* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.
          THEY WERE CORRECT. 
          [00:00:01]
YOU KNOW, THE OF THE BODY, WHATEVER, LIKE, HEY, I'M GONNA CALL THE ORDER THE JANUARY 13TH, 2026 REGULAR MEETING AT THE CITY OF DALLAS HOUSING FINANCE CORPORATION. 
          MY NAME IS DAVID ELLIS, PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD, THE DALLAS HOUSING FINANCE CORPORATION. 
          SO FIRST ITEM ON THE AGENDA ROLL CALL. 
          IT'S JACKIE. 
          CAN YOU? YES. 
          UH, DIRECTOR OF SEAN ALLEN. 
          PRESENT DIRECTOR SHALANDA OLA. 
          HERE SHADA. 
          HI. 
          UH, JUST A REMINDER FOR THOSE ONLINE THAT WE NEED YOUR CAMERA ON. 
          DIRECTOR JACK MARSHALL SEAT HERE. 
          DIRECTOR PATTY COLLINS. 
          HERE, DIRECTOR KEVIN HEON. 
          PRESENT DIRECTOR LESLIE BRUNICK. 
          PRESENT. 
          VIRGINIA. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          HI, UH, PRESIDENT DAVID ELLIS. 
          PRESENT DIRECTOR COOK FRIEDMAN. 
          PRESENT DIRECTOR OLIVER ROBINSON. 
          PRESENT. 
          UH, SECRETARY TONY. 
          PAGE PRESENT. 
          DIRECTOR SEAN? EIGHT. 
          HERE AGAIN, WE HAVE COURT. 
          ALRIGHT, EXCELLENT. 
          SO, ITEM THREE, PUBLIC COMMENTS ON ITEMS FOUR THROUGH NINE OF THE AGENDA. 
          IS THERE ANYBODY THAT HAS PUBLIC COMMENTS THEY'D LIKE TO SHARE WITH THE BOARD? ALL RIGHT. 
          WITH THAT, I ASSUME THERE ARE NO PUBLIC COMMENTS. 
          LET'S GO ON TO ITEM FOUR OF THE AGENDA APPROVAL OF THIS FOR THE DECEMBER 9TH THOUSAND 25 DALLAS HOUSING QUIET CORPORATION MEETING. 
          IT'S INCLUDED IN OUR PACKET. 
          DOES EVERYONE UPON REVIEW OF THE MINUTES, HAVE ANY ITEMS THEY'D LIKE TO EDIT OR COMMENT ON? YES. 
          YES. 
          UM, THIS WOULD BE, I GUESS, A COMMON SUGGESTION, FEEDBACK ON FROM, UH, STAFF IS I NOTICED IN THE, UH, THE ITEMS WHERE WE HAVE THE, UH,  VOTE, WE WILL NAME A PERSON IF THEY ABSTAINED OR THE SENATE, BUT THEN JUST SAY REST. 
          AGREED. 
          AND SO I WAS WONDERING IF WE COULD CHANGE IT, DO KIND LIKE CPC OR COUNCIL SAY, OKAY. 
          FOR EVERYONE, LIKE IF IT'S RECORD VOTE, WHO ARE THE PEOPLE THAT VOTED IN FAVOR? WHO ARE THE PEOPLE THAT VOTED GUESS FOR THAT? NOPE, WE DO THAT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          FINAL COMMENT. 
          OKAY. 
          GUESS WE, ARE WE GONNA MAKE THAT CHANGE ON THESE MINUTES? JACKIE, DO WE HAVE THAT RECORD? I CAN. 
          LET'S GO AHEAD AND DO IT AGAIN. 
          OKAY. 
          ANY OTHER COMMENTS? EDITS? ALL RIGHT. 
          WITH THE CHANGES THAT SECRETARY PAGE, UH, PROPOSED, DOES ANYONE WANNA MAKE A MOTION? SO MOVE. 
          ALL RIGHT, WE GOT MOTION BY, UH, VICE PRESIDENT. 
          A SECOND. 
          SECOND MOVE. 
          DIRECTOR ROBINSON, LET'S JUST DO A VOICE VOTE. 
          ALL IN FAVOR? AYE. 
          ALL OPPOSED? OKAY. 
          UNANIMOUS THEN IT'S UNANIMOUS. 
          YOU DON'T HAVE, YEAH, IT'S UNANIMOUS. 
          YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY ONLY IF IT'S LIKE A, UH, RECORD VOTE, RIGHT? YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          GOT IT. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SO WITH THE AGENDA, , I'M GONNA MOVE THIS AROUND JUST A LITTLE BIT. 
          SO LET'S GET THE KIND OF LAYUPS WHERE I SAY THE LAYUPS DONE FIRST. 
          UM, WE'RE GONNA MOVE, WE'LL TAKE NUMBER FIVE FIRST, AS IS. 
          IT IS, BUT THEN WE'RE GONNA TACKLE SEVEN TO FOUR SIX. 
          WE HAVE ANY NO OBJECTIONS TO THAT? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          WELL THEN LET'S JUST GO TO FIVE, UM, DELEGATION OF AUTHORITY TO THE GENERAL MANAGER TO GENERAL MANAGER TO UPDATE THE PREPARATION OF MULTIFAMILY FINANCE APPLICATION PROCEDURES AND REGULATIONS. 
          IT SAYS MY NAME THAT ERIC, CAN YOU JUST SUMMARIZE WHAT DO IT HERE? YEAH, SO WE HAVE HAD THE SAME APPLICATION FOR A LOT OF YEARS NOW. 
          I THINK IT'S, UH, KYLE'S NAME THERE. 
          OKAY. 
          WE HAVE A SCORING SYSTEM THAT HAS NEVER REALLY BEEN USED. 
          SO I THINK IN AN ATTEMPT JUST TO BRING UP THE DATE CURRENT REQUIREMENTS AND TO GIVE US WHAT WE ACTUALLY NEED TO DO IT, WE'RE GONNA ACTUALLY, IN THE PROCESS OF LOOKING AT IT, UH, STREAMLINING IT, MAKING IT MORE, MORE VALID, UM, HOPEFULLY BETTER PRODUCTS THAT WE CAN BE MORE, MORE CLEAR ON WHAT WE'RE EXPECTING FROM OUR PRODUCT. 
          SO THIS ONE IS JUST TO GIVE YOU THE AUTHORITY TO MAKE THOSE CHANGES, RIGHT? I MEAN, THE, THE APPLICATION, IT DOESN'T FIND ANYONE ANYTHING, BUT IT'S JUST 
          [00:05:01]
OUR WAY OF COMMUNICATING TO DEVELOPERS WHAT WE WANNA SEE IN OUR COORDINATING. 
          I THINK OVER THE PAST THREE OR FOUR YEARS, WE, WE'VE HONED DOWN WHAT WE REALLY WANT AND SO WE NOW PUT THAT IN WRITING. 
          UM, ARE YOU PLANNING TO, ONCE YOU COME UP THE NEW, UH, APPLICATION PLAN TO SHOW IT TO YEAH. 
          WE'LL, WE'LL BRING IT BACK ALL AND FOR COMMENT. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          THE APPLICATION TODAY, IT'S, I RECALL IT'S FAIRLY MANUAL. 
          THEY ACTUALLY FILLING OUT A LOT. 
          THEY SUBMIT THAT FULL PACKET. 
          YET HAVE WE GIVEN THOUGHT CONSIDERATION TO TRYING TO DIGITIZE IT OR CREATING A PORTAL? I THINK IT WOULD PROBABLY COST SOME MONEY TO GET SOME SOFTWARE TO BUY. 
          WE, WE'LL GIVE THE BUDGET HERE IN A LITTLE BIT. 
          I THINK WE MIGHT HAVE, BUT NO, JUST, JUST TO, AND, AND THE SECOND PART OF THAT WOULD BE WE'RE ABLE TO DIGITIZE IT AND IF WE KNOW WHAT OUR REQUIREMENTS ARE, WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO , WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO USE A LITTLE AUTOMATION APP PRECURSOR TO KIND OF GO THROUGH THE SCREEN AND SAY, HEY, YOU'RE MISSING TO GIVE THAT FEEDBACK ON THE FRONT END TO DEVELOPERS SO THAT THEY CAN GO AHEAD AND BEEF UP WHATEVER THEY SUBMIT EXCEPT WHATEVER WE NEED. 
          MINIMUM. 
          THANK YOU. 
          I THINK THE FIRST, YEAH, THE FIRST STEP THAT PROBABLY JUST PRE FORMAT IT. 
          MAKE SURE THAT ALL THE REQUIREMENTS DIGITIZE IT. 
          MAKE MIXTURE FIELDS. 
          YEAH. 
          RIGHT, RIGHT. 
          GOOD. 
          CREATE AN AUTOMATIC DIGITAL, SOMEONE SUBMIT IT. 
          SO YOU EXACTLY QUESTION. 
          I WOULD, I WOULD YOU GET THE FORMAT DOWN, WHICH WE ALL AGREE ON, LIKE WHAT THE RULES ARE, LIKE YOU TO CAPTURE IT DIGITALLY AND THEN YEAH. 
          IF WE GOT IT, IT'S GONNA COST HIRE SOMEBODY THAT'S 20. 
          WELL DO THAT. 
          UH, ANY OTHER COMMENTS? ANYONE REMOTE? HEY, THIS IS, UH, DI THIS IS DIRECTOR. 
          HE, I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT I THINK THE PORTAL IDEAS IS, IS A GOOD IDEA. 
          MY QUESTION IS, IF YOU WERE TO GO THAT ROUTE, AS FAR AS THE APPLICATION, HOW WOULD THAT IN, IN, HOW WOULD INDIVIDUALS BE ABLE TO ASK QUESTIONS? LIKE RIGHT THERE, IF THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND SOMETHING ABOUT THE APPLICATION, HAS THAT BEEN DISCUSSED? RIGHT NOW IT'S JUST AN IDEA. 
          WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING. 
          OKAY. 
          MATTER WHAT, IF THEY HAVE QUESTIONS ON THE WRITTEN DOCUMENT, I MEAN, IT'S ALL AARON OR JACKIE OR SOMEONE ELSE. 
          STAFF. 
          SO I THINK THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. 
          I MEAN, WE DON'T, WE DON'T GET SO MANY APPLICATIONS THAT I, I CAN'T TALK TO ANYBODY WHO BEEN SOME PROJECTS. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S NOT A PROBLEM. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, ANYONE WANNA MAKE A MOTION? MOTION? SECOND VICE PRESIDENT ALLEN. 
          SO, UH, DIRECTOR ROBINSON MOTIONED SECOND FROM, UH, VICE PRESIDENT ALLEN. 
          LET'S DO A ROLL CALL. 
          VOTE OR NOT, LET'S JUST COME DOWN LIST. 
          UH, VICE PRESIDENT SEAN ALLEN. 
          HMM. 
          DIRECTOR SHALANDA. 
          DIRECTOR JACK MARSHALL. 
          C APPROVE DIRECTOR PATTY COLLINS. 
          ARE YOU STILL ON? I CAN'T SEE. 
          YES. 
          APPROVED. 
          OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          CORRECT. 
          DIRECTOR LESLIE . 
          APPROVED PRESIDENT. 
          DAVID ELLIS, APPROVED DIRECTOR. 
          CLIFF FRIEDMAN APPROVED. 
          OLIVER ROBINSON APPROVED DIRECTOR. 
          RYAN MOORE. 
          APPROVED SECRETARY. 
          TONY PAGE. 
          RUTH AND DIRECTOR? SEAN. 
          SADIE. 
          RUTH. 
          OKAY. 
          PASSES. 
          OKAY, NOW WE'RE GONNA GO TO ACTION ITEMS SEVEN, UH, RULE THE CORPORATION'S 2026 
          [00:10:01]
BUDGET. 
          ERIC, THANK YOU. 
          SO I WORKED THIS MONTH WITH OUR TREASURER, TREASURER MARSHALL C AND ALSO WITH OUR ACCOUNTANT SHANNON RE FROM NOVEMBER. 
          UH, I THINK THAT WAS A PRETTY GOOD ESTIMATION OF, OF WHAT WE'RE GONNA BE SPENDING THIS YEAR. 
          AND BASICALLY WE JUST WENT LINE BY LINE AND ADDED A LITTLE BIT OF AN INCREASE, SOMETHING MODEST SO THAT WE CAN COVER ANYTHING, UM, SIMILAR FOR THE NEXT YEAR. 
          AND THEN WE DID ADD SEVERAL, UM, I GUESS CUSHIONS SO THAT WE'RE JUST MAKING SURE THAT, THAT WE HAVE ENOUGH IN THE BUDGET ALLOCATED FOR THAT. 
          NOW, THE REVENUES, WE ACTUALLY DIDN'T EVEN, UH, INCLUDE ANY NEW DEALS, RIGHT? SO WE, WE JUST TRIED TO BE ULTRA CONSERVATIVE BECAUSE THE DEAL IS NEVER GUARANTEED. 
          AND SO, UH, WE JUST INCLUDED ALL OF THE, WHAT WE CONSIDER REGULAR PAYMENTS. 
          SO BASELINE, THAT'S, THAT'S WORST CASE SCENARIO THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT FOR REVENUE. 
          AND THEN EXPENSES, WE JUST TRY TO BE AS, UH, CONSERVATIVE AS POSSIBLE. 
          THE NEW LINE ITEMS OBVIOUSLY ARE, UH, UM, A BUDGET FOR AN OFFICE SPACE, STRESSED OUT PHYSICAL OFFICE AND, AND ALL OUR MEETINGS THERE, UH, THAT WE'LL SHARE WITH THE PFC. 
          AND THEN, UM, I ADDED A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS , A MARKETING AND AN EDUCATIONAL BUDGET. 
          I THINK THERE'S BEEN A, A LARGE NEED, I THINK FOR SOME FORMALIZED TRAINING FOR BOTH THE BOARD AND FOR CITY COUNCIL. 
          AND SO WE WANNA GET SOME TRAINING MATERIALS, UM, PAID UP THAT WILL BE LONG LASTING AND THAT WILL BE ABLE TO, UH, EDUCATE BOTH OUR BOARD MEMBERS, PUBLIC, WHOEVER NEEDS TO KNOW ON WHAT WE DO, HOW IT'S DONE, WHAT ARE THE MECHANISMS, AND JUST BE REALLY IN DEPTH ABOUT IT. 
          SO I THINK THIS WILL BE SOMETHING THAT WOULD LAST FOR, FOR A LOT OF YEARS. 
          AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, AS WE GO INTO THE NEXT LEGISLATIVE SESSION, IT'S NOT THIS SUMMER, BUT FOLLOW SUMMER, UH, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GONNA BE SITTING DOWN ON OUR STAFF, WE'LL BE, AND HAVE CONVERSATIONS WITH A LOT OF LEGISLATORS. 
          AND THIS IS THE KIND OF STUFF THAT THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT HERE TO DEAL WITH IT EVERY DAY. 
          BUT THEN WHEN THE, UH, WHEN THE LAWS COME UP FOR REVISION, IT'S NICE TO HAVE THAT IN OUR BACK POCKET. 
          UM, OTHER ADDITIONS, I THINK WE, WE WILL BE HIRING ANOTHER ASSET MANAGER. 
          I THINK I TALKED TO  ABOUT THIS. 
          YOU KNOW, OUR PORTFOLIO'S GETTING PRETTY BIG JUST TO KEEP TABS ON THE FINANCIAL CONDITION OF EACH PROPERTY. 
          WE NEED TO HAVE A FULLTIME ASSET MANAGER JUST UPDATING AND WE CAN HAVE SOME FORMALIZED REPORTING. 
          AND, UM, THE GOAL IS WE HAVE TO FORMULATE SOMETHING THAT WE CAN HAVE AT OUR BOARD MEETING EVERY QUARTER. 
          JUST LIKE A, A REGULAR, UH, ASSET MANAGEMENT FIRM. 
          WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, 10,000 UNITS UNDER MANAGEMENT. 
          HERE'S WHERE WE ARE FINANCIALLY, HERE'S WHERE THE PROJECTIONS ARE, HERE'S WHERE WE'RE HITTING AT THIS POINT IN THE YEAR. 
          SO IT'LL JUST BE NICE FOR YOU GUYS TO KEEP TABS ON EVERYTHING. 
          AND FOR ME AS WELL, HOW TO PLAN FOR ANYTHING THAT THAT GETS OFF TRACK. 
          SO MAJOR, MAJOR . 
          YEAH, JUST KIND OF THE REQUEST AND WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT. 
          I THINK A MANAGEMENT POSITION I THINK HAS BEEN KEY. 
          WE'VE SCALED TO A CERTAIN POINT THAT WE HAVE ENOUGH UNITS FROM THOUSAND WE HAVE OR UNDER DEVELOPMENT. 
          AND I'VE SEEN AGENCIES AROUND THE STATE AND THAT'S, THEY HAVE SOMEONE IN THAT ROLE THAT JUST KEEPS TABS WITH WHAT'S HAPPENING ON PROPERTIES. 
          SO I THINK WE'RE AT THAT POINT. 
          HOW ARE YOU MANAGING THAT NOW, AARON? HOW DO YOU ALL MANAGE THAT? YOU KNOW, WE, WE HAVE REQUIREMENTS FOR REPORTING, BUT IT'S NOT INTEGRATED INTO ONE SINGLE KIND OF ROLL UP. 
          BUT THAT'S REALLY WHAT I WANT. 
          YOU KNOW, IT'S HARD. 
          YOU'RE JUST AT PROPERTY BY PROPERTY RIGHT NOW. 
          SO WE, PROPERTY MANAGEMENT, THEY ALL HAVE DIFFERENT SYSTEMS. AND SO THAT'S THE THING. 
          I, I NEED THIS PERSON TO GO AND NORMALIZE THE SYSTEM, MAKE SURE THAT IT'S, IT'S ALL IN OUR FORMAT SO WE CAN READ IT AS IT'S, UH, CONSISTENT. 
          IT'S, UH, SOMETHING THAT YOU GUYS CAN LOOK AT, I CAN LOOK AT AND MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE ON TRACK WITH EVERYTHING. 
          YOU KNOW, AARON, PRIMARY, FIRST AARON'S JOB IS TRYING TO BRING IN, KIND OF WORK OUT. 
          WE NEED SOMEONE THAT'S REALLY ON TOP OF THE EXISTING PORTFOLIO. 
          AND I THINK FREE UP, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE THING. 
          I THINK FIVE YEARS AGO, OH YEAH, WE HAD VERY FEW PROPERTIES, FOUR OR FIVE PROPERTIES. 
          NOW WE'RE UP TO, YOU KNOW, 40 EITHER OPERATING UNDER DEVELOPMENT. 
          SO WE'VE SCALED UP PRETTY HEAVILY IN THE LAST SEVEN YEARS. 
          WE JUST NEED TO STAFF ACCORDINGLY AND MAKE SURE WE KEEP TRACK EVERYTHING AND AS ALWAYS MOVE INTO 
          [00:15:01]
LEASE UP AND THEN TO STABILIZE OPERATING. 
          YOU KNOW, THE PROBLEMS WILL CHANGE AS, AS THE PROPERTIES. 
          ANOTHER THING IS NOT TERRIBLY EXPENSIVE. 
          LIKE KIND OF TFA ASSOCIATION HAS A HIGHEST CORPORATION. 
          IT'D BE NICE. 
          WE BOUGHT SPONSORSHIP, HAVE PREPARED PRESENCE OF THAT CONFERENCE, HC THING. 
          OTHER AGENCIES ARE DOING IT. 
          THAT'S JUST ONE THING I THOUGHT WOULD BE GOOD EXPOSURE TO THE HC DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY THAT WE'RE HERE. 
          WE'RE ACTIVE OR ROBUST. 
          UM, AND YEAH, AT SOME POINT SOON WE ARE PROBABLY GONNA BE, UH, LOOKING OR GETTING OFFICE SPACE FOR THE STAFF, UH, THAT ARE REMOTE AT THIS POINT, SINCE WE PULL IN DIRECTLY NOW, UH, WE NEED TO PROVIDE SPACE FOR WELL, AND WHICH WE'LL SHARE WITH THE PFC FOR THE SHARED SERVICES. 
          SO WE'LL SPLIT THE COST OF THAT. 
          SO AARON'S ON TOP OF THAT MAY TO SOON ANYWAY. 
          THAT'S THE THING. 
          YOU GUYS CAN BE A LITTLE MORE COMFORTABLE. 
          MAYBE HAVE A LITTLE BETTER, UH, EASIER TO ACCESS ACCESS SOMETIMES. 
          SO, AND THE COST OF THAT ASSET MANAGER IS IN THE BUDGET. 
          YEAH. 
          OKAY. 
          THE, THE, UM, TRAINING AND THE STUFF WE TALKED, WHICH FINE IS THAT IN HERE? THAT WILL BE 217,000. 
          THE OFFICE EXPENSE, THE TRAINING THING THEY TALKED ABOUT EARLIER. 
          YEAH. 
          IN OFFICE EXPENSE. 
          SO WE JUST ADDED THAT INTO THAT PART. 
          THE ADMINISTRATIVE AARON, I, I WOULD BE SUPPORTIVE OF THE MANAGER POSITION AS WELL. 
          THANKS. 
          GREAT IDEA. 
          ONE THING I'D ASK YOU TO LOOK AT TOO, IN ADDITION TO REPORTING FOR, UH, BOARD IS, UH, SEPARATE MAYBE A LEADER VERSION OR COUNCIL BASED UPON FEEDBACK. 
          LIKE WHAT KIND OF, AND JUST FROM YOUR INTERACTION WITH THEM, WHAT IS THE STUFF THAT THEY'RE VERY STANDING SO WE CAN THEN PROACTIVELY LIKE YOU SEND THEM A MONTHLY. 
          YEAH, AND THAT'S, I THINK THAT'S PART OF THAT IDEA TOO. 
          YOU KNOW, WE CAN POST ALL THESE ON OUR WEBSITE. 
          WE CAN BE VERY TRANSPARENT, RIGHT? YEAH. 
          I THINK THAT'S ONE OF OUR DUTIES IS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE DOING EVERYTHING ABOVE BOARD AND THAT, YOU KNOW, THE PUBLIC IS MORE ON OUR OPERATIONS. 
          SO THINGS A GO LONG WAY TOWARDS, UH, THAT KIND OF TRUST AS WELL. 
          IS THE PROPOSED NEW OFFICE WRITTEN IN THE OFFICE EXPENSE LINE? YEAH, THAT'S, THAT'S BASICALLY THE FOR OUR PROPOSAL PIECE. 
          OKAY. 
          IT'S ALL THREE. 
          WE NEED TO TAKE A MOTION. 
          UH OH. 
          YEAH. 
          I, SORRY. 
          UH, . 
          ANYONE WHAT? MAKE A MOTION. 
          MOTION DIRECTOR. 
          MOTION. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          GOT A SECOND. 
          DIRECTOR OF TREATMENT FREE MINUTES. 
          FREE APOLOGIES. 
          SO JACKIE, TAKE AWAY VICE PRESIDENT SEAN ALLEN, DIRECTOR SHADA OLA APPROVE TREASURER JACK MARSHALL C APPROVE DR. 
          PATTY COLLINS. 
          APPROVED DR. KEVIN HINTON APPROVED DR. 
          LESLIE BRUIN APPROVED PRESENT. 
          DAVID ELLIS APPROVED. 
          CLIFF FRIEDMAN APPROVED. 
          DR. OLIVER ROBINSON APPROVE. 
           MOORE APPROVE. 
          SECRETARY TONY PAGE APPROVE. 
          AND DIRECTOR APPROVE. 
          OKAY. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          ACTION ITEMS. ACTUALLY ITEM SIX. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          IT'S PRETTY GOOD THAT WE DIDN'T REALLY HAVE ANY DEALS TO APPROVE. 
          'CAUSE THIS COULD TAKE, UH, UM, A GOOD PORTION 
          [00:20:01]
OF OUR CONVERSATION. 
          WE'LL SEE WHERE THE CONVERSATION GOES AND HOW LONG THIS LASTS. 
          VERY SHORT. 
          IT COULD BE VERY, WE'LL SEE. 
          ANYWAYS, UH, SO I'LL JUST KIND OF READ THIS OUT. 
          I'LL JUST KIND OF GO DOWN HOW WE'RE GONNA APPROACH THIS DISCUSSION. 
          UM, IT'S THE APPROVAL TO FILE A WRITTEN APPLICATION FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS, TAKING CITY COUNCIL APPROVAL OF THE AMENDED AND RESTATED BYLAWS OF THE CORPORATION AND PROGRAM STATEMENT OF THE CORPORATION. 
          SO WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO, UM, WE'LL HAVE AARON TO START OFF, SORT OF DESCRIBE WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE, JUST KIND OF SUMMARIZE THE PROGRAM STATEMENT AND THE CHANGES TO THE S UH, AND THEN I JUST MAY GET MY 2 CENTS ON HISTORY, KIND OF WHERE MY HEAD'S AT, BECAUSE I'VE BEEN SORT OF KNEE DEEP IN A LOT OF THIS STUFF, UH, SINCE PRESIDENT A FEW, UH, MONTHS AGO. 
          HOWEVER, UM, WE MAY ALSO HAVE A SPECIAL GUEST HERE TO KIND OF TALK THROUGH SORT OF THE CITY'S, UH, STAFFS POSITION AS WELL FOR WHO IS THE DIRECTOR, HOUSING AND COMMUNITY EMPOWERMENT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          OKAY. 
          AND JAMES ARMS. OKAY. 
          SORRY. 
          I, I, WE MAY HAVE MET IN PAST, BUT, UH, YES. 
          GLAD YOU'RE HERE AS WELL. 
          SO THOR IS ACTUALLY, UH, THE OFFICIAL LIAISON, UH, TO THE DALLAS HOUSING COMPLIANCE CORPORATION. 
          SO SINCE WE HIRED, UH, AARON DIRECTLY THOR BY VIRTUES POSITION, HIS LIAISON, SO WHEN HE SPEAKS, HE CAN SPEAK UP THE PEDESTAL IF YOU WANT. 
          HE'S ALSO WELCOME TO SIT IN THE D AS IF HE WERE A BOARD MEMBER AS WELL. 
          AND THAT BE YOUR CALL. 
          SO I THINK TO KIND OF START OFF, AARON, WHY DON'T YOU KIND OF TRY TO SUMMARIZE WHAT WE'RE FRONT TO COLLEGE HERE? YEAH, SO FOR THE NEWER BOARD MEMBERS, UH, YOU KNOW, CALL IT TWO YEARS, WE'VE BEEN HAVING THIS DISCUSSION ABOUT, YOU KNOW, HOW TO OPERATE THE CORPORATIONS. 
          OBVIOUSLY YOU GUYS HIRED THE CITY, WHICH GREAT, THERE'S THIS QUESTION OF, ALRIGHT, WE GOT STAFFING KIND SQUARED AWAY. 
          HOW DO WE OPERATE WITHIN THE BALANCE OF THE CITY HOUSING POLICY? SO, YOU KNOW, WE'VE HAD MULTIPLE ITERATIONS COME TO HOUSING COMMITTEE, UM, YOU KNOW, STARTED THIS GOOD CONVERSATION AS TO, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS THE BEST, I GUESS, TRACK FOR US TO, TO LEAD THIS ORGANIZATION. 
          OBVIOUSLY OUR GOALS ARE THE SAME AS HOUSING OF THE CITY, BUT, UH, I THINK OVER THE PAST COUPLE YEARS AS WE'VE HAD THIS CONVERSATION, THERE'S BEEN A LITTLE DIFFERENCE OF OPINION ON, ON VARIOUS ITEMS. AND SO I THINK, UM, YOU KNOW, AS A RESPONSE TO SOME OF THIS, AND, AND WE KNOW THAT HOUSING AND THE CITY IS, IS GONNA COME FORWARD WITH A NEW HOUSING POLICY AND OBVIOUSLY SPECIFICALLY A STATEMENT THAT WILL DEFINE PARAMETERS AS TO HOW THIS  CAN OPERATE. 
          UM, I THINK SOME OF THE BOARD MEMBERS EXPRESSED THE DESIRE JUST TO MAKE THEIR FEELINGS KNOWN ON THE MATTERS. 
          SINCE, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T DIRECTLY SUBMIT THINGS TO COUNCIL, WE WILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH HOW, SO THERE'S A DIFFERENCE OF OPINION. 
          WE, WE JUST THE BOARD'S THOUGHTS ON THIS TO BE AND HAVE THAT RECORDED OUT HERE PUBLICLY. 
          SO, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT'S REALLY IT. 
          O OBVIOUSLY THE BYLAWS NEEDED A BIT OF AN UPDATE JUST TO CLEAN UP SOME OF THESE THINGS REGARDING STAFFING, REGARDING, YOU KNOW, THE ATTORNEYS AND THE, UH, CONSULTANTS ROLE IN OUR ORGANIZATION. 
          UH, BUT OTHER THAN THAT, THE POLICY IS REALLY IS THE POLICY AND PROCEDURES, HOW, HOW YOU WANT THE CORPORATION TO OPERATE. 
          AND WHAT WERE THE GUARDRAILS BESIDES THE STATE GUARDRAILS THAT YOU NEED TO, UH, ABIDE BY HERE WITHIN. 
          OKAY. 
          AND YEAH, SO FROM MY OWN VANTAGE POINT, I'VE BEEN KIND OF HEARING ABOUT THESE PROGRAM STATEMENTS OR THE DESIRE FOR PROGRAM STATEMENTS, UH, CAME UP AND, YOU KNOW, IT'S, THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF DISCUSSION BETWEEN SIX STAFF COUNCIL PEOPLE AND OUR ORGANIZATION ABOUT WHAT THEY SHOULD CONTAIN. 
          BUT I THINK THERE'S BEEN A DESIRE FOR SOME FORM OF STRUCTURE, WHAT KIND OF DEALS WE'RE DOING, WHAT'S THE PROCESS OF PROVING THEM, UM, YOU KNOW, WITH THE DISCUSSIONS IT SEEMS, AND YOU KNOW, IT'S ALL GOOD, BUT THERE SEEMS TO BE KIND OF AN IMPASSE, UH, BETWEEN ORGANIZATION, UH, AND, YOU KNOW, STATE STAFF AND SOME ON COUNCIL ON JUST A FEW ITEMS AT THIS POINT. 
          NOW, UH, ONE OF THOSE RELATED TO THE GEOGRAPHIC EMPHASIS OF, IS PROBABLY THE BEST WAY TO PUT IT, WHERE THE PSC UH, DOESN'T PROJECTS AND WHERE THE AGENCY TRIES TO PUBLISH THEIR CONFIDENCE. 
          UM, TWO OTHERS ARE MORE GOVERNANCE ISSUES. 
          UH, ONE BEING, UH, THAT THE REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE CITY IS ACTUALLY AN EX OFFICIO BOARD MEMBER, UH, TO THE BOARD. 
          THE OTHER, AND I'M, I'M GONNA, I'M GONNA, UH, CREDIT FOR, I HAD A DISCUSSION WITH BEFORE HE DID A GOOD JOB SORT EXPLAINING THE CITY POINT OF VIEW, HOW THEY WERE KIND OF APPROACHING IT, WHAT INTENT. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, BEFORE WE KIND OF THOUGHT IT WAS A, UH, IT WAS APPROVAL OF FUNDS AND HOW OUR EXPENDITURES ARE, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S THE CITY STAFF'S ROLE, EXPENDING FUNDS. 
          UM, IT REALLY WASN'T REALLY A GRANULAR, HEY, IF, UH, WE HAD TO MAKE THIS PAYMENT, 
          [00:25:01]
THIS CONTRACTOR, THEY APPROVE IT AS SORT OF A STRATEGIC APPROVAL OF HOW OUR FUNDS ARE, YOU KNOW, HOW HOW WE SPENT IT FROM, YOU KNOW, WHERE WE MAKE THESE MONEY FROM DOING THESE DEALS. 
          UM, KIND OF MY HEAD HAS BEEN ALL OVER THE PLACE, BUT I SORT OF APPRECIATED, YOU KNOW, FORWARD WALKING ME THROUGH THE INTENTION. 
          UM, I STILL KIND OF DECIDED RECENTLY I STILL COULDN'T KIND OF BUY ON TO ADDING THE GEOGRAPHIC BOUNDARIES OR THE GEOGRAPHIC EMPHASIS FOR THE HFC. 
          I JUST COULDN'T GET ON BOARD WITH BECAUSE WHAT THE, UM, INTENT, OH, AND BY THE WAY, THE CITY STAFF ACTUALLY HAS A, THEIR OWN PROGRAM STATEMENTS THAT THEY'RE GETTING COURT COUNCIL. 
          IT'S GONNA GO FOR THE HOUSING AND COMMON SOLUTIONS COMMITTEE ON THE 26TH AND FULL COUNCIL ON THE 28TH. 
          AT THIS POINT I AM. 
          OKAY. 
          AND I MEAN, MY KIND OF VIEWPOINT IS, LOOK, LET'S LET COUNCIL JUST DECIDE IF THAT'S WHAT THEY WANNA DO. 
          NOW, WHAT THAT PROGRAM STATEMENT SAYS IS THAT WE'RE GONNA TRY, THERE'S NOT ANY RED LINES PER SE, THAT'S NOT WHAT'S HAPPENING. 
          BUT IT'S IN AREAS WHERE THE POVERTY LEVEL IS OVER 20%, THERE'S JUST GONNA BE EXTRA APPROVAL HURDLES FOR THE HFC TO, YOU KNOW, UH, CONNECT THEIR LIVE DEALS. 
          YOU KNOW, SO THAT'S USUALLY FINE WITH SOUTHERN SECTOR. 
          I THINK AS YOU KNOW, AND YOU HAD A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY OF ORGANIZATION, THAT'S TEND TENDS TO BE WHERE WE GET MOST OF OUR PROJECTS PRESENTED TO US BY DEVELOPERS. 
          RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          ON THE FLIP SIDE, WE'RE NOT THE PFC, I'M NOT HERE TO SOLVE THEIR PROBLEMS. UM, BUT THE PFC IS THOSE SAME HURDLES, THE SAME APPROVAL RATES. 
          WHAT'S THAT? IT'S THE INVERSE. 
          YEAH. 
          SO I THINK IT'S WITH GREATER EMPHASIS OF, UH, THE P GOING INTO THESE, UH, AREAS OF HIGHER POVERTY WHEN WE'RE PUTTING IN MIXED INCOME PROJECTS, WHICH OUR PROJECTS TEND TO BE ALMOST, YOU KNOW, 90 TO A HUNDRED PERCENT LOW INCOME PROJECTS, LINE TECH. 
          RIGHT. 
          WHEREAS THE PFC TENDS TO BE AN AMOUNT OF DONATION OF SOME LOW INCOME, SOME MIDDLE INCOME, AND THEN, YOU KNOW, UN RESTRICTED UNITS, WHICH IS GENERALLY CALLED WORKFORCE OR MIDDLE INCOME OR SO THEY WANNA PUT MORE WORKFORCE IN HIGHER POVERTY AREAS, MORE LIGHT TAKEN LOWER POVERTY AREAS. 
          HIGHER. 
          YEAH. 
          YEAH. 
          HIGHER WE COULD, YEAH. 
          YEAH. 
          , WE'LL GET TO THAT. 
          SO ON BOARD, I PROMISE YOU. 
          UM, WELL, THAT BEING SAID, THERE'S A LOT OF HISTORY. 
          THE CITY OF DALLAS HAS THAT MAYBE I DON'T EVEN REALLY COMPLETELY HAVE A FULL GRASP OF. 
          YOU DON'T, YOU DON'T. 
          NOW THAT BEING SAID, THERE ARE ONE, THERE'S THE THEORY OF CONCENTRATION OF POVERTY, JUST IN GENERAL, CONCENTRATION OF POVERTY. 
          WHAT DO THESE DEALS DO WHEN WE SIT, YOU KNOW, DEVELOP A LITECH DEAL IN THESE PROJECTS? DOES THIS ADD MORE? HOW DO YOU PUT IT MORE? DEFINITELY, YEAH. 
          DOES THIS ADD TO THE POVERTY LEVEL DETRIMENTAL TO THE, ESPECIALLY WHEN THERE'S NOT A DISPARITY BETWEEN THE 60% A MI RENTS AND THE MARKET. 
          CORRECT. 
          WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY CREATING ANY VALUE WE'RE LOSING. 
          CORRECT. 
          AND LOOK, THAT'S, I THINK ANYONE WOULD SAY THAT'S PROBABLY A DEBATABLE SUBJECT. 
          YOU KNOW, WHETHER THE STUDIES SHOW THAT THERE ARE ANY STUDIES THAT SAYS THESE PROJECTS DO THAT. 
          RIGHT. 
          HAVING SAID, THERE'S ALSO A LITTLE BIT OF A DIFFERENT HISTORY DALLAS HAS, WHICH THERE'S, WE'VE BEEN INVOLVED IN, WELL, ACTUALLY ONE COMPLAINT TO HUD, UM, WHICH WAS FILED ABOUT 15 YEARS AGO AS WELL, WHICH IT WAS RELATED TO A DEAL, UH, CALLED 1600 PACIFIC. 
          UM, IT WAS IN DOWNTOWN, WHICH THE DEVELOPER APPARENTLY, UH, WAS DENIED A SERIES OF FUNDINGS, UH, TIFF, CDGB LOANS, HISTORICAL TAX CREDIT. 
           WAS NOT A LIFETIME DEAL. 
          UH, THAT WAS NOT APPROVED. 
          IT WAS NOT LITECH, IT WAS ACTUALLY A MIXED INCOME PROJECT, UH, THAT WAS DENIED. 
          THE DEVELOPER MAINTAINED A HUD THAT ALL THESE PROJECTS GOT APPROVED BY THE CITY COUNCIL IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR OF DALLAS AND EURO, NORTHERN SECTOR DOWNTOWN, THE NORTHERN SECTOR, THAT DID NOT GET APPROVED. 
          AND SO THE ACCUSATION WAS MADE TO HUD, IT WAS MADE TO HUD, UM, THAT IT WAS DISCRIMINATORY AND IT WAS A CONCENTRATION OF PROPERTIES. 
          SO I THINK THE FUNDAMENTAL POINT THOUGH WAS IT WAS THE DENIAL OF THE DEAL. 
          AND LOOK, IF ANYONE WANTS TO CORRECT ME ABOUT THE HISTORY OF THIS, BY ALL MEANS, IT WAS THE DENIAL OF A DEAL THAT GOT THE CITY IN TROUBLE, NOT THE FULL SCALE APPROVAL OF DEALS THAT GOT THE CITY IN TROUBLE AS WELL. 
          NOW, THIS DID LEAD TO, UH, I BELIEVE WHAT WAS CALLED A VOLUNTARY COMPLIANCE AGREEMENT THAT, UM, THAT THE CITY ENTERED INTO WITH HUD LITERALLY, I THINK 10 YEARS AGO. 
          WHICH I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE CITY WAS SUPPOSED TO PROVIDE A 10 YEAR HOUSING AND POLICY. 
          THERE WERE CERTAIN REMEDIES. 
          UM, BUT THAT, I BELIEVE IS WHAT WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE SETTLED THE ISSUE WITH HUD IN THAT LEVEL. 
          THERE WAS ANOTHER SUIT THOUGH, THAT ACTUALLY WENT TO THE UNITED STATES TO SUPREME COURT. 
          NOW, TO MY UNDERSTANDING, THE CITY OF DALLAS WAS NOT A PARTY TO THAT SUIT. 
          THE ACTUAL PARTY TO THE SUIT WAS THE TEXAS DEPARTMENT HOUSING COMMUNITY AFFAIRS WAS SUED BY, I BELIEVE, RACHEL, WHAT WAS THE NAME OF THE ORGANIZATION? UM, IICP, I FORGET WHAT IT STANDS FOR, 
          [00:30:01]
WHICH IT WAS ACCUSING, UH, T-D-H-C-A OF AWARDING, UH, TAX CREDIT DEALS. 
          UH, AND, AND IT WASN'T ACTUALLY BASED ON INCOME, IT WAS BASED ON RACE, UH, WHICH SAID IT WAS PROVING, UH, TOO MANY TAX CREDIT DEALS IN AREAS THAT WERE PREDOMINANTLY AFRICAN AMERICAN WHILE DISAPPROVING DEALS THAT WERE IN PRIMARILY, UH, CAUCASIAN AREAS. 
          SO IT WAS ALSO THE DISAPPROVAL DEALS. 
          NOW, I THINK IT WAS COMMONLY UNDERSTOOD THAT IT WAS THE CITY OF DALLAS THAT WAS INVOLVED. 
          IF YOU READ THE SUIT, IT WAS ACTUALLY THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRE DALLAS METRO AREA. 
          SO CERTAIN INSTANCES IT WAS CITED AS CAP COMPELL, THAT DISAPPROVED DEAL, UH, THAT WAS A TAX CREDIT, I THINK ARLINGTON HEIGHTS AND A FEW OTHERS, UM, THAT DID GO TO SUPREME COURT. 
          AND I THINK A LIGHT DECISION IN 2015 WAS MADE THAT, YEAH, IT WAS UNINTENDED. 
          AND IT WAS ACTUALLY THROUGH THE QAP QUALIFIED OUT ALLOCATE, HOW DO YOU CALL IT? IT WAS THE T-D-H-C-Q-A-P, WHICH IS BASICALLY HOW THE TAX CREDITS ARE OVER FROM EVERY YEAR AS WELL. 
          IT'S THE STATE GUIDELINES, THE STATE GUIDELINES, ALL THAT. 
          AND THEN THAT KIND OF LED TO UNINTENDED CON LED TO THE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCE OF CONCENTRATED CONS. 
          YEAH, THEY SCORED BETTER BECAUSE OF CERTAIN CATEGORIES. 
          CORRECT. 
          HAPPEN TO BE, OKAY. 
          SO, SO I, I BELIEVE A LOT OF THE CONCENTRATION OF POVERTY CONCERNS AMONG THE CITY COUNCIL AND STAFF, SO IT'S NOT JUST STAFF, THE CITY COUNCIL, IS THESE ISSUES. 
          ONE, JUST THE OVERALL PHILOSOPHY OF CONCENTRATION OF POVERTY, SOCIAL, YOU KNOW, IMPACT OF IT. 
          AND THEN TWO, JUST INDUSTRY. 
          WE DON'T WANNA GET SUED, , WE DON'T WANNA HAVE ANY MORE DISTRESSED ISSUES WITH IT. 
          NOW, IS THAT PART OF OUR SCREENING CRITERIA WITH OUR APPLICATION? THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S WHAT SPECIFICALLY, JUST LIKE CENSUS TRACK DATA AREA? YEAH, I MEAN THEY, THEY'RE REQUIRED TO SUBMIT A FAIR HOUSING CHECKLIST AND BEFORE THEY GET A  FROM THE CITY, THEY HAVE TO GO AND HAVE STAFF REVIEW IT AND SAY, THIS AFFIRMATIVELY FURNISHED FOR HOUSING OR NO. 
          AND THAT'S A BIG FACTOR ON WHETHER OR NOT THE HOUSING DEPART SUPPORTS IT. 
          SO I PROMISE I'M GONNA STOP. 
          I'M GONNA HAND THIS OVER TO, UH, YOU TO COME OVER, UM, ANYWAYS, TO EXPLAIN A LOT OF THIS. 
          BUT, UM, SO YEAH, SO THAT, THAT'S A HISTORY OF IT. 
          THE PROGRAM STATEMENT, THE GEOGRAPHIC RED LINES BY SENDING THE HFC IN AREAS ARE MORE HIGH OPPORTUNITY. 
          THE ONE THING THAT I JUST COULDN'T GET AROUND ISSUING A PROGRAM STATEMENT, WHICH KIND OF E DEEMPHASIZES THESE AREAS, IS THAT MOST OF THESE HIGHER POVERTY AREAS ARE QUALIFY CENSUS TRUCKS, RIGHT THROUGH SECTION 42, THE TAX CODE. 
          AND THROUGH HUD LITECH DEVELOPERS ARE AWARDED A GREATER AMOUNT OF TAX CREDITS FOR DOING PROJECTS. 
          THEY ARE INCENTIVIZED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO GO INTO, THEY'RE CALLED, UH, I THINK HARD TO DEVELOP AREAS OR DIFFICULT TO DEVELOP AREAS. 
          SO THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITIES AND CITIES AND COUNTIES ARE ACTUALLY ENCOURAGED TO GO INTO THESE AREAS TO DO THESE DEALS. 
          MY CONCERN IS THAT THIS ACTUALLY BY THE DENIAL OF DEALS OR EXTRA HURDLES, AND I UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, THE FLOOR CAN KIND OF TALK THROUGH IT. 
          BUT HAVING THESE EXTRA HURDLES, I THINK IT EFFECT COULD GET US IN HOT WATER AGAIN WITH HUD BECAUSE IT IS USUALLY THE DISAPPROVAL OF DEALS THAT GET CITIES AND COUNTIES IN TROUBLE AS WELL. 
          AND THERE IS EMPHASIS ONTO DOING PROJECTS, LITECH PROJECTS. 
          AND ON PRACTICAL PURPOSES AS WELL, IT IS GONNA BE HARD FOR THE HSC OR THE PFC WITH ONLY THE TAX EXEMPTION TO DO PROJECTS IN THESE AREAS. 
          THE ONLY, THE DEALS THAT TYPICALLY WORK IN QUALIFIED CENSUS TRACKS ARE A FULL CT OF THE PROPERTY TAX EXEMPTION, TAX CREDITS AND TAXES AND BONDS. 
          THAT'S A PRACTICAL CONCERN AS WELL. 
          SO THERE'S THAT GOVERNANCE ISSUES. 
          THE EX OFFICIO BOARD MEMBER, IN ALL REALITY, THE LIAISON, WHICH THOR IS CURRENTLY THE LIAISON, THE LIAISON CAN COME TO THE MEETINGS, THEY CAN ACTUALLY PARTICIPATE LIKE A BOARD MEMBER. 
          THEY DON'T VOTE. 
          UM, THEY CAN PARTICIPATE IN, UH, AS A BOARD MEMBER THAT'S IN OUR BYLAWS. 
          AND I DON'T THINK THEY'VE ACTUALLY TAKEN THAT OUT THE BYLAWS EITHER. 
          SO THE EXOFFICIO WOULD HAVE ONE ADDITIONAL RIGHT TO IT. 
          AND THAT IS TO ATTEND OUR EXECUTIVE SESSIONS. 
          NOW, I THINK THE INTENTION IS NOT IF WE'RE TALKING ABOUT UNEMPLOYMENT OR TALKING ABOUT IF WE'RE GONNA INCREASE OR DECREASE OUR SALARY, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, , YOU KNOW, THAT'S NOT THE INTENTION. 
          I THINK THE INTENTION, UM, IS IF THERE'S A TROUBLED SITUATION OR PROPERTY RELATED ISSUES WHERE WE HAVE TO GO INTO, UH, EXECUTIVE SESSION TO DISCUSS IT, UH, THE REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE CITY SAID ON THE EXECUTIVE SESSION, WHILE WE GET LEGAL ADVICE FROM OUR, UH, JUDGE, FROM OUR, UH, OUTSIDE COUNSEL. 
          NOW, IN ALL FAIRNESS, THERE WAS A PROJECT THAT PFC WAS INVOLVED WITH THAT WAS DISTRESSED IN TROUBLE THAT ACTUALLY HAD A PRETTY PROFOUND IMPACT ON THE CITY STAFF. 
          I THINK THAT'S THE INTENTION. 
          [00:35:01]
AND I DON'T THINK IT'S REALLY, UH, I DON'T THINK IT'S ANY ILL INTENT. 
          I UNDERSTAND THE REASON, THE ISSUE I HAVE IS IF WE DO HAVE A PROPERTY RELATED ISSUE, TYPICALLY IT'S GOING TO INVOLVE, UH, MAYBE AN ADVERSE RELATIONSHIP OR ADVERSE SITUATION TO THE CITY ITSELF. 
          WE ARE NOT THE CITY. 
          WE ARE A CORPORATION. 
          AND IF WE ARE AN INDEPENDENT CORPORATION, WE'RE NOT THE CITY AS WELL. 
          CASE IN POINT, OUR STROLLING PROPERTY, I'VE ATTENDED A MEETING, UH, IT'S A TROUBLE SITUATION. 
          YOU KNOW, IT HAS A SPECIAL CRIME BASEMENT PROGRAM. 
          I'M ATTENDING MEETINGS WITH DPD, FIRE PERMITTING AND ZONING AND CITY ATTORNEYS AND SO FORTH. 
          AND MY FEELING AFTER HAVING ATTENDED THAT MEETING, IF I HAVE TO GO INTO AN EXECUTIVE SESSION, UH, WITH MY, YOU KNOW, WITH CHAPMAN TO GET ADVICE ON THIS, YOU KNOW, A SITUATION LIKE THAT, I CANNOT HAVE SOMEONE EMPLOYED BY THE CITY MANAGER LISTENING INTO OUR LEGAL ADVICE. 
          'CAUSE ONE THAT IS GOING TO, UH, CREATE CONFLICT BECAUSE ARE THEY REPRESENTING THE CITY'S INTEREST OR ARE THEY REPRESENTING THE STATE CITY'S INTEREST? AND THAT ACTUALLY PUTS THE CITY OFFICIAL IN, OR THE C UH, EXOFFICIO AT A VERY BAD POSITION, PARTICULARLY IF IT'S A HIGH PROFILE SITUATION AS WELL, WHICH THE PFC DEAL IS A VERY HIGH PROFILE SITUATION. 
          IT WILL TEST THEIR LOYALTIES. 
          AND THAT IS JUST NOT GOOD FOR THE HC AND IT'S NOT GOOD FOR THE STATE STAFFER. 
          UM, THE OTHER IS THE APPROVAL OF FUNDS. 
          UM, AGAIN, LOOK, STATE LAW SAYS ALL POWERS OF, UH, ALL POWERS OF THE, YOU KNOW, OF HSC MUST REST WITH THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS. 
          I MEAN, WE ARE THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA GOVERNANCE OF THE HSC. 
          NO OTHER, I JUST CAN'T GET PAST THE SAFE STAFF. 
          NO SAFE STAFF ARE GONNA REALLY HAVE INFLUENCE OVER, UH, HOW, YOU KNOW, WE'RE, UH, DEPLOYING, UH, THE FUNDS THAT WE HAVE. 
          IF THE CITY COUNCIL DOES NOT LIKE WHAT WE'RE DOING, REPLACE THE BOARD. 
          THAT IS HOW HOUSING AUTHORITY IS, UH, MANAGED THROUGHOUT THE STATE. 
          THAT IS HOW PSC IS MANAGED THROUGHOUT THE STATE AS HOUSING, HOUSING, FINANCE, CORPORATIONS MANAGED THROUGHOUT THE STATE. 
          SO THOSE THREE ITEMS ARE ONES THAT WE JUST SIMPLY HAVE A FUNDAMENTAL DIFFERENCE THAT WE'RE NOT OKAY, GET PAST, AT LEAST FOR ME AS ONE INDIVIDUAL BOARD. 
          THAT'S JUST WHY I'M EXPLAINING TO YOU. 
          SO YOU ALL CAN KIND OF FORM YOUR OWN OPINIONS ON THIS. 
          OKAY, SO WITH THAT, NOW YOU'RE ALSO MAKING SOME CHANGES TO THE BYLAWS. 
          SOME OF IT INVOLVES THE CITY ATTORNEY AS WELL. 
          SO I JUST WANT TO KIND OF TALK THROUGH THAT. 
          I THINK NO, NO, NO. 
          HOLD ON. 
          LET JUST, LET'S GET THROUGH IT. 
          SO THE CITY ATTORNEY, UH, THEY ARE IN OUR BYLAWS, SUPPOSED TO PROVIDE GENERAL COUNSEL SERVICES, RIGHT? ONE OF THE OTHER FEATURES WAS THAT THEY COULD APPROVE OR DENY OUR SELECTION OF OUTSIDE COUNSEL AS WELL. 
          THAT WAS A CLEAR VIOLATION OF STATE LAW IN MY OPINION. 
          AND THAT HAD TO BE REMOVED AS WELL. 
          THE OTHER, THIS IS OUR SEPARATE PROVISION THAT ALLOWS US TO HIRE SPECIALIZED CONTRACTORS WITH THE APPROVAL, IF IT'S LEGAL, IF IT'S LEGAL SERVICE, IT HAS TO BE APPROVED BY THE CITY ATTORNEY BILL. 
          WE HADES. 
          YEAH, WE HAD TO REMOVE THAT. 
          UH, THE OTHER ON SOME OF THESE GOVERNANCE ISSUES, WE ASKED THE CITY ATTORNEY, MS. TAMMY PALOMINO, UH, TO OP UPON ON, ON THE ISSUE. 
          SHE DECLINED TO OPINE ON THE ISSUE BECAUSE SHE SAID IF THERE'S AN ISSUE WHERE THERE'S A CONFLICT BETWEEN THE HSCA PEN POTENTIAL CONFLICT WITH THE HSC AND THE CITY, THAT THAT ACTUALLY PREVENTS THEM FROM WEIGHING IT ON IT SIDE OR THEY CAN STILL REPRESENT THE CITY. 
          MY INTERPRETATION WAS EITHER SIDE BECAUSE THEN, THEN THEY WOULD BE, UH, THEY WOULD BE VALUING CLIENTS. 
          THEY WOULD BE VALUING THEIR CLIENTS OR PRIORITIZING THEM. 
          ATTORNEYS DON'T DO THAT, ALTHOUGH THE STATE ATTORNEY MAY HAVE A DIFFERENT OPINION ON THIS. 
          WITH THAT, WE DO WANT THEM ADVISING US ON TOMA AND ROBERT RULES OF ORDER. 
          THAT'S STILL STAYING IN. 
          WE VERY MUCH VALUE HANNAH AND WHAT SHE PROVIDES TO, YEAH, THERE YOU GO. 
          UH, TO THE ORGANIZATION. 
          BUT WE ARE GONNA REMOVE THEM AS HER GENERAL COUNSEL. 
          SO THE CONFLICT, IF THERE IS A CONFLICT BETWEEN HSC AND CITY, THEN YOU KNOW, THEY ARE NOT CONFLICTED AND THEY CAN ADVISE CITY COUNCIL AND STAFF WITHOUT THAT LEVEL OF SHEPHERD. 
          SO WITH THAT, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DOING AS THE HISTORY AS I KNOW IT. 
          SO I'M GONNA INVITE THOR AND MR. ARMSTRONG, UH, IF YOU'D LIKE. 
          WELL, THOR'S ACTUALLY THE LATEST LIAISON IF YOU WANT TO COME UP AND SORT OF DESCRIBE THE PROGRAM STATEMENTS AS YOU'RE PROPOSING THE COUNCIL BY ALL MEANS COME UP SO I CAN SHUT UP. 
          AND HE'S LIKE, HI EVERYONE. 
          ERICKSON DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF HOUSING COMMUNITY EMPOWERMENT, MR. HAVING ME. 
          UM, WHAT'S ARTICULATED IS, UH, PRETTY MUCH ACCURATE, RIGHT? UM, ABOUT A YEAR OR SO AGO, WELL FURTHER BACK THAN THAT, CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS HAVE HAD 
          [00:40:01]
QUESTIONS ABOUT EVERY PROJECT THAT HAVE COME UP AND A DESIRE TO UNDERSTAND THE PORTFOLIO. 
          NOT JUST HSC AND PFC, BUT THE DEVELOPMENT PROJECTS THAT THE PREVIOUS HOUSING DEPARTMENT DID. 
          ALL THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PROJECTS. 
          BECAUSE WHEN ONE PROJECT IS PRESENTED, IT'S JUST THAT PROJECT MASS DOESN'T COME WITH THE WHOLE HISTORY, THE WHOLE UNDERSTANDING OF THAT PLACE. 
          AND SO THERE'S BEEN A DESIRE FROM COUNCIL JUST TO UNDERSTAND THAT THEIR YES VOTE OR NO VOTE MIGHT MEAN HOLISTIC. 
          'CAUSE THAT ONE PROJECT THAT MIGHT BE REQUESTING A WAIVER OR BEING IN A HIGH POVERTY AREA, MAYBE ONE OF FIVE OTHER DEALS, THEY IMPROVE THAT YEAR, BUT THEY DON'T HAVE ANY WAY TO UNDERSTAND THAT. 
          MAYBE BE HOLISTICALLY. 
          'CAUSE THEY'RE ONLY LOOKING AT A DEAL IN FRONT OF THEM. 
          SO THE IDEA OVER TIME THAT THE CORPORATIONS WOULD BE SUCCESSFUL, AND IT'S AWESOME THAT YOU ARE RIGHT, WAS TO HIRE STAFF AND THEN THE DIVISION OF LABOR BETWEEN CORPORATION STAFF AND CITY STAFF WOULD BE SPECIFIED. 
          SO THAT WAY THE STAFF THAT ARE APPOINTED TO REVIEW FROM A FAIR HOUSING STANDPOINT AND HELP MOVE PROJECTS TO AN AGENDA TO GET THEM APPROVED IS CLEAR AND OVER THE GROWTH PERIOD, NONE OF THAT'S BEEN WRITTEN DOWN. 
          IT'S BEEN PRACTICED, WHICH IS WHY THIS CONVERSATION STARTED WITH WE GOTTA UPDATE THE BYLAWS SO THAT WE'RE ALL ON THE SAME PAGE ABOUT WHAT WE DO. 
          AND THAT TURNED INTO, WELL MAYBE IT'S MORE THAN BYLAWS. 
          MAYBE WE NEED TO PROVIDE A WRITTEN DOCUMENT THAT COUNCIL SAYS, HERE'S WHAT WE WANT THE CORPORATION TO DO. 
          AND SO STAFF WORK ON PROGRAM STATEMENTS, THAT IS A, A POLICY GUIDANCE THAT INVOLVES SO MANY DIFFERENT MENTS, RIGHT? ALL THE COUNCIL MEMBERS PLUS THE MAYOR, ALL THE ADVOCATES PLUS THE CORPORATION BOARDS PLUS OUR ATTORNEY FEEDBACK AND CITY STAFF THOUGHT, RIGHT? HAVE TO BE CONDENSED INTO SOMETHING THAT PROVIDES GUIDANCE ON HOW TO OPERATE THOSE PROGRAM STATEMENTS. 
          BECOME THE, THE GENERAL FACTS. 
          AND THEN WHOEVER'S GONNA IMPLEMENT IT HAS TO CREATE THEIR POLICIES AND PROCEDURES. 
          YOU ACTUALLY GONNA DO IT. 
          WHAT DO YOU SCREEN FOR FOR CONCENTRATION OF POVERTY? WHEN DO YOU HAVE A FAIR HOUSING CHECKLIST? WHEN DO YOU HAVE AN ENVIRONMENTAL REVIEW DONE? WHEN DO YOU SEEK, YOU KNOW, THIS TYPE OF FUNDING EQUIPMENT? LIKE ALL THOSE, LIKE HOW DO YOU PROCEDURALLY GO ABOUT IT? SO OUR PROGRAM STATEMENTS ARE DRAFTED IN A WAY THAT TRIES TO CAPTURE THE ESSENCE OF WHAT CORPORATION STAFF VERSUS CITY STAFF DOES, AND THEN PROVIDE GUIDANCE ON WHAT THE APPLICATION CRITERIA SHOULD HAVE FOR THE CORPORATION THAT IS BASED UPON WHAT COUNCIL WANTS TO SEE THE CORPORATIONS DO. 
          AND FUNDAMENTALLY, I THINK THAT THE THREE POINTS THAT YOU'VE ARTICULATED DAVID, ARE, ARE ACCURATE. 
          WE NEED TO HAVE COUNCIL DETERMINE WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE IN PRIORITY PROJECTS. 
          THE FUNDAMENTAL BY RIGHT PROJECT RIGHT NOW FROM AN HFC STANDPOINT WOULD BE IN A HIGH OPPORTUNITY AREA. 
          AND IF THAT PROJECT IS GONNA RE GONNA ASK FOR A WAIVER, RIGHT? IT'S IN A HIGH POVERTY AREA, IT'S GOING TO NEED A WAIVER FOR THE QAP. 
          IT'S UM, YOU KNOW, WITHIN CLOSE PROXIMITY TO ANOTHER ONE, UH, IT HAS SOME OTHER ASPECTS THAT, YOU KNOW, A WAIVER COULD BE APPROVED IF COUNCIL APPROVES IT. 
          BUT THOSE WAIVERS ARE, ARE GONNA REQUIRE THE SUPER MAJORITY OF COUNCIL TO GET SO THAT THEY CAN UNDERSTAND THE WEIGHT OF APPROVING THAT ITEM FROM THAT STANDPOINT. 
          SO THAT THAT'S WHAT'S BEING PUT FORWARD. 
          SO IT DOESN'T SAY YOU CAN'T ASK FOR THE WAIVERS, IT JUST SAYS WHEN YOU DO, YOU'LL HAVE TO HAVE THAT SUPER MAJORITY. 
          IF THAT PROJECT IS ALREADY IN THESE AREAS, UM, IT'S THE LOW POVERTY AREA, RIGHT? LET'S MOVE IT FORWARD, RIGHT? IT'S, IT HAS THE GENERAL SUPPORT AND WE HAVE INVERSE ON SOME OF THE, THE POC LANGUAGE AS WELL, THE USE OF REVENUE. 
          UH, YOU'RE RIGHT, THERE'S A LOT OF STATE GUIDANCE ON HOW THIS IS SET UP. 
          AND WE HAVE A CITY COUNCIL THAT LIKES TO HAVE MORE AWARENESS AND UNDERSTANDING. 
          SO THE WAY WE WROTE THE USE OF REVENUE SECTION IS AROUND BRINGING FORWARD A PLAN TO HOUSING COMMITTEE YEARLY THAT SAYS HERE'S THE PLAN FOR THE YEAR THAT THE BOARD HAS WORKED ON. 
          AND THAT IN COOPERATION WITH CITY DEPARTMENTS PROBABLY HOW'S THE COMMUNITY EMPOWERMENT RIGHT NOW? WE WOULD SAY, YEAH, THAT FITS THE HOUSING PRIORITIES RIGHT NOW BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT FROM CITY COUNCIL, IF WE PUT TOGETHER THIS PLAN AND PRESENT THAT TO HOUSING COMMITTEE, THEN YOU'RE GONNA PROBABLY RECEIVE, UH, GOOD SUPPORT FROM IF YOU, IF YOU DO THIS, IT IT IS GONNA BE HARD OR BAD, RIGHT? AND SO IT'S IN CONSULTATION WITH OUR, WITH OUR OFFICE. 
          SO THAT WAY THE USE OF FUNDS ON A YEARLY BASIS ARE UNDERSTOOD BY COUNCIL. 
          AND AGAIN, YOU ALL HAVE YOUR CITY COUNCIL APPOINTEES THAT YOU SHOULD BE TALKING TO, TO SAY, HERE'S WHAT WE'RE THINKING, THAT THEY'RE FEEDBACK IN TERMS OF HOW ALL THIS WORKS. 
          THE PROGRAM STATEMENTS LAY OUT THAT RESPONSIBILITY TO SAY, YOU KNOW, PROJECTS COME FORWARD. 
          MAKE SURE YOU'RE TALKING TO YOUR COUNCIL MEMBER. 
          MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE RISK COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT OR IF THEY WANT MORE, MAKE SURE THAT YOU'RE ADVOCATING FOR THAT ON YOUR 
          [00:45:01]
PROJECT. 
          SO, 'CAUSE YOU ARE THE REPRESENTATIVES FROM THE DIFFERENT COUNCIL DISTRICTS. 
          AND SO THE, THE STATEMENTS SORT OF LAY OUT AND ARTICULATE HOW ALL THAT SHOULD WORK, SO THAT WAY WE KNOW WHAT AARON'S STAFF IS DOING, YOU KNOW, WHAT MY STAFF IS DOING, AND FUNDAMENTALLY IF IT WORKS OR DOESN'T WORK, WE HAVE A MECHANISM TO BRING IT BACK FOR AMENDMENTS AND TWEAKS. 
          BECAUSE THE IDEA HERE IS TO WRITE DOWN OUR COMPLIANCE FUNCTIONS POINT OF VIEW IN TERMS OF LIKE SITTING ON THE BOARD IN DIFFERENT CAPACITIES. 
          WE GOT A, I'M NOT, I CAN'T SPEAK ABOUT LEGAL DEFINITIONS OR LEGAL OPINIONS ON THAT. 
          UH, THERE'S THE DESIRE TO HEAR THE EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE ON PROBLEMATIC DEALS. 
          THERE'S ABILITY TO RECUSE, UH, OTHER, OTHER AVENUES. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, IN ORDER TO HAVE THAT HAPPEN, CITY STAFF SIT ON OTHER COMMUNITY BOARDS OR UH, UH, YOU KNOW, AS EX OFFICIO, UH, IN THE CITY OF DALLAS. 
          AND SO THERE'S BEEN WAYS TO, TO NAVIGATE AND MANAGE THOSE SITUATIONS. 
          UH, SO AGAIN, WE'LL LEAVE THAT UP TO COUNCIL CONSIDERATION IN TERMS OF GENERALLY DO THESE PROGRAM STATEMENTS CARVE OUT WHAT YOU AS A BODY WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE HSC LATER ON? UH, OR DO THEY NOT? AND I BELIEVE THAT WE TRY TO CRAFT IT IN A WAY THAT CAPTURES MANY DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES ON THE ISSUES AND, AND THERE'S STILL MORE CONVERSATIONS TO BE HAD AND UNDERSTANDING OF HOW IT MIGHT IMPACT OR THE PERCEIVED IMPACT OF THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY CONTINUE TO INVEST IN, IN THE CITY. 
          BECAUSE THAT'S NOT THE INTENTION. 
          THE INTENTION IS TO HELP MAKE SURE THAT WHEN PROJECTS COME FORWARD, THEY'RE GOOD FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS AND THE DEVELOPER, BUT THEY'RE GOOD FOR THE CITY OF DALLAS AND THE RESIDENTS THAT THEY SERVE AND THOSE COMMUNITIES THAT THEY'RE GONNA BE PLACED IN. 
          BECAUSE WE'RE IN A CITY SHAPING BUSINESS, WE'RE IN A HOUSING BUSINESS AND WE ALL COLLECTIVELY NEED TO THINK ABOUT THE HISTORY, THINK ABOUT THE CURRENT, THINK ABOUT THE FUTURE OF EVERYTHING THAT WE DO, UH, FOR OUR RESIDENTS IN OUR CITY. 
          IS THAT HELPFUL? GREAT. 
          OKAY. 
          IF I COULD GO BACK WITH REGARD TO ONE OR TWO THINGS THAT YOU SAID. 
          SO AS IT RELATES TO YOU ALL'S THOUGHT ON THE POOL OF REVENUE SUGGESTED THAT IF WE GET AT THE ON OF THE YEAR, KIND OF HAVE AN AGREEMENT AS TO WHAT THE FOCUS THAT MAKES IT LITTLE EASIER OR SOMEHOW THERE WAS SOME, OKAY, WE HAVE ALIGNMENT, BUT THAT ALSO SAYS LITTLE, THERE'S POSSIBILITY THAT YOU'RE NOT ALIGNED PRIORITY. 
          AND SO THEN YOU SUGGESTED YOU USE THE WORD IMPROVEMENT SOMEWHERE AND IT FEELS LIKE THERE'S A LOT OF DELINEATION WHERE I DON'T BELIEVE THE CITY HAS THE ABILITY TO APPROVE THE USE OF THE REVENUES OF THE . 
          AM I CORRECT? SO YEAH, CITY'S NOT APPROVING YOUR EXPENDITURES, RIGHT? CITY COUNCIL'S GIVING YOU DIRECTION ULTIMATELY THROUGH THE PROGRAM STATEMENT ON WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE THE SURPLUS REVENUE TO BE USED FOR THE WAY IT'S CRAFTED RIGHT NOW. 
          IT'S CRAFTED TO SUPPORT PROJECTS THAT YOU MIGHT BE SUPPORTING THAT NEED GAP FINANCING OR THE ABILITY TO INVEST IN THE DALLAS HOUSING OPPORTUNITY, UM, TO CONTINUE TO SUPPORT ADMINISTRATION. 
          UM, RIGHT? SO IT COVERS THE FUNDAMENTAL AND THEY'VE LISTED EVERYTHING THAT WE PROBABLY WANT. 
          AND YOU'RE NOT GONNA DICTATE THE PROPORTIONS, RIGHT? JUST WE HAVE FREE REIGN WITHIN THIS. 
          AND THAT'S, THAT'S THE GOAL, RIGHT? SO THEN CITY COUNCIL THEN IS PROVIDING THE GUIDANCE ABOUT USE OF REVENUE STATEMENTS AND THEN MAYBE A MODIFIED PLAN. 
          AND SO THROUGH THE QUARTERLY REPORTS THAT GET UPDATED, YOU SAY, HERE'S THE PROJECTS, HERE'S THE COOL THINGS THAT WE'VE DONE WITH OUR EXCESS REVENUE. 
          WE CONTINUE TO PRESERVE AND PRODUCE HOUSING IN THIS WAY. 
          AND IT CONTINUES TO BE THAT POSITIVE NARRATIVE ABOUT THE IMPACT THAT THE CORPORATION MAKES AND SHOW HOW IT'S FULFILLING THE VISION OF DIFFERENT COUNCIL PERSPECTIVES OR MAYBE ADDRESS A HOUSING PRIORITY THAT EXISTS THAT CITY CAN'T GET TO OR NEEDS A, A SPECIAL TYPE OF FUNDING SOURCE TO BE ABLE TO ACHIEVE, RIGHT? THOSE PROJECTS THAT NEED, UM, UH, CAPITAL THAT'S UNIQUE, RIGHT? AND SO WE CAN COLLECTIVELY SHARE HOW THAT COULD WORK. 
          WE BRAINSTORM LIKE ALL THE POSSIBLE THINGS THAT WE, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE THINGS ON THE LIST THAT, THAT WE CAN, I'M JUST, JUST WONDERING OH, OKAY. 
          HOW THAT PLAYS OUT BECAUSE YEAH, BECAUSE WE'RE NOT TRYING TO SAY, LET ME LOOK AT YOUR TRANSACTIONS AND SAY THIS ONE'S FIXED. 
          WE'RE NOT PROVIDING THAT LEVEL OF OVERSIGHT AGAINST THIS. 
          THAT, THAT IS THE ATION THE VISION IS ONE THAT, AND IF YOU LISTEN TO ANY OF THE CONVERSATIONS WITH COUNSEL, THE CONVERSATION OF WHAT ARE THEY DOING WITH ALL THAT MONEY COMES UP TIME AND TIME AGAIN. 
          AND SO WE HAVE TO PUT OUT A STATEMENT THAT SAYS HERE'S A WAY TO MANAGE THAT AND THE EXPECTATIONS AROUND. 
          SURE. 
          LET'S JUST KEEP IN MIND THE PROGRAM STATEMENT IS THE HC PROGRAM STATEMENT THAT STAFF HAS PRODUCED OR HAS A SEPARATE PROGRAM STATEMENT FOR THE AGENCY THAT  COUNCIL. 
          YOU CAN SEE THE LAST DRAFT AND 
          [00:50:01]
AND THIS WEEK I WANT TO HEAR YOUR THOUGHTS ON SOME THINGS. 
          AGAIN, VALUE CONVERSATION, UH, TALKING TO SOME OTHER FOLKS. 
          AND THEN THERE WILL BE A VERSION OF IT THAT COMES OUT, UM, YOU KNOW, WITH, UH, THE, THE NEXT HOUSING AND HOMELESSNESS SOLUTIONS COMMITTEES, UH, PACKET SO THAT WE CAN CONTINUE TO HAVE A CONVERSATION, RIGHT? AND THAT THE POINT OF THAT NEXT BRIEFING ON JANUARY 26TH IS TO CONTINUE THE CONVERSATIONS. 
          ONE OF THE COOL THINGS ALSO COMING OUT FRIDAY, MONDAY, AND AARON'S GONNA PARTNER WITH US IS WE WE'RE PRODUCING HFC AND PFC 1 0 1 VIDEOS THAT KIND OF LAY OUT FUNDAMENTALLY HERE'S THE INTENT OF THE CORPORATION HERE, WHAT THEY DO, HERE'S HOW THEY WORK. 
          AND SO WE HAVE THESE EDUCATIONAL VIDEOS COMING OUT SO THAT WE AND ENCOURAGE COUNCIL AND PEOPLE TO WATCH, TO UNDERSTAND COMPLEXITIES, SIMPLIFIED OF THE CORPORATION SO THAT WE CAN GET INTO THE DISCUSSION IN TERMS OF LEVEL OF PROPERTY AND ASSISTANCE, TRACK AND  AND USING REVENUE IS THE THREE PRIMARY THINGS TO DISCUSS IN THE NEXT. 
          AND I THINK THAT'S A USEFUL TOOL. 
          'CAUSE WE HAVE ALSO SOME OPEN SPOTS ON HC HAVE THESE DIRECTORS COME IN THAT CAN HELP GET THEM UP TO SPEED BECAUSE THEY KNOW IT TAKES A LITTLE WHILE. 
          WHAT IS THAT? IT TAKES A LITTLE WHILE TO PROCESS. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S THE PROBLEM. 
          THAT THAT'S WHY IT'S TAKEN. 
          SO HAVE THIS CONVERSATION BECAUSE I MEAN, YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN ON THE BOARD, SAY CLIFF, YOU KNOW, IS OUR NEWEST MEMBER. 
          YOU GUYS HAVE BEEN ON BOARD FOR SEVERAL YEARS. 
          I THINK IT'S PROBABLY TAKEN MULTIPLE YEARS AND FIGURE OUT WHAT'S GOING ON. 
          I REMEMBER WHEN TONY TOOK MY SPOT. 
          I MEAN, IT TOOK A FEW CONVERSATIONS, RIGHT? AND TONY'S AN EXPERT ALREADY IN THE FIELD. 
          THAT'S THE THING WHEN WE BRING THIS KIND OF POLICY STUFF TO COUNCIL, THAT THAT YOU GET OVERWHELMED AND OVERWHELMING. 
          WELL THAT'S, AND IT'S LIKE YOU JUST THROW IT AT 'EM AND IT'S LIKE, ALL RIGHT, WHAT ARE THESE LITTLE NUANCES THAT, YOU KNOW, MAYBE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES. 
          AND I THINK THAT'S KIND OF THE GENERAL FEELING ON THE BOARD. 
          IT'S LIKE WE DON'T WANT TO TIGHTEN THE GRIP TOO MUCH AND, AND HAVE SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, REALLY BE A, WHEN WE HIRE RYAN GARCIA TO DO THE VIDEO, I FEEL LIKE HE'S, HE'S THE GUY , SO THE BORDER, I KNOW THAT'S WHY WE USE THE OUTSIDE CONTRACT. 
          AND THIS VIDEO IS LIKE AS A PRESENTATION FORMAT. 
          THERE'S A Q AND A SECTION WITH AARON'S THE STAR, UM, , SOME FUNDAMENTAL SHOWS, THE PORTFOLIO. 
          IT'S, IT'S PRETTY, PRETTY, UH, SIMPLISTIC IN ITS ATTENTION, BUT IT'S JUST A LEVEL SET. 
          UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN PLCS AND FEATURES. 
          AND THAT'S THE THING, LIKE EVERYTHING WE DO, WE HAVE TO GET . 
          SO WE, WE NEED TO BE PRETTY WELL IN STEP LIKE ME, JACKIE, WE TALKING WITH JASMINE  PRETTY MUCH EVERY DAY BECAUSE WE'RE TRYING TO PREP THESE THINGS TO GO TO CITY COUNCIL AND THAT'S THE ROLE TO GET IT RIGHT AND THEN TO MAKE SURE THAT COUNCIL IS ALL RIGHT, EVERYTHING. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, EVEN THOUGH WE'RE SEPARATE, WE'RE, WE'RE TRYING TO MOVE AND STEP IN BECAUSE, AND THAT'S WHAT OUR PROGRAM STATEMENT IS INTENDED. 
          ALTHOUGH WE DON'T HAVE THE GEOGRAPHICAL CONCENTRATIONS EMPHASIS AS THE C PROGRAM STATEMENT. 
          IT IS, IT'S MORE OF A PROCESS OF HOW WE GO ABOUT A DEAL, MAKING SURE COUNCIL PEOPLE AND UH, YOU KNOW, PRESENTED WITH THE PROJECT, UM, BY THE DEVELOPER OURSELVES. 
          IT'S LIKE IT'S INTENDED TO SHOW THAT WE ARE NOT TRYING TO GO OUT A LOCKSTEP OUTSIDE VISION OF THE CITY COUNCIL BECAUSE EVEN THOUGH WE'RE AN INDEPENDENT CORPORATION, THEY ARE OUR BOSSES  YOU, YOU MENTIONED SOMETHING I THINK IS REALLY IMPORTANT. 
          THE QAP LISTS GENERAL REQUIREMENTS, RIGHT? AND THE INVESTMENT AREAS. 
          AND THAT'S ALL VERY TRUE. 
          UM, AND YOU HAVE TO APPLY IT TO A LOCAL COMMUNITY, RIGHT? AND, AND WHEN THOSE LOCAL COMMUNITIES, YOU WANT TO DO IT IN THAT AREA, BUT YOU NEED A WAIVER TO DO IT, RIGHT? THAT'S WHERE, THAT'S WHERE THE WORRY COMES IN IS BECAUSE IF THERE'S A, THERE'S ENOUGH OF THOSE PROJECTS OVER TIME THAT ALL NEED A WAIVER IN AREAS THAT STARTS TO FORM A PATTERN, RIGHT? AND SO LOOKING AT THE WHOLE PORTFOLIO IS, IS WHAT'S IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S ONE EVERY 10 DEALS. 
          YOU KNOW, I'M NOT MAKING A NUMBER UP, BUT THE IDEA THAT YOU HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT PROJECT HAS TO HAVE SPECIAL CONSIDERATION TO DO IT IN THIS AREA IN ORDER TO GET THE INVESTMENT. 
          'CAUSE IT, IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE THERE 'CAUSE OF THE WHOLE CENSUS TRACKER. 
          IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE THERE BECAUSE IT'S GONNA BE A CATALOG PROJECT OR IT'S SUPPOSED TO JUMPSTART. 
          UM, WE JUST HAVE TO BE THOUGHTFUL ABOUT ALL OF THAT. 
          AND SO THE ALIGNMENT WITH THE QAP IS WHERE WE'RE GOING GENERALLY FOR THE HOUSING TAX CREDIT APPLICATION PROCESS BECAUSE IT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE. 
          UM, BUT WE, WE ARE STILL LEAVING IN THE 20% POVERTY RATE THRESHOLD BECAUSE THAT IS A CARRYOVER FROM OUR LAST POLICIES AND HOUSING TO SCREAM FOR. 
          AND WHILE THE, COULD YOU SAY 40% POVERTY IS WHERE YOU REALLY NEED TO START PAYING ATTENTION, A LOT OF OUR NEIGHBORHOODS BEEN 20%, 30, 40% POVERTY FOR DECADES. 
          AND ALL THE INVESTMENTS THAT'S BEEN MADE IN PREVIOUS PROJECTS HAVE NOT CHANGED THAT COURSE. 
          SO 
          [00:55:01]
YOU HAVE TO ASK WHY WOULD THIS PROJECT BE ANY DIFFERENT OR ARE YOU JUST GONNA CONTINUE TO INVEST IN AREAS THAT HAVEN'T SEEN A HOUSING ALONE PROJECT IS OBVIOUSLY NOT GONNA GONNA BE, IT'S A WHOLE ECONOMIC PHILOSOPHY AND OTHER UNDERSTANDING OF INVESTMENT. 
          AND SO THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S REALLY WHERE THE CONVERSATION IS AT, IS JUST REALLY UNDERSTANDING MORE ABOUT YOU NEED EVERY HOUSING UNIT WE COULD POSSIBLY GET IN THE CITY OF DALLAS. 
          WE NEED AS MANY OF THEM AT LESS THAN 50% HIGH AS WE CAN GET IF WE HAVE TO TRADE OFF OF WHERE THEY ARE BECAUSE THAT'S, UH, A VERY LOW INCOME CENSUS TRACK. 
          AND WE HAVE TO BE THINKING ABOUT, WELL WHAT ELSE CAN WE BE DOING TO SUPPORT THAT NEIGHBORHOOD IN ADDITION TO JUST A HOUSING DEVELOPMENT? RIGHT? AND 'CAUSE WE'RE NOT GONNA UPLIFT FOLKS, WE'RE NOT GONNA CHANGE THE COURSE OF AREAS AND WE'RE NOT TRYING TO GENTRIFY OVERNIGHT AT THE SAME TIME AND DISPLACE. 
          AND SO IT'S, IT'S UNDERSTANDING THE HISTORY, UNDERSTANDING THOSE LOCAL CENSUS TRACTS AND UNDERSTANDING THE GOALS OF INVESTMENT AND THE INVESTOR'S DESIRE TO INVEST IN CERTAIN PROJECTS IS GONNA MAKE EVERYONE MONEY, RIGHT? AND SO IT'S THE WHOLE THING. 
          AND IN THAT HOUSING COMMUNITY EMPOWERMENT DEPARTMENT, WE HAVE TO LOOK AT POLICY THAT THAT KIND OF BALANCES ALL OF THOSE THINGS OUT. 
          BUT UNDERSTANDING THAT TOO RESTRICTIVE MEANS YOU DON'T GET AS MANY UNITS AS YOU CAN, UM, TO LOOSE MEANS YOU, UH, GET ALL THE UNITS THAT YOU POSSIBLY CAN BUT AREN'T, AREN'T BALANCING THAT SORT OF COMMUNITY. 
          SO FINDING THE RIGHT BALANCE OF ALL OF THAT AND THE WAY WE DISCUSS PROJECTS ON THE FRONT END APPLICATIONS OF, YEAH, IT'S GONNA BE IN A HIGHER POVERTY AREA, BUT IT'S GONNA DO THESE REALLY COOL THINGS AND IT'S GONNA ADDRESS THESE OTHER SOCIAL PROBLEMS. 'CAUSE THEY, THEY ARE BY JUST NATURE, HOW THEY'RE DESIGNED. 
          THEN THOSE ARE THE TYPE OF STORIES THAT ARE DIFFERENT. 
          IT ADDRESSES BLAME, IT ADDRESSES AN ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUE, IT ADDRESSES A NEIGHBORHOOD NUISANCE, RIGHT? SOME OF THESE PROJECTS ARE GONNA DO SOME THINGS THAT ARE ABOVE AND BEYOND JUST HOUSING DEVELOPMENT THAT HAS TO BE ARTICULATED MORE AND BE PART OF THAT NARRATIVE ON THE FRONT END TO SHOW THAT THERE IS A RISK HERE, BUT IT DOES THIS AND SO LET'S TALK ABOUT IT. 
          I THINK, YEAH, I THINK PART OF THE DISCONNECT THERE TOO IS I THINK THE FEAR FROM WHAT THE BOARD AND THE DEVELOPMENT TOO IS WHERE ARE THESE THRESHOLDS FOR A WAIVER? 'CAUSE LIKE YOU SAID, THERE'S NUANCE WITHIN THE COMMUNITY, RIGHT? YOU HAVE THESE GENERAL REQUIREMENTS, BUT THEN IT'S LIKE, IT FEELS LIKE A BLANKET BAND, RIGHT? IF THAT'S NOT THE CASE, I MEAN QCT IS A BROAD INSTRUMENT, RIGHT? THAT'S WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THESE THINGS, WE'RE TAKING A VERY NUANCED APPROACH AND WE'RE LOOKING AT ACCESS TO SCHOOLS, ACCESS TO PUBLIC IDENTIFICATION, ALL OF THE HIGH ATTAINMENT THINGS. 
          'CAUSE 20% POVERTY IS NOT A BLANKET HOMOGENOUS THING, RIGHT? I MEAN 20% POVERTY IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE WITH ACCESS TO NOTHING, WHICH YOU WE'VE SEEN AND DEALS LIKE THAT IS A BAD THING. 
          BUT 20% POVERTY ON THE VERY EDGE OF THAT QCT THAT CAN ALLOW PEOPLE TO MOVE INTO AN AREA WHERE THEY CAN GET TO THE SCHOOL, THAT CAN GET TO THE GROCERY STORES. 
          WE THINK THAT'S A POSITIVE THING. 
          SO THAT 20% DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEAN 20%, WHICH IS WHY WE DON'T WANNA BE COMPLETELY HAMSTRUNG BY JUST LIKE A LINE IN THE SAND. 
          I THINK THAT'S TWO OF THAT WHERE UM, YOU START TO SHOW THAT CENSUS TRACKS CHANGE IN TRAJECTORY OVER A FEW YEARS. 
          YOU COULD SAY IT WAS 40% IN 2019, IT'S 32% LAST YEAR, IT'S 20% TODAY AT APPLICATIONS, ALL SIGNS ARE POINTING TO ECONOMIC ACTIVITY IN THAT AREA. 
          OTHER HOUSING DEVELOPMENTS ARE CHANGING IT. 
          IT'S PART OF IT BECAUSE PART OF THE UNDERSTANDING OF WHY NOW, WHY THAT DEVELOPMENT NOW IN THIS AREA IS IT'S GENTRIFYING. 
          WE HAVE TO PROTECT AND GET AFFORDABLE UNITS IN. 
          NOW PART OF IT IS THERE IS AGING HOUSING STOCK, THE RESTRICTIONS THAT ARE EXPIRING AND WE HAVE TO PRESERVE THEM NOW. 
          RIGHT? SO IT'S, IT'S NOT A ONE SIZE FITS ALL. 
          IT'S A SCREENING POINT TO PROTECT AND HAVE CONVERSATIONS AROUND IN TERMS OF WHAT IS THAT CENSUS STRIKE DOING TODAY AND THEN UNPACKING THE HISTORY OF IT AND WHERE IT'S BEEN. 
          SURE. 
          YOU JUST WANNA BE COGNIZANT OF THE FACT THAT AN IMPEDIMENT COULD LEAD TO IN LOSSES OF DEALS AND WE JUST DON'T, WE DON'T WANNA LOSE 50 THIS. 
          RIGHT. 
          YOU KNOW, A QUESTION THAT I HAD A TALK WITH MADE AT THIS POINT, IT'S REALLY ABOUT THE SUPER MAJORITY, UH, FOR, TO GET THE WAIVERS TO AGENCY THESE DEALS. 
          AND OF COURSE, YOU KNOW, DAVID, DO YOU REALIZE MOST OF YOUR DEALS WHERE ALMOST ALL OF 'EM HAVE MET THAT THRESHOLD AND I WAS LIKE, REALLY DOING A REALLY DANG GOOD JOB SCRAPING THESE DEALS. 
          , GOOD JOB. 
          BUT IT'S ONE THAT REALLY HAD TO MAKE ME THINK. 
          AND I SAID EVEN, I MEAN IT WAS A VERY FAIR POINT, I JUST HARD TO ARGUE, BUT LOOK, MY TECH DEALS, THESE DEVELOPERS, I MEAN THEY'RE TRYING TO GET RESERVATIONS FOR MONITOR. 
          THEY'RE TRYING TO GET A TASK CREDIT ORDER. 
          SO THERE'S A LOT OF HOOPS THAT, THERE'S SO MANY HOOPS. 
          I MEAN, YOU KNOW, JACK, YOU KNOW, AS WELL AS, ANYWAY, AND, AND BY THE WAY, WE'RE A VOLUNTEER BOARD THAT SEEMS 
          [01:00:01]
TO GET STRESSED TO US BY SOME PEOPLE AND CERTAIN COUNCIL PEOPLE. 
          YOU KNOW, LIKE THERE'S RISK TO EVERY BOARD YOU GO TO. 
          THERE'S RISK TO EVERY COUNCIL YOU GO TO. 
          THERE'S RISK TO ALL THESE DIFFERENT BOARDS AND HOUSING DEPARTMENTS AND STATE AND CITY AND THEN JUST THE GENERAL POLITICS AND THEN JUST GETTING LOCAL COMMUNITIES MORE. 
          IT'S LIKE THE MORE HURDLES YOU ADD, IT JUST SENDS A MESSAGE TO THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY. 
          AND WE ARE JUST SIMPLY AT THE MERCY OF THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY, UM, TO RISK MONEY AND THEY WILL LOSE MONEY IF THESE DEALS DON'T CLOSE AND THEY GET PREGNANT WITH DEALS AND IT'S JUST A ENORMOUS FINANCIAL RISK THAT THAT WAS WHEN I JUST LIKE, YOU KNOW, I CAN'T, WHEN YOU LOOK AT WHERE THESE DEALS ARE HAPPEN, IT'S NOT BY ACCIDENT THAT THEY'RE, A LOT OF 'EM ARE IN THE SOUTHERN SECTOR. 
          YEAH, IT'S LAND, IT'S A LITTLE BIT, YOU KNOW, BUT IT'S THE QTS THEY'RE INCENTIVIZED TO DO IT. 
          SO IT'S NO ACCIDENT. 
          IT'S BY DESIGN. 
          AND SO TO PUT IN THE SUPER MAJORITY, THAT WAS WHAT IT WAS, JUST ME AND WHERE I WAS DIFFERENT PAIN. 
          I GET IT. 
          YOU KNOW, AND THIS IS ALL FOR JUST DEBATE. 
          GOOD DISCUSSION, DIALOGUE. 
          I COULDN'T GET PAST THAT. 
          YEAH. 
          THESE ARE THINGS AT THE STATE LEVEL THAT WE NEED TO PUSH CHANGE. 
          YEAH. 
          'CAUSE DEVELOPERS WILL THEN JUST SAY, LOOK, THAT'S JUST, THAT'S JUST TOO RISKY. 
          I CAN'T DO THAT. 
          I, WE, THAT'S, WE'VE DEFINITELY GOTTEN FEEDBACK FROM DEVELOPERS THAT'S, IT'S, IT'S DIFFICULT SOMETIMES, LIKE YOU SAID, WE SCREAM . 
          THE HARDEST THING I DO IS SAY NO BECAUSE MY JOB, I HAVE TO COURT PEOPLE TO COME AND BE WILLING TO GO THROUGH THIS WHOLE ROOM ROLL. 
          I GUESS IF IT WAS EASY, THERE WOULD BE A LOT MORE . 
          YEAH. 
          WE HAVE, YOU SEE THE SAME PEOPLE COME BACK BECAUSE THE PROCESS, ONCE COUNCIL KNOWS YOU, YOU KNOW, THERE'S AN ELEMENT OF TRUST BUT ALSO AN ELEMENT OF CONFIDENCE FROM THE INVESTORS RIGHT NOW TO BREAK INTO A NEW CITY. 
          IT'S VERY, VERY DIFFICULT. 
          AND THAT'S THE FEEDBACK I GET. 
          YOU KNOW, SOMEONE WHEN WE SEE A TIGHTENING OF REGULATIONS THAT CAUSES ALL THESE GUYS TO GET SCREWED BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE THESE 10 YEARS CONTRACTS THAT THEY DON'T GET ANY UPSIDE OUT OF IT UNLESS, YOU KNOW, YOU THEY'RE TYING A LAND AND PUTTING MONEY DOWN OR JUST MONEY SOMETIMES. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, IT INCREASES THAT RISK FOR SURE. 
          THAT'S THE THING. 
          LIKE WE NEED TO BALANCE, YOU KNOW, WHAT ARE THESE DEFINITE NOS VERSUS, YOU KNOW, WHAT ARE THE ONES THAT WE COULD GET A WAIVER FOR OR THAT WE COULD, YOU KNOW, DELVE DEEPER DOWN, YOU KNOW, MAY MAYBE THERE'S, THERE'S A WAY TO ARTICULATE THAT IN OUR POLICIES A LITTLE BETTER, JUST SO THAT THIS DECISION TREE IS A LITTLE MORE CLEAR. 
          RIGHT? YEAH. 
          AND IT GETS TO THE POINT WHERE IT'S ALREADY COMING TO CITY COUNCIL. 
          YEAH. 
          THAT'S THE THING IS THAT'S WHAT WE BOTH AGREE ON, IS IT'S TOO LATE AT THAT POINT. 
          AND THERE'S STILL DISAGREEMENT BETWEEN COUNCIL AND DEVELOPER AND THE BOARD, YOU KNOW, WE FAILED IN OUR, OUR ABILITY TO COMMUNICATE THOSE RISKS. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND SO YOU MIND THE, THE  DRAFTED IT ONLY IF THEY'RE SEEKING WAIVERS AND RECAP IN HIGH POVERTY AREAS. 
          AND SO, YOU KNOW, FROM YOUR SCREENING STANDPOINT, THEN YOU JUST KINDA HAVE TO KNOW THE, THE TRAJECTORY OF THAT AREA AND THAT PROJECT. 
          AND SO THEY'RE ALREADY REQUESTING A WAIVER 'CAUSE IT, IT DOESN'T FIT STANDARD PROJECT AND THE Q THAT THEY'RE APPLYING. 
          AND SO WHAT IT, WHAT IT SAYS IS, COUNSEL WE'RE ALERTING YOU. 
          THIS ONE NEEDS A SUPER MAJORITY 'CAUSE THEY'RE ASKING FOR SOMETHING SPECIAL. 
          AND, AND I GET THE POINT A HUNDRED PERCENT SOUNDS LIKE AN EXTRA HURDLE. 
          YOU KNOW, THERE'S AN EXTRA REQUIREMENT. 
          IT JUST SETS THE UNDERSTANDING OF MAKE SURE THAT'S A, A GOOD PROJECT IN THE AREA. 
          IT GONNA HAVE COUNCIL SUPPORT. 
          BUT IF IT'S ONE THAT'S LIKE, EH, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT ONE'S GONNA REALLY PASS, THEN YEAH THERE MIGHT BE MORE OF A RISK. 
          I THINK ALSO, YOU KNOW, WE MAKE IT CLEAR THAT, AND NOW WE ARE MAKING IT VERY CLEAR BEFORE YOU EVEN SUBMIT A PROJECT. 
          'CAUSE AFTER YOU SUBMIT, YOU CAN'T TALK TO COUNCIL DIRECTLY BECAUSE YOU KNOW IT'S AN ETHICAL ISSUE. 
          BUT BEFORE YOU SUBMIT A PROJECT, I I ASK THEM, HEY, HAVE YOU TALKED TO THE LOCAL COUNSELOR? HAVE YOU GOTTEN FEEDBACK ON WHAT THEY WANT YOU NOW THAT THAT'S NOT A YES NO. 
          END ALL BE ALL. 
          BUT LET'S HELP WITH IT'S GOOD FOR STEP SOME OF THE LOCAL REPRESENTATION. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE'S PROBABLY A WAY WE CAN GET TO IT WHERE WE WE CAN DRILL DOWN AND ELIMINATE SOME OF THESE ISSUES UP FRONT. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT EVEN BEFORE THE PRELIMINARY INDUCEMENT, WE SHOULD BE THIS RIGHT WAY. 
          THAT'S GOOD. 
          I LIKE THIS DISCUSSION 'CAUSE WE'RE NOT PERFECT. 
          WE WE'RE ALWAYS IMPROVING THESE OPERATIONS. 
          THAT'S, WE KIND DEVELOP AND, AND REFINE THESE, THESE PROGRAM POLICIES. 
          IT'S, IT WILL HELP I THINK, ULTIMATELY GENERATE A BETTER PRODUCT. 
          SEE THE CITY GROW, HOW WE APPLY IT IS A SMALL PERCENTAGE OF DEALS THAT MAKE, CAN KNOW UPFRONT THAT THEY WILL INVARIABLY NEED A WAIVER AT THE END OF THIS PROCESS THEN. 
          YEAH. 
          I GUESS, RIGHT? WE DON'T WANT THEM TO HAVE TO HAVE THAT SURPRISE AT THE END AND THEN NOT GET 
          [01:05:01]
 AND THAT CLOSES UP ENDS THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN ALL OF US, THE BOARD, CITY, AND THE, THAT'S WHAT WE HEAR FROM COUNCIL ALL THE TIME. 
          IT'S LIKE, WELL WE NEVER NO ON YOUR DEALS. 
          AND I THINK WE TAKE PRIDE, SAY, WELL I'LL NEVER GIVE TO YOU IF IT'S NOT. 
          YEAH. 
          AND I MEAN EVEN THIS BOARD, RIGHT? I MEAN, BY THE TIME WE GET TO THE INDUCEMENT OR UH, YOU KNOW, THE APPROVAL WE USUALLY VOTE YES BECAUSE WE GET IT THROUGH, RIGHT? I MEAN, YOU'VE SENT US THE DEALS, WE'VE LOOKED AT THEM, WE'VE DRIVEN THEM, YOU'VE DRIVEN 'EM FORWARD. 
          SO I, I'D LIKE TO SAY SOMETHING TOO REAL QUICK ON THAT. 
          SO I WANNA MAKE SURE IT'S KNOWN THAT YOU STAFF DIDN'T JUST WENT IN DREAM UP, WE NEED TO CREATE PROGRAM STATEMENTS, RIGHT? THAT DESIRE FROM COUNCIL AND IT WASN'T AN INTENTION BECAUSE ANYBODY ON CURRENT BOARDS WAS DOING SOMETHING WRONG OR NOT IN ALIGNMENT. 
          RIGHT? IN FACT, EVERYONE WAS LIKE, HEY, THERE'S A LOT OF SUCCESS HERE, WE JUST NEED TO DOCUMENT IT. 
          SURE. 
          AND SO THESE ARE INTENDED TO DOCUMENT SO THAT THE FUTURE USS YOU KNOW, HAVE GOT IT, WHATEVER IT IS. 
          AND SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THAT SENTIMENT'S KNOWN. 
          IT WASN'T AN ATTACK ON ANYONE'S DECISION OR ONE PROJECT THAT WAS APPROVED. 
          IT WAS THE THINGS ARE GROWING PRETTY QUICKLY. 
          LET'S MAKE SURE WE HAVE SOME RULES OF COMPLIANCE LAID OUT AND, AND DOCUMENT THAT. 
          AND SO I, I DIDN'T REALLY SAY THAT IN MY OPENING, BUT THAT WAS ONE OF THE, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE YOU WON'T DO THAT. 
          I MEAN, IT SEEMS LIKE THINGS ARE HAPPEN PRACTICE, WE'RE DOING A VERY CLEAR ANALYSIS OF THE PUBLIC BENEFIT. 
          YOU KNOW, WE LIKE TO SEE 60% AS WELL GET IT RIGHT. 
          UH, BUT AGAIN, YOU WANNA MAKE EXPLICIT THE THINGS THAT WE'RE ALREADY DOING. 
          WE GOTTA BE CAREFUL WITH OUR DEVELOPER SEEDLINGS. 
          WE DON'T WANNA CHECK THAT. 
          DOES EVERYONE HAVE A COPY OF THE CITY? THE, THE FOR OR THE, YOU SEND THAT APPROPRIATE STATEMENT. 
          SO SINCE THE LAST BRIEFING WHEN WE HEARD COMMENTS FROM COUNCIL AND SOME OTHER APPLICANTS, WE'VE MADE SOME MINOR TWEAKS TO IT. 
          AND SO WE'LL BE FINALIZING THAT HERE SOON AND BE ABLE TO GET THAT ALL OUT TO EVERYBODY TO SEE THAT. 
          SO, UM, THE MAJOR CHANGE WE MADE WAS, UM, JUST IN HOW WE ADDRESSED THE WAIVER CONVERSATION. 
          UM, I THINK THAT SOME OF THE WORD CHOICE USED MADE IT, IT SOUNDED LIKE YOU COULDN'T DO IT, BUT THEN YOU COULD DO IT RIGHT. 
          AND SO WE JUST SAID, UM, IF YOU APPLY FOR A WAIVER, THEN THESE THINGS APPLY, RIGHT? SO WE MADE IT SO WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT YOU PROBABLY WILL HAVE SOME PROJECTS THAT APPLY FOR A WAIVER AND THAT'S OKAY 'CAUSE THEY'RE ALLOWED TO APPLY FOR WAIVERS AND THE QP, BUT DOING SO THERE'S SOME THINGS WE HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE, ESPECIALLY DEPENDING ON THE WAIVER REQUEST. 
          I THINK THIS IS GOOD TOO BECAUSE WHATEVER SHAKES OUT AT THE END OF THE MONTH, THAT'S FINE. 
          WE CAN INCORPORATE INTO THE APPLICATION AND SAY UPFRONT, YOU KNOW, HEY, YOU'RE GONNA NEED A WAIVER FOR A B, CP AND IF YOU DON'T DO THIS, LIKE GO HOME. 
          YOU KNOW, LIKE IF YOU'RE NOT WILLING TO DO THAT, LET'S GET AUTOMATED. 
          I'M WITH YOU. 
          DO YOU HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? I'M, I'M, WHAT DO YOU THINK THE SIGNAL, CAN I ASK A QUESTION? SORRY. 
          THIS IS LESS INTERESTING AND, AND I RECOGNIZE I'M, I'M NEW TO THE AREA AND YOU GUYS ESPECIALLY THAT ARE THERE IN PERSON, UH, SOUND MUCH MORE UP TO SPEED ON THIS. 
          SO, UH, CAN WE JUST TAKE A STEP BACK ON, ON WHAT WE WERE JUST DISCUSSING? 'CAUSE IT SEEMS A LITTLE CONFUSING TO ME AND I WANNA MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND WHAT'S, WHAT'S BEING CONTEMPLATED. 
          AND I KNOW IT'S COMING FROM HOUSING STAFF, SO IT'S A LITTLE OUT OF OUR CONTROL, BUT DO I UNDERSTAND IT CORRECT THAT WHAT HOUSING STAFF IS WANTING TO PUT FORWARD IS A PROJECT IN AN AREA THAT HAS 20% OF POVERTY OR MORE WOULD NEED THE SUPER MAJORITY WAIVER. 
          IS THAT, DO I HAVE THAT PART CORRECT? YES. 
          A LITECH PROJECT. 
          LITECH, YEAH. 
          WHAT WE USE ONLY, ONLY A LITECH OR ANY, ANY PROJECT WE SCREEN FOR THAT FOR ALL PROJECTS. 
          WELL, NOT FOR PC PROJECT IN THE, THEY WILL NOT EVEN NEED A WAIVER. 
          THEY, THEY WON'T BECAUSE WE WANT TO INCUR THAT, BUT WE SCREEN ALL PROJECTS FOR 24. 
          SO, SO PFC PROJECTS IN THE HIGHER POVERTY AREAS WILL NOT NEED THE WAIVER BECAUSE OF THE DESIRE OF MIXED INCOME PROJECTS IN THOSE AREAS. 
          WHEREAS  OKAY, WELL, PUTTING ASIDE WHETHER A PFC DEAL WOULD EVEN MAKE SENSE IN A HIGH HIGHER PROPERTY AREA, THAT'S A ISSUE FOR THEM, I GUESS. 
          BUT, SO FOR OUR DEALS, AND, AND I THINK THIS IS WHAT YOU WERE GETTING TO PRESIDENT ELLIS, BUT I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE AGAIN, SOME OF THIS, I KNOW I I'M STILL LEARNING, BUT ON LIKE A LITECH DEAL, IF YOU GET KIND OF BONUS POINTS, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, YOU GET MORE, MORE TAX CREDIT DOLLARS FOR SOMETHING THAT'S GOING INTO A QCT AND A 25% POVERTY AREA, THEN AM I MISSING SOMETHING? IT SEEMS LIKE THEN MOST OF OUR LITECH DEALS ARE GONNA BE REQUIRING THIS SUPER MAJORITY WAIVER. 
          IS THAT RIGHT OR THAT'S WRONG? THAT WOULD BE CORRECT. 
          THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING POSSIBLE. 
          OKAY. 
          BECAUSE IT JUST SEEMS LIKE WE'RE KIND OF TALKING ABOUT THIS IN, IN 
          [01:10:01]
A WAY OF, OH, IT'S NO BIG DEAL, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE THIS WILL AFFECT ALMOST ALL OF OUR LITECH. 
          AND I KIND OF AGREE AT LEAST IT SOUNDED LIKE PRESIDENT ELLIS, SOME OF THE CURRENT CONCERN YOU HAVE IS, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'RE ALL IN ALIGNMENT. 
          WE NEED MORE HOUSING AND, AND WE NEED BETTER QUALITY HOUSING. 
          AND I, I THINK WE ALL AGREE WE DON'T WANNA HAVE A HIGHER CONCENTRATION OF, UH, POVERTY. 
          BUT IF WE AS A CITY AND WE AS A BOARD ARE DOING THINGS THAT SEEM TO COUNTER WHAT, UM, HUD AND, UM, T-H-C-D-A, LIKE WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO, I, IT JUST MAKE, IT DOESN'T MAKE A LOT OF SENSE TO ME. 
          AND IT DOES CONCERN ME THAT IF WE'RE PUTTING MORE ROADBLOCKS, EVEN IF EVERY SINGLE ONE OF OUR PROJECT IS ALMOST, YOU KNOW, UNANIMOUSLY APPROVED AT COUNCIL OR ALL, BUT, YOU KNOW, ONE PERSON VOTES CONSISTENTLY IN FAVOR OF 'EM, UH, IT DOES CONCERN ME TO TELL DEVELOPERS, HEY, ON, ON ALL OF YOUR LITECH DEALS THAT ARE COMING FORWARD, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO GO GET A WAIVER OF A SUPER MAJORITY OF COUNCIL. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, IS THAT REALLY THE RIGHT MESSAGE? IF THAT'S GONNA AFFECT NOT A SMALL, UH, MAJORITY OF THE DEALS WE DO, BUT ALL OF OUR LIGHT TECH DEALS. 
          AND I DON'T KNOW, IT SEEMS VERY CONCERNING TO ME. 
          BUT, UM, BUT LIKE I SAID, I RECOGNIZE I'M, I'M ONE OF THE NEW KIDS ON THE BLOCK, SO MAYBE SOMEONE CAN TELL ME THAT I SHOULDN'T BE SO CONCERNED. 
          . 
          WELL, I'M, I'M SOMEBODY EXPLAINING HERE FOR A WHILE AND I CAN SAY I'M EVEN EQUALLY AS CONCERNED, IF NOT MORE CONCERNED IF I WERE A PRIVATE DEVELOPER AND TRYING TO GO TO A BOARD ON, YOU KNOW, INCORPORATES SAY, HEY, I WANNA SPEND A BUNCH OF PURSUIT DOLLARS, HIGH RISK DOLLARS, AND BY THE WAY, I HAVE TO GET A SUPER MAJORITY VOTE FROM A POLITICAL BODY TO GET SOMETHING APPROVED. 
          I CANNOT IMAGINE A, YOU KNOW, TYPICAL CORPORATION AGREEING TO A DEAL LIKE THAT BECAUSE THESE, NO MATTER HOW GREAT A PROJECT THESE THINGS ARE, YOU KNOW, THESE ARE POLITICAL BODIES AND THE VOTES ARE, ARE UNPREDICTABLE. 
          YOU TALK ABOUT A SUPER MAJORITY, UM, GET INTO, AND WE SEE THIS HAPPENS IN COUNCIL ALL THE TIME WHERE SOMETHING REQUIRES A SUPER MAJORITY VOTE AND YOU HAVE A COUPLE PEOPLE THAT ARE ABSENT. 
          THAT MEANS YOU BASICALLY NEED TO HAVE EVERYBODY TO VOTE FAVOR GRADE. 
          THIS IS, I THINK YOU'RE GONNA, I THINK THIS IS GONNA BE A DISASTER. 
          AND I THINK IT NEEDS TO BE COMMUNICATED JUST TO COUNCIL THAT IF THEY APPROVE THIS, THEY NEED TO BE PREPARED FOR VAST MAJORITY OF OUR LITECH TO, TO SAY, YOU KNOW, WE'RE, WE'RE GONNA PASS ON THOSE DEALS. 
          WE'RE, YOU KNOW, I, I JUST, I DON'T, IT'S HARD ENOUGH. 
          I MEAN, IT IS TAKEN US YEARS TO GET TO THIS POINT WHERE WE HAVE FOLKS LINED UP READY TO DO DEALS HERE. 
          AND I, I THINK IT'S, I THINK WE'RE SETTING OURSELVES UP FOR A, UH, I UNDERSTAND THE INTENTION AND I ALSO APPRECIATE JOY, YOU COMING AND, AND SPEAKING, YOU KNOW, JOSEPH, THAT, YOU KNOW, WASN'T CORROBORATION. 
          THIS IS SOMETHING DEEPLY CONCERNS ME. 
          UM, YEAH, I MEAN, LOOK, THIS WAS THE RESULT OF A LOT OF WORK. 
          A LOT OF TALK. 
          AND WE DID HIT, YOU KNOW, OUR ORGANIZATION AND THE CITY STAFF HAS IMPASSE, AND THIS IS KIND OF WHAT KIND OF WHERE WE'RE AT. 
          UM, THIS IS GOING FOR COUNCIL. 
          UM, I WOULD SAY WHENEVER IT GETS FINALIZED AND DO PROGRAM STATEMENTS, LOVE TO READ THE, UH, READ THE LANGUAGE, UM, LET'S KIND OF THINK THROUGH TO AARON, HE CAN DISSEMINATE TO THE REST OF THE BOARD AND JUST HAVE A RESPONSE. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, WE TALK TO COUNCIL, WE TALK TO COUNCIL AND WE'LL DISCUSS, SEE WHERE THIS ENDS UP AT, AT THE END OF JANUARY. 
          YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE ARE. 
          I THINK THAT FROM HEARING ALL THE VOICES, RIGHT, UM, I FEEL LIKE WHAT WE'RE PRESENTING AND WHERE WE'RE, WHERE WE'RE AT, UM, NO DECISION STAFF CAN MAKE RIGHT NOW MAKES EVERYBODY HAPPY, RIGHT? AND SO THESE THREE POINTS THAT WE STILL NEED TO HAVE A CONVERSATION ON WITH OUR CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS IN TERMS OF WHAT THEY'RE CURRENTLY FEELING, THAT'S THE, THAT'S THE SITUATION THAT, THAT WE'RE IN. 
          BECAUSE ULTIMATELY THERE ARE ALL THESE THINGS THAT HAVE DISCUSSED TO THE, THE 9% APPLICATIONS THAT GOT SUBMITTED, THE 10, NONE OF THEM ARE IN HIGH POVERTY AREAS. 
          UM, TWO OF THE FOUR, 4% ARE, RIGHT? AND SO I KNOW THAT THEY'RE ALL A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT, BUT WE ARE SEEING A LOT MORE APPLICATIONS FOR LITECH AND NON HIGH-POVERTY AREAS. 
          AND SO, AND THE NINE PERCENTS ARE A LITTLE DIFFERENT ANIMAL. 
          THAT'S A HEAVILY SUBSIDIZED AREA, BUT A COUPLE YEARS AGO, WE'RE SEEING HALF OF 'EM, IF NOT MORE IN HIGH POVERTY. 
          UNDERSTOOD. 
          SO, SO SOME OF THE, SOME OF THE UNDERSTANDING AND SOME OF THE, DID THEY CHANGE CRITERIA OR YEAH, I WHAT WAS DRIVING THAT OR IS IT ALREADY THE DISCUSSIONS WITHIN THE CITY? THERE, THERE'S A LOT OF THE, THE WAIVERS IN THE AREAS OF CONCENTRATION OF POVERTY AND THE EXISTING LIITE THAT EXIST, AND A WHOLE LOT OF FACTORS CHANGE THE EVERY YEAR. 
          SO BORING . 
          [01:15:01]
WELL, WE NEED TO DO A VERY THOROUGH JOB OF DATA ANALYSIS HERE TO UNDERSTAND WHAT'S HAPPENING. 
          I MEAN, IF WE'RE SHUTTING THE SPIGOT OFF, GUYS, WE'RE SITTING HERE IN A YEAR AND WE, YOU, OUR DEAL FLOWS DROPPED IN PAST, UNDERSTAND TONY PAGE WILL BE SITTING HERE SAYING, I TOLD YOU SO. 
          WELL, I WOULDN'T SAY ALL OF US. 
          ALL OF US. 
          YEAH. 
          I DON'T TALK TO THE  SAID, HEY, IF WE PUT THE SUPER MAJORITY REQUIREMENT IN THERE, ARE YOU GUYS GONNA CONTINUE WORK, GO OFF? DO WE HAVE ANY FEEDBACK? THE FEEDBACK FROM THE REAL ESTATE COUNCIL IS, IS SIMILAR TO YOUR, LIKE, THESE ARE THE THREE POINTS ACROSS THE BOARD THAT WE'RE ALL, WE'RE ALL, WE'VE ALL THROUGH ALL THE CONVERSATIONS THAT WE'VE HAD AND UNDERSTANDING SOME OTHER THINGS, LIKE THESE ARE THE THREE MAIN POINTS OF CONVERSATION. 
          AND I WOULD SAY JUST TO EVERYBODY'S CREDIT, THAT THAT PARTICIPANTS IN THIS PROCESS, THE FACT THAT WE ACTUALLY GOT ALL THE STUFF FUNNELED, THE THREE ISSUES THAT WE JUST, THAT'S NOT BAD. 
          AS A RESULT OF A LOT OF DIALOGUE, A LOT OF TELLING, HEY, I THINK YOU'RE WRONG. 
          OH, YOU'RE WRONG. 
          YOU KNOW, WE GOT IT DOWN TO THESE ISSUES, WHICH THAT THAT'S GOOD. 
          BUT THEY'RE BIG ISSUES. 
          . 
          YEAH. 
          YOU KNOW, THEY COULD HAVE A MASSIVE IMPACT. 
          AND IT IS A LITTLE BIT OF ROLL OF D SO, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT HAPPENS IF THIS PASSES? WE ONLY GOT THE EXPERIENCE OUR, OUR BACKGROUND OR EXPERIENCE, WHAT WE'VE SEEN TO FORM OUR OPINIONS, AND EVERYONE HAS A DIFFERENT PATH THAT GOT US TO THESE OPINIONS. 
          YOU KNOW? SO I JUST, YOU KNOW, I, WE JUST WE'RE TIED IN WITH THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY. 
          THEY ARE OUR PARTNERS, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE THESE SENSITIVITIES. 
          WE'RE A LITTLE BIT CLOSER TO THEIR CONCERNS. 
          CITY COUNCIL, I THINK AS A LITTLE MORE EXPOSURE TO KIND OF THE PUBLIC SIDE, THE PUBLIC POLICY SIDE. 
          AND I GET THAT TOO, YOU KNOW, BUT IT'S JUST LIKE WE CAN ONLY, LIKE, IT'S UP FOR ELECTED OFFICIALS TO MAKE THESE DIFFERENT CALLS. 
          THAT'S JUST ALL I'M DOING, YOU KNOW? AND I, I GET WHY THEY WANT TO GO AND COUNCIL THE PROGRAM STATEMENTS. 
          I THINK THEY SHOULD, I TOLD TH I THINK YOU OUGHT TO GO WITH YOUR PROGRAM STATEMENT. 
          LET'S SEE WHAT HAPPENS. 
          I'M NOT SAYING THAT'S A, OH, I BET YOU LOSE. 
          IT'S JUST LIKE, LOOK, OH, MAYBE A LITTLE BIT. 
          BUT IT'S JUST LIKE, LIKE IT JUST, WE NEED TO RESOLVE THIS. 
          THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR A VERY LONG TIME. 
          TAXING, I THINK FOUR ONE ON THIS PLATE. 
          WE WANT IT UP, OUR PLATE CITY COUNCIL HAS TO APPROVE THIS AND WE'VE GOTTA MAKE A DECISION AND MOVE FORWARD. 
          BUT I THINK WE SHOULD DO A VERY CONCERTED EFFORT DATA COLLECTION. 
          OH YEAH. 
          AT SOME POINT WE CAN REVISIT THIS. 
          YEAH. 
          I, I THINK THAT'S CERTAINLY THE INTENTION AS WE'VE GROWN PRETTY QUICKLY. 
          WE NEED HIRE A COUPLE MORE STAFF. 
          MAYBE WE DID A STUDY YEARS AGO NOW ON, ON THE TAX EXEMPTION FEES, AND ACTUALLY WE'LL BE TALKING ABOUT TAX EXEMPTIONS THE SAME DAY LATER AT THE FINANCE COMMITTEE. 
          YOU KNOW, THAT'S A WHOLE OTHER ISSUE, RIGHT? AND SO OUR HOPE IS TO CREATE MORE UNITS, RIGHT? WE NEED TO, THE GAP HAS ONLY GROWN THE SIX YEARS. 
          I'VE BEEN AROUND OVER 20,000, OVER 30,000. 
          AND I WOULD HATE TO LOSE A THOUSAND, 2000 UNITS OVER THIS. 
          BUT WE HAVE TO MAKE A, MAKE A DECISION AND MOVE FORWARD. 
          ONE THING I PROGRAM STATE STATEMENTS I LIKE, UH, WE ACTUALLY, BEYOND CONCENTRATION OF POVERTY HUT,  AND ALL THAT STUFF, UH, ONE OF THE MORE CONTROVERSIAL ASPECTS OF WE'VE DONE HISTORICALLY IS ACTUALLY WORKFORCE ACQUISITIONS, UH, AS WELL. 
          SO THAT USUALLY IS GOT A LOT OF GROUPS IN TEXAS IN TROUBLE OVER THE LAST COUPLE YEARS. 
          WE ACTUALLY LIMITED IT FROM THE PROGRAM STATEMENT TO ABOUT IF WE CAN GET THESE FINANCE, WHICH IS NOT EVEN, IT'S UP IN THE YEAR, AND WE WON'T KNOW UNTIL PROBABLY FEBRUARY. 
          WE'VE LIMITED TO THREE PROJECTS A YEAR. 
          I THINK THAT'S THE MOST WE'VE EVER HOPED TO DO. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, FRACTION OF ALL THE DEALS WE'VE DONE, IT IS A FRACTION, IT'S A FRACTION OF WHAT'S BEEN DONE IN OTHER CITIES TO BELY HONEST WITH YOU. 
          SO IT IS A VERY MODERATE THRESHOLD. 
          I JUST WANNA POINT THAT OUT FOR WAY TOO. 
          I MEAN, IF WE CAN GET ONE OF THOSE DEALS ON THAT BE I LOOK, OUR PROGRAM STATEMENT, ODDLY ENOUGH, CAN BE AMENDED IF SOMEHOW IT CAN BE AMENDED. 
          UM, BUT DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY OBJECTIONS TO OUR PROGRAM STATEMENT, MY LAWS THAT WE PUT FORTH? UM, I, I DO. 
          SORRY. 
          OH, YES. 
          DIRECTOR JI. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          DO THANK YOU. 
          AND SORRY I COULDN'T BE THERE IN PERSON. 
          JUST AS YOU CAN SEE, I'M AFTER MEETING AND I'M SITTING MY CAR. 
          BUT, UM, AND I, I APPRECIATE, YOU KNOW, ALL THE WORK THAT WENT INTO THIS, AND I APOLOGIZE FOR NOT CIRCULATING COMMENTS, YOU KNOW, IN ADVANCE OF THE MEETING, BUT IT'S A LITTLE HARD TO SEE SOMETHING THE FIRST TIME ON FRIDAY AFTERNOON AND, AND PROVIDE SOME MEANINGFUL THOUGHTS BEFORE, UM, BEFORE TODAY. 
          BUT, UH, UM, I HAD SOME QUESTIONS AND IT, I, WE CAN TAKE IT IN WHATEVER ORDER, BUT PARTICULARLY ON, UM, THE PROGRAM STATEMENTS NUMBER, UM, FOUR AND FIVE. 
          UM, AND I TALKED TO ERIN BRIEFLY BEFORE THE MEETING, AND SO MAYBE IT WOULD BE HELPFUL BEFORE I TELL YOU MY COMMENTS TO KIND OF HEAR WHAT THE THOUGHT PROCESS IS BETWEEN, UH, OF WHY THEY ARE DRAFTED 
          [01:20:01]
THE WAY THEY ARE, UM, IN SOME CONTEXT FORUM. 
          I THINK AARON SUGGESTED THAT THOSE WERE MOSTLY GOING TO APPLY TO NON-TECH DEALS, BUT AS DRAFTED, I DON'T SEE THAT, UH, THAT LANGUAGE, UH, SAYING THAT IT SAYS IT LOOKS LIKE IT APPLIES TO EVERYTHING, BUT I'LL JUST STOP THERE AND SAY I'D LOVE TO DISCUSS THOSE TWO PROVISIONS. 
          UM, AND THEN I, THEN I PROBABLY HAVE SOME FURTHER COMMENTS ON THEM. 
          I CAN'T SPEAK TO FOUR ON FIVE. 
          IT'S ACQUISITION OF MARKET RATE PROPERTIES FOR CONVERSION TO AFFORDABLE HOUSING WILL BE LIMITED TO SEVEN 50. 
          WELL, I GUESS, I GUESS THEORETICALLY YOU COULD TAKE A MARKET RATE DEAL TO LITECH RIGHT ABOUT IT. 
          I THINK WE SHOULD BE A LITTLE MORE CLEAR THAT, YEAH, NO, YOU'RE RIGHT. 
          GOOD 0.054. 
          IS THAT AN ANNUAL NUMBER ALSO? ANNUAL NUMBER YOU SHOULD PROBABLY SAY THAT DOESN'T SAY FOR A YEAR ON THERE. 
          YEAH, I THINK WE PUT THAT, YEAH, LET'S WORDSMITH THAT A LITTLE BIT CLEARER. 
          IT DOES SAY IT ON P LET'S, YEAH, LET'S JUST CUT FOR A YEAR ON BOTH AND LET'S MAKE SURE TWO MIDDLE INCOME OR, OR WHATEVER, OR COURSE, WHATEVER THE TECHNICAL TERM IS FOR THAT, SAY NON NON, NON LITECH. 
          YEAH. 
          YAHOO. 
          WHAT WAS FOUR GEOGRAPHIC GEOGRAPHIC RESTRICTIONS? MY SPECIFIC CONCERN, AND IT, IT WILL PROBABLY BE NO SURPRISE BASED ON MY PRIOR COMMENTS, IS, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY TIMES ARE WE PUTTING HURDLES IN PLACE OR EXTRA, UM, COSTS FOR OUR, OUR DEVELOPERS? AND SO THE, THE, UH, QUESTION I HAD WAS ON THE REQUIREMENT OF A MARKET STUDY. 
          UM, IT, IT, I DON'T KNOW. 
          SO I KNOW OBVIOUSLY I, I UNDERSTAND THE, SOME CONTEXT OF WHY WE'RE PROPOSING, UM, THAT PROJECTS THAT ARE IN A 40%, UM, CENSUS TRACK MORE THAT THEY WOULD HAVE THAT. 
          BUT I JUST, AGAIN, IS THIS FOR ANY DEAL THAT'S COMING FORWARD AND, AND ARE WE COGNIZANT OF HOW MUCH ADDED COST WE'RE ADDING, YOU KNOW, FOR DEVELOPERS TO COME FORWARD, UM, TO HAVE TO DO THIS MARKET STUDY? AND SO THOSE, THOSE WERE BOTH KIND OF MY CONCERN, MAKING SURE THAT WHATEVER WE'RE PUTTING IN HERE OR WE'RE NOT PUTTING MORE HURDLES TO CREATE OUR DEALS. 
          AND THEN ARE WE BEING VERY PRECISE WITH OUR LANGUAGE ON, UH, WHAT THEY APPLY TO? DO THEY NOT ALREADY, AARON, HAVE TO GET A MARKET STUDY SHOWING THE NEED FOR, UH, I THAT'S A NORMAL STEP FOR MARKET RATE. 
          THAT'S TRUE. 
          SO PRETTY STANDARD. 
          I THINK, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S EXPLICIT IN OUR POLICY, BUT OBVIOUSLY I THINK WE RELIED HEAVILY ON THE LENDERS BECAUSE EACH LENDER IS GONNA REQUIRE THEY HAVE SCOPE APPRAISAL, MARKET STUDY AND . 
          WELL, SO APPRAISAL, THAT APPRAISAL COUNT AS A MARKET STUDY. 
          I WOULDN'T THINK SO. 
          NO, I WOULDN'T THINK THAT APPRAISAL COUNTS AS A MARKET STUDY. 
          I MEAN, THERE'S TWO DIFFERENT, YEAH, I MEAN, NO APPRAISAL HAS A MARKET SURVEY. 
          IT'S NOT A, A ASSESSMENT OF THE DEMAND, RIGHT? SO I THINK MAYBE WE CAN ARTICULATE A LITTLE MORE CLEARLY WHAT, WHAT EXACTLY WE NEED. 
          UM, BUT THE IDEA FOR DIRECTOR  THERE IS, WE, WE DON'T WANT TO TAKE ANYTHING OFF THE TAX ROLLS THAT ISN'T ADDING TO THE AFFORDABILITY. 
          LIKE CORRECT. 
          YOU KNOW, MAYBE IT IS IRRELEVANT ON THE 40%. 
          LIKE WE'RE NEVER GONNA CONSIDER AN ACQUISITION IN THAT 40% , RIGHT? LIKE, THAT WOULD BE RIDICULOUS. 
          BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, IF WE DO COMPLETE AN ACQUISITION, WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT ANY LOST TAX REVENUE OH, IS GONNA BE, SO THE AFFORDABILITY, SO THIS IS WORKFORCE. 
          THIS IS TO DO WORKFORCE. 
          I THINK THAT WAS THE, OKAY. 
          I, I WOULD SAY I WOULD AGREE WITH THAT. 
          AND THE ONLY REASON I WOULD ALMOST CALL IT LIKE A MAYBE BUFFER ANALYSIS, UH, THAT THE PFCS HAVE TO DO. 
          YEAH. 
          AND THE REASON WHY I LOOK, LOOK, THE ACQUISITIONS TO TAKE A MARKET RATE PROJECT TO A MIXED INCOME PROJECT USING ALL THE ONLY, ONLY THE ATTACK EXEMPTION IS THE MOST CONTROVERSIAL THING WE DO. 
          I WOULDN'T SAY CONTROVERSIAL. 
          IT'S THE MOST POLITICALLY HOT THING WE DO. 
          I THINK I AM. 
          OKAY. 
          I UNDERSTAND ABOUT, YOU KNOW, EXTRA HURDLES. 
          I DO THINK FOR THIS TYPE OF ENDEAVOR, WE DO NEED TO SHOW THAT THIS IS NEEDED BECAUSE THERE'S JUST, IT'S A BIG PUBLIC BENEFIT HURDLE THEY HAVE TO HIT. 
          I AM, I PERSONALLY AM OKAY WITH THAT, BUT MAYBE WE COULD MAKE THIS CLEARER THAT IT'S WORKFORCE. 
          IT'S WHENEVER YOU MAKE THE MOTION, YOU GUYS CAN JUST OKAY. 
          ATE WITH THESE CLARIFICATION ON SECTION FOUR AND FIVE. 
          DIRECTOR, DID YOU HEAR ME? AND I MEAN, YOU DON'T HAVE TO AGREE WITH ME, BUT DO THAT MAKE ANY SENSE IN SAYING THIS? YEAH, IT DOES. 
          I THINK THE LANGUAGE, I, I THINK ON BOTH OF THOSE PROVISIONS, BECAUSE IF WHAT I'M UNDERSTANDING, UM, FROM AARON AND, AND 
          [01:25:01]
FROM WHAT YOU DISCUSSED, I THINK IF WE COULD JUST MAYBE MAKE THE LANGUAGE A LITTLE MORE PRECISE, UM, MAYBE THAT WOULD ALLEVIATE MY CONCERNS. 
          UM, AND, AND ON, NOT TO JUMP BACK, BUT TO GO BACK ON FIVE, 'CAUSE I FEEL LIKE WE MOVED ON IT QUICKLY. 
          MAYBE YOU COULD TELL ME WHAT, OR SOMEONE COULD TELL ME WHAT HISTORICALLY WE'VE DONE AS FAR AS, UM, ACQUISITIONS OF MARKET RATE PROPERTY FOR CONVERSION. 
          I THINK I HEARD IT, BUT IT WAS SO QUICK THAT I, I DIDN'T REALLY CATCH IT, UM, TO KNOW IT, IT SOUNDS LIKE THIS IS WELL ABOVE THAT THRESHOLD OF WHAT WE'VE DONE HISTORICALLY, BUT THAT THAT WOULD ALSO BE HELPFUL INFORMATION. 
          YEAH, WE'VE ONLY DONE FIVE OF THESE, TOTAL FIVE SINCE 2022, RIGHT? SO IN THE LAST THREE YEARS WE'VE DONE FIVE. 
          SO WE'VE NOT COME CLOSE TO THIS NUMBER. 
          NOT ON A YEARLY BASIS, BUT YEAH, NOT ON AN ANNUAL BASIS. 
          NOW, PART OF IT HAS BEEN A LITTLE BIT MARKET DRIVEN PART OF IT, THE POLITICS OF, UH, YOU KNOW, THESE TYPE OF CONVERSIONS. 
          I MEAN, THERE'S JUST A LOT OF DIFFERENT SCENARIOS. 
          THIS CAN BE REVISED IF WE FEEL LIKE THE POLITICAL SUPPORT'S THERE FOR MORE ACQUISITIONS. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, BUT I JUST THINK THIS IS A, IT'S, IT'S A MODERATE NUMBER. 
          A LOT OF CITIES DO A LOT MORE THAN US, UH, THAN THAT, YOU KNOW, BUT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE NOT HIT THAT CLIP. 
          UM, BUT IT JUST CODIFIES THE MODERATE GOALS FOR, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO ACHIEVE ON THE MOST SENSE OF, UH, YOU KNOW, EXECUTION WE CAN DO. 
          AND I THINK ALSO THE INTENT THERE TOO IS TO GIVE COUNCILS SOME, SOME COMFORT THAT THERE'S A . 
          YOU KNOW, BECAUSE SEVERAL YEARS AGO WHEN WE DID START TO DO THESE, THERE WAS A BIG DISCUSSION ABOUT TAX EXEMPTIONS AND THE EFFECT ON OUR, OUR BOTTOM LINE AS A CITY. 
          AND IT'S, IT'S ABOUT DISCUSSION. 
          AND SO I THINK BY HAVING A BACKSTOP THERE OR A LIMIT, YOU CAN SAY, ALL RIGHT, UP UNTIL THIS AMOUNT, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE NOT GONNA DO ANYMORE. 
          AND I THINK THAT WILL GIVE COMP COUNCIL THE CONFIDENCE TO SAY, ALL RIGHT, WE CAN APPROVE THESE WITHOUT HAVING TO GO THROUGH AN ENTIRE, YOU KNOW, HUGE ANALYSIS OF, OF EVERY DOLLAR EFFECT THAT, UH, THAT WE'VE DONE. 
          I HAVE HEARD THAT COMMENT AND FROM OUR MOST ARMED SUPPORTERS ON COUNCIL, LIKE, WELL, HOW MANY ARE YOU DOING? YOU KNOW, BECAUSE SOMETIMES, UH, TWO OR THREE, YOU KNOW, PROPOSED IN TWO SUCCESSIVE MEETINGS AND THEY'RE JUST WONDERING HOW, HOW MANY ARE WE GOING TO BE APPROVING HAVING THAT GOAL? THAT ANNUAL GOAL DOES, IT DOES GIVE THAT COMFORT. 
          I DO AGREE WITH THAT. 
          WELL, I'LL TELL YOU JUST FOR Y'ALLS IFICATION AND THAT, SO YOU CAN COMMUNICATE TO YOUR COUNCIL MEMBERS WHO MIGHT NOT BE ASKING ABOUT THIS, AND I'LL SEND YOU THE PRESENTATION, BUT OUR CURRENT PORTFOLIO, OUR TOTAL PORTFOLIO ONLY COST THE CITY ABOUT $1.7 MILLION IN TAXES ON A YEARLY BASIS SINCE 2011, A CUMULATIVE TOTAL OF ABOUT 4.8 MILLION. 
          SO WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT IT, HOW WAS THAT ANALYSIS DONE? AND JACKIE TOOK ALL OF THE PROPERTIES, TAXABLE VALUES AND ALL OF THE TAXES OWE TO THE CITY OF DALLAS ABOUT 9,000 UNITS. 
          YEAH. 
          AT THE TIME OF CLOSING. 
          WELL, THE PROBLEM IS MOST OF OUR, OUR PROPERTIES ARE DEVELOPED ON VACANT LAND. 
          THAT'S RIGHT. 
          BASIS. 
          IT'S NOT THE OPPORTUNITY COST BASIS. 
          I WOULDN'T SAY THE OPPORTUNITY COST. 
          SOMETIMES IT'S LIKE, LOOK, SOME OF THESE AREAS, THIS IS ONLY THE EXISTING UNITS ACTUAL TAXES, ACTUAL ACTUAL REVENUE. 
          RIGHT, RIGHT. 
          WHICH IS FAIR BECAUSE THESE PROPERTIES, BUT IF THEY DID EXIST AND THEY WERE ON THE MARKET ROLL, THEN IT WOULD BE LIKE $20 MILLION. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE YOU COME INTO THE HIGH BE. 
          SO THAT, THAT'S THE THING. 
          COUNCIL NEEDS NO NUMBERS. 
          YES. 
          YOU KNOW, IT'S LIKE, ALL RIGHT, LOOK AT EACH AREA, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S IN SOUTH DALLAS OR IF IT'S IN AN AREA THAT HAS BEEN VACANT FOR 50 YEARS. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS THE FUNCTIONAL COST TO THE CITY OF DALLAS IS THAT ONE POINT STATE. 
          YEAH. 
          AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I THINK IT'S A BIG, IT'S A BIG BOOM TO OUR, IT'S A BIG SUPPORT TO THE WAY THAT WE DO BUSINESS. 
          SURE. 
          AND THAT OUR SLICE OF TAXES, I THINK YEAH. 
          IS INCREDIBLY SMALL. 
          RIGHT. 
          OTHER, OTHER PROGRAMS, AND IT'S ONLY ABOUT $200 A UNIT A YEAR. 
          LIKE THAT'S, THAT'S A PRETTY PALATABLE COST FOR ALL OF THE PRODUCTION. 
          AND I CAN UNDERSTAND THEM WANTING TO, TO LIMIT, BECAUSE I MEAN, PROBABLY THE BULK OF THAT IS DEALING IN THE BRISCO LEFT. 
          RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          AND I MEAN, WHEN THAT JOE ANOVA GOT TAKEN UP OVER BY PES COUNTY, THAT WAS $1.8 MILLION OFF THE TAX, WHICH IS THE MILLION WENT TO THE CITY OF DALLAS'S OFFICE. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT BEING VERY P****D ABOUT THAT. 
          BY THE WAY, IT'S GONNA GET LEGISLATED. 
          I'M DONE IN 20 AT THE END OF 26, SO, YOU KNOW, BUT FOR 
          [01:30:01]
FOR A MOMENT IT APPEARED THAT THERE WAS A 1.8 MILLION HOLD. 
          RIGHT. 
          AGAIN, THAT, THAT'S THE THING. 
          I I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT EVERYBODY KNOWS ALL THESE NUMBERS. 
          SO THAT'S, YOU KNOW, I AGREE. 
          GOES TO THE EFFECT THAT WE NEED TO CUT MORE PEOPLE, WE NEED BETTER REPORTING. 
          RIGHT. 
          I KEEP IT JUST SO THAT WE HAVE THE DATA BECAUSE YOU KNOW, THESE POLICY STATEMENTS THAT I THINK PREVIOUSLY IT WAS JUST THROWING OUT IDEAS AND WISHLISTS VERSUS, YOU KNOW, WHAT ARE THE ACTUAL EFFECTS. 
          I THINK NOW WE CAN, WE CAN GATHER SOME DATA AND WE CAN DO KIND OF A, UH, POSTMORTEM IF YOU WILL, RIGHT. 
          SAY WHAT, WHAT IS THE ACTUAL EFFECT OF IT? AND I THINK WE CAN DO A BETTER JOB GOING FORWARD WITH THAT, AND THEN WE'LL GET TO THAT POINT. 
          WELL, I THINK IT ALLOWS US TO REFINE OUR PUBLIC BENEFIT CALCULATION. 
          RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          YOU JUST GOTTA BE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU TAKE THE TRUE MARKET VALUE RENTS, YEAH, OBVIOUSLY THAT NUMBER'S GONNA BE VERY LOW, BUT IT'S NOT REALLY A FAIR COMPARISON TO SAY THAT BECAUSE IF YOU USE THAT, THEN THE PROPERTY NEVER UNDERWRITES AND NEVER GETSS A BILL. 
          I'M WITH YOU. 
          SO TWO, TWO QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS ON THIS ISSUE THAT WAS BROUGHT UP MIGHT BE USEFUL. 
          YOU KNOW, IF YOU LOOK UP AT NUMBER THREE, THERE'S KIND OF THIS, YOU KNOW, LIGHT TYPE FIRST NON-LINE TECH PROJECTS, THEN WE GO INTO GEOGRAPHIC, EVERYTHING WE JUST TALKED ABOUT. 
          IT SOUNDS LIKE THERE'S MAYBE A LITTLE MORE, UH, ARTICULATION THAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN. 
          IT COULD BE USEFUL TO SUMMARIZE ALL THIS LIKE YOU SEE IN CITY CODE OR WHATEVER WITH A, YOU KNOW, SOME KIND OF CHART THAT HAS LITECH NON-LINE TECH AND SOME DIFFERENT, UH, JUST A SUMMARY SO THAT IT'S VERY CLEAR. 
          IT CAN BE DONE WITH WORDS AS WELL, BUT IT'D BE POTENTIALLY NICE TO HAVE SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, A ONE PAGE EXHIBIT THAT SUMMARIZES A LOT OF THIS STUFF FOR US. 
          UM, ONE THOUGHT, AND THEN AS WAS JUST BROUGHT UP, I GUESS I HAD A QUESTION ABOUT THE, THE PUBLIC BENEFIT. 
          I MEAN, I KNOW THAT I'VE RANTED ABOUT THIS FOR 18 MONTHS THAT I'VE BEEN HERE. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT KIND OF THIS 40 60 RULE IN HERE. 
          AND HONESTLY, I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY WHAT MY COMMENT IS YET, EXCEPT, EXCEPT THAT I, I MEAN, TO THE POINT THAT WAS JUST MADE, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, THIS MAY BE, MAY BE INSURMOUNTABLE, I CAN'T IMAGINE, BUT IT'S VERY, VERY HARD FOR ME AT LEAST TO APPROVE. 
          OBVIOUSLY THE BIGGER BURDEN IS ON EXISTING PRODUCT PROJECTS THAT ARE BEING ACQUIRED. 
          IT'S VERY, VERY HARD FOR ME TO, TO VOTE TO APPROVE A DEAL THAT IS SHOWING, UH, KIND OF A, A, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, YOU KNOW, A NET COST WHEN WE KNOW THAT THERE ARE THESE OTHER FACTORS THAT WE'RE, ARE NOT FACTORED IN THAT WE NEED TO, PART OF WHICH IS WHY WE'RE HERE, RIGHT? THERE'S, THERE'S ALL THESE OTHER BENEFITS AND I HAVEN'T FIGURED OUT A WAY TO QUANTIFY, QUANTIFY IT OR PRESENT IT, BUT I WISH, YEAH. 
          AND, AND MAYBE IT'S A SEPARATE TOPIC TO, TO MEET WITH FINANCIAL FOLKS AND TALK ABOUT IT, BUT I THINK IT'S A HURDLE. 
          I WOULD THINK IT'S A HURDLE FOR CITY COUNCIL FOLKS. 
          IT'S CERTAINLY A HURDLE FOR ME. 
          CLEARLY WE'RE SAYING THAT THERE'S A BENEFIT TO THE CITY OF DALLAS, THE RESIDENCE OF DALLAS, THAT WE'RE SHOWING, WE'RE SHOWING ON THE NUMBERS QUANTIFICATIONS THAT THERE ISN'T, RIGHT? IT'S A, YOU'RE QUALIFYING AND NOT YOU QUALIFY, BUT YOU CAN'T QUALIFY. 
          IT SEEMS LIKE THERE IS A LITTLE EASIER WELL, YOU'RE TRYING TO DO IT. 
          WE, YES. 
          THE LACK HERE IS BEING ABLE, BEING ABLE TO QUANTIFY THAT, WHICH WE TALK ABOUT AND QUALIFY, RIGHT? I THINK FOR THIS CALCULATION THOUGH, IT'S ALL NUMBERS, RIGHT? YOU LOOK AT TOTAL TAXES AND HONESTLY, I QUOTE YOU THE ACTUAL TAXES. 
          SO WHEN WE DO THE PUBLIC BENEFIT, WE ACTUALLY DO A, AN ANALYSIS BASED ON HYPOTHETICAL MARKET VALUE. 
          SO WE'LL TAKE, YOU KNOW, THE DEVELOPMENT COSTS AND TAKE THOSE BASELINE TAXES FROM THE PROJECT AS IF IT WERE MARKET RATE, EVEN THOUGH IT MAY NEVER HAVE EXISTED, RIGHT? SO WE'RE, WE'RE TRYING TO HOLD OURSELVES TO A VERY HIGH STANDARD TO MAKE THESE, THESE CALCULATIONS. 
          LIKE YOU SAID, I, I DON'T THINK IT'S AN ALL ENCOMPASSING NUMBER, BUT I THINK IT GIVES US A BASELINE FROM WHERE WE CAN THINK ABOUT IT AND SAY, IS THIS WORTH THE SALT? RIGHT? SO THIS THIS 60% NUMBER, THE 40% NUMBER IT TAKES INTO ACCOUNT ALL THE TAXES, NOT JUST CITY OF DALLAS. 
          IF WE ONLY DID THE CITY OF DALLAS TAXES, IT'D BE WELL OVER A HUNDRED PERCENT, RIGHT? SO IF WE'RE JUST LOOKING BASELINE COST TO THE CITY, EVERY SINGLE ONE OF OUR PROJECTS SHOULD BE OFF THE CHARTS, RIGHT? COST OF PUBLIC. 
          WE'RE LOOKING HOLISTICALLY, AND YOU GUYS HAVE TO REMEMBER TO FINANCE AFFORDABLE HOUSING, THERE NEEDS TO BE A SUBSTITUTE FOR US. 
          THAT'S CORRECT. 
          SO IT'S LIKE, YOU KNOW, THE 60 40 BENEFITS, YOU 
          [01:35:01]
KNOW, IS IT WORTH 60 CENTS ON THE DOLLAR? IS IT WORTH 40 CENTS ON THE DOLLAR TO GET THESE, UH, THESE CREDIT COSTS LOWERED FOR THIS PARTICULAR AREA? RIGHT? SO I, THAT'S THE THING, YOU CAN NEVER BE PERFECT, BUT IT GIVES YOU A LITTLE BIT OF A BASELINE TO FORM YOUR OPINION. 
          WELL, SORT OF THE PUBLIC BENEFIT BASED ON HOW THE DEAL UNDERWRITES, AND I'M SAYING THAT DEVELOP CAPITAL, BUT THOSE DEALS DEVELOP, HAS CAPITALIZE WITH COMMISSIONAL DEBT EQUITY, YOU KNOW, SO, YOU KNOW, IN ORDER TO DOCE, YOU KNOW, THESE GROUPS TO GO INTO A PARTNERSHIP LIKE THIS, THE TAX PAYMENT HAS TO BE A CREATED TO THE PROJECT HAS TO BE. 
          SO WHAT ARE THE TWO THINGS THAT, YOU KNOW, DON'T FLOW THROUGH TO THE BOTTOM LINE? IT'S GONNA BE WHATEVER RENT SAVINGS, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER RENT SAVINGS, UH, ARE THERE FOR THE TENANTS AND WHATEVER MONEY THEY HAVE TO GET INTO THE HSC. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, YOU NEED AT LEAST 40% OF THESE ACQUISITIONS TO CLOSE BOTTOM ONLINE TO PULL TOGETHER THE CAPITAL, SAY, YEAH, WE'LL GO INTO THAT FOR THAT. 
          KNOW IT'S NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT, BUT SAY LOVE, BUT IT'S ACCRETIVE OF ENOUGH. 
          NOW THOSE ARE THE PUBLIC BENEFIT. 
          THOSE ARE THE BENEFITS THAT YOU SEE AT THE PROPERTY LEVEL. 
          OKAY. 
          OR THAT'S THE COST OF PROPERTY LEVEL, THEN IT'S PROPERTY LEVEL. 
          BUT THEN THERE'S A, OKAY, WHAT DOES THAT DO FOR LOCAL EMPLOYERS THAT NOW CAN ACTUALLY GET, YOU KNOW, AND THEY'RE NOT LEAVING THE CITY BECAUSE, OH, WE CAN GET EXECUTIVE ASSISTANTS AND, YOU KNOW, INTER LOCAL PROFESSIONALS SO NEAR, YOU KNOW, OUR WORK AND THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE TO GO EXPLAIN IT, HUH. 
          YOU KNOW, TO, UH, YOU KNOW, MOVE, MOVE OUR OFFICE. 
          SO IT'S LIKE, BUT THAT'S HARD. 
          THAT'S HARD TO QUANTIFY. 
          RIGHT? BUT YOU CAN'T TELL ME THERE'S NOT A BENEFIT THERE. 
          BUT THAT IS VERY DIFFICULT TO QUANTIFY KNOW. 
          WE DID HAVE LIKE A CONCORD STUDY. 
          I THINK THAT ACTUALLY IT WASN'T DEAL BY DEAL, BUT IT KIND OF GAVE SORT A GENERAL, HERE ARE THE BENEFITS FOR DOING IT. 
          BUT YEAH, I MEAN, I GET WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT IT'S ALSO LIKE, HEY, WE NEED THE DEAL. 
          IF, IF WE, IF WE VALUE THESE DEALS IN A WAY, SHAPE OR FORM, WE THINK THEY HAVE ANY VALUE, IT'S GOING TO HAVE A PUBLIC BENEFIT WHERE SOME OF THIS TAX SAVINGS PAYMENT IS GOING TO THE BOTTOM LINE, GOING TO THE PRIVATE DEVELOPER AND THEIR PARTNERS. 
          I'M SAYING IT'S RIGHT OR WRONG. 
          I'M JUST SAYING, HEY, IN ORDER TO MAKE IT HAPPEN, THAT'S WHAT, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO DO. 
          I THINK IT'D BE WORTHWHILE TO HAVE SOME KIND OF SESSION WITH THEM LOOKING AT THE MODEL AND TRYING TO, IF WE CAN BRING IN SEAN ROUSON AT WATERFORD, UH, AND A HAR KIND TOMORROW TO DO A LITTLE SIT DOWN SESSION, SOME EVENING DAY OR WHATEVER. 
          WELL, I, I THINK THAT'S ANOTHER CONVERSATION FOR ANOTHER DAY. 
          YEAH, THAT'S FOR SURE. 
          KIND A TRAINING PLANNING SESSION EVERY YEAR WE REALLY HAVE SOMETHING DIFFERENT, BUT SUGGEST THAT IT HAPPEN. 
          SHE HAD A STATEMENT. 
          I WAS JUST GOING TO ALSO MENTION THAT WITH THE STATE LAW CHANGES THAT WENT INTO EFFECT THIS YEAR, UM, SO YOU ALL HAVEN'T SEEN THIS BECAUSE YOU HAVEN'T SEEN A WORKFORCE DEAL COME FOR APPROVAL SINCE THE CHANGES WENT INTO EFFECT. 
          BUT THE NEW REQUIREMENT WOULD BE AN UNDERWRITING STUDY THAT SHOWS THE BOARD CAN MAKE A GOOD FAITH DETERMINATION AND PERCENT RENT REDUCTION BASED ON, YOU KNOW, MARKET RATES THAT COULD HAVE BEEN CHARGED, UM, FOR, YOU KNOW, CERTAIN YEARS DEPENDING ON IF IT'S CONSTRUCTION OR ACQUISITION. 
          AND THEN THE ONGOING REQUIREMENT, UM, AT THE STATE LEVEL TO RECEIVE THE TAX EXEMPTION WOULD BE TO DEMONSTRATE THAT 50% SAVINGS OR THE DEVELOPER HAS TO PAY THE DIFFERENCE. 
          UM, SO FUNCTIONALLY FROM A STATE, YOU KNOW, FROM STATE LAW PERSPECTIVE, YOU'D BE ACHIEVING A 50% RENTAL REDUCTION, UM, WHICH IS PART OF WHAT HILLTOP USES TO LOOK AT THE PUBLIC BENEFIT. 
          AND THAT'S, THAT'S CODE SECTION THREE B, WHERE IT JUST REFERS BACK TO THE STATE STATUTE, YOU KNOW, IT COULD CHANGE. 
          AND I THINK THEY TRIED TO CAPTURE ALL THESE THINGS. 
          THIS CONVERSATION'S GOING ON STATEWIDE ONE'S GOT IT. 
          PERFECTLY RIGHT. 
          WE'RE TRYING 60%  DIRECT TO PAGE. 
          SHE HAD SOME EDITS ON THE YES. 
          S GO THROUGH PRETTY QUICKLY. 
          OKAY. 
          GOT FIVE. 
          I THINK I WANNA GET AT LEAST ALL THE PROPOSED EDITS OUT THERE BECAUSE WE'RE AT ONE 40, SO I DUNNO. 
          I KNOW. 
          JUST THOUGHT THIS WAS SHORT. 
          LOOKED LIKE IT. 
          SORRY. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, I HAVE FIVE PROPOSED, UM, AMENDMENTS TO THE BYLAWS. 
          UH, THE FIRST ONE IS IN SECTION 2.6, WHICH RELATES TO QUORUM. 
          UM, ON THAT ONE I WOULD LIKE TO PROPOSE ADDING AS A SENTENCE AT THE END. 
          NOTWITHSTANDING THE FOREGOING BILL CORN SHALL CONSIST OF FEWER THAN ONE THIRD OF THE DEFAULT AUTHORIZED NUMBER OF DIRECTOR. 
          SO WE HAVE 15 AUTHORIZED BASICALLY QUO LESS THAN FIVE PEOPLE. 
          THAT'S THE KEY. 
          TWO OR THREE PEOPLE FROM 
          [01:40:01]
MAKING THEM BIGGER BASIC MAKING TWO OR THREE DIRECTORS. 
          I MEAN, IS THERE A MATHEMATICAL SCENARIO? I GUESS THAT THERE'S NOT AS MANY APPOINTEES? THERE'S SEVEN BIG YEAH, IF EVERYBODY QUITS ONE YEAR EXCEPT LIKE THREE PEOPLE YEAH. 
          THEN HAVE A SITUATION. 
          THEY JUST DO WHATEVER, DO WHATEVER. 
          YEAH. 
          FIVE PEOPLE. 
          YEAH, I MEAN THE CITY COUNCIL HOPEFULLY NOMINATE ONE, YOU KNOW, YOU LIKE. 
          OKAY. 
          SO THAT, THAT'S, UH, NUMBER ONE. 
          NUMBER TWO IS IN SECTION 3.6, SUB A, SUB EIGHT. 
          ADDING THIS RELATES TO THE SPENDING AUTHORITY OF THE GENERAL MANAGER. 
          UM, AND A PROVISION WHICH ALLOWS YOU SPEND LIKE $25,000 BASED ON, UM, ANY EXPENDITURE MAY PURSUANT TO THIS SUBSECTION SHALL BE REPORT IT TO THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS AT ITS NEXT REGULAR MEETING AND SHALL BE SUBJECT TO RAMIFICATION OR DISAFFIRM BY THE BOARD. 
          UM, SO DO IT. 
          JUST GOTTA COME BACK AND, YOU KNOW, THE NEXT BOARD MEETING, I DON'T EVER ANTICIPATE HEARING THAT. 
          HONESTLY, WE'RE NOT A DEVELOPER, SO, ALRIGHT. 
          I GUESS WE, IF WE WANNA MOVE INTO DEVELOPMENT, THAT WOULD BECOME QUESTION. 
          YEAH. 
          CAN I, CAN I JUST ASK? YEAH. 
          WHAT HAPPENS IF UNDER YOUR OPPOSED AMENDMENT IS DISAFFIRM? WELL, THE MONEY'S ALREADY BEEN SPENT, IS REPORTED. 
          WE SAY, OH NO, YOU CAN'T DO THAT. 
          I THINK IF YOU HAVE THAT CLAUSE THERE, YOU HAVE TO, YOU HAVE TO WAIT AS A GENERAL MANAGER, THE CONTRACT CLAUSE WAS RESPONSIBLE BASED ON DEPARTMENT. 
          YEAH, IT'S OKAY. 
          UM, SECTION 3.8, ADDING, UM, SINCE AT THE END OF THE FIRST PARAGRAPH, IT'S RELATING TO ADDITIONAL STAFF SERVICES SAYING ADDITIONAL STAFF SERVICES UNDER THIS SECTION ARE INTENDED TO SUPPLEMENT AND NOT SUPPLANT THE AUTHORITY OR RESPONSIBILITIES OF THE GENERAL MANAGER OR OFFICERS APPOINTED BY THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS. 
          SO JUST MAKING IT CLEAR THAT, YOU KNOW, YEARS DOWN ROAD WON'T SEE THIS MIGRATED INTO SOMETHING DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WE BE, UM, SECTION 5.4 ON NOTICE AND WAIVER NOTICE, JUST ADDING THIS SENTENCE SAYS, FOR PURPOSES OF NOTICE BY ELECTRONIC GRADE CORPORATION SHALL MAINTAIN AND ANNUALLY CONFIRMED EACH DIRECTOR'S PREFERRED ELECTRONIC NOTICE ADDRESS. 
          AND THOSE SHALL SENT SUCH ADDRESS REFLECTED IN THE CORPORATION'S RECORDS. 
          JUST SO AS WE JUST KEEP TRACK OF RAISING AGAINST, UM, UH, FINAL COMMENT PROPOSED AT SECTION 7.3, ADVANCEMENT OF FUNDS. 
          UM, AND THIS RELATES TO, UM, UM, INDEMNIFICATION AND BEING ADVANCING FUNDS. 
          DIRECTORS ARE SUED, ANY DETERMINATION UNDER THE SECTION SHALL BE MADE PROPERLY AND IN GOOD FAITH BASED ON THE INFORMATION RECENTLY AVAILABLE AT THE TIME. 
          AND ANY DOUBT SHALL BE RESOLVED IN FAVOR OF ADVANCEMENT. 
          SO THIS JUST BASICALLY AVOID SITUATION, YOU JUST GOTTA BE HANGING OUT THERE SO THEY DIRECTOR COMES, MAKES A CLAIM AND AFTER THERE'S JUST NO NOT ACTIVE ON. 
          SO THOSE ARE MY PROPOSED AND I, I GAVE THEM TO UH, I EMAILED THEM TO, UH, PRESIDENT, UM, ALICE AND AARON, UH, THIS MORNING. 
          UM, THEY HAVE, THEY HAVE THOSE, I THINK I SENT THEM UP EVERYONE. 
          OKAY. 
          UM, OKAY, SO I THINK WE HAVE SEVERAL AMENDMENTS PROPOSED HERE. 
          YEAH. 
          THIS FROM DIRECTOR PAGE AND THEN SEVERAL FROM DIRECTOR FOR ON THE SECTION. 
          YES. 
          BOARD'S MISSING THE SECTION FOUR AND FIVE MAKE IT CLEAR IT'S WORKFORCE MARKET TO WORKFORCE CONVERSION. 
          AND ON THE ANNUAL NUMBERS SPECIFICALLY SAYS IT'S THE ANNUAL GOAL, ANNUAL LIMIT. 
          HOW DO YOU WANT STATEMENTS? DON'T KNOW. 
          UH, HE PUT IT ALL A BUCKET. 
          UNLESS SOMEBODY, UNLESS FRONT THE DIRECTORS SAYS, HEY, I WANT TO CONSIDER RIGHT NOW BY ON IT SEPARATELY. 
          I MEAN, DO WE FEEL READY TO MAKE A VOTE ON THESE PROGRAM STATEMENTS? PRESIDENT, I CAN WE TWEAK IT AND GET IT IN THE FORM WE'RE ALL MAYBE CIRCULATE IT OFF, YOU KNOW, IN A WEEK OR TWO YOU CAN APPROVE THEM NOW WITH THOSE AMENDMENTS BACK AGAIN, ATE THE NEXT MONTH'S MEETING IF YOU NEED, UM, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO LIMIT ON HOW MANY TIMES YOU CAN VOTE FOR YOUR OWN VOTE. 
          OKAY. 
          JUST FAST TAX. 
          LET'S JUST SAY, UH, THEIR PROGRAMS SAYING LET'S GO DOWN IN FLAMES. 
          WE WANNA COME UP AND GET OURS APPROVED. 
          IS THERE ANY WAY WE CAN KIND OF, HOW CAN WE STAGGER THE, IF 
          [01:45:01]
WE DECIDED DEFER TO THE NEXT BOARD MEETING, CAN WE STILL GO ON THE AGENDA FOR CITY COUNCIL WITH OUR PROGRAM? SAY THAT? WELL, I, I DON'T KNOW. 
          I THINK IF YOU GUYS WANTED THIS TO GO ON A CITY COUNCIL AGENDA, YOU HAVE TO GET THE SPONSORSHIP OF A, UH, A CITY COUNCIL WITH THE SIGNATURES OF DO WITH THE DRAFT. 
          YEAH. 
          YOU'D HAVE TO HAVE A SPECIAL MEMO WITH PRIVATE SIGNING. 
          UM, BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, THE HOUSING DEPARTMENT WILL ADVANCE THESE. 
          YEAH. 
          I DON'T THINK THEY'LL  THAT WOULD BE THE AVENUE. 
          SO THEIR STATEMENT IS GOING ON THE 28TH OF THIS MONTH BECAUSE I THINK IF YOU WANTED TO DO SOMETHING, ASK GREG'S OFFICE. 
          YEAH. 
          IF YOU WANTED AN OPTION, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU HAVE TO GET THAT DONE PRETTY QUICKLY. 
          UM, BECAUSE THEIR MEETING IS IN TWO WEEKS. 
          OH, TWO AND A HALF WEEKS. 
          YEAH. 
          I MEAN I GUESS MY THOUGHT IS LET'S VOTE NOT EVERYONE'S GONNA BE COMPLETELY ON BOARD. 
          THAT'S FINE. 
          IF I, I MEAN I THINK I UNDERSTAND THE AMENDMENTS. 
          I UNDERSTAND. 
          UH, I MEAN WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO PROPOSE AND GET THROUGH, I WOULD LIKE TO KIND OF COME IN RIGHT AT ASSUMING THE CITY COUNCIL AND LOOK, I'M GONNA OPPOSE, I'M ABSOLUTELY GONNA OPPOSE, UH, THE PROGRAM STATEMENT FROM STATE STAFF AND I'M GONNA MAKE IT I TO COUNCIL PEOPLE. 
          I'VE BEEN IN FRONT OF SOME OF THESE COUNCIL PEOPLE AS WELL SAYING WHY EVERY INTENTION MAKE PUBLIC COMMENTS AT THE CITY COUNCIL MEETING AS WELL. 
          BUT I DO THINK THEY NEED TO GO CITY COUNCIL AND LET THE CHIP FALL. 
          AND I THINK THE INTENT, YOU GUYS CAN SUBMIT THESE TO COUNCIL MEMBERS AND SAY, HEY, WHAT, WHATEVER THE HOUSING DEPARTMENT COMES OUT WITH NEXT WEEK, I THINK IS WHEN HE SAID IT WOULD BE PUBLISHED. 
          MAYBE. 
          I MEAN THAT'S, THAT'S THE DISADVANTAGE. 
          THE AT YOU DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT'S IN IT UNTIL GOOD POINT ON THE AGENDA. 
          AND SO THAT'S KIND OF A WE WANT GET ROOM. 
          YEAH, LET'S, LET'S DO IT. 
          OKAY. 
          TONY. 
          YEAH. 
          ALRIGHT, LET'S TAKE, LET'S, LET'S TAKE A VOTE AS AMENDED. 
          I WANNA TAKE A VOTE. 
          ASD AND LET'S JUST SEE WHERE FIRST THAT, I GUESS. 
          I GUESS SO. 
          OKAY, I'LL MOTION TO APPROVE AS AMENDED POLICY DIRECTOR JD MOTION. 
          DO WE HAVE A SECOND? ONE SECOND. 
          SECOND. 
          TONY GOT THERE. 
          UH, DIRECTOR, SECRETARY PAGE. 
          GOT THERE FIRST. 
          CE SECONDED. 
          SO LET'S JUST DO JACKIE, LET'S, CAN I ASK A POINT OF CLARIFICATION TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND, I KNOW I DIDN'T PROPOSE SPECIFIC LANGUAGE TWEAKS, BUT WHEN ON THIS MOTION, IS IT CONTEMPLATING THAT FOUR AND FIVE WILL BE, THE LANGUAGE WILL BE MADE MORE PRECISE TO CAPTURE WHAT THE INTENT OF THEM? CORRECT. 
          IT IS GOING TO CLARIFY THAT THIS IS A MARKET TO WORKFORCE HOUSING CONVERSION. 
          NON LITECH I THINK IS GOING TO BE THE, UH, ACTUAL PHRASING OF IT, OF TAKING A MARKET RATE PROPERTY TO AFFORDABLE, NOT AS NON LITECH. 
          AND THEN WITH NUMBER FIVE, WE'RE GONNA BE CLEAR THAT IT IS A ANNUAL LIMIT TO HOW MANY DEALS WE'RE GOING TO DO. 
          AND JUST ONE FURTHER CLARIFICATION. 
          I THINK THE LANGUAGE ON FIVE NEEDS, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, IT'S ACQUISITION OF LIKE EXISTING MARKET RATE UNITS YES. 
          THAT ARE BEING CONVERTED. 
          SO I THINK WE COULD ALSO JUST TWEAK THAT SO SOMEONE DOESN'T ARGUE LATER THAT'S ANY KIND OF MARKET RATE COMMERCIAL PROPERTY OR YOU, YOU KNOW, SO AS LONG AS WE CAN TWEAK THAT LANGUAGE, I'M GOOD THERE. 
          SO THANK YOU FOR, FOR IT'S MARKET RATES ARE NON LITECH. 
          SO WORKFORCE HOUSING, IT ADDRESSES WORKFORCE HOUSING ONLY. 
          SHE'S TALKING ABOUT LIKE SAY WE BUY A SUPERMARKET AND CONVERT. 
          OH. 
          UH, YEAH, I KNOW I'M BEING TECHNICAL, BUT THAT'S WHAT THE LANGUAGE READS, SO I'M JUST TRYING TO MAKE SURE WE'RE PRECISE BECAUSE WE MIGHT NOT BE HERE . 
          CORRECT. 
          NO, UNDERSTOOD. 
          POINT TAKEN. 
          THAT MAKES SENSE. 
          UM, OKAY, SO JACKIE, LET'S JUST TAKE A VOTE. 
          VICE PRESIDENT SEAN ELLEN APPROVED SHALONDA AJ APPROVE TREASURER JACK, JACK MARSHALL. 
          C APPROVE DIRECTOR PATTY COLLINS. 
          APPROVE DIRECTOR KEVIN HINTON, APPROVED DIRECTOR LESLIE ING APPROVED PRESIDENT. 
          DAVID ELLIS APPROVED DIRECTOR CLIFF FRIEDMAN APPROVED OLIVER ROBINSON. 
          UM, APPROVE DIRECTOR RYAN MOORE. 
          APPROVE SECRETARY TONY PAGE APPROVE DIRECTOR SEAN C YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT, YOU'RE RIGHT. 
          I AGREE. 
          UM, ALL RIGHT, WELL DONE. 
          EVERYBODY THINK I LOST MY AGENDA? ALL THESE DOCUMENTS? THANK YOU. 
          [01:50:01]
UM, LEMME PASS THE TREASURER'S REPORT. 
          YEAH, WE CAN MOTION WE NEED TO, YOU CAN DO WHATEVER YOU WANT. 
          YOU CAN SKIP THOSE ITEMS OR WE CAN JUST, YEAH. 
          LET'S SKIP ITEM EIGHT. 
          UH, AARON ITEM NINE. 
          IS THERE ANY ON THE PIPELINE, ANYTHING THAT NEEDS TO BE RECORDED ON AT MOMENT? WE'RE CLOSING TABLE OR VILLAGE NEXT WEEK. 
          RIGHT. 
          UM, ANY UP? I, WE'RE STILL WAITING ON THE FINAL RULES, I THINK. 
          S**T. 
          SO FANNIE MAE TOLD YEAH, NO, FANNIE MAE TOLD, UH, WATERFORD, I WAIT FOR THE RULES TO GET COMPLETELY APPROVED. 
          UH, RULES WE'RE STILL IN THE PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD FOR T-D-H-C-A FOR THE DRAFT OF THE RULES. 
          UH, THEN THE BOARD OF T-D-H-C-A HAS TO VOTE ON, WHICH IS IN FEBRUARY. 
          I THINK ONCE THAT'S APPROVED, THEN HOPEFULLY FABE FINALLY MAKES A DECISION ON WILL THEY, YOU KNOW, WILL THEY FINANCE A HFC WORKFORCE PACKAGE? WHICH WE DON'T KNOW. 
          AND I THINK ELK AND ALLEN WAS PROBABLY THE BOGEY OR TEST CASE FOR ALL TEXAS OFFICER. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          WELL, OKAY, THE TIME IS 1 52, I BELIEVE. 
          UH, THE MEETING IS NOW AGER.
* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.