAVE THAT RELATES TO THAT SPELLED OUT WORD FOR WORD I WAS TRYING TO FIND SPECIFICALLY. OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MS. MAINE? DR. GLOVER, WHAT, WHAT ARE THE GUIDELINES YOU HAVE WHEN IT COMES TO TRAFFIC SURVEYS? UH, WHY I ASK THIS IS THAT I'VE SEEN, UM, DEVELOPERS ACTUALLY DO TRAFFIC SURVEYS AND THEY'VE BEEN APPROVED AND, UH, NEW DEVELOPERS HAVE COME AND BUILT BIGGER PROPERTIES THAN THE ONES THAT WERE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED. AND LATER THOSE DEVELOPERS CAME AND BUILT. AND BECAUSE THEY CAME AT A LATER DATE, THEY CREATED CONGESTION AND TRAFFIC IN THAT AREA. SO WHAT ARE THE GUIDELINES OR MODALITIES THAT YOU HAVE IN PLACE TO CHECK THESE THINGS? IT MIGHT BE A BETTER QUESTION FOR DAVID NAVAREZ, SINCE HE'S OUR TRAFFIC ENGINEER. . I THINK, UM, UH, THERE'S, THERE'S A SHIFT AND A NEW WAY OF THINKING AND PLANNING, UM, THAT WE SHOULD DEAL WITH, UM, TRANSPORTATION AS A MULTIMODAL THING, THAT PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE CHOICES ON WHERE THEY'RE GOING. UM, AND WE SHOULDN'T OVERBUILD ANY PARKING SPACES 'CAUSE THAT HAS A LOT OF OTHER, UM, NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES TO OUR ENVIRONMENT, TO OUR CITY. UM, SO I THINK THAT WAS THE PRIMARY REASON OF REDUCTION, REDUCING THE PARKING REQUIREMENTS. UM, BUT, UH, AS FAR AS THE STANDARDS THAT TRAFFIC ENGINEERS DO, I WOULD, WE WOULD BE BETTER OFF LISTENING TO DAVID NAVAREZ, UM, ON THAT. THEY, FROM MY UNDERSTANDING, AS THEY USE THE INTERNATIONAL TRAFFIC ENGINEERS MANUAL AND DRAW SOME ASSUMPTIONS AND, AND THEY PUT IT ALL IN A REPORT FOR YOU TO CONSIDER. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, MS. MAY VERY MUCH APPRECIATE IT. AGAIN, MODEL PRESENTER, EVERYONE ELSE SHOULD LISTEN TO. OKAY. UH, MS. BOARD ADMINISTRATOR NEXT TRAINING ITEM. MR. MICHAEL WADE WILL PRESENT, UM, INFORMATION ON THE DALLAS ZONING AND REFORM, AND HE'S CHIEF PLANNER FOR CODE AMENDMENTS. MR. WADE, COME ON DOWN. THERE YOU GO. HE'S RUNNING, RUN INTO THE PODIUM. WHO IS THAT? WAS THAT BOB BARKER USED TO SAY, COME ON DOWN. THAT'S FOR THE PRICE IS RIGHT, OR LET'S MAKE A DEAL. THANK YOU SO MUCH. GIMME JUST ONE MOMENT. OKAY. WE'RE USED TO HAVING A LAPTOP HERE WHERE I CAN PLUG IN MY POWERPOINT, SO I'M NOT SURE WHERE THIS IS GOING, IF I CAN GET ASSISTANCE. NOPE. UH, HE'S GOT, HE'S GOT A, HE'S GOT A USB. OH, I'M SORRY. I COULD HAVE BROUGHT MY LAPTOP AFTER HIS PRESENTATION. WE'RE SHIFTING TO THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE AND MR. THERESA CARLISLE. OKAY. SO MR. WADE, UH, I WAS IN MY MEETING WITH, UM, EMILY LEW, THE DIRECTOR A WEEK, TWO WEEKS AGO, AND I SHOWED HER WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO ON OUR AGENDA, AND SHE SAID, OH, MR. CHAIRMAN, PLEASE, CAN YOU HAVE, UH, MICHAEL WADE SPEAK ABOUT DOW'S ZONING REFORM? SO YOU GOT ADDED TO THE AGENDA AT HER REQUEST. SO DON'T SCREW THIS UP. OH, THANK YOU. I I KNOW I'M USED TO BLAMING MY DIRECTOR ANYWAY, YOU KNOW, SO , I'M JUST SAYING YOU'RE HERE BECAUSE SHE SAID, OH, YOU NEED TO HEAR FROM HIM ON THIS PROJECT. SHE TOUCHED ON IT A LITTLE BIT THIS MORNING. YES. AND I, I WILL GIVE YOU AN UPDATE. I'M GOING TO SHARE MY SCREEN VERY EFFICIENTLY. IT'S A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT, UH, [04:45:02] DIFFERENT ONE TODAY. IT WILL BE EFFICIENT, IT WILL BE SHORT A LITTLE BIT. UM, WE WANT TO, YOU KNOW, KEEP YOUR, KEEP THE ATTENTION, KEEP THE ENERGY HIGH. OKAY. SO THANK YOU SO MUCH. AGAIN, SCOOT THIS MY WAY A LITTLE BIT. MY NAME IS MICHAEL WADE, CHIEF PLANNER FOR CODE AMENDMENTS. UM, I'M HAPPY TO MEET ALL OF YOU. I KNOW SOME OF Y'ALL ARE NEW TO THE, THE BOARD, UM, BUT I KNOW THAT I'M PROBABLY NEWER TO DALLAS THAN A LOT OF YOU HAVE ONLY BEEN HERE FOR TWO AND A HALF YEARS OR SO. UM, AND SO WE'RE EXCITED ON THE UPSTREAM SIDE, THOSE OF US WHO ARE WORKING ON WRITING CODE AMENDING CODE TO GIVE Y'ALL SOMETHING AMAZING TO WORK WITH. WE WANT TO GIVE YOU, YOU KNOW, AS LITTLE WORK AS POSSIBLE, OR AT LEAST MAKE IT AS EASY AND CLEAR AS POSSIBLE. SO LET'S DIVE IN. UM, I'M PROVIDING A QR CODE ON EACH ONE OF THESE SLIDES. AND THROUGHOUT THIS, I'M GONNA HAVE A VERY SIMILAR REFRAIN. GO TO WWW.DALLASZONINGREFORM.COM FOR ALL THE INFORMATION YOU COULD EVER WANT ON THIS PROJECT. SO, UH, YOU SAW THIS SLIDE EARLIER FROM OUR DIRECTOR. WE WANT THIS NEW CODE TO BE SIMPLE, CLEAR, AND FUTURE READY. THERE'S GENERAL CONSENSUS THAT OUR CURRENT CODE IS NOT DOING GREAT AT THESE GOALS. UM, I WILL GO INTO WHO'S WORKING ON THIS PROJECT IN JUST A MOMENT, BUT IN VERY EARLY, UH, INTERVIEWS WITH KIND OF DAILY USERS, PROFESSIONAL USERS, YOU KNOW, ARCHITECTS, ET CETERA, WITH THE CODE. UH, IT CAN BE A REAL PAIN. AND SO, UH, I'LL TAKE A JUST A MOMENT TO TAKE A STRAW POLL. WHO'S EVER WORKED WITH A ZONING CODE IN A DIFFERENT CITY OUTSIDE OF DALLAS? I'VE HAD THE, THE FORTUNE OF WORKING IN MINNESOTA AND, UH, REVIEWING SEVERAL AROUND THE COUNTRY. WE HAVE ONE THAT IS SO FULL OF ELEGANT SOLUTIONS. IT BECOMES A LITTLE GET LITTLE BIT NO LONGER ELEGANT AFTER A CERTAIN POINT. UM, AND THAT'S ALSO SORT OF ANTICIPATED BY 1100 PLUS PLAN DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS. MANY JUST ONE PARCEL. THAT'S NOT THE POINT OF A PD. YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT A LOT OF UNIQUE HOSPITAL DESIGNS. THAT'S WHAT PDS ARE FOR, MAYBE, UH, HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOODS, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. THOSE ARE WHAT THOSE ARE FOR. SO, UH, VERY GENERAL CONSENSUS THAT OUR CODE, WHICH IS BASED ON A FRAMEWORK FROM THE 1960S, BUT HONESTLY IT CARRIES FORWARD A LOT OF CONCEPTS FROM THE 1920S. THE WORLD HAS CHANGED. UH, DALLAS IS CHANGING, EVEN JUST IN THE LAST 10 YEARS. THEIR DEMOGRAPHIC CHANGES, CHANGES IN, UH, EXPECTATIONS FOR HOUSING, EXPECTATIONS FOR TRANSPORTATION, EXPECTATIONS FOR, UH, JUST CITY GOVERNMENT OVERALL. AND WE KNOW THAT A GOOD CODE IS GOOD GOVERNMENT AND THAT'S WHAT WE OWE TO OUR RESIDENTS. SO, SIMPLE, CLEAR, FUTURE READY. WHO'S WORKING ON THIS? YOU HEARD FROM OUR DIRECTOR EMILY LIU, AND THEN I THINK YOU ALL KNOW DEPUTY DIRECTOR DR. ANDREA UREA. THEY ARE THE CHAMPIONS. THEY'RE REALLY PUTTING THE, THE WIND AND THE SAILS. UM, VERY OFTEN WHEN Y'ALL ARE WANTING TO INTERACT ON THIS OR WHEN CITY PLAN COMMISSIONS, CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, ET CETERA, UH, AS YOU DISCUSSED AT LENGTH EARLIER, THERE'S THAT LAYER OF LEADERSHIP THERE. UM, PROJECT MANAGERS, MEGAN WEIMER, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, MEGAN WEER AND MYSELF ARE HANDLING THE DAY-TO-DAY OF THE CONTRACT, FACILITATING MEETINGS, ET CETERA. CONSULTANTS, WE HAVE CONTRACTED WITH ROS. THEY'RE A GROUP FROM CHICAGO. THEY HAVE DECADES OF EXPERIENCE WORKING ON LAND USE PLANS, ZONING, UH, CODES, ET CETERA. WE'RE EXCITED TO HAVE THEM ON BOARD THERE. THE ONES REALLY IN THE CAVE AT MIDNIGHT, LAMP ON SCRIBBLING OUT THERE, THE NEW CODE, BRINGING IT TOGETHER AS ONE COHERENT SYSTEM. ZOE COMMUNICATIONS AGENCY IS BASED HERE IN DALLAS. THEY HAVE BEEN JUST A PHENOMENAL PARTNER RIGHT OUT OF THE GATE. THEY'RE PRETTY NEW TO THE TEAM, BUT THEY ARE THE EARS AND ALSO THE STORYTELLERS OF THIS PROJECT. ZONING IS WONKY. WE KNOW YOU GUYS ARE REALLY IN THE THICK OF IT, YOU GUYS. UH, THIS IS A DETAIL BODY. A LOT OF US ARE IN ZONING BECAUSE WE APPRECIATE THAT KIND OF THING. WE, HOWEVER, UH, MOST PEOPLE WHO WANT TO ENGAGE ON THIS HAVEN'T HEARD OF ZONING OR THEY ONLY HEAR ABOUT IT BECAUSE ONE CASE IN THEIR NEIGHBORHOOD IS IMPACTING THEM AND THEY FEEL UNPREPARED. SO IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT FOR US TO HAVE A, A QUALIFIED, UH, COMMUNICATIONS AGENCY ON OUR SIDE TO INFORM AND HELP UNDERSTAND AND ALSO RECEIVE INPUT AND RECEIVE INFORMATION. I'M USING THIS VERY BROAD AND ALMOST DISRESPECTFULLY BROAD INTERDEPARTMENTAL STAFF JUST TO KEEP US MOVING. WE HAVE SO MANY STAFF WITHIN PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT, UM, AND THEN WITHIN CODE ENFORCEMENT WITH TRANSPORTATION, OEQS, PARKS, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, HOUSING, ET CETERA, WHO ARE GIVING INPUT TO THIS. SO WHAT ARE OUR OBJECTIVES? THESE REALLY FALL WITHIN TWO BUCKETS. THERE'S SORT OF A QUALITATIVE OR POLICY SIDE, AND I'M SORRY, MY SLIDES, UH, MAY LOOK A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. THE INFORMATION'S THE SAME. UM, BUT BECAUSE OF THE LAST MINUTE, UM, SCHEDULING OF THIS, I WAS ABLE TO BUFF THEM UP JUST A LITTLE BIT. [04:50:01] SO THERE'S SORT OF TWO BUCKETS, UH, WITH THEIR OWN UNIQUE DECISIONS, IMPLEMENTING FORWARD DALLAS 2.0, THAT WAS A GREAT BIG COMMUNITY CONVERSATION. IT WAS VOTED IN BY CITY COUNCIL AND WE'RE REQUIRED BY STATE LAW TO HAVE A ZONING CODE THAT IMPLEMENTS THAT CODE. NOW, ONE OF MY PROFESSORS IN GRAD SCHOOL DESCRIBED THE LAND USE PLAN AS GENERALLY THE PLAN FOR THE MEAL. IT'S GOING TO BE A THREE COURSE ITALIAN MEAL. OKAY, GREAT. THE ZONING CODE. HOW DO YOU MAKE THE SALAD, HOW DO YOU MAKE THE NOODLES, UH, HOW EXACTLY DO YOU MAKE THE DESSERT? WE'RE WORKING OUT THE DETAILS OF BRINGING THOSE CONCEPTS, THOSE SOCIAL CONCEPTS DOWN TO THE REGULATORY LEVEL. SO OF COURSE, FORWARD DALLAS IS DIVIDED UP INTO SEVERAL SECTIONS, UH, WITH TOPICAL FOCI, ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT, TRANSIT ORIENTED DEVELOPMENT, HOUSING CHOICE AND ACCESS, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, REVITALIZATION AND COMMUNITY AND URBAN DESIGN. AND THEY EACH HAVE THEIR OWN IMPLEMENTATION ITEMS. THEY HAVE, UH, EXPLANATIONS OF THOSE POLICY GOALS, ET CETERA. AND THEN JUST IN GENERAL, UH, WE WANT SUSTAINABLE AND RESILIENT DEVELOPMENT. WE WANT BUILD BUILDINGS THAT WILL STAND THE TEST OF TIME. WE WANT URBAN FORM THAT WILL STAND THE TEST OF TIME. AND WE WANT REGULATIONS THAT WILL EASILY FACILITATE UPDATING WHEN THAT'S NECESSARY. WE'RE LOOKING AT OBJECTIVE DESIGN STANDARDS. SO WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT OUR MEASUREMENTS ONCE AND FOR ALL. HAVE A SYSTEM OF MEASUREMENTS, FOR EXAMPLE, AND THEN THE ORGANIZATION OF THE CODE. THE CODE IS A TOOL IS THE OTHER BUCKET. UM, REGARDLESS OF HOUSING, REGARDLESS OF, UM, ENVIRONMENTAL SUSTAINABILITY, ET CETERA. CAN SOMEONE READ THE CODE? DOES A PROPERTY OWNER UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY CAN DO ON THEIR PROPERTY, UNDERSTAND WHAT THEIR NEIGHBORS CAN DO ON THEIR PROPERTY, ET CETERA. WE WANT IT TO BE TRANSPARENT. WE DON'T WANT ZONING DECISIONS. THE RESULT OF BACK ROOM DEALS. THIS IS A PUBLIC CONVERSATION, WHETHER IT'S DONE HERE, WHETHER IT'S DONE AT CITY COUNCIL, CITY PLAN COMMISSION, ET CETERA. AND SO WE WANT TO DEPOLITICIZE THIS. WE WANNA REDUCE DEPENDENCY ON SPECIAL APPROVALS. NOW WE'RE NOT SAYING STRIP IT OF ALL SPECIAL APPROVALS. THAT WOULD BE AN APPROPRIATE, WE WANT A RESILIENT CODE. AND SO VARIANCES, SPECIAL APPROVALS, ET CETERA, THOSE ARE DEFINITELY STILL IN THE MIX. WE JUST WANT THOSE TO BE, UH, A RARITY. THE POINT IS THAT THAT EXPANDS THE CAPACITY OF A SOCIETY IN USING ZONING TO SHAPE THEIR CITY. GOOD TO CATCH MY BREATH FOR A MOMENT. AND THEN OF COURSE, INCREASING TRANSPARENCY AND MODERNIZING THE CODE TOO. THERE ARE A LOT OF WEB-BASED PLATFORMS WHERE YOU CAN HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION YOU CAN IMAGINE RIGHT AT YOUR FINGERTIPS. IT SIMPLY TAKES ONE GREAT BIG STEP UPWARD. WE'VE GOTTA GO FROM PLATEAU TO PLATEAU. SOME OF THESE IMPROVEMENTS CAN'T HAPPEN. ONE CODE AMENDMENT AT A TIME. SO I'M GOING TO TALK A BIT ABOUT PROCESS HERE. I'M GOING TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT A CODE DIAGNOSTIC, AND THEN I'M GOING TO BE OUT AND, UH, WE'RE HAPPY TO TAKE QUESTIONS. UM, WWW.DALLASZONINGREFORM.COM. I'M GONNA TELL YOU WHAT I'M TELLING YOU AND THEN I'M GONNA TELL YOU AGAIN. SO WHAT WE'VE DONE SO FAR, ROS HAS DEVELOPED THE DIAGNOSTIC. IT'S A COLLABORATIVE ASSESSMENT BASED ON THEIR KNOWLEDGE AND EXPERTISE BASED ON INPUT FROM, AGAIN, WHAT I CALL DAILY USERS OF THE CODE ARCHITECTS, ET CETERA. UM, AND THEN THAT WAS FOLLOWED UP BY A LOT OF, UH, VERY OPEN AND PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT TOO. SO, UM, WE'LL TALK ABOUT THE DIAGNOSTIC IN JUST A MOMENT, BUT THAT'S THEM SAYING, OKAY, WE HEAR WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE CODE. WE THINK IN GENERAL LET'S EXPLORE THESE PATHS AS WE'RE DRAFTING OUR CODE. MEANWHILE, ZONING AND CITY STAFF ARE GOING ABOUT ENGAGEMENT IN THREE PHASES. WE'VE ALREADY STARTED ON THE BUILDING AWARENESS PHASE. UH, WE'VE RECEIVED INPUT FROM JUST OVER 700 FOLKS. WE'VE GOT AN EMAIL LIST WITH OVER 300 FOLKS, AND WE'VE, UH, I JUST WAS EMAILED THIS MORNING. WE HAVE ALMOST 7,000 VISITS TO THE WEBSITE SO FAR. AND SO EVEN THOUGH WE ASSIGNED THIS CONTRACT TO AMIRO A LITTLE WHILE AGO, THIS WASN'T A VERY PUBLIC THING UNTIL RECENTLY. SO PEOPLE ARE EXTREMELY ENGAGED. PEOPLE ARE EXCITED TO LEARN ABOUT IT AND LEARN WHAT KIND OF PARTICIPATION THEY CAN EXERCISE. SO RIGHT NOW, BUILDING AWARENESS IS JUST TELLING PEOPLE WE'RE DOING IT. AND BY THE WAY, HERE'S WHAT ZONING IS. AGAIN, MOST PEOPLE DON'T SWIM IN THE WATERS THAT WE DO. THE NEXT PHASE OF ENGAGEMENT, DEVELOPING UNDERSTANDING. SO HERE'S WHAT ZONING IS, WHAT DOES IT MEAN FOR YOU? WHAT DOES IT MEAN ON YOUR LOT? UH, WHAT DOES IT MEAN FOR PEOPLE JUST GENERALLY IN YOUR LIFE EXPERIENCE? ARE YOU A HOMEOWNER? ARE YOU A BUSINESS OWNER? UM, ARE YOU HISTORICALLY UNDERENGAGED, ET CETERA. AND SO ZOE'S DOING A GOOD JOB OF BUILDING THOSE TARGET AUDIENCES AND THE UNIQUE MESSAGES THAT, UH, WILL INVITE THEM [04:55:01] INTO THE CONVERSATION. ALL OF THAT LEADS UP TO THE PRODUCTION OF THE FIRST DRAFT. WE'RE LOOKING FORWARD TO THIS AT AN ESTIMATED END OF SPRING 2026. UM, THE TIMELINE HAS ALREADY BEEN EXPANDED A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE, UH, CITY COUNCIL ASKED FOR MORE, UH, PUBLIC INPUT, WHICH WE PROVIDED SEVERAL DAYS FULL IN SEPTEMBER OF VIRTUAL INPUT DIRECTLY TO KAROS. UM, AND SO AS WE DEVELOP UNDERSTANDING, WE ARE DRIVING PARTICIPATION TO GIVE FEEDBACK ON THAT FIRST DRAFT. CIRRUS WILL THEN TAKE THAT FEEDBACK. AND AGAIN, THAT'S, THAT'S GOING TO INCLUDE WHAT THEY CALL THE ROADSHOW COMMUNITY MEETINGS, MORE COMMUNITY COMMUNITY MEETINGS THAN WE'VE ALREADY HAD AROUND THE CITY. UM, THEY'RE GONNA TAKE THAT FEEDBACK AND SAY, OKAY, WE DIDN'T GET IT RIGHT WITH THIS FIRST DRAFT. HERE ARE THE WAYS THAT WE CAN POLISH IT UP. HAVE A GREAT, UH, SECOND AND PREFERABLY FINAL DRAFT. THIS IS THE WORLD OF ZONING. INTELLIGENT PEOPLE CAN DISAGREE ON THINGS AND SOMETIMES, UH, YOU ACHIEVE AS CLOSE TO CONSENSUS AS YOU CAN AND YOU MOVE FORWARD. SO WE'RE LOOKING FOR HOPEFULLY A FINAL DRAFT BY THE END OF 2026. AND THEN IT CAN FORMALLY ENTER THE ADOPTION PROCESS. THE ZONING ORDINANCE ADVISORY COMMITTEE IS THE COMMITTEE OF THE CPC THAT WILL, UM, BE MOSTLY HANDLING THIS. AND THEN IT GOES TO CITY PLAN COMMISSION AND CITY COUNCIL. AND THEN THERE'S A WHOLE IMPLEMENTATION REGIMEN. ONCE CITY COUNCIL ADOPTS SOMETHING, UM, THAT OUR CONSULTANT CIRS WILL WALK US THROUGH THE DEVELOPMENT CODE DIAGNOSTIC, UH, THIS IS ONLINE, WWW.DALLASZONINGREFORM.COM. THERE ARE ALSO SOME HARD COPIES IN THE BREAK ROOM IF, UH, YOU TAKE A BATHROOM BREAK AND JUST NEED MORE ZONING IN YOUR LIFE. UM, THAT IS DESCRIBING THE GENERAL DIRECTION THAT THE CONSULTANT IS SAYING WE LOOK. AND SO THIS IS DONE PART AND PARCEL AND COOPERATION WITH STAFF AT THE SAME TIME. THEY'RE LEARNING FOR US FROM US AND WE'RE LEARNING FROM THEM. AND SO THIS IS WHERE THEY'VE IDENTIFIED ISSUES AND GENERALLY SET CONCEPTUAL APPROACHES. IT'S BASED ON QUITE A BIT OF STAKEHOLDER INPUT AND HAS BEEN DISCUSSED AT ZAC CITY PLAN COMMISSION, CITY COUNCIL, AND TODAY OF COURSE, BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AS WELL AS PRESENTATIONS WITH SOME OTHER, UH, PRIVATE SECTOR NONPROFIT PARTNERS. IT GOES THROUGH THE POINT OF ZONING IN THE FIRST PLACE, CODE ORGANIZATION, DISTRICT STRUCTURE ADMINISTRATION, EVERYTHING. UM, SOME OF THE DISCUSSION AND RECOMMENDATION IN THERE IS STILL PRETTY BROAD. AGAIN, THAT'S NOT A FORMAL RECOMMENDATION. IT'S, UH, YOUR FIRST TRIP TO THE DOCTOR AND THE DOCTOR SAYING, OKAY, IN GENERAL, HERE'S THE PROBLEM AND HERE'S WHAT WE'RE GOING TO EXPLORE TO FIX IT. SOME OF THOSE GENERAL RECOMMENDATIONS, CREATION OF A NEW CHAPTER. SO EVENTUALLY MOVING OUT OF 51 A RIGHT NOW WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS A NEW CHAPTER AND A MAP AMENDMENT THAT FOLLOWS. SO FOR EXAMPLE, IF THERE WAS JUST AN AMENDMENT TO 51 A, UH, THOSE WOULD IMMEDIATELY AFFECT ALL OF THE LOTS ON THE GROUND WITH A NEW CHAPTER. WE CAN CREATE NEW DISTRICTS, WE CAN CREATE THIS COHESIVE SYSTEM AND THEN APPLY IT PROPERTY BY PROPERTY, REZONING BY REZONING, CITY INITIATED REZONING, ET CETERA. UM, OVER TIME, THEY'RE LOOKING AT BUILDING A LOGICAL, COMPREHENSIVE ORGANIZATION OF ARTICLES RATHER THAN ONE THAT'S JUST BEEN THE PRODUCT OF CODE AMENDMENT F CODE AMENDMENT, SIMPLIFYING DISTRICTS AND EXPANDING SOME MIXED USE AND LOWER DENSITY RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS. WE HAVE A BIT OF REDUNDANCY AND THEN WE HAVE A FEW, NOT A FEW, WE HAVE A LOT OF PARCELS THAT ARE ACTUALLY NON-CONFORMING AND THAT SHOWS MAYBE OUR CODE ISN'T WORKING FOR THE CITY AS IT IS RIGHT NOW. UM, ENSURING UP-TO-DATE LAND USES, REVIEWS, APPROVALS, SETBACKS, ET CETERA. ALL OF THOSE, AGAIN, THEY'RE BRINGING AN EYE AND IT'S A FRESH EYE AND IT'S AN EXPERIENCED EYE TO DO THESE. MAKE SENSE? IS THIS COHERENT, EXPANDING AND ENHANCING DESIGN STANDARDS? WE KNOW THAT SO MUCH OF THE DISCUSSION AROUND LAND USES ISN'T JUST WHAT IT IS, BUT IT'S HOW IT'S DONE. HOW IS IT BUILT? AND IN THE END, UH, I'M MY GUILTY PLEASURE IS ENVIRONMENTAL PSYCHOLOGY. HOW DOES THIS MAKE YOU FEEL AS YOU'RE WALKING DOWN THE STREET? WHAT DOES THIS TELL US ABOUT WHO WE ARE AS A SOCIETY? AND THEN CLARIFYING ADMINISTRATION NOTES ON SITE PLAN REVIEW, NONCONFORMITIES, SUBDIVISION, ET CETERA. AGAIN, SIMPLE, CLEAR, FUTURE READY. SO THAT'S MY PRESENTATION TODAY. AGAIN, I HAPPILY DIRECT YOU TO, TO THE DIAGNOSTIC, UM, THAT GIVES OUR DIRECTION. WE ARE ENTERING INTO THE DRAFTING PHASE AND THE BUILDING AWARENESS PHASE OF ENGAGEMENT. AND SO, UH, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER QUESTIONS ON PROCESS, WWW.DALLASZONINGREFORM.COM. THANK YOU. THANK YOU MR. WADE. UM, QUESTIONS FOR MR. WADE. UM, [05:00:01] ARE THERE, HAVE YOU FINISHED YOUR COMMUNITY OUTREACH MEETINGS OR ARE THOSE ONGOING? THOSE ARE ONGOING. OKAY. THEY WILL GO ON FOR THE LIFE OF THE PROJECT. SO I WOULD, I WOULD THINK IT'D BE WORTHWHILE IN ADDING THE EMAIL ADDRESSES OF THESE 21 MEMBERS, UM, TO YOUR LIST TO INCLUDE THEM IF THEY CARE TO PARTICIPATE. I'VE SHOWN UP AT TWO OF YOUR EVENTS, UM, AND THEY'RE VERY INTERESTING. UH, AND IT'S A WAY FOR YOU ALL AS MEMBERS OF THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT TO HAVE INPUT IN THE EVENTUAL ZONING DOCUMENT THAT WE WILL BE RESPONSIBLE FOR INTERPRETING AND, AND ADJUDICATING WHEN CASES COME. I JUST THINK IT'S WORTHWHILE TO INC INCLUDE THIS GROUP ON FUTURE MEETINGS IN SOS PLACES. OKAY. YES, MS. HAYDEN. SO I, I KNOW YOU'VE PROBABLY HEARD EARLIER IN THE MEETING, THEY'VE, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME ISSUES WITH, UM, JUST TRYING TO FIND THE MOST CURRENT ZONING ONLINE. LIKE IF I'M A HOMEOWNER AND I WANT TO PUT A FENCE IN AND I GO ONLINE AND TRY TO FIND WHAT MY ZONING IS, I DON'T HAVE ANY CONFIDENCE THAT THAT'S ACTUALLY UPDATED OR IT'S, YOU KNOW, JUST BASED ON WHAT MY EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN ON THIS PANEL. SO I'M ASSUMING THAT THAT'S, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE ULTIMATE GOALS OF THIS IS TO, TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT IS, IS CURRENT, THAT AS SOON AS THE COUNCIL, UM, APPROVES THE ZONING THIS, UH, CHANGE THAT, THAT GETS UPDATED AND IT'S EASY. AND THEN, LIKE YOU SAID, TRANSPARENT, BUT IF YOU COULD ELABORATE ON THAT. SURE. I I HAPPILY TO HAPPY TO SAY THAT THAT'S, THAT'S A GOAL EVEN RIGHT NOW IN IMPROVING OUR COMMUNICATION PROCESS. SO, YOU KNOW, WE, WE HAD A MASSIVE PARKING REFORM CODE AMENDMENT. UM, IT TOOK, ONCE IT WAS ADOPTED, IT TOOK THE CITY ATTORNEY, UM, QUITE A WHILE TO DRAFT UP THE EXACT ORDINANCE. HOW WILL THIS BE IMPLEMENTED? AND THEN IT TAKES TIME TO GET INTO A, A ALEGAL, ET CETERA. DURING ALL THAT TIME. IT IS ABSOLUTELY OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE OUR WHOLE DEPARTMENT, EVERYONE FROM THE INTAKE DESK TO UH, LEADERSHIP, ANYONE INTERPRETING IT, KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT'S GOING ON. UM, THAT, UH, I WOULD EVEN SAY THAT THAT'S A MORE FUNDAMENTAL GOAL THAN JUST IN THIS LIMITED PROJECT. AND SO IT'S TRUE THAT ONCE THIS IS ADOPTED, IT NEEDS TO BE PUT INTO EFFECT AND COMMUNICATED CLEARLY TRANSPARENTLY RIGHT AWAY. WE'RE WORKING ON THAT RIGHT NOW. WE'RE GONNA REMEMBER THAT VERY COMMENT BECAUSE UNFORTUNATELY WE HAVE HAD TOO MANY INSTANCES WHERE, UH, PEOPLE MAKE DECISIONS BECAUSE EITHER THEY WERE MISINFORMED OR NOT INFORMED OR THEY COULDN'T GET DATA INFORMATION. UM, SO I THINK THAT'S A VERY RELEVANT QUESTION ON MS. HAYDEN'S PART. THANK YOU, YOU VERY MUCH MR. WADE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ALRIGHT, WE'RE GONNA DO A PICTURE. SO EVERYONE NEEDS TO COME IN FRONT, UH, COME AROUND HERE. WE'RE GONNA DO THE BOARD PLUS THE THREE OFFICERS COME TO THE CENTER. [05:06:23] OKAY, WE'RE GONNA CONTINUE, UH, BEFORE WE MOVE TO THE NEXT SECTION, MS. BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE THAT YOU WANT TO MAKE A COMMENT ABOUT? UH, OR FOR ADDITIONAL ITEMS? NOTHING ELSE. OKAY. I WANNA REINFORCE BEFORE WE LEAVE THIS SECTION OF, OF THE AGENDA, AND THAT IS THE MEMBER ORIENTATION GUIDE. YOU WERE GIVEN A HARD COPY FOR A REASON THAT IS SO THAT YOU CAN REVIEW IT. AGAIN, IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS, PLEASE CONTACT MYSELF, CONTACT, UH, THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT YOU HAVE A, A GOOD HANDLE OF THAT. ALRIGHT, THE NEXT ITEM ON OUR AGENDA IS CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. THERESA CARLISLE, OR BOARD ATTORNEY AND ASSISTANT CITY ATTORNEY, UM, THERESA, EXCUSE ME, MS. BOARD ATTORNEY. I'D LIKE YOU FIRST TO INTRODUCE YOUR TEAM WITH ME TODAY. OH, THERESA CARLISLE, YOUR BOARD ATTORNEY. AND WITH ME TODAY WE HAVE MATTHEW SAPP AND DANIEL MOORE. OKAY. AND SO WHAT'S, WHAT'S THE FIRST PRESENTATION THAT YOU'RE WANTING TO HANDLE? MATTHEW SAPP WILL DISCUSS VARIANCES IN SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS FOLLOWED BY THAT. OH, DO, NO, JUST LET DO ONE AT A TIME. OKAY. OKAY. OKAY. MR. SAPP. THANK YOU CHAIRMAN. UM, FOR THE NEW PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T, UH, HAVEN'T HAD THE PLEASURE OF MEETING YET, MY NAME IS MATTHEW S, ASSISTANT CITY ATTORNEY, UM, FORMER BOARD COUNSEL. AND SO I'LL BE DOING A PRESENTATION ON VARIANCES. UM, WHO, WHO'S THERESA? YEAH. OKAY, GREAT. UM, SO VARIANCES, WHEN I, WHEN I THINK OF VARIANCES, I WANT YOU GUYS TO THINK OF, I TEND TO THINK OF THE 3D ASPECT OF THE LOT OR THE STRUCTURE. SO, AND MATT, MATT, ONE SECOND. AGAIN, INTERACTIVE GUYS. THE VALUE IS WHEN IT'S INTERACTIVE. WHEN YOU'RE HEARING FROM THE SPEAKER AND HE GOES OVER SOMETHING AND YOU HAVE A QUESTION, I WANT YOU TO GET MY ATTENTION SO THAT WE CAN, 'CAUSE THAT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THIS, THIS INTERACTIVE TRAINING. THANK YOU CHAIRMAN. UM, SO LIKE I SAID, IT'S THE 3D ASPECT OF THE LOT OR THE STRUCTURE. IF YOU LOOK AT THE LANGUAGE AND THE VARIANCE FROM THE CODE, IT'S FRONT YARD, SIDE YARD, REAR YARD, LOT WIDTH, LOT DEPTH, LOT COVERAGE, THE HEIGHT. THESE ARE ALL, UH, DIMENSIONAL, UH, DESCRIPTORS. AND SO I TEND TO THINK OF A VARIANCE BEING THE 3D NATURE OF THE LOT OR THE STRUCTURE. WHEREAS A SPECIAL EXCEPTION YOU'LL NOTICE IS A VERY SPECIFIC THING ABOUT SOMETHING ON THE PROPERTY. MAYBE IT'S THE FENCE HEIGHT, MAYBE IT'S THE FENCE OPACITY, BUT IT'S A SPECIFIC THING ABOUT THE CODE. SO YOU GET A SPECIAL EXCEPTION FOR THAT HAS A LESSER STANDARD THAN A VARIANCE WHICH HAS A HIGHER STANDARD. UM, WHEN WE GO OVER THE THREE ELEMENTS, WE WE'LL GO OVER, ARE THESE ALL STATE STANDARDS OR IS CAN THESE BEING INTERPRETED BY A MUNICIPALITY IN TEXAS? SO THE STATE CODE, I BELIEVE IT'S A LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE, HAS A STANDARD FOR THAT IS SET OUT FOR THE VARIANCE STANDARD THAT IS CODIFIED IN THE CITY, UH, DEVELOPMENT CODE. I KNOW, BUT THAT'S ALL DRIVEN FROM THE STATE, CORRECT? THAT'S NOT SOMETHING THE CITY COUNCIL HERE COULD CHANGE. THAT IS ALL STATE DRIVEN. I DON'T, I'M JUST CURIOUS THOUGH. I HAVE ALWAYS SAID THAT. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S NECESSARILY TRUE, BUT CERTAINLY, CERTAINLY THEY CERTAINLY CANNOT, UM, GO AGAINST THE GRAIN OF WHAT THE STATE IS, IS PUTTING FORWARD. OKAY. UM, THE FIRST ELEMENT THAT WE WILL DISCUSS IS THAT THE VARIANCE BE NOT CONTRARY TO THE PUBLIC INTEREST. UM, THAT IS A LITTLE BIT MORE BROADER THAN WHAT IS PUT FORTH WITH A SPECIAL EXCEPTION, WHICH IT CAN'T BE ADVERSELY AFFECT NEIGHBORING PROPERTY. SO PUBLIC INTEREST IS OBVIOUSLY BROADER BECAUSE IT DEALS WITH THE ENTIRE PUBLIC. UM, YOU GUYS AS THE BOARD ARE QUASI-JUDICIAL. I THINK, UH, BAR ELIASON SAID EARLIER, AND I, I WROTE THIS DOWN BECAUSE I THOUGHT IT WAS A GOOD QUOTE. QUASI-JUDICIAL MEANS IN ESSENCE YOU [05:10:01] MAKE DECISIONS. AND SO YOU GUYS ARE THE DECIDER, YOU ARE THE ARBITER. WHEN THIS ELEMENT COMES BEFORE YOU, YOU'RE THE ONE MAKING THE DECISION. SO YOU CAN ASK, YOU CAN SORT OF PULL THE AUDIENCE TO SEE WHAT THEY WANT, WHAT DO THE NEIGHBORS THINK? WHAT DO THE PROPERTY OWNERS THINK? BUT YOU GUYS ARE THE ONES MAKING THE ACTUAL DECISION. SO IT'S NOT REALLY, UH, THE PUBLIC INTEREST ISN'T DEFINED AS WHAT THE PROPERTY OWNERS WANT. THE DEFINE PUBLIC, PUBLIC INTEREST IS DEFINED AS WHAT YOU GUYS THINK PUBLIC INTEREST IS. 'CAUSE YOU WERE THE ARBITER OF THAT ELEMENT. THE SECOND ELEMENT, AND I THINK THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT ELEMENT, IS THE ELEMENTS THAT DEALS WITH THE HARDSHIP. NOW THAT'S TRICKY BECAUSE LET'S GO BACK TO THE FIRST ONE. SO I MENTIONED SEVERAL TIMES TODAY AND BEFORE THAT YOU'LL, THE STATE LAW REQUIRES US TO NOTIFY PROPERTY ORDERS WITHIN 200 FEET 10 DAYS PRIOR. AND SO GOING TO THE NOT CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST, WHAT HAPPENS IF WE GET 25 REPLIES AND THEY'RE ALL AGAINST THIS? DOES THAT BIND THE BOARD? NO. WHY DOES IT NOT BIND THE BOARD? BECAUSE THEY, YOU ARE THE ARBITER OF WHAT IS CONSIDERED PUBLIC INTEREST. ISN'T THAT AN ABUSIVE DISCRETION BY IGNORING THOSE 25 PROPERTY OWNERS? OKAY, SO I WILL SAY IT'S THE, I'M NOT ARGUING I'M DOING THIS TO GET, TO GET THEIR THINKING. CERTAINLY, CERTAINLY. SO IT'S THEORETICALLY NOT AN ABUSIVE DISCRETION. I BELIEVE I SAID THAT CORRECTLY. SO YOU MIGHT HAVE 25 PROPERTY OWNERS AND THEY SAY, WE WANT YOU TO GO LEFT. AND YOU SAY, WELL, IN OUR WISDOM, WE THINK YOU'RE WRONG. PEOPLE ARE WRONG. THAT HAPPENS. WE'VE HAD, UH, PUBLIC MEMBERS COME AND THEY'RE UPSET ABOUT WHATEVER IT IS THEY'RE UPSET ABOUT. AND WE EXPLAIN TO THEM, YOU'RE READING THIS INCORRECTLY. THIS ISN'T WHAT THIS IS FOR, THIS IS FOR SOMETHING ELSE. AND THEY GO, OH, I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT. UM, POINT BEING THE PUBLIC ISN'T THE ONE WHO DECIDES WHAT PUBLIC INTEREST IS. YOU ARE WHO DECIDES WHAT PUBLIC INTEREST IS. I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT SINKS IN BECAUSE THAT THAT IS A WRITTEN, I'M GONNA GO TO YOU MS. DAVIS IN A SECOND. THAT IS A WRITTEN STANDARD, BUT BOY, IT VARIES, DOESN'T IT? FROM CASE TO CASE, CERTAINLY PANEL TO PANEL, TIME TO TIME, ISSUE TO ISSUE, ABSOLUTELY. MS. DAVIS. SO WHEN, WHEN SOMETHING LIKE THAT HAPPENS AND UH, YOU KNOW, THE, THE FEEDBACK WE'VE RECEIVED IS VERY POSITIVE, BUT WE, WE, WE DECIDE NO, WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO THIS. DOES THAT INCREASE OUR CHANCES OF GETTING SUED? MEANING THE BOARD AND WELL, DON'T SAY SUED. YOU MEAN APPEALED? SORRY, PARDON ME? APPEALED. I'M SORRY. APPEALED. NOT SUED. AND IS THAT SOMETHING WE ALWAYS NEED TO BE THINKING ABOUT IN THE BACK OF OUR MINDS AS WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS CRITERIA? YOU GOT IT. YOU WANNA PINCH IT? I CAN. ALRIGHT, WE GOT A PINCH HITTER. . GOOD AFTERNOON. UM, MS. DAVIS, I WOULD SAY THAT THE JOB OF THIS BOARD IS TO MAKE WHAT THE BOARD THINKS IS THE RIGHT DECISION AND NOT WORRY ABOUT, UM, WHETHER OR NOT SOMEONE WILL DISAGREE AND TAKE AND APPEAL THAT DECISION TO DISTRICT COURT. I HOPE THAT WAS HELPFUL. ONE OTHER COMMENT. I I I WOULD AGREE MR. MOORE. UM, THE TIMES THAT THE BOARD HAS BEEN APPEALED, UM, WE'VE WON MORE THAN WE'VE LOST. UM, THE ONE MEMORY OF WHEN WE LOST, BUT IT LATER REVERSED. IT WAS TEXAS CARDHOUSE. AND WHEN IT WAS REVVER, WHEN IT WAS WHEN WE WERE REVER, WHEN WE WERE OVERTURNED BY THE DISTRICT COURT, HIS COMMENT WAS, WE ABUSED OUR DISCRETION. WOW, THAT'S A SMACK IN THE FACE. THEN WHEN THE APPEALS COURT HEARD IT, THEY REVERSED HIM ENTIRELY. THREE TO ZERO SAID, NO, WE USE GOOD DECISION MAKING AND THERE WAS NO ABUSIVE DISCRETION. SO GO FIGURE. THANK YOU CHAIRMAN. SO MOVING ON TO THE SECOND ELEMENT, WHICH I THINK IS THE MOST IMPORTANT. AND WHEN I DO MY ANALYSIS, I TEND TO, I KNOW IT'S LAID OUT IN ELEMENTS 1, 2, 3. WHEN I DO MY ANALYSIS, I TEND TO DO 2, 3, 1 BECAUSE I THINK I DON'T EVEN WANNA DEAL WITH WHETHER IT'S CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST. FIRST THING I WANNA KNOW IS WHETHER THERE'S A HARDSHIP. SO THAT'S JUST HOW I PERSONALLY DO IT. YOU GUYS CAN DO IT HOW YOU LIKE. UM, BUT IT'S, THE VARIOUS IS NECESSARY TO PERMIT DEVELOPMENT OF SPECIFIC PARTS OF LAND THAT DIFFERS FROM OTHER PARCEL OF LAND BY BEING OF SUCH A RESTRICTIVE AREA, SHAPE, OR SLOPE. AND THAT LAST THREE WORDS THAT I SAID ARE THE IMPORTANT ONES, IT'S GOTTA BE A RESTRICTIVE AREA, SHAPE OR SLOPE. AND THAT'S REALLY WHAT ILLUSTRATES THE HARDSHIP. IT IS KIND OF, UH, TRICKY BECAUSE THIS IS THE HARDSHIP ELEMENT, BUT YOU'LL NOTICE THE WORD HARDSHIP DOESN'T APPEAR IN THE LANGUAGE. SO, UM, THAT'S SOMETHING TO KEEP IN MIND. IT ALSO SAYS IT HAS TO BE DONE SO THAT IT CAN'T BE DONE DEVELOPED IN A MANNER COMMENSURATE WITH THE DEVELOPMENT UPON OTHER PARCELS OF THE LAND WITHIN THE SAME ZONING. IT'S MISSING THE WORD DISTRICT, ISN'T IT SUPPOSED TO SAY DISTRICT ZONING? DISTRICT? I BELIEVE IT ENDS IN ZONING, BUT, OKAY. BUT TO ELABORATE ON THAT POINT, SIR, UM, I THINK THE LANGUAGE I USED PREVIOUSLY WAS CLASSIFICATION. BUT CLASSIFICATION OR DISTRICT, UM, IN THIS SENSE ARE SYNONYMS AND ESSENTIALLY MEANS THAT IT'S INCLUDING THE STATUS THAT MAY BE AN NSO OR A PD, WHATEVER IS THE MOST RESTRICTIVE. SO IF IT'S A R SEVEN FIVE A, WE KNOW THAT'S 7,500 SQUARE FOOT LOT, BUT IT'S ALSO IN A NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION, UM, SITUATION, THEN THAT THEN THE [05:15:01] NSO IS WHAT WOULD HOLD. SO I'LL GIVE YOU, I'LL GIVE YOU EXAMPLE AND, AND GIVE, GIMME THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS. SO WE, WE HAVE A, A LOT THAT'S IN FRONT OF US. IT'S AN R 75, I'M JUST SAYING FOR WHATEVER REASON, R 75 AND IT'S 6,500 SQUARE FEET, NOT 7,500. UH, AND IT HAS SOME IRREGULAR CORNERS. AM I COMPARING IT TO THE LOTS, TO THE RIGHT, TO THE LEFT, TO THE CENTER, TO THE SOUTH, TO THE EAST, TO THE WEST? OR AM I COMPARING THAT LOT TO ANY LOT IN A SIMILAR ZONING DISTRICT IN THE CITY? THE SECOND OPTION, ANY LOT IN THE SIMILAR ZONING IN THE CITY. HOW ARE WE ABLE TO COMPARE THAT WITH EVERY ZONING DISTRICT IN THE CITY? WOW. OKAY. BECAUSE THE LAZY EYE, I'LL ADMIT IS I LOOK AT THE GRID MAP THAT THE STAFF PREFERS, AND I LOOK AT THE LOTS AND I SEE ALL THESE RECTANGLES AND I GO, IT'S NOT, THERE'S NOT, THERE'S NO AREA SHAPE OR THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO SQUARE FOOTAGE DIFFERENCE, CERTAINLY , BUT I'M ONLY LOOKING AT THAT PICTURE THAT WE GET. I THINK THAT'S A, I'M NOT LOOKING AT OTHER ZONING DISTRICTS. ABSOLUTELY. I THINK THAT'S A REASONABLE INTERPRETATION, RIGHT? WHEN YOU LOOK AT A BUNCH OF RECTANGLES AND YOU SAY, THIS RECTANGLE LOOKS LIKE ALL THE OTHER RECTANGLES NEXT TO IT, UM, IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE IT'S A RESTRICTIVE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE TO ME. UH, THAT'S CERTAINLY FAIR AND THAT'S CERTAINLY A GREAT PLACE TO START YOUR ANALYSIS. BUT THE WAY THE CODE RINGS, IT'S THAT SAME ZONING AND WE'RE INTERPRETING THAT TO BE ZONING CLASSIFICATION OR ZONING DISTRICT TO INCLUDE THE ENTIRE CITY. BUT CHAIRMAN, JUST TO JUMP ON, I THINK IT GOES TO THE PROBATIVE NATURE OF IT, RIGHT? UM, THE, THE LOTS AROUND PROBABLY ARE MORE INFLUENTIAL THAN THE ONE THAT IS ACROSS TOWN. THAT MAY BE THE SAME ZONING. IT'S JUST WHETHER OR NOT HOW THIS BOARD WEIGHS THAT PROBATIVE FACT OR NOT. I WOULD AGREE. THE LAZY EYE, I'M SAYING, MINE SAYS, I LOOK AT THE MAP AND THE MAP SAYS ALL THESE RECTANGLES AND THEY LOOK SIMILAR. AND SO I DON'T SEE ANYTHING DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHERS. NOW I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE TOPOGRAPHY AND THE SLOPE AND THAT SORT OF THING, 'CAUSE YOU CAN'T SEE THAT ON A SHEET OF PAPER SOMETIMES, BUT, OKAY. SO THEN TO FURTHER ELABORATE ON RESTRICTIVE AREA, SHAPE AND SLOPE, MY FAVORITE OF THOSE IS AREA, BECAUSE AREA CAN, YOU CAN DEFINE IT MATHEMATICALLY, RIGHT? LIKE IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT R SEVEN FIVE A, THAT'S 7,500 SQUARE FEET, THE STAFF DOES A GREAT JOB OF TELLING YOU IN THE STAFF REPORT, HEY, THIS IS R SEVEN FIVE A AND THEY'LL ALSO SHOULD HAVE A, A ILLUSTRATION IN THERE OF THIS LOT IS 7,000 SQUARE FEET. SO IF YOU CAN LOOK AT SOMETHING AND SAY IT'S, YOU KNOW, CONSIDERABLY LESS OR LESS THAN THE AVERAGE ZONING CLASSIFICATION, THAT'S PRETTY PRIMA FACIE EXAMPLE OF IT BEING OF A RESTRICTIVE AREA. THAT'S A, A PRETTY GOOD ONE TO, TO GO. I LIKE THAT BECAUSE IT'S, UH, YOU CAN PROVE IT EMPIRICALLY. UH, RESTRICTIVE SHAPE'S A LITTLE BIT MORE TRICKY BECAUSE, UH, LIKE THE CHAIRMAN NOTED, LIKE YOU'RE LOOKING AT A BUNCH OF RECTANGLES, RIGHT? SO WHAT'S THE AVERAGE, WHAT'S THE AVERAGE, UM, SHAPE? GENERALLY IT'S A RECTANGLE OR A SQUARE. SO AS A GENERAL RULE, IF YOU SEE A TRIANGLE OR A REALLY NARROW RECTANGLE OR A REALLY WIDE RECTANGLE THAT'S NOT, NOT AS DEEP, THEN, UM, EXCUSE ME, I DON'T WANT THIS ALARM TO GO OFF AGAIN, MY APOLOGIES. UM, IF YOU HAVE A RECTANGLE THAT'S NOT AS DEEP, THEN, UM, THAT IS ILLUSTRATIVE OF A RESTRICTIVE SHAPE. AND THAT'S BECAUSE, UH, WHEN YOU HAVE A RESTRICTIVE SHAPE, YOU'RE DEALING WITH, UH, FRONT YARD, REAR YARD SETBACK THAT WILL MAKE THE SHAPE ODDLY SHAPED, UM, RESTRICTIVE SLOPE. AGAIN, THAT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, UNFORTUNATELY FOR A RESTRICTIVE SLOPE, THERE'S NO, UH, NUMERICAL THING THAT YOU CAN LOOK AT. YOU CAN'T SAY, WELL, IT'S A 45 DEGREE SLOPE OR A 30 DEGREE SLOPE. AND SO THAT MEANS IT'S A RESTRICTIVE SLOPE. IT'S REALLY, AGAIN, YOU GUYS ARE THE ARBITER. IT'S IN YOUR DISCRETION AS TO WHAT IS RESTRICTIVE. GENERALLY, YOU LOOK AT IT, THERE'S SOME TOPOGRAPHICAL LINES AND YOU CAN REALIZE THE FRONT OF THE LOT IS HIGHER OR LOWER THAN THE BACKSIDE OF THE LOT, OR THE EAST SIDE OF THE LOT IS HIGHER THAN THE WEST SIDE OF THE LOT. THEN THAT'S PRETTY INDICATIVE THAT MAYBE YOU HAVE A SITUATION WHERE THERE IS A RESTRICTIVE, UH, AND SLOPE AND THAT THAT CAN QUALIFY AS YOUR HARDSHIP. UM, SO WE'RE GONNA CIRCLE BACK AROUND TO ELEMENT TWO IN A SECOND, UM, TO DISCUSS D 10 B, BUT WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE THIRD ELEMENT, WHICH IS THE VARIANCE CANNOT BE CREATED TO RELIEVE A SELF-CREATED A PERSONAL HARDSHIP. AND THIS ONE'S TRICKY BECAUSE, UM, I TEND TO THINK, WELL, IF EVERYBODY WHO BRINGS SOMETHING TO THE BOARD IS DOING IT OUT OF THEIR OWN SELF-INTEREST, AND, AND REALLY THE, THE, THE FALLACY THERE IS, IT'S NOT THE SELF-CREATED ASPECT, HOLD ON. JUST THE PERSON BRINGING IT TO THE BOARD IS NOT WHAT CREATED THE HARDSHIP. THE SELF-CREATED ASPECT MUST BE CORRELATED TO THE HARDSHIP AS EVIDENCED BY THE RESTRICTIVE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE. SO THE TRUE QUESTION IS WHETHER THE RESTRICTIVE AREA, SHAPE OR SLOPE IS SELF-CREATED. SO IN MOST INSTANCES, LIKE THE CLASSIC EXAMPLE IS LIKE SOMEBODY BUYS A LOT THAT IS NOT OF A RESTRICTIVE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE, AND THEN THEY SUBDIVIDE IT INTO, INTO LIKE TWO, LET'S SAY TWO NARROW LOTS. AND THEN THEY COME TO THE BOARD AND SAY, HEY, I WANNA DEVELOP THIS. IT'S [05:20:01] OVERLY RESTRICTIVE. IT'S TOO, IT'S TOO NARROW. WELL, IT'S TOO NARROW BECAUSE THAT INDIVIDUAL CREATED THAT BY SUBDIVIDING IT. GENERALLY YOU DON'T SEE THAT BECAUSE WHEN YOU HAVE A LOT THAT'S TOO NARROW OR IT'S TRIANGULAR IN SHAPE, IT WAS DONE AT PLATTING AGES AGO AND THE PERSON IS BUYING IS A BONAFIDE PURCHASER. WHAT IF SOMEONE, UM, HAS A PLOT OF LAND AND WANTS TO PUT A HOME ON IT AND IT'S R 75 AND IT'S 7,500 SQUARE FEET AND THEY WANT, OR IT'S 6,500 SQUARE FEET. I'M TRYING TO GET, THEY'RE WANTING TO PUT TOO LARGE OF, OF BUILD ON TOO SMALL OF A LOT. WE'VE HAD CORNERS THAT ARE TRIANGLES AND THEY WANT TO PUT A BIG ASS HOUSE IN THE CORNER HERE AND WE'RE GOING, WELL, THAT'S TOTALLY SELF-CREATED, SELF-INFLICTED. IS IT NOT? OR IS IT? SO THAT COULD BE UP TO THE, THE, THE BOARD. SO THIS I THINK GOES TO THE D 10, UM, B ELEMENT, WHICH WOULD BE THE NEXT SLIDE, DEALS WITH, UH, WHETHER THERE'S A PREEXISTING STRUCTURE. SO AN EXAMPLE YOU GAVE, THEY'RE WANTING TO BUILD A HOUSE. WELL, THAT WOULDN'T BE PREEXISTING, BUT WHEN THERE IS A PREEXISTING STRUCTURE, UM, YOU, YOU WANNA LOOK AT THAT TO CLASSIFY. AND SO THERE'S THREE CLASSIFICATIONS, LEGAL, NON-CONFORMING, AND ILLEGAL. UM, AND A LEGAL STRUCTURE IS ONE WHERE IT'S IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE DALLAS CITY CODES, RIGHT? AND SO IF YOU CAN IMAGINE CODE COMPLIANCE DRIVING DOWN THE STREET AND MAY PASS BY A LEGAL STRUCTURE, SO IMAGINE YOUR HOUSE, RIGHT? THEORETICALLY ALL YOUR HOUSES, RIGHT? THEY'RE ALL LEGAL STRUCTURES. WE ALL LIVE IN LEGAL STRUCTURES. WHEN CODE COMPLIANCE DRIVES BY YOUR HOUSE, THEY'RE NOT GONNA TAKE A SECOND GLANCE. THEY'RE GONNA THINK THAT HOUSE LOOKS GREAT, LOOKS BEAUTIFUL, NO PROBLEMS THERE. WHEN THEY GO BY A NON-CONFORMING STRUCTURE, THEY MIGHT LOOK AT IT AND SAY, OH, THIS HOUSE IS TOO CLOSE TO THE BUILD LINE. IT'S TOO CLOSE TO THE FRONT YARD, IT'S TOO CLOSE TO THE BACKYARD, WHATEVER THE SITUATION MAY BE. UM, BUT IT'S NOT COMPLIANT WITH THE DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE. AND THEY'LL PROBABLY LOOK INTO IT AND THEN THEY'LL REALIZE THAT THIS, THIS HOME WAS, UH, BUILT PRIOR TO THE IMPLEMENTATION OF THE CURRENT ZONING RULES. AND SO IT'S DEEMED LEGAL AND AS SUCH, IT'S NOT RIPE TO RECEIVE VIOLATIONS OF CODE COMPLIANCE. UM, THE THIRD OPTION IS THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE DRIVING BY, THEY SEE A STRUCTURE, IT LOOKS ILLEGAL, THEY INVESTIGATE IT, IT IS ILLEGAL, AND THAT IS GONNA BE ONE THAT'S IN VIOLATION OF THE DALLAS DEVELOPMENT CODE. UM, AND IT'S GOTTA BE CURED BY A BOARDED ADJUSTMENT DECISION OR A ZONING CHANGE. AND THOSE ARE ESSENTIALLY RIPE TO RECEIVE CODE COMPLIANCE CITATIONS. AND SO THE REASON THAT'S IMPORTANT IS FOR WHEN YOU GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE, YOU LOOK AT THE D 10 B, WHICH IS, THIS USED TO BE HOUSE BILL 1426, I THOUGHT IT WAS 1450. IT USED TO BE A HOUSE BILL, BUT IT GOT CODIFIED IN CITY CODE. AND THE CITY CODE HAS THESE FIVE ELEMENTS THAT ALLOW US TO SUBSTITUTE FOR THE SECOND ELEMENT, WHICH IS THE HARDSHIP. SO IF YOU LOOK AT THIS, IF YOU GO THROUGH YOUR ANALYSIS AND YOU REALIZE, WELL, I CAN'T FIND A, A RESTRICTIVE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE. THERE'S NO HARDSHIP THERE, BUT THERE IS A, A BUILDING THERE AND I, AND, AND YOU THINK THAT THAT BUILDING IS, UH, THE CAUSE OF THE HARDSHIP, YOU COULD GO THROUGH THESE ELEMENTS. AND SO THE FIRST ELEMENT IS THAT THE FINAL FINANCIAL COST AND COMPLIANCE IS GREATER THAN 50% OF THE APPRAISED VALUE OF THE STRUCTURE IS SHOWN ON THE MOST RECENT APPRAISAL RULE ROLE CERTIFIED TO THE ASSESSOR FOR THE MUNICIPALITY. SO ESSENTIALLY, IF FIXING THE PROBLEM IS GONNA COST MORE THAN 50% OF THE VALUE, THEN YOU CAN USE THAT TO SUBSTITUTE ELEMENT TWO AND SAY THAT THAT IS THE HARDSHIP. THAT'S THE ONE THAT COMES BEFORE THE BOARD THE MOST IS THAT REQUEST. THE OTHER ONES THAT ARE LISTED HERE, WE DON'T SEE AS OFTEN. UM, SO FOR INSTANCE, THE SECOND ASPECT IS COMPLIANCE WOULD RESULT IN A LOST ON A LOT OF THE STRUCTURE LOCATED AT 25% OF THE AREA. SO BY COMPLYING WITH THE CODE, YOU'D LOSE 25% OF YOUR AREA. UM, AND I'VE NEVER SEEN THIS ONE COME FORWARD. AND I THINK THE REASON IS BECAUSE IT'S A REDUNDANCY OF THE RESTRICTIVE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE THAT THAT'S THE REASON WE DON'T REALLY SEE THAT ONE. THE THIRD ONE IS COMPLIANCE WOULD RESULT IN A STRUCTURE NOT BEING IN COMPLIANCE WITH ANOTHER MUNICIPAL REQUIREMENT. AND NOW THEORETICALLY THAT COULD HAPPEN, BUT, UH, I HAVE YET TO SEE IT. I DON'T WANNA SAY IT CAN'T HAPPEN THAT IT'S IMPOSSIBLE 'CAUSE IT CERTAINLY COULD HAPPEN. I JUST HAVE YET TO SEE THAT. UH, THE FOURTH ONE IS THAT COMPLIANCE WOULD RESULT IN AN UNREASONABLE ENCROACHMENT ON AN ADJACENT PROPERTY. AGAIN, I'VE NEVER SEEN THIS ONE. IT SEEMS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE THAT IT WOULD, UM, COME ABOUT. BUT AGAIN, IT'S ALSO KIND OF A REDUNDANCY OF THE ELEMENTS OF A RESTRICTIVE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE. AND THE, THE LAST ONE, THE FIFTH ONE IS THAT THE MUNICIPALITY CONSIDERS THE STRUCTURE TO BE A NON-CONFORMING STRUCTURE. AND, UH, CITY COUNCIL IS IMPLICITLY SAYING THAT, THAT A NON-CONFORMING STRUCTURE COULD BE CONSIDERED IF YOU GUYS SO SEE IT, UH, AS A HARDSHIP. AND SO ONCE YOU USE, UM, EITHER B ONE OR B, WELL, ANY OF THESE REALLY, UM, TO CONCLUDE THAT THE ELEMENT TWO HAS BEEN MET, YOU CAN SAY, WELL, THAT'S THE HARDSHIP. AND THEN MOVE ON WITH YOUR ANALYSIS. HOW WAS THAT, UM, SELF-CREATED? WAS THE HARDSHIP SELF CREATED? AND YOU CAN MOVE ON THAT WAY. GO BACK TO THE PREVIOUS SLIDE, UH, 1 58 PLEASE, OR 1 58 IN THE DOCKET. ONE MORE PLEASE. I WANNA REITERATE TO THE BOARD THAT, WELL, ONCE IT COMES UP FOR A VARIANCE, IT REQUIRES ALL THREE MET. YOU CAN'T HAVE ONE OR TWO. IT HAS TO BE ALL [05:25:01] THREE HAVE TO BE MET IN ORDER TO VARIANCE. SO IT'S LITERALLY A, HOW DOES THE REQUEST MEET? UH, I TWO I AND THREE I. THAT'S A GREAT POINT, CHAIRMAN. AND ALSO LIKE, NOT JUST DO THEY HAVE TO BE, UM, IT'S AN, IT'S AN AND TEST. IT'S ALL THREE OF 'EM, BUT THEY'RE ALSO ALL CORRELATED TO EACH OTHER. SO THE HARDSHIP HAS TO BE CORRELATED WITH THE SELF-CREATED ASPECT, OR RATHER THE SELF-CREATED ASPECT HAS TO BE CORRELATED WITH THE HARDSHIP. AND SO, UM, THAT'S A GREAT POINT. UM, THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THAT UP. AND I BELIEVE WE'RE ON THE SLIDE THAT IS CASE STUDY A. AND SO THIS IS TO ILLUSTRATE, UM, DA LITTLE CLOSER TO THE MICROPHONE, MATT. THIS IS TO ILLUSTRATE D 10 B ONE. AND THIS IS A, JUST A MOCKUP OF WHAT YOU LOOKED AFTER. ON THE RIGHT YOU'LL SEE AN IMAGE THAT COMES FROM THE TAX ASSESSORS, UM, AND IT LISTS THE PROPERTY THAT'S AT, THIS IS COME FROM A PROPERTY THAT WE U THAT I USE AS AN EXAMPLE. IT'S IN THE SWISS AVENUE, I BELIEVE. BUT THE, THE IMPROVEMENT, SO THE STRUCTURE OF THE HOME IS 2.49 MILLION. THE PROPERTY, UH, THE LAND VALUE'S AROUND 400,000 AND THE MARKET VALUE'S AROUND 2.9 MILLION. SO WHAT YOU'RE GONNA WANNA DO IS YOU'RE GONNA LOOK AT WHAT 50% OF THE IMPROVEMENT IS, OR THE STRUCTURE, UM, WHICH IS THE 2.49 MILLION. SO HALF OF THAT IS AROUND 1.248 MILLION. AND THE BID THAT WE HAVE, WE'VE CREATED A FICTIONAL, UH, DEMOLITION COMPANY, BIG D DEMOLITIONS, AND THEY HAVE A BID HERE FOR $274,000, WHICH IS LESS THAN 50% OF THE APPRAISED VALUE OF THE STRUCTURE. SO IF THIS PROPERTY CAME BEFORE YOU AND THE APPLICANT WAS OFFERING THIS AS EVIDENCE, THIS WOULD NOT MEET THE STANDARD FOR YOU TO MOVE FORWARD AS SUBSTITUTING THIS IN ELEMENT A. AND LET'S MOVE ON TO CASE STUDY B. PERFECT. AND THIS IS THE SAME, UH, PROPERTY WITH, UH, THE SAME NUMBERS. THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS THAT, UM, THIS IS NOT DOING JUST A DEMOLITION. THIS IS DOING DEMOLITION AND ADDITIONAL CONSTRUCTION TO BRING IT INTO COMPLIANCE. AND THAT NUMBER IS AROUND 1.249 MILLION, UH, WHICH IS SLIGHTLY MORE THAN 50% OF THE 1.248 MILLION, WHICH MEANS THAT THE, UH, THE BID IS GREATER THAN 50% OF THE APPRAISED VALUE. SO IF THE APPLICANT BROUGHT THESE NUMBERS TO YOU, UM, YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO IN GOOD FAITH USE THIS AS A SUBSTITUTE FOR ELEMENT TWO OF THE VARIANCE STANDARD AND BOARD MEMBERS. THERE HAVE BEEN TIMES WHEN WE'VE GOTTEN A STUDY THAT'S PRESENTED TO US AND IT'S A SINGLE SHEET OF PAPER AND YOU KIND OF GO, HUH, I WONDER HOW THEY GOT THAT. AND THERE ARE TIMES WHEN IT'S VERY DEEP AND VERY DETAILED, IT'S UP TO THE BOARD TO DECIDE WHETHER WHAT THEY'VE PRESENTED MEETS YOUR BURDEN OF PROOF. JUST LIKE PARKING STUDIES. ABSOLUTELY. THAT'S WHY I SAY THAT WITH SARCASM , WELL THAT'S WHY YOU GUYS GET PAID THE BIG BUCKS, RIGHT? IS BECAUSE YOU'LL HAVE TO MAKE THE TOUGH DECISIONS. AND SO WHEN IT COMES TO PARKING STUDIES AND THINGS LIKE, UH, PEOPLE PRESENTING EVIDENCE, UM, THAT'S WHERE, UH, IT REALLY GETS TOUGH FOR YOU GUYS. AND SO I DON'T ENVY THAT POSITION. THE BURDEN, UM, WHEN THIS COMES UP IS ON THE APPLICANT TO FURNISH EVIDENCE THAT THE COST IS GREATER THAN 50%. AND SO, JUST LIKE THE CHAIRMAN SAID, WHEN THEY COME UP, MAYBE THEY DON'T EVEN HAVE ANYTHING WRITTEN DOWN. MAYBE THEY JUST HAVE THEIR OWN TESTIMONY. MAYBE THEY HAVE ONE SHEET OF HANDWRITTEN NOTES. MAYBE THEY HAVE ONE SHEET FROM A CONTRACTOR, MAYBE THEY HAVE A WHOLE, UH, DOSSIER FROM THE CONTRACTOR. UM, YOU GUYS GET TO USE YOUR DISCRETION IN DETERMINING WHAT IS VALID. MAYBE THEY JUST HAVE A REALLY, UM, A, A REALLY INCREDIBLE PRESENTATION AND YOU FEEL THAT, THAT YOU CAN MOVE FORWARD WITH THAT, BUT THAT'S IN, UH, IN YOUR DISCRETION. UH, SO MOVING ON TO SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, UH, MR. OVITZ, THE, UH, THE ISSUE OF THE APPRAISED VALUE BEING THE BASIS 50% OF THE APPRAISED VALUE, UH, I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND WE'RE THE VAST MAJORITY OF CASES. THAT'S A VERY REASONABLE MEASUREMENT POINT WE RAN INTO. CAN I MENTION A SPECIFIC CASE, MR. CHAIRMAN? MR. CHAIRMAN, CAN I, I APOLOGIZE. SIDEBAR. GO AHEAD MR. HO. I, CAN I MENTION A SPECIFIC CASE AND YES, AS LONG AS THE CASE IS IN 10 DAYS PAST DECIDED, YEAH, PROCEED IN THE INSTANCES OF, UM, SOME OF THE PROPERTIES WE HEARD IN ELM THICKETT, WHICH WERE NEW CONSTRUCTION, THAT TURNED OUT TO BE SOMEWHAT PROBLEMATIC FOR ME 'CAUSE THEY WERE VACANT LOTS ON THE APPRAISED ON THE APPRA ON THE CITY APPRAISAL ROLES, CONSTRUCTION STARTED AFTER AND THERE WAS A SUBSTANTIAL INCREASE IN THE VALUE OF WHAT WAS ON THAT LOT. BUT IT WASN'T REFLECT, REFLECTED IN THE APPRAISED VALUE OF THE MOST RECENT APPRAISAL, WHICH I FOUND TO BE PROBLEMATIC. YEAH, I THINK THAT'S AN ASTUTE OBSERVATION. IT'S, IT'S VERY FRUSTRATING WHEN THAT SORT OF THING COMES UP. AND SO IN THOSE SITUATIONS, AGAIN, YOU HAVE TO WEIGH WHETHER THAT, THAT THAT IS THE RIGHT AVENUE TO TAKE. SO WHEREAS THE STANDARD FOR THE VARIANCE STANDARD IS YOU HAVE TO HAVE ALL THREE, YOU GOTTA HAVE THE FIRST ELEMENT, THE SECOND AND THE THIRD, THE STANDARD FOR D 10 B, YOU JUST GOTTA MEET [05:30:01] ONE OF THOSE STANDARDS, 1, 2, 3, 4 OR FIVE, ONE BEING THE 50% OF THE APPRAISED VALUE. IF YOU DON'T FEEL THAT THAT'S MET, IT'S NOT A REQUIREMENT THAT YOU SUBSTITUTE IT, SO YOU COULD JUST NOT DO IT. AND THEN ALSO YOU COULD JUST EXERCISE YOUR DISCRETION. YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T HAVE TO VOTE FOR EVERY, UM, I MEAN, YOU'RE AWARE OF THIS, I'M PREACHING TO THE CHOIR, BUT, UH, YOU DON'T HAVE TO VOTE IF YOU FEEL THAT THE, UH, THE MOTION BEING MADE ISN'T CORRECT. I DO WANNA ADD THOUGH, THAT STATE LAW DOES SAY THAT IT'S THE MOST, UM, RECENT APPRAISAL ROLE CERTIFIED ON DCA. SO ALTHOUGH YOU MIGHT NOT AGREE WITH THAT NUMBER, STATE LAW SAYS WE HAVE TO USE THAT NUMBER. I THINK HIS POINT WAS THEY WERE VACANT LOTS, AND SO THERE'S NO STRUCTURE TO COMPARE IT AGAINST. SO IT'S A ZERO, RIGHT? WELL, THEY WERE SAYING, FOR EXAMPLE, I'M JUST MAKING TO MAKE UP NUMBERS, THE LOT WAS VALUED AT A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS. NOW IT'S NOT ABOUT THE LOT, IT'S ABOUT THE IMPROVEMENT. NO, I UNDERSTAND. BUT, BUT THE, THE APPRAISAL ON THE LAST THING, IT WAS A VACANT LOT. THE APPRAISAL WAS A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS MM-HMM . NOW IT'S GOT A MILLION DOLLAR HOME SITTING ON IT, MOSTLY CONSTRUCTED, MOSTLY FINISHED, BUT SUBSTANTIALLY MORE THAN WORTH A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS. BUT ACCORDING TO THAT STANDARD, IF IT COSTS MORE THAN $50,000 TO CURE IT, THEN THAT'S MORE THAN 50%. AND THAT, THAT BECAME, THAT BECAME PROBLEMATIC FOR THIS BOARD MEMBER IN TERMS OF USING THAT STANDARD CONTINUE. UM, SO MOVING ON A SPECIAL EXCEPTION ANALYSIS. SO CHAPTER 51 A AUTHORIZES OVER 50 SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS TO SPECIFIC PROHIBITIONS. SO AS YOU NOTED, I NOTED EARLIER THAT WHEN YOU THINK OF A VARIANCE, I TEND TO THINK OF A 3D UH, ASPECT OF THE STRUCTURE OR A LOT, WELL, SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS DEAL WITH A SPECIFIC THING. SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE FENCE STANDARDS ARE PROBABLY ONE WE SEE MOST OFTEN, RIGHT? FENCE, HEIGHT, FENCE OPACITY, FENCE MATERIALS. WE ALSO DEAL WITH, UH, ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS, ADDITIONAL DWELLING UNITS AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE. BUT THE ONE COMMON DENOMIN FOR ALL THE SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS FOR THE MOST PART , IS THAT, UH, THE STANDARD IS THAT IT CANNOT ADVERSELY AFFECT NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES. AND THERE'S TWO THINGS I WANNA POINT OUT ABOUT THAT, WHICH IS THAT IS THAT THEY CANNOT ADVERSELY AFFECT THE PROPERTY. SO IT'S CANNOT NEGATIVELY AFFECT IT. SO IF APPLICANT COMES AND THEIR PROPOSAL IS TO HAVE A NEUTRAL EFFECT, THAT'S OKAY. IF THE PROPOSAL IS TO HAVE A POSITIVE EFFECT, THAT'S OKAY. IT JUST CAN'T BE A NEGATIVE EFFECT. AND THE OTHER THING THAT I WOULD POINT OUT IS THAT THE, THE CODE IS THAT IT CANNOT ADVERSELY AFFECT NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES. SO IT'S NOT ADVERSELY AFFECT NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OWNERS. IT'S NOT THAT IT CAN'T, CAN'T AFFECT NEIGHBORING, UM, CITIZENS OR CONSTITUENTS. IT'S TALKING ABOUT NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES, WHICH IS AN INANIMATE OBJECT. THE REASON I POINT THAT OUT IS BECAUSE PEOPLE COME AND THEY SAY, THIS IS GONNA HURT MY PROPERTY. AND THAT'S, AND IT CERTAINLY MAY, BUT THAT IS THEIR OPINION. AND YOUR OPINION IS THE ONE THAT MATTERS BECAUSE YOU ARE THE GUYS ARE THE ONES THAT ARE DETERMINING WHETHER THIS ADVERSELY AFFECTS NEIGHBORING PROPERTY. SO THIS IS VERY SIMILAR TO THE, UH, NOT CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST ASPECT, BUT I JUST WANTED TO ILLUSTRATE THAT, UM, FURTHER. SO WHEREAS, ONE SECOND MATT, I'M JUST MAKING SURE EVERYONE'S GETTING IT AS WE GO. UM, ANOTHER TOOL THAT A BOARD MEMBER COULD UTILIZE IS THAT FEEDBACK FROM THE 200 FEET SURROUNDING PROPERTY OWNERS. THAT'S A TOOL. AND IT MAY BE 10 AND MAY BE 50, IT MAY BE 20 PROPERTIES, AND IT MAY BE TWO RESPONSES OR MAYBE 20 RESPONSE. THAT'S A TOOL FOR YOU TO DETERMINE WHETHER THAT'S A AFFECTING NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES OR NOT. AND THAT'S A GREAT WAY TO LOOK AT IT, IS A TOOL IN YOUR TOOLBOX. IT'S ONE OF THE TOOLS. AND YOU HAVE OTHER TOOLS THAT YOU CAN UTILIZE AS WELL. I THINK THAT'S A GREAT ANALOGY. UM, THE OTHER THINGS IN THAT TOOLBOX THAT YOU CAN UTILIZE ARE, UH, AN ACRONYM THAT WE CAME UP WITH, WHICH IS SAM STANDS FOR SAFETY, AESTHETICS AND MONETARY. AND THESE, UM, SO THERE'S A, A TON OF SUBJECTS THAT A COURT MIGHT LOOK AT TO DETERMINE IF A SPECIAL EXCEPTION WILL ADVERSELY AFFECT A NEIGHBORING PROPERTY OR, UH, WITH A VARIANCE IF IT'S GONNA BE CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST. BUT WE NARROWED IT DOWN TO THREE, WHICH WE FEEL ARE A SOLID PLACE TO BEGIN YOUR ANALYSIS. NOW, THIS IS BY NO MEANS AN END ALL BE ALL. IT'S NOT A CONCLUSIVE LIST, IT'S JUST A GREAT PLACE TO START. AND SO SAFETY DEALS WITH DOES THE SPECIAL EXCEPTION CREATE OR MITIGATE SAFETY ISSUES? AND SO WHEN PEOPLE COME THERE, PARTICULARLY WITH FENCES, RIGHT, YOU REALLY HEAR ONE OR TWO, UH, REASONS IS I WANT PRIVACY, I WANT SAFETY. UM, AND SO YOU CAN LOOK AT IT FROM BOTH SIDES OF THE COIN, RIGHT? IT'S GONNA MAKE THE HOMEOWNER FEEL SAFE, BUT WHAT ABOUT, UH, THE NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES? UM, THE OTHER ONE IS AESTHETICS, WHICH IS THE A, UM, DOES IT COMPORT OR FIT IN WITH THE CHARACTER OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD? SOME NEIGHBORHOODS HAVE FENCES, UH, OR WALLS, AND SO ADDING ANOTHER FENCE OR WALL PROBABLY WON'T, UM, D HAVE A DELETERIOUS EFFECT ON THAT. SO, UH, ON THAT POINT, ONE OF THE QUESTIONS THAT YOU'LL REGULARLY GET IS TELL ME WHAT ELSE IS GOING ON IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD ALONG THE STREET, ALONG THE NEXT STREET, THREE STREETS OVER. ARE THERE A LOT OF FENCES? ARE THEY HIGH FENCES? ARE THEY SOLID FENCES? ARE THE FENCES AT THE CURB OR NONE? IS IT A ROLLING PLANE WHERE THERE'S [05:35:01] ALL OPEN NEIGHBORHOOD OR IS IT A BUSY STREET LIKE WALNUT HILL OR ROYAL LANE OR NORTHWEST HIGHWAY, WHICH IS SIX FEET, SIX LANES DIVIDED? THOSE ARE ALL CRITERIA AS TO WHAT IS POTENTIALLY ADVERSE TO THE NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES. AND THEN THE LAST ONE, WHICH I THINK IS, UH, EXTREMELY IMPORTANT IS THE, DOES THE SPECIAL EXCEPTION INCREASE OR DECREASE PROPERTY VALUE? UM, SO THAT'S THE MONETARY ASPECT. UM, AND THEN THE ARBITER, WHICH IS YOU GUYS, YOU SHOULD LOOK AT ALL THE EVIDENCE AND USE A SLIDING SCALE TO DETERMINE IF IN YOUR OPINION, UH, THE STANDARD HAS BEEN MET. I MEAN, I PUT THIS SLIDE IN LAST YEAR AND IT GOT, UH, A GOOD RECEPTION, SO I WANTED TO ADD IT AGAIN HERE. UM, AND IT DEALS WITH THE OVERARCHING POLICY, UH, QUESTIONS THAT COUNCIL IS ASKING WHEN THEY'RE LOOKING AT SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS AND VARIANCES. AND YOU'LL NOTICE WE HAVE SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE COLUMN, THE POLICY QUESTION IN THE MIDDLE, AND THEN VARIANCES ON THE RIGHT SIDE. THE SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS FOR THE TWO BOTTOM WAS THERE'S JUST XS. AND SO THINK OF THOSE AS CHECK MARKS. THOSE TWO ITEMS HAVE ALREADY BEEN MET THEORETICALLY, RIGHT? AND SO WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS AND VARIANCES, ONE OF THE QUESTIONS THAT COUNSEL BRINGS TO YOU IS TO ASK, IS THIS FAIR TO THE PUBLIC? THE APPLICANT'S COMING TO YOU SAYING, WE WANT THIS SPECIAL EXCEPTION OF VARIANCE, AND IS IT FAIR TO THE PUBLIC? AND THE THAT IS ILLUSTRATED IN THE LANGUAGE OF SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS SAYING IT CANNOT ADVERSELY AFFECT NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES, THE PUBLIC, RIGHT? IN VARIANCES, YOU GET A SIMILAR LANGUAGE, SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT, BUT SIMILAR, THAT IT CANNOT BE CONTRARY TO PUBLIC INTEREST. SO AGAIN, WE'RE DEALING WITH THE PUBLIC AND THAT IS THE, THE MAIN QUESTION WHEN IT COMES TO A SPECIAL EXCEPTION. THE SECOND QUESTION THAT COUNCIL ASKS IS, IS IT FAIR TO THE APPLICANT? AND YOU'LL NOTICE THERE ISN'T A, UH, AN ELEMENT LISTED THERE FOR SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS. HOWEVER, THERE IS AN ELEMENT LISTED FOR THE VARIANCE IN THE VARIANCES. WE'RE TRYING TO ENSURE THAT THERE IS A HARDSHIP. SO IF IT'S FAIR TO THE APPLICANT, MEANING DO THEY HAVE A HARDSHIP? 'CAUSE IF THEY HAVE A HARDSHIP, IT'S NOT FAIR TO THE APPLICANT. AND IF WE'RE TRYING TO ILLUSTRATE THAT HARDSHIP BEING A RESTRICTIVE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE, OR IF WE'RE GONNA USE D 10 B, THAT IT IS, UM, 50% OF THE APPRAISED VALUE OR LIKE A NON-CONFORMING USE OR SOMETHING OF THAT NATURE. BUT THAT WOULD INDICATE THAT THERE IS A HARDSHIP AND THAT THAT REQUEST IS BECAUSE IT'S NOT FAIR TO THE APPLICANT. THE THIRD ONE IS THE OVERARCHING Y WHY DOES THE APPLICANT WANT THIS? AND I CERTAINLY WANNA KNOW, YI KNOW THAT WHEN, UH, PEOPLE BRING UP THEIR SPECIAL EXCEPTION, I'M CUR, PART OF ME IS JUST CURIOSITY, RIGHT? I WANNA KNOW WHY DOES THIS GUY WANT THIS? UH, AND THE REASON THERE'S AN X THERE IS BECAUSE ON SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS IS 'CAUSE IT'S NOT RELEVANT WHEN IT COMES TO SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS. SO WHEN WE'RE POLLING THE AUDIENCE, UM, IT'S REALLY RELEVANT WHEN IT'S A VARIANCE BECAUSE IT BECOMES THE, THE ASPECT OF WHETHER IT'S SELF-CREATED OR NOT, RIGHT? IF, IF THE ANSWER TO Y IS WHY DO YOU WANT THIS IS 'CAUSE 'CAUSE THE APPLICANT SELF-CREATED IT, THEN THAT'S EVIDENCE THAT IS BEING SELF-CREATED AND YOU DON'T NEED TO, UM, ACCOMMODATE THAT REQUEST WITH A SPECIAL EXCEPTION. IT'S IRRELEVANT. THE WHY ASPECT IS IRRELEVANT. BECAUSE REALLY THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS IS WHETHER IT ADVERSELY AFFECTS NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES. QUESTIONS FOR MR. SAPP ON VARIANCES AND SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS. EXCELLENT. THANK YOU SIR. MS. CARLISLE, BOARD ATTORNEY, WHO'S NEXT? I THINK YOU ARE. I WILL BE PLEASE PRESENTING UPON ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL APPEALS IN COMPLIANCE CASES. WE DON'T EVER HAVE APPEALS TO ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIALS. DO WE? YOU KNOW, NOT OFTEN, BUT PANEL C MORE SO C PANEL C HAS AN AO APPEAL IN, UH, NOVEMBER. THEY DO, THEY DO. SO THIS BOARD CAN ALSO HEAR ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL APPEALS. AND ESSENTIALLY THIS APPEAL ALLOWS A PERSON TO CHALLENGE AN ADMINISTRATOR'S OFFICIAL'S DECISION ORDER REQUIREMENT OR DETERMINATION THAT THEY MADE. AND IN COMMON APPEALS THAT THE BOARD HEARS ARE DENIALS OR REVOCATIONS OR CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCIES OR OF BUILDING PERMITS. SO THE BOARD BOARD WILL HOLD A HEARING. DO WE HAVE 10 PEOPLE? WE'RE STILL 11. OKAY. , I JUST COUNTED FOUR. WE STILL HAVE 11. WE HAVE TO HAVE 10 IN THE ROOM. I HAVE 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11. WE'RE FINE. OKAY. OKAY. , THAT'S WHAT I WAS DOING. THERESA , I WAS COUNTING. UM, SO THE, WHAT'S IMPORTANT WITH APPEALS IS THAT THE BOARD HAS THE SAME AUTHORITY AS THE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL. AND SO THEREFORE THEY CAN AFFIRM, REVERSE OR AMEND THE DECISION OF THE OFFICIAL AND AT TIMES CAN IMPOSE REASONABLE CONDITIONS. SO YOU'RE ESSENTIALLY STANDING IN THE SHOES OF THE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL IN DETERMINING WHETHER OR NOT THE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL, WHICH IS OFTENTIMES THE BUILDING OFFICIAL, WHETHER OR NOT THEY AIRED IN THEIR DECISION. SO DURING THE APPEAL, AGAIN, THE BOARD ONLY HAS THE POWERS AND DUTIES OF THE BUILDING OFFICIAL IN PURSUANT TO THE CODE. THE BUILDING OFFICIAL CAN ONLY ISSUE PERMITS AND CERTIFICATE CERTIFICATES OF OCCUPANCY IN ACCORDANCE WITH THIS CHAPTER. AND IT HAS THE AUTHORITY TO ENFORCE THE PROVISIONS OF THIS CHAPTER. SO [05:40:01] YOU CAN'T LEGISLATIVELY CHANGE SOMETHING OR ALTERNATE THE INTENT OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE. THAT IS A CITY COUNCIL AFFECTION. WHAT YOU ARE CHARGED TO DO IS TAKE THE FACTS PRESENTED AND APPLY THEM TO THE CODE AS WRITTEN TO DETERMINE WHETHER THE DECISION WAS MADE IN ERROR. AND YOU CAN ONLY MODIFY TO THE EXTENT THAT THE CODE ALLOWS. SO GIVE US SOME TANGIBLE EXAMPLES. FOR INSTANCE, IF IT WAS A REVOCATION OF A RESTAURANT, OKAY, SO THEY, SO, SO CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY, THE BUILDING OFFICIAL ISSUED A CO FOR A RESTAURANT MM-HMM . AND THEN REVOKED IT. THEY REVOKED IT BECAUSE THEY SAID IT WAS ISSUED AN ERROR BECAUSE MAYBE THEY WEREN'T FOLLOWING SOME PROVISION IN OUR CODE. OKAY? UM, WITH AND IF IT'S IN A CERTAIN DISTRICT. UH, SO YOU COULD AFFIRM THE DECISION SAYING, YOU KNOW, YOU DID, YOU, YOU FAILED TO COMPLY WITH THE CODE. SO WE ARE GOING TO AFFIRM THE DECISION AND YOU CAN'T HAVE YOUR CERTIFICATE ADVOCACY, OR YOU CAN SAY YOU DID COMPLY WITH THE CODE. WE DON'T THINK THAT, WE THINK THAT THE BUILDING OFFICIAL AIRED IN HIS DECISION. AND YOU CAN REVERSE A DECISION OR YOU CAN MODIFY THE DECISION AND PLACE CONDITIONS. IF FOR THIS INSTANCE, UM, THE ZONING DISTRICT REQUIRES A RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCY REVIEW FOR THE RESTAURANT. SO I'LL GIVE EVERYONE AN EXAMPLE. THIS IS A CLOSED CASE. IT'S FINISHED, IT'S OVER. UH, IT WASN'T APPEALED SO FORTH. THERE WAS A SITUATION WHERE A PROPERTY OWNER, UH, WENT INTO THE CITY, GOT A PERMIT, UM, IN OCTOBER OF ONE YEAR AND GOT SUBSEQUENT GREEN TAGS. AND THEN IN APRIL OF THE NEXT YEAR, UH, THE, THE APPLICANT SAID, OKAY, I'VE GOTTEN ALL MY GREEN TAGS, I'M READY FOR MY CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY. THE BUILDING OFFICIAL ISSUED THE CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY WHAMO WITHIN ONE WEEK. THEY WERE READY TO OPEN WHAMO, THE BUILDING OFFICIAL REVOKED THE PERMIT, REVOKED THE CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY. SO THE APPLICANT, THE RESTAURANT OWNER SAID, WAIT A MINUTE, YOU WHAT? SO THAT PERSON FILED A CASE THROUGH THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT OFFICE, DIFFERENT SET OF PAPERWORK THAT THEY'RE REQUIRED, NOT THE NORMAL STUFF THAT THEY GO THROUGH. AND WE, IT WAS SCHEDULED AND WAS ASSIGNED RANDOMLY ASSIGNED TO A PANEL. AND WE HAD A HEARING AND I HAD A HEARING. AND BASICALLY THE RESTAURANT OWNER PRESENTED A CASE AS TO WHY THEY SHOULD HAVE A LEGITIMATE, UH, CERTIFICATE OCCUPANCY. THE BUILDING OFFICIAL PRESENTED A CASE AS TO WHY THEY SHOULD NEVER HAVE ISSUED IT IN THE FIRST PLACE. AND THE PANEL GOES THROUGH A QUESTION AND ANSWER SESSION WITH EACH OF THE, EACH OF THE PARTIES. THEY CAN CALL WITNESSES UP. YOU CROSS EXAMINE THE WITNESS AND IT'S INTERACTIVE THE WHOLE TIME. IT TAKES HOURS BECAUSE THESE ARE COMPLICATED. AND THERE'S, HE SAID, SHE SAID, AND THERE'S, UH, WELL THAT WAS INFERRED OR THIS WAS WRITTEN OR THIS WAS VERBAL. AND THEN THE BOARD MAKES A DECISION. IN THIS CASE, THE BOARD REVERSED THE BUILDING OFFICIAL AND REINSTATED HIS CERTIFICATE OCCUPANCY. OKAY, I'M GONNA GO TO, TO J MR. SLADE, ONE SECOND. I'M WALKING YOU THROUGH THAT PANEL. C LIKE I SAID, NEXT MONTH THAT'LL BE NEW FOR YOU, MS. GARNER IS A DIFFERENT SET OF RULES THAT YOU HANDLED THAN THE CASES YOU HANDLED LAST TIME. IT'S A DIFFERENT PROCESS. IT'S MORE COURTROOM LIKE AND YOU KNOW, LIKE ALMOST LIKE A PROSECUTOR AND A DEFENDANT OR, OR REVERSED. AND, UM, THE REASON WHY I'M GOING THROUGH THAT IS PART OF WHAT YOU DO, AND IT GOES BACK TO MS. CARLISLE'S SHOES, THINGS, THESE, UM, WING TIPS. UM, IT'S, YOU HAVE TO THINK, OKAY, WHY DID THE BUILDING OFFICIAL APPROVE IT IN THE FIRST PLACE AND WHY DID THE BUILDING OFFICIAL REVERSE IT? AND YOU TRY TO GO THROUGH THAT DECISION MAKING PROCESS ON BOTH OF THOSE AND SEE IF YOU CAN MATCH 'EM UP OR NOT. LIKEWISE, WHY IS THERE MERIT ON THE APPLICANT'S PART IF HE OR SHE FOLLOWED THROUGH ALL THE STEPS THAT HE WAS TOLD TO FOLLOW BY THE CITY? AND HOW IS HE TO BE HELD FOR SOMETHING THAT THE CITY CHANGES THEIR MIND ON? MR. SLADE, UH, THANK YOU CHAIR NEWMAN. AND THAT'S A GOOD SEGUE BECAUSE AM I RIGHT THAT THE DECISION IS OUTCOME DETERMINATIVE? IT'S WHETHER WE AGREE WITH THE OUTCOME THAT THE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL GAVE, NOT NECESSARILY ON THE METHODOLOGY OR EXPLANATION, THEREFORE, WOW, THAT'S A HARD ONE. IT BECAUSE IT'S A COMBINATION. IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, AGAIN, THE CASE IS CLOSED, WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT. PAST 10 DAYS, WE WERE STYMIED AND I, I WILL SPEAK FOR THE PANEL AND THEY CAN CONTRADICT ME OR AGREE. WE WERE STYMIED ABOUT HOW WE DIDN'T GET INFORMATION FROM THE BUILDING OFFICIAL AND WE ASKED QUESTION AFTER QUESTION AND COULDN'T GET STRAIGHT ANSWERS AS TO WHO, [05:45:01] WHY, WHEN, HOW ON BOTH ON ISSUING AND REVOKING. AND SO WE KIND OF HAD TO COME UP WITH OUR OWN JUSTIFICATION. IN THE END, WE REVERSED THE BUILDING OFFICIAL AND PUT NEW CONDITIONS ON IT. IN THIS CASE, WE SAID THERE WAS ACCESS FROM A SIDE STREET. WE SAID YOU GOTTA CLOSE THIS OFF. SO IT KIND OF PROTECTS THIS NEIGHBORHOOD. WHAT DID YOU CALL IT, THERESA? UH, THE RESIDENTIAL WHAT? RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCY REVIEW, RESIDENTIAL ADJACENCY REVIEW. UH, AND THAT WAS PART OF THE CONDITIONS THAT WE CAN SET ON THE ISSUANCE OF THE PERMIT. SO IT MINI MINIMIZED THE IMPACT ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD. SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, MR. SLADE, IT'S COMBINATION AND IN THE END IT'S, IT'S VERACITY. OKAY, WHAT DO YOU BELIEVE VERSUS NOT? AND WHY AREN'T YOU TELLING ME MORE AND PERSUADE ME, PERSUADE ME THAT, THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE, YOU'RE OF WHY YOU MADE THE DECISION, HOW YOU MADE THE DECISION VERSUS WHY YOU REVERSED YOURSELF AND, AND THAT SORT OF THING. GO AHEAD. THANK YOU CHAIRMAN NEWMAN. AND I'M GONNA TRY TO PUSH BACK ON THAT AND WOULD WELCOME OTHER PEOPLE'S SORT OF THOUGHTS. I ALWAYS VIEWED AN ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL APPEAL AS THE PETITIONER IS ASKING FOR OVERRULING WHATEVER THE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL DECIDED. AND SO OUR DECISION IS WHETHER THE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL REACHED THE CORRECT OUTCOME, REGARDLESS OF WHAT METH, WHAT CONSIDERATIONS WERE THERE. UM, BECAUSE OFTEN THEY'RE NOT THE REVERSAL OF IT CAN JUST BE THAT IN THE INITIAL INSTANCE THAT THEY DENIED, DENIED. UM, AND SO I WOULD WELCOME ANY THOUGHTS, PARTICULARLY FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY STAFF ABOUT WHETHER WE ARE SUPPOSED TO LOOK AT THOSE CASES DIFFERENTLY. IF THERE'S BEEN A REVERSAL OF A POSITION BY ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL OR WHETHER WE HAVE, WHETHER WE ARE ESSENTIALLY BLESSING THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS OR SIMPLY SAYING, UH, BLIND SQUIRREL FINDS A NOT EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE, AND MAYBE IT WAS CORRECT OR INCORRECT BASED ON, ON THAT. WELL, I THINK IT'S LIMITED TO THE APPEAL LETTER WHEN THE APPLICANT GETS THE LETTER SAYING THEY'RE REVOKING OR DENYING THE BUILDING OFFICIAL HAS TO WRITE THE REASON WHY THEY'RE REVOKING OR DENYING. AND SO THEN YOUR SCOPE IS LIMITED TO LIKE, FOR THE CASE THAT THE CHAIRMAN WAS TALKING ABOUT, THAT THEY DIDN'T COMPLY WITH STATE LAW. SO YOU HAVE TO SEE WHETHER OR NOT THEIR OPERATION WAS IN COMPLIANCE WITH STATE LAW OR WAS IT NOT? SO IT JUST DEPENDS ON WHAT THE LETTER STATED OF THE REASONING WHY OF THE REVOCATION OR THE DENIAL AND NOT NECESS NOT NECESSARILY THE METHODOLOGY, BUT APPLYING THE FACTS TO THEIR REASON FOR DENIAL OR REVOKING. I, FOR 1:00 AM HARD, IT'S HARDER FOR ME TO DECIDE A, UM, REVERSAL. UH, IT'S HARDER FOR ME WHEN THE BUILDING OFFICIAL APPROVES THEN REVOKES THAN SIMPLY DENIES IN THE FIRST PLACE. 'CAUSE DENIAL IN THE FIRST PLACE DOESN'T BEG THE QUESTION OF A TAKING. AND I'M SENSITIVE TO A TAKING. AND THERE'S CASE LAW IN TEXAS WHEN A MUNICIPALITY AND OR, UH, A BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT PLANNING COMMISSION TYPE APPROVES, APPROVES, APPROVES, APPROVES, APPROVES BASED ON THE FEEDBACK FROM THE STAFF. I'M TALKING ABOUT PDT HOLDINGS AND THEN THE CITY REVERSES. AND THAT CASE, THE SUPREME COURT SAID THERE WAS RELIANCE ON THE STAFF'S DECISION AND THEY SAID, NO, YOU CAN'T DO THAT. NOW I'M NOT TRYING TO WADE INTO THAT LEGAL OPINION, BUT, UM, THAT'S MY PERSPECTIVE. SO, BUT UH, YOU'LL BE BLESSED NEXT MONTH. I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THE DETAILS OF THE CASE IS. PANEL C WILL HAVE A, A AO APPEAL AND YOU'LL GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS. AND THE FOUR, THE FIVE OF YOU WILL HAVE TO MAKE A DETERMINATION. AND AGAIN, IT TAKES FOUR TO MAKE A DECISION. QUESTIONS MS. CARLISLE, IF THERE'S NO MORE QUESTIONS ABOUT ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL APPEALS, I'M GOING TO MOVE ON TO COMPLIANCE CASES. SO SOMETIMES THE BOARD MAY HEAR COMPLIANCE CASES AND DECIDE WHETHER USE THAT NO LONGER MEETS CURRENT RULES CALLED A NONCONFORMING USE SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN. SO THESE ARE USES THAT WERE LEGAL UNDER OLD RULES, BUT ARE NOW NOT ALLOWED UNDER THE CURRENT RULES THAT WE HAVE IN PLACE AT THE CITY. SO BEFORE IT EVEN COMES BEFORE THE BOARD, THE CITY COUNCIL MUST FIRST REQUEST THE BOARD TO CONSIDER OPPOSING A COMPLIANCE REQUIREMENT. AND THEN ONCE THAT REQUEST IS MADE, THE CITY'S CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICERS CHECKS TO SEE IF THERE'S ENOUGH MONEY IN THE FUND TO COVER POTENTIAL COSTS RELATED TO ENFORCING COMPLIANCE. NOW, IF THERE ARE ENOUGH FUNDS, THEN IT COMES BEFORE THE BOARD AND THE BOARD WILL HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING [05:50:01] TO DECIDE IF KEEPING THE NON-CONFORMING USE WILL HAVE AN ADVERSE EFFECT ON NEARBY PROPERTIES. NOW IF THE BOARD DECIDES THAT THE USE IS ENDED AND THE PROPERTY OWNER MUST BE GIVEN A FAIR CHANCE TO RECOVER THEIR INVESTMENT, NOW THERE'S FACTORS TO CONSIDERED TO DETERMINE WHETHER, WHETHER THE CONTINUED OPERATION OF THE NONCONFORMING USE WILL HAVE ADVERSE EFFECT ON NEARBY PROPERTIES. AND SOME OF THEM INCLUDE THE CHARACTER WITH THEIR SURROUNDING NEIGHBORHOOD, THE DEGREE OF INCOMPATIBILITY OF THE USE WITH THE ZONING DISTRICT IN WI IN WHICH IT IS LOCATED, THE HOURS OF OPERATION, UM, ANY ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS SUCH AS NOISE GLARE, DUST OR ODOR, UM, EXTENT TO WHICH TRAFFIC OR PAR PARKING PROBLEMS MAY BE CREATED OR PERPETUATED BY CONTINUED OPERATION OF THE USE AND ANY OTHER RELEVANT FACTORS YOU MAY DEEM, UM, WILL HELP YOU DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT THEY WOULD HAVE AN ADVERSE EFFECT ON NEARBY PROPERTIES. NOW, IF THE BOARD BASED ON EVIDENCE PRESENTED AT THE PUBLIC HEARING DETERMINES THAT THE CONTINUED OPERATION OF THE USE WILL NOT HAVE AN ADVERSE EFFECT, IT MAY, THE NON-CONFORMING USE MAY CONTINUE TO OPERATE. AND THIS, UM, SO THE DENIAL TO IMPOSE A COMPLIANCE REQUIREMENT IS A FINAL DECISION AND CAN BE APPEALED WITHIN 10 DAYS TO COURT. NOW IF THE BOARD DETERMINES THAT THE NONCONFORMING USE WILL HAVE AN ADVERSE EFFECT ON NEARBY PROPERTIES, THE BOARD WILL IMPOSE A COMPLIANCE REQUIREMENT AND THIS DECISION IS NOT FINAL AND CAN'T BE APPEALED RIGHT AWAY. SO AFTER THAT HEARING, THEN THE DIRECTOR MUST THEN FIGURE OUT HOW MUCH THE OWNER OR LESSEE SHOULD BE COMPENSATED. AND THIS INCLUDES TWO PARTS. UM, THEY FIRST HAVE TO CALCULATE THE COST OF THE PROPERTY OWNER WOULD FACE FROM STOPPING THE NONCONFORMING USE, INCLUDING ANY EXPENSES RELATED TO DEMOLITION, RELOCATION, TERMINATION OF A LEASE OR DISCHARGE OF A MORTGAGE, AND EXCUSE ME, AND HOW THE PROPERTY'S MARKET VALUE HAS DROPPED BECAUSE A NON-CONFORMING USE MUST STOP. SO THEN THE OWNER IS ENTITLED TO WHICHEVER AMOUNT IS GREATER. NOW ONCE THAT DETERMINATION IS MADE, THE PROPERTY OWNER OR LESSEE MAY CHOOSE TO RECEIVE A PAYMENT FROM THE CITY FOR THE AMOUNT CALCULATED, OR THEY CAN KEEP OPERATING THE USE THROUGH NORMAL BUSINESS OPERATIONS UNTIL THEY EARN BACK THE AMOUNT PREVIOUSLY CALCULATED. NOW, AFTER THE BOARD DECIDES TO SHUT DOWN THE NON-CONFORMING USE, THE DIRECTOR MUST SEND WRITTEN NOTICE TO THE OWNER WITHIN 10 DAYS OF THE HEARING EXPLAINING THE DECISION AND THOSE TWO AVAILABLE OPTIONS, AND THEN NOT LATER THAN THE 30TH DATE AFTER THE DATE THE DIRECTOR GIVES NOTICE, THE OWNER EE SHALL RESPOND IN WRITING THEIR CHOSEN REMEDY. SO THEN WHAT WOULD THE COMPLIANCE DATE BE? IF THEY CHOOSE TO, UM, RECEIVE A PAYMENT, THEN THEY MUST STOP OPERATING THE NONCONFORMING USE WITHIN 10 DAYS AFTER RECEIVING PAYMENT. IF THEY CHOOSE TO KEEP OPERATING THE NON-CONFORMING USE, THEY MUST STOP IMMEDIATELY ONCE THEY HAVE EARNED BACK THE AMOUNT SET BY THE DIRECTOR. NOW THIS COULD COME BACK BEFORE THE BOARD IF THEY APPEAL THE DIRECTOR'S DECISION WITHIN 20 DAYS AFTER THE DIRECTOR MADE THE DETERMINATION OF THE COST. UM, AND THEN THE DIRECTOR MUST PROVE THEIR DETERMINATION WAS CORRECT IN FRONT OF THE BOARD. SO THEN THE BOARD HAS TO FIND THAT THE PAYMENT COULD, THE BOARD CAN DETERMINE THAT THE PAYMENT IS DIFFERENT AND IT CAN ORDER THE CITY TO PAY MORE MONEY OR REQUIRE THE OWNER OR LESSIE TO PAY BACK THE MONEY TO THE CITY IF THEY THINK THAT IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN LESS OR IF THEY CONTINUED TO OPERATE THE USE THE BOARD CAN ADJUST THE AMOUNT OF TIME THE NON-CONFORMING USE CAN CONTINUE. NOW, AT THIS JUNCTURE, THE BOARD'S DECISION IS FINAL UNLESS APPEALED TO DISTRICT COURT WITHIN 20 DAYS AFTER THE FINAL DECISION IS MADE. HOW OFTEN DO WE HAVE COMPLIANCE CASES? THAT'S A RARE THING. IS IT NON? THAT IS A RARE THING. OUT OF MY NINE YEARS, I I'VE ONLY BEEN A PART OF ONE NON-CONFORMING OR COMPLIANCE HEARING, BUT THE CITY WAS ON HOLD FOR A LITTLE BIT OF TIME UNTIL THE STATE LEGISLATOR PASSED. YES. OKAY. UM, THIS NEW LAW, SO THESE MIGHT BE COMING BEFORE YOU IF CITY COUNCIL PUTS MONEY INTO THE FUND. QUESTIONS FOR THE BOARD ATTORNEY REGARDING COMPLIANCE CASES? THANK YOU MS. BOARD ATTORNEY. UH, LET'S BRIEFLY GO ON VELASCO PLEASE. CAN YOU, SO THE ISSUE WITH THIS IS THE CITY OF DALLAS VERSUS VANESSA CASE. AND THE MAIN ISSUE IS WHETHER THE CITY CAN ENFORCE A ZONING ORDINANCE AGAINST A PROPERTY OWNER WHO SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLETED NEW HOME HAS BEEN BUILT IN VIOLATION OF THE ORDINANCE EVEN THOUGH THE CITY HAD GIVEN PRELIMINARY APPROVAL TO THE OWNER'S BUILDING PLANS. SO THE FACTS OF THE CASE IS THAT ESCOS WANTED A LARGER HOUSE. SO THEY TORE DOWN THE EXISTING HOUSE THAT THEY HAD ON THE LOT AND WANTED TO BUILD A NEW ONE. THEY PAID AN AN ADDITIONAL FEE FOR THE CITY TO REVIEW THE PLANS. THE CITY APPROVED THE PLANS, BUT WHEN THE ROOF WAS [05:55:01] BEING BUILT, THE INSPECTOR CAME OUT THERE AND WAS LIKE, OH NO, THIS IS TOO TALL. BUT HE DIDN'T ISSUE A STOP WORK ORDER BUT RECOMMENDED THAT THEY GO IN IN FRONT OF THE BOARD FOR A VARIANCE. SO THE PROCEDURAL HISTORIES THAT 80% OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD SUPPORTED THE VARIANCE REQUEST, 20% DIDN'T ACTIVELY SUPPORT, NOR DID THEY OBJECT. BUT THE BOARD WAS ULTIMATELY DEADLOCKED. THEY COULDN'T PASS A MOTION TO GRANT OR DENY. SO THEN IT WAS STATUS QUO AND IT'S DENIED. UM, AND THEN THE DISTRICT COURT REVERSED THE DECISION AND ORDER ORDERED THE MATTER REMANDED TO THE BOARD FOR FURTHER PROCEEDINGS IN THE COURT OF APPEALS AFFIRM THE DISTRICT COURT'S, UM, REVERSAL. BUT THEN WHEN IT GOT TO THE SUPREME COURT, THE ONLY QUESTION ON APPEAL IS WHETHER THE BOARD'S ACTION WAS LEGAL AND TO AN ESTABLISHMENT IN AN ILLEGAL ORDER. THE CHALLENGER MUST SHOW A CLEAR ABUSE OF DISCRETION AND A ZONING BOARD ABUSES ITS DISCRETION IF IT ACTS WITHOUT REFERENCE TO ANY GUIDING RULES AND PRINCIPLES OR CLEARLY FAILS TO ANALYZE OR APPLY THE LAW CORRECTLY. SO A RE A REVIEWING COURT CANNOT SUBSTITUTE ITS OWN JUDGMENT FOR THAT OF THE BOARD BECAUSE THEY DISAGREE. UM, SO IN THIS CASE, THE SUPREME COURT HELD THAT THE BOARD DID NOT ABUSE ITS DISCRETION WHEN IT DENIED THE VARIANCE. EVEN THOUGH THE CITY APPROVED THE BUILDING PLANS, THE THEY REASON INVOLVED THE COST INVOLVED IN RE-PITCHING THE ROOF, THE STRUCTURE MAY CONSTITUTE A HARDSHIP. THE HARDSHIP WASN'T RELATED TO THE AREA SHAPE OR SLOPE OF THE PARCEL OF LAND. AND THAT THE MERE ISSUANCE OF A BUILDING PERMIT DOES NOT RENDER A CITY ZONING ORDINANCE UNENFORCEABLE. NOR DOES THE FACT THAT A PERMIT WAS ISSUED IN ERROR ENTITLED THE PROPERTY OWNER TO A VARIANCE. THE VARIANCE MUST BE BASED ON THE STANDARDS OF THE CODE, NOT THE PERSONAL CIRCUMSTANCES. UM, AND NOTHING ON THE PARCEL OF LAND REQUIRED A HIGHER ROOF. SO THE VARIANCE WASN'T NECESSARY TO PERMIT DEVELOPMENT OF THE PROPERTY BECAUSE IT COULD HAVE OTHERWISE BEEN DEVELOPED. UM, AND THE HARDSHIP WAS PERSONABLE IN NATURE BECAUSE THEY WANTED A HIRE OF THE DESIGN THAT THEY CHOSE. THEY WANTED A HIGHER ROOF. UM, SOCO IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE THE SUPREME COURT CONCLUDED THAT A CITY CAN ENFORCE THE CITY'S ZONING RULES EVEN AFTER A HOME IS NEARLY FINISHED. IF THE BUILD VIOLATES THE ORDINANCE, EVEN THOUGH THE CITY PREVIOUSLY APPROVED THE BUILDING PERMIT AND ISSUED IT IN ERROR, I THINK IT REALLY ZEROS IN ON DID THE BOARD ABUSE ITS DISCRETION AND THEY RULED IT DID NOT CORRECT. THEY RULED THAT THE BOARD DID NOT ABUSE ITS DISCRETION BY DENYING IT THREE TO TWO. SAY THAT THE BOARD DID NOT DENY THE BOARD DID NOT ABUSE ITS DISCRETION BY DENYING THE VARIOUS THAT THAT IS CORRECT. SORRY. YES. AND THAT'S WHAT THE SUPREME COURT SAID WHAT THEY'RE DOING AND WHAT, WHAT WE GENERALLY SEE IS THE COURT'S REINFORCE A CITIZEN DECISION OF A BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT UNLESS WE ABUSE OUR DISCRETION. SO THE KEY THING IS TO NOT ABUSE OUR DISCRETION. THANK YOU MS. THERESA. OKAY. YES PLEASE. MR. CAMPBELL, IF IT'S NOT INAPPROPRIATE, IS THERE A WAY FOR THE BOARD SPECIFICALLY ME, 'CAUSE I'M NEW TO HAVE, NOT COMPREHENSIVE, BUT A LIST OF CASE LAW, RELEVANT CASE LAW BE PROVIDED. AGAIN, IF IT'S NOT APPROPRIATE, I DON'T WANNA ASK THE CITY ATTORNEYS TO DO WORK PRODUCT THAT YOU'RE NOT BEING ASKED TO DO. BUT IF THERE'S LIKE MAYBE JUST A SYNOPSIS THAT I CAN REVIEW, MAYBE SOME PARENTHETICALS THAT WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL FOR ME. SURE. THERE'S A COUPLE THAT WE RELY ON. I CAN CERTAINLY PASS ALONG THAT INFORMATION. THANK YOU. I WOULD ASK THAT YOU DO THAT TO EVERYONE THEN. YEAH, IF WE'RE GONNA GIVE INFORMATION TO ONE, WE NEED TO GIVE IT TO EVERYONE. OKAY, THANK YOU. THAT'S, THAT'S A VERY APPROPRIATE, UH, PDT HOLDINGS IS ANOTHER ONE, MS. CARLISLE, THAT NEEDS TO BE, BECAUSE THAT'S ANOTHER SUPREME COURT HOLDING REGARDING THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. UM, OKAY, THE LAST ITEM ON CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE IS TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT. MR. EMERITUS. THANK YOU MR. CHAIRMAN. UM, THE TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT IS ONE OF THE THREE NOTICE REGIMES THAT YOU GUYS DEAL WITH. THE OTHER TWO CAN BE SUMMED UP IN A SENTENCE EACH, YOU HAVE TO PUT AN AD IN THE NEWSPAPER FOR THE CASES YOU'RE GONNA HEAR. AND THE SECOND ONE IS YOU HAVE TO SEND NOTICE TO PROPERTY OWNERS WITHIN 200 FEET. SO CHECK THOSE TWO BOXES. THE THIRD NOTICE REGIME IS THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT. AND IT REQUIRES THAT EVERY REGULAR SPECIAL OR CALLED MEETING OF A GOVERNMENTAL BODY MUST BE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC. IT APPLIES TO CITY COUNCIL, IT APPLIES TO ALL THE CITY BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS. AND SO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO IS YOU HAVE TO NOTICE YOUR MEETING. WE HAVE TO PLACE IT ONLINE AND WE PUT IT ON THE CITY'S ELECTRONIC BULLETIN BOARD, WHICH IS ON THE FIRST FLOOR, ON THE BLUE ELEVATOR SIDE. AND THEN ANY ACTION THAT'S NOT TAKEN IN A PROPERLY NOTICED MEETING IS VOIDABLE. NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. [06:00:01] AND SO, UM, TOMA APPLIES TO ALL GOVERNMENTAL BODIES, IT'S MANDATORY. UM, CITY COUNCIL SAYS THAT ALL OF BOARDING COMMISSIONS IN THE CITY OF DALLAS HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT. BUT CHAPTER TWO 11, WHICH OF THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE, WHICH IS THE ZONING ENABLING ACT, WHICH CREATES, UH, THE CITY PLAN COMMISSION, THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AND THE LANDMARK COMMISSION ALL SAY THAT YOU HAVE TO COMPLY WITH THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT. SO EVEN THE LEGISLATURE ADDS THAT, UH, REQUIREMENT ONTO, UM, YOU ALL. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. AND A MEETING UNDER THE TEXAS OPEN MEETINGS ACT IS CAN BE SUMMED UP SORT OF AS A, AS A MATH FORMULA MEETING EQUALS A QUORUM PLUS DELIBERATION. SO IF YOU HAVE A QUORUM OF A PANEL OR OF THE FULL BOARD DISCUSSING OFFICIAL PUBLIC BUSINESS, THAT IS A MEETING THAT MUST BE, UM, NOTICED UNDER THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT. IF YOU GUYS WANNA TALK ABOUT HOW DISAPPOINTED YOU ARE IN THE COWBOYS AS A GROUP, YOU CAN DO THAT. THAT WOULDN'T BE A VIOLATION OF TOMA. BUT, UM, IF YOU'RE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT MATTERS AND THERE'S A QUORUM OF YOU ALL, YOU MUST, UM, NOTICE THAT TO COMPLY WITH THE ACT. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. UM, WALKING QUORUMS ARE THIS INTERESTING SECTION IN THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT AND I DON'T KNOW HOW ELSE TO EXPLAIN IT OTHER THAN LITERALLY PROVIDE YOU THE SECTION. BUT THE IDEA IS BASICALLY YOU CANNOT CIRCUMVENT THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT BY HAVING LESS THAN A QUORUM ENGAGE IN A CONVERSATION AND THEN PLAY TELEPHONE WHERE PERSON A GOES AND RUNS AND TELLS PERSON B, WHO TELLS PERSON C AND SORT OF GET AROUND THAT WAY. SO THIS IS THE LEGISLATURE'S RESPONSE TO THAT. AND THIS IS THEIR SORT OF WAY OF DESCRIBING IT, IS YOU CAN ENGAGE IN A SERIES OF COMMUNICATIONS WITH LESS THAN A QUORUM THAT ULTIMATELY BECOMES MORE THAN A QUORUM. SO THAT'S A, THAT'S A BIG NO-NO. THIS COMES FROM A, UM, CASE. IT WAS A CITY SOUTH OF SAN ANTONIO WHERE THE COUNCIL MEMBERS WOULD GO INTO THE MAYOR'S OFFICE WITH THE CITY MANAGER AND THE THREE OF THEM WOULD DISCUSS, AND THEN THE COUNCIL MEMBER WOULD LEAVE AND THEY'D SEND IN A NEW COUNCIL MEMBER AND THE THREE OF THEM WOULD DISCUSS AND THEY WOULD SAY WHAT THEY DID AND THEY'D GO TO THE HORSESHOE AND GO VOTE, AND THEN GO BACK INTO THE MAYOR'S OFFICE AND DO IT ALL OVER AGAIN. SO THIS WAS THE LEGISLATURE'S RESPONSE. NEXT SLIDE, PLEASE. SO WHAT THIS EFFECTIVELY DOES IS, UM, PREVENT YOU FROM HAVING SECRET DELIBERATIONS EMAILING EACH OTHER, SAYING, YOU KNOW, I'M GONNA VOTE THIS WAY ON CASE NUMBER THREE, UM, VOTING OVER THE TELEPHONE OR DELIBERATING THROUGH A SERIES OF CLOSED MEETINGS. AND THEN IF YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A MEETING, YOU HAVE TO NOTICE IT. AND ONE OF THE NEW CHANGES THAT THE LEGISLATURE MADE WAS, INSTEAD OF 72 HOURS, WHICH I KNOW SOME OF YOU WHO HAVE BEEN ON THIS BOARD FOR A WHILE, HAVE HEAR, HEARD ME HARP ABOUT YOU HAVE TO POST YOUR MEETING 72 HOURS IN ADVANCE. THE LEGISLATURE CHANGED THAT AND IT IS NOW THREE BUSINESS DAYS. SO IF YOUR MEETING IS ON A MONDAY, YOU WOULD HAVE TO POST THE TUESDAY BEFORE. SO WEDNESDAY, THURSDAY, FRIDAY WOULD BE YOUR THREE BUSINESS DAYS. IF THERE'S A CITY HOLIDAY AT AN ADDITIONAL DAY. SO THE LEGISLATURE IS REQUIRING, UM, MUCH MORE LONGER NOTICE PERIODS NOW. AND THEN THE NOTICE MUST BE SUFFICIENT TO INFORM THE PUBLIC OF THE SUBJECT THAT WILL BE DISCUSSED. SO, MR. MOORE, WHAT IS THE QUORUM REQUIREMENT FOR THE FULL BOARD? WHAT IS THE QUORUM REQUIREMENT FOR A PANEL? I, UH, SO IT IS FOUR MEMBERS. IF YOU HAVE ALL FIVE APPOINTEES, IT'S FOUR MEMBERS, IT'S 75%. SO IF A PANEL HAS THREE MEMBERS IN THE ROOM, THAT'S NOT A QUORUM. THAT IS NOT A QUORUM. IF IT HAS FOUR, IT BECOMES A QUORUM. THAT IS CORRECT. ALRIGHT. NOW FOR THE FULL BOARD, IT IS 12 MEMBERS OF 15 APPOINTED. OF 12 OF 15. YES. SO WE HAVE FOUR, WE HAVE RIGHT NOW 13 APPOINTED MEMBERS. SO 75% OF 13 IS 10. I TRUST YOUR MATH. WELL, I I DID THE MATH. OKAY. YEAH, I I'M JUST VERY, VERY, IT'S 75%, RIGHT? YES. OKAY. I'M ALWAYS, I'M ALWAYS NERVOUS ABOUT DOING MATH IN PUBLIC LIKE THAT. SO I WILL, I WILL TRUST YOUR MATH CHAIRMAN. WELL, BUT IT'S 75% THOSE, IT'S 75% THOSE APPOINTED IS WHAT I'M TRYING TO GET, RIGHT? YES. AND THEN A PANEL, IT HAS TO HAVE FOUR REGARDLESS. CORRECT. OKAY. AND SO YOU'LL FIND MEETINGS START AS SOON AS FOUR PEOPLE ARE IN THE ROOM OR TODAY. I STARTED AT RIGHT AT NINE O'CLOCK. 'CAUSE I KNEW I HAD AT LEAST 10 MEMBERS IN THE ROOM. NEXT QUESTION. UM, THIS IS JUST EDUCATIONAL. UH, I KNOW WE UNDERSTAND NOW IT'S THREE BUSINESS DAYS, BUT WHAT IS THE RULES OF PROCEDURES AS IT RELATES TO OUR POSTING OF OUR AGENDA? IT IS SEVEN DAYS. AND I CORRECT. I DO NOT, THERE WOULD BE, I CANNOT THINK OF A SCENARIO, I GUESS UNLESS YOU HAVE LIKE MULTIPLE CITY HOLIDAYS BACK TO BACK, WHICH I WOULD THINK WOULD [06:05:01] ONLY BE THANKSGIVING IN THE DAY AFTER THANKSGIVING, WHERE THIS WOULD, AND THAT WOULD ONLY, THAT WOULD STILL BE SEVEN DAYS. SO, UH, IT, IT, THIS CHANGE UNDER THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT WOULD HAVE NO EFFECT FOR THIS BOARD. THERE ARE EFFECTS FOR OTHER CITY BOARDS, OTHER CITY COMMISSIONS. BUT SO, SO THREE YEARS AGO BOARD, FOUR YEARS AGO, BOARD MEMBERS, WE OPERATED ON, ON, UH, 72 HOURS. SO YOU WOULD GET YOUR, YOUR AGENDA PACKET 72 HOURS BEFORE MEETING. ONE OF THE THINGS THIS BOARD DID THREE YEARS AGO WAS TO SAY SEVEN DAYS. WE, THAT'S A BURDEN ON THE STAFF AND WE UNDERSTAND THAT. BUT SEVEN DAYS PRIOR TO A MEETING, ANY AND EVERY MEETING THAT WE HAVE, ALL THE DOC INFORMATION IS PUBLIC, YOU'LL GET YOURS AN EMAIL, IT'S ON THE WEBSITE AND THE PUBLIC GETS IT. SO THAT'S WHAT WE OPERATE ON. SEVEN DAYS. AND IT WAS HARD AT FIRST, BUT WE ARE CRUISING AT SEVEN DAYS. THANK YOU, MS. BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. AND THEN THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT PERMITS, BUT DOES NOT REQUIRE YOU TO DO, UM, HYBRID MEETINGS THAT ARE VIRTUAL WHERE THERE'S A VIRTUAL COMPONENT. BUT IF YOU DO HAVE THAT, YOU CAN ATTEND VIRTUALLY. UM, THE PRESIDING OFFICER MUST BE IN A PLACE THAT IS PHYSICALLY PRESENT WHERE THE PUBLIC CAN COME IN AND WATCH. AND THEN THE, UM, PUBLIC WHO IS PARTICIPATING, WHO ARE LIKE ACTUALLY SPEAKING TO YOU ALL. AND THE BOARD MEMBERS THEMSELVES MUST HAVE THEIR CAMERA ON THE WHOLE TIME. AND, UM, THEY'RE, THEY MUST BE ABLE TO COMMUNICATE. AND IF YOU LOSE YOUR VIDEO CONNECTION, IT'S SORT OF LIKE YOU'RE NOT HERE. I, I, I DON'T KNOW HOW ELSE TO EXPLAIN IT OTHER THAN WE'VE GOTTA BE ABLE TO SEE YOU. UM, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. AND THEN OPEN MICROPHONE SPEAKERS. THE AGENDA HAS TO GIVE NOTICE OF AN THAT THERE WILL BE OPEN MICROPHONE SPEAKERS TECHNICALLY THAT, UM, THE OPEN MICROPHONE SPEAKER IS DELIBERATION AS THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT DEFINES IT JUST BECAUSE THERE'S A THIRD PERSON PRESENTING YOU ALL WITH INFO INFORMATION. AND THEN IF YOU'RE GOING TO RESPOND, IT HAS TO BE SPECIFIC FACTUAL STATEMENTS OF EXISTING POLICY. THAT'S WHAT TOMA PERMITS YOU TO RESPOND WITH. AND THEN, UM, IF YOU WANT TO PLACE AN ITEM, IF SOMEONE BRINGS SOMETHING UP AND YOU'RE LIKE, YEAH, YEAH, WE, WE WANT TO DISCUSS, YOU KNOW, X WE THE CHAIR OR THREE BOARD MEMBERS CAN, I BELIEVE IT'S THREE MEMBERS, UM, I'D HAVE TO DOUBLE CHECK YOUR RULES. DON'T QUOTE ME ON THAT. UH, BUT THE CHAIR OR THREE BOARD MEMBERS CAN SIGN A MEMO DIRECTING STAFF TO MAKE THAT AN AGENDA ITEM FOR A SUBSEQUENT MEETING. AND THEN JUST SOME OTHER RANDOM HODGEPODGE RULES. UM, ADJOURN IS A MAGIC WORD. ONCE YOU ADJOURN, YOU'RE DONE FOR THE DAY. YOU CAN RECESS ALL YOU WANT, BUT ADJOURN IS A MAGIC WORD. UM, YOU HAVE TO VOTE IN PUBLIC, NO SECRET BALLOTS. AND IF WE FORGOT TO POST AN ITEM, THEN WE CAN'T DISCUSS IT. UM, WE'D HAVE TO PUT IT ON THE NEXT AGENDA ITEM OR PUT IT ON FOR THE NEXT MONTH'S AGENDA. AND THEN SOME CLOSED MEETINGS. YOU GUYS SELDOM GO INTO CLOSED MEETINGS. YOU WILL DO IT OCCASIONALLY UNDER THE, UM, CONSULTATION WITH THE ATTORNEY EXCEPTION. BUT BASICALLY YOU FIRST HAVE TO CONVENE IN AN OPEN MEETING, ANNOUNCE THAT YOU'RE GOING INTO A CLOSED MEETING, GO INTO THAT CLOSED MEETING, UM, BY IDENTIFYING WHICH EXCEPTION TO THE OPEN MEETINGS ACT, ALLOWS YOU TO GO INTO THE CLOSED MEETING. AND THEN ONCE YOU'VE CONDUCTED THE CLOSED MEETING, GO BACK INTO THE OPEN MEETING AND ADJOURN BASICALLY. NEXT SLIDE PLEASE. AND THEN WHO MAY ATTEND THE MEMBERS OF THE BODY, OBVIOUSLY. UM, IF YOU'RE GOING IN UNDER THE ATTORNEY EXCEPTION, YOU HAVE TO HAVE YOUR LAWYER PRESENT AND, UM, YOU CAN HAVE ANYONE ELSE WHO IS CONSIDERED NECESSARY FOR THE FULL CONSULTATION WITH THE LAWYER. THAT DOES NOT MEAN YOU CAN HAVE OPPOSING COUNSEL. IF ANYONE IS WONDERING THAT YOU CAN'T DO LIKE SETTLEMENT NEGOTIATIONS BASICALLY IS WHAT THAT IS. MEANING. AND THEN RECORD KEEPING. YOU HAVE TO KEEP, UH, YOUR MINUTES. MS. MARY DOES A GREAT JOB OF THAT. UM, BUT TOMA REQUIRES THAT. AND THEN IF ANYONE WANTS TO BE ABLE TO SEE THEM, THEY CAN COME SEE THEM. THEY GET POSTED ONLINE, SO SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO, BUT THEY'RE ALL AVAILABLE ONLINE. AND THEN ANY MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC CAN, IF THERE'S A VIDEO RECORDING OF IT, LIKE THERE IS, THEY'RE ALSO AVAILABLE ONLINE. MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC CAN, CAN GO BACK AND WATCH YOU ALL AND ANY QUESTIONS. YOU DID THAT IN YOUR SLEEP. MR. MOORE, THANK YOU. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YOU'VE DONE THAT THREE YEARS IN A ROW NOW. WE APPRECIATE THAT. I'VE DONE THAT TO MANY, MANY ABOARD AND MANY A COMMISSION. WELL, WE ARE HERE TODAY. THAT'S WHAT'S MOST IMPORTANT. ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. MOORE ON TEXAS [06:10:01] OPEN MEETING ACT. ALRIGHT, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ALRIGHT, WE'RE IN THE HOME STRETCH. UH, LET'S GO TO PAGE 1 95 IN THE DOCKET 1 95. THESE ARE ACTION ITEMS AND WE'RE GONNA GO THROUGH THE, UM, PROPOSED ANNUAL REPORT FIRST, BUT GO TO 1 95. WHO'S CONTROLLING THE SCREEN? OKAY, PLEASE PUSH THE BUTTON. THANK YOU MR. MOORE. THANK YOU MR. SAP. BEFORE WE DO THIS, LET, LET ME OPEN IT UP FOR FEEDBACK AND SUGGESTIONS ABOUT YOUR EXPERIENCE ON THE PANELS, YOUR EXPERIENCE AS A BOARD MEMBER, UH, AND IF YOU HAVE CRITICISM, LET'S MAKE IT CONSTRUCTIVE. SO THIS IS THE OPPORTUNITY FOR BOARD MEMBER FEEDBACK AND SUGGESTIONS. WE'RE ALL EARS. AND THEN WE'RE GONNA GO TO THE ANNUAL REPORT. WOW, NO FEEDBACK MS. DAVIS. JUST SOME GENERAL FEEDBACK. I KNOW WHEN I PLEASE, WHEN I STARTED ON THE PANEL FOUR YEARS AGO, WE DIDN'T HAVE THE VIDEOS AND THE, UM, THE VIDEOS ARE JUST UNBELIEVABLY HELPFUL. SO THOSE VIDEOS, THE PHOTOS HAVE BEEN MORE EXTENSIVE, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COMES TO LOOKING AT, UM, BLACKFACE CONTINUITY AND LOOKING AT FENCES. VERY, VERY HELPFUL. SO REALLY THAT'S, THAT'S MADE A HUGE DIFFERENCE. SO I TRULY APPRECIATE THAT CHANGE. THANK YOU. OTHERS QUESTIONS? MR. FINNEY? BUILDING ON KATHLEEN'S COMMENT ABOUT THE VIDEOS? UM, I THINK THAT THE, IT'S, UM, THE, THE VIDEOS SHOULD NOT REPLACE LIKE, ACTUAL GETTING OUT, UH, AT THE SITE. UM, IT SEEMS LIKE IF THE STAFF MEMBERS JUST DRIVE BY AND TAKE A VIDEO AND DON'T ACTUALLY PARK AND GET OUT, IT JUST SEEMS LIKE THERE'S INFORMATION THAT THEY MIGHT BE MISSING. SO, UM, I JUST WANNA, UH, I THINK THAT I, I DON'T KNOW IF THEY ARE, MAYBE, MAYBE THEY ARE GETTING OUT AND MAKING ACTUAL SITE OBSERVATIONS. UM, BUT, UH, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THEY ARE GETTING OUT. THEY DO, THAT'S HOW YOU GET THE ACTUAL VIDEOS. SO THE VIDEOS ARE TAKEN AT A DIFFERENT TIME THAN THE ACTUAL, THE PICTURES ARE TAKEN AT A DIFFERENT TIME THAN THE VIDEO. SO THEY'RE GOING OUT TO THE SITE MULTIPLE TIMES. PICTURES, STATIC PICTURES, STATIC PICTURES VERSUS THE VIDEO. CORRECT. THE 360 VIDEO? CORRECT. OKAY, COOL. THANKS. OTHER SUGGESTIONS OR OBSERVATIONS? DR. GLOVER? UH, FIRST OF ALL, I'D LIKE TO COMMENT CT STAFF FOR THE YEOMAN JOB. IF THEN, SO FAR I'VE SEEN TREMENDOUS PROGRESS WITH FEEDBACK WE HAVE GIVEN TO YOU. UM, AND ASIDE THAT I FEEL THAT MOST OF THE THINGS WE MENTIONED, WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO ACTION THEM AND SEE SOME PROGRESS, BUT SO FAR I THINK THEY'RE DOING A, A PHENOMENAL JOB. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, SIR. OTHER SUGGESTIONS, OBSERVATIONS, UH, ON A GOING FORWARD BASIS, IT'S ALWAYS HELPFUL AT THE END OF EVERY PANEL HEARING, WHETHER THEY READ EVERY PANEL HEARING THAT YOU GIVE FEEDBACK, UH, NOT DURING THE SESSION, BUT AFTER THE HEARING'S OVER FEEDBACK TO YOUR PRESIDING OFFICER ON, YOU KNOW, I REALLY WISH THIS, I REALLY WISH THAT THAT IS, THAT FEEDBACK GETS CHANNELED BACK THROUGH ME THEN TO, UH, THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. IT'S NOT A B***H SESSION, IT'S CONSTRUCTIVE. LIKE, YOU KNOW, JUST LIKE THE COMMON, THE VIDEOS AND THE ON STAFF ON SITE THAT, THAT'S VERY GOOD SUGGESTIONS. WE'RE GONNA GO TO OUR GOALS AND OBJECTIVES IN A MINUTE AND YOU'LL SEE SOME COMMENTS THAT ARE GONNA GO RIGHT TO THOSE COMMENTS. UM, SO, UH, I THINK THAT'S WORTHWHILE. ALRIGHT, WE'RE GONNA MOVE TO, WE'RE GONNA MOVE TO THE ANNUAL REPORT, BUT THAT DOES NOT PRECLUDE ANY FEEDBACK OR SUGGESTIONS YOU HAVE AS WE GO. CHAPTER EIGHT OF THE CODE SAYS THAT EVERY BOARD AND COMMISSION NEEDS TO FILE AN ANNUAL REPORT WITH THE CITY COUNCIL BY FEBRUARY 1ST OF THE FOLLOWING YEAR. SO THE FISCAL YEAR ENDED SEPTEMBER 30TH. SO I UTILIZE THIS MEETING AS A BASIS TO PRESENT TO THE BOARD A DRAFT ANNUAL REPORT. AND SO WE'RE GONNA WALK YOU THROUGH THAT AND THEN, UH, I WILL A ASK FOR FEEDBACK AND OR MODIFICATIONS AND OR ADOPTION. SO PAGE ONE 90, AND I WILL GIVE KUDOS AND CREDIT TO MS. MARY WILLIAMS, OUR BOARD SECRETARY, WHO HAS THE, THE JOY OF WORKING WITH ME ON [06:15:01] THIS PROJECT NOW THREE YEARS, THE JOY, UH, NO, MARY'S DONE A FABULOUS JOB. SHE WAS WAY AHEAD OF THE CURVE THIS YEAR COMPARED TO LAST YEAR COMPARED TO BEFORE. I MEAN, WAY AHEAD. I MEAN, IT WAS LIKE ALMOST A NON-ISSUE. THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT WAS EASY. SO, BUT KUDOS TO MISS MARY. ALRIGHT, PAGE 1 95 IS JUST THE COVER SHEET. PAGE 1 96 IS TABLE OF CONTEXT. PAGE 1 97 IS A COVER PAGE ABOUT MISSION, PURPOSE, AND AUTHORITY AND PROCESS. PAGE 1 98. AND I'M GONNA KEEP GOING UNLESS SOMEONE TELLS ME NOT. PAGE 1 98 IS BOILERPLATE MISSION STATEMENT. THIS COMES FROM THE SOME, IT COMES FROM THE CODE, IT COMES FROM A VARIETY OF THOSE THINGS. PAGE 1 99 IS PURPOSE, AUTHORITY, AND POWERS. THIS IS A LOT THAT YOU'VE HEARD TODAY. CHAPTER TWO 11 OF TEXAS GOVERNMENT CODE. THIS JUST GIVES US THE, ESTABLISHES THE PURPOSE OF THE BOARD AND THE LEGAL AUTHORITY. PAGE 200 IS THE PROCESS FOR ZONING APPEALS. WE TRIED TO MAKE THE CHANGE TO PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT FROM DEVELOPMENT SERVICES. YES, MS. GARNER. UM, IF YOU BACK UP TO PLEASE, UH, 1 97. 1 97 20 23 TO 2024. OOH. SO I, THE COPY THAT I HAVE ALSO HAS 2023 TO 20 20 20 23 TO 23. THE COPY IS CORRECT ON THE FRONT ANNUAL REPORT. OCTOBER 1 24, SEPTEMBER 30TH TO SEPTEMBER 25 IS CORRECT, BUT YOU ARE CORRECT. PAGE 1 97 IS A TYPO. THANK YOU FOR CATCHING IT. THIS IS WHAT WE WANT. IT SHOULD BE 2024 DASH 2025. THANK YOU. I DON'T THINK I HAVE THE RIGHT COPY. WERE WE GIVEN COPIES? DID I BRING THE WRONG WAY? IT SHOULD BEEN IN THE DOCKET, IN THE DOCK. OKAY, THEN I, I MAY HAVE GIVEN YOU LAST YEAR'S. THAT'S WHAT THAT IS. THANK YOU. OKAY, WELL THAT'S WHAT MADE ME CATCH THE DATE HERE. NO, I, I, I GET IT. ALRIGHT, SO ON PAGE 1 97, MARY, WE'RE GONNA CHANGE THAT TO 24 25. ALRIGHT, 1 98, WE TALKED ABOUT 1 99. 2 0 1 IS MEMBER ROSTER. NOW WE'RE ON PAGE 2 0 2. I'M NOT, I'M JUST MOVING ALONG. WHAT THE BOARD SECRETARY DOES IS LOOK AT WHO WERE THE MEMBERS OF WHAT PANELS WHEN THEY WERE APPOINTED AND ALTERNATE MEMBERS, AND THEN RESIGNATIONS FOR FIRST AND TERM ENDINGS. THIS IS JUST A FACTUAL PAGE OF WHO DURING WHAT TIME PERIOD AND WHAT PANELS THEY WERE ASSIGNED TO BY THE CITY SECRETARY. SO THE NATURAL THING IS TO LOOK FOR YOUR NAME AND MAKE SURE THERE'S NOT ANY ERRORS. SO PLEASE, EVERYONE LOOK FOR YOUR NAME. MAKE SURE THERE'S NOT ANY ERRORS. MR. CAMPBELL, YOU SHOULDN'T BE ON THERE YET. IF THIS IS, THIS IS 23 TO 25. YEP. YEP. NO, NO, YOU'RE CORRECT. THAT WAS A, THAT WAS ALMOST A GOOD CATCH, BUT NO, YOU'RE NOT THERE. YOU'LL BE ON THERE NEXT YEAR. ALRIGHT, ANY QUESTIONS ON MEMBER ROSTER? OKAY, PAGE 2 0 3 IS COVER PAGE FOR MEMBER ATTENDANCE. THEN ON 2 0 4, 2 0 5 AND 2 0 6 IS THE ACTUAL REPORT THAT THE BOARD SECRETARY SUBMITS TO THE CITY SECRETARY EVERY MONTH. SO EVERY MONTH AFTER A PANEL MEETING, SHE FILLS OUT THIS SPREADSHEET AND YOU CAN SEE THE TIMESTAMPS. SO THE FIRST ONE IS PANEL A. IT'S GOT NEWMAN DAVIS, HAYDEN, UH, MARY KOVI, THEN FINNEY SA GLOVER DORN DURING THIS LAST 12 MONTHS. AND IT SHOWS PRESENT, SO FORTH, SO FORTH, SO FORTH. OKAY. THEN PAGE 2 0 5. AND AGAIN, LOOK FOR YOUR NAME AND MAKE SURE, MAKE SURE IT'S ACCURATE. THIS IS IT. 2 0 5 IS PANEL B GABO LAMB, CANNON GRAHAM, VACANT. FINNEY SAUK GLOVER DORN. OKAY. AND AGAIN, IT SHOWS THE WITNESS FILED. OKAY. AND THEN PAGE 2 0 6 IS PANEL C, AGNES P*****K, MILLIKEN, SLADE, SASSING, FINNEY, SAUK, GLOVER, GRIFFIN, AND DORN. OKAY, THESE ARE FILED WITH THE CITY SECRETARY AND THEY BECOME PART OF THIS OFFICIAL ANNUAL REPORT. OKAY, I'M MOVING ON. EVERYONE SAW THEIR NAME? NO, YOU'RE NOT THERE, STUART. JUST PICKING ON YOU. SORRY. MR. CAMPBELL. MR. CAMPBELL. OKAY. PAGE 2 0 8 AND 2 0 9. 2 0 8. 2 0 9. THIS IS A FOLLOW UP FROM THE BRIEFING TO ALL THE PANELS IN AUGUST AND SEPTEMBER. THIS IS PROPOSED ACCOMPLISHMENTS ON OUR ADOPTED 24 25 GOALS AND OBJECTIVES. AND IN OCT IN AUGUST, I VISITED WITH EACH PANEL AND THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND I CAME UP WITH GREEN COLORS AND ALL THIS SORT OF THING. AND WE VISITED AND DID A Q AND A AND WE ADDRESSED EACH ONE OF THE GOALS THAT THIS BOARD ADOPTED LAST YEAR AND THEN GAVE FEEDBACK. I'M NOT GONNA READ EVERYTHING. SO FIRST ONE WAS FAIRNESS, TIMELINESS, ACCURACY, TRANSPARENCY. SECOND ONE WAS WITHIN 60 DAYS. [06:20:01] WOBA 54. THAT'S, I MEAN, THAT'S ALL YOU KNOW. UB 54, YOU CAN SMILE, YOU CAN DO A DANCE HERE. DO A LITTLE DANCE HERE. THAT'S RIGHT. DO A LITTLE DANCE FOR THE, FOR THE STAFF. ALL RIGHT. 54. UM, IT WAS FUNNY MS. LEW THIS MORNING SAYING, YOU'VE MADE THE PROGRESS DOWN, BUT DON'T, YOU CAN'T KEEP GOING DOWN . I ENJOYED THAT. ALRIGHT, NUMBER THREE, PROCESS IMPROVEMENT. THAT HAS TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. TALKING ABOUT THE DALLAS NOW PORTAL AND THEN ALSO TALK ABOUT FIVE MEMBER PANELS. FIVE MEMBER PANELS. YIKES. OUR FIRST READ, I WILL READ THE BOTTOM OF PAGE 2 0 8. NUMBER THREE, THE BOARD SECRETARY COORDINATES WITH THE CHAIRMAN OF THE BOARD EACH MONTH TO ANTICIPATE MEMBER NCES AND FILL AVAILABLE ALTERNATE MEMBERS AND ATTEMPT TO HAVE FIVE TO HAVE FULL FIVE MEMBER PANELS. WE HAD 32 32 MEETINGS. WE HAD TO CANCEL ONE FOR THE LACK OF QUORUM. AND WE HAD SIX THAT DID NOT HAVE FIVE MEMBERS. YIKES, THAT'S A YIKES, THAT'S AN 81% PASS RATE. AND MY BOOK, THAT'S NOT VERY GOOD. WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT THAT FURTHER IN THE NEXT GOAL. OKAY. UM, PAGE 2 0 9. PAGE TWO. NUMBER FOUR. THE GOAL WAS STAFF COMPREHENSIVE TECHNICAL ANALYSIS AND APPEALS AND CURRENT MAPS AND SO FORTH, SO FORTH, SO FORTH. UH, THIS GOES TO, UH, MS. DAVIS' COMMENT AND MR. FINNEY'S COMMENT ABOUT VIDEO AND 200 FEET AND PRESENTATIONS AND KUDOS, KUDOS, KUDOS. THAT DAMN 360 DEGREE CAMERA IS WONDERFUL. THE RED ITEM IS THE, THE, THE IMPLIED DESIRE TO INCORPORATE MORE PROFESSIONAL NARRATIVES. THIS IS YOU, MR. FINNEY. THIS IS YOU. TO INCORPORATE MORE PROFESSIONAL NARRATIVES ON THE UNIQUENESS OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND PROPERTIES IN THE CASE. AND AVOID CUT AND PASTE PRESENTATIONS. IN OTHER WORDS, WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD BEYOND WHAT JUST IS FROM YOU SEE FROM THE CAR. NOW, THIS IS A VERY, WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT THIS ON OUR GOALS FOR NEXT YEAR. 'CAUSE WE'RE GONNA, I'M RECOMMENDING WE INCLUDE THIS VERB. IT'S A VERY FINE LINE OF ASKING THE PROFESSIONAL STAFF TO GIVE US THEIR OPINION OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD, BECAUSE BY AND LARGE, WE REALLY WANT FACTS AND PROFESSIONAL JUDGMENT. SO HOW DO YOU GO FROM FACTS AND PROFESSIONAL JUDGMENT TO SUBJECTIVE? HMM. OKAY, NUMBER FIVE, WEBSITE IMPROVEMENT. OH MY GOSH, WHAT AN IMPROVEMENT PENDING CASE LOG RIGHT NOW, A CITIZEN, ANYONE CAN GO ON THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT WEBSITE AND LOOK AT THE PENDING CASES THAT HAVE BEEN FILED AND CLICK ON IT AND SEE EXACTLY WHAT THE APPLICANT HAS REQUESTED WITH THEIR SUBMITTALS AND SO FORTH. IT'S LIGHT YEARS AHEAD OF WHERE WE USED TO BE. TALK ABOUT GIVING INFORMATION DIRECTLY BACK TO THE PUBLIC. UM, RELEVANT FORMS OF DOCUMENTS UPDATED. THE ONE THING HERE IS USER-FRIENDLY FLOWCHART PROCESS UNDER DEVELOPMENT. YOU HEARD HER US TODAY TALK OVER AND OVER AGAIN. HOW ARE WE MAKING THIS EASIER FOR THE NON-PROFESSIONAL USER THAT, YOU KNOW, THE, THE HOMEOWNER WHO HAS TO COME DOWN HERE AND ASK FOR SOMETHING HAVING TO DO WITH THEIR HOME AND THEIR PROPERTY. SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT, UM, IS, IS OF HOPE. NUMBER SIX, TRAINING. THIS WAS A, THIS WAS A HARD ONE BECAUSE WE DID NOT MEET THIS AT ALL. THE NEW MEMBER ORIENTATION THAT WE GOT TODAY WAS DUE SEPTEMBER 30TH, BUT AT LEAST WE GOT IT TODAY. SO YOU ALL GOT ORIENTATED TODAY. UH, MS. UH, MILLER HOSKINS ASKED ME, DR. MILLER HOSS SAID, ARE WE STILL GONNA DO ONE-ON-ONE ORIENTATIONS? I SAID, NO, THEY'RE ORIENTATED. SO THIS IS THE ADOPTED GOALS AND OBJECTIVES FOR 24 25 AND OUR ACCOMPLISHMENTS THEREOF, THE CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO APPROVE MS. HAYDEN. I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE PROPOSED ACCOMPLISHMENTS AND ADOPTED 24 25 GOALS AND OBJECTIVES. IT'S BEEN MOVED BY MS. HAYDEN. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND? SECONDED BY MR. CAMPBELL DISCUSSION IN THE MOTION. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. ALL THOSE OPPOSED PASSAGE UNANIMOUSLY. LET'S DO OUR COUNT AGAIN, MARY. WE'VE GOT 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13. SO WE HAVE 13, 10 IS OUR QUORUM SO NO ONE CAN MOVE. BUT ANYWAY, 13 3 13 0. ALRIGHT, NEXT ITEM. LET'S GO TO PAGE TWO. 10, 2 10. THIS IS A FOR YOU NUMBERS PEOPLE. THIS IS A GREAT GRAPHIC. WE CREATED THIS A COUPLE YEARS AGO. TWO 10 SHOWS. WHAT IS OUR WORKFLOW THIS YEAR? IF YOU LOOK AT THE, THE, THE COLUMN 23, 24, THAT WAS THE PREVIOUS FISCAL YEAR. THEN 24, 25 IS THE RISKIER THAT JUST FINISHED. AND THEN A CHANGE COLUMN. SO THE THIRD LINE DOWN IS IMPORTANT. OUR REQUESTS WENT FROM 200 TO 2 31. THAT'S A 16% INCREASE IN [06:25:01] BUSINESS. WHOA. YOU CAN INTERPRET THAT IN MANY WAYS. DOES THAT MEAN THERE'S MORE DEVELOPMENT GOING ON OR DOES THAT MEAN THE CODE AND ZONING IS MORE DYSFUNCTIONAL? I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS, BUT OUR, WE HAVE AN INCREASE OF 16% OF THE CASES COMING TO THE BOARD. GO FARTHER DOWN. YOU CAN SEE THE SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS. BASICALLY FLAT VARIANCES UP 40%. MR. SLATE, CHAIR NEWMAN FOR THE TOTAL APPLICATIONS. IF A CASE IS A HOLDOVER, DOES THAT COUNT AS ONE APPLICATION OR TWO? UH, MARY, HOW DID WE DO THAT? IT'S ONLY COUNTED ONCE. THANK YOU. I KNEW SHE HAD THE ANSWER. THANK GOODNESS. UM, YOU CAN SEE THE SPIKE IN FEE WAIVER REFUNDS. NOW SOME OF THAT IS FOR, UH, A APPLICANT WHO CAN'T PAY THEIR DEAL. THE OTHER IS PERMIT ERRORS. NOT EVERY PERMIT ERROR COMES BACK AND ASK FOR IT. I REGULARLY SAY TO THOSE APPLICANTS THAT HAVE PERMIT ERRORS, ASK FOR A REFUND, WE'LL GIVE IT TO YOU. NOW THE BOARD DECIDES THAT IT'S NOT ME THAT DECIDES THAT. SO LET'S ALL LOOK AT NUMBER OF CASES APPROVED. NUMBER OF CASES DENIED. YOU SEE THE 80 AND THE 20, 80% OF OUR 231 CASES WE APPROVED. 20% WE DENIED. YES, SIR. MR. OVITZ, MR. CHAIRMAN, I WOULD SUGGEST ADDING, UH, ONE MORE STAT, PLEASE. NOT NECESSARILY FOR THIS TIME, BUT OKAY. MAYBE FOR THE FUTURE. THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL CASES WE'VE HEARD ON PANEL A WHERE WE'VE CONDITIONALLY APPROVED CASES BASED ON SOME FUTURE ACTION TO BE TAKEN BY THE APPLICANT. YES. PARKING USUALLY, UM, USUALLY, UM, IF WE COULD MAYBE HAVE A SEPARATE STATISTIC THAT SHOWS THAT AND HOW MANY AND WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THOSE ENDED UP COMPLYING OR NOT COMPLYING WITH THE REQUIREMENTS THAT WERE PLACED ON THEM. OKAY. OR, OR, OR MAYBE I DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW THEY EVEN FOLD IN HERE. NOW. CAN WE DO THAT FOR THE FUTURE? CERTAINLY. BUT HOW, HOW WOULD THEY FOLD IN HERE NOW IN THIS, THESE TIMES? UM, THEY WOULD BE UNDER APPROVAL 'CAUSE THE PANEL APPROVED IT. IF IT'D BE A SUBSET OF APPROVED CASES IF THEY DID THE ACTIONS REQUIRED OR WELL, THAT'S MS. BOARD ATTORNEY IF WE APPROVE IT. BUT THOSE THAT WE APPROVE CONDITIONALLY, IT'S NOT A FINAL APPROVAL, IS IT? NO, BECAUSE THEY WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK BEFORE THE BOARD. SO IT WOULD SHOW UP HERE AS AN APPROVAL BECAUSE IT'S PART OF THE 2 31. UM, IF I, IF I MAY MISS MR. YES, MS. WILLIAMS. UM, SO ON THE COUNT, SO OBVIOUSLY EACH APPLICATION MAY HAVE SEVERAL REQUESTS. YES. SO, YOU KNOW, SOME OF 'EM, YES, THEY GET APPROVED, WHICH GOES UNDER THE APPROVAL, WHICHEVER, 'CAUSE THESE ARE THE REQUESTS THAT HAVE BEEN APPROVED AND SOME REQUESTS HAVE BEEN DENIED. YEP. AND SO IF A, UH, OBVIOUSLY IF A, IF AN APPLICATION HAS, YOU KNOW, THREE REQUESTS AND TWO GET APPROVED AND ONE DENIED, SO OBVIOUSLY IT'S GONNA BE DIVIDED, UNDERSTOOD TO THE ONE. UM, BUT, UM, BUT YES, UH, UH, IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE AS FAR AS HOW MANY APPLICATIONS GET PARTIALLY, UM, APPROVED, ARE YOU LOOKING FOR THE NUMBER OF CONDITIONALS OR THE NUMBER OF CONDITIONALS THAT ACTUALLY MEET THE CONDITION? I GUESS WHAT MARY JUST SAID RAISED ANOTHER ISSUE. ANOTHER QUESTION. SO, UM, BUT I'LL FINISH WITH MY ORIGINAL QUESTION. WHAT I, WHAT I WAS LOOKING FOR WAS, UM, WE CONDITIONALLY APPROVE A CASE PROVIDING, FOR EXAMPLE, THERE WAS A PARKING CASE THAT THEY HAD TO COME BACK TO US WITH SOME ADDITIONAL, THEY HAD TO MAKE SOME MODIFICATIONS AND COME BACK TO US ONE YEAR. ONE YEAR. UM, WHERE, HOW DO WE, HOW DOES THAT GET TRACKED WHETHER THEY CAME BACK IN A YEAR WITH THE INFORMATION AND WHETHER THEY FULFILLED THE REQUIREMENT AND DIDN'T FULFILL THE REQUIREMENT IN OTHER, IN OTHER WORDS, HOW SUCCESSFUL IS IT? I GUESS WHAT I'M AFTER IS, HOW SUCCESSFUL IS IT TO CONDI PUT CONDITIONS ON A, ON APPROVAL? OKAY, THAT'S A VERY GOOD QUESTION. SO IS THAT A PLANNING DEVELOPMENT ISSUE? HOW WOULD YOU, HOW DO YOU TRACK THAT? OR DID YOU ISSUE, WOULD, AFTER THAT BOARD MEETING, DID YOU GUYS ISSUE A PERMIT SUBJECT TO, AND HOW DO YOU TRIGGER THAT ONE YEAR BACK? THAT'S YOUR QUESTION. SO DO WE HAVE SOMEONE THAT CAN ANSWER THAT? MS. BOARD ADMINISTRATOR? I DON'T KNOW WHETHER OR NOT A PERMIT HAS BEEN ISSUED FOR THAT PARTICULAR CASE OR NOT, BUT, UM, I GUESS GOING FORWARD WE COULD POSSIBLY TRACK THAT INFORMATION, YOU KNOW, BASED UPON WHAT THE CONDITION WAS. WELL JUST [06:30:01] TRACK THE CONDITIONAL APPROVAL ITSELF. AND THEN WHEN THEY COME BACK TO THE BOARD, I GUESS IN THE, IN A FOLLOW UP MEETING, THAT NUMBER WOULD BE AVAILABLE. BUT I THINK NOW THE BIGGER ISSUE IS HOW DOES THE CITY STAFF TRACK THAT PROPERTY OWNER THAT WE GAVE PERMISSION FOR A PARKING SPECIAL EXCEPTION SUBJECT TO A PARKING STUDY A YEAR FROM NOW. 'CAUSE THAT WAS THE WHOLE THING. THEY SAID IT'S NOT GONNA BE AN ISSUE. WE SAID, OH, OKAY. GIVE YOU ONE YEAR TO PROVE THAT IT'S NOT. SO HOW DOES THE, HOW DOES THE CITY TRACK THAT? AM I HIJACKING YOUR QUESTION? ESSENTIALLY? SORRY, ONE SECOND. MR. QUINT. SO WHO, WHAT AREA IN THE CITY TRACKS THAT? HOW DOES IT, HOW DOES THE THUMB COME BACK UP IN THE AIR? IF YOU DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER, WE'LL COME BACK TO IT. I DON'T, I DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER FOR THAT. UM, THE BOARD, YOU GAVE THEM A CONDITION AT THAT BRIEFING? YES. SO IT'S ALSO ON THE APPLICANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY COME BACK WITHIN A YEAR. UM, NOW I HAVE NOT SEEN THIS BEFORE. THIS WAS MY FIRST ROUND WITH THIS. BUT I WOULD ASSUME WHAT BOARD STAFF PROBABLY REACH BACK OUT TO THEM UPCOMING, YOU KNOW, AS THEY GET CLOSEST TO THEIR YEAR. BUT THE APPLICANT, I GUESS AGAIN, IT'S UPON THE APPLICANT AND IF THAT CONDITION ISN'T MADE, IF THEY DON'T COME BACK BEFORE THE BOARD, ONCE A PERMIT IS ISSUED AND IT'S NOTED, THAT'S HOW IT'S GOTTA BE NOTED IN THE PERMIT. MM-HMM . OKAY. WOULD YOU REVERIFY THE SYSTEM IN PLACE? YOU DON'T HAVE TO NOW, BUT LET ME KNOW. YES. WHAT'S THE SYSTEM IN PLACE? DIANA'S GOT AN ANSWER. OH, HERE'S THE ONE WHO REALLY HAS THE ANSWER. ONE SECOND. RIGHT. SO, OKAY, SO GO AHEAD AND TELL US, RIGHT? NO, SO SHE JUST BASICALLY SAID THE SAME THING. THAT THEY HAVE THAT CONDITION ON THEIR APPROVAL, THAT IT'S UP ON THEM. YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE TO TAKE THEIR RESPONSIBILITY TO COME BACK. BUT IF THEY DON'T, IF THEY DON'T, I DO FEEL LIKE THERE'S A WAY, THERE NEEDS TO BE A WAY THAT WE, YES. SO WOULD YOU PLEASE FOLLOW UP ON THAT? OKAY. MR. KOVICH THEN MR. DR. GLOVER. MR. HOVI. MY, MY, MY OTHER QUESTION THAT MARY'S STATEMENT BROUGHT UP WAS, WHEN IT SAYS NUMBER OF CASES APPROVED, WE HAVE SO MANY CASES, THEY HAVE ONE CASE NUMBER WITH MULTIPLE ELEMENTS. WHAT ARE WHAT? THEY MIGHT HAVE THREE THINGS WITHIN THE CASE. THREE. IT WILL, IT REALLY PROBABLY SHOULD SAY NUMBER OF REQUESTS APPROVED. IS THAT WHAT THAT ACTUALLY IS? YES. RIGHT, BECAUSE A CASE AND MULTIPLE REQUESTS. SO IT'S NOT, SO IT'S A-B-D-B-D-A NUMBER AND IT HAS SEVERAL REQUESTS. AM I CORRECT? IT'LL BE, IT'LL BE IN THERE WITH MULTIPLE COUNTS. IT WON'T, IT'S NOT JUST ONE FOR EACH CASE NUMBER. OKAY. SO MARY, I'M GONNA SAY, LET'S CHANGE THAT TO SAY NUMBER OF REQUESTS APPROVE AND NUMBER OF REQUESTS DENIED. TAKE THE WORD CASES OFF. 'CAUSE REALLY IT'S REQUESTS. YES. THANK YOU. DR. GLOVER. UH, WHEN CASES ARE WITHDRAWN, DO THE APPLICANTS RECEIVE A REFUND? OOH, I DON'T, WELL THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. WHEN CASES ARE WITHDRAWN, DOES THE APPLICANT RECEIVE A REFUND? IF THE CASE HAS BEEN ALREADY NOTICED, THEN THEY DON'T GET A REFUND AND NOTICED MEANS 10 DAYS OR 14 DAYS. WHAT DOES NOTICED MEAN IF THEY WITHDRAW? SHE'S LOOKING AT THE RULES. 35. NO, ONCE IT'S NOTICED WITH THE 10 DAYS, UM, THEY, THEY'RE ONLY ALLOWED A PARTIAL REFUND. IS THAT CORRECT? SHE'S LOOKING IT UP RIGHT NOW. DIANA'S GOING TO, UM, CLARIFY. OKAY. THE STAFF WILL COME BACK TO ANSWER YOU THAT QUESTION. OKAY, DIANA. OKAY. UM, ONCE THE APPLICATION HAS BEEN NOTICED, THEY, AND IT'S UM, NOTICE YOU MEAN DALLAS MORNING NEWS, RIGHT? CORRECT. THEY, THEY CAN ONLY RECEIVE, UM, THEY RECEIVE A REFUND, BUT WE HAVE TO DEDUCT 25%. SO THEY GET A 75% REFUND. CORRECT. OKAY. UM, IF IT'S THE APPLICANT THAT WITHDRAWS COMPLETELY, THEN THEY DO NOT RECEIVE ANY REFUND AFTER IT'S BEEN ED. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE? YES. WELL, IF THERE'S, IF IT'S A STAFF ERROR LIKE WE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER, UM, THEN THEY WOULD RECEIVE THAT. BUT THEY DON'T RECEIVE THE 25% BECAUSE IT'S, IT'S ALREADY BEEN NOTICED. DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? OKAY. WE'RE GONNA KEEP GOING. MR. CHAIRMAN? YES. I'M SORRY MR. QUINN. I'M SORRY. UM, IS THERE A REASON OR A NEED TO TRACK, UH, DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE VERSUS WITHOUT PREJUDICE? OKAY, THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. AND A, WITH THE TIMELINE, JUST SO AS WE'RE DOING THIS, IF, IF WE'RE TRACKING TIME SINCE, SO GO AHEAD. ALRIGHT, THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. UH, [06:35:01] I'M GONNA SAY PROBABLY NOT BECAUSE THERE ARE VERY FEW DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE. VERY FEW. 'CAUSE THAT IS REALLY PUNITIVE. YOU'RE TELLING A PROPERTY OWNER, YOU CAN'T COME BACK TO US IN TWO YEARS UNLESS YOU PROVE TO THE BOARD ON A SEPARATE HEARING THAT THERE WAS A CHANGE IN CIRCUMSTANCES. UM, IF AN APPLICANT ON A PIECE OF PROPERTY IS, MAKES A REQUEST AND IT'S DENIED WITH PREJUDICE, IT GOES INTO THE WHAT SYSTEM THAT SHOWS THAT A CASE WAS FILED AGAINST THAT PROPERTY. YOUR POTUS WHAT'S YOUR OR IS IT DALLAS NOW? NOW IT'S DALLAS. NOW. NOW. ALRIGHT. HE ASKED THE QUESTION AS IT RELATES TO, UH, HOW OFTEN DOES A DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE SHOULD IT BE TRACKED? AND ALSO HOW IS IT THAT WE KNOW THAT THEY HAD A DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE? YOUR SYSTEM SHOULD TRACK THAT, RIGHT? YES. YES. IT'S NOTED IN THE SYSTEM, BUT DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE IS WITHIN THE BOARD'S POWER, BUT IS RARE. I'LL TELL YOU WHEN IT TYPICALLY HAPPENS, IT HAPPENS WHEN SOMEONE'S LYING TO US AND WE, WHEN WE CAN JUST FEEL IT OR WHEN SOMEONE IS ABUSING THEIR, THE PROCESS AND USUALLY FIBBING, I SHOULDN'T SAY LYING, I'LL SAY JUST FIBBING AND YOU CAN KIND OF SMOKE IT OUT. UM, BUT THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN THAT OFTEN 'CAUSE THAT'S TOUGH. MR. SLADE, CHAIR NEWMAN, I WILL, UH, TAKE A DIFFERENT OPINION AND SORT OF VIEW THE DEFAULT AS A DISMISSAL WITH PREJUDICE UNLESS THEY GIVE US SOME REASON WHY THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO COME BACK WITHIN MULTIPLE YEARS IF THERE'S A CHANGE IN CIRCUMSTANCE. I JUST WANT THAT OUT THERE IN CASE, UM, SOMEONE RECEIVES A DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE FROM ONE PANEL THAT THEY MIGHT NOT PRESUME THAT WE WERE BEING PUNITIVE OR VINDICTIVE TO THEM OR DEEM THEM LIARS. ABSOLUTELY. THAT'S WITHIN THE DISCRETION OF EACH PANEL BASED ON THE FACTS PRESENTED IN THE CIRCUMSTANCES. ABSOLUTELY. YES. I WANT TO, UM, GO BACK TO THE REFUND AND MAKE A CLARIFICATION. SO THE CODE SAYS THAT, UM, IF THE APPLICANT WITHDRAWALS BEFORE THE CASE IS ADVERTISED, THEY WILL GET 75% BACK. ONCE THE CASE HAS BEEN ADVERTISED, THEN THEY RECEIVE NO REFUND. THAT WOULD MAKE SENSE BECAUSE YOU'VE PAID FOR THE DALLAS MORNING NEWS AND ALL THE STAFF PREP. SO DID YOU GET THAT DR. ? OKAY. UH, SORRY. OH MY GOD. SORRY. UM, UH, UH, IT'S A, THIS THAT WAS A VERY GOOD EXAMPLE OF TWO DIFFERENT MEMBERS THAT HAVE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE ON THAT. I KNOW THAT IF SOME, IF PER OUR RULES, IF AN APPLICANT COMES FORWARD AND MAKES A REQUEST AND FAILS TO GET FOUR VOTES, IT'S A VOTE OF THREE TO TWO, WHAT HAPPENS? OUR RULE SAY IT'S DENIED WITH PREJUDICE, PERIOD. JUST, JUST SAYS IT. USUALLY WHAT HAPPENS IS ANOTHER PERSON MAKES A MOTION AND SAYS, I MOVE TO DENY WITHOUT PREJUDICE IS WHAT USUALLY HAPPENS. NOT ALWAYS, BUT USUALLY BECAUSE JUST 'CAUSE YOU DIDN'T MAKE YOUR CASE TODAY DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEAN YOU CAN'T COME BACK TOMORROW, A MONTH OR TWO MONTHS. YOU HAVE TO REPAY YOUR FEES AND ALL THAT. BUT DENIAL WITH PREJUDICE IS RARE. AND AGAIN, EVEN IF IT'S DENIED WITH PREJUDICE, YOU CAN PETITION THE BOARD AND SAY, MY CIRCUMSTANCES CHANGE, PROVE THAT, AND WE LET YOU BACK IN, IN THE TWO YEAR TIME PERIOD. OKAY? ALRIGHT. PAGES TWO 11. WE'RE GONNA MAKE THE CHANGES ON THE WORK SUMMARY TO PUT REQUESTS ON THERE. UM, PAGE 2 11 13 15 IS A EXCEL SPREADSHEET THAT A BOARD SECRETARY CREATED TO TRACK EVERY CASE AND EVERY REQUEST. OH MY GOSH, WE'RE GONNA GO PAST THAT. YOU'RE WELCOME TO GIVE FEEDBACK. SIDEBAR. PAGE 2 25. 2 25. ALRIGHT, 2 25 IS OUR PROPOSED GOALS AND OBJECTIVES FOR 25 26. I AM NOT GONNA READ EVERY LINE. I'M GONNA PARAPHRASE. UM, THESE ARE PROPOSED BASED ON THE OFFICERS AND THE FEEDBACK THAT WE GOT AFTER THE AUGUST SERIES OF BOARD, UH, PANEL PRESENTATIONS. ONE IS THE SAME THING AGAIN, FAIRNESS, TRANSPARENT, TIMELY AND ACCURATE. NUMBER TWO, THIS IS A BIGGIE. MEMBERS AND ALTERNATES ACKNOWLEDGE THE IMPORTANCE OF IN-PERSON FULLY FIVE BY FIVE ATTENDED PANEL HEARINGS. MEMBERS COMMIT TO EFFECTIVE A HUNDRED PERCENT ATTENDANCE BY MEMBERS AND OR ALTERNATE MEMBERS BY CALENDARIZING. PRIORITIZING MONTHLY MEETINGS AND COMMUNICATING POTENTIAL AND ABSENCE. WELL IN ADVANCE OF MEETING DATES. I'M READING IT TO OPTIMIZE ALTERNATE MEMBER COVERAGE. WE HAD TO CANCEL A PANEL JUST RECENTLY 'CAUSE WE COULDN'T GET A QUORUM. ALMOST HAD TO, WE HAD TO CANCEL TWO PANELS AND THEN WE REESTABLISH PANEL A FOR NEXT WEEK. UM, I GET THE CITY GETS THAT YOU'RE ALL VOLUNTEERS, BUT WHAT WE HAVE TO DO IS UNDERSTAND AND APPRECIATE WE'RE DEALING WITH SOMEONE'S PROPERTY, THEIR LIVELIHOOD. [06:40:01] IT'S ONLY FAIR THAT THEY HAVE A FULL PANEL OF FIVE JUDGES. SO THEREFORE WE'RE GONNA BE DEALING WITH OUR CALENDAR HERE MOMENTARILY. GET PUT THAT IN YOUR, IN YOUR BOOK FOR 2026 DEPENDING ON WHAT WE APPROVE. AND PLEASE PRIORITIZE THOSE DATES. WE'LL HAVE THIS WHOLE CONVERSATION ABOUT CALENDAR A MINUTE. AND AS SOON AS YOU KNOW YOU HAVE A CONFLICT, YOU LET ME KNOW. JUST LET ME KNOW. AND THEN I WORKED WITH THE SIX ALTERNATES AND MARY, EXCUSE ME, MS. WILLIAMS, TO GET FIVE MEMBER PANELS. THAT IS SO IMPORTANT. SO IMPORTANT. OKAY, NUMBER THREE, UH, 55 DAYS WE WENT UP ONE FROM 54. THAT GIVES HER A ONE DAY OF BREATHING ROOM, AREN'T I? AREN'T WE GENEROUS? THAT'S RIGHT. NUMBER FOUR, PROCESS IMPROVEMENTS. UH, VERY GOOD SUGGESTION MADE HERE. CAN AI ASSIST IN STREAMLINING THE PROCESS? WOO. NUMBER TWO, SHOULD WE CONSIDER SURVEYS FROM APPLICANTS TO OBTAIN THEIR FEEDBACK ON USER FRIENDLINESS? I SAID CONSIDER THAT'S NOT DIRECTION THAT SAYS CONSIDER. NOW IF SOMEONE GETS DENIED A CASE, THEY'RE PROBABLY NOT GONNA GIVE YOU GOOD FEEDBACK. BUT THE IDEA IS WHAT IS OUR CUSTOMER THINKING OF THE PROCESS? NUMBER FIVE, COMPREHENSIVE TECHNICAL ANALYSIS. CONSIDER AI AND DRONE FOR AERIAL OVERHEAD VIDEO. AND ALSO PROFESSIONAL NARRATIVES TO INCLUDE UNIQUENESS OF SURROUNDING PROPERTIES WITHIN 200 FEET OF APPEAL. LOCATION. EXAMPLE, MR. FINNEY'S COMMENT, GET OUT OF THE CAR. I'M NOT BEING DIS DISRESPECTFUL. GET OUT OF THE CAR. ASSESS WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD IF OUR EYES AREN'T SUPPOSED TO BE THERE. THE STAFF'S EYES NEED TO BE THERE. NOT JUST THE VIDEO, BUT GET A SENSE. I ALWAYS SAY ON A FENCE CASE, WELL THE VIDEO I SEE, I DON'T SEE ANY FENCES. WHY WOULD WE PUT FENCES IN WITH TALL AND THAT SORT OF THING. WHAT IS THE SENSE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD? IT'S A VERY FINE LINE, MISS BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. WE WANT YOUR PROFESSIONAL TECHNICAL JUDGMENT AND WE WANT A LITTLE BIT OF SUBJECTIVE, OKAY? IF THE BOARD WANTS TO DO THIS. UM, I LOVE THAT. THAT WAS, UM, MR. DORAN'S SUGGESTION ON AI AND DRONE. NOW THAT'S CONSIDER, I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU KNOW, ALTHOUGH MS. L TALKED ABOUT AI THIS MORNING. SHE DID. SO I DON'T KNOW HOW THE IDEAS STAY TECHNOLOGICALLY PROFICIENT. I DON'T KNOW IF THE CITY WANTS DRONES OVER PROPERTIES OR NOT. I DON'T KNOW. THAT MAY GET INTRUSIVE. SO I DON'T KNOW. THAT'S WHY I SAID CONSIDER WEBSITE ENHANCEMENT. THIS PENDING CASES ESSENTIAL. ADD A VIDEO LINK SO THAT PEOPLE CAN SEE WHAT A TYPICAL BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT CASE IS. IF MS. GARNER WAS GONNA HAVE A CASE COME FOR THE BOARD, HOW CAN WE HELP HER PREPARE AS AN APPLICANT SO SHE DOESN'T WALK IN AND GO, OH MY GOSH, WHAT DO I DO? AS OPPOSED TO SEEING A TYPICAL BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT. CASE NUMBER SEVEN, TRAINING. AND THE OTHER QUESTION, SHOULD BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT MEMBERS AND ALTERNATES ATTEND CITY PLANNING COMMISSION, AMERICAN PLANNING ASSOCIATION, TEXAS PLANNING ASSOCIATION TO LEARN FULLER ASPECTS OF LAND USE? THAT'S A QUESTION. THAT'S NOT A DIRECTION. THOSE ARE THE SUGGESTIONS TO THE BOARD DISCUSSION. MR. FINNEY, CAN I MAKE AN ADDITIONAL SUGGESTION? PLEASE? I TOUCHED ON THIS EARLIER. UM, BUT I I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO RESTATE IT AS A FORMAL SUGGESTION. UM, ANY CASE WHERE THE CRITERIA IS, UM, WHETHER OR NOT THE VARIANCE WOULD, WOULD CREATE A TRAFFIC HAZARD SPECIFICALLY, UH, PARKING, UM, PARKING REQUIREMENT, VARIANCE REQUEST. SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS. YOU MEAN SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS? YES. UM, I THINK IT WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL AND CRUCIAL TO THE DECISION MAKING PROCESS TO HAVE SOME SORT OF QUANTITATIVE METRIC FROM OUR TRANSPORTATION TEAM TO ASSIST US IN MAKING A QUICKER, UH, MORE EFFECTIVE DECISION. BECAUSE WHAT I'VE OBSERVED IN THE SITUATIONS WHERE I HAVE BEEN PRESENT, UH, ON THESE CASES IS THAT WE END UP RUNNING IN CIRCLES MM-HMM . BICKERING WITH EACH OTHER. MM-HMM . ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT WE TRUST THE THIRD PARTY TRAFFIC ANALYSIS STUDY. AND IT COULD BE SOMETHING AS SIMPLE AS, UM, THERE'S INDUSTRY STANDARD FOR LEVELS OF SERVICE. SO THERE COULD BE A PROJECTED LEVEL OF SERVICE A THROUGH F AND OUR CITY STAFF KNOWS WHAT I'M, WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. UM, BASICALLY THERE'S VERY QUANTITATIVE, VERY VAGUE, UH, QUANTITATIVE, UH, EVALUATIONS OF, UH, WHERE YOU RANK IT FROM A THROUGH F UH, WHETHER IT'S, UM, FREE FLOWING TRAFFIC OR HIGHLY CONGESTED, YOU KNOW THAT OKAY, THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE A LOT OF MATH OR, SO PUT THAT INTO SEVEN, SEVEN WORDS. PUT ALL THAT INTO SEVEN WORDS AND I'LL ADD IT TO NUMBER FIVE. OKAY. UM, QUANTITATIVE METRIC FOR [06:45:03] FROM TR TRANSPORTATION TEAM. THAT'S TRAFFIC WORKING CONGESTION FOR QUANTITATIVE TRAFFIC DATA. QUANTITATIVE METRIC OR QUANTITATIVE? WHAT'D YOU SAY? QUANTITATIVE TRAFFIC DATA. IS THAT OKAY? UM, ANDREW? YES. MR. FINNEY? YES. ALRIGHT, SO WE'RE GONNA SAY SEEK, EXCUSE ME, OBTAIN NOT SEEK. SEEK MEANS. LOOK, OBTAIN MEANS HAVE, OBTAIN QUANTITATIVE TRAFFIC DATA FOR PARKING REQUESTS. IS THAT WHAT WE'RE SAYING? IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING MR. FINNEY? UM, IT HAS TO BE SOMETHING THAT WE BELIEVE IN AND WE THINK IS OBTAINABLE AND CAN BE MEASURED. YEAH. UM, IT'S NOT JUST THE PARKING VARIANCE REQUEST, IT'S ANY SITUATION WHERE THE CRITERIA IS, DOES IT CREATE A TRAFFIC HAZARD? YOU NEED EVALUATION IN THERE. THE WORD EVALUATION. IT, IT NEEDS THE WORD COMPREHENSIVE IN THERE BECAUSE ONE OF THE THINGS WE GOT ON ONE OF THE TRAFFIC NUMBER FIVE SAYS COMPREHENSIVE IN THE BEGINNING. AND NUMBER FIVE, IT SAYS STAFF'S COMPREHENSIVE AND TECHNICAL ANALYSIS. I'M SORRY. THANK YOU. SO THAT'S GOOD. OBTAIN QUANTITATIVE TRAFFIC DATA FOR PARKING REQUESTS, OBTAIN QUANTITATIVE DATA FOR, UM, TRAFFIC AND PARKING REQUESTS FOR, OR, UM, TRAFFIC HAZARD REQUESTS. WHAT'S THAT? DID YOU HAVE SOMETHING? WHAT? YES. TELL US BRIEFLY. UM, I WAS JUST GONNA ADD, UM, ACCORDING TO OUR, UM, POLICIES, IT'S, IT'S NOT REQUIRED TO HAVE A TRAFFIC STUDY 'CAUSE THAT CAN BE RIGHT. VERY EXPENSIVE. MM-HMM . YEAH, IT'S NOT, BUT IT'S THE BURDEN ON THE APPLICANT. YES. WE COULD CERTAINLY ENCOURAGE THEM TO DO THAT. AND I THINK WE DO CURRENTLY ENCOURAGE THEM AND UH, WE'D BE HAPPY TO, UH, INCORPORATE OUR TRAFFIC ENGINEER'S COMMENTS IF THEY HAVE ANY, IF THEY HAVE ANYTHING TO REVIEW INTO OUR STAFF REPORTS. WELL THESE, THESE GOALS ARE ASPIRATIONAL AND MEASURED, SO I THINK WE STILL CAN SAY MM-HMM . OBTAIN QUANTITATIVE TRAFFIC DATA FOR PARKING REQUESTS AND IMPACT ON TRAFFICKED. IS THAT OKAY? NO. YES. YES. ALRIGHT. THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT IS A REQUEST. OR WE CAN SAY EVEN CONSIDER, I MEAN THERE'S A FINE LINE HERE GUYS, BECAUSE REMEMBER IN THE, THE DEAL THIS MORNING, MR. ELIAS, I CAN'T TELL THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR DO THIS. I CAN SAY, KAMIKA, I REALLY NEED YOU TO DO THIS. IT'S A FINE LINE. SAME THING WITH THE BOARD. SO WE WANNA DO SOMETHING THAT'S ASPIRATIONAL THAT DRIVES BEHAVIOR AND OUTCOMES. YES. AND THAT'S WHY I INCLUDED THE SUGGESTION OF THE LEVEL OF SERVICE METRIC. 'CAUSE THAT'S NOT REQUIRING A TRAFFIC ANALYSIS. THAT'S, THAT'S A KIND OF, UH, WELL, YOU'RE JUST SAYING TRAFFIC DATA. MM-HMM . YEAH. DID YOU WANT TO WORDSMITH IT FURTHER? ANYONE ELSE ON THIS? DOES THIS COMMENT INFRINGE ON THE MANAGER? YEAH, ON THE CITY MANAGERS. IF I PUT THIS, WE PUT THIS IN. I DON'T THINK IT DOES. IT'S WHAT IT'S DOING IS WE'RE ENCOURAGING THE STAFF AS IT DEALS WITH APPLICANTS SAYING THE BOARD REALLY WANTS TO SEE QUANTITATIVE TRAFFIC DATA. I THINK ALSO PART OF THE THING THAT STAFF IS, UH, STRUGGLING WITH IS THAT IT'S A SPECIAL EXCEPTION. AND IF THE RULE IS THAT STAFF DOESN'T MAKE A RECOMMENDATION ON SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS, THEY DO NOT, HOW DO WE, YOU KNOW, OFFER THAT INPUT OTHER THAN SAYING THIS IS WHAT THE BOARD WANTS. WELL, AND WE, WE END UP ASKING, WE DO OUR TRAFFIC ENGINEERS RECOMMENDATION ANYWAYS, AND THEY DO COME AND TESTIFY PUBLICLY IN THE HEARING AND GIVE US A RECOMMENDATION. THE PROBLEM IS THEIR, THEIR RECOMMENDATION IS TYPICALLY YES OR NO. AND IT DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO, TO BACK IT UP. I, I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU. SO I'M GONNA COME TO CONCLUSION. DO WE WANNA INCLUDE THIS INTO THE, THE GOALS FOR NUMBER FIVE? YES. STRAW POLL. AM I HEARING IT OR NOT? YES. YES. SYSTEM THAT HELPS US. YES. OKAY. ALRIGHT. SO WE'RE GONNA INCLUDE THAT. ALRIGHT. UH, THAT'S THE PROPOSED 25 26 GOALS AND OBJECTIVES. THE CHAIR TO ENTERTAIN A MOTION. MR. CHAIRMAN, MR. HOPKOS, I MOVE. WE SUBMIT THE RECOMMENDATIONS, UH, I'M SORRY. UM, THE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES AS [06:50:01] OUTLINED AND WITH THE CHANGES AS DISCUSSED, IT'S BEEN MOVED BY MR. HAITZ TO ADOPT THE PROPOSED 25 26 GOALS AND OBJECTIVES WITH THAT INSERTION REGARDING OBTAINING QUANTITATIVE TRAFFIC, DATE OF A PARKING REQUESTS AND IMPACT ON TRAFFIC. IS THERE A SECOND? I SECOND THE MOTION SECOND BY MR. FINNEY DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION HEARING? NO DISCUSSION. THE BOARD WILL VOTE. ALL IN ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. THOSE OPPOSED? MOTION CARRIES. 13 TO ZERO. THANK YOU. NEXT ITEM IS MR. CHAIRMAN. YES. BEFORE WE MOVE ON TO THE FUTURE, NO. YES. OH YES. CORRECT. I I I'D LIKE TO GO BACK TO THE PAST FOR A MOMENT. OKAY. UM, AND DISCUSS SOMETHING THAT WAS DONE AT A PRIOR FULL BOARD MEETING YES. AS REGARDS TO HOW CERTAIN CASES WERE HANDLED, HOW, WHAT, HOW CERTAIN CASES WERE DEALT WITH BY THE BOARD BEING THE ELM THICKET CASES. YES. I KNOW WE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT WHETHER TO RANDOMLY ASSIGN THOSE CASES OR HAVE THEM HANDLED BY ONE PANEL AND THE DECISION WAS MADE TO HAVE THEM HANDLED BY ONE PANEL. UM, HAVING HAD THE EXPERIENCE OF BEING ON THAT PANEL MM-HMM . AND IN RETROSPECT, I'M JUST SAYING THIS FOR, TO GET IT OUT THERE. I'M NOT, I DON'T HAVE A SPECIFIC REQUEST TIED TO IT. WE TALK ABOUT THE ASSIGNMENT OF CASES AND THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT AS BEING, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHETHER YOU GET PANEL A, B, OR C BECAUSE WE'RE ALL OBJECTIVELY HANDLING THESE CASES. YET IN THAT CASE, THEY WERE ALL HANDLED BY ONE PANEL FOR THE PURPOSE OF HAVING SOME LEVEL OF CONSISTENCY, I BELIEVE WAS THE PRIMARY, UH, REASON FOR THAT. I FOUND THE WHOLE EXPERIENCE OF BEING ON THE PANEL, HAVING TO DEAL WITH THAT TO BE EXTREMELY STRESSFUL FOR MYSELF. UM, AND I KEPT GOING BACK AND THINKING, WELL, IF WE'RE SUPPOSED TO ALL BE, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHICH PANEL YOU GET ASSIGNED TO 'CAUSE WE'RE ALL GOING TO TREAT THE CASES FAIRLY, THEN WHY WERE THEY ALL TREATED BY ONE PANEL AND WHY WAS ALL THAT PRESSURE PUT ON ONE PANEL? AND SO I JUST WOULD LIKE TO BRING UP THAT. I THINK IF WE WERE HAVING THAT DISCUSSION TODAY AND THOSE CASES WERE ABOUT TO COME UP, I WOULD BE STRENUOUSLY SUGGESTING THAT WE RANDOMLY ASSIGN THEM. I JUST WANT TO GET THAT OUT THERE. UH, AND, AND THAT IS A RELEVANT, UM, UH, GROUNDED SUGGESTION. I'M GONNA ASK YOU TO HOLD THAT UNTIL WE DO THE REVIEW. REVIEW OF THE RULES. UH, WE ADOPTED A YEAR AGO A CHANGE TO THE RULES AND IT'S IN THE RULES APPROVED BY CITY COUNCIL SECTION 10 L. IN EX EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES, THE BOARD BY MAJORITY VOTE, MAY CONSOLIDATE AND ASSIGN CASES AND APPEALS TO A SINGLE PANEL TO PROMOTE EFFICIENCY, EXPEDIENCY, FAIRNESS TO EFFECTIVE PARTIES AND ECONOMY OF CASE MANAGEMENT. SO WE DID ADOPT THAT AS PART OF A RULES LAST YEAR. SO WHEN WE GET TO RULES IN A MINUTE, WE COULD HAVE THAT CONVERSATION AGAIN. IF, IF THAT IS YOUR, IF THAT'S YOUR DESIRE. BUT LET'S PUT THAT AS PART OF THE RULES. CAN WE DO THAT? OKAY. UM, SO WE APPROVED OUR GOALS AND OBJECTIVES ARE 25 26. SUBJECT TO THIS EDIT. THANK YOU. PAGE 2 27. AND AGAIN, THESE ARE COMPONENTS OF THE ANNUAL REPORT THAT ARE REQUIRED BY CHAPTER EIGHT OF THE CODE. ITS ACCOMPLISHMENTS, ITS GOALS, AND ITS RECOMMENDATIONS. THREE. RECOMMENDATIONS FIRST IS REQUEST CITY COUNCIL'S CONFIRMATION AND UNDERSTANDING OF THE BOARD'S MISSION TO ADJUDICATE LAND USE DECISIONS, TIMELINESS, ACCURACY, TRANSPARENT FAIRNESS IN A QUAS FORMAT. I'M IN CODE HERE. WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY IS, CITY COUNCIL, PLEASE UNDERSTAND THAT WE ARE QUASI-JUDICIAL. WE'RE NOT LEGISLATIVE, WE'RE NOT SUBJECT TO LOBBYING. THAT'S WHAT I'M, I'M REINFORCING. AND THAT OUR GOAL IS TIMELINESS, ACCURACY, TRANSPARENCY, AND FAIRNESS. WE WANT TO ACHIEVE THOSE FOUR THINGS IN THE FRAMEWORK OF BEING QUASI-JUDICIAL. NUMBER TWO, THIS IS SIMILAR TO LAST YEAR. WOO. THIS WAS CONTROVERSIAL LAST YEAR. REQUEST CITY COUNCIL INCREASED OVERSIGHT AND PLANNING, DEVELOPMENT, PERMITTING PROCESS FOR PERMITTING, HEIRS, FINANCIAL COSTS AND DELAYS SINCE TAXPAYERS, HOMEOWNERS, DEVELOPERS, NEIGHBORHOODS. JUST SO WE ALL REFRESHED LAST YEAR'S DEBATE LAST YEAR WE HAD WAS HOTLY CONTESTED ABOUT WHETHER WE WANTED TO CREATE SOME SORT OF MAKE A, A MEASUREMENT ON THAT. AND, AND WE DECIDED NOT TO DO THAT BECAUSE WE DIDN'T KNOW HOW WE COULD TRACK THAT. I STILL DON'T HAVE THAT ANSWER IF WE WERE TO TRY TO CONSIDER THAT. WHAT THIS IS TRYING TO SAY IS WE ARE STILL CONCERNED ABOUT A PERMITTING PROCESS, OVERSIGHT ISSUE. NOW I SAY THAT AND THEN WE HEAR FROM THE DIRECTOR THAT WE HAVE 50,000 PERMITS ISSUED A YEAR, NOT FIVE, NOT 15, 50,000 PERMITS. AND I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PERMITS WE IT BEARS. WE HAVE PROBABLY LESS THAN 1% GUYS. SO, BUT I STILL THINK IT'S AN ISSUE BECAUSE THE DISRUPTION IT CREATES. BUT I [06:55:01] JUST, SO THE THIRD ONE IS TO REQUEST APPROVAL OF ANY CHANGES TO OUR BOARD OF, UH, RULES AND PROCEDURES. QUESTIONS. MR. HOPKOS, ONE OF THE THINGS WE HEARD MUCH TOO OFTEN IN A LOT OF THE CASES, UM, RELATING TO THE PERMITTING ERRORS WAS WE DON'T KNOW WHO DID IT . AND I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU PUT THAT IN HERE, BUT WE NEED TO KNOW, WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO KNOW WHO MAKES THESE DECISIONS BECAUSE CONSTANTLY BEING TOLD, WELL, WE DON'T KNOW. WE DON'T KNOW HOW THAT HAPPENED. WE DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT WENT. WE DON'T KNOW WHO SIGNED OFF ON IT. WE DON'T KNOW. THAT WAS REALLY UNACCEPTABLE. SO, UH, I'M GONNA REFER TO YOU MS. MAY BECAUSE YOU'RE THE SENIOR IN THE ROOM. I ALWAYS LOVE SAYING THIS. UH, WHOEVER'S THE SENIOR REPRESENTING THE CITY MANAGER IS WHO I LOOK TO. AND YOU'RE THE SENIOR IN THE ROOM. UH, OUR JOB IS A SUBSET OF THE CITY COUNCIL. WE'RE NOT IN THE CHAIN OF COMMAND OF THE MANAGER. SARAH, YOU'RE IN CHAIN OF THE COMMAND OF THE MANAGER. I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN DEMAND TO NO SOURCE OF PERMIT ERRORS PER SE OF THE DIRECTOR. UM, I KNOW IN A CASE THAT WAS RECENTLY HEARD BY THE BOARD, I ASKED THE QUESTION AFTER THE 10 DAY PERIOD AND THE ANSWER WAS THEY DIDN'T KNOW WHY THE PERSON APPROVED THE PERMITS. AND I WAS DUMBFOUNDED. HOW CAN YOU NOT KNOW HOW I'M, I'M NOT GOING INTO DETAIL, I'M JUST SAYING. SO THERE'S A FINE LINE OF WHAT WE CAN SAY. I GUESS WE COULD ASK. SO I'M RESPONDING TO YOU. I'M TRYING TO BE RESPECTFUL OF THE MANAGER, MR. CHAIRMAN, I'M NOT SUGGESTING THAT WHO THAT INFORMATION BE PUT INTO THE PUBLIC RECORD ON EVERY CASE. , WE'RE NOT PUTTING TARGETS ON PEOPLE'S BACKS, BUT, BUT THE IMPLICATION THAT IT, THAT THEY DON'T EVEN KNOW THAT NOBODY KNOWS STEVE HOLD ANYBODY ACCOUNTABLE. THAT'S WHAT I WAS TOLD. YEAH. I'M ASTONISHED. THAT'S, THAT'S REALLY NOT ACCEPTABLE. I, I AGREE. BUT THAT'S THE COUNCIL'S RESPONSIBILITY OF OVERSIGHT TO THE MANAGER. DID, UH, DID YOU WANNA MAKE ANY COMMENT ON THIS OR JUST LISTEN FOR A MINUTE, DR. GLOVER, UH, JUST FOR ACCOUNTABILITY'S SAKE, CAN WE SUGGEST RESPECTFULLY THAT EACH UM, OFFICER GETS A STUMP? 'CAUSE YOU SEE A LOT OF STUMPS IN THE DOCKET. SO WHY, WHY DON'T WE SUGGEST, UH, EACH OFFICER GETS A STUMP SO THEY CAN STUMP IT AND WE KNOW WHO'S RESPONSIBLE. THAT GOES INTO US TELLING THE MANAGER HOW TO RUN THE CITY. AND I DON'T THINK WE CAN DO THAT. WE JUST CAN'T. JUST LIKE, I CAN'T TELL THE BOARD ADMINISTER HOW TO RUN HER STAFF. I CAN'T, I CAN'T TELL, I CAN'T TELL THE BOARD ATTORNEY HOW TO GIVE ME WHAT BOARD WHAT LEGAL ADVICE. SO THAT'S, THAT'S ONE BRIDGE TOO FAR. I HEAR YOU. I, I THINK IS, I THINK THE DIRECTOR KNOWS WE'RE SENSITIVE ABOUT THESE PERMITTING, HEIRS. UM, SHE COULD HAVE JUST SAID, SHE COULD HAVE BEEN MORE DISMISSIVE AND SAYING IT'S X OF 50,000. I LED THE 50,000 NUMBER. SO SHE WOULDN'T BE DISMISSIVE. SHE WOULDN'T DO THAT. SHE'S SENSITIVE TO THAT. THE SYSTEMIC IS WHAT SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT. AND THAT WAS THICKENED. THAT IS DEADLY. OTHER SUGGESTIONS ON THE RECOMMENDATIONS? THE CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION. WOW. NOPE, MS. DAVIS. ALRIGHT, I, UM, I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THE PROPOSED RECOMMENDATIONS TO CITY COUNCIL DATED OCTOBER 20. IT'S BEEN MOVED BY MS. DAVIS. IS THERE A SECOND? I SECOND. SECONDED BY MR. QUINT DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION. ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. THOSE OPPOSED MAY MOTION PASSES 13 TO ZERO. UH, MARY, THAT'S, SO THAT'S THE ANNUAL REPORT. ALRIGHT. THE CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO APPROVE THE ANNUAL REPORT AS COMBINED. MS. DAVIS, I MOVE TO APPROVE THE ANNUAL REPORT AS COMBINED. IT'S BEEN MOVED. IS THERE A SECOND? I SECOND. SECOND. AND BY MR. FINNEY. ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. THOSE OPPOSED PASSES. 13 TO ZERO. EXCELLENT, THANK YOU. TWO MORE TRANSACTIONS. YOU SHOULD HAVE A COLORED SHEET HANDOUT AS WELL AS ON THE GRID. MARY, COULD YOU PUT ON THE, FOR THE, THE CALENDAR. OKAY, SO THIS IS THE PROPOSED CALENDAR FOR 2026. HOW DID WE COME UP WITH THIS MISS BOARD ADMINISTRATOR, HOW'D YOU COME UP WITH THIS? SO I, SHE AND I HAVE TALKED OVER THE LAST MONTH OR SO AND I SAID SEND ME A DRAFT. SO TELL ME HOW YOU CAME UP WITH YOUR DRAFT. UM, SIMPLY JUST FOLLOWING, UM, THE SCHEDULE AS THE PREVIOUS YEAR'S MEETING. THE THIRD WEEK OF EACH MONTH. [07:00:01] OKAY. NOW THE ONE DIFFERENCE ON THIS IS IT SAYS THREE PER MONTH. EVERY PANEL MEETS EVERY MONTH. THE CONSENSUS OF THE OFFICERS AND THE BOARD AND, AND THE BOARD ADMINISTER IS IT'S BETTER TO HAVE IT SCHEDULED ON THE CALENDAR AND CANCEL IF WE DON'T HAVE THE WORK PRODUCT THAN TO ADD IT BACK IN AND THEN CHASE PEOPLE. BUT THAT'S THE BOARD'S DISCRETION. USUALLY JANUARY, JULY, AND DECEMBER ONLY MERITS TWO PANELS USUALLY JANUARY, JULY AND DECEMBER. BUT IT'S ALL A FUNCTION OF WHAT COMES INTO THE, WHAT COMES INTO THE DEAL IN NOVEMBER. WE HAVE THREE PANELS MEETING, I THINK IT'S SIX CASES A PIECE OR FIVE PACE CASES A PIECE. SO THAT'S 15 CASES FOR NOVEMBER. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOUR THROUGHPUT FOR DECEMBER IS. DO YOU KNOW WHAT NUMBER? OKAY, THAT'S ALL RIGHT. SO THAT IS HOW THE CASE THEY, THE PANELS ARE, ARE DETERMINED EACH MONTH BASED ON THE BOARD OF MINISTER SAYS DAVE. I'VE GOT, I'VE GOT 12 CASES. SO I DO TWO PANELS OR DAVE, I'VE GOT 15 CASES, THREE PANELS OR GOSH FORBID WE'VE GOT 20 CASES AND THERE'S NO LIMIT. WE TAKE 'EM ALL TO KEEP THAT NUMBER DOWN TO 54 OR LESS. SO WHAT YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU IS COLOR CODED FOR, UM, PANELS, CS IN GREEN AS IN YELLOW, BS IN BLUE. AND YOU'LL NOTICE IN SOME OF THE MONTHS THERE, THAT PANEL C MOVES FROM MONDAY TO THURSDAY. SO THOSE OF YOU IN PANEL C, THAT'S JANUARY, THAT'S FEBRUARY, THAT'S JUNE, RIGHT? THAT'S IT. OKAY. AND THAT IS 'CAUSE THERE'S A, A CITY HOLIDAY ALSO SCHEDULED IS THE FULL BOARD MEETING THE 27TH OF OCTOBER. QUESTIONS. SO THE RECOMMENDATION IS GO AHEAD AND SCHEDULE ALL THIS AND THEN PEEL BACK WHEN WE KNOW AND WE USUALLY KNOW TWO TO THREE WEEKS PRIOR AND WE'LL LET PEOPLE KNOW PANEL B IS NOT GONNA MEET, OR PANEL A IS NOT GONNA MEET A PANEL C. AND THE IDEA IS TO DIVIDE IT BETWEEN THE THREE PANELS. AND AGAIN, PANEL ASSIGNMENTS ARE DONE BY THE BOARD SECRETARY, NOT BY MYSELF OR THE BOARD STAFF. SO IN INDEPENDENT, OKAY, THE CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADOPT THE 2026 MEETING CALENDAR. MR. CHAIRMAN, I MAKE A RECOMMENDATION THAT WE ADOPT THE PROPOSED 2026 CALENDAR. IT'S BEEN MOVED BY MR. QUINT TO ADOPT THE 2026 CALENDAR. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND, SECOND BY MR. KOVICH DISCUSSION, HEARING NO DISCUSSION. ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. THOSE OPPOSED PASSES. 13 TO ZERO. OKAY, LAST ON OUR LIST. TODAY IS OUR POTENTIAL CHANGES TO OUR RULES OF PROCEDURE. UM, THE OFFICERS HAVE MET ABOUT THIS SEVERAL TIMES AND THEN, THEN THE BOARD ATTORNEY AND I WENT THROUGH THIS. UH, AND SO, UM, MS. CARLISLE AND I ARE GONNA WALK YOU THROUGH, UH, THIS, THIS IS A RED LINE VERSION. OH, YOU, YOU'VE GOT IT. OKAY. RED LINE VERSION. SO WE'RE ON PAGE 2 32. WHAT I'M GONNA DO IS WALK YOU THROUGH THIS AND TELL YOU THE NUMBER OF CHANGES AND THE TOPIC OF THE CHANGE. OKAY? THE NUMBER OF CHANGES AND THE TOPIC OF CHANGE. 2 32 IS JUST THE DATE CHANGE. PAGE 2 33, WHICH IS SECOND PAGE IS THE TABLE OF CON CONTENTS CHANGE. THAT'S JUST CHANGING THE HEADERS. OKAY? PAGE THREE, WHICH IS 2 34 POWERS OF THE BOARD, NO CHANGES AND STOP ME, OTHERWISE I'LL KEEP GOING. PAGE FOUR, WHICH IS PAGE 2 35 IS TWO INSERTS. NUMBER ONE, WE'RE CHANGING THE COMPOSITION OF THE BOARD THAT FOLLOWS THE CHARTER AMENDMENT. THE CHARTER AMENDMENT SAID THAT ANY ONE OF US CAN BE CANNED BY A SIMPLE MAJORITY VOTE IN ANY TIME FOR ANY REASON. DID YOU ALL KNOW THAT? THAT'S, THAT'S THE REALITY AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE PUTTING IN OUR RULES. ANYONE ON ANY BOARD AND COMMISSION CAN BE, THEIR SERVICE CAN BE TERMINATED BY A MAJORITY OF ORDER OF THE COUNCIL WITHOUT NOTICE. JUST GOES ON THE AGENDA. OKAY. NUMBER C TALKS ABOUT, UH, SAYING THAT THE ASSIGNMENT OF PANEL MEMBERS IS BY THE CITY SECRETARY LANGUAGE RIGHT FROM THE CODE. OKAY. PAGE FOUR, PAGE 5, 2 36 IS HAS TWO HAS THREE INSERTS. TWO THAT TALKS ABOUT THE CHAIR'S RESPONSIBILITY, ONE ABOUT DECISION LETTERS. ONE, IT TALKS ABOUT THE CHAIR WORKING WITH THE TWO VICE CHAIRS TO PROVIDE LEADERSHIP AMONGST THE PANELS. AND TWO SAYS THE CHAIRS SERVES AS LIAISON BETWEEN THE BOARD, THE COUNCIL, CITY OFFICERS, DIRECTOR AND STAFF. THE, THE THIRD INSERT ON THAT PAGE IS JUST PUTTING THE WORD DECISION LETTERS IN, UH, THE NEW DALLAS NOW SYSTEM THAT THE STAFF HAS, HAS A COMPUTER GENERATED LETTER AFTER EVERY HEARING THAT THE BOARD SECRETARY GENERATES AND IT'S SIGNED BY THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR AND THE PRESIDING OFFICER AND THEY STEAL OUR SIGNATURE. OKAY? SO THAT'S JUST PUTTING DECISION LETTERS IN. OKAY, I AM GONNA KEEP GOING. PAGE 2 37. PAGE SIX [07:05:01] IS JUST INSERTING THE WORD. UH, THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR'S JOB FOR ADMINISTRATORS, MANAGERS IS TO LIAISE IN ALL THE SAME THINGS THAT THE CHAIR DOES ON A POLICY MATTER. PAGE 2 38, PAGE SEVEN IS ONE INSERT IS SAYING THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR WILL SIGN DECISION LETTERS JUST LIKE WE ADDED TO THE PRESIDING OFFICERS. PAGE 8, 2 39 IS TWO INSERTS RIGHT NOW. THE BOARD SECRETARY'S BEEN DOING THE OATH, ALTHOUGH THAT THE AUTHORITY RELEASE IS ONLY FOR THE BOARD ADMINISTRATOR. SO WE GAVE . SO WE GAVE THE BOARD SECRETARY THE AUTHORITY TO ADMINISTER OATH. AND NUMBER TWO, WE SAID THAT THE BOARD SECRETARY HAS TO ISSUE DEC DECISION LETTERS WITHIN TWO DAYS OF HEARINGS. SO THAT WAY THE APPLICANT IS PROMPTLY NOTIFIED. AND MARY, DO YOU DO THAT BY EMAIL? IS THAT HOW THEY GET IT? OR MAIL? BOTH. OKAY. THAT'S PAGE 8, 2 39. SHARON NEWMAN, HOW DOES THAT WORK FOR HEARINGS THAT ARE ON A THURSDAY? IS IT TWO DAYS OR TWO BUSINESS DAYS? UM, DOES IT SAY, IT SAYS BUSINESS DAYS? SO DOES THAT COVER THAT? OKAY. YES, THE IS TO GIVE THE STAFF ENOUGH TIME, BUT REASONABLY QUICK. SO IT SAYS BUSINESS DAYS. THANK YOU. OKAY, PAGE TWO 40, WHICH IS NUMBER NINE. UM, THIS IS THIS, UH, THIS IS TWO VERY RELEVANT, TWO VERY IMPACTFUL CHANGES. C ONLY MEMBERS OR ALTERNATE MEMBERS WHO ARE PHYSICALLY PRESENT AT THE LOCATION SPECIFIED IN THE POSTING MEETING. NOTICE WILL BE CONSIDERED TO BE IN ATTENDANCE AT THE MEETING. NO MORE CITY COUNCIL DID AWAY WITH 'EM FOR CITY COUNCIL COMMITTEE MEETINGS AUGUST 22ND. SO WHAT I TOOK IS THE EXACT LANGUAGE THAT THE CITY COUNCIL ADOPTED AND PROPOSED THIS ONLY MEMBERS OR ALTER MEMBERS WHO ARE PHYSICALLY PRESENT AT THE LOCATION SPECIFIED IN THE POSTED MEETING NOTES WOULD BE CONSIDERED BEING INTENSIVE OF THE MEETING. NUMBER TWO, I'M GONNA KEEP GOING. YOU CAN DISTILL THIS. NUMBER TWO, THIS IS VERY, VERY IMPORTANT. MEMBERS, ANDAR MEMBERS SHALL NOT DISCUSS A PENDING CASE WITH ANYONE PRIOR TO ITS PANEL HEARING, NOR AFTER THE HEARING OR DECISION OF THE PANEL UNTIL 10 DAY APPEAL PERIOD HAS EXPIRED. OR WHILE THE CASE REMAINS UNDER APPEAL IN THE DISTRICT COURT, THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE SHALL PROMPTLY NOTIFY THE PANEL IF AN APPEAL HAS BEEN FILED. MR. OVITZ? YEAH, MY QUESTION'S ACTUALLY ABOUT THE IMMEDIATE PRIOR CHANGE. PLEASE, PLEASE. UM, YOU INDICATED THERE'S, THERE'S HAS BEEN OCCASIONALLY A PROBLEM POPULATING. YEP. OUR MEETINGS FULLY. AND THIS IS GOING TO MAKE IT NO MORE DIFFICULT BY NOT ALLOWING ANY VIRTUAL ATTENDANCE. CITY COUNCIL DOESN'T DO IT ANYMORE. IT STILL WILL. IT STILL WILL BECAUSE WE HAVE HAD FULL PANELS BY ALLOWING VIRTUAL IN THE PAST. SO, UM, ONE QUESTION I HAVE, I SHOULD KNOW THIS, BUT I DON'T, WHO SETS THE NUMBER OF ALTERNATES? IT'S AN, UH, CITY CODE. SIX OF THEM. SO THEY, THEY, THE CITY COUNCIL COULD ALLOW MORE ALTERNATES? THEY COULD. OKAY. AND WHO, WHERE IS IT STATED THAT A PERSON SITTING ON ONE PANEL CANNOT BE AN ALTERNATE MEMBER TO ANOTHER PANEL CITY CODE? SO THE CITY COUNCIL COULD CHANGE THAT TOO? CORRECT? THEY COULD. OKAY. IS THERE ANY REASON TO REQUEST EITHER OF THOSE CHANGES? SO WHEN YOU START ALLOWING JUDGES TO HOP BETWEEN PANELS, IT GETS INTO THE QUESTION OF WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAVE RANDOM ASSIGNMENT THAT, AND NOW I'M THE ALTERNATES THAT ARE HERE. ALTERNATE MEMBERS ACTUALLY ARE SITTING IN SOMETIMES A LITTLE BIT MORE OF A IMPACTFUL ROLE BECAUSE THEY COULD SIT ON THREE PANELS IN ONE MONTH OR SIT, YOU KNOW, SIT ON A, B OR C OR B AND C OR A AND C. UM, THE CONCEPT WAS, I THINK, I DON'T KNOW, THE CONCEPT OF CREATING THE ALTERS WAS TO TRY TO MAKE SURE YOU HAD ENOUGH MEMBERS IN THE PANEL. I THINK OUR CHALLENGE HAS BEEN THAT WE'VE HAD SOME VACANCIES THROUGHOUT THE YEAR. WE STILL HAVE TWO VACANCIES RIGHT NOW. NOW WE HAVE SIX ALTERNATES AND 13 MEMBERS RIGHT NOW. UM, BUT I CANNOT EMPHASIZE ENOUGH THE IMPORTANCE OF AN APPLICANT KNOWING WHO THEIR JUDGES ARE IN PERSON. THE TIME HAS LONG PASSED WHEN THIS ONLINE ACCESS WAS FOR A MEDICAL EMERGENCY. I'M KIND OF PARAPHRASING WHAT THE MAYOR SAID THAT HAS LONG PASSED. IT'S, I'LL BE DELICATE. IF PEOPLE CANNOT SHOW UP ON AND BE HERE, THEN YOU SHOULD NOT BE ON THE BOARD. AND THAT APPLIES TO ANY BOARD THAT YOU'RE ON NOW. EMERGENCIES HAPPEN. I MISSED A MEETING A YEAR AGO AND THINGS HAPPEN. I GET ALL THAT THAT THERE'S NOT, BUT WE GOTTA COMMUNICATE MORE IN ADVANCE. THAT IS THE BIGGEST, THAT'S THE BIGGEST PROBLEM THERE. SO, SO THEN SHOULD [07:10:01] WE POTENTIALLY THEN ASK TO GO FROM, AND I REALIZE THERE'S HAD TROUBLE FILLING THE SPOTS TO GO FROM SIX TO 10 ALTERNATES. WOO . WE COULD SEPARATE ISSUES THOUGH, MR. HOP. IT'S, IN MY OPINION, I THINK THE ONE QUESTION IS THE IMPORTANCE OF THE JUDGES, THE APPLICANT AND THE PUBLIC SEEING AND FACING THEIR JUDGES, THE REALITIES, THE TECHNOLOGY IS POOR. HALF THE TIME YOU CAN'T SEE OR HEAR THEM. IT GOES ON THEN OFF AND THE PUBLIC AND YOU SQUINT. SO TO BE ABLE TO TRULY HAVE A FAIR PANEL, I'D RATHER HAVE FOUR RATHER THAN FOUR PLUS ONE ONLINE. AND THAT, THAT, THAT MAKES PERFECT SENSE. HOWEVER, IF WE'RE GOING TO MAKE IT MORE RESTRICTIVE TO HAVING FIVE PEOPLE AVAILABLE TO HEAR A CASE, MAYBE, MAYBE WE SHOULD ASK FOR AT LEAST A FEW MORE ALTERNATE SPOTS TO BE, TO BE MADE AVAILABLE. EVEN IF THEY CAN'T TODAY BE FILLED. AT LEAST THERE'S A POTENTIAL OF HAVING THEM FILLED AND HAVING THOSE EXTRA BODIES AVAILABLE. I APPRECIATE YOUR SUGGESTION MR. FINNEY. UM, TO BUILD ON MR. KO'S POINT, UM, MAYBE INSTEAD OF INCREASING THE NUMBER OF ALTERNATES, UH, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT ALTERNATES ARE NOT LIMITED TO THREE ABSENCES OR NOS LIKE THE ALTERNATES. UM, THE ONLY ME, I DON'T KNOW. I DON'T THINK THE ALTERNATES THERESA, I DON'T THINK THEY HAVE ATTENDANCE REQUIREMENT BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT SCHEDULED TO A PANEL. RIGHT. THAT IS MY UNDERSTANDING. THE ONLY THING WOULD BE THE ANNUAL MEETING. BUT EVEN THEN, QUITE HONESTLY, AN ALTERNATE CANNOT SERVE. I CAN'T ASK AN ALTERNATE TO COME UNLESS THERE'S A VACANCY OR ABSENCE. AND THERE HAPPENS TO BE FOUR ALTERNATES HERE. 'CAUSE WE HAD TWO VACANCIES AND TWO ABSENCES. SO THE FOUR WITH THE 11 MAY 15, IF WE HAD ALL THE ALTERNATES HERE, I'D BE IN TROUBLE BECAUSE TWO, YOU COULDN'T VOTE HMM. IF WE HAD ALL THE MEMBERS. SO, SO MY QUESTION WAS, UM, OR MY, MY POINT WAS, WHICH IS A QUESTION, UM, INSTEAD OF INCREASING THE NUMBER OF ALTERNATES. WHAT IF WE LIMITED THE NUMBER OF TIMES AN ALTERNATE COULD SAY NO WHEN YOU ASK THEM? OH, UH, RIGHT NOW THE PROCESS IS THIS. THE BOARD SECRETARY SUBMITS AN ATTENDANCE REPORT EVERY MONTH. WHEN YOU HAVE MORE THAN THREE SUCCESSIVE ABSENCES OR MORE THAN 25% IN A RUNNING 12 MONTH PERIOD, YOU GET BUMPED. THAT'S UNDER CHAPTER EIGHT, THE CODE. IT DOES NOT REFERENCE ALTERNATES. CORRECT. MARY THERESA, I DON'T THINK IT REFERENCES ALTERNATES. SO I, I DON'T, I DON'T, WE'D HAVE TO AMEND THE CHAPTER EIGHT CODE TO DO. THAT'S OKAY. I WOULDN'T RECOMMEND THAT. OKAY. BECAUSE THAT HAS REPERCUSSIONS ON ALL THE OTHER BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS. OKAY. MR. CHAIRMAN? YES, MS. LIN. UH, MS. GARDNER, UM, I'M NOT SURE IF THIS IS OUT THERE TO, UM, UM, HIS, HIS POINT ABOUT ADDING MORE ALTERNATES, THAT WOULD TAKE A CODE AMENDMENT, RIGHT? YES. AND IT'S AR UH, ARTICLE SIX THAT CREATED THIS BOARD. I'M SORRY, WHICH ARTICLE WAS IT THAT CREATED THIS BOARD? I DON'T KNOW. 51. SO IT WOULD BE A CODE AMENDMENT, CORRECT? YES. AND CODE AMENDMENTS ARE APPROVED. OH, UM, DONE BY CITY COUNCIL? CORRECT. IT WOULD HAVE TO BE APPROVED BY ZAC PLANNING COMMISSION AND THE COUNCIL. OKAY. SO MAYBE THIS IS FARFETCHED, BUT COULD WE RECONSIDER APPROVAL OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS, BRING IT BACK UP FOR DISCUSSION AND MAKE THAT AS A REQUEST TO CITY COUNCIL SO THAT HIS POINT COULD BE ADDRESSED TO EXPAND THE ALTERNATE POOL? COULD THAT BE HERE? WE COULD. I WOULDN'T RECOMMEND IT. I THINK IF WE HAVE THE RIGHT SIX ALTERNATES AND THE RIGHT 15 MEMBERS, IT'S NOT A PROBLEM. THAT SOUNDS HARDCORE GUYS, BUT IN MY OPINION, AND WE COMMUNICATE IN MUCH MORE IN ADVANCE. I, I KNOW. WHAT DO YOU MEAN THE ALTERNATES? UH, CITY COUNCIL'S NOMINATING THE ALTERNATES. ARE THEY NOT? YES. WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT PICKING WHO WE WANT FOR ALTERNATES. WE DON'T. CORRECT. THAT'S COUNSEL RECOMMENDATIONS. THEY'VE CHOSEN SIX ALREADY, RIGHT? THEY'VE CHOSEN SIX ALREADY. THAT'S FULLY STAFFED. WE ONLY HAVE TWO VACANCIES AND REGULAR MEMBERS. I, I DON'T THINK WE NEED MORE THAN SIX ALTERNATES. I THINK THAT'S, I MEAN, WE'RE TRYING TO KEEP 21 OF US IN THE SAME LANE HERE, GUYS. THAT'S 15 PLUS SIX. I THINK WE JUST NEED TO, AS WE TURN THE YEAR, MAKE A DECISION WHETHER WE'RE GONNA HAVE FIVE PERSON PANELS THIS, YOU KNOW, SO, YEAH, I MEAN, I'M, I'M, I MEAN, IT'S JUST, WE'RE, WE'RE, WE'RE MAKING LITTLE TWEAKS HERE AND THERE TO MAKE IT MORE, MAKE IT MORE DIFFICULT [07:15:01] TO GET FIVE PANEL MEMBERS AT A, AT A PANEL MEETING WITHOUT EXPANDING THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE WE CAN PICK FROM. I JUST, WE RARELY HAVE AN ONLINE PERSON AT THIS POINT IN TIME. FIRST OF ALL, I DON'T PICK ALTERNATES TO COME TO PANEL MEETINGS UNLESS THEY CAN COME IN PERSON. I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS REALIZE THAT, BUT I ALWAYS SAY IN PERSON. YES. IF NOT, FORGET IT. NO, WE NEED TO BE HERE IN PERSON. THE CITY COUNCIL HAS, HAS, HAS ACTED. I THINK WE SHOULD FOLLOW SUIT. SO, SO LET ME ASK YOU, I, SO WHAT, WHAT WOULD'VE, WHAT WOULD'VE HAPPENED TO ME? I MISSED THREE MEETINGS WHEN I BROKE MY ANKLE. I WAS, I WAS REMOTE IF YOU, BUT I, I MISSED IF YOU, IF YOU MISSED, I THINK YOU MISSED TWO. MICHAEL, YOU DIDN'T MISS THREE. IF YOU MISSED MORE THAN THREE, THEN YOU'RE BUMPED MORE THAN THREE. MR. CHAIRMAN, I BELIEVE CHAPTER EIGHT, DOESN'T IT? ISN'T THERE, UM, SOME LANGUAGE ABOUT MEDICAL EMERGENCIES? UH, BUT YOU KNOW, IT SAYS THAT, BUT IT ALSO SAYS THAT NOT EXCUSED. SO IT, IT, CHAPTER EIGHT IS DUPLICITOUS. IT DOES TALK ABOUT EXCUSING AN ABSENCE, BUT IT SAYS YOU ARE, YOU'RE BUMPED REGARDLESS OF EXCUSED OR NOT, IF YOU EXCEED 25% IN 12 MONTHS. AM I CORRECT, THERESA? OKAY. I'M PRETTY SURE IS THAT, I'M GONNA TRUST YOUR MEMORY ON THAT. NO, I'M, I'M JUST SAYING FROM WHAT I RECALL IN CHAPTER EIGHT. UM, BUT I'LL READ IT. YEAH. THERE'S, WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO READ THE SECTION IN THE CODE, PLEASE? YES. VERY BRIEFLY. CHAIRMAN, IN SECTION EIGHT DASH 20, IT SAYS THAT A MEMBER OF A BOARD THAT MEETS MONTHLY, WHO IS ABSENT FROM MORE THAN 25% OF THE REGULAR MEETINGS DURING ANY 12 MONTH PERIOD, WHETHER EXCUSED OR NOT, SHALL RESULT THERE IN A FORFEITURE. IT, IT'S KIND OF STRANGE. SO WE'RE GONNA EXCUSE YOU, BUT IT DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING. WELL, I THINK THE EXCUSE, THE MAIN RULE OR THE GENERAL RULE SAYS NO MEMBERS SHALL BE EXCUSED FROM ATTENDANCE AT A BOARD MEETING UNLESS FOR MEDICAL REASONS CERTIFIED BY A PHYSICIAN OR UNLESS EXCUSED BY THE BOARD AND THE CITY COUNCIL, MORE THAN THREE UNEXCUSED ABSENCES AND SUCCESSION SHALL RESULT IN A FORM FOR JERK. OKAY. SO THE ANSWER IS SOMEONE COULD PETITION THE CITY COUNCIL. GUESS WHAT? THAT NEVER HAPPENS. MR. CHAIRMAN? YES. OH, SO, UM, THE CITY SECRETARY, SECRETARY MONITORS THE ABSENCES, CORRECT? UH, IN THE SPREADSHEET SHE SENDS EVERY MONTH? YES. YES. OKAY. SO IT'S REALLY INCUMBENT. IT REALLY, YOU KNOW, SHE, SHE DOESN'T, WELL, NEVER. NEVERMIND. THANK YOU. YEAH. THE BOARD SECRETARY, AFTER EVERY MEETING SENDS A SPREADSHEET TO THE CITY SECRETARY, SAYS, THESE ARE THE PEOPLE THAT WERE HERE VERSUS ABSENT. AND THEN THE CITY SECRETARY INFORMS THE BOARD SECRETARY MEMBER, PERSON X HAS FORFEITED THE POSITION BECAUSE THEY'VE EXCEEDED MORE THAN THREE IN A ROW OR MORE THAN 25% IN A YEAR. SO, OTHER QUESTIONS, NOT TO BEAT A DEAD HORSE, BUT PLEASE, UM, JUST BACK TO THE ME, WHETHER OR NOT MEDICAL REASONS ARE EXCUSED. IT SAYS, UM, AND I'M JUST READING EXACTLY WHAT OUR CITY ATTORNEY JUST READ TO US. UM, IT SAYS, NO MEMBER MAY BE EXCUSED FROM ATTENDANCE AT A BOARD OR PANEL MEETING, EXCEPT FOR MEDICAL REASONS, CERTIFIED TO BY HIS OR HER PHYSICIAN, OR UNLESS EXCUSED BY THE BOARD AND THE CITY COUNCIL. SO THE, THE BOARD, THE BOARD BEING APPROVED BY THE BOARD AND THE CITY COUNCIL IS A SEPARATE SITUATION. IT'S AN OR. UM, SO, SO MEDICAL REASONS ARE, ARE EXCUSED. I, I STAND CORRECTED. OKAY. SO, BUT WHAT I'M SAYING TO YOU, AGAIN, THAT'S NEVER, I'VE NEVER HEARD OF THAT. OKAY. I'VE NEVER HEARD OF SOMEONE GOING THROUGH THAT TRACK. OKAY. NOW THAT MAY BE THE CASE, BUT, BUT YES. IS THAT YOUR CORRECT INTERPRETATION OF THAT, THE EXCUSED ABSENCE OR EXCUSE FOR MEDICAL? YES, IT DOES SAY OR UNLESS EXCUSED BY THE BOARD AND CITY COUNCIL. SO, YES. I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT EITHER. THANKS FOR POINTING IT OUT. SO WE'LL TAKE THE OR. THANK YOU, MR. FINNEY. GOOD. OKAY. SO OTHER DISCUSSIONS. DOES EVERYONE UNDERSTAND WHAT THE, THE, THE TWO COMPONENTS ON THE BOTTOM OF PAGE 9, 2 41, NOT TO BEAT A DEAD HORSE. ONE TALKS ABOUT MEMBERS IN ATTENDANCE IN PERSON. THE OTHER TALKS ABOUT NOT TALKING ABOUT THE CASE BEFORE THE HEARING, OR AT LEAST 10 DAYS AFTER. AND AGAIN, NOT TO BEAT A DEAD HORSE. THE LANGUAGE YOU'RE PUTTING HERE IS DIRECTLY FROM WHAT THE CITY COUNCIL ADOPTED. UM, NEXT IS FLIP PAGES. FLIP PAGES. GO TO PAGE 13, 2 44. UM, WHAT MS. CARLISLE AND I DID WAS TO REORGANIZE THE, THE, UH, SECTIONS RELATING TO APPEAL HEARINGS AND COMPLIANCE HEARINGS. SO SPEAK TO THAT IF YOU WOULD, MS. CARLISLE. RIGHT. SO WE DIDN'T MAKE ANY CHANGES. [07:20:01] WE WERE JUST, BECAUSE SECTION 11 IS PUBLIC TESTIMONY AND PUBLIC HEARINGS, AO APPEALS AND COMPLIANCE CASES AREN'T CONSIDERED PUBLIC HEARINGS. THEY'RE, THEY'RE STANDAL STANDALONE CASES. SO WE CREATED THEIR OWN SEPARATE SECTIONS. SO, UM, SUBSECTION 11, IT WILL NOW BE RELOCATE, RELOCATED TO SECTION 12, AND THOSE WOULD BE ADMINISTRATIVE, OFFICIAL APPEALS. AND THEN SUBSECTION M COMPLIANCE CASES IS NOW SUBSECTION TH OR IS NOW SECTION 13 COMPLIANCE CASES. WE JUST MOVED THE TEXT FROM ONE PART OF THE RULES TO ANOTHER PART. NO CHANGES MADE THOUGH. SO THAT GOES TO PAGE 2 44, 13 IN THE RULES. PAGE 14, 2 45, PAGE 15, 2 46. AGAIN, NO CHANGES. SHE JUST PICKED UP AND MOVED THEM TO ANOTHER SECTION OF THE RULES. I PANICKED WHEN SHE FIRST SENT ME THIS. I THOUGHT, OH MY GOSH, THEY'RE GONNA THINK WE REWROTE THE WHOLE THING. NO CHANGES. WE'RE JUST ORGANIZING HIM FOR COMPLIANCE UNDER COMPLIANCE AND, UH, APPEALS FOR, UH, ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIALS. OKAY? UM, SO THEY LAND BACK ON 17 2 48 AND LAND BACK ON 18 2 49. JUST AS IS. THEY JUST GOT RELOCATED. SAME THING ON PAGE 19, 2 50. SAME EXACT WORDING, NO CHANGE WHATSOEVER. UM, SAME THING ON PAGE 2251, JUST THE FINISH OF THE RELOCATION. THAT HAS TO DO WITH NON-CONFORMING USES. OKAY, ON PAGE 2, 52, 21, WHY DON'T YOU GO THERE? I DON'T KNOW WHO'S CONTROLLING THIS ON THE DEAL. IT'S, WE ADDED A SECTION THAT SAYS THE DECISION OF THE BOARD IS FINAL, UNLESS APPEALED TO THE DISTRICT COURT WITHIN 10 DAYS OF THE DATE OF THE DECISION IS FILED, WHERE THE BOARD'S OFFICE IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE CHAPTER TWO 11. WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS MAKE IT VERY CLEAR TO THE PUBLIC TO AN APPLICANT THAT IT'S, YOU CAN APPEAL, BUT YOU HAVE TO DO IT IN 10 DAYS. AND THAT'S ACCORDING TO STATE LAW. THAT'S NOT CITY COUNCIL, THAT'S NOT US. THAT'S STATE LAW. QUESTIONS. THE RULES OR PROCEDURE, I VIEW AS THE AUDIENCE FOR THEM THREEFOLD. IT'S FOR THE APPLICANT WHO COMES BEFORE US. IT'S FOR THE PUBLIC AND IT'S FOR THE BOARD. SO ONE, WE WANNA MAKE SURE THE APPLICANT KNOWS WHAT ARE THE RULES WHEN THEY COME TO US. TWO, WE WANNA MAKE SURE THE PUBLIC, WHO WANTS TO GIVE AN OPINION ABOUT A PENDING CASE, WHAT ARE THE RULES? AND THREE IS FOR US AS AN ORGANIZATION, WHAT ARE OUR RULES? THOSE ARE THE, THAT'S THE THREE AUDIENCES. IS THAT A FAIR ASSESSMENT, MS. BOARD ATTORNEY? OKAY. QUESTIONS? THE CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION. MR. HOPKINS. MR. CHAIRMAN, IS THIS WHERE? OH, I'M SORRY. WE WOULD TALK ABOUT GO AHEAD. UH, PAGE, SORRY, I LOST IT. ABOUT CONSOLIDATING CASES. IT'S PAGE 12, 2 43. THANK YOU. IT'S UNDER SECTION NINE. YES. UH, LET'S SEE. LEMME MAKE SURE. NOPE, I GOT THAT MIXED UP. I'M SORRY. SECTION 10, SUBSECTION L. THERE YOU GO. UM, I GUESS MY RECOMMENDATION, OR I WOULD LIKE TO SUGGEST THE CONSIDERATION OR DISCUSSION ABOUT REMOVING THAT DISCUSSION, MS. DAVIS. UM, I AM, I UNDERSTAND WHERE MR. KOVICH IS COMING FROM BECAUSE IT IS, I'VE BEEN ON THE PANEL THAT HAS BEEN HEARING, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, THOSE DIFFICULT CASES. HOWEVER, I DO, FIRST OF ALL, IT DOES SAY BY A MAJORITY VOTE. SO IT'S NOT NECESSARILY CONDENSED TO ONE PANEL UNLESS THERE'S A DISCUSSION AND THERE'S A VOTE. NUMBER TWO, I DO THINK IT'S BETTER FOR THE PANEL MEMBERS BECAUSE WE'RE A LITTLE BIT MORE EDUCATED, EVEN THOUGH THERE'S, YOU KNOW, NO, NO CASE SETS A PRECEDENT. WE HAVE THAT BACKGROUND AND IT DOES HELP US MAKE BETTER INFORMED DECISIONS. I ALSO THINK IT'S BETTER FOR THE APPLICANT BECAUSE THEY'RE DEALING WITH A PANEL THAT IS IMMERSED IN THESE CASES AND INFORMED. AND THAT'S WHY I, I DON'T NECESSARILY LIKE STAYING HERE TILL EIGHT OR NINE O'CLOCK LISTENING TO THESE CASES, BUT I THINK IT'S BEEN IMPORTANT. AND I ALSO THINK IT'S IMPORTANT WHEN THESE DIFFICULT CASES THAT YOU, AS THE, THE CHAIR HAS BEEN OVERSEEING THEM. SO FOR ALL OF THOSE REASONS, I WOULD, I WOULD ELECT TO KEEP THAT INCLUDED. THANK YOU, MS. DAVIS, OF THE DISCUSSION. I'M GONNA GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY AND THEN LET YOU PERCOLATE. A YEAR AGO, I WAS NOTIFIED BY THE DIRECTOR THAT THE PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT HAD DISCOVERED ENORMOUS SYSTEMIC ERRORS IN PERMITTING IN A GEOGRAPHIC AREA UP [07:25:01] TO 170 WERE PUT IN QUESTION. AND, UM, THEY SAID THEY'RE DOING AN INVESTIGATION TO FIND OUT WHO, HOW, WHERE IT HAPPENED. AND IT WAS A FUNCTION FROM ASBESTOS THAT THEY HAD COMMUNICATED THAT THE CITY COUNCIL APPROVED A CHANGE IN ZONING BUT DIDN'T UPDATE THE SYSTEM. THAT'S WHY YOU HEARD ME SEVERAL TIMES SAYING, ARE YOU GONNA UPDATE THE SYSTEM? IS YOUR ZONING MAP GONNA BE CURRENT? AND SO PERMIT AFTER PERMIT WAS ISSUED FOR THINGS WITH THE OLD ZONING IN AN AREA, IT'S CALLED ELM THICKET. SO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE APPROACHED MYSELF AND SAID, WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO CONSIDER WHETHER THE BOARD WOULD ADOPT A RULE CHANGE TO CONSOLIDATE CASES SO THAT THERE WAS SOME LEVEL OF EXPERTISE AND EX AND EFFICIENCY IN HANDLING THIS? AND I SAID, I WOULDN'T DO IT ON MY OWN, THAT THE BOARD WOULD HAVE TO DECIDE. SO WE CONVENED A MEETING OF THE BOARD. I THINK IT WAS, I CAN'T REMEMBER. IT WAS OCTOBER LAST YEAR, OR WAS MAYBE SEPTEMBER. WAS IT THIS, THE END? UH, NO, IT WASN'T AT THE ANNUAL MEETING. SEPTEMBER, WAS IT SEPTEMBER. WE CALLED THE FULL BOARD MEETING AND WE HAD A DISCUSSION. CITY ATTORNEY MADE A PRESENTATION. JASON POOLE MADE A PRESENTATION. HE LAID OUT THE CASE, RECOMMENDED THAT THE BOARD CONSIDER CHANGING ITS RULES IN EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES IN ORDER TO HANDLE THIS. AND WE HAD A THOROUGH DEBATE, UH, WAS APPROVED 12 TO TWO, AND THEN WE CODIFIED IT INTO OUR RULES OF PROCEDURE LAST YEAR AT THE ANNUAL MEETING. AND THE CITY COUNCIL APPROVED THAT. SO IT IS, IT'S RULES AND LAW CONSISTENT WITH CITY COUNCIL. SO THAT'S THE BACKGROUND OF THIS, THAT THAT WAS THE GENESIS. IN THE END, THE 170 CASES ENDED UP BEING 30 25 OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. AND WE JUST HEARD TODAY THERE'S ONE HANGING OUT THERE. I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IT IS. I DON'T WANT TO KNOW ONE, ONE OUT THERE. UM, SO THAT WAS THE CONCEPT, MS. HAYDEN AND THEN MR. FINNEY. SO I THINK, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE ISSUES, YEAH, THEY, THEY WERE DEFINITELY VERY STRESSFUL AS WAS THE, THE POKER ROOM ONE, JUST, JUST BECAUSE IT WAS SO LATE. UM, AND, YOU KNOW, I WONDER IF THERE'S A WAY THAT WE CAN, IF, IF, IF ONE PANEL IS GONNA BE HEARING THESE, THESE VERY, UM, HIGH PROFILE CASES THAT ARE VERY, YOU KNOW, CONTROVERSIAL AND MIGHT GO LONG, THAT WE COULD ASSIGN SOME OF THE OTHER CASES TO THE OTHER PANELS SO THAT WE'RE NOT HERE UNTIL 7, 8, 9 O'CLOCK LISTENING TO, YOU KNOW, ALL THESE OTHER PA ALL THESE OTHER CASES AFTER THE AO APPEAL OR, OR WHATEVER IT IS. SO THE EVOLUTION, THANK YOU, MS. HAYDEN. THE EVOLUTION WAS, THEY STARTED OFF AS ALL AO APPEALS, WHICH IS OURS, EACH ONE. AND THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE SAID, OKAY, WE'RE NOT GONNA DO AO APPEALS ANYMORE. WE'RE GONNA TELL THE, THE APPLICANTS IN THE AREA TO MAKE VARIANCE REQUESTS. DO YOU REMEMBER THAT? AND THAT CHANGED THE SCOPE OF THE REQUESTS INSTEAD OF THE DRAWN OUT BATTLE LINES. IT WAS A VARIANCE REQUEST THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE TO START WITH. THEN WE WOULDN'T HAVE BURNED THROUGH ALL THAT EMOTION ON THE FRONT END. I THINK THE MANAGER'S OFFICE AND THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE REALIZED, WOW, WE SHOULD DO THESE BY VARIANCE REQUESTS, NOT AS IT RELATES TO THE AO APPEALS, MR. FINNEY, AND THEN MR. HOPKOS. UM, SO I, I EMPATHIZE WITH THE COMMENTS OF MY COLLEAGUES. UM, HOWEVER, UM, I THINK, UH, GOING BACK TO MR. KO'S INITIAL CONCERNS THAT HE EXPRESSED, UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE SACRIFICES OF THAT PANEL MADE WERE NOT JUST IN TERMS OF TIME AND JUST THE STRESS OF IT ALL, BUT THE OTHER SACRIFICE WAS THE REALITIES OF A CONTROVERSIAL SITUATION WHERE OUR LOCAL MEDIA WENT AFTER THAT BOARD, SPECIFICALLY CALLING OUT NAMES OF SPECIFIC PANEL MEMBERS. AND WHILE THOSE SPECIFIC PANEL MEMBERS MIGHT BE OKAY WITH THAT, UM, I THINK IT, IT, IT PROTECTS THE INTEGRITY OF THIS BOARD TO DISPERSE IT EVENLY. BECAUSE I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I REMEMBER READING AND ONE OF THOSE HOT TAKES BY OUR LOCAL MEDIA OUTLETS WAS THAT WAS THE IMPLICATION THAT ALL OF THESE CASES WERE SPECIFICALLY ASSIGNED TO THE SPECIFIC PANEL SO THAT THEY WOULD RULE IN A CERTAIN WAY. AND SO I THINK, I THINK GIVEN THAT, UM, CHARACTERIZATION, I THINK IT JUST, I THINK THE CONTINUING THE RANDOM ASSIGNMENT, UM, PROTECTS THE INTEGRITY OF THE BOARD. THANK YOU. UH, EACH CASE, I PROMISE YOU, WAS HANDLED INDEPENDENTLY BASED ON THE FACTS PRESENTED. ABSOLUTELY. AND THE VOTES CHANGED [07:30:01] ALONG THE WAY. THEY DID. THEY DID. OKAY. OTHER COMMENTS, MR. HOPKINS? SO BASED ON, UM, YOUR REPETITION OF THE SEQUENCE OF EVENTS, UM, LET ME MODIFY MY RECOMMENDATION AND NOT REMOVE THIS. BUT IT SEEMS THAT IT MADE A LOT MORE SENSE WHEN THEY WERE ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL APPEALS, WHICH ARE FAIRLY EXTRAORDINARY IN NATURE. WHEN THEY BECAME VARIANCE REQUESTS, THEY SHOULD HAVE GONE INTO THE QUEUE WITH ALL THE OTHER VARIANCE REQUESTS. THAT WAS, SO I GUESS I'M MAYBE GOING TO SUGGEST FOR THAT THIS BE RESTRICTED TO ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL CASES REVIEWS. UM, IF THERE ARE OTHER EXTRAORDINARY KINDS OF THINGS THAT I HAVEN'T SAT IN ON THAT I DON'T NECESSARILY KNOW ABOUT, I WOULD INCLUDE THOSE TOO. BUT IF THEY'RE JUST REGULAR VARIANCE OR SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS OR WHATEVER, THEY SHOULD GO INTO THE RANDOM ASSIGNMENT. AND IF THERE TRULY ARE SPECIAL TYPES OF SITUATIONS, LIKE AN ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICIAL REVIEW CASE, APPEAL CASE THAT REALLY DON'T COME UP THAT OFTEN, THERE MAY MAKE SOME SENSE TO DO THAT, UM, APPEAL, UH, ASSIGNMENT TO A SINGLE PANEL. I HEAR YOU REMEMBER, THE BOARD STILL HAS TO APPROVE THIS. IT JUST DOESN'T HAPPEN. I WOULD CALL IF THIS, OH GOD FORBID A THICKET OCCURRED AGAIN, I WOULD HAVE TO CALL MEETING THE BOARD. IT WOULD BE ON THE AGENDA. THE CITY ATTORNEY, THE, THE, UH, THE DIRECTOR OF PLANNING DEVELOPMENT WOULD HAVE TO MAKE A CASE AS TO WHY, WHAT AND HOW. AND THEN THE BOARD, BY MAJORITY VOTE, WOULD STILL HAVE TO APPROVE IT. THIS IS NOT AUTOMATIC. IT, THIS IS A WHAT IF. SO THIS IS A CONTINGENCY PROVISION. THIS IS NOT AN ACTIONABLE PROVISION. MS. HAYDEN. YEAH, I THINK, UM, KNOWING WHAT I KNOW NOW, I WOULD PROBABLY VOTE AGAINST THAT IF WE HAD TO VOTE AGAIN. SO, YEAH, BUT THAT MAKES SENSE. BUT AGAIN, THIS SAYS THE BOARD DECIDES IT'S NOT, IT DOESN'T AUTOMATICALLY TRIP. OKAY. ANYONE ELSE THEN, MR. CHAIRMAN? I'LL RESPECTFULLY SAY THAT IF IT'S GOING TO BE ASSIGNED TO A SINGLE PANEL, THEN THAT PANEL SHOULD BE RANDOMLY ASSIGNED. AS I RECALL, WE VOTED TO ASSIGN IT TO PANEL A. YES. AND PERHAPS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN RANDOMLY ASSIGNED TO A PANEL AS THEY WOULD HANDLE THEM ALL INSTEAD OF THE, BECAUSE IT BECAME VERY EASY FOR PEOPLE ON PANEL B AND C TO SAY, SURE. YOU KNOW, , GO AHEAD, . WELL, THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF THE INTERESTING DYNAMIC IS THAT, UH, IT DID INCREASE WORKLOAD AS IT RELATES TO ONE PANEL. THE OTHER, UH, LET ME ASSURE THE BOARD AGAIN, WE WERE THE RECIPIENT OF THE DISASTER IN THE THICKET AND THE CITY, UH, MANAGER AND CITY ATTORNEY'S REQUEST TO DO THIS. WE WEREN'T GOING OUT HUNTING FOR THIS, EVEN THOUGH THIS IS OUR JOB TO DEAL WITH THESE SORT OF MISTAKES THAT OCCUR IN A MUNICIPALITY. SO I, I, I'M PERSONALLY COMFORTABLE WITH AS IT IS. 'CAUSE IT STILL GIVES THE BOARD THE POWER TO MAKE THE DECISION WHEN AND IF THAT'S ALL, BUT THAT'S THE WILL OF THE BOARD. I, I THINK THE POINT I WANTED TO MAKE, I THINK I'VE MADE. SO IF THERE'S NOT AN APPETITE FOR MAKING THAT CHANGE, UM, THEN LET'S MOVE ON. OKAY. AGAIN, THAT THIS ISSUE WOULD COME BACK TO THE BOARD FOR DISCUSSION AND VOTE. AND IF THE BOARD SO FELT TO BE HANDLED DIFFERENTLY, THE BOARD WOULD SO DIRECT 'CAUSE IT'S IN HERE. IT COMES BACK. YES. . OKAY. SO DISCUSSIONS ON THE PROPOSED MODIFICATIONS TO THE RULES OF PROCEDURE. THIS IS DEMOCRACY IN ACTION. NOTHING'S DECIDED IN THE BACK ROOM TODAY. THE CHAIR WOULD ENTERTAIN A MOTION. SO MOVED. MR. CAMPBELL MOVED TO ADOPT THE PROPOSED BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT RULES OF PRO PROCEDURES AS AMENDED. IS THERE A SECOND? I SECOND. I SECOND. SECONDED BY DR. GLOVER. DISCUSSION OF THE MOTION. ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. THOSE OPPOSED PASSES. 12 TO ZERO. THAT IS THE LAST ITEM ON OUR AGENDA. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING IN PERSON AND PRESENT. UH, WE'RE A LITTLE BIT BEHIND SCHEDULE, BUT WE ACCOMPLISHED A HELL OF A LOT TODAY. UM, I VERY MUCH APPRECIATE IT. I BEG YOU, BEG YOU, BEG YOU AS WE ROLL OUT THE CALENDAR FOR THE BALANCE OF 25 AND AS WE GO INTO 26, [07:35:01] PLEASE LET US KNOW AS MUCH IN ADVANCE THAT YOU CAN OR CANNOT BE ATTENDING A MEETING. IT HAPPENS. JUST LET US KNOW IN ADVANCE THE FARTHER IN ADVANCE THE BETTER CHANCE WE HAVE FOR COVERAGE. WITH THAT BEING SAID, IT'S UH, THE CHAIRMAN, ENTERTAIN, ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADJOURN. I SO MOVED. ADJOURN TO A MO TO ADJOURN. IT'S BEEN MOVED TO ADJOURN BY MS. DAVIS. IS THERE A SECOND? I ENTER FINNEY SECOND. MR. FINNEY SECONDED THE MOTION. ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. THOSE OPPOSED THE BOARD ADJOURNS AT 5:17 PM ON OCTOBER 28TH. THANK YOU. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.